Engineering an Open Attic with Site Built LVL Trusses
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 4 май 2020
- On this Build Show we will take you into the coolest Attic you've ever seen with Matt's Engineer on his personal BUILD. Whit Smith,PE is a second generation Structural Engineer that has worked with Matt and his team on many complicated custom homes. Whit will show you how he designed this very open attic which is actually a truss but looks like a traditional rafter setup.
Huge thanks to Whit for coming on the show! www.smith-structural.com/people
Also, be sure to sign up for my weekly newsletter so you'll get all the updates from Build Show Network.
buildshownetwork.com/newsletter
Smith Structural Engineers was founded in Austin, TX 30 years ago. They specialize in commercial and residential structural design. SSE is currently focused on serving their established clientele, but they appreciate you taking the time to watch the video and hope you find the information useful for your next project.
More on the Spax PowerLags here: spax.us/products/powerlags
More on the FasterMaster PAMFast Decking Screw system and FrameFAST Structural Connectors here: www.fastenmaster.com/
Build Show Amazon Store: www.amazon.com/shop/mattrisin...
Follow Matt on Instagram! / risingerbuild
or Twitter / mattrisinger
Huge thanks to our Show sponsors Polywall, Huber, Dorken Delta, Prosoco, Rockwool & Viewrail for helping to make these videos possible! These are all trusted companies that Matt has worked with for years and trusts their products in the homes he builds. We would highly encourage you to check out their websites for more info.
www.Poly-Wall.com
www.Dorken.com
www.Huberwood.com
www.Prosoco.com
www.Viewrail.com
www.Rockwool.com
Two engineering videos in a row?? Oh Matt, you know how to spoil ME.
With this design, your attic has its own attic.
As a builder, in Australia, I always try and pitch a roof similar to this. Trusses are such a waste of space. My clients love it and I can upsell extra rooms for them, for more profit.
Traditional trusses suck
I'm going to say on every LVL show you put out. We really needs to go full-on to engineered wood and keep up with them across the pond.
Always a pleasure to hear a pro that is clearly on top of his game. Another great walk through Matt.
We used a similar layout when we built a loft during an addition. It was a great choice, and we have so much more space!
I'm glad you mentioned at the end that the attic was going to be a conditioned space for your HVAC. That is good for people to understand. Good video Matt.
One of my favorite videos on this channel I was particularly interested in how the various elements were connected. When I did a back to the studs renovation on an old apartment building unit I added some screws to improve the connection of the ceiling joists to the top plate similar to what was done in this video. It was nice to see that the idea had some engineering support for it.
I'd love to see a conversion video for all of us who got an unusable attic space and want to create more storage above our garage or home without compromising the structure of the roof! Love the attic in this video...exactly what I will ask for if I custom build in the future
I like this idea, but wow, this would be some serious effort. But every time I go up into my crappy attic for anything I wish that I had a nice clean attic like on this video.
I’m over here in the UK and that is exactly the same style attic we have in our 1923 cottage. They knew how to engineer back then quite well also : ) We ended up insulating in between the rafters, then plaster-boarding and plaster and paint. We left those collar ties along the top exposed because the wood was nice and rustic. Nice video.
Solid information, not neck deep into my project yet, but I’m doing my research and you have given me the best information that I’ve been looking for. I now have a good direction to start with. Myself, I will need to cut three trusses, so like you have all the capability and knowledge, aside from engineering knowledge, so anyway, thank you, you’ve given me what I’ve needed for my starting point. Matt, you rock brother !
We did a very a very similar roof truss system. Our designer had us put a 2X8 flat on the attic floor on top of the osb sheathing at the outside edge and then attach joist hangers laying flat. This putting up the rafters was easy because that end fit right into the joist hanger and did not move or float around while you secured it to the ridge board
Really enjoyed having Whit on the show. He speaks very articulately and I learned a lot!
This is a good video and I appreciate seeing the attic. I am currently building my first garage. Have been watching a lot of RUclips videos on how to frame up an attic or a roof. It is amazing at the different opinions and building styles there are. One carpenter may strongly discourage a certain building method. Then other builder will practice that particular method and encourage it.
Free, professional building information. Gotta love it.
Finally on something on the show I agree with. The Collar Ties
The opportunity to come along with you as you build your new home is truly invaluable. The insight as to how you employ best practices is amazing. I’m okay that you might be biased; when I build my home, I’ll be biased too. Thanks to your teachings, I’ll know how to build it right! Thanks Matt!
Very kind my friend. I appreciate the support
Good job! I love the engineering and your general thinking and strategies!
Best attic I have ever seen.
Great video Matt I have used fasten master screws on LVL beams and they are awesome.
I'm impressed with Whit (hope that's right). Going through and explaining how he designed everything, you can just tell this guy really knows what he's doing. I was very impressed. Often times, engineers are great on paper that doesn't transfer very well in the actual build. I speak from experience.....
As an HVAC Installer, constantly jammed in tiny little attics and crawlspaces, I approve of this design lol
Excellent video - thanks for sharing!
Love the show Matt!
Did a large attic too with drop down ladder, but found it a pain to get up and down with your arms full. So went back and added an "L" space stair case and now we're able to carry tons of stuff up and down without ladder issues, great job, great build, and totally enjoy your channel.
Good day... You seem quite familiar with the subject so I wanted to asked you; what style of roof is this. I'm planning a new construction home. Also would a roof like like this be suitable for coastal region e.g. Florida ?
Very professional, and well detailed instructional video.
This house is never gonna come apart!
A lot of housing is built on the same plans where I live. Less slope is less costs ...... That causes unknowing owners to be " Given " a 4 foot attic. The Rockwool is the greatest thing I have seen. Sorry construction guys and gals, but I have never seen it til Matt showed it with the shop vac sound demo. Wow, We will surely be adding that to our 1953 plaster walled house for sure. This may be what happens before the next roof replacement ..... Gotta empty out the garage for creating an Epoxy Countertop pouring shop. I always loved these attics and may one day have one without moving.
Your new attic looks identical to my attic, which was built in 1956 with 2x4 sawn lumber!
Great video guys as always.
We love The Build Show!
After years of crawling around in blown in insulation, fishing wires and cutting in recessed cans, I love the idea of treating the attic as conditioned space.
Is there any reason why a vented attic can't do the same thing if properly framed and insulated?
They said the attic floor is part of the structural integrity. Doesn't that floor get in the way of fishing wires etc?
@@vecamiolo Yeah, I'm sure the more framing involved with having a floor would make it tougher. But if only always are spaced around it would still be pretty easy.
When I learned to build over 40 years ago we belt all are trusses. This is still my go to method
Old school!
man i was just watching Jordans video and said to my cousin well now i can make you a nice roof, thank you Jordan
That is some sweet and very usable space, not sure I would be using it only for storage and would try to 'hide' a little staircase to get up there easily
Matt, please come to Virginia to educate these builders in the south that houses don't need to breathe!
Well, I have gone the same route on my barn build; I have those same StrongTie straps with all the nails, and the 12” Simpson powerlag type screws holding my barn rafters to the lintel beams.
that looks like a perfect loft area - the mech room can be 1/2 of that, the rest a cool little attic space.
Bent steel beam! Totally going to steal that idea. (and Collar ties are required by code at 4 foot on center in the upper third of the attic to counter uplift.)
that is some excellent crawl space
Very informative, thanks
That attic is sick. So much storage space.
Excellent stuff
I remember hearing that in structural wood design, particularly for splices it's often better to construct connections with a greater quantity of smaller fasteners over a longer connection (nails and/or screw) rather than fewer large fasteners (bolts). It's interesting to see how small the splices were. Is this a benefit of the products mentioned?
Sorry to be so offtopic but does someone know of a trick to get back into an instagram account??
I somehow lost the password. I love any tricks you can offer me.
@Enrique Uriel instablaster :)
@Colson Marcos i really appreciate your reply. I got to the site thru google and im trying it out atm.
Looks like it's gonna take quite some time so I will reply here later with my results.
Great content!!
@ Matt .. it’s so funny for me as a German carpenter to see your roof construction and how proud you are about this open roof space ... in good old Germany we do this kind of “ open “ roof space construction type for 100 of years ... OMG America you need so much more
We have these "open" attics all over the Northeast and they have been around for over100 yrs.
The open attics were popular/normal in the past when roofs were framed with traditional rafters. Most modern construction (from 1970’s to current) built by production builders utilizes roof trusses due to cost and time savings. There are still builders that “hand cut” rafters but it’s not as common. You definitely wouldn’t see any production framing crew hand cutting rafters. The house I grew up in (I’m 35) was built in 1989 and it had an open attic. It wasn’t built by a production builder though, it was built by my dad’s cousin who only built a handful of houses a year.
Wolfgang, this type of open attic was also normal in the USA up until around 1950. After that it was found that you could frame a roof much more cheaply by using pre-fabricated trusses. Since many Americans did not use the attic space this was worth doing. It is still very common today and it is still cheaper than what Matt has done in this video. However Matt plans to use the attic space. So his choice makes sense. If the roof pitch were lower and the attic was too low to useful it would be more economical and efficient to use pre-fabricated trusses. We are not backwards here in the USA. We just have different household needs and a different economy of construction materials. I am an American but I have lived in Europe for many years. It has always surprised me that pre-fabricated roof trusses for houses are not readily available in Europe. They are a very efficient use of material and labor.
@@HistoricHomePlans pre-fabricated trusses are cheaper for sure! But could you please comment on moisture, humidity and mold risk in no-vent vs vented/pre-fabricated trusses based roof?
Do you get hurricanes, tornadoes or earthquakes? In 100 years all of those have hit America multiple times. Making codes more stringent. So kudos for him because he got an engineer to circumvent the typical construction practice and local code requirements while allowing him to be happy with the aesthetics of his open attic. Anyone can place sticks together at the right angle and have them stand for a while if you're just worried about gravity, but when lateral forces hit, you can only fight physics with physics and you need to know what you're doing and what you're trying to resist and accomplish for yourself.
Awesome show
Great info Thank you
I love watching this go in, as we are starting to consider building our home. I was wondering if you have any suggestions on finding a good design/build team in the Philadelphia area? I am finding that it is very hard to know who to work with. I know that I will not be building a high end house, i just cannot afford that, but I do not want a production home.
Hey Matt! Love your channel. We’re watching from Utah. We’re getting ready to remodel our whole home and we have a typical 2x4 truss attic. We’d love to re-engineer a section of that to turn it into a bonus room for the kids to play in. Do you have any videos showing that being done?
Congratulation for reinventing the wheel!
Mathieu, I gather you live in France. I'm an American but so do I. That's where I am now. In case you don't know, this is roughly how roofs were framed in the USA, up until WW2. But after that most housing construction shifted over to pre-fabricated wood roof framing and attics weren't used for storage anymore. So whole generations of framing carpenters have grown up without learning these older techniques.
Now we are coming full circle and people are wanting to do more with their attics again. Matt is providing a valuable service by re-introducing these old techniques WITH the changes necessary to bring them up to modern energy and structural code requirements.
Hey Matt, wonder if you can give us an update on that itemized list of costs...
I’ve been fallowing this project, as you may have been as well.
Let’s see here, Matt bought a 1970’s house then planned on doing some renovations. As he started to open up walls and cavities of the property, Matt quickly found out to be more cost efficient just to start from scratch. Mind you, he’s got the right connections, been building for sometime now. Let’s not forget the major corporate sponsorships. Let’s keep in mind I don’t know Matt personally and I’ve watch many of his videos. For the average man the budget for his house would be way outside the reach of many and would not any make financial sense. But the ideas building construction advancements and technology is what’s interesting. I highly doubt he’ll disclose one penny for this project.
So much was “donated” probably can’t get that accurately.
@@ABC-oo4vm From one of his earlier videos, he was open about his connections and sponsorships, but mentioned that he will list these out as what they would cost if the viewers were buying.
@@ABC-oo4vm ruclips.net/video/PFGL0JkAE08/видео.html
@@ABC-oo4vm LVL is not cheap, but last
That is a nice attic.
Another benefit of an open attic is that moving the HVAC into a conditioned space is more efficient. Modern attics are either hot or cold when we ask the HVAC to move BTUs. It's like starting the race a lap behind. I told the architect on our new house (in permitting right now), "everything inside". Wish my first home was like that. Only downside to the open attic is more space means more junk. But that might be my personal affliction...
If you go whole house mini split you don't have to worry about ducts in the attic.
Thanks for another great video. I just bought a 1960s house and will be replacing the roof. I would love to hear what you would do to air seal while the shingles are off. It’s a brick facade so I don’t know how to tie in to the wall sheathing. Would it be better to just leave the attic vented and try to air seal the actual living spaces? All ideas welcome
I would be interested to see how this kind of building could adapted to cold weather locations. This is a really fun series.
Especially interested on the roof insulation and how that would hold up in our Canadian winters.
@@johnnyv5995 If building new I would look into using SIPs for the roof, even if the walls are conventionally framed. Basically Matt is creating a SIP type panel on site here. Using a commercial SIP system you could eliminate the cost of a lot of the roof framing, as the panels can span many feet on their own.
The main point to pay attention to with SIPs in cold climates is to make sure the panel joints are well sealed from the inside. This can be done with the high quality tapes now available, like Siga Wigluv.
Thermapan and InsulSpan are 2 SIP manufacturers with production facilities in Canada.
Decking providing tensile strength is something new. All those deck joints will one up under tension.
So good.😊
The collar ties are really important!
As a German its really interesting seeing american builds. Especially the joy of this attic space.
As in Germany, or even europe, its totally normal to have this kind of roof without beams in the middle, even on flatter roofs we just build in an triangle form.
If one does not remember (study) history, then after re-inventing the wheel a greater level of self-congratulation is allowed.
For a large part, the difference comes from the difference in the base materials. European houses are often made with concrete/stone structural members, instead of American wooden framing.
This isn’t reinventing the same idea, because you’re starting from a very different base. It’s a bit false superiority to degrade him for achieving the same goals but from a very different base.
Same here in the Netherlands, bild my roof this way, it wasnt even a question to do it a different way.
@@wolflegion_ You must not know much about the history of wood-framed residential structures in the US/ North America. Matt's novel attic is exactly what has been done for decades, centuries even, in large parts of this country. Trusses are the modern marvel, and came about because of need for speed and economy of production, exaggerated by the lack of skilled or properly trained labor. It has zero to do with masonry or "base materials". All Matt did was use Advantech instead of board flooring/ sheathing, and LVL's, to give himself a bit of false superiority (and rub it in our faces that he gets special deals on cost, not that that would be a factor for anyone else). And let's be clear, Matt did not build "TRUSSES" here. The bearing wall on the second floor is a necessary and critical design structural element. The splice in the ceiling/ floor joists would collapse if not supported by that wall, unlike a truss, which is able to be placed and carry loads as a free-standing structural element. Matt did a nice job of joists and rafters, with modern engineered expensive wood products. That is not novel, in my book.
Are your attics in Germany usually conditioned spaces? If they're not conditioned then there isn't much value in having an open attic. Household goods don't last when the temperatures are hitting 50c.
Do you have fixed steps or pull down ladder to get to the attic?
Need to show more about cost comparisons and energy savings pay back on the lumber and insulation, smaller furnace and ac demand. Would love to build a new house using more of these types of construction.
Great videos
Would love to see an engineer go over the calculations and the plans, interspersed with a walk around of the framing. Something similar to what Steve Baczek on the Build Show network, but with an engineer’s perspective.
As an structural Engineer who designs single family and multifamiltyy with lumber, you do not want to see those calcs. Lol you would need an engineering major or atleast a physics degree to even begin to understand the calcs.
@@MrFernando9602 umm no, not at all; most of the calcs are algebraic; you dont need a physics degree to do either of the two types of truss analysis; just geometry and trig
@@benbauer7016 I argue against this. It’s not just geometry. Thats less than half of it. The other part is strength of materials and stability design. Analysis (to determine forces) is different from design (sizing a member). There are definitely structural concepts that took the majority of people at my school a while to grasp. Everything is simple under you delve a bit deeper. That’s when it’s hard
Love your videos. Have learned a lot over the years. Really appreciate it. Question is do you need a fan to take out moisture from a house that is insulated w/ spray foam.
I think rafter tails are good to keep drainage away from vertical exterior walls , my thinking might be old school though . Also we used to call those horizontal rafter supports , collar ties , and they were supported by a center support 2 x 4 going up to the ridge and then secured . Thank You for your knowledge .
Aren't those rafter tails good for shading from the sun as well?
He added large overhangs, you can see them at the end of the video.
Thanks. Now I want to rebuild my 1968 roof that I cannot move around in without a lot of dodging and squatting!
Matt👍 Forgot to mention. EVERYTHING'S Man made , engineered.
Structure 2X4s and such 👍❗
I am actually a little amazed Whit Smith seems to perfectly understand the situation with the roof framing and ceiling joists. I have been disappointed repeatedly with Texas structural engineers and it's refreshing to see someone who knows what they are doing.
I wish smart/quality home design came in affordable, modest-sized houses. Everything is either built as cheaply and quickly as possible or it's a million+ dollar custom mansion. No modest, quality, ~2000sq/ft homes seem to exist. At least not in my market.
Dr Droop
I’ll make you one
Not enough profit margin for a reasonable sized house (but I consider 2,000 square feet house as too big).
Agreed, Maryland suburbs are expensive poorly built houses that are too big. I would love to try that exterior roof insulation design, this guy has lots of very interesting insights: ruclips.net/video/Ld8pzIu45F8/видео.html
Nobody (well, most people) would pay for it. This series is a good example of how an extra 15% cost here, extra 20% cost there would start to bump the total cost of the house well above other comparables for $/sq ft. Most homebuyers would rather have an extra 500sq/ft of space or fancy finishes over 2x6 engineered framing that is covered by drywall. You'd lose money when you go to sell, or it might cause issues with appraisal.
There is no market for a modest, quality home. The Majority of home buyers:
1. Want the most space for their buck: answer cheap & poor quality
2. Most homeowners move about every 10 years or less, so they have no long term interest in the home.
If you want a 2,000sqft home that is quality built you have go with a custom home.
Matt - you left off one important part of the "sealed" attic.... Ventilation - many homes have attic odors like mold an insulation etc. However, passive vents waste energy in the winter & present a fire hazard what is the the update solution? Add HVAC to circulate air in the attic since all spaces need some air circulation?
Lol, why are people liking this comment? What makes you think his current system isn't already conditioning the air in the attic? He said as much in the video. Where is this fire hazard coming from?
Nice assembly. Is there a need or benefit in the order of assembly. For example, since the attic floor is stressed in tension, is the attic floor installed before anything above it?
Two weeks ago, I used those Spax power lags to install a wall hanging vanity in a bathroom.
Just got my floor I-joists in. I was surprised to see a wood top and bottom plate inside of these Boise Cascade I-joists that have a LVL top and bottom plate. Hope mine stands up!
I did the exact same thing in my attic I figured it was simple and sturdy and that was really all that mattered to me. Well I didnt want it cluttered up either
So Nice! -- QUESTION -- Matt, we really wish you had an episode on building this attic. We have checked and I can't find that episode. Is it possible to post it after all this time? Would love to see how it was actually built.
Need Whit on more videos!
My question is about the roof. Will the top layer of zip that is right under the shingles or metal end up soaked with moisture? How would you stop that moisture transfer or vapor transfer? That top layer of zip is basically acting like the layer over a spray foamed attic so that's why I ask. I'm about to build and cant decide to vent the attic or not or do some version of that
One interesting question is, if the trusses were design as a integral 3 piece truss. How did you manage the trusses where the bottom joists had to go through the staircase entrance in the attic, that had to be an interrupted truss, did you just connected to the wall below it?
Hey Matt just wondering if you know when your next visit out to Demo Ranches Abandoned Manson is going to be?
I have a question. If you were to convert a vented attic house to a non-vented attic house and create a controlled ventilation, how would you go about it? My project is a small cabin with two vents in the attic and I want to seal it off from the elements and temperatures to make a very high efficiency home. I want to use an outside insulation possess but I don't know how I should vent it properly.
So nice! -- QUESTION -- Matt we noticed that you didn't use any Closed Cell Spray Foam insulation for your personal house. We know that you get sponsor prices for insulation and that is very cool, but would you have preferred closed cell insulation or a combination "spray and batt", if you had the proper sponsors? We don't know if this is a statement against closed cell or just a business arrangmenet?
Matt do you board up that open gap at the end of the roof truss? or leave it open? The part where the roof truss meets the floor truss.
My engineer. Pretentious a bit. Simple solution that just lets us slap in LVLs LAMS BOX BEAMS TO EASILY SISTER TO our EXISTING. STEP BY STEP AS YOU WISH FROM ONE END TO THE OTHER - AS THE 94% CAN ONLY AFFORD TO DO. ONE long/bolted STEEL STRONG BACK 1/2" x 3" it flexes. Slipped in beforehand.
So sawn and engineered lumber mixed for the floor joists and no ties straps from the plate to the studs?
Matt, this is turning out really nice. Are you gonna give up the family home and move here when it’s done? It’d be a nice reward in this time of Covid. Blessings
On our larger homes in Connecticut we frame on the attic deck and use a joist hanger upside down to hold the rafter , just curious.
Beautiful -- QUESTION -- WERE You tempted to leave the attic bear of any insulation and just use the exterior insulation? Looks so nice without insulation and would be awesome leaving it exposed.
Is floor insulation (ceiling for room underneath) required or desired?
Going back doing another reprogramming of my mind...lol. The older I get, the more that I like to make sure that my practices supercede my age... okay probably not possible, hence the reviews of older info that you have provided! Thank you brother... by the way, in these reviews, then back to current day, it seems you are looking younger every day, lol ! KUDO'S !
Seth
Do you have a dedicated staircase for the attic or is it going to be a pull down ladder style? If it is the latter, what product/brand will you use? Thanks!
How do i vault a mobile home ceiling with standard wood roof
In my attached 3 car garage, I have 10 foot ceilings. With roof trusses above, is this the best way to vault the ceilings so that I can get enough room for a vehicle lift?
That is going to be a great HOME love all the design details
Can you do this in a remodle, as far as the insulation ??? Thanks
Hey thank you for this, I'm building a very small house, 16 by 24 ft. Can you tell me how big si that attic?
Thanks!!
Just want to say big fan and love all the vids I’ve learned a lot.
So I was watching you news vid and it seems at 4:21 minutes in I notice that your zip tap is missing on some of your zip boards on the front of the house
Meh, that was many weeks ago and they weren't anywhere near done with air sealing.
Matt, I read through a ton of replies and didn't find this. What is the pitch of the roof, and the span? I want to do a loft in a cabin style house. And of course a steeper pitch gets you more head room, but yours seemed a pretty reasonable pitch.
Do Coller ties reduce the run of the rafter if been calculating the span on my rafter s from bottom connection to we're they meet the collar tie
Now do this but without a joist to hold the walls together.
With attics that are part of the conditioned envelope a subtle yet significant physics is surface area to volume. It is the surfaces that transfer heat while the envelope contains it. If you add your attic to the conditioned envelope you have "spent" less surface area to achieve more volume. That is also why larger houses can more effectively condition the larger space they contain. So when factoring the cost of enclosing the attic its really a matter of how much that usable volume costs as a ratio of surface area then consider how much of it is usable space. Its not usable as living space but just for the HVAC that already makes the room it takes up useful. The remainder is conditioned storage space.