HOT SURFACE IGNITOR Training for Gas Furnaces! HSI Types, Operation, Troubleshooting!
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- Опубликовано: 17 мар 2022
- In this HVAC Training Video, I Show How to Test if a HSI is Bad without having to take it out for a Visual Inspection and Accidentally Breaking it. I cover Silicon Nitride and Silicon Carbide HSI's. I explain and show types, installation location, testing, and the sequence of operation for a gas furnace in heating mode. I show Silicon Nitride and Silicon Carbide HSI's. Supervision is needed by a licensed HVACR Tech while performing tasks as Experience and Apprenticeship garners Wisdom and Safety.
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Information in this video is intended for educational purposes only. Any work related to the topics in this video should be performed by licensed technicians or by apprentices under the supervision of licensed technicians. AC Service Tech LLC is not responsible for any possible damages or injuries caused by the use or misuse of any information provided.
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I’m still learning loved your videos. I broke an igniter I learned the hard way . Just graduated from HVAC school and I’m learning more from your videos than school.
Excellent, just an excellent video...I see in comments they are used in ovens and such...True, and if the amperage draw and the Resistance as they get weaker is not enough the gas valve will not open...The igniter will glow but it still will not open the gas valve...Most require 2.5 - 3amps on an amp probe to open the safety valve on an oven...Thanks for a great video.
Absolutely on the money with all of your insights. I was having a problem with an igniter that only worked once. It turned out that the angle on it was the issue. It needed to be slightly angled and little closer to the burners to ignite. Saved me lots of money and additional frustrations. Great video! 👍👍👍
When I worked for an LP gas company we used to check amperage. I forget the specifics but the flat and round operated at different amperage.
Thanks so much for this video. It is a super clear explanation of how an ignitor works and how to troubleshoot it. My furnace was not making heat and I was on the verge of looking for an HVAC company to come out and fix it but that would have undoubtedly cost me hundreds of dollars and days of delay. This video showed me that my ignitor was bad and I was able to fix it myself. I used a voltmeter to confirm that AC was reaching the ignitor and that the resistance of the ignitor was zero. My furnace is a Trane and I was only getting a max of about 3.5 volts AC before it stepped down to 1.2 volts. The repair was actually quite simple, just replace the ignitor. Thanks again for this excellent video!!! You're a rock star!!!
These tips not only are useful to HVAC but also to dryers and ovens.
I'm not an HVAC tech but I am interested in your troubleshooting videos and guides and bought your AC Service Tech e-book because it is some of the best documentation I have seen on furnace and AC maintenance and troubleshooting. Thanks for doing this video.
Important to note that the resistance with these igniters changes with heat. May start out at 20-50Ω but that resistance multiplies ~10X when powered for current regulation and longevity.
Thanks, your video’s really help grasp the whole concept from the the text book to actual imagery and functionality
Your videos are great man, thanks for all the content.
Another great video. Thanks again , always a subscriber
Thank you. Very interesting video. Great tips.
great job Craig
Very good information. Thanks 😊
A AC clamp on meter Worked for the Oven I was working on. The valve was labeled with expected current range.
Ty so much for ur educational video
I learned a lot
great vid
Thank you good information
depends on manufacturers specs, some carriers say they should be replaced if the resistance is over 90 ohms. The 98 ohm should be replaced. Be proactive!
Thank you!
Thank You!!!
My heat just went out and i live in a small town. I managed to self diagnose and pull the ignitor and it has a huge crack in it plus corrosion. Had to order the part and now waiting for it to come while i freeze to death in my own home.
Thank you again for all that you do for the industry!
If you zoom in on the one in the middle that is bad when he applies power, you can see tiny arcs across the crack. Those heat the crack, which likely expands enough to cause the ignitor to start flowing enough current to glow. As with anything, those arc will eventually erode (pit) the crack causing complete failure.
Craig these videos are amazing, I’ve been in this field 16 years and there’s always stuff to learn, not a day goes by when I’m not trying to better myself and learn something new! Thanks for these videos bud!! I knew most if not all of this information but I just wanted to thank you! How about spark ignition type systems do you have a video on those, such as Rheem/Rudd furnaces?
Thank you so much Tom. we have some older vids on spark ignition. Look up "acservicetech spark ignition" thanks!
I found this very educational. Thanks. A few questions when it comes to replacing a HSI. Would accidentally touching the element during installation cause shorter lifespan due to skin oils? Some folks tell me you should take precautions similar to changing out a halogen lamp, that is, use rubbing alcohol if accidentally touched, to remove skin oils that can hot spots and damage the glass when the lamp is turned on. Others say it doesn't affect a hot surface ignitor. Any other precautions that should be considered when removing or installing a hot surface ignitor?
Good, got mine repaces yesterday after it went poopie in the trousers.
When you applied power, a tiny flash occurred on the defective unit and it started glowing in a small area. That would have been an intermittent failure mode. BTY the good one on the left was drawing 245W and the small one on the right was drawing 300W.
great demo
"Hot surface igniter fact sheet" has helped me quite a bit
can you do a video on communicating thermostats?
Hi! What about flame sensing using a HSI for example in trane units? Thank you. I enjoy your videos
Hi Craig did you have a fire extinguisher for this video
on the stand by
Good stuff
Would like to see videos on low nox furnaces, please...
That first one got hot 😂 started to burn the wood
Hi Sir, Thanks a lot for the video. Learned a lot. Here, I've got a question to ask for help. My house has a Goodman 2 Stage gas furnace. Recently it stopped working. I doubted the failure of the control board so I ordered one and replaced it. But it still doesn’t work. Problem is same. After the further check, I've noticed that if I connect all 5 pin connecter (link inducer and igniter), the draft inducer won’t work. It has only a couple of volts. But the ingiter has around 110 volts of power. When I disconnect either end of the line to igniter (on 5 pin connecter), the inducer runs, but igniter doesn’t (surely, no power in). When the inducer runs, it runs normally and smoothly. No any sign of problem. The igniter has 48 ohm when tested continuity. Seems also good. What could be the cause? Thanks.
I had a No Heat call in 2019. I went there and tested every part for heat. The Hot Surface Igniter was not very bright. I took ahold of the connector and turned it to see the part numbers. The igniter started to glow real bright. What was the problem? Just some corrosion on a contact at the connector. That was the second job for that customer. The first was a no cooling call. The capacitor for the indoor fan was replaced. The classic bowing of the top of the capacitor. My thiord time there was to replace the return air register. It sits low on the wall and does get hit at times. The customer inquired about the register on the first job.
Are these igniters in direct vent hot water heaters?
The third one looks like a diesel glow plug. Are they the same in operation?
Do you have a heating/ furnace/ boiler book on the market.?
How do you check for micro-amps on a furnace using the hot surface igniter as both the igniter and sensing rod? After having disappeared, (I thought), they’re back. I’m wrong. The system I was remembering was intermittent spark. What I’m seeing now is silicon nitride hot surface.
is possible to change a HSi silicon Carbide for a HSI silicon Nitride?. Thanks
On the 24v ignitor. How many ohms if bad? Over 10 is bad right? Fact sheet says should be 4-10 ohms.
Mine will glow bright red but sometimes won't glow at all, I did notice a little white spot on it so could it be going out?
Does which wire goes to where matter for the igniter? I was trying to replace mine and cannot remember which one went to which side of the igniter.
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👍👍
Thanks again for the videos.
🥃🥃🍺🍺🍺⛳🎳
Stay safe.
Retired (werk'n)keyboard super tech. Wear your safety glasses!
my igniter is in a caloric oven, glows but does not lite burner for oven. caloric site made it sound as tho if its weak then it wont open gas valve and i should replace igniter. does it have to be cracked to be bad/weak?? or can it just be old age? ( my caloric oven is 30+ yrs old or so) ... I'm just asking cuz from what i see, i don't see any cracks in it ...
Hvac newbie here…. If its glowing evenly no white residue, but measures 130 ohms is it still good? Is there a definite limit?
@@FloatingLeaf1111 @E Man over the years on equipment I've found that 45 to 75 is OK, anything above 100/125 I recommend replacement, a lot of people decide against it the first time you recommend something like that especially if theyve never had a 95 dollar ignitor shut their furnace down lol.
I typically do an amp draw as well as ohm check. On the silicon carbide, I generally like to see at least 3 amps. Under 3 amps on a carbide means it might not be getting hot enough. I don't remember off hand the amp draw on silicon nitride, I've had virtually no issues with those. About the only failures I've seen with the nitrides are from getting wet from leaking condensate.
At 40 ohms they are pulling 3 amps so on a 120v circuit heating at 360 watts. But at 120 ohms, they would only pull 1 am so 120 watts. So in still air, the 40 ohm will turn red 3 times faster than the 1 ohm. And the lower wattage also runs the risk that even the flowing gas could cool it to the point where it doesn't get hot enough to ignite the gas.
@@FloatingLeaf1111Something to consider is the pressure of the gas is only 3.5" w.c. or 11" w.c. manifold pressure, which is under 1/3 of a psi max. the inducer whipping around at 3000 rpm is going to cool the ignitor down a lot more than the gas flow. Ive found position of the ignitor to be alot more important than pressure or even the condition of the ignitor all important, but also Dirty burner or turbolator wont help either
You just check the manufacturer literature for the acceptable range. If it’s outside that range then replace it
I made a mistake and (preventative maintenance reasons) cleaned my silicone nitride version, which looks just like the newest style in your video. I used 0000 steel wool, then cleaned it with alcohol before re-installation. It was in super good physical condition and worked fine, before and after. Will this likely shorten its life?
Yes!
Ah yes, the hot surface igniter. Or as I call em' the "Don't even sneeze in it's general direction...just make sure the burners run" Those asshole things will crack if you so much as remove a screw for the in-shot burners to clean them. Not worth getting a system with one if you enjoy maintenance.
Since i switched to commercial/ industrial a few years ago......i almost never see a HSI anymore. Only on Trane Voyagers. Everything else uses spark. RTU's, MUA'S, Boilers, Unit Heaters. Obviously there are still different brands who use a HSI, but as a generalization most don't. I think Rheem is one of the only residential brands that still uses spark ignition. I like spark better than HSI.
My igniter glowed but didn’t ignite the furnace. It’s a silicone nitride so the resistance is 49 which is good? Where else should I check? Thank you.
Check gas valve
My gas furnace has SPARK ignition which has proven to be very reliable, so I’ve always questioned the HOT SURFACE IGNITOR. Why use them when they always fail. How would you convert from hot surface ignitor to spark ignition.
Thank you.
Hot surface has finally caught up with spark in reliability with the silicon nitride. Why HSI vs Spark? Spark ignition requires a more complicated circuit to produce the spark, where hot surface is just a relay with 120v and most spark have intermittent pilot, so a more complicated gas valve, a pilot and tubing for the pilot. It wouldn't be impossible to change from hot surface to spark, but the furnace was not engineered to have that type of ignition and the liability of changing it could be substantial. But to answer your question, the 3 main differences between hot surface and spark are: 1. the ignition module or control board has to be spark. 2. The gas valves are likely different as mentioned before. 3. The ignitor would have to be replaced with a spark/pilot assembly.
Intermittent pilot with spark pilot ignition is likely what you have. That way the pilot flame is proven before turning on the gas full. If you try to light the burner with spark ignition, you could end up with a cabinet full of gas if the ignition failed. And then you could have an explosion.
Should the gas not immediately ignite with a hot surface ignitor being poorly placed, it will sooner rather than later thus reducing the risk of gas build up.
Ultimately, a pilot, even intermittent, is a cost for the gas, an impact on the efficiency and likely was essentially abandoned to meet government climate change regulations.
How about spark ignition?
Great video on the HSI, appreciate all your shared knowledge, keep up the great work
Why would leaving the ignitor in make any difference when testing for ohms
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