*UPDATE* 7.62X39 Palmetto State Armory AAC ammo issues! Spec's and alt measurement test.
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- Опубликовано: 1 июн 2024
- Wow! 😀👍🦬🦅🪶🌩
I was glad to see so many people engaged in conversations, questions, and suggestions when I reviewed Palmetto State Armory's AAC 7.62x39 ammunition.
Here is my follow-up video to the comments, etc. across my social media platforms to see if there is a way to fix this and spoiler alert (#ain'tthemag)
Please note, I said "Tapco rifle" in the video. I meant "Tapco mag in my SKS rifle."
TOGETHER, we will get this issue resolved.
** UPDATE** Just received a refund for the remainder of the ammunition.
Much appreciation to Matt and Melissa of Palmetto State Armory for their promptness and professionalism.
Working together, I am sure we can resolve the issue between the manufacturer and end user.
😀👍🦬🦅🪶🌩
Johnny, I was a class 6 ammunition manufacturer back in the 80’s and 90's, loading custom rounds for two dozen very dedicated individuals, and three police department's training ammo. And have 60 years of experience in loading ammunition overall. I can tell at a glance, that the ammunition you're having issues with are simply not seated to the correct depth. If I were you, I'd contact the manufacturer, and advise them the lot numbers for the ammunition in question, and advise them they have not seated the bullet deep enough to be within specifications.
As to correcting your ammunition you have, locate a reloader with appropriate dies, and have him seat the bullets to the correct depth. This is easily done with proper dies. Otherwise, separate the too long rounds, and shoot them from more "forgiving " magazines. That's the "easy button " method. 😏
Good luck with finding your reloader.👍
Wade
*Update* I just got off the phone with Melissa at Palmetto State Armory and they will look into the issue.
It.was good ro finally talk to a human being, and hopefully it will yield a better product for all of us.
Nice, better products for all! Appreciate your efforts!!!
AAC needs to get on top of this and make it right. If you can't trust your ammo and are forced to check each and every round one by one, they need to be paying me for doing there QA work. I was all worked up about them making a replacement for the imported stuff, but not now.
Great content, thanks for sharing. I want to believe in PSA but I keep seeing videos with issues on QC on everything from guns to ammo. Seems like they're just rushing too much out too fast and it's coming at the expense of the consumer. As it stands, I won't buy their guns anymore, or their ammo until I see people are consistently getting better results. And I'm not a hater, I want them to succeed and continue to grow.
I have two ak’s and a JAKL and two daggers. No problems.
It's very dependant on the product line. You also need to understand how PSA is organized, every single product line is a completely separate entity. QC issues in their AKs are not indicative of their Daggers, or issues with ammo has no relevance to their AR line. Which is kinda a bad setup for a company, but it's how they run. Generally anytime PSA starts a new line of products you need to watch that line specifically, because they have their own engineers, R&D staff, facility, production line, etc.
PSA last month warranted an upper for me that was not right.
They paid shipping both ways and I had it back in about 3 weeks.
I’ve tested it and it works great now.
My two cents.
If you search for videos about issues, you’ll find them. That still doesn’t give us any idea about how prevalent some issue is, and people have zero understanding of statistics.
Yeah there's a reason why I never bought any guns from them, I have shot there AAC 9mm and AAC 5.56 with no problems ammo is hotter pressure than Winchester white box stuff I've noticed, but yeah I do agree 100% with ya I have not stock piled any aac just speer gold dot g2 duty ammo, lake city, tulammo, golden tiger, red army standard, wolf, barnaul, pmc xtac, Winchester 9mm NATO, federal, Hornady, tela impex ammo, 7n6, m855, freedom munitions ammo as well. I refuse to buy there firearms
The way I see it. You either take the ammo back, Use it in a mag that will accept them or reseat them .022”. And if you’re concerned with water proof ing finger nail polish works wonders. And would definitely get in touch with the manufacturer and let them know there’s an issue.
I love your channel, I was completely expecting this though seeing how it's ammo made by PSA with their notorious qc problems.
Great video! I love the new addition to the end! Good work! ❤
@chelle71668 I am glad you like it.
😀👍🦬🦅🪶🌩
Well done and explained. Keep up the good work.
Damn i was kinda hoping this was a 2 year old video, and maybe they've got it together by now. I just bought some 9mm ammo from them. I hope its not a mixed batch like that 7.62x39. Great job on the video and thank you for putting this out there for people to see.
@davidcampbell8599 I am hoping they have upped their QC on the 7.62x39 ammo. A little more attention to detail and it could have been a fine product. Some other people have let me know the round fellt undercharged, as in there wasn't enough powder in the casing.
Hopefully, with information like this they can improve the product.
Good work Johnny. Hopefully PSA can get this sorted out. I bought some of the black tip. Hope it’s ok.
Yep. When I reload, I keep my rounds within 0.005" and don't go over max OAL.
Dang!! I just got ad from PSA on these, this a.m. Was considering ordering a batch this p.m. Whoa! TY!
Thanks for posting.
Thanks for the data!
THANK YOU JOHNNY
Great information 👍
Thanks for the info.
That tells the story ...
Will the long rounds feed in your AK mags. ???
There are specs. for a reason !!!
Great job Johnny , God bless ...
@@1mrgasgas1 So far I haven't run into any feeding issues with AK mags YET.
Even though it's over maximum length, it would fit & function fine in every SKS & AK mag I have. I don't have any plastic SKS mags to measure.
@@praktikalnurse504 That is good to hear ... I just think that the OEM would have a little more wiggle room , but I have been wrong be4 ... I'll have to get some and try in something ...God bless and thanks for the update ...
Thank you
Matt here with PSA. Happy to return the ammo for a refund. Just reach out with your order number or case number should you already have one.
I'm pretty sure that DOT regulations prevent returns of ammunition.
Awesome.
@@baileyparadis1815I’ve returned ammo before to a different company for an exchange when I was sent the wrong ammunition. Not every place will allow ammo shipments though.
@mattpsa Thanks! I just off rhe phone with Melissa at customer care, and I will return what's left of the ammo if y'all can arrange that.
She said I will be getting an email soon, and I will fill it out on my next day off.
I am not asking for a refund, but only asking for a chance to Pow Wow so this doesn't happen to anyone else.
Thanks for your attention in this matter.
Poor QC seems to be a reoccurring theme at PSA. Its why I don't buy your product and I've convinced several others not to.
Had the same problem with a certain brand of 5.45x39 for the AK74...would jam so much. I thought it was the rifle until I changed ammo(s). Then everything was fine using every ammo, but not the one I had bought originally. Tried to use that ammo again only to have the same feeding issues. Trying to figure out what the deal was...I then noticed it was slightly longer than the other brands. Thanks for the video.
Didn’t even have any issues with my AAC 7.62x39,(Magpul 30 round) I’ll be checking them out now.
Thanks a big help.
Haven’t measured my black tips(didn’t order any fmj) and they all loaded into mags fine and looked fine to me, I have some experience with reloading this caliber and can actually tell size differences just from looking , seem fine to me but thanks for the info I’m sure they will fix this
#warrenog499 in my previous video of the 7.62x39 AAC ammo, the black tips checked out fine
One reason it’s good to wait a while when something new comes out, wait till the bugs are gone!👌🏼
Cough... sig
I couldn't post a link on "Buffman's" channel in the comments on his AAC ammo test. I did mention your problem. His son was shooting their Yugo SKS, The primer got pierced and blew back a lot of smoke. I am guessing the primer pocket is either off indepth, or the primer wasn't set deep enough. I have some Wolf that has the primers set too deep. God bless PSA! They are probably going through a learning curve. Guys like you are going to help them identify, snd sort out the problems.
Easy fix, set a bullet seating die to push ibullet in to correct over-all length.... give yourself a half- millimeter shorter than max length, even a full mm. won't hurt.....but yes, it should be right coming out of the box from the factory!
The Maximum Overal Length of the 7.62X39 is 2.20" (55.9mm). I just measured a few mags for internal dimensions.
Russian SKS 2.25" (57.2mm)
Romanian Steel AK 2.24" (56.9mm)
Bulgarian Steel AK 2.25" (57.2mm)
Tapco AK Plastic 2.25" (57.2mm)
Promag AK Plastic 2.245" (57mm)
Its 56 mm. CIP shows 56 mm. SAAMI used 2.20 inch (55.88 and it is 55.88 on their engineering drawings) because of Inches.
Just ONE of the reasons I load my own
If you were a reloader or know someone, seating them a bit would be the fix... but the factory should have caught that in quality control.
Yep. Apparently their qc isn't strict enough, need to tighten it up.
I just had a case neck separation with this ammo last weekend. Sent an email to PSA and no response yet. Scared the crap out of me, it jammed one round into the neck of the other and i had to really yank on the charging handle to get the live round out. Took a few pics and sent it to them. Have run a few thousand rounds of other ammo brands without issue so im doubting its any head spacing issue.
Woah! what gun?
@@BuffRANGE it was a KUSA kp104
I've had problems with their 300 Blackout ammo. I've had multiple rounds where the primer comes out after the round was fired and the primer gets smashed in BCG or the primer sticks out causing feed issues
Hopefully this will get corrected soon.
I love psa, but out of spec ammo is a no go. I have faith they'll figure it out.
It's definitely out of spec. SAAMI Maximum Overal Length is 2.20" (55.9mm)
@brianhoxworth3881 I have faith they will listen to a bigger RUclipsr than me. As many times as I have tried to contact them, and have gotten no response, ....well I will just leave it at that for now
The rounds on the left appear to be crimped at the cannelure, but not the ones on the right. Are all these from the same lot?
@agrif762. Yes. They are all from the AAC plastic ammo can you see to the left.
Their quality needs addressed in general for all products, my PSA AKV9 is junk for the $1100… it’s been 2 weeks and I haven’t even heard from the the warranty department to get my firearm sent back in to even get started… Major headspace issues
Most all, and I'm sure PSA production lines has sensors checking for out of spec products as they move through the production phase. They should have caught this one.
My ammo from them was the same. More out of spec than good! Be safe!
I'm fine with bi-metsl jackets, boxer primers are nice as you can reload steel cases so many times.
If they purchased all the machining from a ex USSR ammo plant they could crank them out slot cheaper at a better quality.
The gilded metal uses for bimetslnjackets and berdan primers are very cheap and also berdan primers are cheaper to make.
But I'm sure PSA / AAV can't make their own smokeless powder and priming compounds.
Would be nice if they sold spam cans also.
What a bummer, I just bought a bunch of the stuff except I got the Soviet ammo by PSA. I wonder if it’s the same and just packaged different. It is new for PSA and AAC, I’m sure they will tighten up the dimensions and get it right eventually. Growing pains for sure, you have to respect them though for making it so that Americans can get their 7.62 X 39
If it fits in the magazine its fine
Dude I just shot 150 rounds of the AAC x39 FMJ in a Zpap m70 and it Ran flawlessly,, and yes the cannelure sticks above the case in a lot of the shells.. but they all ran.. I even put some in a pmag and some in a Yugo mag…But,, even still they shouldn’t be out of wack like that.. I think they rushed them out to get them on the market and hopefully they fix them
Does it fit in real AK magazines ?
@billwilson7981 the ammo I pulled at random fit the AKs with only a few minor glitches. I only used a Romanian mag and one of my XTech Tactical for the AKs and didn't try any others at the time I made the original video.
just did this same test i was doing in inches in my last comment on the other vid the ones showing less cannelure were 55.8,55.6,55.6 the ones with more were all constant 56.1 my other ammo is tella brand was 55.5,55.6 and 55.4 theses were 3 rounds each again haven't shot em just thought id send this
also the tella ammo i have has been going through my 64 Chinese sks for months now no issues
last 4 are not fully seated and not crimped properly. Its a QA prob.
PSA would most likely replace the ammo if you notify them.
I won't be buying any of it at US prices for sure though.
Now, they won't fit into the mag but will they be dangerous to use if you were just loading one at a time per shot?
@Strigon01 PSA sent me a shipping label to return the ammo back to them. In the first video, there was no fitment problem with the 2 AK mags I used. I did have a light primer strike, and off camera I did have one round that didn't go off immediately. Good thing I had the barrel pointed down range.
Just received my ammo from them. There definitely looks like an issue with the bullet seating, doesnt look consistent. No problems loading in pmags, is it a safety issue shooting this stuff?
@TheKlamminator It loaded fine with my AKs, though I did have one hang fire I didn't catch on camera, and a light primer strike I did catch on recording with my MAK-90. My Romy WASR had no issues with cycling it. BOTH rifles felt like there wasn't enough "Ooomph" to them, for want of a better term.
Would I ever buy it again? Not until the problems are ironed out.
Please know my tests were my own experience, so others may vary.
@@praktikalnurse504 thank you for the response, good to know it ran okay, nobodywants a catastrophicfailure. I'll probably run it and not buy anymore from them unless they bump up the QC
I just ordered 762 from them. Hopefully i have better luck than you. Luckily I ordered a bunch of tula beforehand. I feel like, that things today are made with a priority of speed and mass quantity first. Rather than quality being priority first.
This and the underpowered nature of the ammunition based on another YT channel, doesn't give me warm and fuzziess about their supposedly soon to be released 5.45. At this point you might as well shoot Tela
Chamber pressures are great to start with...have NO CHOICE but to do it correctly PSA!
I've seen too many videos of PSA AK's falling apart after 2-3k rounds. It doesn't surprise me that their ammo is out of spec. I only have imported 7.62x39 ammo, glad I bought enough to last my lifetime
@oacardelta1257 now I will get back to going to gun shows and finding the Com-bloc ammo from independent sellers who are clearing out their stash.
@praktikalnurse504 Yep that's a good idea. I know if I kick the bucket before the wife she will be selling all of my ammo.
Sampling bias
@praktikalnurse504 Johnnie, others have had the same feeding issues in their AK's so something isn't right with the PSA ammo.
Years ago I was all in on Psa until I bought a Ak 47 from them. Had crazy feeding issues and never worked. After a month of emailing them and them telling me to clean it or lube it they finally had me send it in. I got the rifle back and it had the same issues. After sending it in again and them saying it was fixed, it had the same issues. Then I bought an ar and after a couple of magazines the gas block walked off the front. Again, it took weeks to be able to send it in for repairs. Now qc issues with their ammo. They have lost their way and my business
@mikemartin-vt4to. I always try have hope. I am hoping if companies hear our concerns, eventually they will fix the problem
Were those 4 rounds just from one box or a whole case type thing?
@@noneyabiz8225 they were from the 250 round plastic ammo box
I think I should make a vid bling testing my aac ammo just to see
I made the vid thanks for the inspiration !
At least you received the correct ammo.. I ordered 250 rds of the same thing. The sticker on the box said 7.62x39, but in it was a bag of .223. I requested an exchange. They asked for pictures, in which I sent. They then provided me with a return label. After it was returned, I got an email saying there was nothing they could do and that they were sending the WRONG ammo back to me. I don't understand how there's "nothing they can do" when they sent me the wrong stuff and the bag was unopened. They did give me a 5% discount code. So I ordered 2 boxes. If it's not right this time, I'm done buying from them. I have been a customer since 2017.
@eparkerh15 Sorry this happened to you. I will say that we are all humans, and there will be mistakes made. However, they should own up to the mistakes and take care of their customers. We as consumers should hold their feet to the fire and be responsible and take care of their mistakes.
They do have TulAmmo 7.62x39 on sale right now, if that helps
@praktikalnurse504 I was hoping by leaving this comment, they might see it and actually do something about it.
@@eparkerh15 @mattpsa
@eparkerh15 have you called their customer care center? [Matt] Palmetto State Armory
1 (803) 724-6950
@@praktikalnurse504 I will give that a try.
And this cost the same as brass from what ive seen.
@mobilegamersunite I want to say it was 9 bonez per box of 20. I already forgot what I paid for the plastic ammo can with 250 rds, but I do remember calculating the price per round, and the plastic ammo can came out to be about 17/18 bonez. At the moment I didn't really care so long as I had enough ammo for a fair honest review.
@praktikalnurse504 yeah the Tula steel case PSA is selling comes in at 50, ...so anything around 20 is awesome I would say.
What does it due in say another mag.? Like a mag for the AK it seemed to work in.?
I just mic'd an assortment of SKS & AK mags. The ammo is over maximum length for SAAMI & CIP, but it would fit in every mag I measured.
Dude you should use the fat part of the caliper jaws whenever possible for the most accurate measurements. Only use the skinny part of the jaws in certain situations where you have to. 👍 Just trying to help. I was a machinist for quite a few yeass.
@kylejohnson1308 all the same line, just more to the balance, kind of like tight rope walking. 😉
Have not bought a single PSA product to date! Have not regretted my decision one bit so far. Quantity over quality just never works.
Measure from the Ogive and see what you get. Some ammo is loaded from the Ogive, making OAL meaningless. Especially in military type rifles with a huge jump to the throat vs tolerence of bolt action rifles.
Looks like the good aac rounds were crimped, while the out of spec were not. Maybe missed a step at the factory
@NDomore83 probably a QC issue they need to adress. PSA is notorious for then, but eventually, they apply enough boot to butt corrective action, and they get it right. 🤣🤣🤣
Unfortunately I don’t foresee PSA correcting their QC issues. Instead, they will focus their time on releasing a different caliber. That seems to be their business model. Release a huge variety of products without perfecting any of it. Stay relevant by staying in the headlines.
Kitty sharpening it’s murder mittens 😺
How is this happening? Machines off?
@Gunner-11zd I am guessing something in QC didn't catch it. Worked OK in my AKs with only a few hiccups, but definitely nothing I would substitute my Com-bloc stash or ATS ammo for.
Did you measure all the bullets from the ogive?…. I doubt they push the bullets in from the nose. The ogive will give more accurate measurements.
Have you talked with PSA? what is their warranty/refund/service in response to this out of spec ammo? I hate videos like this showing an issue with no talk of what the manufacturer is doing or not doing.
@jeremygrbj4745 I have called their customer service line, which is somewhat automated, multiple times. I keep getting hung up on without getting to speak to a human being. I have tagged them on my social media platforms and have got nothing but crickets.
I would be more than honored to work with them to adress this matter.
Had the same problem with Sig a year ago. Sig packed 115grain 9mm in 124grain boxes that sold for a few dollars more. I email Sig about the problem .I told them I have experience reloading 9 mm for 30 years. I also sent pictures of ammunition and remove the bullet from the case. Find out to be 115 grain 9mm not 124 that sold in the boxes that I purchased. SIG stop replying to my emails. So open the box before purchasing any Sig ammunition.
Im waiting on there 5.56
@DyllonMcDonald68 I bought some of their 5.56. Do you mean 5.45x39?
Man those cases sound hollow….. almost like they are empty….
You pull the bullet and reseat them for your video?
@MegaOldjoe I am a full-time nurse and full-time farmer. Do you think I have enough time to do that? 🤣🤣🤣🤣
If you're waiting for consistency and quality control out of Palmetto State Armory or any JJE Capital portfolio well then I've got a nice bridge still under construction to sell you
I’m not surprised at all, anything AK related with PSA attached to it has proven to be trash. I do hope and pray there’s an affordable alternative to the Russian steel case that hits the market soon, it must be equal in quality and reliability to the Russian ammo though for it to be successful. Thanks for the video.
What do your mags mike at?
@chknbskt the SKS mag I was using is 55.91mm, so anything past 56mm won't pass.
@@praktikalnurse504 what do your AK mags mic at?
@@chknbskt1I used a Romanian mag and an XTech Tactical mag
56.81mm and 57.34 resptively
I've not had any problem with my 7.62x39 ammo that I bought from AAC.
@frankhernandez6651 AWESOME! Hopefully, they addressed the batch I returned and dusted some butts with some boot therapy and fixed the problem. 🤣🤣🤣
Considering how many AK's are so out of spec ammo should work fine.....
@user-iw5ce9px34 It worked "OK" but not great on my AKs, In my first video, I went through about 100 on and off camera with one light primer strike and one hang fire in my Chinese MAK-90.
That's not a good, dependable ratio.
The other thing to consider is not all firearms chambered in 7.62x39 are AKs.
I wish I had an AR chambered in 7.62x39, a mini 30, and a modern Galil to do overall testing.
06/02/2024 Hello Johnny. Don
Checks ammo with Pro mag.
imagine my shock.. its PSA
PSA needs to wake up and fast. The economy is already showing signs of recession and people have less money to spend. PSA has already built a reputation of suspect quality and making garbage ammo will only make it worse. I was hoping for better. PSA better jump on this issue quickly or else they may soon find themselves out of business. I'm already surprised people put up with their terrible QC and keep coming back.
I mean. They aren't know for there QC hah. But that being said I'd run it hah
Me thinks PSA needs to just focus on American guns and ammo.
Mallet tap time ! Easy fix .
@bobwilson758 Noooooll!! 😂😂😂
An SKS with it's fixed magazine won't care as much as an AK about the rounds being a little longer than typical Russian ammo
6:53 "I don't wanna bash PSA....."
BRUH. It's OK. We've all been there. Now say it with me: fuck PSA. 👎
Palmetto at it again! As others have said their AKs are notorious for failures so seeing this ammo with OAL issues isn’t surprising. Disappointing yes, but we saw this coming.
Palmetto can do better, they just need massive overhauls in their QC department.
First!!!
50 cpr for crap ammo..... sounds like PSA
The bullet tip only matters for mag length. You need a tool that seats on the ogive of the bullet to properly measure the seating depth. This is in regards to the comment about the cannelures being too high. As far as the tips of the bullets, just take a pair of scissors or similar tool and cut the tips back a hair so they'll fit in your mags. Simple and easy to do, doesn't affect accuracy at a;; one bit. You have to remember, with your magazines, they are all over the place as far as length specs. The Russians, and every other communist country that made magazine had very sloppy manufacturing.They couldn't do the quality that we do here. The COAL allowed in each magazine is wildly different from mag to mag, and from country to country. Early, com bloc era Romanian and Ukrainian mags tended to be on the high side, Yugo and Russian a touch smaller, but the old 70s era Romanians were the best.
There are thousands with nmo issues with this ammo. I do believe the correct thing to do would be for PSA to shorten it by seating it .010-.020 deeper. That would eliminate the issues with the ammo being a tad long in some magazines.
We've had no issues with it here, but most of our mags are 70s and 80s era Romanian or Yugoslavian. It feeds fine in all of our mags ( my son and I).
Come on PSA! I'm not spending a cent. Johnny saud it best. I work hard for my money and get the payrate I'm at. I rather get cheaper for better quality.
I think they need to send a case to Johnny to do a unbias test.
@survivalistu6623 I don't want anything free, I just want them to fix the problem.
You are using old ass sks mags? I don't think aac is making ammo meant for ancient tapco mags?
People can make fun of the Tula ammo. Facts are that it’s great ammo.
@anthonybarnes8500. Works every time for me. Just wish I could still get it at $10 a box of 40 rds again. It's not gonna happen, but I will always try to show everyone what the alternatives are.
when using calipers take the measurement from the base of the jaws and not the tips if you can. itll help stop false readings
The ammo is in spec. The magazine is not. #FACTS
@j45acp69 not according to the data spread sheets I have read. 56mm is supposed to be the OAL. Read others comments #facts
He literally just showed that the ammo is out of spec.
oops
For all the cheerleading that people are doing for PSA I wonder if they are still doing it even though some issues have started to arise with their hand gun and apparently their ammo.
I’m not sure if PSA sells their ammo here in NY since they apparently want to treat us folks here like a red headed step child by not selling anything of theirs here maybe it’s a good thing. God forbid a state AG sues them for faulty advertising.
NY hates you, so it’s best to leave.
Poverty State Armory (POSa) strikes again.......
It sounds like you’re bitching about a problem that every single ammo manufacturer ever has had, and maybe you don’t understand there is no set spec for AK mags. It’s not like a AR that has a set spec for sizing. Every country has its own little thing, I’ve had plenty of Russian ammo that didn’t like to run in yugo mags, or whatever sometimes some guns don’t like some mags of the times they go in like butter
@Scott079 "bitching"..🤣🤣🤣
InterOrdinance PSA.
PSA just sucks....