As a Warframe player, the amount of time to build these things for free are nearly the same, the problem is rushing the build and how much it costs to just buy it out right, in Warframe it costs 20 platinum (4.99 USD gets you 75) to just buy OR you can buy them from vendors/earn them from special event missions or whatever and to rush the build it only costs 10 platinum while in TFD to buy one it's over 19.99 USD and unlike Warframe (atleast for now) you are only given two for free (one for getting a descendant to level 40 and another for beating the main story) and farming these things are absolute hell since the drop chance for them are either 3% from normal mode sources or 6% from hard mode sources. having to pay roughly $25 or pray to RNJesus for a single digit chance for progression is absurd
^This. And I appreciate everyone's take. But due to how close this game model is to Warframe - we need more of the Warframe community here to offer insight like this. It's cute to say it's like Destiny or Anthem, but the systems in place here, are Warframe systems nearly 1:1. Warframe also has in game trade which bolsters the RMT economy, which this game does not have, which makes the urge to HAVE to spend money so much greater.
A forma takes about 10 minutes to get.. the catalysts are the ones that take a while since you have to wait for the free ones or by from the store.. but the difference it could still cost nothing since you can trade prime currency.
@@kingxkaey Warframe player of 8 years here! I really appreciate you acknowledging the need to hear from Warframe players to get an informed opinion. First off, "endgame" is really quite nebulous in Warframe and what qualifies as an "endgame material" in Warframe is even more so. At this stage in the game's life I would say either some specific Arcanes (kinda like whispers or fragments in Destiny), Archon Shards, and/or Riven mods. All of the above except for Archon Shards can be TRADED for premium currency but never bought from a store. They need to be earned first before they can be traded for that premium currency. Yes because they are rare and heavily dependant on RNG trading for them is more appealing but you can always earn them for real
@@itgamer4143 one reason why I didn't bring up trading (even though they've spoke on potential adding it) is just cause with trading you essentially don't need to spend a dime to get anything which isn't a fair comparison as of right now since we can't see what the trading could be like
Big thing is that The First Descendant uses Warframe's microtransaction system but without trading and having the prices being more out of whack compared to Warframe. For example, in Warframe there are reactors, the equivalent of energy activators in The First Descendant, and they cost much cheaper than energy activators in First Descendant. In Warframe, you can pretty much get platinum, the currency you can buy with IRL money, from trading. You can trade parts, mods, etc. for platinum so it's entirely possible to play the game without having to spend any IRL money so you can get what you need easily and that's not even factoring in grinding the materials and crafting the item.
@@darthvocrum5719 This mentality is exactly why companies like Nexon get away with this shit. Trading isn't gonna magically fix the grind like you think it is. 15 dollars for one end game upgrade material is criminal. You can easily get the upgrade materials in Warframe without having to spend any money. Shit they basically give them away as login rewards. TFD is predatory in its monetization, but as long as people like you keep feeding them money it's never gonna get better. Also, being able to waste money on end game upgrades for a FREE TO PLAY game isn't the flex you think it is. Frankly, it's kinda sad
People talk about trading as if that will really help that much. It will help with exchanging mat for mat. But to get the currency, it won't help that much, because guess what, the currency has to come from other people that buy it from nexon. People still have to buy the currency to get it in flow from player to player.
brokie? My boy, I rather act broke to be rich. I got the money to spend hundreds to thousands on Warframe, but I have the equivalent exchange of $1000 in platinum(WF premium currency)just from trading in-game
Edit: i regret this comment I mean I definitely get what he's saying. But during my 30 hours I have spent $30 purely on skins. What I'm seeing is almost a 50/50. People who know how to farm these games have 0 issue getting these materials quickly without money and then you have the normal nexon game players who just bought all of them. You really truly do not need to buy these. The crystalzation catalyst is very easy to farm I had the materials for 3 within an hour last night. As for the energy amplifier there is no reason you should be able to buy it. I hope they go back on that and make them easier to farm. Bc honestly this is a very fun casual game.
@@Dream146 Or people know what they where getting into with a f2p game lol meanwhile half you mfs simp bungie who has kept pushing the needle of trying to add paid power into the BP and such in a 70 buck game
Orokin reactors and catalysts in warframe are 20 platinum, so for roughly $5 usd (75 plat pack) you can get three of them meanwhile this is far more expensive and hard to get
Also, I see anything purchasable with plat (especially at such a low price) as totally purchasable without irl money, just from selling random prime parts I've gotten over time without even really trying, I've gotten quite a bit.
if you actually buy reactors or catalysts, idk what to say other than youre lazy. you can get it from nora night, you can get it from razorback armadas, formorians, and the daily sortie, so like.... it REALLY doesnt make sense to buy them.
As someone who has poured countless hours into warframe, a game which at a cursory glance, seems to be the main thing that first descendant copies all of its core systems from word for word, seeing the pricing on the equivalent of reactors/catalysts and forma for this game is obscene, idk how much you get but those prices are crazy for the equivalent items. Not to mention warframe's starter platinum and the fact its premium currency can be traded between players. This just seems like a worse version of warframe's gear monetization, which is not the best by any means in the first place. This just reflects even more poorly on first descendant to me.
Not to mention that Warframe in general has actual character and it's own identity. Not a single dev cared about this game, and it shows. Fuckin' "Kyle..."
To answer your question, you get the same exact amount for $30 less, till you get to the materials and colors. They also don’t have a direct cash payment option for ultimates in The First Descendant so buy an Ultimate is pointless. Farming is much better. Use the premium currency to rush, or wait the 16hrs. Now the upgrade materials are outrageous. $20 dollars is not even excusable and will completely hurt the longevity of the game. Also colors are only permanently unlocked per character, so having to buy them all over again is also outrageous. There’s also the fact that default outfits are no longer colorable like in the beta.
@@Everlost_Nation It's Nexon game and they are known for being greedy so be prepared it will be just tip of iceberg and as time goes and new things will be added it will be even worse. Wouldn't be suprsied if they tried again to manipulate drop rates and mission will show you drop rate of like 3% but in reality it will be like 0,1% and only option will be buying it from shop for irl money because it will be close to impossible to get something.
I’ve never played Warframe. Objectively speaking if they’re both similarly monetized and grindy. Which of the 2 did you actually enjoy playing and grinding for?
@@ukbleedbluex9340Warframe aren’t really that similar for warframes case you can actually earn premium currency by selling prime items which are pretty easy to obtain as for the first descendent the game is extremely monetizing with its options to the point It’ll take months to get an ultimate or could just spend 100 dollars for one character, now if we pan back to Warframe spending a 100 dollars can get you nearly or more of the roster of the characters you can choose from and if you spend it wisely in trading instead of buying from the market it’ll be their prime variant instead of the regular.
I'm gonna go as far as I can as a F2p player, but right now I'm enjoying the farming loop and gameplay of the characters over a lot of other games. Ajax is everything I wish titan was, valby is everything I wished yareli was in warframe. I farmed valby freyna in one day and I'm half way done with gley farm as I only need the resources now.
Nah imo out of l their games blue archive is probably their least monetized game. Even for a gacha. Hope it stays like that because no game should be this damn expensive
First, i want to say that The First Descendant developers took inspirations from Warframe and Destiny. They said it in an interview provided by Gamerant. Warframe has this purchasable booster/upgrade materials, but much cheaper. Warframe has trading system which alleviates the amount of money spending at a point where you can go full free-to-play while also having premium currency. You can farm the resources and craft these upgrade materials sure but they're tedious, unlike Warframe. Do i want the developers not to earn their money? No, but these price tag cannot be normalized. Unfortunately, Nexon do what Nexon does and i won't be surprised if they decided to shut down The First Descendant after a few months/years
I was talking with friends about this game and most of them are saying that game will be shut down within year or two because Nexon will decide that it's not giving enough profit to keep it alive and do anything.
@@kadarak1 Man I'm glad you said what your friends said, meanwhile they have had other games going that pull less views and less dollars that are still going to this day. But pop off chief.
"inspirations" my ass bro, charecter relics, primes, the modding system, half of the charecter cast etc etc thats not inspiration thats ripping at that point. BROTHER THEY COPIED FORMA AND POLARITIES THEY COPIED *POLARITIES*! AS IN THEY COPIED IT DOWN TO THE LAST LETTER BASICALLY
Nexon recently was fined for a loot box that had an advertised high desirable drop item that for various periods of time had a drop rate of 0%. Sadly it was a "cost of doing business" fine of only the equivalent of $9m USD, a far cry from the amount money they made from that loot box.
The fact that there's always people defending this continues to show me why so many online games are in such a bad state these days. Keep using "why do you care how people spend their money" all you want just don't be surprised when majority of the games playerbase leaves because of stuff like this. Which always happens. You guys are going have to learn sooner or later to stop being so reckless/irresponsible with your money.
This is exactly it dont care how people spend their money but they constantly funnel cash into half bake undown constantly deteriorating in quality games that continue to increase their prices
@@hi-kc7blBecause irresponsible spending tends to make it worse for everyone else. Companies always get greedy and test what they can get away with once they see people spending absurd amounts of $ for nonsense. This almost always happens I don't understand how in 2024 this has to be explained to people
It's wild that people are okay with the constant creep of monetization getting more and more egregious. As if the whole loot box debacle never existed, little aspects of pay to win keep rearing their ugly head with people defending it as "timesavers". If you don't have a ton of time to play and grind a game, don't worry about it and just play the game more casually, eventually you'll catch up and be able to do endgame anyways. My dad is in his 60s and plays D2, sure he isn't raiding, but every now and then we hop into a dungeon together. He doesn't need to buy the season rank booster, material packs, or all the dungeon keys. Games shouldn't be trying to nickel and dime people in ways like these that are completely unnecessary to enjoy the core experience. Games need money to develop, yeah. Skins sell like crazy. Expansions rake in absurd amounts even if they're mid. Anywhere past that is where we drew the line years ago, but the goalposts keep moving. Letting that slide is absurd.
This is why people get paid for marketing. If you put a huge price on microtransactions right away, you scare people off. Give them a way to earn it in-game,they'll dislike it, but tolerate it. The same thing with pricing something at a dollar or 5 dollars. It doesn't seem so bad at that point and will get more purchases.
Erm sir, your dad is playing literally like half the content the game has to offer. Meanwhile we get to experience the full thing for FREE. I play with my brothers, and not once have we said "I need to buy this thing from the store" we literally play the game to get what we want and that is the fun of it.
@@cephydash1533cept that's the thing the second the whales start to throw around influence in content and people get kicked for 'not being op' are you really playing the way you want at that point? Because that stuffs like a slow insidious creep no game should have a in-game power but cosmetics only.
@div3345 I'm not reading all this, but there is no need to be mad or trip about it. It will continue to happen as long as people keep spending money. It would have to be a law put in place to stop it. For a free game, I treat it like a game I'm buying . You may get $75 out of me, but that's as far as I'm going . Control what you can.
As someone who lives in Korea, I can confirm this is typical for Korean games. Being able to buy your way to winning is common here. Regardless of if this game is currently appealing to a western audience, you still have korean game developers who are used to egregiously monitizing their games paired with Nexon, one of the worst in the business. Don’t waste your time on this game, it will be dead with a year or two.
@@cephydash1533defending the company that basically made microtransactions and the concept of p2w games mainstream is not the play chief. Spending money on an expansion is in no way comparable to the cash grab garbage nexon has made their fortune on
@petervalvo1186 I've spent 200 dollars + just to be able to keep up and catch up with my friends on Destiny. I've spent 0 dollars on first descendant, and we're all on equal grinds. I don't care about who invented what. All I care about is how deeply my wallet is affected and if I felt pressured into buying something, and so far, Destiny has done me dirty on those 2.
@@cephydash1533 comparing a paid game that's been out 10 years to a f2p game that's been out a week is a crazy comparison. If your friends pressured you into buying Destiny content knowing that it cost money, then you have pretty shitty friends, ngl
@@cephydash1533 How LoL, you could get all the content up to final shape for like 30 bucks before launch. I don't think you can spend that much even now. Stop coping with this game.
There is no 'level playing field' since there's no competition to compare yourself to. There's no PVP aspect, you progress your characters at your own pace as much as you want to. These materials are also aquired through general gameplay. The drop rates are low, but they drop from dozens of sources so you'll get them eventually no matter what you do. These mechanics have been around in MMO's for decades. Anyone who's played a similar game understands the system and appreciates that everything can be farmed for free, meaning it's not pay to win. New players to the genre however struggle to grasp this concept and scream 'PAY TO WIN' at the top of their lungs the moment they notice you can buy them. Relax and just play the game. You'll get everything you want without having to spend hundreds
@@imblu6954 exactly. It was Piratesoftware that did the short about WoW's very first store mount and how it made more money than starcraft 2. It'll never go away now because of people that have more money than sense.
@@sparhawk2195nah, i'm gonna blame the dumbass following a carrot on a stick for being so stupid as to not only not realize he's following a carrot on a stick, but to deny and defend it after being told and shown that it is indeed, a carrot on a stick.
It’s legit so insane to me, as someone that was excited for this game since pre alpha, how the Caliber currencies is halved in comparison to other games. Normally $5 gets you 500 but here it’s 250. Nexon blows so hard. Gonna just free to play it till I get bored.
yea thats why its otional. complaining an optional obtainable item is expensive, in game no less where earning it is the point duh, is dumb. play for free and earn it like every other normal MMO gamer. like if it was 5$ a skin and then the game dies in a month due to everyone having everything first week is any better? people just dont think anymore.
The worst part is that their battle pass is just 500 which seems cheaper than other games but it’s actually exactly the same $10 price. However, everything else they sell in their stores has the same 1,500-5,000 price tag as other games but bc their game currency is double the price instead of spending $50 on a premium skin you’re spending $100. It’s a very deceiving and aggressive strategy
@@javiercastrejon8102 Please stop spreading lies. Most Costumes have a pricetag of 750, which is 15 bucks. That is the standard for most games nowadays. They halfed the amount you get but also halfed the prices. It's literally the same as in most other games. They even published a patch today that made farming catalysts way easier. This game is fun but the Warframe community will shit on it until it dies. Which is sad... let people enjoy what they prefer and not just the game you enjoy. Also Prime Access in Warframe costs even more than an Ultimate in this game. Still both are farmable and no one needs to pay for it.
I don't get why people defend monetization practices like they have some stake in it or it's going to negatively effect them personally when a company gets called out for being greedy.
Bruh, its normal for live service games. The company ain't greedy, they're just running a business and the price is just a tag. Entering the mall is free, but everything else ain't. Can't call the management greedy for charging parking fees innit?
@@oishicurrypuffus that's a poor comparison when there are other f2p games that implement their money-making better. You can't even get one of those items from the paid battle pass and it's a necessary item. And what mall do you go to that has parking fees wtf
In Canadian currency, this works out to about 40$ to purchase one activator with caliber. These serve the same function as a Warframe potato (Reactor or Catalyst), which in Warframe costs 20 plat. I can buy 75 plat for $5.49 Cdn. So (like pretty much all things in this game), they took Warframe's systems and monetization model and just multiplied all the costs by 20 while reducing the drop rates almost as much.
yea but this game also cost millions to make........and warframe has been out for over 13 years....of course everything is cheap and is better. TFD came out less than a month ago. chill out. also inflation is real as well. costs of everything went up. as well as also steam taking 30% of everything. how do you expect the studio to make $$. i feel like every tool in here forgets game development is a business. its not an art project made especially for you. its cost millions to make and millions to maintain. get over it and just play the MMO like its meant to be played and earn the items. if not then stop playing games just to purchase your way to the top. its pointless.
@@nicholaswilkerson501 this argument is literally dumb, as warframe literally exists. you think warframe hasn't been a victim of inflation? they havent changed the prices of their premium currency at all. so with inflation, they'd actually be making LESS money now since the prices have stayed the same since 2013. and, to get the premium currency in warframe, you dont even need to spend money, you can get it for free! so many players are actually purely free-to-play. warframe makes money purely because people pay to support the game, not because it makes you feel like you need to spend money on the game or else you're at a disadvantage. the only time you will feel like that, is when you just start playing and see someone that's been playing for years and you're like "dang i wish i could do that." well you might if you spend some money, but i bet you're not a high enough mastery rank to even use the weapons that person is using either. so you're gonna have to grind for that mastery rank, and in that time, you probably could've earned most of the mods and materials required to build a lot of that older players loadout if you so desired. the "game development is a business" take is so stupid, if people like your game and its popular, people will spend money on it. people just dont like feeling forced to spend money on it, hence this game receiving the back lash that it's receiving.
That's the whole mentality behind these kinds of games. I like this game. I enjoy playing it and building my characters. But when I commit a 6 hours grind for ONE piece of a NORMAL Descendent and after I have nothing to show for it, it's obvious the devs are telling me to go screw myself, my time and my effort, and that I should go and buy it from the shop. There's a limit to my time and my patience and as much as I'm enjoying this game, that limit is fast approaching.
As a Mastery Rank 34 (LR4) Warframe vet, I'm completely used to these items being available at a cost. While you can buy these to increase your mod capacity, you can't buy your mods or the gold/kuiper shards to level the mods. You have to grind that out. You can have all the mod capacity in the world, but without good mods to put in, and the knowledge of which mods *should* be used, and what makes a Descendent scale well, youre not going to be making it into any hard content. Where I do get frustrated is the rarity of the resources coupled with the rarity of the blueprints themselves. Not to mention the vault hacking minigame that without Enzo is quite tough with server side lag. Also, the infiltration missions for the amorphous materials to get descendants & ultimate weapons are basically uncompletable solo without a Sharen. And even more so without a squad of Sharens for any degree of relative speed. We have bigger fish to fry, and we are not going to get them to stop selling these or lower the price. If we were lucky, they'll make the in-game farm for them a bit easier.
@bloodfest8510 I mean they didn't have a patent on it. And there's some bare bones things that are identical, but also some things that are different. Like the way the mods interact with your components, as opposed to only modding being the character drive. The addition of elemental resistances like Diablo & PoE. The gun/descendant synergies. Plus the QOL that we've asked for the past 11 years, dismantling all dupes, augment slot, the "aura" mods being more than just basic stat boosts, it's original enough in many ways that I don't see it as ripping, bit taking inspiration from.
I didn't even know of this game until the day before launch. Had some people telling me it's fun and I should try it because I like Warframe and destiny so I looked it up saw Nexon and immediately lost interest. Also hearing it was free to play made me very suspicious. Free games like this always have a catch.
this is the item they want to get most of the lazy whales money from im pretty sure the f2p or the minnows even dolphins wont touch it with a yard pole because more often than not they only purchase things that they ever really really want or cant get through grinding like a skin
I got 2 just by finishing the main story plus a few mats short of crafting 1 but you can only use 1 on a descendant anyways or gun so dont need many and the other mat can obly be used when your max lvl and then it resets your lvl so you still gotta grind all the lvls again and by the time you grind the mats you might be lvl 40 again
They recently congratulated a team for being the first to clear Molten Fortress, the hardest of all void bosses (as per their tweet/X). Imagine achieving this and having people question whether you paid for that success.
@@ronnie0817 lol and why does it matter? Its a choice and a time saver. just like buying prime bundles in warframe. Most MMO's do this. if you want to spend that cash on time savers then that's your choice. there is no extra advantage for doing something 1st in this game.
@@nicholaswilkerson501it isn’t fair that’s the problem along with the fact there’s a 3% drop rate for the blueprint makes it feel like their gatekeeping endgame from people that don’t want to pay I’ve been playing since day one and haven’t gotten a single energy activator bp out of doing atleast like 10 void intercepts a day but somebody can say f tht drop some money and skip a grind that’s taken me a week atp I’ve wasted 7 days of my life to get something some lonely dude with 3 cats just bought 5 of em cuz he can and as a long time warframe player it’s kinda like a slap in the face whats the point of the grind if yall want me to pay to get the shit I’m grinding for its damn near a microtransaction simulator late game
I am guessing you don’t play Warframe for the same reason, they have the same items in the game shop that are also purchasable, but they break it down into two different ones, Orikin Reactor for the Warframe and Orikin Catalyst for weapons, the Forma for polarizing the mod slots on both. I guess for me since I have played Warframe for years I don’t see it as anything unusual, but I can see the point you’re making.
@@cyrus6461 agreed but that wasn’t what my comment was about, the cost and it is worth up to the individual to decide and is between that person and the person selling the item, my comment was simply asking if he doesn’t like/play Warframe for that same reason.
If you're buying reactors for plat ur trolling they are dirt cheap with night wave credits also forma is so easy to obtain unlike the stuff in the first descendants
They’re also given out in the battle pass in the track, or tokens you get from the track, that you can use to directly buy these reactors and catalysts with. It’s also 20 platinum. You can trade mods or useless parts to someone and get enough to buy one outright. Warframe, while allowing you to buy them, also allows you to trade the premium currency, platinum.
What level playing field when there is no PVP??? Why would you care so much about level playing field when there is no competitive scene in this game? Not everything has to be so fucking competitive and not everything has to be a race to be the first Aztec.
I can barely buy groceries weekly and keeping up with all my bills. Not all of us got it like that. I appreciate you sticking up for the common man on this!
I think these materials are closer to Warframe’s Orokin catalyst and forma (both can be farmed and bought) but they are substantially easier to obtain WITHOUT dropping money on the game. I wish these materials could drop from sources already built and ready to use rather than having to go through a mega grind just to build one, maybe two. But I’m still enjoying the game, it’s a nice break from D2 and I get to play the game for free. Being a f2p model can suck at times but I don’t feel the need to drop a sack of cash on this game as I won’t be making it a top priority game. If the game dropped a dungeon or raid, I wouldn’t really care what anyone else did to get ready for the activity. It’s their life and I’m happy to just play that activity when I’m ready. It’s the same for me in D2, I have never done a Day 1 raid and I doubt I ever will. I’ll just watch you, Aztecross, or someone else go through it and have a good time.
im personally having a lot of fun as a break from warframe warframe whilst a little freindlier to f2p players is also friendly to p2w players too when a new update comes out for warframe im usually done with it in 1-14 days depending how big it is because ive basically completed the game so it for me is nice to have another game thats kinda simular to sink some time into cus warframe is pretty dry of any endgame content its got some basic dailies and nothing that would be considered challenging content for a hardcore player
Okay. I decided to finally watch this video and realize Destiny content creators dont understand how easy it is to farm for the mushrooms and rings in this game. You put time in it and you'll get it easily there is always either a mushroom or ring blueprint in a relic. They dont take long to farm and you having the ability to buy them is just a fast way of saying i need one now for my build. unlike in destiny where the golf balls and everything else isnt guarantee drop either. It just makes the grind less painful. It doesn't make your character have bigger advantage.
It's honestly not, there are definitely a lot of ideas from WF, at the same time, they did take things into their own direction with proper dungeons and world bosses
See Warframe gets away with mats like that being able to be bought because there is a ingame market for the same curacy that you would have to buy in this game, out of all the things FD coped and pasted from WF, they forgot that... the one reason it was ok for WF to sell those mats. Because im setting with 3k plat in my wallet, and I've never spent a dime in WF.
My first thought when I got in this game was "it's like Warframe" the movement doesn't feel as tight, but the character models are better and I like the environments more. It's pretty much just Warframe that is all it is but it doesn't have the in-game market, and as people have pointed out it's really expensive to get a ultimate descendant, Like back in the day I bought one of the primes I don't remember which one it was but it was a bundle for $80 for two of them and like the equivalent of 40 or $50 worth of platinum and prime weapons that go with the characters... I like the game but also they are trying to milk people really hard, and I wouldn't be surprised if we find out in the future if they are secretly messing with percentages on things (because the percentages of some things don't line up to the way it feels when you're trying to get it.) I think this game can be really fun but they do have a lot of work to do and they should probably get to it very quickly because it's going to get bad it's going to be in a tera situation if they don't find something to hook people because all they have right now is a worse movement experience but a better-looking version of Warframe that is even more grindy
You cant buy prime warframes. You farm them from relics and prime parts drop pretty easily. Can most parts within 1~3 runs per relic with radgroups. To get the materials needed for ultimates in this game you need to farm a much longer, more annoying and sometimes more difficult dungeon that only has a 3% drop rate. Thats 1 part out of like 30 different things you need that either you need a ton of or has absurdly low drop rates.
With the energy activators, people were off. They can buy as many as they want for weapons but each descendant only looks like they can have 1 energy booster. So it’s not like someone’s character is gonna have 250 energy for modules
After 1 month, energy activated every descendant, stacks of catalysts to build whatever descendant i want, and all ultimate weap n descendants unlocked no money spent, after playing TFD for 1 month free
The problem with aggressive monetization like this is that it forces game design to find the breaking point of players to get more and more people to swipe their cards. Making the grind worse and worse with each new iteration of the free-to-play game model.
The difference is...Warframe found that point, and rarely, if ever crosses it, and when they do, they backpedal hard and fast. Nexon has made it a point TO cross that line CONSTANTLY, to the point of being caught physically making RNG items unavailable to drive people to buy things...and people are still more willing to play this than Warframe. Make that make sense. First Descendant is a terrible iteration of this model, and with a game like Warframe not only in existence, but the majority blueprint for this monetization, is pretty offensive. Digital Extremes has been refining that type of difficult to build good will over 11 years, and mostly succeeded for a reason. Nexon comes along and is trying to destroy it by simply being Nexon, and it sucks.
@RedShadowOfSaturn honestly I haven't played warframe in years, but I played at launch and it took hundreds of runs of the same mission over and over again to unlock basic characters, or you could drop 20 bucks (can't remember the price at launch but both the grind and the cost felt egregious). The prime characters were even worse and they were charging like 100 bucks or you could grind for like a month straight. I don't mind a grind if it is either long but there is a decent amount of variety to the activities I'm running, or if it's fairly short and I'm not spending 20 hours on the same mission.
@@UncannyTrickster So a few things. First, several of the harder farms for certain Frames, like Harrow, have been significantly improved with better RNG pools and drop rates. Some of the newer ones that released in the past year or two have even had a pity currency system attached so if your RNG is crummy, you can save up the currency to get the remaining blueprints you need while you grind it. The amount of activities has broadened a ton as well, so when one thing gets boring to grind, plenty of other different ones to get involved with. The philosophy of respecting players' time has been upgraded drastically. Even grinds like Focus can be done faster and easier in certain places like Conjunction Survival and Duviri, Omnia Fissures where players can open ANY era relic means groups can both grind Focus AND have a wider range of Prime rewards to collect as well. And that's on top of the fact that players can gather up rare items and trade them for premium currency for free, which is part of the larger discussion here. We don't know how Nexon will approach that when they implement trading, but they NEED to make caliber something we can trade for. In any case, Warframe grinds have been greatly improved over the years. The core of grinding is still there, obviously, but much of it has been smoothed out.
The difference is that part of Warframe's gameplay IS the grind, and most of the time it's fun. The First Dependent has no activity variation, no enemy variety, terrible story, awful voice acting, ugly playable characters (in terms of most of the male characters, the females being overly sexualized,) painfully long unfun grinding/time gating, and soulless character design. With all that, how could anyone justify the shit TFD pulls? The ONLY thing I'd say I like better about TFD than I do Warframe, is that the movement feels good and weighty, instead of too fast and floaty.
@@imblu6954 One could argue TFD's movement is more steady than Warframe's, but...the one mobility thing they added to be quicker, the grapple hook, is hyper awkward, it never seems to catch for me (even with a little indicator). Thus, the game is basically Outriders for me. Running and rolling and shooting and that's it. So...basically it doesn't really have "special movement" to highlight, "you can move in it," I guess. Outriders with a grapple hook and no cover system. Which is not great.
100% Agree with Cross. Imagine you and a friend are playing side by side through the game, they pay $500, look cooler, do more damage, are faster, have tons of ammo... And you are a free player and just watch your friend destroy everything. On one hand it could be fun to watch them wreck stuff, but you would start to feel inferior and therefore less excited about your own character and power.
Cross I'm going to be honest, I understand what you are trying to say and I agree for the most part. I don't like this monetization strategy and I would really like if they modified it to something better. Also their prices are REALLY egregious. But I think you are being unfair in your comparisons with Destiny. Multiple times you say "if it get a Destiny type activity", this game is nothing like Destiny, except for it being a looter shooter. (Comparisons can happen, I just think the ones you made are unfair). I know people will criticize me here but I will say it. Why everyone is on the same playing field on day one ? I answer you there is no playing field. Either you bought the 100 dollar expansion or you can't do day one. I don't have the option to play for a long time and try it. Is Sleeper Simulant the meta ? Guess you need to have the forsaken pack huh. Need the new dungeon exotic is fire ? It's ok just get that dungeon key. What I mean is Veteran Destiny players (I include myself), usually are unable to see how a game can be unfair or exclusive. (For new players that is obvious, that is why is so difficult to get new players to play Destiny) Destiny = Fair, but you need to pay to play. Destiny just locks content and say everyone that pay that fee can be on the same playing field. First Descendant = "Unfair", but you can play everything. FD dont lock content but you can pay to be on a higher playing field or just play a lot.
@@blix17to also add, there's a legit FREE battle pass where you just do challenges and earn BP points(I forgot the actual name)to basically earn "free" reactors/catalysts
And that 20p is a child's play lmao anybody can get that starting from MR 5 hell anybody can sell stuff worth 10p each which is so easy daily and still get 50p each day lol minimum 2 potatoes a day think about the grind and money hungry this game's been...be money hungry but don't make it so obvious is all I'm requesting to Nexon
Or you could just save your plat and get them from, let's see...Invasions, Nightwave, Duviri, Sorties, Archon Hunts, Twitch Drops, should I continue? Why on earth would you PAY for this?
@@RedShadowOfSaturnbecause those resources aren't always available, there's around 50 warframes and around 10 times as many weapons. You'll eventually run out of ways to get catslysts or reactors because they aren't infinite. Once that happens your options that remain are either trading or buying currency yourself. Of which i'd always recommend trading unless your daily login gifts you a discount (which can range anywhere from 10-75%) and you end up buying a sizable amount of plat, of which you decide to spend some on reactors and the like which is fine.
As a warframe player I’m not gonna act as if I didn’t pay for catalyst, reactors, forma, exiles adaptors, arcane adaptors etc, but as everyone has already said even if the system wasn’t perfect trading allows one to mitigate the need drop cash while also not being as pricey. (I still think at this point they should be dropping from dedicated sources at this point however) Not going to repeat what the other warframe players have said besides that, what I will say however is that good games, and good studios whether the game are free to play or full price deserve to be paid for. Warframe is not only fun, but the people behind the game are to this day are so extremely passionate about it, something you don’t see from many game devs these days, and being very communicative and responsive to their community. They’re not perfect either they’ve screwed up before especially from pricing certain things, but when they say “we listen, we learn” they are. It’s that relationship that they have cultivated over the years that allow a system as bad as it looks on the outside to be able to work for a f2p game. I can drop money without batting an eye because I know that the money is going back to the game or to one of the many causes DE supports. As such it makes me want to support their future and Warframes future. This to me is the difference, nexon does not have this and with pricing like that and their track record it only makes this worse. TLDR; it’s about trust. Good games, and good studios deserve to be rewarded, this can only be done by building trust with their player base and showing good faith through their product. Nexon does not have this. Great video thanks
ima be deadass with you, played this game for almost 10 years now. i payed for the kuva pack during the war within and payed to skip farming a nechramech. you aint gotta pay for allat at all. thats the point. also when i payed for a nechramech? i got a 75% discount on plat. so deadass, TFD is el garbage for ripping warframes systems
@@bloodfest8510 Yeah you just drop 45 bucks when you get the big discount if you want and you're set for a long time, I even invest it and basically resell stuff that I get cheap. Most times I end up with more than I started with unless I go on a big cosmetic spending spree.
well said, Warframe is the only game where i have no regrets buying skins or prime-access stuff because of DE, such a fantastic dev-studio. I dont see any other dev-studio that has the same humor as DE, e.g. Relay 69, some Warframe ASSets, hilarious dev-streams/dev shorts, etc I even got called "whale" a few times just beause i bought some cosmetic stuff
I have a hypothesis on that. Was Cross streaming during standard work hours? Because if he was, maybe chat was mostly people who can already afford to not work.....
Decent long time player for warframe, I think an important think to note is that warframe has a market where you can earn platinum by trading items from grinding blueprints n such for their in-game currency, which then allows to buy forma/crystallization catalyst/ascendant alloys. Point is I don’t think selling them is a bad thing, I think it’s just the fact that there’s just not anyway to earn in-game currency in TFD.
i compare then to potatoes in warframe. i dont mind they exists, my problem is how expensive they are and how much grinding takes to get them or the catalyst for swapping slot polarity
That's a ridiculous comparison. One cost 1.5 USD, and the other cost 30 USD. Warframe also gives you them for free CONSTANTLY. I haven't bought one in like 3 years.
Last boss in hard or normal cause I beat normal last boss without spending any money. I'am not deffending,you can grind everything. So don't know why people bitching abot it,if they don't even play the game 🤣
Idk much about this game but with Warframe, at least there is trading and you can trade the “premium currency of platinum, so if you want to grind stuff out, you could also be gathering materials, that you can then trade for essentially real money.
I have spent money but no more than I think the game is worth (£30-40). I hated the game early on but its grown on me, it does grind fairly and every pain point Cross talked about here isn't really an issue. The only real issue is the craft time/rush prices being far too big.
Warframe is the same way i've spend about 8-9k hours playing it and is the same you spend real money for the catalyst and reactor. But in the end game you start getting them left and right. I personally feel like they made them more accessible in this game. And the point that if they implement raids, you can stock up on things like that prior to the update. Same as we do on D2 we pull out all the best of the best weaponry we have, we test stuff up, and go ready for anything. For a d2 player I understand why it doesn't seem right because I do play d2 as well, but having 8k hours on warframe it really is not a bad thing. If you wanna pay 2 rush, go a head but I don't think is needed.
people defend this shit now, but if someday they drop a raid or something similar, then release a incredibly broken character, and now you can only get into a raid party if you have that character at maximum, and your only options is waste 2 years building the char or pay 120 dollar to get it instantly, then they will start to cry about it. but then it will be too late, as always. weak willed, shortsighted people always fuck everything up.
I know right? People are crazy, I didn't even know they were in the shop til last night lmfao. I've been grinding to make em, and will continue to do so until the need arises to spend actual money lol.
hey everyone just a fyi everything aztec is saying its a deal breaker becuase of how much things cost everything hes talking about can also be farmed in game for FREE so plz dont let the prices sway you from playing this amzingly made FREE TO PLAY you make the choice wheaather youy want to support the devs for there amzing content or you want to remain FTP thats up to you but you can get all those upgrade materials from farming :)
Warframe has something similar...except they also give those things out like candy as well as having them be directly purchasable they make them so easy to get you never feel pushed the buy them. TFD does the exact opposite, making the grind to tedious you feel pushed to buy them just to skip it they are also cheaper to buy, AND you can grind for the necessary premium currency in about an hour or two. 3 if your RNG is trash. same their equivalent to Crystallization Catalysts, except those you can also get while grinding for the premium currency as well the difference between how Warframe does it and how TFD does it is day and night Warframe does it in a way that I find acceptable. mostly because you can only put 1 reactor on a Warframe or weapon, and there is only so many forma you can put on before they start becoming redundant and unnecessary. that said...really strange take coming from someone who defends how Destiny 2 monetizes. selling dungeon keys, then locking an OP exotic behind said dungeon? paying for the OP seasonal exotic? paying for the deluxe edition of an expansion to get an OP exotic? how are any of these any different?
The dungeon exotic rarely is op (if ever honestly), it's mostly usually a gimmick exotic that's fun to use, maybe navigator was strong but that was due to strand titan grapple, not the weapon itself. The pass exotic is free for everyone at level 45 of the pass and the other one from missions is usually shite. 20 bucks for 2 mini raids is not that big of a deal and you can skip them if the loot isn't worth it for you, btw that price is lower than TFD's "reactors". The exotic from the deluxe is just early access for people before the expansion drops, then every base dlc owner gets it, and on top of that it's absolute garbage and no one uses/used it. There's justified hate for D2, but there's also hate by misinformation apparently.
Personally I don’t have the time to grind it out, so anything that can save me some time to be able to play for a bit after work and catch up with friends is always nice.
A better way to think about it though is that if people 10 years ago didn’t needlessly spend there money in the first place on stuff like this financial analysts at these gaming companies wouldn’t pick up on the fact that they could have put more things behind paywalls or increased grinds in the first place in exchange for monetization speeding it up. It was because people spent money so much on stuff like “time savers” that the average grind of your usual game changed dramatically over the years. Video games are literally changing because of the money people are spending.
I subscribed maybe a hour ago seeing this i have alot more respect for you as a content creator than the others bringing this to attention than brushing over it this is getting worse year by year in multiple games not just this one
The fact you have to make it ALL THE WAY to the end of the campaign, to craft an energy activator (WHILE HAVING LOW DROP RATES FOR THE STUFF YOU NEED) but Tommy next door can use his mom or dads credit card without touching the cusp of the campaign is down right disgusting and money hungry
These painful grinds for items to make your progression much longer and harder with ridiculous RNG are definitely dealbreakers… they took the models from Warframe but instead made it shite… I can forma my Warframes 8 times in maybe an hour… (also to get Forma, just go do a mission for a drop.. easy) But here in TFD you want to change your mod slot and increase your capacity… try 2 days at best lmao🤦🏽♂️
@@blackyonbidid you not pay attention to the items mentioned and do you not understand the ultimate goal? In order to increase your mod capacity (far beyond the little bit you get for MR rank which is also a grind in of itself as I’m MR 15 in TFD… which at this point is probably the average of most players for people with actual lives) you use the Energy Activator to increase the base mod capacity for your descendant/weapon… then you use Crystal Catalyst to change the polarity on your mod slots so mods in that slot cost half which enables you to upgrade a mod to its max….to get these items they take a long grind and crafting session that slows down your progression when you want to build up your character.. unless you pay. The model they copied from Warframe we can get the upgrade item itself from farming relic missions easily and then Forma multiples times in under an hour and also when you want to upgrade a base overall capacity it is simply done after after getting the reactor/catalyst item drop from another mission in WF. What are you smoking?
@@blackyonbihe said “change mod slot” mod slot have little icon that reduce 50% of cost u need an item to do that in warframe it easy to farm this item, but in tfd is very tedious cuz u need to do a lot of step, imagine u get this by doing 1 missions instead of 4 mission and tedious step that is warframe
I mean… aren’t you only allowed to use one activator per item anyway, and can only use the crystalization after to max out at level 40 per use? It still takes a long time either way.
I find there’s this sub-culture of people. I don’t know if they’re just annoying online contrarians or if they secretly like the idea of non-cosmetic MTX in games because they can pay to be stronger. But every time this comes up and someone says they don’t like it and don’t want it in their game, this weird chorus of “you don’t have to buy it” starts echoing. NO ONE IS SAYING THEY HAVE TO BUY IT. We’re saying WE DO NOT WANT IT IN OUR GAME. These are two separate things: being forced to buy something and opposing its presence. There’s no grey area-you either like pay-to-win or you don’t. There are games that have it and games that don’t. Pick one and stop trying to claim moral victories over stuff no one is arguing about. In debate what yall do would be described as a “red herring”
I am fine with people not liking the mtx, it’s your opinion. I can understand how they might seem unfair to those who can’t afford it or spent the hours grinding it out. Personally if the mtx are pay-to-advance and not true pay-to-win (unable to get things without buying them) I don’t mind them and as someone who works 60 hours a week and has some expendable cash it helps me to keep up to some degree when I don’t get to play as much as I would like to. Also this game currently does not have much competition between players and rather a personal sense of achievement beating new things.
@@KonflictedPay to win just refers to skipping manipulative and sluggish grind that's put there specifically to get you to spend money. It's way more unacceptable when in PvP games, but equally hated anywhere.
@@imblu6954 for me they way you win at games like this is to refine and modify your builds so that farming is so easy and the grind doesn’t phase you that’s how I feel you win at games like this and warframe etc unlike destiny where you have to buy DLC to have access to certain gear guns etc it’s just all about farming to get what you want and TFD gives you bunny and free capacity which with all blue mods I’m farming hard content with ease most games don’t even give you a good foundation to start your farming career you usually would have to buy a character like bunny
Even in Warframe, the potatoes were 2 dollars, a single activator or catalyst costing 30 dollars we have how many Descendants and weapons? Bruh, its the one thing I cant get behind
I used to have the same thought process until I realized that me getting all these materials, modules, reactors etc. is playing the game for me. I enjoy the journey of getting my character really powerful. I very much enjoy the Borderlands series because of that reason. Getting the gear is playing the game for me and I wouldn’t take that from myself by paying my way through. Also some people need to take a step back and realize not everything is a competition. Especially this game. There’s nothing competitive about this game.
Lmao I gave this game a shot, all the way up until I tried crafting my first weapon, looked for the mats did the mission I needed 3 times (The mission was boring af) but eventually I got it. I was all excited to use this new weapon only to be met with an 18hrs crafting time before I could use it... Now I understand this game didn't invent this but, give me 1 good reason except for money that this is a good mechanic. No seriously, why? I was playing the game, wanted to keep playing, but the game told me fuck you pay us now or stop playing... I do not envy yall that grew up playing games where this is acceptable, cause I grew up playing games that were meant to be fun.
Bottom line is simple, If they don't change the acquisition of these progression items to either be easier to farm or cheaper to buy (like warframe), the game will die. The reason Warframes been so popular and had longevity is because DE listens very closely to its players and has put systems In place that are actually F2P friendly. Nexon are fine with copying the system but they seem to fundamentally fail on why those systems work for Warframe. I've hit Hard mode and I was having fun maxing my builds… right up until I tried to farm for an energy activator. 50 amorphous materials cracked and not one BP drop. Warframe is the game I've by far spent the most on, but instead of feeling robbed I always felt like it was well spent because I get rewarded and I'm supporting devs that actually care. This game was fun for a while, but I'll be going back to warframe, as I'm sure many others will to.
Yes and no. Yes they are in the season pass and you get a couple. No you don't need the season pass to get them. You can buy 3 of each from Rahool with in game currency each week. You can also get them from activities like gm nightfall. Tons of easy ways to get them really without any money
@@luckywater-gaming3840 the original comment is not a good argument though. Also the first descendant is definitely not the same they're intentionally making the grind tedious to push people to spend more. I really question the drop percentage. The other difference in destiny you only need one material you get for doing activities. The first descendant you have to grind for materials to make more materials to make more materials to wait to use your crafted item or to upgrade. Or you spend $20 and have it instantly.
I feel like cross is coming into this with a destiny 2 mindset and this is way closer to warframe. You just grind and that’s the gameplay loop. No endgame like destiny and no contest mode stuff. Just play and enjoy yourself. I’m close to 100 hours in and I actually enjoy this more than destiny 2 act 1. Act 1 and what I’m hearing from act 2 is bummy. I’ve gotten 4 energy activators blueprints over the last couple days and it’s genuinely not bad at all. The energy activators aren’t making you do 100% extra damage. The 25 dollar price tag for that stuff is absurd though. Need to be like warframe and be like 2 bucks
This game makes me wanna play destiny again. Love how the gameplay loop of this game reminds me of doing patrol missions in d2... the most basic activity d2 has..
Being able to buy the activators is something I’m not having a issue with, it’s how much they cost for how many you get. Warframe allows you to buy their reactors but they are much much cheaper
You are 100% right to question this and disparage it Cross. This type of monetization is the MOST toxic thing in gaming right now. Not only can you literally pay to win, the game is designed so that if you don't spend money on those things, you must dedicate hundreds of hours to grinding. It's the exact same argument the Warframe community has been having for years, and the reason I quit that game. What incentive is there to actually play the game and grind for the best stuff, when at any time Joe Schmuck can drop 100$ and be just as powerful as me and also have a cooler skin than what I can earn in the game. I agree that people can spend their money on whatever they want, but this game won't get a cent from me or another moment of my time.
When I was younger I played Maple Story, which was also made by Nexon. People would spend so much real money to boost their characters' stats. Hundreds of dollars
These things will from now on be in all games. My son who is 7 will know nothing else and it will systematically become the norm. It's a sad sad day but the big corporations are really starting to dig they're claws in on our little slice of peace.
@Aztecross , that "Maybe it was Warframe" kind of hurt me. So I've gone and checked warframe's premium currency and: "On average across all bundles, one platinum is equal to: 5.4 American cents(¢)" and a Forma, that lets you "up the capacity" costs 20 platinums. On top of that, you randomly and very commonly get platinum discounts on the account from 20% up to 75% on platinum. So I highly doublt it's even close to the same thing. Also Also, Formae are EXTREMELY easy to farm...although you do need 24 hours to craft one...and you can only make one at a time :x BUT many times you can buy fully crafted formae from event vendors for event points.
I mean to be fair it's a pretty simple argument you go and you buy a level one weapon from the guy in town with no modifiers. You look in the shop and you purchase the bundles that comes with purple modifiers, you purchase the little duhiki that allows you to equip more modifications and you compare. Because sure the gap closes as you both max out and beat the game. But if at level 1 they do 3x the damage you can assume they have 3x the advantage. Now sure later on in the game after your maxed it's only gonna be maybe 24% more damage output or survivability but that means a 4 man group of these guys would be equivalent to a 5 man group when it comes to bossing. They could still be out played but if they had the same skill level as the other player they would still have a 24% advantage if they used the same class and guns. 24% just being a random number maybe it's closer to 16% maybe it's more like 30%. I know right off the bat 10 points on my character is equivalent to doubling my hp, 10 more doubles my Def, 10 more is my shield and as a guy who plays like it's cod thats 90% of my build atm lol
In WF you have a chance to get these daily by doing a three mission sortie, the rewards have different drop chances but these are actually far better IMO Afterwards you just build it with regular materials you barely ever have to actually grind for Forma is specific to relics but is the most common drop from any relic it is on TFD requires u grind 4 rare resources for each, one is on a maximum of 3% drop chance, another is specific to vaults Vaults are next to impossible without enzo meaning you need to clear the game and farm a full decendant before you can grind one Vaults require breaker codes (or whatever the name) to open, u use them regardless of if you fail U are not guaranteed anything but keiper in these vaults, the code breaker is a random drop with no specific place to be farmed, meaning there is no way to speed up how fast you build these, just pray for good luck Same sistem, far diferent levels of grind, thus far different levels of tolerance for its monetisation
knew this was gonna happen when i first learned who made the game lol. Notorious for it. Same, not sinking my time into this 100% Gonna have some fun with it for a while then bounce.
I just hope they become more generous as time goes. Like warframe. Each event they basically "handout" the most needed items and materials needed for upgrades. They even give them out via twitch drops.
I agree with you cross as some one that plays both Warframe and Destiny things need to be leveled out for materials thats the only reason why there is no competitive warframe pve because most weapons, resources, or Gear you can straight up buy. That isn't bad either Warframe caters to this game style to keep their community as chill as possible the down side of that is nothing ever catches your eye for long not much makes you want to grind for it. If this game wants to pop out it needs to sit down and really consider where the vision of the game will go. Nobody wants this game to disappear into the background. I hope they actually listen to constructive criticism and not give into the quickest cash project.
Two things. 1- I agree. There's something very fishy with the way they've implemented this mechanics, and Nexon doesn't have the best reputation, so it's way too early to put any money in the game. 2- you get everything you need to clear the entire game solo (except obviously for those bosses which you don't get the option to). It's too early to tell what the game will be like in a couple of years, or even if it'll make it past this year. It'll all depend on whether devs listens to their community or not, and so far they have, so fingers crossed everything will be way better in the future, and the grind will become a million times more reasonable, like in Warframe.
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Crazy how they ignore the fact things take progressively longer than other games because they want you to pay for it
Thank you! Like I was shocked no one brought this up
What a shit take, already crafted 2 Energy And 4 crystalization
Nothing takes along as BDO to become slightly competitive.
It's not as bad if you don't fear fomo.
Ncsoft is from south Korea. Koreans are notorious heavily monetizing their MMOs. That's is why was just question of time they will show that
people who bring this up, are people who have never played warframe...
As a Warframe player, the amount of time to build these things for free are nearly the same, the problem is rushing the build and how much it costs to just buy it out right, in Warframe it costs 20 platinum (4.99 USD gets you 75) to just buy OR you can buy them from vendors/earn them from special event missions or whatever and to rush the build it only costs 10 platinum while in TFD to buy one it's over 19.99 USD and unlike Warframe (atleast for now) you are only given two for free (one for getting a descendant to level 40 and another for beating the main story) and farming these things are absolute hell since the drop chance for them are either 3% from normal mode sources or 6% from hard mode sources. having to pay roughly $25 or pray to RNJesus for a single digit chance for progression is absurd
^This. And I appreciate everyone's take. But due to how close this game model is to Warframe - we need more of the Warframe community here to offer insight like this. It's cute to say it's like Destiny or Anthem, but the systems in place here, are Warframe systems nearly 1:1. Warframe also has in game trade which bolsters the RMT economy, which this game does not have, which makes the urge to HAVE to spend money so much greater.
A forma takes about 10 minutes to get.. the catalysts are the ones that take a while since you have to wait for the free ones or by from the store.. but the difference it could still cost nothing since you can trade prime currency.
@@kingxkaey Warframe player of 8 years here! I really appreciate you acknowledging the need to hear from Warframe players to get an informed opinion.
First off, "endgame" is really quite nebulous in Warframe and what qualifies as an "endgame material" in Warframe is even more so. At this stage in the game's life I would say either some specific Arcanes (kinda like whispers or fragments in Destiny), Archon Shards, and/or Riven mods. All of the above except for Archon Shards can be TRADED for premium currency but never bought from a store. They need to be earned first before they can be traded for that premium currency. Yes because they are rare and heavily dependant on RNG trading for them is more appealing but you can always earn them for real
@@itgamer4143 one reason why I didn't bring up trading (even though they've spoke on potential adding it) is just cause with trading you essentially don't need to spend a dime to get anything which isn't a fair comparison as of right now since we can't see what the trading could be like
@@itgamer4143you can buy those also with nora night
Big thing is that The First Descendant uses Warframe's microtransaction system but without trading and having the prices being more out of whack compared to Warframe. For example, in Warframe there are reactors, the equivalent of energy activators in The First Descendant, and they cost much cheaper than energy activators in First Descendant.
In Warframe, you can pretty much get platinum, the currency you can buy with IRL money, from trading. You can trade parts, mods, etc. for platinum so it's entirely possible to play the game without having to spend any IRL money so you can get what you need easily and that's not even factoring in grinding the materials and crafting the item.
TFD is going to have trade
Developers said that before
chill brokie kid, the game's gonna have trade!
@@darthvocrum5719 This mentality is exactly why companies like Nexon get away with this shit. Trading isn't gonna magically fix the grind like you think it is. 15 dollars for one end game upgrade material is criminal. You can easily get the upgrade materials in Warframe without having to spend any money. Shit they basically give them away as login rewards. TFD is predatory in its monetization, but as long as people like you keep feeding them money it's never gonna get better. Also, being able to waste money on end game upgrades for a FREE TO PLAY game isn't the flex you think it is. Frankly, it's kinda sad
People talk about trading as if that will really help that much. It will help with exchanging mat for mat. But to get the currency, it won't help that much, because guess what, the currency has to come from other people that buy it from nexon. People still have to buy the currency to get it in flow from player to player.
brokie? My boy, I rather act broke to be rich. I got the money to spend hundreds to thousands on Warframe, but I have the equivalent exchange of $1000 in platinum(WF premium currency)just from trading in-game
crazy how hard the chat was coping
Lmao facts
my guess is it's people who cracked open their credit cards and are desperately trying to justify that decision.
@@Dream146 there it is..I couldn't have said it better myself
Edit: i regret this comment
I mean I definitely get what he's saying. But during my 30 hours I have spent $30 purely on skins. What I'm seeing is almost a 50/50. People who know how to farm these games have 0 issue getting these materials quickly without money and then you have the normal nexon game players who just bought all of them. You really truly do not need to buy these. The crystalzation catalyst is very easy to farm I had the materials for 3 within an hour last night. As for the energy amplifier there is no reason you should be able to buy it. I hope they go back on that and make them easier to farm. Bc honestly this is a very fun casual game.
@@Dream146 Or people know what they where getting into with a f2p game lol meanwhile half you mfs simp bungie who has kept pushing the needle of trying to add paid power into the BP and such in a 70 buck game
Orokin reactors and catalysts in warframe are 20 platinum, so for roughly $5 usd (75 plat pack) you can get three of them meanwhile this is far more expensive and hard to get
Or just buy it from Nora night in the free battle pass 😂
It's actually like 1.50 USD
Also, I see anything purchasable with plat (especially at such a low price) as totally purchasable without irl money, just from selling random prime parts I've gotten over time without even really trying, I've gotten quite a bit.
if you actually buy reactors or catalysts, idk what to say other than youre lazy. you can get it from nora night, you can get it from razorback armadas, formorians, and the daily sortie, so like.... it REALLY doesnt make sense to buy them.
Ther are multiple ways to get them too, for free, from events and via trading etc.
I also find it rather odd that there is not even one of these in the battle pass.
Pay to win
@@deioncaddiell7537 Pay to win PvE game? Cope.
Update: they now put it in the battle pass
As someone who has poured countless hours into warframe, a game which at a cursory glance, seems to be the main thing that first descendant copies all of its core systems from word for word, seeing the pricing on the equivalent of reactors/catalysts and forma for this game is obscene, idk how much you get but those prices are crazy for the equivalent items. Not to mention warframe's starter platinum and the fact its premium currency can be traded between players. This just seems like a worse version of warframe's gear monetization, which is not the best by any means in the first place. This just reflects even more poorly on first descendant to me.
Not to mention that Warframe in general has actual character and it's own identity. Not a single dev cared about this game, and it shows.
Fuckin' "Kyle..."
To answer your question, you get the same exact amount for $30 less, till you get to the materials and colors. They also don’t have a direct cash payment option for ultimates in The First Descendant so buy an Ultimate is pointless. Farming is much better. Use the premium currency to rush, or wait the 16hrs. Now the upgrade materials are outrageous. $20 dollars is not even excusable and will completely hurt the longevity of the game. Also colors are only permanently unlocked per character, so having to buy them all over again is also outrageous. There’s also the fact that default outfits are no longer colorable like in the beta.
@@Everlost_Nation It's Nexon game and they are known for being greedy so be prepared it will be just tip of iceberg and as time goes and new things will be added it will be even worse. Wouldn't be suprsied if they tried again to manipulate drop rates and mission will show you drop rate of like 3% but in reality it will be like 0,1% and only option will be buying it from shop for irl money because it will be close to impossible to get something.
@@kadarak1 I’m not new to this. This is tame for them
I know nothing about warframe but you sound so based I gotta give you the thumbs up 👍
I don’t make the rules
No one told Aztecross that its also like 5 times as expensive and several more times difficult than doubling your capacity in Warframe
5 times? More like 13 times.
and in WF it doubles your cap, in TFD it just adds 20 so its like 1 maxed out mod
I’ve never played Warframe. Objectively speaking if they’re both similarly monetized and grindy. Which of the 2 did you actually enjoy playing and grinding for?
@@ukbleedbluex9340Warframe aren’t really that similar for warframes case you can actually earn premium currency by selling prime items which are pretty easy to obtain as for the first descendent the game is extremely monetizing with its options to the point It’ll take months to get an ultimate or could just spend 100 dollars for one character, now if we pan back to Warframe spending a 100 dollars can get you nearly or more of the roster of the characters you can choose from and if you spend it wisely in trading instead of buying from the market it’ll be their prime variant instead of the regular.
@@ukbleedbluex9340 "if they’re both similarly monetized and grindy." First descendant is much rougher, trust me
I'm gonna go as far as I can as a F2p player, but right now I'm enjoying the farming loop and gameplay of the characters over a lot of other games. Ajax is everything I wish titan was, valby is everything I wished yareli was in warframe. I farmed valby freyna in one day and I'm half way done with gley farm as I only need the resources now.
Welcome to Nexon. This seems tame to their other games.
I'm genuinely surprised they didn't have ultimate weapon packs
Nah imo out of l their games blue archive is probably their least monetized game. Even for a gacha. Hope it stays like that because no game should be this damn expensive
The finals is good atleast for now i hope it stays that way
that is because they were trying to copy one of the best F2P games on the market but still wanted to add that Nexon greed
Im suprised there isnt a vacuum pet with a timer that only refreshes the timer with paid currency
First, i want to say that The First Descendant developers took inspirations from Warframe and Destiny. They said it in an interview provided by Gamerant.
Warframe has this purchasable booster/upgrade materials, but much cheaper. Warframe has trading system which alleviates the amount of money spending at a point where you can go full free-to-play while also having premium currency. You can farm the resources and craft these upgrade materials sure but they're tedious, unlike Warframe.
Do i want the developers not to earn their money? No, but these price tag cannot be normalized. Unfortunately, Nexon do what Nexon does and i won't be surprised if they decided to shut down The First Descendant after a few months/years
I was talking with friends about this game and most of them are saying that game will be shut down within year or two because Nexon will decide that it's not giving enough profit to keep it alive and do anything.
@@kadarak1 Man I'm glad you said what your friends said, meanwhile they have had other games going that pull less views and less dollars that are still going to this day. But pop off chief.
"inspirations" my ass bro, charecter relics, primes, the modding system, half of the charecter cast etc etc
thats not inspiration thats ripping at that point.
BROTHER THEY COPIED FORMA AND POLARITIES
THEY COPIED *POLARITIES*! AS IN THEY COPIED IT DOWN TO THE LAST LETTER BASICALLY
Naw this went way beyond inspiration lol they literally ripped every idea, system the game had and made it their own 😂
Nexon is actually known for keeping their MMO's up, despite how bad they're doin.
Nexon recently was fined for a loot box that had an advertised high desirable drop item that for various periods of time had a drop rate of 0%. Sadly it was a "cost of doing business" fine of only the equivalent of $9m USD, a far cry from the amount money they made from that loot box.
The fact that there's always people defending this continues to show me why so many online games are in such a bad state these days. Keep using "why do you care how people spend their money" all you want just don't be surprised when majority of the games playerbase leaves because of stuff like this. Which always happens. You guys are going have to learn sooner or later to stop being so reckless/irresponsible with your money.
This is exactly it dont care how people spend their money but they constantly funnel cash into half bake undown constantly deteriorating in quality games that continue to increase their prices
Thanks Coach, any other life lessons you want to pass on in the comments?
@@justbob242 Aww did someone's comment upset you ❄
Why yall pocket watching fr I get it's a dumb mechanic to by materials that buff you but it's not that deep
@@hi-kc7blBecause irresponsible spending tends to make it worse for everyone else. Companies always get greedy and test what they can get away with once they see people spending absurd amounts of $ for nonsense. This almost always happens I don't understand how in 2024 this has to be explained to people
It's wild that people are okay with the constant creep of monetization getting more and more egregious. As if the whole loot box debacle never existed, little aspects of pay to win keep rearing their ugly head with people defending it as "timesavers". If you don't have a ton of time to play and grind a game, don't worry about it and just play the game more casually, eventually you'll catch up and be able to do endgame anyways.
My dad is in his 60s and plays D2, sure he isn't raiding, but every now and then we hop into a dungeon together. He doesn't need to buy the season rank booster, material packs, or all the dungeon keys.
Games shouldn't be trying to nickel and dime people in ways like these that are completely unnecessary to enjoy the core experience. Games need money to develop, yeah. Skins sell like crazy. Expansions rake in absurd amounts even if they're mid. Anywhere past that is where we drew the line years ago, but the goalposts keep moving. Letting that slide is absurd.
This is why people get paid for marketing. If you put a huge price on microtransactions right away, you scare people off. Give them a way to earn it in-game,they'll dislike it, but tolerate it. The same thing with pricing something at a dollar or 5 dollars. It doesn't seem so bad at that point and will get more purchases.
Erm sir, your dad is playing literally like half the content the game has to offer. Meanwhile we get to experience the full thing for FREE. I play with my brothers, and not once have we said "I need to buy this thing from the store" we literally play the game to get what we want and that is the fun of it.
@@cephydash1533cept that's the thing the second the whales start to throw around influence in content and people get kicked for 'not being op' are you really playing the way you want at that point?
Because that stuffs like a slow insidious creep no game should have a in-game power but cosmetics only.
@div3345 I'm not reading all this, but there is no need to be mad or trip about it. It will continue to happen as long as people keep spending money.
It would have to be a law put in place to stop it. For a free game, I treat it like a game I'm buying . You may get $75 out of me, but that's as far as I'm going .
Control what you can.
*cough* Warframe players *cough*
As someone who lives in Korea, I can confirm this is typical for Korean games. Being able to buy your way to winning is common here. Regardless of if this game is currently appealing to a western audience, you still have korean game developers who are used to egregiously monitizing their games paired with Nexon, one of the worst in the business. Don’t waste your time on this game, it will be dead with a year or two.
If this game was a color, it would be beige
But you'd have to buy the color multiple times to cover your whole suit lol
Don't do beige dirty like that...
@@imblu6954glad someone typed that for me
HAHAHHAHA
It's from Nexon...let's stop being surprised. The games will always be a manipulative cash grab.
You say that while you probably spend 50 dollars + yearly on destiny. Different monetization buddy
@@cephydash1533defending the company that basically made microtransactions and the concept of p2w games mainstream is not the play chief. Spending money on an expansion is in no way comparable to the cash grab garbage nexon has made their fortune on
@petervalvo1186 I've spent 200 dollars + just to be able to keep up and catch up with my friends on Destiny. I've spent 0 dollars on first descendant, and we're all on equal grinds. I don't care about who invented what. All I care about is how deeply my wallet is affected and if I felt pressured into buying something, and so far, Destiny has done me dirty on those 2.
@@cephydash1533 comparing a paid game that's been out 10 years to a f2p game that's been out a week is a crazy comparison. If your friends pressured you into buying Destiny content knowing that it cost money, then you have pretty shitty friends, ngl
@@cephydash1533 How LoL, you could get all the content up to final shape for like 30 bucks before launch. I don't think you can spend that much even now. Stop coping with this game.
There is no 'level playing field' since there's no competition to compare yourself to. There's no PVP aspect, you progress your characters at your own pace as much as you want to. These materials are also aquired through general gameplay. The drop rates are low, but they drop from dozens of sources so you'll get them eventually no matter what you do. These mechanics have been around in MMO's for decades. Anyone who's played a similar game understands the system and appreciates that everything can be farmed for free, meaning it's not pay to win. New players to the genre however struggle to grasp this concept and scream 'PAY TO WIN' at the top of their lungs the moment they notice you can buy them. Relax and just play the game. You'll get everything you want without having to spend hundreds
I draw the line at paying for shaders
Blame the people who buy them. They wouldn't exist otherwise.
@@imblu6954 exactly. It was Piratesoftware that did the short about WoW's very first store mount and how it made more money than starcraft 2. It'll never go away now because of people that have more money than sense.
@@imblu6954 Blame the one holding the dangling carrot, not the one follow it.
@@sparhawk2195nah, i'm gonna blame the dumbass following a carrot on a stick for being so stupid as to not only not realize he's following a carrot on a stick, but to deny and defend it after being told and shown that it is indeed, a carrot on a stick.
@@sparhawk2195 If you stopped following the carrot, they'd stop dangling it 🤷♂️
It’s legit so insane to me, as someone that was excited for this game since pre alpha, how the Caliber currencies is halved in comparison to other games. Normally $5 gets you 500 but here it’s 250. Nexon blows so hard. Gonna just free to play it till I get bored.
yea thats why its otional. complaining an optional obtainable item is expensive, in game no less where earning it is the point duh, is dumb. play for free and earn it like every other normal MMO gamer. like if it was 5$ a skin and then the game dies in a month due to everyone having everything first week is any better? people just dont think anymore.
The worst part is that their battle pass is just 500 which seems cheaper than other games but it’s actually exactly the same $10 price. However, everything else they sell in their stores has the same 1,500-5,000 price tag as other games but bc their game currency is double the price instead of spending $50 on a premium skin you’re spending $100. It’s a very deceiving and aggressive strategy
@@nicholaswilkerson501 It sucks to have other people be able to buy their way to the best stuff. It shouldn't be an option.
@@nicholaswilkerson501you're the problem
@@javiercastrejon8102 Please stop spreading lies. Most Costumes have a pricetag of 750, which is 15 bucks. That is the standard for most games nowadays. They halfed the amount you get but also halfed the prices. It's literally the same as in most other games. They even published a patch today that made farming catalysts way easier. This game is fun but the Warframe community will shit on it until it dies. Which is sad... let people enjoy what they prefer and not just the game you enjoy. Also Prime Access in Warframe costs even more than an Ultimate in this game. Still both are farmable and no one needs to pay for it.
I don't get why people defend monetization practices like they have some stake in it or it's going to negatively effect them personally when a company gets called out for being greedy.
Bruh, its normal for live service games. The company ain't greedy, they're just running a business and the price is just a tag.
Entering the mall is free, but everything else ain't. Can't call the management greedy for charging parking fees innit?
@@oishicurrypuffus that's a poor comparison when there are other f2p games that implement their money-making better. You can't even get one of those items from the paid battle pass and it's a necessary item.
And what mall do you go to that has parking fees wtf
Simpletons 🙄🙄🙄
Playing first descendants just made me get back into warframe lol
It made me realize just how good so many other games actually are lol
Warframe is an absolute trash
@@revan1865Such trash that someone that doesn't know how to use basic grammar had to point it out.
@@imblu6954Check his comment history. You'll see what kind of person he is.
Same. D2 is my favorite game, always will be. But Warframe is also solid. I was blown away at how fair it is in pricing.
In Canadian currency, this works out to about 40$ to purchase one activator with caliber. These serve the same function as a Warframe potato (Reactor or Catalyst), which in Warframe costs 20 plat. I can buy 75 plat for $5.49 Cdn. So (like pretty much all things in this game), they took Warframe's systems and monetization model and just multiplied all the costs by 20 while reducing the drop rates almost as much.
yea but this game also cost millions to make........and warframe has been out for over 13 years....of course everything is cheap and is better. TFD came out less than a month ago. chill out. also inflation is real as well. costs of everything went up. as well as also steam taking 30% of everything. how do you expect the studio to make $$. i feel like every tool in here forgets game development is a business. its not an art project made especially for you. its cost millions to make and millions to maintain. get over it and just play the MMO like its meant to be played and earn the items. if not then stop playing games just to purchase your way to the top. its pointless.
@@nicholaswilkerson501 this argument is literally dumb, as warframe literally exists. you think warframe hasn't been a victim of inflation? they havent changed the prices of their premium currency at all. so with inflation, they'd actually be making LESS money now since the prices have stayed the same since 2013. and, to get the premium currency in warframe, you dont even need to spend money, you can get it for free! so many players are actually purely free-to-play. warframe makes money purely because people pay to support the game, not because it makes you feel like you need to spend money on the game or else you're at a disadvantage. the only time you will feel like that, is when you just start playing and see someone that's been playing for years and you're like "dang i wish i could do that." well you might if you spend some money, but i bet you're not a high enough mastery rank to even use the weapons that person is using either. so you're gonna have to grind for that mastery rank, and in that time, you probably could've earned most of the mods and materials required to build a lot of that older players loadout if you so desired. the "game development is a business" take is so stupid, if people like your game and its popular, people will spend money on it. people just dont like feeling forced to spend money on it, hence this game receiving the back lash that it's receiving.
That's the whole mentality behind these kinds of games. I like this game. I enjoy playing it and building my characters. But when I commit a 6 hours grind for ONE piece of a NORMAL Descendent and after I have nothing to show for it, it's obvious the devs are telling me to go screw myself, my time and my effort, and that I should go and buy it from the shop.
There's a limit to my time and my patience and as much as I'm enjoying this game, that limit is fast approaching.
As a Mastery Rank 34 (LR4) Warframe vet, I'm completely used to these items being available at a cost. While you can buy these to increase your mod capacity, you can't buy your mods or the gold/kuiper shards to level the mods. You have to grind that out. You can have all the mod capacity in the world, but without good mods to put in, and the knowledge of which mods *should* be used, and what makes a Descendent scale well, youre not going to be making it into any hard content.
Where I do get frustrated is the rarity of the resources coupled with the rarity of the blueprints themselves. Not to mention the vault hacking minigame that without Enzo is quite tough with server side lag. Also, the infiltration missions for the amorphous materials to get descendants & ultimate weapons are basically uncompletable solo without a Sharen. And even more so without a squad of Sharens for any degree of relative speed. We have bigger fish to fry, and we are not going to get them to stop selling these or lower the price. If we were lucky, they'll make the in-game farm for them a bit easier.
@@Azurewrath_TV sharen is good???
@@Konflicted She has cloaking. And you have to be undetected to get the additional drop roll. So she's good for that, not sure otherwise
@@Azurewrath_TV oh is that on any infiltration or just a specific modifier I’ve only completed one I just made it to hard mode
you feel ok that they ripped the modding system and a few other mechanics from DE? just curious on ur opinion
@bloodfest8510 I mean they didn't have a patent on it. And there's some bare bones things that are identical, but also some things that are different. Like the way the mods interact with your components, as opposed to only modding being the character drive. The addition of elemental resistances like Diablo & PoE. The gun/descendant synergies. Plus the QOL that we've asked for the past 11 years, dismantling all dupes, augment slot, the "aura" mods being more than just basic stat boosts, it's original enough in many ways that I don't see it as ripping, bit taking inspiration from.
thats nexon for you was hyped for this game until i saw it was made by nexon
same played maplestory for years and knew immediately what they had in store when it comes to monetization
laughed off the mere idea of playing the game the moment I saw that it's made by Nexon. That's a HELL NO right from the start.
I didn't even know of this game until the day before launch. Had some people telling me it's fun and I should try it because I like Warframe and destiny so I looked it up saw Nexon and immediately lost interest.
Also hearing it was free to play made me very suspicious. Free games like this always have a catch.
same brother iwas the same.....
I think you should play it and not worry about the company name, if you enjoy the gameplay you should play it
putting these materials in the shop is also a great motivator in keeping drop rates low
I personally dont like the vaults that I need to go to look for to get materials but I'll do it cause $30 for 1 energy activator is crazy
Craft Enzo he'll make those vaults easy
i dont use money and already crafted 2 mushrooms
@@cephydash1533 I'll definitely do that when my power is back on if he does make it easy
this is the item they want to get most of the lazy whales money from im pretty sure the f2p or the minnows even dolphins wont touch it with a yard pole because more often than not they only purchase things that they ever really really want or cant get through grinding like a skin
I got 2 just by finishing the main story plus a few mats short of crafting 1 but you can only use 1 on a descendant anyways or gun so dont need many and the other mat can obly be used when your max lvl and then it resets your lvl so you still gotta grind all the lvls again and by the time you grind the mats you might be lvl 40 again
They recently congratulated a team for being the first to clear Molten Fortress, the hardest of all void bosses (as per their tweet/X). Imagine achieving this and having people question whether you paid for that success.
From my understanding the team that beat it did pay for it. They spent around $1000 for upgrades and stuff 💀
😮😮😮@@ronnie0817
To be fair most top players in every game are cheating/p2w one way or another.
@@ronnie0817 lol and why does it matter? Its a choice and a time saver. just like buying prime bundles in warframe. Most MMO's do this. if you want to spend that cash on time savers then that's your choice. there is no extra advantage for doing something 1st in this game.
@@nicholaswilkerson501it isn’t fair that’s the problem along with the fact there’s a 3% drop rate for the blueprint makes it feel like their gatekeeping endgame from people that don’t want to pay I’ve been playing since day one and haven’t gotten a single energy activator bp out of doing atleast like 10 void intercepts a day but somebody can say f tht drop some money and skip a grind that’s taken me a week atp I’ve wasted 7 days of my life to get something some lonely dude with 3 cats just bought 5 of em cuz he can and as a long time warframe player it’s kinda like a slap in the face whats the point of the grind if yall want me to pay to get the shit I’m grinding for its damn near a microtransaction simulator late game
I am guessing you don’t play Warframe for the same reason, they have the same items in the game shop that are also purchasable, but they break it down into two different ones, Orikin Reactor for the Warframe and Orikin Catalyst for weapons, the Forma for polarizing the mod slots on both. I guess for me since I have played Warframe for years I don’t see it as anything unusual, but I can see the point you’re making.
The Orokin reactor and catalyst also don't cost 20 dollars like in first descendant
@@cyrus6461 agreed but that wasn’t what my comment was about, the cost and it is worth up to the individual to decide and is between that person and the person selling the item, my comment was simply asking if he doesn’t like/play Warframe for that same reason.
If you're buying reactors for plat ur trolling they are dirt cheap with night wave credits also forma is so easy to obtain unlike the stuff in the first descendants
Monthly devstreams also give out alerts that give them
They’re also given out in the battle pass in the track, or tokens you get from the track, that you can use to directly buy these reactors and catalysts with.
It’s also 20 platinum. You can trade mods or useless parts to someone and get enough to buy one outright. Warframe, while allowing you to buy them, also allows you to trade the premium currency, platinum.
It’s nice to play when there is a 3 week break in destiny
Yeah buts sadly that's all it's for imo. Just for the d2 downtime
Naw. I go back HD2😂😂
Untill we get a couple more weeks of lifeless writing.
@bignblack63bx I went back to Helldivers 2 for roughly 30 min, forgot how repetitive it was and went to Elden Ring
Elden ring ismt repetitive? Hmmm@@soraxstacy1477
What level playing field when there is no PVP??? Why would you care so much about level playing field when there is no competitive scene in this game? Not everything has to be so fucking competitive and not everything has to be a race to be the first Aztec.
I can barely buy groceries weekly and keeping up with all my bills. Not all of us got it like that. I appreciate you sticking up for the common man on this!
Starforge the new raid shadow legends for these sponsorships.
They giveaway free computer why are you complaining? Seems like you are sick in the head.
About the same quality as well
@@DucisImperiumdamn starforge pcs are bad? I was looking to get one lol
I think these materials are closer to Warframe’s Orokin catalyst and forma (both can be farmed and bought) but they are substantially easier to obtain WITHOUT dropping money on the game. I wish these materials could drop from sources already built and ready to use rather than having to go through a mega grind just to build one, maybe two. But I’m still enjoying the game, it’s a nice break from D2 and I get to play the game for free. Being a f2p model can suck at times but I don’t feel the need to drop a sack of cash on this game as I won’t be making it a top priority game.
If the game dropped a dungeon or raid, I wouldn’t really care what anyone else did to get ready for the activity. It’s their life and I’m happy to just play that activity when I’m ready. It’s the same for me in D2, I have never done a Day 1 raid and I doubt I ever will. I’ll just watch you, Aztecross, or someone else go through it and have a good time.
im personally having a lot of fun as a break from warframe warframe whilst a little freindlier to f2p players is also friendly to p2w players too when a new update comes out for warframe im usually done with it in 1-14 days depending how big it is because ive basically completed the game so it for me is nice to have another game thats kinda simular to sink some time into cus warframe is pretty dry of any endgame content its got some basic dailies and nothing that would be considered challenging content for a hardcore player
Okay. I decided to finally watch this video and realize Destiny content creators dont understand how easy it is to farm for the mushrooms and rings in this game. You put time in it and you'll get it easily there is always either a mushroom or ring blueprint in a relic. They dont take long to farm and you having the ability to buy them is just a fast way of saying i need one now for my build. unlike in destiny where the golf balls and everything else isnt guarantee drop either. It just makes the grind less painful. It doesn't make your character have bigger advantage.
But…why does starforge’s logo look like a man’s….unit.
Man ? Is he stupid?
Life size copy of asmongolds dong
Lol
coc n bolls
i will never unsee this
I'm amazed you've not bigged up the RuneScape case on starforged as an ad yet 😅
I love the first descendant but man it's boring in late game no raids or dungeons. I've been playing Deadlock I'd love to see a review Cross
Check out Warframe when 1999 drops later this year
Warframe does exactly this lol
@@kazeoniwaban9786 name one material or mod that you can buy with plat that is super hard to grind for without mentioning the ingame market
@@kazeoniwaban9786nop warframe is better
@@kazeoniwaban9786 not at all lol
@@kazeoniwaban9786 its way easier to get stuff though
The First Descendant is literally just "we have Warframe at home."
In terms of quality maybe. But in terms of price it’s more like Warframe on a yacht. Shit is mad expensive
It's honestly not, there are definitely a lot of ideas from WF, at the same time, they did take things into their own direction with proper dungeons and world bosses
See Warframe gets away with mats like that being able to be bought because there is a ingame market for the same curacy that you would have to buy in this game, out of all the things FD coped and pasted from WF, they forgot that... the one reason it was ok for WF to sell those mats. Because im setting with 3k plat in my wallet, and I've never spent a dime in WF.
My first thought when I got in this game was "it's like Warframe" the movement doesn't feel as tight, but the character models are better and I like the environments more. It's pretty much just Warframe that is all it is but it doesn't have the in-game market, and as people have pointed out it's really expensive to get a ultimate descendant,
Like back in the day I bought one of the primes I don't remember which one it was but it was a bundle for $80 for two of them and like the equivalent of 40 or $50 worth of platinum and prime weapons that go with the characters... I like the game but also they are trying to milk people really hard, and I wouldn't be surprised if we find out in the future if they are secretly messing with percentages on things (because the percentages of some things don't line up to the way it feels when you're trying to get it.)
I think this game can be really fun but they do have a lot of work to do and they should probably get to it very quickly because it's going to get bad it's going to be in a tera situation if they don't find something to hook people because all they have right now is a worse movement experience but a better-looking version of Warframe that is even more grindy
You cant buy prime warframes. You farm them from relics and prime parts drop pretty easily. Can most parts within 1~3 runs per relic with radgroups. To get the materials needed for ultimates in this game you need to farm a much longer, more annoying and sometimes more difficult dungeon that only has a 3% drop rate. Thats 1 part out of like 30 different things you need that either you need a ton of or has absurdly low drop rates.
@@Sirkingx There are prime bundles that let you buy the warframes, I dont remember how often they happen but gauss had one
@@Wonderkinge82 They happen every update.
With the energy activators, people were off. They can buy as many as they want for weapons but each descendant only looks like they can have 1 energy booster. So it’s not like someone’s character is gonna have 250 energy for modules
They are soo expensive tho.
After 1 month, energy activated every descendant, stacks of catalysts to build whatever descendant i want, and all ultimate weap n descendants unlocked no money spent, after playing TFD for 1 month free
The problem with aggressive monetization like this is that it forces game design to find the breaking point of players to get more and more people to swipe their cards. Making the grind worse and worse with each new iteration of the free-to-play game model.
The difference is...Warframe found that point, and rarely, if ever crosses it, and when they do, they backpedal hard and fast. Nexon has made it a point TO cross that line CONSTANTLY, to the point of being caught physically making RNG items unavailable to drive people to buy things...and people are still more willing to play this than Warframe. Make that make sense.
First Descendant is a terrible iteration of this model, and with a game like Warframe not only in existence, but the majority blueprint for this monetization, is pretty offensive. Digital Extremes has been refining that type of difficult to build good will over 11 years, and mostly succeeded for a reason.
Nexon comes along and is trying to destroy it by simply being Nexon, and it sucks.
@RedShadowOfSaturn honestly I haven't played warframe in years, but I played at launch and it took hundreds of runs of the same mission over and over again to unlock basic characters, or you could drop 20 bucks (can't remember the price at launch but both the grind and the cost felt egregious). The prime characters were even worse and they were charging like 100 bucks or you could grind for like a month straight.
I don't mind a grind if it is either long but there is a decent amount of variety to the activities I'm running, or if it's fairly short and I'm not spending 20 hours on the same mission.
@@UncannyTrickster So a few things. First, several of the harder farms for certain Frames, like Harrow, have been significantly improved with better RNG pools and drop rates. Some of the newer ones that released in the past year or two have even had a pity currency system attached so if your RNG is crummy, you can save up the currency to get the remaining blueprints you need while you grind it. The amount of activities has broadened a ton as well, so when one thing gets boring to grind, plenty of other different ones to get involved with. The philosophy of respecting players' time has been upgraded drastically. Even grinds like Focus can be done faster and easier in certain places like Conjunction Survival and Duviri, Omnia Fissures where players can open ANY era relic means groups can both grind Focus AND have a wider range of Prime rewards to collect as well.
And that's on top of the fact that players can gather up rare items and trade them for premium currency for free, which is part of the larger discussion here. We don't know how Nexon will approach that when they implement trading, but they NEED to make caliber something we can trade for.
In any case, Warframe grinds have been greatly improved over the years. The core of grinding is still there, obviously, but much of it has been smoothed out.
The difference is that part of Warframe's gameplay IS the grind, and most of the time it's fun. The First Dependent has no activity variation, no enemy variety, terrible story, awful voice acting, ugly playable characters (in terms of most of the male characters, the females being overly sexualized,) painfully long unfun grinding/time gating, and soulless character design. With all that, how could anyone justify the shit TFD pulls?
The ONLY thing I'd say I like better about TFD than I do Warframe, is that the movement feels good and weighty, instead of too fast and floaty.
@@imblu6954 One could argue TFD's movement is more steady than Warframe's, but...the one mobility thing they added to be quicker, the grapple hook, is hyper awkward, it never seems to catch for me (even with a little indicator). Thus, the game is basically Outriders for me. Running and rolling and shooting and that's it. So...basically it doesn't really have "special movement" to highlight, "you can move in it," I guess. Outriders with a grapple hook and no cover system. Which is not great.
100% Agree with Cross. Imagine you and a friend are playing side by side through the game, they pay $500, look cooler, do more damage, are faster, have tons of ammo... And you are a free player and just watch your friend destroy everything. On one hand it could be fun to watch them wreck stuff, but you would start to feel inferior and therefore less excited about your own character and power.
Cross I'm going to be honest, I understand what you are trying to say and I agree for the most part. I don't like this monetization strategy and I would really like if they modified it to something better. Also their prices are REALLY egregious. But I think you are being unfair in your comparisons with Destiny. Multiple times you say "if it get a Destiny type activity", this game is nothing like Destiny, except for it being a looter shooter. (Comparisons can happen, I just think the ones you made are unfair).
I know people will criticize me here but I will say it.
Why everyone is on the same playing field on day one ?
I answer you there is no playing field. Either you bought the 100 dollar expansion or you can't do day one. I don't have the option to play for a long time and try it.
Is Sleeper Simulant the meta ?
Guess you need to have the forsaken pack huh.
Need the new dungeon exotic is fire ?
It's ok just get that dungeon key.
What I mean is Veteran Destiny players (I include myself), usually are unable to see how a game can be unfair or exclusive. (For new players that is obvious, that is why is so difficult to get new players to play Destiny)
Destiny = Fair, but you need to pay to play. Destiny just locks content and say everyone that pay that fee can be on the same playing field.
First Descendant = "Unfair", but you can play everything. FD dont lock content but you can pay to be on a higher playing field or just play a lot.
That’s something warframe does great, reactors (same thing as energy activator) can be earned for FREE or cost 20 platinum.
And can be obtained for very little effort and not behind lots and lots of rng that also requires you to be 80% through the games story
@@blix17to also add, there's a legit FREE battle pass where you just do challenges and earn BP points(I forgot the actual name)to basically earn "free" reactors/catalysts
We buy with 20 plat in Warframe
And that 20p is a child's play lmao anybody can get that starting from MR 5 hell anybody can sell stuff worth 10p each which is so easy daily and still get 50p each day lol minimum 2 potatoes a day think about the grind and money hungry this game's been...be money hungry but don't make it so obvious is all I'm requesting to Nexon
@@godtiergarou2531 yea I like the game really but these things are very expensive
Or you could just save your plat and get them from, let's see...Invasions, Nightwave, Duviri, Sorties, Archon Hunts, Twitch Drops, should I continue? Why on earth would you PAY for this?
@@RedShadowOfSaturnbecause those resources aren't always available, there's around 50 warframes and around 10 times as many weapons. You'll eventually run out of ways to get catslysts or reactors because they aren't infinite.
Once that happens your options that remain are either trading or buying currency yourself. Of which i'd always recommend trading unless your daily login gifts you a discount (which can range anywhere from 10-75%) and you end up buying a sizable amount of plat, of which you decide to spend some on reactors and the like which is fine.
@@godtiergarou2531 If nothing else, every 2 weeks people will buy trash Prime parts in bulk to sell for Ducats, because Baro is back....
@aztecross, I guess you dont buy the season pass for additional xp boosters, ascendant shards/alloy, and other in-game items.
As a warframe player I’m not gonna act as if I didn’t pay for catalyst, reactors, forma, exiles adaptors, arcane adaptors etc, but as everyone has already said even if the system wasn’t perfect trading allows one to mitigate the need drop cash while also not being as pricey. (I still think at this point they should be dropping from dedicated sources at this point however) Not going to repeat what the other warframe players have said besides that, what I will say however is that good games, and good studios whether the game are free to play or full price deserve to be paid for.
Warframe is not only fun, but the people behind the game are to this day are so extremely passionate about it, something you don’t see from many game devs these days, and being very communicative and responsive to their community. They’re not perfect either they’ve screwed up before especially from pricing certain things, but when they say “we listen, we learn” they are. It’s that relationship that they have cultivated over the years that allow a system as bad as it looks on the outside to be able to work for a f2p game. I can drop money without batting an eye because I know that the money is going back to the game or to one of the many causes DE supports. As such it makes me want to support their future and Warframes future.
This to me is the difference, nexon does not have this and with pricing like that and their track record it only makes this worse.
TLDR; it’s about trust. Good games, and good studios deserve to be rewarded, this can only be done by building trust with their player base and showing good faith through their product. Nexon does not have this.
Great video thanks
ima be deadass with you, played this game for almost 10 years now.
i payed for the kuva pack during the war within
and payed to skip farming a nechramech.
you aint gotta pay for allat at all.
thats the point.
also when i payed for a nechramech? i got a 75% discount on plat.
so deadass, TFD is el garbage for ripping warframes systems
@@bloodfest8510 Yeah you just drop 45 bucks when you get the big discount if you want and you're set for a long time, I even invest it and basically resell stuff that I get cheap.
Most times I end up with more than I started with unless I go on a big cosmetic spending spree.
well said, Warframe is the only game where i have no regrets buying skins or prime-access stuff because of DE, such a fantastic dev-studio. I dont see any other dev-studio that has the same humor as DE, e.g. Relay 69, some Warframe ASSets, hilarious dev-streams/dev shorts, etc
I even got called "whale" a few times just beause i bought some cosmetic stuff
@@Lieentz exactly, never seen a game make me happy that I'm supporting developers with Ingame purchases up until DE
I was watching live during the discussion. Its actually insane how delusional chat was, and sad that people are accepting monetization like this.
I have a hypothesis on that. Was Cross streaming during standard work hours? Because if he was, maybe chat was mostly people who can already afford to not work.....
Decent long time player for warframe, I think an important think to note is that warframe has a market where you can earn platinum by trading items from grinding blueprints n such for their in-game currency, which then allows to buy forma/crystallization catalyst/ascendant alloys. Point is I don’t think selling them is a bad thing, I think it’s just the fact that there’s just not anyway to earn in-game currency in TFD.
i compare then to potatoes in warframe. i dont mind they exists, my problem is how expensive they are and how much grinding takes to get them or the catalyst for swapping slot polarity
Night wave?
expensive? lmao. nightwave, sorties, razorback armada, formorians, archon hunts, like theres so many places to get potatoes.
That's a ridiculous comparison.
One cost 1.5 USD, and the other cost 30 USD.
Warframe also gives you them for free CONSTANTLY. I haven't bought one in like 3 years.
on warframe you can get these as easy as you breathe lmao
people not realising you're talking about tfd with how expensive and how much of a time investment it is to get one of them. lmao.
They forgot to tell you the first people to beat the last boss spent over 1000 dollars on activators to do it lmfao
Last boss in hard or normal cause I beat normal last boss without spending any money. I'am not deffending,you can grind everything. So don't know why people bitching abot it,if they don't even play the game 🤣
@@patrikpetrucha5536 well I mean you beat it last night and they beat it less than 24 hours after the full game was out..
@@gobonkersyeah7368 It's totally fine, this is a game and not a race.
@@KaiserBrasil It's not fine if you can just buy your way to victory, but you do you.
@@okami1272 Feels more like pay to not play, it's pure pay to lose in my perspective.
Idk much about this game but with Warframe, at least there is trading and you can trade the “premium currency of platinum, so if you want to grind stuff out, you could also be gathering materials, that you can then trade for essentially real money.
I’ve played about 40 hours and haven’t spent a penny yet and I have really enjoyed my time.
I have spent money but no more than I think the game is worth (£30-40).
I hated the game early on but its grown on me, it does grind fairly and every pain point Cross talked about here isn't really an issue. The only real issue is the craft time/rush prices being far too big.
Warframe is the same way i've spend about 8-9k hours playing it and is the same you spend real money for the catalyst and reactor. But in the end game you start getting them left and right. I personally feel like they made them more accessible in this game. And the point that if they implement raids, you can stock up on things like that prior to the update. Same as we do on D2 we pull out all the best of the best weaponry we have, we test stuff up, and go ready for anything. For a d2 player I understand why it doesn't seem right because I do play d2 as well, but having 8k hours on warframe it really is not a bad thing. If you wanna pay 2 rush, go a head but I don't think is needed.
warframe actually has a reason for craft time though, TFD just stole so much shit from WF that it got included
people defend this shit now, but if someday they drop a raid or something similar, then release a incredibly broken character, and now you can only get into a raid party if you have that character at maximum, and your only options is waste 2 years building the char or pay 120 dollar to get it instantly, then they will start to cry about it.
but then it will be too late, as always.
weak willed, shortsighted people always fuck everything up.
Cant wait to make freaky baldurs gate mods
Its been 6 days, you get 2 for free and I have farmed two of them already, what are people talking about?!?
Destiny community hates every game but destiny.
I know right? People are crazy, I didn't even know they were in the shop til last night lmfao. I've been grinding to make em, and will continue to do so until the need arises to spend actual money lol.
@@cryxbaby2250they hate destiny too😂
hey everyone just a fyi everything aztec is saying its a deal breaker becuase of how much things cost everything hes talking about can also be farmed in game for FREE so plz dont let the prices sway you from playing this amzingly made FREE TO PLAY you make the choice wheaather youy want to support the devs for there amzing content or you want to remain FTP thats up to you but you can get all those upgrade materials from farming :)
Warframe has something similar...except they also give those things out like candy as well as having them be directly purchasable
they make them so easy to get you never feel pushed the buy them. TFD does the exact opposite, making the grind to tedious you feel pushed to buy them just to skip it
they are also cheaper to buy, AND you can grind for the necessary premium currency in about an hour or two. 3 if your RNG is trash.
same their equivalent to Crystallization Catalysts, except those you can also get while grinding for the premium currency as well
the difference between how Warframe does it and how TFD does it is day and night
Warframe does it in a way that I find acceptable. mostly because you can only put 1 reactor on a Warframe or weapon, and there is only so many forma you can put on before they start becoming redundant and unnecessary.
that said...really strange take coming from someone who defends how Destiny 2 monetizes. selling dungeon keys, then locking an OP exotic behind said dungeon?
paying for the OP seasonal exotic?
paying for the deluxe edition of an expansion to get an OP exotic?
how are any of these any different?
The dungeon exotic rarely is op (if ever honestly), it's mostly usually a gimmick exotic that's fun to use, maybe navigator was strong but that was due to strand titan grapple, not the weapon itself.
The pass exotic is free for everyone at level 45 of the pass and the other one from missions is usually shite.
20 bucks for 2 mini raids is not that big of a deal and you can skip them if the loot isn't worth it for you, btw that price is lower than TFD's "reactors".
The exotic from the deluxe is just early access for people before the expansion drops, then every base dlc owner gets it, and on top of that it's absolute garbage and no one uses/used it.
There's justified hate for D2, but there's also hate by misinformation apparently.
Personally I don’t have the time to grind it out, so anything that can save me some time to be able to play for a bit after work and catch up with friends is always nice.
A better way to think about it though is that if people 10 years ago didn’t needlessly spend there money in the first place on stuff like this financial analysts at these gaming companies wouldn’t pick up on the fact that they could have put more things behind paywalls or increased grinds in the first place in exchange for monetization speeding it up. It was because people spent money so much on stuff like “time savers” that the average grind of your usual game changed dramatically over the years. Video games are literally changing because of the money people are spending.
Here's the thing: You dont have time to grind it out because they artificially made that grind longer to entice you to buy it. You've been conned.
@@Ghost0fDawn Na
I subscribed maybe a hour ago seeing this i have alot more respect for you as a content creator than the others bringing this to attention than brushing over it this is getting worse year by year in multiple games not just this one
The fact you have to make it ALL THE WAY to the end of the campaign, to craft an energy activator (WHILE HAVING LOW DROP RATES FOR THE STUFF YOU NEED) but Tommy next door can use his mom or dads credit card without touching the cusp of the campaign is down right disgusting and money hungry
Games free bro
@@SuperKinahead when you're basically forced to pay for necessities, its not
@SuperKinahead these companies have a lot of yesmen I see. And you're not even getting paid...
@@Qwlett Did you buy the game
@@zelohendricks51 is the game free or not.
Its a simple question.
These painful grinds for items to make your progression much longer and harder with ridiculous RNG are definitely dealbreakers… they took the models from Warframe but instead made it shite… I can forma my Warframes 8 times in maybe an hour… (also to get Forma, just go do a mission for a drop.. easy) But here in TFD you want to change your mod slot and increase your capacity… try 2 days at best lmao🤦🏽♂️
What you're smoking , because you'd get them spaces and mod slots by leveling up your master rank
@@blackyonbiI was just about to say this lol
@@blackyonbidid you not pay attention to the items mentioned and do you not understand the ultimate goal? In order to increase your mod capacity (far beyond the little bit you get for MR rank which is also a grind in of itself as I’m MR 15 in TFD… which at this point is probably the average of most players for people with actual lives) you use the Energy Activator to increase the base mod capacity for your descendant/weapon… then you use Crystal Catalyst to change the polarity on your mod slots so mods in that slot cost half which enables you to upgrade a mod to its max….to get these items they take a long grind and crafting session that slows down your progression when you want to build up your character.. unless you pay. The model they copied from Warframe we can get the upgrade item itself from farming relic missions easily and then Forma multiples times in under an hour and also when you want to upgrade a base overall capacity it is simply done after after getting the reactor/catalyst item drop from another mission in WF. What are you smoking?
@@blackyonbihe said “change mod slot” mod slot have little icon that reduce 50% of cost u need an item to do that in warframe it easy to farm this item, but in tfd is very tedious cuz u need to do a lot of step, imagine u get this by doing 1 missions instead of 4 mission and tedious step that is warframe
@@kazeoniwaban9786 🤦🏽♂️ you also and the people who liked his comment do not understand the system.
I mean… aren’t you only allowed to use one activator per item anyway, and can only use the crystalization after to max out at level 40 per use?
It still takes a long time either way.
I find there’s this sub-culture of people. I don’t know if they’re just annoying online contrarians or if they secretly like the idea of non-cosmetic MTX in games because they can pay to be stronger. But every time this comes up and someone says they don’t like it and don’t want it in their game, this weird chorus of “you don’t have to buy it” starts echoing. NO ONE IS SAYING THEY HAVE TO BUY IT. We’re saying WE DO NOT WANT IT IN OUR GAME. These are two separate things: being forced to buy something and opposing its presence. There’s no grey area-you either like pay-to-win or you don’t. There are games that have it and games that don’t. Pick one and stop trying to claim moral victories over stuff no one is arguing about. In debate what yall do would be described as a “red herring”
I am fine with people not liking the mtx, it’s your opinion. I can understand how they might seem unfair to those who can’t afford it or spent the hours grinding it out. Personally if the mtx are pay-to-advance and not true pay-to-win (unable to get things without buying them) I don’t mind them and as someone who works 60 hours a week and has some expendable cash it helps me to keep up to some degree when I don’t get to play as much as I would like to. Also this game currently does not have much competition between players and rather a personal sense of achievement beating new things.
It's wild to me how hard people are jumping through hoops to excuse nonsense like this
Glad I waited to see how bad the microtransactions were before playing. Now I get to save time and money.
Weird how people are suddenly realizing this game is hot garbage with pay to win bs.
Who are you paying to win against ????????
@@KonflictedPay to win just refers to skipping manipulative and sluggish grind that's put there specifically to get you to spend money.
It's way more unacceptable when in PvP games, but equally hated anywhere.
@@Konflicted the well articulated individual above this put it well. but yes.
@@imblu6954 for me they way you win at games like this is to refine and modify your builds so that farming is so easy and the grind doesn’t phase you that’s how I feel you win at games like this and warframe etc unlike destiny where you have to buy DLC to have access to certain gear guns etc it’s just all about farming to get what you want and TFD gives you bunny and free capacity which with all blue mods I’m farming hard content with ease most games don’t even give you a good foundation to start your farming career you usually would have to buy a character like bunny
@@Konflicted that is just flat out wrong, name me a single game that doesnt do that
8:20 and destiny 2 isn’t guilty of this practice? Paid bungie shill.
D2 isn't P2W...
@@hectornieves537 if it is its nowhere’s near as greedy as TFD. Wake up delusional simp.
Even in Warframe, the potatoes were 2 dollars, a single activator or catalyst costing 30 dollars we have how many Descendants and weapons? Bruh, its the one thing I cant get behind
0:06 I totally disagree lol
So brave to be so open about your disability like that.
@@brandenpedersen5127what a dumbass comment
As a mostly free to play player with Warframe the First Descendent just looks very scummy with everything
I used to have the same thought process until I realized that me getting all these materials, modules, reactors etc. is playing the game for me. I enjoy the journey of getting my character really powerful. I very much enjoy the Borderlands series because of that reason. Getting the gear is playing the game for me and I wouldn’t take that from myself by paying my way through. Also some people need to take a step back and realize not everything is a competition. Especially this game. There’s nothing competitive about this game.
Keeping the gaming culture gaming. Appreciate you man.
I’m with you 100% on this. Monetization shld always be cosmetic, when it’s not I find it very difficult to take the game seriously
Lmao I gave this game a shot, all the way up until I tried crafting my first weapon, looked for the mats did the mission I needed 3 times (The mission was boring af) but eventually I got it.
I was all excited to use this new weapon only to be met with an 18hrs crafting time before I could use it... Now I understand this game didn't invent this but, give me 1 good reason except for money that this is a good mechanic. No seriously, why? I was playing the game, wanted to keep playing, but the game told me fuck you pay us now or stop playing... I do not envy yall that grew up playing games where this is acceptable, cause I grew up playing games that were meant to be fun.
simple, there isnt one, there IS a good reason its in warframe.
this game uses it for player time retention and as a money grab
Bottom line is simple, If they don't change the acquisition of these progression items to either be easier to farm or cheaper to buy (like warframe), the game will die. The reason Warframes been so popular and had longevity is because DE listens very closely to its players and has put systems In place that are actually F2P friendly. Nexon are fine with copying the system but they seem to fundamentally fail on why those systems work for Warframe.
I've hit Hard mode and I was having fun maxing my builds… right up until I tried to farm for an energy activator. 50 amorphous materials cracked and not one BP drop. Warframe is the game I've by far spent the most on, but instead of feeling robbed I always felt like it was well spent because I get rewarded and I'm supporting devs that actually care. This game was fun for a while, but I'll be going back to warframe, as I'm sure many others will to.
Aren't ascendant Alloys and ascendant shards in the seasons pass in destiny so you're spending money for them as well 1:52
Yep but destiny and warframe players are to ignorant to realize there game does the exact same shit
Yes and no. Yes they are in the season pass and you get a couple. No you don't need the season pass to get them. You can buy 3 of each from Rahool with in game currency each week. You can also get them from activities like gm nightfall. Tons of easy ways to get them really without any money
@@ronnie0817 it’s the exact same with first descendant that’s the funny part there not hard to get
@@luckywater-gaming3840 the original comment is not a good argument though. Also the first descendant is definitely not the same they're intentionally making the grind tedious to push people to spend more. I really question the drop percentage. The other difference in destiny you only need one material you get for doing activities. The first descendant you have to grind for materials to make more materials to make more materials to wait to use your crafted item or to upgrade. Or you spend $20 and have it instantly.
I feel like cross is coming into this with a destiny 2 mindset and this is way closer to warframe. You just grind and that’s the gameplay loop. No endgame like destiny and no contest mode stuff. Just play and enjoy yourself. I’m close to 100 hours in and I actually enjoy this more than destiny 2 act 1. Act 1 and what I’m hearing from act 2 is bummy. I’ve gotten 4 energy activators blueprints over the last couple days and it’s genuinely not bad at all. The energy activators aren’t making you do 100% extra damage. The 25 dollar price tag for that stuff is absurd though. Need to be like warframe and be like 2 bucks
Lucky as fuck if you’re actually getting the 3% drop on those blueprints
This game makes me wanna play destiny again. Love how the gameplay loop of this game reminds me of doing patrol missions in d2... the most basic activity d2 has..
Being able to buy the activators is something I’m not having a issue with, it’s how much they cost for how many you get. Warframe allows you to buy their reactors but they are much much cheaper
I wish bro had this energy for the Dr.Disrespect video
You are 100% right to question this and disparage it Cross. This type of monetization is the MOST toxic thing in gaming right now. Not only can you literally pay to win, the game is designed so that if you don't spend money on those things, you must dedicate hundreds of hours to grinding. It's the exact same argument the Warframe community has been having for years, and the reason I quit that game. What incentive is there to actually play the game and grind for the best stuff, when at any time Joe Schmuck can drop 100$ and be just as powerful as me and also have a cooler skin than what I can earn in the game. I agree that people can spend their money on whatever they want, but this game won't get a cent from me or another moment of my time.
The grind for those upgrade part is real.
When I was younger I played Maple Story, which was also made by Nexon. People would spend so much real money to boost their characters' stats. Hundreds of dollars
These things will from now on be in all games. My son who is 7 will know nothing else and it will systematically become the norm. It's a sad sad day but the big corporations are really starting to dig they're claws in on our little slice of peace.
@Aztecross , that "Maybe it was Warframe" kind of hurt me. So I've gone and checked warframe's premium currency and: "On average across all bundles, one platinum is equal to: 5.4 American cents(¢)" and a Forma, that lets you "up the capacity" costs 20 platinums. On top of that, you randomly and very commonly get platinum discounts on the account from 20% up to 75% on platinum. So I highly doublt it's even close to the same thing. Also Also, Formae are EXTREMELY easy to farm...although you do need 24 hours to craft one...and you can only make one at a time :x
BUT many times you can buy fully crafted formae from event vendors for event points.
I mean to be fair it's a pretty simple argument you go and you buy a level one weapon from the guy in town with no modifiers. You look in the shop and you purchase the bundles that comes with purple modifiers, you purchase the little duhiki that allows you to equip more modifications and you compare. Because sure the gap closes as you both max out and beat the game. But if at level 1 they do 3x the damage you can assume they have 3x the advantage. Now sure later on in the game after your maxed it's only gonna be maybe 24% more damage output or survivability but that means a 4 man group of these guys would be equivalent to a 5 man group when it comes to bossing. They could still be out played but if they had the same skill level as the other player they would still have a 24% advantage if they used the same class and guns. 24% just being a random number maybe it's closer to 16% maybe it's more like 30%. I know right off the bat 10 points on my character is equivalent to doubling my hp, 10 more doubles my Def, 10 more is my shield and as a guy who plays like it's cod thats 90% of my build atm lol
Yeeaaaahh, I think I’ll just stay in Warframe I can’t do this again 😅
In WF you have a chance to get these daily by doing a three mission sortie, the rewards have different drop chances but these are actually far better IMO
Afterwards you just build it with regular materials you barely ever have to actually grind for
Forma is specific to relics but is the most common drop from any relic it is on
TFD requires u grind 4 rare resources for each, one is on a maximum of 3% drop chance, another is specific to vaults
Vaults are next to impossible without enzo meaning you need to clear the game and farm a full decendant before you can grind one
Vaults require breaker codes (or whatever the name) to open, u use them regardless of if you fail
U are not guaranteed anything but keiper in these vaults, the code breaker is a random drop with no specific place to be farmed, meaning there is no way to speed up how fast you build these, just pray for good luck
Same sistem, far diferent levels of grind, thus far different levels of tolerance for its monetisation
knew this was gonna happen when i first learned who made the game lol. Notorious for it. Same, not sinking my time into this 100% Gonna have some fun with it for a while then bounce.
I just hope they become more generous as time goes. Like warframe. Each event they basically "handout" the most needed items and materials needed for upgrades. They even give them out via twitch drops.
I agree with you cross as some one that plays both Warframe and Destiny things need to be leveled out for materials thats the only reason why there is no competitive warframe pve because most weapons, resources, or Gear you can straight up buy. That isn't bad either Warframe caters to this game style to keep their community as chill as possible the down side of that is nothing ever catches your eye for long not much makes you want to grind for it. If this game wants to pop out it needs to sit down and really consider where the vision of the game will go. Nobody wants this game to disappear into the background. I hope they actually listen to constructive criticism and not give into the quickest cash project.
i feel like watching this after playing Destiny feels like I'm watching a game that was made for xbox back in 2004
Two things.
1- I agree. There's something very fishy with the way they've implemented this mechanics, and Nexon doesn't have the best reputation, so it's way too early to put any money in the game.
2- you get everything you need to clear the entire game solo (except obviously for those bosses which you don't get the option to).
It's too early to tell what the game will be like in a couple of years, or even if it'll make it past this year. It'll all depend on whether devs listens to their community or not, and so far they have, so fingers crossed everything will be way better in the future, and the grind will become a million times more reasonable, like in Warframe.