BOAT SAFE LITHIUM?//Changing The Boat Battery Game-Episode 122
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- Опубликовано: 8 апр 2023
- We have some exciting news to share with you guys this week! Come along with us to the Miami Boat Show and get the inside scoop on some cool new technology.
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Recently we were looking at a power bank for work from a well known solar energy company. Our research showed the product was going to outperform similar units, however it did not have the proper certifications and the purchase was a no go. Certification is slow and expensive and many companies just won't bother.
Yup, LOTS of batteries showing up but few of them have certifications which is a big problem if one burns down your home and your insurance investigates. Seems the same issue occurs with boats!
Isn't the Dragonfly intelligence the same thing that EVTV and Victron Connect already do? What am I missing here?
Kind of….. Tesla however will not be compliant with ABYC due to the fact that it is not a new consumer available product with installation instructions
I like how security chased off that large woman in yellow/black who got in Ty’s shot.
Hey Battleborn, welcome to 2017!!! Lots of RUclipsers tear apart batteries like your "new" one that cost around 1/3 what yours do.
Franklin Rand Where is all the info you are talking about?
Watch some teardown videos by will prowse or lithium solar.
@@michaelcanto6175 Will Prowse might be a good channel to start with. Battleborn is overpriced and definitely nothing special to be so much more.
I'm shocked!
Hope that is the end of the commercial!
Wow ! This is a totally 💯 Cool Factor!
Ok... connecting it to Victron makes it better.
OMG Ty this is fantastic! Thank you so much!
I'm glad you like it
Great show as always. I've been designing and installing Victron systems for 28 Yrs and for the past 12 Yrs I've been utilising Freedom Won LiPo4 batteries. Victron works very well with FW. Full monitoring, from 5Kw 48VDc up to 1Mw. Check them out. Cheers.
I do not agree with him saying a bms can not keep a 48v battery balanced. I have JK-BMS x4 they have 2 amp active balancer built in. It does a good job way better than the others. It takes voltage form 1 cell and gives to another. I can add another 5 amp active balancer to each bank if I wanted but do not see the need.
I will have to watch this 3 times to understand it😉
You don't need a whole other 12V system for the marine electronics, you just need step-down DC-DC "buck" converters, and if you have one for each device or each area where you need devices, you can use light-gauge 48V wiring for the long runs because you aren't converting to 12V too early.
48 to 12 converters are traditionally very inefficient. Most available converters at that voltage unfortunately peak out at 87%. That is a big loss. However, we have something coming so stay tuned.
@@SailingDauntless long runs of cable for 12V are also inefficient, surprisingly so. You have to go nuts on heavy gauge to compensate, and all that copper comes with significant costs. You’ll get 12% loss on a 12g wire at 4A over only 20’.
I first encountered DragonFly / BattleBorn at SPI in LasVehas in 2017 and at that time they were an obvious marketplace leader, these new advances shown today take them to a new level both in the marine but also the other industry applications such as residential battery back up and Recreational RV, thanks again for the heads up on this battery industry leader.
You should look at SW batteries. You can get them in the voltage you want and multiple voltage per battery. Like 48 volt with 12 volt out as well. If it ever needs fluid top up which is very rare you can use ocean water. Also no fire risk and huge temp range use
Lekker man lekker 🇿🇦
I'm curious to see if battleborn is going to jump on the Sodium-Ion tech.soon
Bad experience with Dragonfly/Battleborn. Bought 6 x 100ah batteries from them 4 years ago for my boat. I'm a full-time cruiser and have them hooked up to victron mppt solar controllers, set up as per Battleborn website. After 4 years and max 1500 cycles 1 x Batt won't hold charge, 5 x batts only able to hold 40% capacity. The 10 year Warranty only covers the one that isn't holding any charge, the other 5 Battleborn says quote "are working OK just with reduced capacity because they haven't been charged correctly". I'm still unsure what this means, other than that Warranty does not cover this. Also, the warranty requires me to pay for shipping for the one they say they will take a look at. I'm currently in Guatemala, so I'm not paying that shipment. So I paid the top dollar for these $1000 a piece as I thought they were the best company, turns out not so good. My advice after 4 years of experience is to go with cheaper Lifepo4 that are about a third the price of Battleborn because they'll probably last just the same. I'm really disappointed with Battleborn.
I use LiFePO4 batteries in high capacity battery arrays at work. We have three suppliers We are currently purchasing from, Baytle Born, Ampertime (think that's correct spelling) and another company, green top/black body but I can't remember their name. Ampertime has the best reliability for us so far, Battle Born is the worst, 6x the failures as Ampertime. In every case BB has warranties the bad battery but still quality is questionable IMO right now.
@gregstevens527 that's a lot of failures from batteries that are still one of the most expensive on the market.
Our data is based on more than a 1,000 batteries. Relative rate of all is still REALLY low, but BB's is hovering just over 1% right now. Way too high IMO.
Daaaaaaaaaang that was a long drive!!
Hi,Love this episode ❤
I was just wondering why,don’t they have a fender permanent on the back of yachts . And if it goes down they have a quick replacement that clicks in.🦋🐬🐬⛵️
Good question!
does the bms turn off all charging devices when they detect a fault to prevent power still being put into the battery
The BMS turns off the batteries so in turn the devices will not see a battery to charge
The Flex is interesting functionality for sure. Being able to reconfigure 48/24/12V without rewiring, is great forward-thinking and very interesting "future tech" - even though it's not so often that batteries go out of charge balance? Why do I think that an online standby charger exists to solve an imbalance problem - in real-time - as it happens - already?
I'm always mindful of the fact that with 2 server-rack batteries, you get the same as 8 Battleborn batteries. Battleborn's footprint is very large; one server-rack EG4 (12, 24,or 48V) has the same capacity as that massive Wing box.
The form-factor is a problem with Battleborn - and its solution(s) are multiples more-expensive than competitors in some cases too. Perhaps Battleborn could explain the diff?
They, like many companies are using the drop in replacement size form factor to make installation easier when changing out from traditional lead. Agreed, there are other chemistries that are more energy dense and lighter per kWh but the industry has settled on LifePo4 and that is driving installation practices and what insurance companies are starting to require. More energy dense systems are out there but if you can’t get the boat insured then it really doesn’t make a difference. This looks to be the future in the marine world and they are leading the charge on compliance. As far as cost, yes there are cheaper options but none with the level of support, proven reliability and a solid US based supply chain IMO.
@@SailingDauntless hmmm - not to sound dismissive of an important sponsor, but am recalling the EQ4 and lookalike batteries are also LifePo4. Battleborn's approach has merits I don't doubt, but footprint ain't one of them. If you want ease of lifting, build a battery out of individual cells and optimize footprint to your exact boat's compartment size (Minecraft style).
Having building block style batteries would be convenient. I think for scalability they stick to the common sizes.
Loved this epi. lots of very interesting info as electrifying is the future for small/med yachts
Glad you enjoyed it!
Here's the problem with their 48v/12v design. All BMS's balance the individual 3.2 volt cells via a "balance lead", not the aggregate 12 or 48v battery. Please let me know if I got it wrong.
They essentially top balance all the cells individually and if there is are stray battery/cells that stray out of balance from the rest they use a 12v parallel configuration to top end balance with a full charge.
Saying a battery is safer because you are able to communicate with it, is like saying a smart phone will make you smarter. Sends me a message in the very rare instance I'm having issues with an individual battery while underway. About as useful as getting a message from some hot chick in Bulgaria that finds old bald guys attractive.
Lithium iron phosphate batteries are safe. You switch to them because they have a longer life cycle than standard lithium-ion. They are also more stable at higher temperatures, which makes them more forgiving if if your system screws up. They can handle extended storage periods with minimum voltage loss. Cold weather hinders their recharging?... Fixed!
Benjamin Franklin came up with the term "battery' after he linked several moonshine glass jars together and formed a capacitor. Few decades later (forgot who) saw frog’s legs twitching when dissecting a frog with brass and iron instruments. I'm no where near happy with todays batteries, but allot happier than with the batteries 20 years ago.
People need to earn their living that is comprehensible but why not tell us it is a sponsor stuff
All sponsored videos are listed as such. It’s a requirement with the FCC and the law.
Displayed as Sponsored Video for me
Hello cả nhà
Excellent Geek meet!!! Epic news for the best battery systems that will be the game changer for the entire industry!!!
Lots of great information. Is it Spring yet?
Too expensive and too heavy.. much better options like Dakota.
Dakota and BB weight the same per Ah. LifePO4 cells all have equal weight/energy density per unit of storage
Oups the tesla battery are going to garbage?
Tesla doesn’t sell directly to public and no end user support if implementation on a yacht has issues- this makes it hard to recommend to the average boater - this is my take from watching the channel, not that I know anything about electrical anything(s) 😉
No, they are still great batteries but will not be used on this project. Until now, NO battery could meet any ABYC standards. This tech will soon be a requirement demanded by insurance companies if you want to insure your boat with lithium. Unfortunately, the tesla modules will never be able to meet those standards as it is not an end user product and cannot meet the ABYC recommendations.
@@SailingDauntless Tesla are the have the best performance cell! But not the good chemistry for a diy project for a boat!
Mastervolt is certified for Volvo Ocean race and it speaks for itself :) i use it, i love it. 28 kg Li-ion can give 500A, new team has to prove they are reliable batteries and 1 y later u may come up with update. Mastervolt is alternative to Victron, just better quality with higher level of inner components, much better built :)
This praised hybrid solution is half ass and does real solve the problems to keep batteries well monitored and maintained. They should invest to develop a modular and simple but functional active balancing (with proper monitoring). The tech exists. The software exists. You run it from an arduino with open source SW... just unify an eco system that is safe and simple enough for the boat world. Dauntless is a beacon when it comes to superior self made solutions... this is not it