If you want a good example from 100T of someone who took advantage of their opportunity look at JHB. Guy starts as an intern and ends up as a fan favorite with his own series on the main channel. I bet any of the guys from the mob could've talked to him and got some genuinely good ideas for content that didn't cost $2,500.
To add to this, JHB was the mob's editor to begin with and initially wasn't signed with 100T, they then brought him on as the editor for the mob and grinded from that moment, well before he was brought on even.
I think the saddest part of this entire story is how they were given a once-in-a-lifetime shot and it seems that they're not grateful for it. $50k/year is the average salary in the US. Getting paid a salary + having access to the connections that 100T has is more than most will ever dream of getting. Even though this story ended up blowing up, probably for the wrong reasons, it gives me hope. If I keep grinding, someone will give me a shot one day.
The amount of stories how streamers take the most shittiest situations to be in LA. TRY, TRY to be close to the offline streamers . dude 2020 everybody and your granda was playing Warzone, streamers would play nonstop warzone. if only they could leech with CouRAGE, Valkrae, Nadeshot. But nah this kids expect Nadeshot would call them to play with them . They take everything as granded. Even the videos the did. they did it with the 100thieves filming crew. How hard it is to making a simple reel video to put on the chanel? play a game with the group record and upload?
I mean they had a good salary. They also had to move to be close to the 100thieves compound and pay la rent. 50k/year average in the us maybe but in la it’s 66k/year. Still a lot but again LA rent, young people getting thrown supposedly a „bag of money“ and then just do something? Idk I don’t think 100thieves did anything maliciously wrong but lets not shit on these kids for having literally no real experience in content creation and then failing without any real guidance.
@@lenoio512 Agree with you here. 100T gave a group of kids a great opportunity to make something for themselves. Unfortunately, they didn't yet have the maturity to make good on it. Hopefully Froste learns from this and is able to change his habits to become successful in something else. Right now he just seems bitter. He's blaming Nadeshot because he knows, deep down, that he screwed up and blew this chance.
it also important to realize the salary they got paid was never meant to be their main income. it was more like a stipend that was supposed to add to the money they made off streaming and content. but since some of them rarely streamed, that stipend became their main income. The only time i ever saw frosty while he was on 100T was when 100T posted their own content with him in it
@@haz7461 Risking being pedantic to your joking comment, but there's no theft involved here. It's not against the law to be unproductive. They just didn't live up to expectations so , 100T didn't renew their deal after year 2. If they thought the 85% was unfair, they should've not signed an extension under the same structure. It's also a bad look for 100T to operate under the 85% regardless of what revenue they are trying to recuperate from the Mob, but 100T seemed to be providing most of the value in those deals with their film crews, equipment, editors, brand recognition, and everything else their company provides.
@@iammars142 I see2 sorry I actually just randomly copy paste comments from twitter..didnt fully understand the situation yet but great explanation from your part
Exactly what I've been thinking. Too many people are skirting this fact. If I had that as a stipend and was able ot funnel that into my side hustle (streaming and uploading clips to YT) then it would be plenty. It's a matter of drive that's all.
I'm 100% with Nadeshot on this one. Even with Classify who they're like "he did the work"...he did the minimum amount of work necessary. They were handed a golden platter for creators and squandered it. They should have been reaching out to other 100 Thieves creators and collaborating like crazy. They should have taken a 2-3 bedroom house, bunked 2 to a room, and set up streams in every other room; that "we need our own rooms because we're adults" is just entitlement. Clearly they've never seen a barracks; real adults have no problem with bunking if that's what it takes. And 20 hours of streams per week is perfectly acceptable, but only IF you're also making RUclips content and editing and setting up future content at the same time. Anything less than 40 hours of work per week is them not being hungry enough. Most creators put in more like 60 hours per week. Content Creation is a job with an insanely high supply of people who want to do it; only the most talented AND dedicated will actually succeed...there are too many other people fighting for that spot for it to end up any other way.
me too shit even with the deals, they were pulling hundreds of views gaining all the perks but they put the foot out of the gás pedal they did. U compare The Mob with The Nuke from Faze u see how much content the members of The Nuke put how much streaming time and content on both plantaforms.
If I am remembering correctly the original OpTic house had just about everyone streaming in the same room and no one had anything nice as far as setups go. They were all in the background of each others streams and Nade and Scump were uploading to RUclips every single day
Froste essentially wanted everyone to approach him and bring in money as he sat on his ass. Even now he just recently streamed, it was the first time in 3 months!
@@JC-bs5pd which is why he should have been super thankful for the opportunity and grinded his ass off .. it’s streamers and content creators that get 500-1000 average viewers that didn’t get the chance to be with 100 thieves .. I would be editing my own footage and everything .. they weren’t hungry enough and suffered from the “Already made it” syndrome that I see a lot .. even in the music industry this happens .. One song blow up , the artist gets signed and stops grinding !! Boom ! One hit wonder
They were given all they needed to succeed. 1# Paid enough salary to live in LA, the entertainment capital of the world. 2# Attached their group to the 100 Thieves brand, which would bring ANYONE a massive advantage on discoverability and a great chance to blow-up 3# They were included in a lot of the 100T videos on the main channel. 4# Were given the chance to collab with the TOP of the streaming world. (Valkyrae, Courage, Nadeshot, BrookeAB) a small streamer would DO ANYTHING for a chance to play with these people, every single people that collabs with them gets an instant fanbase. They were struggling because they did not do the work. 100T gave them everything anyone could need. The contract was not predatory even at 85%. These people had no fanbase, no one was watching them before 100t signed them. People with nothing to give can't expect a multimillion contract. It is not the same as with Tfue as froste says for a simple reason: Tfue was fine with his contract until he blew up, then he could have renegotionated his contract, as 100t would have negotiated if the mob had blown up. which they didn't because they did not do the work.
The crazy thing is.. They did renegotiate and give them more money even though they were doing nothing… They really wasted such a big opportunity away.
Bro wtf is this lmao 💀 Why would any of the large creators be willing to collaborate with someone that nobody knows? Even if they’re in the same org, collabing with the mob won’t give them any views as noone knows who they are. Any how is 85% not predatory at all? Shouldn’t it be the opposite? Because they’re not popular they should need more money from sponsors to make a profit. If they’re already not making money from views and subs alone, it’s even worse if you take so much sponsor money away from them. Brian dead supporters
One thing I found funny was how if their internet truly wasn't able to hold more than one or two streamers at a time for four months, by January 2020 (at the very latest as that is when the "tour" video was released) the 100T compound had four streaming pods that they could have used. So IMO the internet not working for four months excuse is invalid because less than two months into their contract they could have streamed from the compound, at this point its all excuses to not put in the work. And if scheduling the pods is a big difficulty, then schedule as much as possible and be at the compound every day anyway getting help and elevating themselves.
exactly and they are 15 mins away from the house and its not like those streaming booths are used all the time i imaginr there is some kind of schedule on who can use or reserved it at a specific time
it depends when covid hit nadeshot said they had to close the compound to people just going in and out so if its around covid they couldnt use the pods
@@lmco5690 they were there for 2 years..... covid lock down didnt last 2 years. The dude streamed 40 hours average a month (and it's his hardworking month, he went 4-6 hours on some).. People put more hours than that in 1 week on normal jobs
34 minute secret shoutout!! Great work on getting this out so quickly, and amazing job with compiling the important parts of both streams so we don't have to look through 5+ hours of vods.
34 minute secret shoutout! I've watched every single one of your videos for years. These guys just didn't have the work ethic required but also they probably needed a lot more coaching than they were getting. To REALLY boost unexperienced creators like this, I feel like they'd need to be treated like actors and get an experienced content team. I can't really grasp how Nadeshot spent 250K on these 4 & not even assign a clips/repurpose person to them. You could also argue that if they'd need that much hand holding, they weren't made for the job, but if I'd be in Nadeshot's shoes I would've made sure the house was 5K instead of 10K and spent the 5K on production. The $2500 content budget would've been better spent on guidance. Not saying this is Nadeshot's fault, it's kinda on the guys. Just talking about what I feel could've been done better to secure a return on his investment. Absolutely love these conversations and videos Devin!
A great example of someone that put in the work is JHB. He improved so much. Dude may look timid on screen, but I think he got some bite in him. This reminds me of quote: 'you'll not outwork me.'
Love this convo. Can’t wait to hear what you have to say on this! I think it’s so important for people to look at this from both perspectives. But for me at the end of the day Froste is over reacting. He made great money as a “small creator” and didn’t capitalize on what was given. Of course the 85% was aggressive but they were also on payroll which changes things for me. Because they weren’t paid what they were worth. They should’ve been paid less. -34 mins secret shout :)
Yeah I agree with you. The other thing for me is it’s 85 percent of deals BROUGHT TO THEM. Froste even said on his response stream that for the fireball deal which they got themselves 100T didn’t take anything and they each got 30k for it. Like sure 85 percent sounds like a lot but if you’re a 100viewer nobody getting brought free deals from a tier 1 org, that’s 15 more percent than you would have gotten on your own. They literally get to keep everything they earn on their own plus get paid from the org plus get brought free sponsor deals.
@@Glazierstar I’m pretty sure that Fireball deal came to them, so Fireball could get their foot in the door with 100T as well… Not so much because of the MOB.. Fireball wanted to create a partnership through them.
@@Glazierstar I think Devin refuted this Fireball to a degree. Froste said that he needed 100T to do the Fireball deal because he didn't have the stats/data that Fireball needed to commit. So he took the deal to 100T so that they could close for him. Devin goes on to say that each Mob member made 30k from this deal and that 100T got 80k. So of the 200k total value of the deal, Mob got 120k (60%) and 100T got 80k (40%). To me, this seems more than fair. Froste originated the deal but couldn't have closed without the resources of 100T. Agree with everything regarding the 85% and general sponsor talk.
Definitely still here! This channel is better for information on this world than anything out there, primarily because your multiple POVs makes this as objective as possible.
Forget "they need to work 80 hours a week", maybe they should have just worked 40 hours a week. Working 20 hours a week @ 65k is effectively getting paid 130K. I do think that 100T could have structured the sponsorship revenue share better at 85% of the first 300k/year, dropping to 35% after, which would have given The Mob incentive to get above the 300k line every year.
The mob had opportunity that MOST creators don't. At the end of the day it comes down to work ethic. The ability to create multiple streams of revenue were more than abundant in their position. Its almost like Sports, if you don't produce, you get cut. same situation. The amount of people in ORGs that still don't post on RUclips and only stick to their one niche always blows my mind. 100T gave them a chance to prove themselves and they assumed it would just happen. Content Creating is arguably one of the most competitive fields, gotta put in the work. Hard to expect Nadeshot to groom you personally when he's managing so much, its just unrealistic expectations on their part. secret time gang
I would like to see the stats comparing the mob's stream hours pre 100T compared to after they got signed. I feel like there's this line of thinking along the lines of "we made it" that makes them feel like it's time to relax and stop putting in the work. Content creators, except for a handful, aren't at the celebrity status that I think a lot of people on the outside view them at. It's still a job before anything. I'd love to see a video going in depth on how orgs recruit creators. Also...9 stream hours per week average over 2 years? must be nice 😴
Nadeshot touched on it in his stream. Matt pulled up the numbers and Froste who did the least amount of work averaged only 40 hours a month making content.
For the modern twitch , 10/9 hours a week or 1.43 hours average daily streamtime is pretty low . I mean atleast 4/5 hour daily streamtime should be there to get a chance to grow on twitch ( personal opinion) .
Been learning from you for so long now. Signing up for the Patreon has been one of the best decisions I've made to learn and grow as a creator. Thank you for all you do! #34minute squad!
Amazing video! I totally agree with Nadeshot and 100T's perspective on this matter. The ROI in a deal like this is very sharky but you are signing people with ~100 viewers on stream. If they got big enough and stream revenue was significant, they could have renegotiated after their success, but because they did not reach that point, they were stuck with "unfair" terms. If they put in the work they could have made it and established themselves.
34-minute secret shoutout - Yesterday while listening to both sides, I was looking forward to hearing someone from your POV. Someone who has been around and would know the inner workings. I didn’t consider your ROI point through while listening to both sides yesterday and glad you explained it. I thought the 85% was a bit heavy handed but if you signed that contract nothing to complain about (that’s business). Maybe a bit scummy on 100t side but again, you signed the contract. I never considered the fact they would make a move like that just to try to break even on “The Mob investment” Nadeshot had envisioned. The salary, 100t resource allocation, time producing, editing, and even having a content budget. One aspect you didn’t cover because you didn’t know them was regarding gambling. Now, I’ll stick to Froste as he is the one that hit the beehive. Now one of the reasons the “we were broke” portion rubbed me the wrong way was because Froste gambled. In fact, from what I saw, his gambling streams were some of, if not, his highest viewed content. On more than one occasion, I watched him gamble with big name creators NoahJ, Couragejd, Jericho, Wildcat, BasicallyIdowork, etc. Substantial buy ins might I add. Clip - uploaded April 2021 while under 100t contract: ruclips.net/video/mWNhBj88PQg/видео.html Finally that pic of his bedroom with food delivery bags everywhere… like c'mon. If you’re broke you are not ordering food delivery 3 times a day and gambling with some of the most wealthy content creators. I have no issues with Froste, I was sad and disappointed when The Mob split ways with 100T. I was of the same mindset as Nadeshot, I could see them blowing up. They did have the personality and potential. Nade took a gamble on them and it backfired. Seems like Froste just has a ton of regrets and is lashing out. Feel bad the other members got dragged into Froste's drunk tweeting drama he started. “trust me bro” doesn’t work in the corporate world btw. CYA is commonly said for a reason, you have to have receipts or you look like a joke.
Im still here. Why would I like these long videos you asked Devin? Glad you asked. I have not watched a few videos from this channel in a while because I'm on and off from the internet "drama"/big issues/etc. However when I saw that you had a video on this, i forgo the other channels because I know you'll gather all the information and give a comprehensive explanation of the situation. Letting us process the information with out trying to sway our opinion.
Devin, just found your channel. In the Esports space I'd probably be considered pediatric being 28 (29 on Friday!), but I find it really hard to find folks who have mature and experienced stances on subjects like this. I know the business as a whole is still relatively in it's infancy stage, but I really appreciate your capacity to give both sides the BOD when going over the facts. These things are rarely black and white, but I do think pointing out how and why the businesses are set up the way they are, and how difficult it is to make it in Esports/content creation removes a lot of the bias that folks might have when clicking on your videos. Definitely will be watching more in the future :)
Can watch these all day. I'm far removed from where these opportunities come up but ANYONE who wants to succeed would kill for this opportunity. Wild that it spiraled out of control like this.
What I hate to most about all the responses on twitter is how people refuse to understand that Esports is still a business. Of course the org will try to make money, people that work in the background also need to be paid, it would be a horrible business model to lose more money on them than what they brought back. that's
34. I like listening to this stuff like a podcast in the background. I almost never have any info / need this info in any way, but its very nice to listen to you talk about things.
ayeee 34 min shout out! I've missed a few videos here, but I'll be sure to catch up on it! Love the content man, I don't see why they need so much money for content, when content is just an idea. Just use that idea and make it work, many people such as you Devin just sit and talk, I don't see an issue with that type of content as I enjoy that stuff. I think both sides are wrong in different areas but I still think that 85% is just nuts. Moistcrit made a video about this also and that is the glaring red flag for sure.
34 min secret shoutout! I'm new here and really liking how you've added your esports insight into the matter. I find it much easier to watch your breakdown instead of going through multiple hours of clips and vods
Hi Devin. tl;dr thanks for the kick in the pants - I have seen you around via other people but this is the first of your videos I have watched, just from my home screen. Hearing you point out their ages and "still having plenty of time" and the way you laid everything out really landed with me. I dropped out of a full ride to college while working part time in sales for an international multi-billion dollar company to try and punch my ticket. Within five years I had received multiple promotions, purchased my first house, gotten married, moved across the states and purchased my second house, and had bigger plans and was still headed up before the 'corporate world' eventually rescinded that ticket, firing me in a downsize. After eating through savings, retirement accounts, and starting to rack up debts we moved back home and in with the parents temporarily. I'm 28 now, four years later, and since then I've grinded my way with a desk job back to almost the income I was making and at home have a nice PC and a whole room set up for content creation that I keep saying I will do but instead choose to just play games for leisure.. I prefer action to words, and of all places a RUclips comment section with an alt account I made up, but I'm gonna stop wasting time now. For what it's worth, thank you.
Incredible video, you've earned a new fan. Also, made it to 34 minutes. Also, @33:00 and @44:00. This is 100% how it works, you HAVE to produce, thats it, end of discussion. "No free lunch" means you HAVE to give something back for the resources used on you, even if thats breakeven.
Devin it's been super cool to see how your content has evolved over the years. I really appreciate your ability to stream of consciousness create legitimately useful content that is this long and structured. Your takes are very helpful as a content creator trying to navigate the landscape. #34minshout
One of the most valuable channels on YT, would love to hear you discuss ethics in esports and twitch with Richard Lewis or collaborate with other fringe twitch/YT people. We dont hear enough of this backroom discussion
still here...as someone who works in data/marketing analytics i love the content; its hard to find true analytical driven content for internet esports econ/culture/drama
So just for reference typical 40 hour a week full time work is over 2000 hours per year. I know a lot of streamers without deals who treat content creation like a full time job working for 30-50 hours a week, spending most of the time streaming but around 20-30% of that working on other content like vods, clips, etc. To me the math just doesn't add up in Froste's favor.
Devin, these videos captivate me. I’m not interested in the spot light through social media, but the business aspect behind the scenes and the nuance of the industry. Here’s my 34:00 minute shoutout. Ty for content
Really interesting point about the initiative required to make something of the opportunity. It draws parallels to college for me. I went to a really good, big school, but was ultimately too shy, awkward, unfocused and/or unmotivated to recognize and then execute on what I needed to do to make the most of the opportunity. I would look back at college and it was easy to listen to the people saying how useless it is now. How it's a waste of money. How the universities are predators. I would feel like I got ripped off. Like it didn't live up to my expectations. Now, 5 years later, I look back and regret my work ethic at the time. It would've been really nice if I had known the blueprint to be successful in school. Not just successful enough to get a diploma and get a good job (which I did), but the blueprint to build meaningful relationships and really squeeze every drop of opportunity from this school that tens of thousands of people dream of going to but can't get in. I think this is what 100T was to these kids, but they didn't recognize the opportunity that they had in front of them. They should've been in a 2BR apartment on a month to month lease while they got settled in LA. Then upgraded after they figured it out. They should've been banging down the door of the 100T Compound every single day to stream from their setups. Collaborate with the creative teams and other content creators. Build a network. It's easy to look back with hindsight that we have and say they should've been doing x, y, & z, but it's hard for kids to recognize this unless they are already extremely self driven/motivated.
I'm new to the social video world and your explanation and your experiences with orgs really helps explaining all of these drama. also here at 34 minutes . Thank You!
34 minute gang. First Devin Nash video I've seen, didn't even seem like close to an hour passed. Really enjoyed the mix of hot takes from experience as well as the statistics to back up the muddled points
Hey 34 mins here been a fan of base for a long time. Watching this whole situation really motivated me to work hard to find my own success. Last year I moved from SoCal to Dallas to pursue Valorant.
34min Secret shoutout! LETS GOOO!!! You asked why I might be interested in stuff like this or staying this long. My answer: You've proven to be very intelligent and knowledgeable about the topics you discuss and that commands a certain level of authority so when I listen to you, I know you're speaking facts and talking from a higher place. That is worth listening to. Also, I'm interested in the topic😂
i was still there. Love your insght in everything and just have the unique opportunity to get an inside perspective on things that "twitter" just imagines they understand
First time encountering your channel and honestly, the video was great. Had you not called out that 24 minutes had passed by, I would have never noticed!
great video! thorough and fair! It's clear nadeshot is in the right, they needed to be putting in 80-hour weeks and only did 10. Some people want it and others only want it handed to them. Those who get handouts then will still ask why others have more.
I made it to the 34 minute mark. I love the deep dives and analysis on esports and business. I just don't know how to get into it myself. Great content as always!
Not sure if you saw, but the person from the Company that did the sponsorship said that 100T did a ton of the work brokering the deal for the sponsorship and that 100T approached them with this (not Froste and them coming to 100T with it).
just by scrolling in twitter we can see why actually froste failing in 100T. the facts that he wanted to succeed without enough efforts says all. everyone with enough sense would literally summon demons just to get such opportunity, but he just wants to take it all easy and hope 100T brands to take him to top. not to mention he "reveal" all this drama in the year that 100T literally in the sky. we can clearly see he wanted some of the clout for himself. btw this is a really good video.
The 34 minute gang!! Thanks for always putting in the work to make these videos. Your channel is a CONSTANT resource for me and I'm always excited to see more content coming out.
![I.N "HALLUCINATION" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/n5B5q1Hwt_U/mqdefault.jpg)
If you want a good example from 100T of someone who took advantage of their opportunity look at JHB. Guy starts as an intern and ends up as a fan favorite with his own series on the main channel. I bet any of the guys from the mob could've talked to him and got some genuinely good ideas for content that didn't cost $2,500.
Facts
To add to this, JHB was the mob's editor to begin with and initially wasn't signed with 100T, they then brought him on as the editor for the mob and grinded from that moment, well before he was brought on even.
Yeah the clown who let's everybody walk all over him
I think the saddest part of this entire story is how they were given a once-in-a-lifetime shot and it seems that they're not grateful for it. $50k/year is the average salary in the US. Getting paid a salary + having access to the connections that 100T has is more than most will ever dream of getting. Even though this story ended up blowing up, probably for the wrong reasons, it gives me hope. If I keep grinding, someone will give me a shot one day.
The amount of stories how streamers take the most shittiest situations to be in LA. TRY, TRY to be close to the offline streamers . dude 2020 everybody and your granda was playing Warzone, streamers would play nonstop warzone. if only they could leech with CouRAGE, Valkrae, Nadeshot. But nah this kids expect Nadeshot would call them to play with them . They take everything as granded. Even the videos the did. they did it with the 100thieves filming crew. How hard it is to making a simple reel video to put on the chanel? play a game with the group record and upload?
I just subscribed, I expect big things
You gotta get those RUclips shorts going
I mean they had a good salary. They also had to move to be close to the 100thieves compound and pay la rent. 50k/year average in the us maybe but in la it’s 66k/year. Still a lot but again LA rent, young people getting thrown supposedly a „bag of money“ and then just do something?
Idk I don’t think 100thieves did anything maliciously wrong but lets not shit on these kids for having literally no real experience in content creation and then failing without any real guidance.
@@lenoio512 Agree with you here. 100T gave a group of kids a great opportunity to make something for themselves. Unfortunately, they didn't yet have the maturity to make good on it. Hopefully Froste learns from this and is able to change his habits to become successful in something else. Right now he just seems bitter. He's blaming Nadeshot because he knows, deep down, that he screwed up and blew this chance.
it also important to realize the salary they got paid was never meant to be their main income. it was more like a stipend that was supposed to add to the money they made off streaming and content. but since some of them rarely streamed, that stipend became their main income. The only time i ever saw frosty while he was on 100T was when 100T posted their own content with him in it
bro this. idk why no one brings this point up
@@haz7461 Risking being pedantic to your joking comment, but there's no theft involved here. It's not against the law to be unproductive. They just didn't live up to expectations so , 100T didn't renew their deal after year 2. If they thought the 85% was unfair, they should've not signed an extension under the same structure.
It's also a bad look for 100T to operate under the 85% regardless of what revenue they are trying to recuperate from the Mob, but 100T seemed to be providing most of the value in those deals with their film crews, equipment, editors, brand recognition, and everything else their company provides.
@@iammars142 I see2 sorry I actually just randomly copy paste comments from twitter..didnt fully understand the situation yet but great explanation from your part
Exactly what I've been thinking. Too many people are skirting this fact. If I had that as a stipend and was able ot funnel that into my side hustle (streaming and uploading clips to YT) then it would be plenty. It's a matter of drive that's all.
@\f_a/ correct
this has become one of my favorite channels on RUclips. Thank you for insane detail and research and keep it up !
Hello M'Lord
I'm 100% with Nadeshot on this one. Even with Classify who they're like "he did the work"...he did the minimum amount of work necessary. They were handed a golden platter for creators and squandered it. They should have been reaching out to other 100 Thieves creators and collaborating like crazy. They should have taken a 2-3 bedroom house, bunked 2 to a room, and set up streams in every other room; that "we need our own rooms because we're adults" is just entitlement. Clearly they've never seen a barracks; real adults have no problem with bunking if that's what it takes. And 20 hours of streams per week is perfectly acceptable, but only IF you're also making RUclips content and editing and setting up future content at the same time. Anything less than 40 hours of work per week is them not being hungry enough. Most creators put in more like 60 hours per week. Content Creation is a job with an insanely high supply of people who want to do it; only the most talented AND dedicated will actually succeed...there are too many other people fighting for that spot for it to end up any other way.
me too shit even with the deals, they were pulling hundreds of views gaining all the perks but they put the foot out of the gás pedal they did. U compare The Mob with The Nuke from Faze u see how much content the members of The Nuke put how much streaming time and content on both plantaforms.
If I am remembering correctly the original OpTic house had just about everyone streaming in the same room and no one had anything nice as far as setups go. They were all in the background of each others streams and Nade and Scump were uploading to RUclips every single day
Froste essentially wanted everyone to approach him and bring in money as he sat on his ass. Even now he just recently streamed, it was the first time in 3 months!
He had 100 viewer average 😂😂😂
@@JC-bs5pd which is why he should have been super thankful for the opportunity and grinded his ass off .. it’s streamers and content creators that get 500-1000 average viewers that didn’t get the chance to be with 100 thieves .. I would be editing my own footage and everything .. they weren’t hungry enough and suffered from the “Already made it” syndrome that I see a lot .. even in the music industry this happens .. One song blow up , the artist gets signed and stops grinding !! Boom ! One hit wonder
They were given all they needed to succeed.
1# Paid enough salary to live in LA, the entertainment capital of the world.
2# Attached their group to the 100 Thieves brand, which would bring ANYONE a massive advantage on discoverability and a great chance to blow-up
3# They were included in a lot of the 100T videos on the main channel.
4# Were given the chance to collab with the TOP of the streaming world. (Valkyrae, Courage, Nadeshot, BrookeAB) a small streamer would DO ANYTHING for a chance to play with these people, every single people that collabs with them gets an instant fanbase.
They were struggling because they did not do the work. 100T gave them everything anyone could need.
The contract was not predatory even at 85%. These people had no fanbase, no one was watching them before 100t signed them. People with nothing to give can't expect a multimillion contract.
It is not the same as with Tfue as froste says for a simple reason: Tfue was fine with his contract until he blew up, then he could have renegotionated his contract, as 100t would have negotiated if the mob had blown up. which they didn't because they did not do the work.
Bro Nade could take 100% and still not get their investment back.
I don't know how they could complain about that lol
who asked
Why so long
The crazy thing is.. They did renegotiate and give them more money even though they were doing nothing… They really wasted such a big opportunity away.
Bro wtf is this lmao 💀
Why would any of the large creators be willing to collaborate with someone that nobody knows? Even if they’re in the same org, collabing with the mob won’t give them any views as noone knows who they are.
Any how is 85% not predatory at all? Shouldn’t it be the opposite? Because they’re not popular they should need more money from sponsors to make a profit. If they’re already not making money from views and subs alone, it’s even worse if you take so much sponsor money away from them.
Brian dead supporters
One thing I found funny was how if their internet truly wasn't able to hold more than one or two streamers at a time for four months, by January 2020 (at the very latest as that is when the "tour" video was released) the 100T compound had four streaming pods that they could have used.
So IMO the internet not working for four months excuse is invalid because less than two months into their contract they could have streamed from the compound, at this point its all excuses to not put in the work. And if scheduling the pods is a big difficulty, then schedule as much as possible and be at the compound every day anyway getting help and elevating themselves.
exactly and they are 15 mins away from the house and its not like those streaming booths are used all the time i imaginr there is some kind of schedule on who can use or reserved it at a specific time
it depends when covid hit nadeshot said they had to close the compound to people just going in and out so if its around covid they couldnt use the pods
@@lmco5690 they were there for 2 years..... covid lock down didnt last 2 years. The dude streamed 40 hours average a month (and it's his hardworking month, he went 4-6 hours on some).. People put more hours than that in 1 week on normal jobs
Soon as frostee got dropped from 100t he went from 40hours a month to 300+ hours LOL dude is a rat straight up
@@lmco5690 the end of that 4 months was jan 2020 and covid wasn't rampant at that time
34 minute secret shoutout!! Great work on getting this out so quickly, and amazing job with compiling the important parts of both streams so we don't have to look through 5+ hours of vods.
Still Here LOVE THIS! To have been givin this opportunity and to have thrown it away… I can’t even imagine.
34 minute secret shoutout!
I've watched every single one of your videos for years.
These guys just didn't have the work ethic required but also they probably needed a lot more coaching than they were getting.
To REALLY boost unexperienced creators like this, I feel like they'd need to be treated like actors and get an experienced content team.
I can't really grasp how Nadeshot spent 250K on these 4 & not even assign a clips/repurpose person to them.
You could also argue that if they'd need that much hand holding, they weren't made for the job, but if I'd be in Nadeshot's shoes I would've made sure the house was 5K instead of 10K and spent the 5K on production.
The $2500 content budget would've been better spent on guidance.
Not saying this is Nadeshot's fault, it's kinda on the guys. Just talking about what I feel could've been done better to secure a return on his investment.
Absolutely love these conversations and videos Devin!
Still here! Thanks for breaking it down, very informative.
A great example of someone that put in the work is JHB. He improved so much. Dude may look timid on screen, but I think he got some bite in him.
This reminds me of quote: 'you'll not outwork me.'
Love this convo. Can’t wait to hear what you have to say on this! I think it’s so important for people to look at this from both perspectives. But for me at the end of the day Froste is over reacting. He made great money as a “small creator” and didn’t capitalize on what was given. Of course the 85% was aggressive but they were also on payroll which changes things for me. Because they weren’t paid what they were worth. They should’ve been paid less. -34 mins secret shout :)
Pretty spot on
Yeah I agree with you. The other thing for me is it’s 85 percent of deals BROUGHT TO THEM. Froste even said on his response stream that for the fireball deal which they got themselves 100T didn’t take anything and they each got 30k for it. Like sure 85 percent sounds like a lot but if you’re a 100viewer nobody getting brought free deals from a tier 1 org, that’s 15 more percent than you would have gotten on your own. They literally get to keep everything they earn on their own plus get paid from the org plus get brought free sponsor deals.
@@Glazierstar I’m pretty sure that Fireball deal came to them, so Fireball could get their foot in the door with 100T as well… Not so much because of the MOB.. Fireball wanted to create a partnership through them.
@@Glazierstar I think Devin refuted this Fireball to a degree. Froste said that he needed 100T to do the Fireball deal because he didn't have the stats/data that Fireball needed to commit. So he took the deal to 100T so that they could close for him. Devin goes on to say that each Mob member made 30k from this deal and that 100T got 80k. So of the 200k total value of the deal, Mob got 120k (60%) and 100T got 80k (40%). To me, this seems more than fair. Froste originated the deal but couldn't have closed without the resources of 100T.
Agree with everything regarding the 85% and general sponsor talk.
@@iammars142 How si this fair when other agencies / orgs charge a maximum of 20% per deal no matter the circumstances?
Definitely still here! This channel is better for information on this world than anything out there, primarily because your multiple POVs makes this as objective as possible.
Forget "they need to work 80 hours a week", maybe they should have just worked 40 hours a week. Working 20 hours a week @ 65k is effectively getting paid 130K. I do think that 100T could have structured the sponsorship revenue share better at 85% of the first 300k/year, dropping to 35% after, which would have given The Mob incentive to get above the 300k line every year.
The mob had opportunity that MOST creators don't. At the end of the day it comes down to work ethic. The ability to create multiple streams of revenue were more than abundant in their position. Its almost like Sports, if you don't produce, you get cut. same situation. The amount of people in ORGs that still don't post on RUclips and only stick to their one niche always blows my mind. 100T gave them a chance to prove themselves and they assumed it would just happen. Content Creating is arguably one of the most competitive fields, gotta put in the work. Hard to expect Nadeshot to groom you personally when he's managing so much, its just unrealistic expectations on their part. secret time gang
Now this is a quality video, thank you for taking the time to separate the clips and time stamps so the conversation flowed as easy as water
I never knew you were a part of OG Dig. That's hella cool to see that you are still around.
Froste fumbled the bag, pretty clear cut case 😮💨
Still here. Now subscribed! Love this!
100T had the info that fireball needed? Yes, that means they brokered the deal. Froste didn’t broker the deal. He relayed information. That’s it.
I would like to see the stats comparing the mob's stream hours pre 100T compared to after they got signed. I feel like there's this line of thinking along the lines of "we made it" that makes them feel like it's time to relax and stop putting in the work. Content creators, except for a handful, aren't at the celebrity status that I think a lot of people on the outside view them at. It's still a job before anything. I'd love to see a video going in depth on how orgs recruit creators. Also...9 stream hours per week average over 2 years? must be nice 😴
Nadeshot touched on it in his stream. Matt pulled up the numbers and Froste who did the least amount of work averaged only 40 hours a month making content.
For the modern twitch , 10/9 hours a week or 1.43 hours average daily streamtime is pretty low . I mean atleast 4/5 hour daily streamtime should be there to get a chance to grow on twitch ( personal opinion) .
The kid had like 150 viewers lol
@@roughdude2917 I completely agree especially if you just got hired by an org lol like what are you doing with the other 23 hours of your day??
@@AceBiggi3 and that was before he was hired? i wonder if that was always the average or if they all decided to slack off after joining 100T
Been learning from you for so long now. Signing up for the Patreon has been one of the best decisions I've made to learn and grow as a creator. Thank you for all you do! #34minute squad!
Signing in for the 34:00 gang. Great rundown, Devin!
Love being able to hear both sides of this to get more of the big picture.
Amazing video! I totally agree with Nadeshot and 100T's perspective on this matter. The ROI in a deal like this is very sharky but you are signing people with ~100 viewers on stream. If they got big enough and stream revenue was significant, they could have renegotiated after their success, but because they did not reach that point, they were stuck with "unfair" terms. If they put in the work they could have made it and established themselves.
34-minute secret shoutout - Yesterday while listening to both sides, I was looking forward to hearing someone from your POV. Someone who has been around and would know the inner workings. I didn’t consider your ROI point through while listening to both sides yesterday and glad you explained it. I thought the 85% was a bit heavy handed but if you signed that contract nothing to complain about (that’s business). Maybe a bit scummy on 100t side but again, you signed the contract. I never considered the fact they would make a move like that just to try to break even on “The Mob investment” Nadeshot had envisioned. The salary, 100t resource allocation, time producing, editing, and even having a content budget.
One aspect you didn’t cover because you didn’t know them was regarding gambling. Now, I’ll stick to Froste as he is the one that hit the beehive. Now one of the reasons the “we were broke” portion rubbed me the wrong way was because Froste gambled. In fact, from what I saw, his gambling streams were some of, if not, his highest viewed content. On more than one occasion, I watched him gamble with big name creators NoahJ, Couragejd, Jericho, Wildcat, BasicallyIdowork, etc. Substantial buy ins might I add.
Clip - uploaded April 2021 while under 100t contract: ruclips.net/video/mWNhBj88PQg/видео.html
Finally that pic of his bedroom with food delivery bags everywhere… like c'mon. If you’re broke you are not ordering food delivery 3 times a day and gambling with some of the most wealthy content creators.
I have no issues with Froste, I was sad and disappointed when The Mob split ways with 100T. I was of the same mindset as Nadeshot, I could see them blowing up. They did have the personality and potential. Nade took a gamble on them and it backfired. Seems like Froste just has a ton of regrets and is lashing out. Feel bad the other members got dragged into Froste's drunk tweeting drama he started.
“trust me bro” doesn’t work in the corporate world btw. CYA is commonly said for a reason, you have to have receipts or you look like a joke.
I love the Secret Shoutout you had in the middle of the video!!
Im still here. Why would I like these long videos you asked Devin? Glad you asked. I have not watched a few videos from this channel in a while because I'm on and off from the internet "drama"/big issues/etc. However when I saw that you had a video on this, i forgo the other channels because I know you'll gather all the information and give a comprehensive explanation of the situation. Letting us process the information with out trying to sway our opinion.
Devin, just found your channel. In the Esports space I'd probably be considered pediatric being 28 (29 on Friday!), but I find it really hard to find folks who have mature and experienced stances on subjects like this. I know the business as a whole is still relatively in it's infancy stage, but I really appreciate your capacity to give both sides the BOD when going over the facts. These things are rarely black and white, but I do think pointing out how and why the businesses are set up the way they are, and how difficult it is to make it in Esports/content creation removes a lot of the bias that folks might have when clicking on your videos. Definitely will be watching more in the future :)
As soon as Froste brought up contracts, I was like “can’t wait for the Devin Nash video”
I heard 95-85% split and thought the same thing lmfao
Can watch these all day. I'm far removed from where these opportunities come up but ANYONE who wants to succeed would kill for this opportunity. Wild that it spiraled out of control like this.
What I hate to most about all the responses on twitter is how people refuse to understand that Esports is still a business. Of course the org will try to make money, people that work in the background also need to be paid, it would be a horrible business model to lose more money on them than what they brought back.
that's
34. I like listening to this stuff like a podcast in the background. I almost never have any info / need this info in any way, but its very nice to listen to you talk about things.
I'm still here Devin thanks for the shoutout. I'm in your walls.
Was hoping someone like you would recap this and provide perspective. Thanks!
I'm still here! Loving the video
34 minutes in and I gotta say I love your in-depth breakdown of this. Thank you!
ayeee 34 min shout out! I've missed a few videos here, but I'll be sure to catch up on it! Love the content man, I don't see why they need so much money for content, when content is just an idea. Just use that idea and make it work, many people such as you Devin just sit and talk, I don't see an issue with that type of content as I enjoy that stuff. I think both sides are wrong in different areas but I still think that 85% is just nuts. Moistcrit made a video about this also and that is the glaring red flag for sure.
34 min secret shoutout! I'm new here and really liking how you've added your esports insight into the matter. I find it much easier to watch your breakdown instead of going through multiple hours of clips and vods
Good video! Enjoyed very much!
34 mins! I actually watch all of these videos beginning to end though - love learning about all this stuff!
Dude streamed 9 hours a week and says “I was putting in the work”. You’re trippin young man.
Great video made it all they way to the end!!! Love this a lot
Hi Devin. tl;dr thanks for the kick in the pants - I have seen you around via other people but this is the first of your videos I have watched, just from my home screen. Hearing you point out their ages and "still having plenty of time" and the way you laid everything out really landed with me. I dropped out of a full ride to college while working part time in sales for an international multi-billion dollar company to try and punch my ticket. Within five years I had received multiple promotions, purchased my first house, gotten married, moved across the states and purchased my second house, and had bigger plans and was still headed up before the 'corporate world' eventually rescinded that ticket, firing me in a downsize. After eating through savings, retirement accounts, and starting to rack up debts we moved back home and in with the parents temporarily. I'm 28 now, four years later, and since then I've grinded my way with a desk job back to almost the income I was making and at home have a nice PC and a whole room set up for content creation that I keep saying I will do but instead choose to just play games for leisure..
I prefer action to words, and of all places a RUclips comment section with an alt account I made up, but I'm gonna stop wasting time now. For what it's worth, thank you.
im still here devin been subsribed for a couple years :)
great deep dive and shout out :)
I'm just mad I had to search for this topic to realize you had a video. YT notifications are ass
Lol the 34 min SO caught me off guard and I really like videos that breakdown things that are hard to learn about. Thanks for the content
Still here great content. Love it.
34 min shoutout. I love to see all your takes on these topics
Incredible video, you've earned a new fan. Also, made it to 34 minutes.
Also, @33:00 and @44:00. This is 100% how it works, you HAVE to produce, thats it, end of discussion.
"No free lunch" means you HAVE to give something back for the resources used on you, even if thats breakeven.
Always great to see topic breakdowns on these cross my feed
Great breakdown and analysis. Still here!
Devin it's been super cool to see how your content has evolved over the years. I really appreciate your ability to stream of consciousness create legitimately useful content that is this long and structured. Your takes are very helpful as a content creator trying to navigate the landscape. #34minshout
Yoo Val Ascended is here! Love your content man.
Awesome content! Ty
One of the most valuable channels on YT, would love to hear you discuss ethics in esports and twitch with Richard Lewis or collaborate with other fringe twitch/YT people. We dont hear enough of this backroom discussion
Great video, enjoyed the anaylsis
Great semi deep dive. The unbiased overview will hopefully explain this for the "non-corp" people out there.
Lets goooo made it to the 34 min shoutout. Thanks for this awesome breakdown on the situation
35 mins deep and loving the deep dive! Keep it up man!
Froste missed out HUGE on not collabing with 100T creators more, biggest miss i've ever seen
34min gang, love the vid!
still here...as someone who works in data/marketing analytics i love the content; its hard to find true analytical driven content for internet esports econ/culture/drama
Was an interesting take / perspective, enjoyable to watch!
34 mins in - Esports is my favorite topic for Devin Nash vids. Really enjoyed this one, thank you!
I enjoyed watching a video of the perspective a former CEO of an Esports Org on this situation. Keep up the good work!
Still here, and subscribed. Can't beat a rational and considered perspective!
So just for reference typical 40 hour a week full time work is over 2000 hours per year. I know a lot of streamers without deals who treat content creation like a full time job working for 30-50 hours a week, spending most of the time streaming but around 20-30% of that working on other content like vods, clips, etc. To me the math just doesn't add up in Froste's favor.
Devin, these videos captivate me. I’m not interested in the spot light through social media, but the business aspect behind the scenes and the nuance of the industry. Here’s my 34:00 minute shoutout. Ty for content
Love the content, and how you present it. Always look out for your videos when topics like this are in the spotlight.
Keep the great content up 👍 once I move into my new pad. I'll grind 😤. Been grinding
Always thanks for the content! Great to watch while working.
34 minute secret shoutout! Keep up the good work!
Really interesting point about the initiative required to make something of the opportunity. It draws parallels to college for me. I went to a really good, big school, but was ultimately too shy, awkward, unfocused and/or unmotivated to recognize and then execute on what I needed to do to make the most of the opportunity. I would look back at college and it was easy to listen to the people saying how useless it is now. How it's a waste of money. How the universities are predators. I would feel like I got ripped off. Like it didn't live up to my expectations. Now, 5 years later, I look back and regret my work ethic at the time.
It would've been really nice if I had known the blueprint to be successful in school. Not just successful enough to get a diploma and get a good job (which I did), but the blueprint to build meaningful relationships and really squeeze every drop of opportunity from this school that tens of thousands of people dream of going to but can't get in.
I think this is what 100T was to these kids, but they didn't recognize the opportunity that they had in front of them. They should've been in a 2BR apartment on a month to month lease while they got settled in LA. Then upgraded after they figured it out. They should've been banging down the door of the 100T Compound every single day to stream from their setups. Collaborate with the creative teams and other content creators. Build a network. It's easy to look back with hindsight that we have and say they should've been doing x, y, & z, but it's hard for kids to recognize this unless they are already extremely self driven/motivated.
I'm new to the social video world and your explanation and your experiences with orgs really helps explaining all of these drama. also here at 34 minutes . Thank You!
great video, thoughtful input and reporting.
Secret club hype!
34 minute gang. First Devin Nash video I've seen, didn't even seem like close to an hour passed. Really enjoyed the mix of hot takes from experience as well as the statistics to back up the muddled points
Hey 34 mins here been a fan of base for a long time. Watching this whole situation really motivated me to work hard to find my own success. Last year I moved from SoCal to Dallas to pursue Valorant.
yo yo yo, chilling here still. I appreciate you!
Great takes as always been refreshing all day waiting on your video!
Secret shoutout. love the deep dives on these issues with the Livestreaming/Content Creation industry
34min Secret shoutout!
LETS GOOO!!!
You asked why I might be interested in stuff like this or staying this long.
My answer: You've proven to be very intelligent and knowledgeable about the topics you discuss and that commands a certain level of authority so when I listen to you, I know you're speaking facts and talking from a higher place. That is worth listening to.
Also, I'm interested in the topic😂
I legit googled you coz someone commented on a Harris heller video that he was becoming a Devin nash ahahaha and not im Subbed. Great insight!
i was still there. Love your insght in everything and just have the unique opportunity to get an inside perspective on things that "twitter" just imagines they understand
First time encountering your channel and honestly, the video was great. Had you not called out that 24 minutes had passed by, I would have never noticed!
Still here at 34 minutes! Love the info and the inspiration to start creating again.
On the topic of houses, I want to say I remember a video at the og OpTic house where they had 3 people in a room.
Devin I'm a big fan. where do you find editors for 50 a video? I edit my own stuff so im just curious how I could scale
This was a great my guy! Very informative and understandable.
great video! thorough and fair!
It's clear nadeshot is in the right, they needed to be putting in 80-hour weeks and only did 10.
Some people want it and others only want it handed to them. Those who get handouts then will still ask why others have more.
Secret shoutout crew! I Have signed up to Novo Nexus. Loved the video
I made it to the 34 minute mark. I love the deep dives and analysis on esports and business. I just don't know how to get into it myself. Great content as always!
wish I would get a chance like that.. would stream 50 + hours a week if needed
34 minute secret shoutout... I enjoy listening and learning from your videos..
Not sure if you saw, but the person from the Company that did the sponsorship said that 100T did a ton of the work brokering the deal for the sponsorship and that 100T approached them with this (not Froste and them coming to 100T with it).
just by scrolling in twitter we can see why actually froste failing in 100T.
the facts that he wanted to succeed without enough efforts says all.
everyone with enough sense would literally summon demons just to get such opportunity, but he just wants to take it all easy and hope 100T brands to take him to top.
not to mention he "reveal" all this drama in the year that 100T literally in the sky.
we can clearly see he wanted some of the clout for himself.
btw this is a really good video.
Love the video, especially this one regarding it stop that have transpired.
The 34 minute gang!! Thanks for always putting in the work to make these videos. Your channel is a CONSTANT resource for me and I'm always excited to see more content coming out.
Gotta watch every Devin video all the way through thanks for all the great content
34 minutes Shout out! Just watching you talking about anything Esports or media related is awesome! I just get to learn some many things from you.