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Classic Talents are not straight forward at all. Many of them are traps.

You don't learn abilities by slow leveling. You learn them wrong.

You can't use Pandaria Remix to judge LFG. That is not Retail. Remix is meant for veterans.

Addons are the best. The main reason I still play WoW and not other MMOs. I wouldn't mind if Blizz added some quality of life elements from Retail into Classic, though. Your suggestion is fine. Pandaria Remix is what happens when you fuse classic content with modern UI and it's amazing.

Like old KISS fans still wanting Ace back in the band after he's been gone over twenty years

this has to be a troll

one of those people you have to watch at 1.5 speed...

Asshat.. the retail talents were expanded because there was just 3 per row and since classic has 7-9 per row it was too simple. So more complexity, more dificulty, more better. That means learn to read.

You would get fucking destroyed under any amount of pressure because you ignore 90% of your abilities.

You not using your abilities =/= there being only 2 usable abilities dillhole...

Lets be honest, only people who dont play the game well think its just 4 buttons. Bitch you dont even use those 4 buttons well so who are you to say how the combat works... Oh and by the way ckassic has about 30 spells per class which is more than retail.

Yes slow leveling provides a healthy pace which allows for more enjoyment and a good pace to learn the game.

Faster leveling is fucking abhorrently garbage. You personal beliefs dont matter, you are a dunce so why would your oppinion matter? Leveling is the pacing of the adventure to make you experience a lot of the zones and content while giving you some leway to choose this or that zone to go to. Itvmakes sure you eat your stake and potatoes amd chew it well.its like a fork and a knife. Retail leveling is like eating your steak run quickly through garbage disposal mill with a buy boost to throw your dinner instantlt into garbage. So no, its not about consuming things as fast as possible. Its about enjoyment. Maybe if you stopoed and read about some orcs missing shipment you would enjoy the quest more because you wouldnt be just clicking on 10 brown squares but helping an orc get his missing shipment back to resupply an overseas military encampment deasoerately low on supplies. But you would have to be able to read nigga...

Dungeon finder should be removed from all mmorpgs

Retail is easier to get into, you have all the addons and simpleton accomodations. Your complaints proove classic enjoyers are right.

Yes they should not implement that because its classic. Everyone has to play the game the wat its meant to be played. You are not specuial and you deserve no special treatment.

So wow had 13 mill subs active in wotlk. And easily 30+mill played and enjoyed the game at some point in its history but questie was only downloaded one million times? I dont think it dies to your argument what you think it does...

If you dont care about wow, fantasy, you are a consoomer who doesnt even really understand the content hes consooming, fuck off to retail. Its literally the version for manchildren. You dont have to know what you are doing, or read. You can be drunk and high and with iq of a chimpanzee and just mash your face into the keyboard and you can play retail. Its a videogame equivalent of danglung keys in front of a baby so its get distracted by colorful fobs and the clinking of the shiny metal.

If you dont wanna read the quests the you are not gonna enjoy classic. Go play retail. Fuck off. Literally just fuck off and everything will be fine. We can have our motorcycles and you can ride your bicycle with side wheels while wearing a hat with a propeller on on retail.

They cant do that to classic because classic was made because they did that to retail. Why is this so hard for yoy to understand?

Right, they did that to retail which is why people demanded classoc, so its NOT like retail. Got it?

Yes, it is really that bad. Yes you are wrong. Yes you should stop complaining and learn to read.

Classic is supposed to BE CLASSIC. Got it?

Just stop your little complaints

Stop complaining.

Fuck what you consider quality of life. Its a videogame, its all about inconvenient problem solving for fun. You want to have convenience, order fast food and watch marvel slop while slowly fusing into the couch...

Listen, you want soy slop go play retail. The reason you wanted classic is all the things that you complain about that make it better than retail. You wanting something doesnt mean its gonna make the thing better. You want to add icecream to a steak and potatoes because you want icecream but you went to the bistro not the icecream stand because bistro smelled nicer. Then like a dunce you started complaining your steak diesnt have chocolate sprinkles on it. People correctly ratiod you into the soil and yet you have not learned. Whats the lesson? The people who refuse to change are right and you are wrong.

Did you not understand what "classic" meant? You are complaining that a museum doesnt want to vandalize its collectiion for you. How dare the custodians of the collection preserve and gatekeep me and my fanart of spyro fucking sonic out of the mona lisa bulletproof glass case?!?

You should gatekeep all hobbies.

Gatekeep always! Either you adapt to the game or fuck off. End of story.

This gotta be trolling.

Good, fuck your idiotic oppinion.

What are you on about mate? Stop having potato takes. And if you dont want to read or care about the quest and dont care to find searing gorge this game isnt for you why are you playing it? And other issues like crying about best gear being locked behind hard content that you cant brainlessly pug. You have to learn mechanics oh my God imagine that...man just stop. Its obv not enjoyable for you go do something else.

Or blizzard could just keep classic era to be as close to the original game as possible while giving the classic+ crowd what they want too... The recent changes were not cosmetic nor optional which is dumb

Blizzard has a bug up their butt about introducing friction to every situation, so it's an uphill battle to get up to speed if you've never played a similar type of game. But I think most people if dedicated can probably sort it out and decide if it's for them, and many new players have previous experience in other raiding MMOs. Sure it's different but many of the same things apply, like basic lingo (e.g. aggro, tank, stack, soak, interrupt and so on). So that takes a big chunk of learning off the table so they will have time to wonder why they have to deal with depleting keys and other blizzard monkey paw antics. By nature, many people will want to play the latest stuff to play with friends, be competitive, be in the in-group for the current pvp or pve scenes, and so on. It would be a tough sell I think to ask everyone to do classic first, even if I think that would be awesome if everyone went through the glory days. But those days are gone, and now it's a different world (of warcraft). Even just graphically, it looks dated. As much as I get what you are saying, I don't think new players are going to play a game from 2004 when their friends play a 2024 version. They will quit and move on. I think the best bet is to ease up on the ever-increasing complexity of fights, game systems and mechanics. It's easy mode in retail until the brick wall that is group content (not queued content). Leveling in no way prepares you for what is to come. Also, I fondly remember vanilla grabbing me by the balls and keeping me fascinated for years to come. Sadly I don't think the magic will be as strong for new players in a world where persistent gaming worlds are commonplace now, where social and competitive gaming is the norm, not the brand new hotness. We're also playing an older person's game now, and sadly it's an unbelievably unfriendly place to settle in as a newbie. So choices are play casual and just chill, or do the legwork and learn what is needed to not be kicked from group for trying to tank or something without skill and experience. It sucks but those expectations aren't going anywhere, and forcing people into a mold for the greater good will piss off both new and old players. (and word to the wise - messing with classic in any way is dangerous. I'd argue it could be seen as insulting to the players who carried blizzard to the top, although I don't personally feel that way). Treat your vets with respect and they will stay with you for life, or at least come back sometimes. Piss them off repeatedly by messing with beloved games and memories and they will never forget. The moment the word churn comes up in their plans is the moment the soul of the game starts to die, imho.

I think the #nochanges thing was a total fail, as much as people like to act like 2019 classic was amazing, its nothing like 2004, with worldbuff meta and optimization, its basically like retail.

Retail encourages you to turn your brain off and look at the pretty colors. Classic Era wants you to actually engage with the world and its people, like an RPG, and adding things like Questie into the base game would take away some of that. Classic Cata might give you an experience more to your liking, with its QoL changes, and being a middle-ground between Era and Retail. SoD's phase 3 "invasion" questing is a large reason that Era players are so resistant to change. Running around in a small area and doing the same thing over and over again is a mind-numbing experience. I am an addon developer (for both Retail and Classic) and classic era player. I like the freedom that addons can give while appreciating the simplicity of the older style UI/UX that comes along with Era. It's not always about nostalgia but that's why they call them flavors. Era is vanilla, Progressive Classic is chocolate, and Retail is strawberry. I hope you'll be able to find a flavor that suits you.

I think it's simple. All these quality of life changes that players typically have mods for need to be available, as a toggle feature. Want quest markers? check the box in the settings. Etc.

this video has to be engagement bait

@2:05 - YES... it IS really that bad to implement a quest tracker in Classic. Even though you may use Questie, there are plenty of us who DO NOT use questie and don't want to be shown where to go. Baking it into the UI makes it not optional, whereas downloading an addon is 100% optional. Additionally, I don't play Classic because of Nostalgia. I play the game because it is fun and far superior to any other version of WoW (and honestly most modern games). If not for Classic I would not be playing World of Warcraft at all. anyway, from the way you're talking about not wanting to read the quests it sounds like Classic really isn't the version of WoW for you.

Keep Classic Classic.#Nochanges

here is your TL:DR reply. I'm trying to understand what you're complaining about here, because it sounds pretty confusing. At one point you talk about a toxic fanbase and gatekeeping.. you think its easier to get started in Classic than it is in retail and you dont think a new player should be having to download all these addons just to get started... i'm going to address some of your points. 1: you dont HAVE to download addons. they are only really necessary if you're doing top tier mythic raiding content or in some cases high rating PvP. If you're a casual just starting out, you don't need that stuff. Just go play the game and experience it. 2: @03:11 the reason its called classic, is because there is a large player base that didn't like all the changes Activision made to the game, thus why you have a classic and a retail to begin with. Classic was meant to be what the game was in that era, not just some pre-cata sandbox for retail players to go goof around in while retaining all their QoL addons that do everything for you. If you need the crutches to simply exist, go download them. Then you can experience WoW in a way you want to, without fucking up someone elses experience who wants it the way it was. You want to have blizzard implement them for you just to save you a download, while putting the effort on the other people to "turn it off if they dont want it". lazy. a sidenote to this point... everything blizzard touches turns to shit... often times an addon is designed better than the native blizzard system which comes along later and tries to replace it @4:10 (prime example). Use your addons and be thankful they were designed by people smarter than blizzard. 3: "I don't want to read a quest". " I don't want to look at a map". ok... so what are you doing playing ANY MMO then? its pretty much par for the course for the entire genre. If you need your hand held go to retail, and if looking at maps is too much for you, maybe MMO's just aren't for you bro. As much as a pain in the ass as you think WoW classic is... for its time it was actually the easymode MMO already. 4: you are this strange mix between. "i don't wanna just follow behind the level 70 god player and he one shots everything". and "oh no, i can't be bothered to open my map and figure out where that zone is". As far as how do you learn your character... I won't pretend to know what bullshit catchup mechanics blizzard has in place these days because I stopped playing their dumpsterfire games a while ago, but I would tell you from being an OG player all the way back to the first weeks of Vanilla, just play your character from level 1 through current, and by the time you're into Cata content you will already know how to play him. 5: New raiding is harder than old raiding? Im not here trying to take personal shots at you, but you dont look old enough to have raided OG content back in the day, Having been a mythic raider for years as a main tank Its my opinion that they were each hard for different reasons. Now its more a dance and if someone messes up you start over. In the old days it wasnt just "dont stand in the beam" etc. you wanna raid MC? oh cool... you wanna wear your best gear? well thats too fucking bad.. your best gear doesn't have fire resist, so wear that gimp shit specifically for fire resistance or the raid wont take you. Vanilla you had to do more things ahead of the raid for you to be successful, where as retail you show up, someone drops a table, you get your lock rock, flask and go.. then all your management happens during the fight attempt itself. 5.5: a follow up to newbies raiding and mythic. its really not that bad. the thing to understand is... WoW players cry. as sure as Huntards stand in fire, they put it out with their tears. Back in the day some players said raiding was too hard, others wanted more challenge... Blizzard created the normal, heroic, mythic format. Blizzard looked out across Azeroth and saw all was good, and on the 7th day Blizzard rested.... foooooooor about 10 minutes... until players were then bitching about wanting to raid but not having the time to raid and groups wouldnt take them due to a lack of time/gear/talent, whatever the excuse. So Blizzard created LFR.. Now even those who completely sucked at mechanics and had no friends, finally had a raid tier to call their very own. The point is, if you're new, you get to level cap, you run your dungeons for some baseline gear.. then you start working the LFR's and M+. before you know it youre into normals and heroics in pug groups. You want mythic??? You'll have to get over having to open your map, because that effort level wont cut it even in retail... but just make friends and find yourself a guild. Healer is about the easiest thing to find a raid spot on, because healing sucks and not many people want to do it. DPS are a dime a dozen with 100 people lining up to raid on their rogue. god tier tanks are hard to find, but with raids only having 2 spots for tanks, its hard to find yourself into a mythic raiding team where they are in need of a tank. 6: @8:57 Your thought process is sound, however a couple things. 1: Blizz cant really force a player to do something. 2: there arent really any genuinely new players these days, havent been in years. Youre either returning old player or... 3: you are new but you have friends who talked you into playing the game. In which case the newbie and friend are trying to link up as soon as possible.. that was the entire point of the catch-up mechanics blizzard put into the game was people were complaining about how long it took to get through all the old content before they could play with their friends, especially when there werent many people at those levels to group with.

Yea generally classic players are really close minded and act like implementing something like questie is a hate crime nearly, druids can use polearms? how dare they. like its so stupid you cacn read the quest you can just not use polearms? worst part is majority of them use questie and some form of leveling guide or they just spam dungeons to level anyway and idk why you are trying to talk about how the dungeon finder works and you use mop remix literaly a time gated game mode made so u can basically eventually solo all the content. thats just a stupid comparison and means nothing

the whole questie argument was one of the dumbest arguments I've ever heard. Download curse, search questie and click download. There, blizzard doesn't need to add it because it already exists.

At the end of the day, people need a new game. We try to recreate experiences from the past because the experiences in the present are so unsatisfying

What most people don't realize about WoW is back in the day, the raids really werent played by most people. Raids were sorta this, elite thing, that players new about, but the majority of players never got too. Back in the day, most wow players never even got to 60. I remember when I was in middle school, kids were just playing wow and exploring and sharing their stories. It wasn't about rushing to max level. From my pov the biggest problem with classic, aside from blizzard itself, is this notion that the end game experience is the whole experience. That wasnt the case at all originally. Originally, most players never even leveled to 60. Their joy and adventures began, unfolded, and ended, before they ever hit max level So, when you make the raiding experience "the main game" you are ALWAYS going to end up with a different result. In original vanilla, LEVELING was the "the main game"

I'll premise by saying I didn't see the last video, but couldn't your first point literally be flipped on it's head? "If you want to use it, install it, if you don't want to use it, don't install it". Also, I feel like remix is not a great example - it isn't standard "retail" WoW, but yes retail has a levelling and learning issue. However, follower dungeons have been implemented that should allow new players to do dungeons at their own pace and learn their class in a bit more of a "real" environment. -Mythic content is not made for new players. New players shouldn't be expecting to get the best gear, they are new. -Classic and retail are so different it would be MORE confusing trying to mix the two. Playing a warrior on Classic is nothing like playing a warrior on retail for instance. Overall I really don't understand what you are trying to say - Classic and retail are completely separate entities. I agree that the new player experience in retail needs improved but I don't see what it has to do with classic. It just sounds like there are aspects you like from both but simultaneously don't understand why some people enjoy playing the game differently than you do.

Not all "change" is for the better. I don't want to say the Retail is worse; I just think it enabled the worst in people. But to be honest, I only play retail because I can be a panda brewmaster on my flying mount, and I get to see all the cool worlds. Sure there is always a part of me that wants to be a Cutting Edge Gladiator High Warlord, but if there is no friends to share it with why bother?

Generalizing the WoW player base is ignorant. Citing things like "nostalgia" is rarely part, prelude, or conclusion to a reasoned and considered argument.

My girlfriend started to play wotlk classic and she is not able to raid hc or do most of the endgame stuff. I feel like classic 60 would be better for her and never retail. What makes the game fun for my group of friends is playing together not that anti social boring retail.