Im working on my Pile of Shame, i have a simple rule now. Paint and build 4 kits before i allow myself to buy 1 kit. Ive halved me POS in a year doing this.
40K is, frankly, not a well designed game. Even in its 10th edition, it is still rooted heavily in 1970s war games, with extensive dice rolling and re-rolling, thousands of edge-case rules and special circumstances, tedious measuring, and morale systems which add a lot of complexity without adding much fun. Watch nearly any 40K battle report on youtube and you will hear moments where the voiceovers say "we made a mistake here" or a notification will pop up saying "we got this rule wrong". 40K also has a huge problem with first player advantage. It's not unusual to lose 1/3 of your army before you have even had a chance to fire a single shot. Imagine a game of chess where the white player gets to move ALL their pieces before black. In fully half of the tournament maps, the stats show that first player gains an edge of more than 4%, in some cases up to 14%! In other competitive games this would be totally unacceptable. Kill team has benefitted from more modern game design, with more streamlined rules, an easier learning curve, shorter games, more interaction (more back-and-forth, much less downtime) and more balanced and competitive matches where a wide range of factions and styles are competitive, while still feeling like a satisfying and strategic contest. Kill team also has a much lower barrier to entry as you can purchase and paint a one-box army for much less time and money than even a 500pt army in 40K. Kill team definitely has balance issues, no doubt about that, but the problems are more with individual faction balance rather than the fundamental swinginess of the 40K rules. Having said all that...40K thrives because it's a beer-and-pretzels hobby, and it's a way to show off your painting skills and spend a day with friends, not because it's a "good" game. I know 40K has its loyal fans, and we all owe it a debt of gratitude since its success has given rise to the deep lore and fantastic detailed minis, but honestly, if both games had been invented at the same time, i think kill team would have overtaken 40K years ago. If you are new to these hobbies, i strongly recommend kill team as the entry point.
Yeah, there are small differences in the starter set booklets/data cards to help learn, once you are ready though you can grab the full team rules of Warhammer Community and you are good to go!
I actually have never had the chance to play it yet, but it does look great and with all the "Into the Dark" terrain I have thanks to Kill Team, I have the board setup too! Maybe it's time!
I really hate the new edition. I loved the last edition so much but now the new edition has pushed me towards 40K even with its outdated rule set. The primary and secondary mission play of 40K is so good and balances out the terrible gaming mechanics. I know most people don’t agree with me but 1 secondary, 3 primary and emphasis on killing makes the game so brain dead compared to the last edition.
I can answer this before even watching the video. Kill Team every time. The present 40k rules are hot garbage. All designed to maximise speed over gameplay to cater for the tournament scene. For example the cover mechanics, a unit that can see one model of an enemy unit can shoot the whole unit of the table if they roll well. This was never a rule pre-8th. Also the tables can be as diverse as you like as long as you only use ruins. I played 40K from 2nd - 4th and loved the game. What 10th is now is a hollow soul of a game. Kill Team has proper cover mechanics, you can go diverse with the terrain, i have played games with no building, just hills, rocks and trees. Hills and rocks are heavy and trees are light. Simple. It all works well. Kill Team has soul, its easy to create a narrative via board design. The design team has given us all the tools we need to create a thematic board. Just give each terrain peice a key word (heavy, light, vantage etc) and get playing. Luckily i can still play 40K as someone at GW produced a lovely supplement calld Boarding Actions that changes a lot of the core rules so that the game mechanics makes more sense to an old gamer like me. Rant over. Now time to watch you video.
Been into Warhammer and Warhammer 40K since 96, and you're dropping pure facts! Great video!
this is very informative, i just got my kill team starter set, and listen to this while assembling the minitures. its quite enjoyable so far, cheers
A good overview (and a good conclusion). Now let’s see if Ben wants to do a Kill Team vs Middle-Earth video!
Kill Team FTW
A true fan!
Im working on my Pile of Shame, i have a simple rule now. Paint and build 4 kits before i allow myself to buy 1 kit. Ive halved me POS in a year doing this.
I think you gotta have a system.....even if it's not perfect it can help chip away at it 😅
40K is, frankly, not a well designed game. Even in its 10th edition, it is still rooted heavily in 1970s war games, with extensive dice rolling and re-rolling, thousands of edge-case rules and special circumstances, tedious measuring, and morale systems which add a lot of complexity without adding much fun. Watch nearly any 40K battle report on youtube and you will hear moments where the voiceovers say "we made a mistake here" or a notification will pop up saying "we got this rule wrong".
40K also has a huge problem with first player advantage. It's not unusual to lose 1/3 of your army before you have even had a chance to fire a single shot. Imagine a game of chess where the white player gets to move ALL their pieces before black. In fully half of the tournament maps, the stats show that first player gains an edge of more than 4%, in some cases up to 14%! In other competitive games this would be totally unacceptable.
Kill team has benefitted from more modern game design, with more streamlined rules, an easier learning curve, shorter games, more interaction (more back-and-forth, much less downtime) and more balanced and competitive matches where a wide range of factions and styles are competitive, while still feeling like a satisfying and strategic contest. Kill team also has a much lower barrier to entry as you can purchase and paint a one-box army for much less time and money than even a 500pt army in 40K. Kill team definitely has balance issues, no doubt about that, but the problems are more with individual faction balance rather than the fundamental swinginess of the 40K rules.
Having said all that...40K thrives because it's a beer-and-pretzels hobby, and it's a way to show off your painting skills and spend a day with friends, not because it's a "good" game. I know 40K has its loyal fans, and we all owe it a debt of gratitude since its success has given rise to the deep lore and fantastic detailed minis, but honestly, if both games had been invented at the same time, i think kill team would have overtaken 40K years ago. If you are new to these hobbies, i strongly recommend kill team as the entry point.
Well said!
Been playing 40k on and off since Rogue Trader.. these days alternating activations is the only way to go. I'm firmly in the Kill Team camp theee dqys
One of us, one of us! It's a great camp to be in! Appreciate you watching.
i did choose Legion Imperialis (i am sorry hehe)
THIS WASN'T ON THE LIST!!!! 🤣
I got starter set newest one but the data cards are slightly different then the regular ones
Yeah, there are small differences in the starter set booklets/data cards to help learn, once you are ready though you can grab the full team rules of Warhammer Community and you are good to go!
Boarding Actions middle ground the best.
I actually have never had the chance to play it yet, but it does look great and with all the "Into the Dark" terrain I have thanks to Kill Team, I have the board setup too! Maybe it's time!
The correct answer is always Kill Team. It is simply, objectively a better made game.
For sure! The previous edition and the latest have gone from strength to strength! Thanks for watching!
i went the route of building a parade standing of my successor chapter and little kill teams for the others, my 12 year olds play kill team way better
Variety is the best way! At least the game systems are interchangable!
I’ve never really understood the thrill of rolling buckets of dice. One of my least favorite parts of 40k.
True, it's not for everyone and can really slow the game down! I still get caught up in the fun though! 😅 Appreciate you dropping by!
Any game that has alternated activation beats any game that uses igoyougo activation nuff said!
It's a huge vibe setter for any game, the old "I go you go" is feeling a bit dated now! Thanks for watching!
💯 Came here to say this. Igoyougo is an auto-disqualify in a new minis system for me. I will never go backwards to that type of game.
@mikeelliott3052
Agreed it's a deal breaker for me as well.
Very well presented video
Thanks for tuning in! Appreciate it!
I really hate the new edition. I loved the last edition so much but now the new edition has pushed me towards 40K even with its outdated rule set. The primary and secondary mission play of 40K is so good and balances out the terrible gaming mechanics. I know most people don’t agree with me but 1 secondary, 3 primary and emphasis on killing makes the game so brain dead compared to the last edition.
It was a big change and a risk with how they changed the scoring mechanics in the game!
I can answer this before even watching the video. Kill Team every time. The present 40k rules are hot garbage. All designed to maximise speed over gameplay to cater for the tournament scene. For example the cover mechanics, a unit that can see one model of an enemy unit can shoot the whole unit of the table if they roll well. This was never a rule pre-8th. Also the tables can be as diverse as you like as long as you only use ruins. I played 40K from 2nd - 4th and loved the game. What 10th is now is a hollow soul of a game.
Kill Team has proper cover mechanics, you can go diverse with the terrain, i have played games with no building, just hills, rocks and trees. Hills and rocks are heavy and trees are light. Simple. It all works well. Kill Team has soul, its easy to create a narrative via board design. The design team has given us all the tools we need to create a thematic board. Just give each terrain peice a key word (heavy, light, vantage etc) and get playing.
Luckily i can still play 40K as someone at GW produced a lovely supplement calld Boarding Actions that changes a lot of the core rules so that the game mechanics makes more sense to an old gamer like me.
Rant over. Now time to watch you video.
I keep hearing great things about Boarding Actions, may be time to test it out!
@@3StoWound the great thing for kill team players is there is a good chance we have at least two into the dark sets kicking about.
Let's see, one game makes your minis that you bought for $$$$$$ and painted obsolete within 3 years and the other doesn't.. tough choice....
Definitley a sticking point for some people!