What alternative liquids can you use in the sourdough bread? | Foodgeek
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- Опубликовано: 28 июл 2024
- Experiment Time! Today I am going to experiment with alternative liquids to water. I will be trying out beer, milk and whey. We'll see what difference it makes in the handling, the crust, the crumb and the taste.
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#sourdoughbread #highhydration #alternativeliquids 
Хобби
Happy 4th of July to all my American viewers 🇺🇸🎆
Thanks for the video!
Thanks!
thank you, I celebrated with a BBQ in Thailand :)
Thanks for the experiment!
My son makes beer...I’ll be sure to make him a loaf made with beer🍺
BTW, love your Cali shirt.
Are you close by? 🥖👩🍳🥖
I Sune, I had tried with weiss beer, and it works great. I am waiting for winter time to try-out with guiness beer, but not sure yet with which flour mixture.
4:30 Milk only contains about 90% water (87-90% depending on type of milk). The milk dough is actually only about 72% hydration.
Making his own whey! Truly a dedicated artisan. I bow 🙇.
A friend of mine who is a baker uses beetroot juice for about 30% of his liquid content. Has amazing oven spring with lovely even crumb and he attributes it to that!
I used Guinness once. The result was delicious, and not overpowering, plus of course, you get the colour from the Guinness. I have also used tomato puree, chopped sun-dried tomatoes and a handful of dried herbs. It doesn't rise quite as much but makes a delicious bread. I used to make this tomato bread with yeast, but the sourdough version is much better.
Was the tomato puree 100% of your dough liquid?
There is a whole world of beer experiments to be done
Milk automatically reduces hydration by 15%, hence a tighter crumb, though milk protein is likely involved as well.
Thank you for doing these kinds of experiments. You have become my favorite sourdough teacher.
I would love to see you make a video about lamination, what differences does it make, in a side to side comparison. I generally use this method and I find it very strengthening for my dough. I love your videos and experiments they are very informative and interesting keep doing them.
Two other experiments I have done: both contained 60 - 80g of black treacle (molasses), 100g rye flour, 500g white flour, 12g salt. In the first, I added a handful of chopped walnuts and raisins. In the second, two teaspoons of fennel seeds. Both were really nice breads. Rye + treacle is a marriage made in heaven, but don't use too much treacle or the bread becomes too sweet.
Sparkling water should make for an interesting alternative.
Radu Aurelian Panait wouldn’t the sparkle just go away leaving a flat weird tasting water?
@@wakabaloola I genuinely don't know. Maybe the gluten structure allows the bubbles to be kept in provided that the dough isn't handled too aggressively. Or maybe if the starter itself were made with sparkling water it would behave differently. Maybe Sune can clarify?
Sparkling water is more acidic so that would do something.
@@wakabaloola I don't know what the final result will be in this case, but I know, from my mother, that sparkling water is used in other recipes, like cakes or even minced meat recipes, to make the final product fluffier.
You could do a beer bake off. Stout v Dark Ale v Other Beer.
Stout and Dark ale work really well.
Interesting! Looking forward to a new basics video featuring all your acquired knowledge from these experiments. Love your channel💚
I often make sourdough pizzas with beer, it seems to give the dough a stronger malty/cereal flavor I really enjoy.
Thanks Sune for producing all these amazing videos and experiments! You always mentioned in your video that “the dough is ready after xx hours for shaping...” I struggle to judge when bulk fermentation is finished and can start to shape the dough. I know I can’t just follow the suggestion of a recipe as temperature affects a lot. Can you please make a video teaching us how to determine when fermentation is done using features other than temperature?
Thank you so much!
I agree. That’s probably the hardest thing for me. I think I usually ferment the dough too little. It’s hard to measure how much the dough has grown too, even then in a flat container. I guess it gets better with practice.
Another fabulous experiment!! I really love how you are teaching!!!!!
Thanks for your videos Sune, greetings from Norway!
Suggestion for a future video that would be super helpful for newcomers:
Make a video with vertical splits: Underproofed, correctly proofed, and overproofed.
The split would be very nice such that we can see the difference in handling at various stages.
Hope you'll consider this. Great channel!
Very nice and interesting experiment. My "other liquids" suggestions:
- cider
- bewed: coffiee, tea, herbs ( I know you can use oil for extracting aromas, but this is fat-free)
- milks: goat, coconut
- juices: apple, greip, orange, soy, rice or almond
- bouillons: vegetable, meat or fish
Hoping on here to add a couple more suggestions:
-Oatmilk
-Stronger alcohols like whiskey and rum
People why would you ever add any of these things to bread and therefore why experiment with them. Lmfao...
@@nealjonmurphy'cause this channel is "made by geeks for the geeks"
Les claypool
😂😂
I’ve always wondered about pairing a nice sourdough bread infused with other flavors with food, much like wine is. Citrus to go with fish. Apple to go with pork. Habernero to go with enchiladas. Or even a spicy chili canapé crisp beneath a rich chocolate mousse. This experiment is right up my alley.
The coffee one sounds interesting. I was wondering about this myself and was planning on doing it with a cold brew I had made.
well done, experimental is always great. Bread from the beginning is always a new yourney. Every baking i learn the more. Love it. Great.
So wonderful to see these experiments!!!
Great video! I have actually been thinking of trying ginger beer in bread, I think the taste will compliment the sourdough well.
I've just tried one with tomato juice this weekend and it was a croud pleaser. I also put sun-dried tomatoes on it and enriched thr dough with a bit of thr oil from the tomatoes jar.
Awesome experiment Sune! I'll give a try to both milk and beer ones as well. Thanks a lot 👍🏼
Gracias, Sune! I have been baking so much bread lately because of you. All the best.
I join the suggestions of using inusual líquids such as, wine, fruit juices, other milk types, espresso.
Another fender fan here
Wow that was fascinating! I love specialty beers and baking bread, this sends me off in a whole new adventure!
Very nicely done Sune! I have on several occasions used plain water - that I've taken a medium sized, raw, peeled, and thinly sliced Russet potato, and boiled it to mush in said water. After it cooled down, I poured it through a fine sieve, which removed the majority of the potato solids. The resulting bread rose more, but didn't have much of an improvement with oven spring. The bread was quite moist after baking, and had a relatively strong flavor, with a close crumb. I'd be very curious what your results might be. I'm learning a great deal from your experiments! Thank you for uploading them, where we all may benefit!
Love your videos. I’ve learned a lot. Thanks.
Thanks Suni! Audio was much better. I had no trouble at all. I’m going to try the beer experiment using a 15% rye, 15% barley and Guinness beer. Hopefully it will make a nice loaf for Reuben (corned beef) sandwiches.
Love your experiments. I’m going to have to try the beer now! I’ve not thought of using milk in my sourdough, I only use that for soft and enriched doughs, but it’s great to know it works ok so I can use it in loaves for family members with less love for decent crust and chew. There are a couple of them!
I love making pickle bread- pickle brine is usually 2%salt, so you use the pickle liquid and no salt. I’ve only made it with instant yeast, and it required an extra 4 hours of rising time (a total of 6 hours), and the end result well tastes like pickles, definitely an acquired taste
So I made the beer one yesterday, I didn't get enough tension in the final shape, or I over fermented, so I got little oven spring. Most likely the former. The final result has absolutely fantastic flavour. Great idea. I will try it again with a dark beer or porter. Hope to do better with oven spring. I must try harder.
Thank you for your videos
I'd love to see your take on different beers. My favorite is a stout, the maltiness goes great with the flavors in bread. IPA was too hoppy, not really a fan, and cider was too much apple...it needed cinnamon and brown sugar to make it work.
Great video, thanks for your dedication to your fans!
Bro, you are a genius and my baking has improved so much since I found you :), And the tunes... oh yeah.
I've done one with unfermented kvass wort (wheat bread used for wort was sliced and heavily toasted after baking, no raisins or lemons added). Had too much, didn't fit in the fermenter, so I boiled it to reduce the amount (from 500ml to 300ml) and used that for bread instead of water. This gave crusty flavor to the crumb. I loved it.
Right now I'm thinking about using different infusions to the water, first on my mind are medium toasted french oak chips - would love to get that taste but I somewhat fear getting too much tannins. Also Schlenkerla Rauchbier - bread tasting like sausage beer.
I have wondered for some time how the whey could be used in baking. Thanks for answering my questions!!
I’m going to be trying cold brewed coffee in my bread this week.
Glenn Tillery Let us know how it turns out. Green and black tea would also be interesting.
@@gattamom tried the tea. Black tea is better for me, green tea has more aftertaste.
We have rooibos tea in South Africa. Our family loves the rooibos taste in our sourdough.
@@DavidPurviance this also makes me wonder if using kombucha (just the base liquid from the first fermentation) would yield a good tasting sourdough bread. Though, the microbes and acidity from it might interfere with the starter.
@@kwinvdv thats what my wife does, makes sweet black tea and lets it ferment, smells just like kombucha. Use the tea with flour to make a very active levan that doubles in size in 3 hours. She just made a loaf this evening
I've been using tomato passata in place of water for mine and I love it. Lots of great flavour, and a nice lacy crumb.
Interesting!
I make cheese at home just like you did in this video and have been using the whey to make bread instead of discarding it. Now Ive yet to make it with sourdough (I moved and couldn't take my starter with me and its been too cold to attempt to culture a new one...no central heating). But with instant yeast it makes a really soft, nutty loaf with an open lacy crumb. Really super good with a mix of wholewheat, unbleached and whole spelt. Never fails! Really oeen to try it when my levain is up and running. :) Will do the beer experiment too.
A friend of mine and I have been experimenting with chicken stock, vegetable stock, mushroom broth, and dashi with great results.
I use a mix of pickle juice and water when making rye bread, and potato water (the water in which I've cooked potatoes) for most of my other breeds. I find they stay fresher longer with the potato water, which is good because I freeze a lot of my bread for later consumption.
Great stuff, Sune! I'd look into baking with a stout, or dark lager. The colour of the crumb changes massively, and the taste is incredible
if Sune doesnt try it, I will!
The bread calculator is awesome, super useful when trying out different flower combos but a potential suggestion: I would love the ability to state that the starter is x% of a given flower type (e.g. mine is all bread flower) so that you could have it recalculate for an exact % of some type of flower.
Thanks for a great video - as always. I found some recommendations for using very dark beer, and some recipes also suggest a bit of vinegar for flavoring. I would love to see your take on those two in a future video.
I use the whey from my homemade Greek yogurt and milk too. I make an enriched oat wheat and honey bread. I will try scalding the milk the next time! Thanks for giving so much information!
I loved that whey bread Idea! Bread for body builders!
I think the next experiment you should do is bread with scalded vs unscalded milk :)
Thanks Sune for a great video!
Great video! Do an earl grey tea loaf, call it the Picard Loaf
I’ve always wondered about pairing a nice sourdough bread infused with other flavors with food, much like wine is. Citrus to go with fish. Apple to go with pork. Habarnero to go with enchiladas. Or even a spicy chili canapé crisp beneath a rich chocolate mousse. This experiment is right up my alley.
oooooh I'm excited for this experiment!
Edit: I'm definitely going to try the beer sourdough (I love stronger tasting breads)!
So informative! Thank you! I would love to see a video using non-dairy milks (soy or almond or oat).
great video! i've wondered about beer myself. it would be interesting to see some bread made with sauerkraut juice, or sour dill pickle liquid, or kimchi juice. maybe not just the liquids by themselves, that might be too strong a flavor, but half and half with water? could be an interesting experiment since they all have fermenting cultures in them, and very unique flavor profiles. ive made some nice buns with kefir, that could be a fun one for sourdough (but i've yet to try it in that way).
I've swapped out 30% of the water with a heavily peated Whisky (Laphroaig 10y 40%). Tried 25% and 50% before. The 50% had to much Whisky and the alcohol seemed to have killed most of the yeast. 25% and 30% were just fine and the peaty flavour fits really good! Nice with some smoked ham, salmon, and it even fits with marmelade!
Love this video. Thank you for this experiment. I was totally looking forward to the beer bread and am so glad that it worked. With loads of different beer types in Germany I can hopefully achieve loads of different tasty breads. I guess I will try a bread with alcohol free malt beer first. The sweet malty flavour could be interesting. Did you stir out the fizzy bubbles beforehand or doesn't that make any difference?
Loved this. At least you tasted this time but can you please try to describe the different flavours? I love your vids. Thanks for singlehandedly bringing sourdough to our home
I would love one test about using different kind of starters. Like from fruit, chocolate, and probably many others! All of them are good sources of yeast.
Hi Sune! I am a huge fan. I love your laidback style and your experiments are fun to watch. I do have a question that I'm hoping you can answer. I have been wanting to make longer loaves as opposed to round ones. Is there a special technique that I could use, or should I just stretch out the dough when I prepare my final shaping before baking? Again, thanks for helping me in my sourdough bread baking journey!
I've baked a lot of beer bread before at a bakery I used to work for and we usually use the discard from breweries (Ølmesk in Norwegian) I'm uncertain of it's name in english, but mixing it with different seeds and beer and then letting it sit before adding flour and letting it autolyse before mixing in sourdough makes a very unique bread!
Great video! Rum and coffee/cold brew would be interesting to see!
Hi Sune - I've made bread using Kombucha as the liquid. It worked and tasted quite good. I had made the kombucha myself, too :-) Thank you for your videos; they are so interesting and informative.
Experiment time! Love it
Thank you for the comparison of liquids!
I bake two loaves at a time. I have one Dutch oven and small aluminum tray and a pot. I use the small tray for the bottom and cover it with the pot as cover!
Hi Sune, I'm a newbie in Sourdough baking and been watching your videos for guidance. Thank you for your amazing videos! Coming from a country where alcoholic beverages are not easily available, I thought of substituting Beer with Soda Water. It would be great if you could do an Experiment Time with Soda Water. :) Many thanks in advance!!
I’m not a huge fan of sourdough breads but I like the milder sourdough flavor of the long fermentation bread.
I came to your channel to check out the scoring patterns. They certainly do make beautiful bread.
I have only a oval Dutch oven so I need to get an oval bowl to proof in.
I tried making the long fermentation bread with beer and didn’t care for it, since I love beer I was very surprised.
I’ll have to give your sourdough recipe a try and perhaps I’ll like the flavor better.
Thanks for your information. It was very helpful.
I’m surprised you don’t have a ‘lam’, for sale here. I’ll find one on Amazon.
Interesting video! I wonder if soy milk would give a different result as it's unlikely it has the protein you mentioned in cow milk. I regularly have whey from making soy yogurt, I'll give this a try...and the beer 🍻
What about yoghurt? I’ve used it to make flatbreads and they have a velvety texture.
Also try using Guinness for your beer option! 😁
My though also. A draft Guinness in the can would be the best bet as the bottle Guinness i find undrinkable.
I'm thinking about trying to bake using a dark beer, like a porter or stout, instead of pilsner. It would be interesting to use an imperial beer too, which is sweeter and would add quite a bit of sugar to the mix, possibly changing the rate of fermentation.
use a Porter. It will blow your mind
Great experiment. The beer looks like a great loaf. My wife loves my cooking but struggles with sour dough😄
You rock Sune. Love your videos!
thank you very much for your vídeo.. its really very interesting sending you a big hug from Brasil
You did not account for the solids in milk when calculating hydration percentage.
You are correct. That explains why that one seemed drier :)
I was looking to see if someone beat me to this comment. Either way, I think it's great you did it so that others will understand the need to do so. I've learned a lot from watching your videos, so thank you
@@80RedRock This calculator accounts for it, Sune explains it one of his later videos: foodgeek.dk/en/bread-calculator/
@@skapur thanks for the link. I will check it out
I have often added some leftover brine from making fermented hot sauce. Add some nice cheddar cheese and you have an amazing cheesy and spicy bread. I would love to see your results using leftover brine from a fermented hot sauce.
This is my favorite video of yours so far not that I have got to see them all YET!!! If you used the milk in a tangzhong bread how would that work and add a little extra milk to make up for the solids in it ? I grab husband's beer once in awhile and make bread with it and it is a hit, I don't like American beer, maybe I'll have to get hold of some Pilsner, but in bread it rich ens it, I think. THANK YOU for this FANTASTIC experiment.
Hei! Nice video!
I've tried making a sourdough with my ginger bug (for my ginger beer), so more lactic acid therefore a little bit more sweetness. The bread itself is like a typical sourdough (I'm doing a 80% hydration rate), airy with a nice crust, although developing the gluten quite fast.
I recently made a sourdough loaf with dry mushrooms. I hidrated the mushrooms with hot water, let it cool down and used both the mushrooms and the water on the loaf. It turned out pretty great, although I think using only the mushroom water would have been enough.
I use homemade kefir milk - because my body can't handle gluten and I figured the more fermentation the better. 😀
Sourdough saved me from a life without bread! I even keep a quart size mason jar of starter (or as I like to think of it - premade pancake/waffle/crumpet mix) in my fridge at all times.
Thanks a lot for your experimental Video!👍👍👍👍🇩🇪
The beer one looks interesting, you should try making bread with yogurt and one with goats milk and maybe other types of stronger beers.
A rye bread with a solid stout, maybe... mmm.
Perhaps buttermilk as another alternative liquid?
When making curds and whey; make sure to use either raw or pasteurised milk only, with homogenised, sterilised or UHT milk the protein is denatured and it will not separate correctly. In the UK we have milk bread, it is soft white and usually in small soft rolls, but only 30-50% of the hydration comes from the milk, the rest is water. On the milk front it might be worth testing skimmed vs semi-skimmed vs whole milk and whey. This would help identify if the difference was protein or fat related.
How about an episode with just different beers. Stout/porter, rauchbier, brown ale and lager perhaps?
Thanks Sune. Will try with beer next time.
THIS IS AWESOME!
We always have a lot of discard liquid from store bought pre cooked beans like kidney beans and chickpeas. Would be great to to put that in an experiment.
Suggestion for a experiment: try adding different % of yogurt to the dough.
Also try red wine 🍷
I strain my home made yogurt and use the resulting whey in my bread making.
Hello! Do you use the exact same amount of yogurt whey as you do with water? Any difference in the process? I would love recipes using whey as I have lots ( only eat homemade yogurt. Easy to make and so much better)
OOO my, you make understanding sourdough so easy. I enjoy making your recipes. I have your Delicious SOURDOUGH bread with CHEDDAR in the oven right now. I have a question for you. Can you show us how to make cinnamon sourdough rolls with no machine? My next cook lol :)
Thanks for the great videos. I believe milk kefir would be a good experiment.
When i make sourdough bread, I add sugar to counteract the sourness. So I have been thinking about using grape juice to naturally add in the sweetness, and especially since fermented grape juice tastes wonderful!
id you want a huge boom in flavor you should try adding unhopped wort instead of beer. you can make it yourself by extracting it from barley malt and even use the spent grains in your bread just like you would use seeds.
for extraction you dont need fancy beermaking equipment. just steep the malt at around 68 C for an hour and strain it to get the liquid.
hope you try it!
Would love to see another experiment with fruit juice (not from concentrate).
Apple and various others.
Plus one with 51% apple juice 49% water.
Amazing videos!!!. How about making bread with fresh blended tomato juice(plain tomatoes in a blender)? I think that wine might also be interesting to try out :)
I have tried orange juice with a bit of pepper (good), pomegranate juice (eh...) and lapsang souchong tea (different, ok).
Excellent video, the one with beer looks promising. Maybe you should try making bread with different types of beer (Stout, Porter, IPA, Lager, etc.)
I'm looking forward to try making my own beer bread.
Greetings from Venezuela.
I would have thought the yeast from the beer would have added/done something but the dark, hop taste would be interesting to try.
I will definitely try the beer. Maybe different kinds of beers: lager, ale, IPA?
Last week I've baked one using 2/3 water and 1/3 of a Stout that I had homebrewed. The beer gave the bread a nice brownish color and some great toasty notes
I like to use honey. It makes the dough more 'spongish'. Highly recommended. (about %2-3)
Dear Sune, firstly, let me thank you for this very nice channel and content. I got into the sourdough business during the Covid quarantine (I am sure so did many people), and your videos have been very useful. I wonder, however, if it were not time to revise your Sourdough Bread for Beginner video. I think you have modified you cooking technique and sometimes I wish for a new videos showing every steps of your current baking process. I don't know if you have time or interest in doing so, but thanks in any case.
I have one scheduled, but I want to finish a couple of experiments before I do :)
@@Foodgeek Excellent! I'll be looking forward for it.
Great video!
I only make sourdough every other week so my experiments are normally done with my yeast breads that I make twice a week. I most unusual was substituting plain water with chicken broth.
Thank you - definitely going to try the beer one.
As an experiment, how does it impact your loaf if you do the folds at different stages if the bulk ferment? i.e. all up front (the control), all at the end, dispersed throughout. I often have unexpected circumstances that stop me being able to do them all at the start, but not sure what impact that's having...
I'd love to see buttermilk in this set.
The beer addition seems interesting :-)
I was just thinking buttermilk. Great suggestion!
I used potato water, makes a light fluffy loaf, same as oat water.