Shaper 101 Shopmade Outboard Fence for Sliding Table Shaper
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- Опубликовано: 15 окт 2024
- This video shows my new shop made outboard fence for a sliding table shaper. It also demonstrates setup and use to achieve snipe free cuts.
The UHMW tape I used was purchased from CS Hyde Company (Item # 19-10R-.5-18, UHMW Tape-Rubber Adhesive)
And i was JUST so proud of my most recent acquisition...an Inca 3/4" 1.5hp Shaper, fully loaded... Then i see how this guy is hangin'... Holly crap, what a machine.
Another great video Steve! That's a great way for use with a sliding table. The outboard fence method is hard to beat for a smooth consistent width snipe free cut. I have two setups myself. One is on a Powermatic Super 27 shaper deducted for coping and sticking, and the other is on a Powermatic Super 27 shaper that gets used for various tasks. I use this shaper with a Byrd Shelix head for making face frame stock to clean up the saw kerfs. The other nice benefit to an outboard fence is that if you have varying width of stock that is greater than the finished width, you will get a consistent width after running it through. Thanks for sharing Steve. Scott
Thanks Scott. It was watching one of your videos that inspired me to remake my outboard fence to get a greater width range. BTW, I played around with various bevels on the modified shaker style cope and stick and have pretty much decided on a 10 degree bevel. The 7.5 bevel looks good too. The 5 and 12.5 bevels were either too much or too little. Looks like my next tooling purchase will be a custom cope and stick cutter since the bevel is too shallow to be used on my current sets. Steve
How fortitous that I should come across this video. I've been having problems getting a snipe free finish using a glue joint cutter on my shaper (I call it a spindle moulder here in England) I'd never thought of using an outboard fence, but this makes absolute sense, so I'll definitely be trying it. The problem with the glue joint cutters is that for the joints to be strong the cut need to be made at full depth so the finished workpieces interlock perfectly with no gaps. (Similar to your mould and scribe example in this video) As you know adjusting the outfeed fence to allow a full depth cut without sniping is almost impossible to get perfect, and i've been chasing my tail with this for a long time. Thanks for the tip.
Glad it was helpful. Have a great and blessed day. Steve
I disagree with your assertion that “adjusting the outfeed fence to allow a full depth cut without sniping is almost impossible to get perfect.” I do it all the time; it’s just a matter of knowing how to make the adjustment efficiently. That said, registering off the opposite side of the workpiece does have its advantages, especially when you’re working with short pieces. But because there is always the risk of your workpiece drifting into the cutter-in spite of power feed angling-it’s a good idea to make two pressure blocks that ensure your piece doesn’t wander from the outboard fence. The pressure blocks are easy to make, and you can attach them, depending on the circumstances, either to the shaper fence or directly to the table with low-profile switch magnets.
Interesting video and some really cool machines. Nice work Steve👍
Thank you. Steve
When I had a router table with a hard maple one piece fence with a 3 HP Bosch router for using router bit profiles, I begrudged not have a split fence for certain milling operations. So I taped polyester shims to the outfeed side of the fence to take up the slack created by the profile being cut. Then, with the Aigner fence installed on a Felder shaper, milling thin pieces with quick adjustment from the Felder fence motor and using a push stick and hand pressure I was able to overcome the one piece 44" long stationary-C clamped router fence. When we use a one piece auxiliary fence as you have with power feeder we lose the split fence and quick adjustment and thin wood products are not in the offing. So, I wonder what you do for thin mouldings and muntin profile work?
I had a boom mounted Felder power feeder with 4 wheels that I sold off because I never used it as planned for flooring work. Also, my Felder shaper did not have an overload circuit on the auxiliary power feed circuit, so one can burn up the electrics of the Felder system. You can piggyback the overload on the Felder.
I am able to profile thin product with Aigner tension accessories and if I need to move the Felder fence less than .005" increments, the best way is to tweak the outfeed fence setting. I spent $1K's for the Aigner fence; and, this off side fence shown here seems to be the long way around for a variety of product widths? Every time I break a setup, the Aigner-Felder fence system enables me to repeat the setup quicker if I need to. With variable tensions before and after the profile head, my control is better no matter what the grain direction in a variety of woods. Does that model Felder shaper have more than one lock position for the slider? I am not familiar with the newer version. Thanks
Hi Vincent. I have used the split fence adjustment as you described and it works very well for taking a full profile cut. Dimensioning to a specific width using that method is a bit more complex though and that is why I default to the outboard fence for such operations. For thin stock such as muntins, I would use the ouboard fence with a shim of the appropriate height for the rabbet portion of the profile similar to what Joe Calhoon does.
I have the power feeder outlet on the shaper but do not use it since there is about a 7-10 second delay on the feeder start. Hindsight is 20/20 and I would not order this option if I had to do it over again. The Felder shaper has only one table lock position (at least for the shorter table).
Steve
Steve, good to hear from you and know you are continuing your quest in woodworking. You as I have the same idea for thin pieces to shape with a Felder Format4. Interesting thing is I thought I would need to do that shoulder support approach and was concerned with the potential of an explosion whilst trying to get the wood past the cutter head; but, no, the tension devices proved good to keep the keel of the piece being cut.
I ordered the plates for a second sliding table stop on the Felder and drilled and cut and filed it in there; thus, helping me to position the slider relative to which profile head I am working. etc. Sometimes we are too close to a revolving tool (atleast for my comfort) so being able to back away and hold the table in a second position seems safer. I have a slight problem with the garage floor wanting to move the slider. that second stop is nice for tenon cuts and a host of other larger work. If you need a vid on that stop install, let me know. Best wishes to you and family for 2018 overthere.
Thanks Steve. Increasing the thickness of the fence reduces the amount of cut which would be a problem, but I was thinking by recessing a wider slot to allow the screw heads and washer to be lower (not necessarily all of the head) may provide enough clearance for the feeder to swing across? Cheers, David.
Thanks David. That is a possible solution but with only 12mm thick ply, there isn't a lot of room to do this. Another possible solution is to position the feeder reach or axial position of the fence on the sliding table such that the screw head passes between the wheels. I may play around with that idea some more. Steve
excellent information, thank you for posting.
Thanks for the video. I do have a Felder shaper so I'd love to make what you've got but can't seem to find those brackets you have at around 3 minutes in. I've tried to find the on the Felder site but no luck. Could you put a link to those?
Hi Joshua. These are parts and will not be listed in their on-line shop. Call Felder and ask for parts to order. Make sure you get the threaded inserts as well. I have long since lost the part numbers for these. Steve
Thanks for a very informative video. I have recently acquired a used Minimax with a sliding table and feeder and did not know about outboard fences. Another trick in the book :)
You mentioned you previously had a minimax, which one did you have and do you have any videos on it?
Hi New Dutch. I had a Minimax T55I shaper. Check out my Shaper 101 playlist and it should show up in there somewhere. Steve
@@extremewoodworker Nice! I'll see if I can find it. Mine is a T55WF with the analog dial indicators, it's been great so far though your CNC Format4 is a real monster.
Super vid, thank you.
Hi Steve, great video, thank you! One quick question; do you remember what the part # might be for these FELDER channels? I called FELDER and they do not seem to sell these as stand alone parts. Thank you!
I cannot find the part number. I do recall contacting someone in service/parts and they were able to look them up and took my order. The sales staff is likely unfamiliar with ordering parts. Hope this helps. Steve
@@extremewoodworkerWhen I called them I talked with service, I will try one more time. Thank you again!
@@marmiz923 I might also suggest having some steel tee slot inserts milled up and tapped for your desired thread. These are much more versatile and less expensive to boot especially with Felders shipping charge structure. Steve
Hey Steve, nice video and thanks for sharing with us. Outboard fences can be very useful. I have used them to make tongue and groove flooring among other things. After watching I am curious as to whether you considered the Aigner Outboard Fence. It is not inexpensive but is a quality piece and has the digital measurement built in. I am wondering if you went that way could you mount an Aigner 830mm rail to the front of your sliding table by mounting the rail bolts into the P blocks. This would allow removal of the rail if needed and keep from directly mounting the rail into the slider edge. It might be a sweet setup, but what you have done is certainly great for the relatively low cost involved. I would recommend anyone consider an outboard shaper fence if they have a feeder to use with it. Very useful accessory. Best,Todd
Thanks Todd. The Aigner outboard fence is certainly nice especially with the digital scale. It would certainly make setup easier. I think the P channel on the Felder makes attaching to the table difficult. It would be much easier if there was a tee slot on the side. I think a guy in New Orleans may have such a setup on the same shaper so I may need to give him a call.
Steve, I have looked at the images of the Aigner piece and while it is nice it is also about $1000. A little more than I can justify as primarily a hobbyist right now. I have been thinking about making my own based on a similar parallelogram design. I have a spare Delta Unifence fence that I could use for the main fence. Would perhaps use a Whixy planer digital measure for the measuring device. I would use the Aigner 830mm rail and two of the 170mm clamps for the rail and connect them with a piece of aluminum. The alternative would be 2 shorter rails instead one the long one...but the long one would be easier and more useful I think. I am lucky in living in NASCAR country where aluminum and steel is readily available and not that expensive. The fence could be made out of readily available aluminum if I didn't have the Unifence fence or wanted a longer fence. I'm thinking the Unifence is 43" long. The hardest part might be a locking mechanism to securely lock the setting in place. I am thinking this could be made for about $150 to $200 including the Aigner rail and clamps.
Hi Todd, Having previously had a Unifence, I would think it would be too tall and cause angst with a power feeder even in the low position. I had thought about using some 80/20 extrusions for a fence but chose not to go that route. My son had purchased some that was about 1/2" thick which we used to build him a monitor stand. Steve
Possibly Steve. I figured the Unifence fence would have to be used in the low position unless doing very thick or taller materials. I did look in the Aigner catalog and the fence on their's is 1200mm long. Of course the digital measure has to be able to move to the right or left to accommodate the parallel movement of the fence as distance changes. So, the locking mechanism seems to have to be on that component to lock the whole fence in position. I have not found the range on the Aigner but it appears it is 150mm and less to me from the photos. Todd
Ha. I’ve been pondering doing the same on my shaper. Thanks for your version. Some things to think about
Thanks Michael. I did go out today and get some button head cap screws with some thinner fender washers. The feeder wheels just barely clear the screws with my normal setting for 20mm stock. Steve
Great vid, thanks for sharing. Love the top down camera view.
Thanks Joe. I don't use that camera a lot because the lens is very wide angle. It seems to work well for close-in shots though. Steve
It is always a great day when you post a new video Steve! Even better when it is about the shaper:) If I wanted to ask Santa for a first shaper tool would you have any suggestions? Looking forward to taking that class your recommended and have been reading a couple books on the subject, but alway great to see your creative solutions in action.
Thanks Anthony. For a first shaper cutter, I recommend a rebate cutter which is useful for most every project. I really like this one offered by Rangate: rangate.com/products/shear-rabbeting-cutter
It has a 125mm diameter steel body, has shear angle knives, and has diamond coated carbide inserts.
Steve
Great Video (Again) Steve, I have a suggestion for another Video, that would be about using the Aigner Bowmaster, If that is You have one, I so appreciate seeing better tools and there uses.
Thanks Nathan. I ordered the Aigner Bowmaster and guide with the machine with the top drilled and tapped for it. I have used it several times. I am planning a future project that will use it so a video will be forthcoming. Steve
Groovy, I’ll look forward to it, it doesn’t seem Aigner has very good marketing skills as far as letting you know the capabilities of some of their products
The Aigner catalog is really good showing the various uses of their accessories. Steve
Dude! I think ya freaked out on tnat shaper a lil bit dontchya think? Sseriously, NICE machine!
happy holidays Extreme woodworker
Thank you Pieter, we are traveling to visit family. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and your familty as well. Steve
Great video, I always look forward to them.
Thanks Kirsten. Steve
thanks Steve a great jig
Curious to know why you aren't climb cutting?
I normally don't climb cut unless I have to.
Hi Steve, Belgium Calling...
I just don't get it, you dispose of very very precise & multi thousand Euros moulder/shapeer equiped with an top of the art AIGNER fence and on top of that a fitted with a powerdrive ...(I can only dream of that!!!) Why would any one guide a workpiece against a selfmade birch fence on such a machine ???
I would love to have an Aigner thickness stop but the fence is too tall to use with a power feed on typical North American cabinet door thicknesses. I just had no desire to spend nearly $1K for something that would not be useful.
Thank you for your statement, do love your channel, very instructive.
Nice solution!
Do you ever clamp long or wide work pieces to the table and feed through the shaper?
Hi Mark. I have only used the sliding table for tenoning type operations. I can see how the operation you describe might be useful for profiling large unwieldy items such as heavy doors. Steve
With the Felder hold down clamps in the T slots and the slider, one can go to town with accuracy on short or long doors, furniture and raised panel profiles and get by with one pass with good results if the grain is tight and your profile head knives are sharp. I adapted those hold downs to a Martin slider and that opens up a new world. Custom length 30MM round rods for the clamps are another feature I have found to make quick setup possible on a variety of machines.
Thanks Vincent, I am headed to a KF700 just to get the long slide ability with the shaper. I was just going to get a K700 but I went to the open house and as Steve says it is hard on your wallet.
I would have gotten the KF700 due to floor space and the 700's ability to cut angles-tilt without changing length of cut. The 500 series saw changes cut length with different tilts angles. Felder keeps building such a variety of machines.
Furniture and cabinet work is my main drive. Happy New Year to you.
What is the shaper class that you have recommended?
Check out alpineworkshops.com/
what brand rails and clamps did you use for the mini max shaper? ...i;d like to do something similar to my powermatic non sliding table shaper
The rails and clamps were made by Aigner and in the US are available from Martin or any of their dealers. The rails are surprisingly affordable and come in a variety of lengths and two different profiles. I have outfitted most of my machinery with the rails which I use primarily for attaching extension tables. Steve
thanks!!
Oh Steve, I just realized that I no longer have been receiving your "notifications". This is happening also to at least one more site that I love to watch; and possibly others too. I just realized that some how, the little bell next to the subscribe button has been turned off.
I did not do that. I call this to your attention because if it happened to me, it may have happened to other of your subscribers.
For now I must go back and watch some of your newer videos, because I want to miss NOT a one.
Take care dear friend.
It is an interesting thing when we move from "I'll move the car and CBX soes I can do a little saw dust work" into a full garage with dedicated positions of machines, voltage and dust collect for woodworking. The wallet gets thinner, we drive to Atlanta and we talk to Felder and Martin about different machines.
Me wife and I were over at a neighbor's home in the town and he was an installer for high end Euro made electronics cabinets, etc that were spec'd and fab'd in northern Europe and he installed such. Here I had the saw with options, jointer and planer with options with money down and was waiting for that call and this joker said to me on the patio with me wife sitting close by, "Oh, you don't need all that equipment; just a table saw and a chop saw is enough!" Boy, he almost sank my ship on that one statement. People cannot see and understand what we make and therefore they comment on our purchase based on what they have in their minds. It always works that way. Like you said on a reply to one gent who was typing all in CAPS about the machines you use. He was limited by his own mind and it really has nothing to do with what you, Steve, need to accomplish. But, here they are making contrary comments that effect our feathers.
By the time this guy has twiddled around with packing and crap, all of us proper wood machinists would have run a hundred metres of moulding and sat down with a cup of tea.
Yet another insightful and useless comment from a pompous know it all.
@@extremewoodworker truth hurts doesn’t it?
@@riverbuilder2251 Nope