Debunking Common Anti-Noncat Points
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- Опубликовано: 15 июл 2024
- This was originally intended for a joint TikTok account I shared with some other users, but that got hacked and taken down during the making of this video. So instead, it’ll just go here.
This is mainly directed at the Warrior Cats: Ultimate Edition fandom, especially the part that’s on TikTok. But it also goes out to the rest of the Warriors fandom.
Something I forgot to add in the video that is another common point: "Go play ___'s life" (Dog's Life, Dragon's Life, etc.)
And it's a super weak point anyway. All you need to realize is that, often, when someone is a dog on Ultimate Edition, they want to play as a dog in the warrior's universe, not a dog in the dog's universe. The same reason most people play as a cat in the warrior's universe, and not a cat in Cat's Life. Telling them to go to Dog's Life is like someone telling cat roleplayers to go to Cat's Life. It just is not the same universe.
question, what about the prey
since they eat squirrels and other small mammals
what would be their eating way in clanlife with a mammal who eats nuts and stuff :0?
sorry if you covered this alreadly as i only just found you
@@jellobelocreates6601 You’re fine! And that’s more up to the creators of the prey OCs, since there’s different ways to work around that question. Maybe the prey collects their own separate food and stores it near the fresh-kill pile, maybe the prey eats meat too (as a lot of thought-to-be herbivores are actually omnivores, such as squirrels, who are known to cannibalize each other’s young!). I think it’s really up to interpretation though, and depends on the OC. Hope that answers your question ^^
@@swanfeathertheelder thank you!
Also, those games don’t have really- that experienced rpers.
I really love playing as a Fox and a Dog- XD
Yes. Whenever ppl say “your dog can’t be in a clan” I’ll show them this.
I feel like the only valid argument against a non-cat character is “It isn’t allowed in this specific role play.” If you’re in a private server on in a group chat on amino or something, But still, it doesn’t extent outside of that exact role play.
Exactly! Private servers I can understand; the host can make whatever rules they want (within Roblox's TOS, of course). But public servers are free reign for everybody.
@@swanfeathertheelder yeah! If there’s a host or owner making specific rules, then of course. But if it’s open for everyone and rules state nothing against non-cats, then that’s when the arguments are no longer valid.
me a year ago: omg noncat ocs are so unrealistic im gonna BARF
me right now, with a lynx, fox, and badger oc: WHOOPSIES
I like the idea of non-cat warriors! I think your squirrel idea! Heck, I might even make an OC who isn’t a cat! I like the idea.
People are debating this??? Oh my gosh. We should all be able to have fun and make different animal warrior OCs!! Midnight exists in canon. Midnight has always existed in canon. Midnight is a badger. This sort of thing; though rare (?), can happen. Great video mate
Honestly, yes! I agree. Unfortunately not many people understand that this is a public game, therefore their rules don't apply to this public game. Yes, to private servers, the rules can, but not in public servers.
That'd be like going out in public and saying that everyone is doing something you don't like and crying out about it.
*It won't at all work*
it's so funny when someone says it's unrealistic for a squirrel / dog / fox / mouse etc to be in a clan among cats. because yes, those species do not traditionally get along, but this is a series about cats, who:
- can talk
- have a religion
- have a monarchy system
- get prophecies and omens
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also, the people who harass noncats for things being "against the code" are fucking stupid because cats break the code all the time in the books, and so do their characters.
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i personally do not care if you are uncomfy with roleplaying with noncats, but people need to stop openly harassing them because its fucking ridiculous at this point. they are in a PUBLIC SERVER. i do not give a shit if they're the leader, deputy, medicine cat, or medicine cat apprentice, because nobody should be able to control others. lots of time, people will say that they have reign over others in the clan because they are a major role.
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powerplaying. i don't fucking care if people powerplay honestly. if they powerplay, they're likely new to roleplaying as i've seen most of the time. i'll get into this soon with the next topic that strays from noncats.
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new players are what wwe all started out as and it makes me really upset that some people harass them. yeah, they powerplay a lot. yeah, their characters don't have warrior names a lot of the time. but i hate how people on tiktok will be like "oh my god, if you haven't read the books, get off of this game, you don't belong here." nobody gives a shit if you played in beta or have 4 years of experience. by pushing them away you aren't letting them get better. also, yeah, they stereotype them as being young kids, so why don't those people understand that KIDS do not have the money to buy a lot of the books.
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v final statement(s) and diffrentiating topics. [tw: su1c1d@l thoughts, su1c1d3 threats] v
the community around this game is continuously getting worse. and i've quite literally been told to k1ll myself over opinions that diffrentiate from others' in beta, then later was told to "get over it" or "leave the community." we need to stop being like this or we're going to spiral into madness. this community has cost me friendships. it's started disputes between friends. it's even given me su1c1@l thoughts at times. please, i am begging everyone who is reading this, please settle your arguments in a civil manner or people are going to end up how i felt for a really long time in beta when i was facing constant harassment for diffrentiating opinions. i was an anti-noncat and anti-new player at one point, and i learned from my mistakes. please, do better, anti-noncats, anti-new players, and everyone else in this community. we can mend the wounds that we've created if we try hard enough to not argue. we can make this community welcoming again. we can do better. everyone can. please. i want this to be a welcoming game again. i don't want any more arguments, i want a civil community again. please and thank you.
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if you read this entire thing, thank you so much. i really appreciate it.
Thank you so much for all of this. It’s thoughtful that you took the time to think through and analyze the points in the video on your own, and it’s even more thoughtful to share your experience. Because people can be so incredibly nasty to others over things like this, it’s unreal. Death threats, constant group-planned harassment, it’s amazing how far some people will go with this. I’m so sorry you went through those awful things; no one deserves treatment like that, especially over such a minor thing. The UE community, and the Warriors community as a whole, needs to take a step back and realize these problems exist and do better. We don’t need to change our opinions, but we do need to change our behavior. And as long as any side of the community - mostly anti-noncats and anti-new-players at this point in time, but that can always change in the future - continues to endorse and/or excuse this kind of bullying, things will not get better.
May not be into warriors but I really enjoyed the vid and I could tell you've put a lot of effort into it
Aw :) I know I haven’t talked to you in a while but that means a lot. Thank you Steff
Im making a skunk warrior oc right this moment, just in celebration of this video. For so long i've seen the "How to rp as a [Insert non-cat]" and for the most part they are (At least in my opinion) they are almost passive aggressive in the way they give out all these restrictive guidelines.
swan i think you make a lot of great points in this video #noncatpride
Great video! Gotta burn this into my brain in case anyone comes a yowiling at my raccoon, squirrel, fox, lizard, owl, and big-cat ocs!
Ik this is an old comment but I'm interested in how you've made an owl oc and a lizard oc! That seems really cool!
@@Fawnfreckle Oh, Sure, Ill tell you about them - both have some notable backstories. The lizard was made for an event in the Warriors discord, being kitsized and furlesss- mimiking the look of the skink i based them on. The owl was made for a fashion show, and mimiked a barn-owl, using the front legs for the wings - as batwing was not a thing yet - and having the muzzle gray for the beak
Bruh "it's not realistic!!!1@!1"
*excuse you i don't speak neckbeard!*
BAHAHAHA GOOD ONE 💀✋
i've seen diffrent cats take in a squirrel, puppies, wildcat kittens, and even ducklings in real life.
So while i myself don't play as a non-cat (unless being a rusty-spotted-cat counts), i don't think they shouldn't be allowed.
The ones i seen play as foxes where just normal role players, and it's nice that the other players treated them fairly, so that's nice.
I actually really like playing as a fox, and I've seen people get angry at other non cats. This is a great video, explains greatly!
God. I remember seeing a albino squirrel oc in Warriors; ultimate edition and they were really nice! Your content has encouraged me to make more non-cat ocs, and I've even made a squirrel oc of my own! Though I must say, if I roleplayed as him, I'd probably get shouted at since 1, he's an Indian Giant Squirrel and 2, they have a tendency to have purplish markings lol
Anyway, sucks that people are being so against non cat ocs.
cats have been seen to foster other animals so I feel it's not too far off to think that there's gotta be /some/ cats that stumbled upon a puppy or a squirrel, hell, even a mouse, and just adopted it into the clan
Also, love your work!- acorntail is such an interesting character. I can't wait to see more of her!
@@digital430 I think it was Sugar-cloud, but not 100% sure
@@digital430 woah, really?!
Pog! I remember you said you were gonna make an animation about ur character!
Can't remember who I was tho.
@@digital430 oooh! Nice! I'll subscribe to u too so I can watch out for that :D
@@digital430 ^^
@@digital430 maybe we could RP again sometime! If you're ever free lol
Also I remembered who I was (I think)
I'm pretty sure I was Otterslip
Thank you for making this.
Yeah, I was in a Warriors Ultimate Edition server on Roblox, and someone came at me for having a rottweiler design, saying that it's a "cat game" and told me that "Its so annoying when people do that, it's literally a cat game."
Thank you for making this video, it changed my opinion on noncats!
Hmmm this video is interesting when i started joining the Warrior Cats community i thought that only cats can be warriors but when i watched a video of Razmerry's MAP of a AU of Hollyleaf being a adopted mother for a fox cub and the fox is called as RedWish and turns as a warrior on Thunderclan and i saw a video of Pinkbunnygirl43 made a video called "What if a piece of prey joined the Clan?" which is also a good video so had come to the conclusion that not only cats can join lans but also others animals can example: Owls,snakes,foxes,crows,rats and all thank you for making this video this helps alot!
Wooooooo awesome video Swan!! -insert every anti-noncat including the ones who hacked the TikTok having their tiny brains spinning and getting dizzy from this video and trying to justify their stupid, pathetic arguments.-
i dont mind non-cat ocs! i love to see the creativity of others, it’s super interesting to see what people pull of in WCUE. as long as everyone is being respectful (ex: people ask nicely for non-cats to not be in this rp / people are being kind to non-cat ocs when allowed in rp) then anything goes for me tbh
I know I'm late but this is a great video! As someone with a non-cat oc, I never understood why someone would try and limit creativity. A non-cat oc is automatically more creative and interesting than the average cat oc and while theres nothing wrong with a regular cat, as warriors IS a cat book series, I definitely enjoy non-cat ocs more as rare as they are. The point of art and making stories is having fun, so why try and limit that by ONLY having cats? I dont roleplay (anymore) btw, this is mostly talking about warrior cats ocs in general as I've seen people get hate for having a non cat oc. I also want to say I LOVE you're characters! A squirrel is SO creative and different and I ADORE the story you've made!
I remember once I was roleplaying as my cat oc Goldenstrike and a rat joined, apparently an apprentice in the clan had a problem with non cats and proceeded to throw a hissy fit about accuracy before accusing the rats friend of bullying. Also at one point they said the rat "threw a stove" at them. Which I don't think was a typo since they typed it out 3 times. I think alot of the people against non cats in rp in general* are just kids wanting to only hear about cats, or adults who don't remember that most of the wc fandom is minors and that they're allowed to have fun.
*by this I meant the people who think anyone that roleplays as a non cat should be banned, not the people who just void them.
Anyway your squirrel oc is really cool! Cats irl have been known to take in and raise chicks if they've lost a litter so I always found it interesting when a clan cat adopts a prey animal
THANK YOU!! I have a lot of non cat ocs, and I constantly get these, including threats and insults.
I like to roleplay as a fox sometimes and It is fun! When I am a cat I don’t tell people they can’t be foxes just sometimes the non-experienced fox or dog or wolf roleplayers are annoying
clappies
I remember being a fox pup and was took to the med cats den. Their apprentice got so mad they were caring for a fox and left. I was so confused. (This was beta)
Honestly I don’t see anything wrong with no cats, like I have a story where it’s like what if a clan found a baby cougar or mountain lion and raised it as a warrior,
Today I was finally able to RolePlay as my first non-cat ever. I always wished to RolePlay as that character ( a mouse ) but was scared of the jjudgement and to be voided by the Clan (plus the conflict) and seeing AcornTaill/Star finally gave me the courage.
Had one of the best RolePlays and got to grow a lot of kittens! Seeing them become apprentices and more. Thank you so much for existing, you inspired me and a lot of players
Ive started playing as a coyote these past few days, and just today twice ppl undermined me or other noncats .-. One of the leads told the whole clan to ignore some foxes because “they clearly dont know what theyre doing if they think foxs can speak cat lingo” like seriously..
Yeah, mass voiding should be reserved for someone who’s actively being a disturbance to everyone. Telling everyone to void someone just because they’re something you don’t like…it’s so awful.
@@swanfeathertheelder yeah.. Now for some good news, my sibling and I played together most the day today, (me as a coyote and they as a wolf) and had alot of fun ^^ they had to go to bed but I kept playing and even met a few more noncats who were chill!
I was on a WC roblox server , and there were people pretending to be rats. They were the most CHILLEST people ever on the server XD, they did get a little annoying trying to bite people ever second and saying we insta got sick. But after a while they realised that wasn't helping and just started talking to us.
Another time there was this person pretending to be a fox!, and they lived in the rouge area with a kit. They were so nice and even made the rp better (for me), but iv seen a lot of people get upset when someone is a non-cat. Id understand if the non-cat person was a luna stereotype or just trying to bother everyone and annoy everyone (iv seen a lot of that to), but that doesn't mean its ALL bad like in every fandom of sorts there will all ways be bad things or people. But it shouldn't ruin it for the people who do good as non cats!.
wait people have been harrassing you for having non cat ocs?
yeah, people do this CONSTANTLY. me and other noncat roleplayers alike are harassed constantly by anti-noncats
Its very common, sometimes even encouraged to harass people for ocs people deem cringe and unrealistic, i've heard alot of people talking about times where they've been harassed out of rps (i myself have had to leave a roleplay bc people were angry to the point of demoting my rabbit deputy over his species), its really unfortunate tbh
WOOO YEAH GO OFF SWAN!!!! YEAAHHHH WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO YEAHHHHHHHHH
Tbh I love the idea of a non-Cat warrior universe
it open much more horizon of idea :D
> just gonna say this, i'd love to rp with non-cats so long as we can agree upon a starting point to the rp// cause currently the constant sudden unprovoked attacks from dogs and foxes, and lunas[ they dont fit in any category rn] is what's causing a lot of the discourse. So for now i will not rp with a non-cat that suddenly walks into the med den, and i will tell them that so as to prevent a negative outburst from either of us, and they are free to rp however they like, i just dont want to be a part of it, cause that's just how i feel. That is not saying that i wouldnt try i just would need to set up an rp from the start to make it work out// like the badger and cat scenario in the books, or a squirrel/rat scenario that can communicate, but this is because im more into planned rps, and im not going to ask others to change their ocs to fit my preferences you're able to exist i will however for now not partake in the rps with such, till things either calm down, or i find the right server.
I once had a dream where Tigerclaw was a bunny named Terribleclaw and then Redtail acsadently killed him
The only time I've ever had a big enough problem to say something about someone playing a non-cat in a space where there (as far as I recall) weren't any rules against it was when someone was playing as a _full-on human with a sword_ in a discord server I roleplayed as a medicine cat on. Even then, I'm pretty sure that despite everyone mentioning their characters were cats every other sentence this person somehow never had caught on until I said something that the characters weren't humans. Unless actual problems are being caused, like you said, voiding is a thing. I don't enjoy lions or tigers in Warriors RPs- partially because I deeply enjoy the whole TigerClan, LeopardClan, and LionClan mythology thing- but if Sparkleblood the magical tiger that somehow fits in the domestic cat-sized dens isn't actually making it harder for everyone to RP then I just don't have to interact with them. If they're in some kind of role where I *would,* I can just leave the server or switch clans.
Man this makes me wanna remake my fox from the Beta.
Although I don’t roleplay with noncats nor would I see myself play as one either, I’m not gonna go out of my way to harass them because at the end of the day… they want to have fun, too. If I see noncat harassment, I report it cause they’re people behind a screen and shouldn’t go through that. It’s sad, I do want us to coexist and I hate how toxic “antis” can be.
i got harrassed and doxxed for roleplaying as my human oc sasuke uchiha (warrior name sasukeeyes) in ultimate edition and now my mom has banned me from playing roblox.
Oh God that is literally so awful. I'm so sorry that happened to you. You don't deserve something like that over some game.
Jesus Christ you got doxxed over this?! For playing as a human?!? Ok this has gone way too far! That must have been awful for you to experience, and I am so sorry that you went through it! It honestly makes me sick that this sort of harassment is able to run rampant in the game. Honestly I'm surprised this hasn't happened to me yet given I've played as a kit sized medicine rabbit multiple times (and I hope it never will). I just hope that who ever doxxed you was at least reprimanded in some way, and that you are doing ok now!
The most irritating part is when you're the leader of a clan and a non-cat tries to join or make a fuss when you've been established for nearly 3+ hours in the server. My character doesn't like noncats, and I personally do not roleplay with them. If I'm established for 3+ hours at that point and the noncat rper just joined and hasn't even established themselves as a character for more than 5 minutes, I can reasonably expect them to be okay with server hopping! I often politely, out of rp, warn them and say "I do not interact with noncats, and my character would not let you join even if I did."
But more often than not that ends up with them throwing a fit saying I should be allowing it because it's a public server; even though MY character would not allow it, I'm told to break my own immersion and my own characters reasoning for another person who cares little for MY roleplay. While this video points out that they shouldn't have to conform to my roleplay it completely misses the points where noncat players expect ME to change when I've done nothing wrong?
This video was made a while ago and I may have forgotten to include - you feel free to void anyone you don’t like or prefer to roleplay with. This includes noncats. They cannot force you to interact with them just as you cannot force them to leave. If a noncat tries to join inrp and you don’t want to allow it, that’s fine. If they casually join oorp, you can at most let them know you won’t be interacting with them. 👍
hey just to clarify, i do not hate on non-cats unless they really deserve it nor do i (usually) tell them to change to a cat oc. as someone who has several friends that do indeed play as non-cats, i have noticed that they are attacked but they themselves have seen people that are peacefully roleplaying as normal cats be attacked by non-cats for no reason and it has been happening repeatedly. yes, i do get that non-cats are defensive due to the fact they are constantly harrassed but it does hurt me to see people that are roleplaying as a cat be insulted and attacked because they mentioned *1* single thing about non-cats, sometimes it not even being that and them just saying "i-" that isn't directed to really anyone. they could be reacting to someone elses comment or such.
i'm going to state *my* opinions on some of the things that you state in this video and if you do read them in a passive aggressive tone, apologies as they did not mean to come off that way. (SOME WARRIORS SPOILERS WILL ALSO MENTIONED, be warned)
0:31 - for this, i'd like to say that people have made a fanmade title for it due to the fact that it is well.. clans that consist of only (as from what i know of) cats. there are mentions of non-cats invading clans and such, even a badger speaking to them from what i can remember but that's it. my opinion of non-cats being in the clan is.. sort of absurd as i try to keep my roleplays as realistic as can be in warrior cats logic. i've seen prey animals, predator animals, sometimes even foreign animals (ones from savannah that wouldn't even be able to live in forests) join a clan and i don't have a problem with it unless they're OP (such as a prey animal that's a herbivore literally *eat* meat and continue to live and not be malnourished or them being able to pierce a cats skin or a skin of an animal in general, a predator killing the cat in one fell swoop and still getting away with it if they are within the clan and have joined it) or make a huge problem. *apologies for going on a rant, maybe even going slightly off topic*
1:29 - when i mention something being realistic, i usually mention the fact that i want things to be as realistic as can be in warrior cats logic. it is possible to apply real life logic to warrior cats, as impossible as it sounds, as some of the things mentioned in warrior cats is semi-realistic. stone rock aside (as it is their way of "belief") and the fact they have some form of status within the clan, it does keep the realism of multiple cats only barely being able to kill a fox and even a whole clan unable to take down a couple dogs (referring to blue'stars death when she partly sacrificed herself to lead the dogs away from what i remember). there's also the fact of the tribe cats being scared of the mountain lion (which they called sharptooth(?) as they did not know what it was). all in all, it does keep some realistic aspects.
2:10 - as for this, it really shouldn't. the creators probably didn't intend for any of the OC's to be realistic as they added vibrant bluey and green colours so i do agree.
2:30 - now, that argument is sort of useless. especially the one where they say "just go play on a private server if you don't like public servers". which assumes that everyone has access to robux and private servers when they do not. i also do see quite a lot that people argue when a leader refuses to let a non-cat into the clan then that same non-cat brings the matters out of ooc and tries to make themselves at fault, when the leader simply just wants to have a clan that remains fully cats (no offense to non-cat clans, it's just irritating because they make quite a big deal over it)
3:23 - no one knows this for sure, so i say don't make an assumption on that. humans don't even know if each animal has its own language and even then, they wouldn't be able to completely match that other animals vocals to communicate.
3:46 - either way it would've turned hostile due to instincts, even if it did grow up in a peaceful nature instincts are always a thing and CANNOT be changed.
4:31 - they are being disruptive to your roleplay, though you can choose to ignore them or argue with them. i doubt you would be able to change their opinion which is why i rarely bother people who talk down upon non-cats unless they have a completely valid reason.
6:04 - no, it isn't. unless you mean strong prey warrior as in fully capable of killing a cat, as a prey cannot do that. even if they do learn how to, their teeth would not be able to pass through and fatally wound a cat (depending on the prey animal).
6:34 - as to this, a lot of the issues with powerplayers is that they mainly do come in the form of non-cats which have ruined their reputation. although some do take into consideration that not all non-cats are this way, multiple people don't and view non-cats this way due to their experience with them. i am not going against the reason that there are cats that are powerplayers because there are, but majority of powerplayers are non-cats.
6:53 - i'm sorry but they arent. that's also powerplaying if they do and abuse those powers on others. it ruins the roleplay entirely and makes it unfair to anyone who do actually want to roleplay with them. although voiding does work, it is still disruptive to the roleplay (especially if they begin to spam in team chat or purposely blocking chat boxes) and even if we are able to report them, not all of us have discord.
i'm sorry you received those messages (the ones at the end) as they are extremely hurtful
PREACH,, ACTUALLY PREACH. YOU ARE SO RIGHT BESTIE
this is so correct
Hello! I'm more than happy to provide responses to this, as I'm not too proud of how the video came out myself and I think I could've worded a lot of things better. I tend to excel way more in expressing myself through text than audio. Though I too apologize if I come off as passive-aggressive, or type too much.
1) Regardless of where the Warrior Cats title comes from, it is fanmade and not the actual title of the series. And my second point still stands as well; Warriors has never outright forbade noncats joining Clans (and in my realism point, has given hints that it's possible, like the cats asking Midnight the badger if she wanted to join their Clan), while the game Ultimate Edition has outright endorsed and accepted their existence. As for the animals that you've seen, that ties more into my realism point. As I've stated, neither real-life-realism or series-realism can really be applied well, and as long as the people you've mentioned are enjoying their OCs while not using the power unfairly on others, then there's not really much that can be done since they aren't doing any harm to others.
2) Actually, multiple cats having to kill one fox is not realistic at all. Foxes are about the same size as cats, if only slightly bigger, and have been known to run away from cats or not want to engage with them at all unless absolutely necessary. Badgers, too, are exaggerated in size and strength in the series. And even then, while I know Warriors has some realistic aspects of being afraid of animals, I've also mentioned that it shows at other times that cats are not afraid of certain animals once they get to know them (Hollyleaf raising the fox pup, everyone trusting Midnight the badger). So it is possible for noncats to be befriended, even if cats are initially afraid of them. The series' realism is extremely ambiguous.
3) (Addressing the 2:30 one) Private servers actually don't cost that much; only $5 per two months, or $2.50 per month. And even if someone still cannot afford that, it is possible to find hosts of private servers who are willing to open their private servers to you (the main examples being #looking-for-or-hosting-rp and #long-term-rp in the Discord, but I've also seen TikToks that offer private servers and seen people advertise the private servers in game). The thing about private servers is that you are basically paying to not put up with other peoples' bullshit in public servers, which I think is a completely fair trade-off. You are paying so you have complete control over your own roleplay, and if you cannot pay, then you either have to join someone else's controlled roleplay or just stick to public servers where you don't have any righteous control. It all makes sense to me. And the thing about the noncat not being let into the Clan is that - in-roleplay, I can understand the leader's side, but out-of-roleplay, the leader has zero power to enforce who can and cannot join, as long as - again - it's a public server. The leader only has power in-roleplay, but that doesn't mean they can control anything out-of-roleplay. I don't agree with people getting on someone's back for refusing to let a rogue of any species into the Clan in-roleplay, though. Because that's just the leader's character.
4) I do mean that the rat was able to learn cat language and Millie was able to learn dog. True, we don't know the full extent of how much they can or can't learn, but the base thing is that they can learn at all. And like you said, we can't make assumptions that it has any limits, since the series is, again, very ambiguous and hasn't addressed this topic often anyway. They've put no strict rules on it; all they've demonstrated is that it can happen.
5) Assuming it would've turned hostile to instincts is a bit of a stretch. We've seen instincts be overridden in the series when Midnight convinced a band of foxes to not eat the cats (intellect ruling over instincts), and even in real life, where animals of different species occasionally team up as hunting partners. The series is all over the place when it comes to instincts, and in the past, it's been overruled in place of intelligence. We don't have the capacity to assume either way or another, but the way Hollyleaf's relationship with the fox pup was going, it seemed possible it could've been friendly to cats. It did at least prove that cats can override instincts, by the mere fact that Hollyleaf took a shine to a fox.
6) Unfortunately when someone begins to talk poorly about noncats, it's not as easy to void as someone who's just being a noncat. Anti-noncats can rope others into the argument, they can convince the Clan to void you en masse, they can continue to bug you out of roleplay to make sure you can't roleplay at all. Plus, not all noncats are totally zen and unbotherable; there will always be many who cannot ignore the blatant harassment. People who harass others for existing will always be in the wrong, and it's not the harassee's fault for fighting back. Not saying that's what you implied, but I just wanted to make sure!
7 and 9) As has been said in the video, there is nothing wrong with existing with a lot of power. This is more so my opinion than a lot of other people's, but I've come to view powerplaying as unfairly exercising power over someone who has not consented to nor done anything to deserve it. Having a lot of power but not using it, or having a lot of power and only using it on people who explicitly consent to it being used, that cannot be labeled wrong because there is no one who is being harmed. In the former situation, they're not using their power to harm anybody, while in the latter, they're only using it on someone who is okay with it. I don't endorse at all people who exercise their power without permission. That's full and unabated powerplaying and it ruins and disrupts roleplay. But for people who exist with power or get permission to use that power, there is no immediate issue.
8) I guess that's just a difference in perspective, because if I had to roughly percentage things, most of the powerplayers I've met were rogue cats. And even if the majority were noncats, that doesn't justify any kind of assumption and harassment towards them (again, not saying you support this), which is what I wish more people would understand.
Thank you for thinking critically about my video. I absolutely hate certain parts of it and I definitely do better in text, so it allowed me to elaborate a little more on my points as well as think more about them in general.
You make some valid points in this comment, but I just wanna say this - I find it really puzzling when people say squirrels (or any rodent/smaller animal for that matter) cannot kill a cat because their claws are too small and/or not sharp enough. I find this argument funny because if we're going to speak realistically, cats can't either. Sure, they're sharp and could do some damage, but it is almost impossible for a cat to kill another cat with just their claws, as they are not sharp or powerful enough to slice deep enough through flesh for it to be fatal, as it is portrayed in the series (for example, slitting throats, Tigerstar's death). Besides it being unrealistic, most cats in the book series die by their throats being cut open by cat claws - Even Longtail was blinded by bunny claws, which only proves my point. Prey will fight back, and if someones rodent oc has the ability to slice someone up, I see no problem with that, especially if said oc is in the warriors universe.
@@digital430 Also; if we pull real life facts squirrels can, had have done real damage to cats in real life as they have sharp claws and sharp teeth; And to dig into the books; rats [a rodent ~around the size of squirrels ] have multiple kills in the books, along with stoats.
my only problem with other animals rp is that sometimes they force them self into clan rp’s by trying to get adopted which can be annoying, Which is why it’s always better to be an non-cat from the beginning of the rp because it makes it more likely people wouldn’t hate you for being annoying and please ask to join and try not to be weird about it
I agree with this, long as “please ask to join” means asking to join when one’s a rogue. Personally I like joining Clans off the bat and just insert myself in like any other cat, as leaders cannot control the Clan out-of-roleplay.
I agree with your Points!
I do have to say that If any of you wish to be a non cat please ask to be in a role-play or ask to attack someone (cause I see some non cats attack and interrupt role-play which is very rude to the role players) so that way it can be less chaotic and won’t get you into arguments
Personally I think as long as someone’s in a public server, they shouldn’t have to ask for permission to exist or to interact with others, especially if said noncat is in a Clan and just talking to Clanmates ^^ but yeah, anyone should respect it when they’re voided, as you can’t force someone to rp with you, and any good roleplayer will ask for perms before attacking people.
@@swanfeathertheelder definitely:)
I mean everyone has opinions, but why would you hack an account just because you don't agree? That's quiet, how do I say this...Unsmart? I find your idea highly amazing with your OC's. Nothing it wrong with being a noncat at all!
I kinda gave up playing the game from how TOXIC it is... I wish people just magically learned not to be rude to people and if you don't like them, just silently leave? I don't need your opinion flooding the chat, cause no one cares -_-
regarding the actual books and 'accuracy' to the books:
the intro to one of the books was written from a dog's point of view.. though it is somewhat viewed as being from a less intelligent's animal point of view, it's proof that dogs aren't that ignorant smart enough to easily be someone's character.
Next up is going to be some spoilers from the second series of books.
.......
Midnight the badger, is a badger that can speak many languages including rabbit, fox, cat and of course, badger. Even though (apparently) midnight is a ghost, she at one point negotiates with foxes on behalf of travelling cats.
The foxes behave the same as a clan of cats would and make a deal, that the cats would leave their forest (not the main forest, a separate one) before dusk or they would be chased out. This shows foxes also aren't THAT ignorant, just territorial just like cats were when they chased out a mother badger and her pups, badly injuring her.
Midnight also speaks to the badgers that originally inhabited the lake and said badgers plan a HUGE attack on thunderclan where dozens of badgers destroyed their camp and killed cats. This shows that even non-starclan following badgers are intelligent.
Midnight ALSO can speak to rabbits, it's not spoken about a lot but she mentions they're dumb, in spite of them being dumb they still have a language and speak to eachother!
And Millie, I haven't actually reached her part in the books but she's used a lot as an example of a cat that can speak dog, I'd appreciate if ppl didn't reply to debate/discuss her because I'm not sure about this one- as I haven't read about her. But if she does speak dog, it's proof a cat can also speak another animal's language, or atleast understand it.
And finally, in the first series the pack of dogs that tigerclaw send after thunderclan speak cat? Brightpaw or 'lostface 😒' mutters the words 'pack' and 'kill' over and over again, the words that fireheart also hears. It could be blamed on a prophecy or omen from starclan if brightpaw hadn't also heard this, somehow the dogs knew those words and spoke them in a way the cats could understand.
I do want to quickly add that thunderclan actually offered midnight the opportunity to join thunderclan, which proves that even the narrowminded clans would take in another animal if they knew the ways of the clans and respected it.
Even 12 books in there's a substantial amount of proof that in the events of a cat being raised by another animal or vice versa, it's easy to say they could get along.
FACTS!!!!
(I think what people mean by realism is that it's not quite realistic to the *books*)
I usually dont mind non cat roleplayers as long as they arent in a clan, because it makes no sense.. to me at least- and theres points where I draw the line like tigers or wolves or (no offence) squirrels being in clans. Like let's be honest, how has animal controll not noticed a tiger in the forest lol. Theres also the issue of non cats somehow knowing perfect cat language too, but your really able to spice up an rp by being like a fox, coyote, badger, ect.. as long as you play the animal right
I did address the “book realism” in the video, and my response basically boils down to
1) The books are wildly inconsistent and have plenty of things we shouldn’t have to follow (i.e. the rampant ableism)
2) There are parts supporting noncats (the rat speaking cat, Midnight the badger’s arc with her even being asked to join the Clan at one point, Millie speaking dog, etc)
You are free to have your own preferences and ideas about what is realistic and what isn’t, but pretending the books support those exact preferences is cherry-picking. It’s best to live and let live. Void the noncats you want instead of saying they shouldn’t be there at all. I enjoy being a noncat in Clans, and I’m sorry but I’m not going to stop.
I don’t have a big problem with non-cats, but if they’re major roles it makes no sense. Would starclan accept a squirrel as leader?
They’ve accepted me many times as squirrel leader in roleplay :) I think that, assuming StarClan is a good spirit-afterlife, they’d judge a leader by their capabilities and leadership skills, not their physical traits
random question but is there a non cats discord group? would love to join :3
Not particularly, but the Ultimate Edition Discord server is very friendly to noncats and there’s a lot of people with noncat OCs :D I recommend it!
bro i would freaking love a non cat discord group, if you find any PLEASE tell me :D
I don't really have an issue with predator animals, but prey animals would be weird for a clan to raise. They would just.. eat them. A fox is cool, a mouse is a meal.
I made an entire AMV with my squirrel OC, lol. You can come up with a justification for anything if you’re creative enough.
hi
Personally as someone obsessed with biology I.. naturally am uncomfortable with non-cat's inserting themselves into people's roleplays who are just.. trying to have a regular cat rp?? I mean, make your characters and be happy but for me if I see a fucking MURDER SQUIRREL I leave. I mean, c'mon. However, an opinion is an opinion and you are entitled to your own. ( It makes me kinda uncomfy to have to act like a squirrel isn't catfood. But that's just me.) My only problem with it is that I don't like when people as squirrels or mice or rabbits power play and act like they can beat a fucking cat.
..Honestly I think the people who HATE HATE on non-cat oc's are just salty that there's no good servers.
You’re fine with having your own preferences. As I said in the video, no one can or should force you to roleplay with someone you don’t like. Just as long as you live and let live, and let them have fun in their own way. Then everyone can win; even if it’s less than perfect, at least there’s no side that’s losing.
Squirrels taste good tho
acorn does not approve
@@uramania2978 I think you mean acorn DOES approve
@@thylacid hmm, depends, I means she DOES or did murder squirrels which are her own species but I don't think she's a cannibal LMAO but no, no I didnt
@@uramania2978 Acorntail does eat squirrels in her cannon.
@@uramania2978 she canonically eats squirrels and endorses cannibalism i know from experience
i feel like this would be a half decent video had it not been for the fact that half the arguments are regurgitated reflections of arguments in defense of actual marginalized ppl. not a noncat “anti” or whatever, but its just so weird to watch this and hear the sort of rhetoric that nearly makes it seem like y’all think ur oppressed for ur ocs.
in addition to that, a lot of this is just.. hypocritical? is it impossible to acknowledge the flaws within your own community without flipping it onto a different community? obviously, im not going to argue that “anti noncats” arent toxic. they are. ive seen that with my own two eyes, but the noncat community is toxic in its own right as well. literally have screenshots of ppl being harassed and sent death threats for not liking noncats IN character.
a lot of these arguments just flip the comment back onto the side of the person saying it, while also acting like its a 100% true representation OF that side of this “conflict.”
anyways, agree with the overall message, noncats are fine. but oh my god this couldve been done better
Gotta agree that a script could have cleared up this video. This is not my proudest work for sure; I basically had a document of bullet points to touch on, and rambled on them with no guidance. If it sounds like I think noncats are some marginalized minority on par with actual real-life scenarios, that’s embarrassing as fuck for me, because a collection of pixels on a screen cannot and will not ever be more important than real discriminated and oppressed people. That wasn’t my intention in the slightest.
Can definitely agree with toxicity in the noncat community. I said so in my video; I just didn’t touch on it a lot because it wasn’t a main topic, but expanding on it would definitely have helped. Especially since I’ve seen that harassment increase since the making of this video. Do know that I never condone harassment, and always encourage people to make a report on #game-reports in the UED if it happens to them; I don’t give a shit who’s harassing them - noncats, anti-noncats, specs, a goddamn rock. Harassment is harassment, and objectively bad.
I still stand by the fact that more people in general need to learn how to just politely ignore each other or server hop. If it’s not a private server, no one has the right to encroach upon another’s roleplay (as long as it isn’t breaking rules, etc etc). Because the culture of this particular community is so shit at realizing that that’s always the best option. Will still agree with you to the moon and back that I could have structured this video better. Guess that’s what happens when you make opinion videos as a young’un 😭
The one who was harrashing you was literally acting like aquamarine from Steven universe💀