The first time I went to Sydney at age 6½, I was amazed that the trains went everywhere with the doors open. None of the trains in Brisbane at the time were electric, but we had old wooden compartment coaches with swing doors, or stainless steel SX sets with power closing sliding doors, and no train in Brisbane left a platform with a door open (intentionally, at least).
Back then we all travelled along with the doors wide open. You would stand with your sholders between the hand rails,relax and speed along without a worry in the world. occasionally you swung half your body out to see whats going on. As the train slowed at your destination, if you felt like it, you would jump off at the speed you felt safe at. Running for a train was fun too,if you were quick enough to jump on,good luck to you! HA HA!!...no wander they were banned.
I saw on the news a kid got collected by a staunchion doing chin ups near the open doors in the 1990s or late 1980s. It really was crazy they still ran trains with open doors in that period.
I remember catching them when I was really young maybe 3 or 4 years old and the new Tangara trains would go past and The Red Rattler would sway back and forth.
I used to go to and from school in Red rattlers, They stopped em when I got to about Year 9, I remember everyone was spewing. We loved em, Sure they were dangerous to morons but hey if you wanna stick your body out of a moving train and expect not to get hit by a pole or lose your balance thats your fault. They were the type of trains you didnt have to keep quiet in em. The train made that much noise that you'd have to shout for the other to hear you. lol
I use to catch the red rattlers in 1987 from Lidcombe to Central for my tafe coarse, they were a mix of the single deck and double deck carriages, loved the sound of them. It was funny how people would be standing near the open doors when the thing was doing about 60 k's an hour
The 1964 Tulloch double-deck trailer carriages that went with the red-rattler power carriages were not all withdrawn from service until 2004. These had powered doors which closed before the train left the platform, so were a lot safer than the single-deck carriages, but they were also a reminder of the old days. The one that ended up at Dorrigo turned out to be the carriage that was on my regular afternoon school train!
I remember riding on the red rattlers as a kid and into my teenage years. It was fun but in hindsight, not particularly safe. You could open the carriage doors whilst it was moving and literally hang out of the train. Not surprising why there were a number of injuries and fatalities. With the introduction of the Tangara trains in the early 1990's, it was the end of the line for good old Red......
Yeah was really glad to see the last of those trains. As a kid back in the 70s I was pushed off one while it was moving at a fair speed and found myself in hospital in a pretty bad way. Even now days I’m not a big fan of trains but saying that it’s incredible how much safety has improved like the trains themselves.
I remember getting on these trains as a young school student going into the city on school excursions. When we got near Redfern station the train would go underground into the tunnels and it was always pitch black in the carriage in between stations as there was no interior lights (or if there was interior lights they never worked).
If any of you collect model trains, you may be interested to know you can now buy working models of these from Berg's in Parramatta or at the railway store at Central station. Got my own 4-car set, applied the decals just recently and it looks a treat!
While you're at Parramatta, go a bit further along the walkway to a pleasant coffee shop which has an excellent view of St John's Church and surrounding parks. Inside St John's is a huge memorial to one of the Macarthur family from Camden Park.
It'll be such a shame to lose the R, L, S, K, C, [ I think I've covered them :p] sets soon. They have such character, and they feel and look like trains!
Cool been looking for a set for age's and you've answered my question where to get them roughly how much are they, As I hear all these classic stories about them but am to young to remember them (I'm 22) the oldest I can remember is the suburban and intercity and tangara, Cheers Adam
The good old days. I remember as a young kid growing up on the East Hills line holding onto the brass poles hanging out the doors in peak hour getting hit by trees 🤣
Scraped!! I sure hope they kept some as museum pieces!! I was very young when the red rattlers were at their hight, barely remember them. I remember the big silver 3 deckers?, rode on a few of them back in the day. Live in Brisbane now and rail travel is very different to the old days of Sydney trains.
Mum broke her leg when she got on these during an afternoon rush hour. She got partially pushed out of the unclosed doors and her leg got caught in the gap between the platform and the train whilst it accelerated. Wow, that was a fairly long time ago...
True, sorry at the time of the posting I think it was unclear which sets were going. Still I believe the K, and C sets only have a number of years before they too will be retired.
Its funny you should say that, since these cars don't have hydraulics. They do have pneumatics though. I assume you may have been referring to a W set with an auto door which failed.
It's amazing the things people will say when they are the centre of attention like this. So, Gary's father was a train driver with the NSWGR, he was not a guest of the NSW government at the opening ceremony. The official train made two return trips from Wynyard to North Sydney in the period from 12:30 to 1PM. De Groot's misguided stunt occurred well before this and it was not visible from the railway regardless. What Gary's father would have seen briefly on the second trip over, as his train descended in to Milson's Point, were the many school children leading the long foot procession back up along the northern approach. THIS coincidence was caught on film. in fact, of all the events on the bridge on opening day, the presence of the official train is probably the least recognised and recorded. Making wild claims in front of TV cameras doesn't help to put history in to perspective.
I have never been on one but they are a truley magnificant piece of machinery, funny enough you can buy old carragies ie the tangara and chuck it on a block of land pending council aproval (enquired about it thinking about converting one into a mini house / flat for my self) but I say bring back the Rattler's for today (made out of modern matiriels but the same classic design and closeable doors)
I dont know who the driver of that last run over the Harbor Bridge was, but I am sure the Guards name was David Kay. Of Sydney Depot. Like the old train he is now also gone .
If you traveled in these on weekends from about ‘77-81, you wouldn’t be aware that the train driver was between 9-13 years old. As a boy I was a hyperactive little shit. So much so that my train driving Dad would take me to work with him (to save my mothers sanity). Now you may say how irresponsible it was of the old man. But things were different back then. He told you how to do things and when to do them and you bloody well did them.He eased me in from being allowed to blow the horn when we left the station, to being the brakes only boy (oh god I can smell that beautiful smell of asbestos brakes now!). Then elevated to the gears (took me a while to concentrate fully otherwise the dead-mans handle would kick in, and he’d kick me out, and I’d have to sit on the spare seat). I hated it when another driver would come in to ride passenger back to his depot. There were a cpl places I wasn’t allowed to drive. Always coming into Central, especially 16 platform where all the bosses were in the office at the end. There were a cpl bridges an various spots where he’d shout "duck ya head". These were the train fanatics as he called them. Their hobby was photographing trains. Which I found weird at the time. But he was adamant that other drivers sons had been photographed driving trains, and had nearly lost their jobs.To this day I don’t know if he was telling the truth or he just liked to keep me on my toes. I like to think I was a pretty good driver in the end. But I had a great teacher. Driving the "red rattlers" are some of the best memories I have of me and my Dad.❤️
I've heard of bus driver's sons moving buses in the depot! My dad who was a taxi driver would give me a steer of the HZ Holden cab in the dead end street we lived at. I remember it was hard for an 8 year old me! Great story BTW!
The term red rattler was I think invented by Melbourne Sun Newspaper columnist Keith Dunstan around 1965 to disparage Melbourne's red Tait and dogbox electric trains. Most pre 1920. Some comments here that the term was unknown in Sydney at least in the pre 62 experience of one. So when did it start getting used for the brown Sydney trains? I searched Trove for references, but Trove Peter's out in the early sixties, but no usage I could find. Would love a researcher to be definitive about the first usage of the term red rattler.
Speaking from general experience of the era, the term "Red Rattler" was used mainly in the media in the late '80s in Sydney to describe these trains. However unlike in Melbourne, the name really didn't catch on and was variously used by less than 20% of the travelling public as a result. They were known in most circles simply as "Red Sets". It was only in the early 90's as they were retired, that the term "Red Rattler" entered the vernacular in Sydney, such was it's repeated use in the media.
Best trains in nsw, HA!...... they were cold, noisy, badly lit on the city circle...when the lights worked ! and there was always at least one of the light covers that would just swing on it's hinges or a back rest that wouldnt flip over, or they would stop between stations and just make a ticking noise. Or the doors that wouldnt stay closed (or open) I miss those temperamental old bastards ! LOL
The reason why these were retired? Because of the introduction of the Tangara only four years earlier, and they were progressively taking over the Red Rattlers' roles.
Seriously I dont remember them (not long turnt 23) the earliest I can remember are the Tulloch carraige's but more or less remember the introduction of the Tangara's in 88. Knowing me I have been on one but forgot about it
ah, so it took 60 years and multiple fatal accidents for them to retire. And now the somewhat recently renovated and reliable 40yo v-sets are all being scrapped. aiya
My last memory of the "Red Rattler" was @ Parramatta station, a woman was running to jump on, she missed and fell between the platform and train. NOT a pretty sight, saw the whole thing, she spun around like a windmill, two broken legs, fractured pelvis and two broken arms. Went straight over to Dories pub and had a double brandy.
Please don't call them "Red Rattlers". That is a MELBOURNE expression that seems to have crept into Sydney after the event. They were never called that in Sydney when they were active. I'm old enough (76) to remember.
they should keep one of each generation of trains going, just so people can remember and appreciate the past.
I'm perfectly happy to be fully rid of the s-set tbh
Like 1 service of the old trains each Sunday or something
that's exactly why they keep 'a select few'
They do keep a few.
Same with the old Sydney busses.
i loved them.the most comfy seats ever
The first time I went to Sydney at age 6½, I was amazed that the trains went everywhere with the doors open. None of the trains in Brisbane at the time were electric, but we had old wooden compartment coaches with swing doors, or stainless steel SX sets with power closing sliding doors, and no train in Brisbane left a platform with a door open (intentionally, at least).
Doors open in Melbourne too, even for Gregory Peck in On the Beach arriving in Frankston.
Back then we all travelled along with the doors wide open. You would stand with your sholders between the hand rails,relax and speed along without a worry in the world. occasionally you swung half your body out to see whats going on.
As the train slowed at your destination, if you felt like it, you would jump off at the speed you felt safe at. Running for a train was fun too,if you were quick enough to jump on,good luck to you! HA HA!!...no wander they were banned.
yeah because people were starting to get too silly for their own good. stuff would never be a thing now. and again, no wonder.
I love the smell of asbestos train brakes in the morning, that smell i will never forget. I do miss the Reds, alot of memories as a kid.
I saw on the news a kid got collected by a staunchion doing chin ups near the open doors in the 1990s or late 1980s.
It really was crazy they still ran trains with open doors in that period.
I remember catching them when I was really young maybe 3 or 4 years old and the new Tangara trains would go past and The Red Rattler would sway back and forth.
I will be very sad when the V sets are scrapped. Such well built, quiet and reliable trains.
Some V sets make a similar sound to the 7000 series red suburban sets.
To which I'd add comfortable, both in ride and seating
They were the best trains and that train smell !!!!
I think that was the asbestos in the brake shoes
@@rods6405 😳
I remember the drunks who would stand at the open door with a longneck in hand lol..
I used to go to and from school in Red rattlers, They stopped em when I got to about Year 9, I remember everyone was spewing. We loved em, Sure they were dangerous to morons but hey if you wanna stick your body out of a moving train and expect not to get hit by a pole or lose your balance thats your fault. They were the type of trains you didnt have to keep quiet in em. The train made that much noise that you'd have to shout for the other to hear you. lol
The Rattlers weren't dangerous...people are! (Shoulda upgraded 'em.)
They weren't even a question of danger. It was called "natural selection taking care of itself".
So much for OH&S overkill these days.
What if your blind
@@yes1574 well you should not drink so much!
I use to catch the red rattlers in 1987 from Lidcombe to Central for my tafe coarse, they were a mix of the single deck and double deck carriages, loved the sound of them. It was funny how people would be standing near the open doors when the thing was doing about 60 k's an hour
The 1964 Tulloch double-deck trailer carriages that went with the red-rattler power carriages were not all withdrawn from service until 2004. These had powered doors which closed before the train left the platform, so were a lot safer than the single-deck carriages, but they were also a reminder of the old days. The one that ended up at Dorrigo turned out to be the carriage that was on my regular afternoon school train!
I heard that 40 had powers doors and the other 80 didn’t
All very interesting. I traveled to school and university by train1954-62 and never heard the expression "red rattler".
I thought it was a Melbourne term
I think invented by Sun Newspaper columnist Keith Dunstan around 1965. So when did it start getting used for the brown Sydney trains?
Love seeing Katrina Lee
I remember riding on the red rattlers as a kid and into my teenage years. It was fun but in hindsight, not particularly safe. You could open the carriage doors whilst it was moving and literally hang out of the train. Not surprising why there were a number of injuries and fatalities.
With the introduction of the Tangara trains in the early 1990's, it was the end of the line for good old Red......
good on a hot day just open the window or door.i used them when i was living there 1974 1980.
I rode a three car set on the Sandown line in 1990. So glad I decided to explore it.
Loved standing near those open doors
Yeah was really glad to see the last of those trains. As a kid back in the 70s I was pushed off one while it was moving at a fair speed and found myself in hospital in a pretty bad way. Even now days I’m not a big fan of trains but saying that it’s incredible how much safety has improved like the trains themselves.
I remember getting on these trains as a young school student going into the city on school excursions. When we got near Redfern station the train would go underground into the tunnels and it was always pitch black in the carriage in between stations as there was no interior lights (or if there was interior lights they never worked).
They should have just put automatic doors on them! LOL! They took away something that could have been as iconic as Melbourne's old trams
I'm glad that I had the honor to ride one
From the reds’ to the new Metro..
30yrs ago now, gee time flies!
@gmspeedfreak I love Tangara's, but nothing beats the good old train's
If any of you collect model trains, you may be interested to know you can now buy working models of these from Berg's in Parramatta or at the railway store at Central station.
Got my own 4-car set, applied the decals just recently and it looks a treat!
While you're at Parramatta, go a bit further along the walkway to a pleasant coffee shop which has an excellent view of St John's Church and surrounding parks. Inside St John's is a huge memorial to one of the Macarthur family from Camden Park.
It'll be such a shame to lose the R, L, S, K, C, [ I think I've covered them :p] sets soon.
They have such character, and they feel and look like trains!
2024, R, L, S, C set are now gone
The trains did not get dangerous people just got stupid and proceded to do dangerous things on them.
Awesome!
Cool been looking for a set for age's and you've answered my question where to get them roughly how much are they, As I hear all these classic stories about them but am to young to remember them (I'm 22) the oldest I can remember is the suburban and intercity and tangara,
Cheers Adam
This is great. Thank you.
even this upload itself is vintage now. later 2007...
The good old days. I remember as a young kid growing up on the East Hills line holding onto the brass poles hanging out the doors in peak hour getting hit by trees 🤣
Scraped!! I sure hope they kept some as museum pieces!!
I was very young when the red rattlers were at their hight, barely remember them. I remember the big silver 3 deckers?, rode on a few of them back in the day.
Live in Brisbane now and rail travel is very different to the old days of Sydney trains.
They were double deckers not three deckers and there are some still around
i hope not. just a couple of weeks ago i went on a k set. very clean, very fast and very well maintained.
Scrapping working public transport is wild
Mum broke her leg when she got on these during an afternoon rush hour. She got partially pushed out of the unclosed doors and her leg got caught in the gap between the platform and the train whilst it accelerated.
Wow, that was a fairly long time ago...
What!
I feel so sorry for her.
I hope she is ok...
my dad crushed one of his finger bones luckily he went to hospital and had the bone remove and replaced it for a new bone.
But yeah I'm so sad from hearing that.
Never had the honour of riding one of these :(
there's 3 at thirlmere museum, SETS has 8 im pretty sure, double deck and single decks..
and most are scattered around the country
Finally, Something about red rattlers
I'm only 2 years older than you but I remember them well. I picked my set up for $550 (4 car set).
True, sorry at the time of the posting I think it was unclear which sets were going.
Still I believe the K, and C sets only have a number of years before they too will be retired.
Its funny you should say that, since these cars don't have hydraulics. They do have pneumatics though. I assume you may have been referring to a W set with an auto door which failed.
Good to hear that one will be back for the sydney great train expo 2015.
I remember those things. Sometimes the doors didn't close at all and the entire train journey would be doors open.
It's amazing the things people will say when they are the centre of attention like this. So, Gary's father was a train driver with the NSWGR, he was not a guest of the NSW government at the opening ceremony. The official train made two return trips from Wynyard to North Sydney in the period from 12:30 to 1PM. De Groot's misguided stunt occurred well before this and it was not visible from the railway regardless. What Gary's father would have seen briefly on the second trip over, as his train descended in to Milson's Point, were the many school children leading the long foot procession back up along the northern approach. THIS coincidence was caught on film. in fact, of all the events on the bridge on opening day, the presence of the official train is probably the least recognised and recorded. Making wild claims in front of TV cameras doesn't help to put history in to perspective.
I have never been on one but they are a truley magnificant piece of machinery, funny enough you can buy old carragies ie the tangara and chuck it on a block of land pending council aproval (enquired about it thinking about converting one into a mini house / flat for my self) but I say bring back the Rattler's for today (made out of modern matiriels but the same classic design and closeable doors)
I dont know who the driver of that last run over the Harbor Bridge was, but I am sure the Guards name was David Kay. Of Sydney Depot. Like the old train he is now also gone .
If you traveled in these on weekends from about ‘77-81, you wouldn’t be aware that the train driver was between 9-13 years old. As a boy I was a hyperactive little shit. So much so that my train driving Dad would take me to work with him (to save my mothers sanity). Now you may say how irresponsible it was of the old man. But things were different back then. He told you how to do things and when to do them and you bloody well did them.He eased me in from being allowed to blow the horn when we left the station, to being the brakes only boy (oh god I can smell that beautiful smell of asbestos brakes now!). Then elevated to the gears (took me a while to concentrate fully otherwise the dead-mans handle would kick in, and he’d kick me out, and I’d have to sit on the spare seat). I hated it when another driver would come in to ride passenger back to his depot.
There were a cpl places I wasn’t allowed to drive. Always coming into Central, especially 16 platform where all the bosses were in the office at the end. There were a cpl bridges an various spots where he’d shout "duck ya head". These were the train fanatics as he called them. Their hobby was photographing trains. Which I found weird at the time. But he was adamant that other drivers sons had been photographed driving trains, and had nearly lost their jobs.To this day I don’t know if he was telling the truth or he just liked to keep me on my toes.
I like to think I was a pretty good driver in the end. But I had a great teacher. Driving the "red rattlers" are some of the best memories I have of me and my Dad.❤️
Same thing was happening on the ferries lol
I've heard of bus driver's sons moving buses in the depot!
My dad who was a taxi driver would give me a steer of the HZ Holden cab in the dead end street we lived at. I remember it was hard for an 8 year old me!
Great story BTW!
@@jamesfrench7299 Thanks. The mighty HZ. No power steering back then. You must’ve had huge forearms as an 8 year old.👍
The term red rattler was I think invented by Melbourne Sun Newspaper columnist Keith Dunstan around 1965 to disparage Melbourne's red Tait and dogbox electric trains. Most pre 1920.
Some comments here that the term was unknown in Sydney at least in the pre 62 experience of one.
So when did it start getting used for the brown Sydney trains?
I searched Trove for references, but Trove Peter's out in the early sixties, but no usage I could find.
Would love a researcher to be definitive about the first usage of the term red rattler.
Speaking from general experience of the era, the term "Red Rattler" was used mainly in the media in the late '80s in Sydney to describe these trains. However unlike in Melbourne, the name really didn't catch on and was variously used by less than 20% of the travelling public as a result. They were known in most circles simply as "Red Sets". It was only in the early 90's as they were retired, that the term "Red Rattler" entered the vernacular in Sydney, such was it's repeated use in the media.
@MrChowTheTroll: I actually did! It was between St. James & Museum. In 1972!
truly a historic date wen they went
The best train in nsw
Best trains in nsw, HA!...... they were cold, noisy, badly lit on the city circle...when the lights worked ! and there was always at least one of the light covers that would just swing on it's hinges or a back rest that wouldnt flip over, or they would stop between stations and just make a ticking noise.
Or the doors that wouldnt stay closed (or open) I miss those temperamental old bastards !
LOL
I wish they kept all of the K sets,C sets, S sets, V sets H sets M sets and red rattlers all in normal public service
The reason why these were retired? Because of the introduction of the Tangara only four years earlier, and they were progressively taking over the Red Rattlers' roles.
actually, only the L, R and S sets will be scrapped. The K and C sets vill stay in service.
They actually sold most of the carriages to private buyers for as sheds, motel rooms, etc.
Wasnt a modified red rattler used in the movie "the matrix"?
I was born in 1989 and can’t remember these, I’m honestly curious if I ever rode on one
Well they got decommissioned very early into the 90s, if you did, your parents probably were the ones with you
The world if the reds, Silver sets and T sets were still around, without a A, D, or B set:
*A M A Z I N G W O R L D*
Crappy inefficient Sydney with a horrible transport system
@@yes1574 But the trainspotters would be happy
@@yes1574 And also, I think you just got whoooosh ed
@@doohickey-enjoyerwhat about the people catching the trains
@@yes1574 *_f u n_*
were there also called h sets
Remember hanging out the open doors having a smoke.
my left ear enjoyed this
yeah.. where are the rattlers now?? pretty sure most people just used to jump from one train to the other..
Do you know where most of these rattler carriages are left? Like in a museum?
Pennsy MP-54 MU's were also called "Red Rattlers" as well, or just "Reds."
Seriously I dont remember them (not long turnt 23) the earliest I can remember are the Tulloch carraige's but more or less remember the introduction of the Tangara's in 88. Knowing me I have been on one but forgot about it
7 news? He says at the end "10 eye witness news."
ah, so it took 60 years and multiple fatal accidents for them to retire. And now the somewhat recently renovated and reliable 40yo v-sets are all being scrapped. aiya
My dad rode in them in Sydney
there actually is a lot of them left
My last memory of the "Red Rattler" was @ Parramatta station, a woman was running to jump on, she missed and fell between the platform and train.
NOT a pretty sight, saw the whole thing, she spun around like a windmill, two broken legs, fractured pelvis and two broken arms.
Went straight over to Dories pub and had a double brandy.
Nothing wrong with the old red rattlers.
Please don't call them "Red Rattlers". That is a MELBOURNE expression that seems to have crept into Sydney after the event. They were never called that in Sydney when they were active. I'm old enough (76) to remember.
it must be the B-sets
Shame it’s over really!
They were hot in the summer days
true
You wont see them Tangaras lasting 60 years like these ol rattlers did. :)
I can remember these old red rattlers when we used them going to school or work.
I would have peed out the doorway
When the red rattlers are added in Roblox rails unlimited
Me: Ima keep doors open like in real life and dump everyone out
They were great. You could smoke on them.
Victor Harbor
They had the best toilets with a view...
cool
Are these "red rattlers" like the "L" in Chicago?
They should be auctioned off for people to have in their home as our if they like them in the garden and their entertainment area
Old red rattler are the best of the world better and new shit one today there never broker down till 1993
The smell of asbestos brakes and cigarette smoke.... oh yes they were the good old days😆
“they deserve a retirement” They need a retirement!