I follow a lot of .... words? .... intellectual/philosophers ... people who reflect on the nature of our modern world with a different point of vue. JP is the ONLY one I intend to support, even though this religion-angle is necessarily biased. Bias does not mean wrong, and the symbolic study is SO precious!
I subbed to Patreon just for this video. Now it's free! I bet I would have plenty of other patron only content to enjoy but I'm listening to Laurus on audible now. An embarrassment of riches
Perhaps also fitting to that thought: within the tridentine rite the gospel is read northwards so that the lands not (yet) illuminated by the Light of +Christ shines within the darkness.
@6meegz I found a circle with a star inside outside my back door, in a concealed spot. Sort of etched into cement ground. Not sure what to make of it. How do I know if it's inverted? Edit: on a wall, window or in a book I can see being able to tell which edge is UP. But on the ground? Hmmm. Oh!! Would it be direction? If one point of the star points north?
Yes! Chris is truly stronger than all of this, he is the "fulfillment of the law". The symbol for Israel is the Star of David. I have heard that the source of this symbol is from the old testament tabernacle, that the elements of blood from the sacrifice, fire from the heavens that consumed it when it would be acceptable to God, and then water from the lavar that the priest would essentially baptize themselves in would form the first triangle (could also be the formation of our three primary colors - blood=red, water=blue, fire=yellow). The second triangle is formed from the candlesticks (with 66 bowls, knops and flowers - 22 of each - also representing the Light of the world, the Bible, knowledge of God, etc), the alter of incense, and the table of shewbread... and ultimately, Jesus fulfilled what God laid out as a symbolic pattern of worship and spiritual growth toward God in the old testament. I could go on, however, if there is already a video I would love to hear an additional take from Jonathan Pageau... I love this type of content.
To offer an alternate explanation, the four lower points represent the four elements, earth air fire and water, while the upper point represents spirit. The inverted pentagram was considered a symbol of evil because it placed the four lower elements above the element of spirit, representing valuing the material world, the intellectual world, the sensual world, or the emotional world above the spiritual world.
@@user-wp3tr3ns4l yes. Like they don't just have Year of the dragon. It's year of the metal dragon or water pig or whatever, ,based on the year and stuff. Plus they give weight to blood types as well, which also affects a personality
The pentagram is a symbolic representation of the golden ratio. If you take the longer and shorter lines it equals thirds. It was used by Pythagoreans.
First, a Pentagram is a star alone, the Pentacle is the star with a circle around it. Both symbols predate Christianity by thousands of years, it is in fact the oldest symbol of worship on earth. It was first stated to be evil in 1855 when a Catholic church leader was kicked out of the church and wrote a book on magic. For nearly 600 years prior this symbol was a symbol used by the Catholic church. Its primary linkage to evil was in the mid-60s when the atheistic group called "the Church of Satan" took an inverted Pentacleas their official symbol.
Exactly! Old Christian churches in Europe have "inverted" pentacles and pentagrams, as do some Mormon temples. It was considered a symbol of Venus, "The Morning Star" - a name given to Jesus in the Bible. As you say, in popular American culture it wasn't considered "evil" until LaVey used it for the "Church of Satan." Movie makers and rock/metal bands grabbed onto that and made that (and the inverted cross) part of popular culture, cementing the idea that those are inherently evil symbols...
This made me think about the inverted hermeneutic of the creation account employed by gnostics, in which they view the serpent as a liberating figure from a tyrannical God who has entrapped and enslaved mankind. What I find to be a fascinating consistency with the Devil is that he can not create. He can only corrupt and pervert what God has created. This whole idea of the upside-down/ backwards/ inverted/ opposite in relation to Satanism is seemingly a bottomless rabbit hole.
I really like your videos Jonathan, I want to thank you for sharing your wisdom with us. You and Jordan Peterson have rescued me from my reductionist atheism.
I really love how you dedramarize this tvings, presenting simpel fact, without any dwelling or drama in it. Without most of the dark apokalyptic scenario we usually see, and even bring out Hope from it. Thank You for that.
The five points of the pentagram also form the head, two arms and two legs on Da Vinci's Vituvian Man. If it is right-side up, the head is on top, indicating that is what is ruling. If it is upside down, what organ is doing the ruling?
@@Nekrumorfiini1 bla bla symbol of peace or whatever, primitive way of drawing the sun bla bla. I was trying to make a point about symbolism and association but yes, let’s derail this entirely
All the introduction is also an explanation of the Mesoamerican symbol commonly called the "quincunx", which also appears as a flower with four petals and repeats itself further in the "volador" dance or dance of the flyers. This is awesome, great explanation, thanks.
Propaganda is effective. Constant repetition of "our democracy...our democracy...our democracy..." never "our republic" because of what that would entail.
Yeah, basically, what is more believable? That there is God, and we were created by Him - or that life just happen to "occur" on its own? But, somehow, by atheist logic, it is we who have to prove something.
@@jhoughjr1 Only you can't explain how, and won't be able to. Imagine someone saying to you: "If you believe in God, it's pretty obvious that we were created." You don't understand that you are saying the same thing. If something has a chance of happening of 1 in a googolplex, and people think that is what really happened, you can only call that - faith.
the inverted pentagram is an ancient symbol that was often used by the Sumerians to denote their "shining ones" who were to my understanding their gods. A inverted pentagram symbolizes lucifer after his fall from heaven and him becoming satan. A upright pentagram symbolizes luficer before the fall (in my opinion)
Why we suffer by the billions then die a ugly dried up smelly stinking death as old and rot. Stinks and wonder why we deserve such none fathomable make of Control over us forced to be human with a spirit it say's most likley to be doomed. then gives us no benifit of the dougt. pray for somthing that promissed to answer does not. may be some kind we think came from our own conscience.
St. Peter, the head of the Church, asked to be crucified upside down, and was, deeming himself unworthy to be crucifies as Christ was. In addition to that explicit symbolism, does it have other meanings?
HEY, you can use the symphonic recording again? Cool! I really like your friends' small ensemble renditions (even the heavy metal one) but the original remains powerful!
As someone knowledgeable of symbology enough. I share no concern for inverted crosses or standard Pythagorean Pentagrams. I'm concerned with their users and them simply being pretentious, AND them simply ignoring the importance of symbols withheld. St. Peter's Cross (the inverted cross) is a Christian symbol of such superiority, that it's disappointing to see its misuse.
You mention that your knowledgeable on symbology, recently I've gotten interested in the topic and am looking for books to read. So I guess that's my question, what books do you suggest I look into so I can learn about the subject?
St Peter asked for permission to be crucified upside down, as didnt think of himself as worthy of being crucified like Jesus. So sure thing, they dont think of them selfes as worthy of Jesus Christ. Ironic when you mentioned this.
I saw Dune the other day, I realised it can never be a truly satisfying/wholesome experience and Tolkien was right in disliking it. Dune is an inverted pentagram, It doesn't have a redemption story arc. But being a child of the 90s and ex-goth it is still a guilty pleasure.
Dune is phenomenal. I haven't seen the new film yet(American here) but the religious themes and sex/gender images are powerful. The conslusion of Herbert's Dune is a story about Chani as much as Paul. Paul exists in relationship to Chani. The old movie got it exactly, completely wrong in it's apotheotic moment.
When taken as a whole it could maybe be a redemption story, not of a single character, as Paul is not a hero in the first books, but of humanity. Great books! A warning about the cult of personality.
The lines of the pentagram follow the golden rule (phi) and harmonic scales in music. Also the alignment-points between earth and venus form a pentagram. So it's highly associated with beauty and balance.
The Crucifixion itself even has pentagram imagery. The four nail-scars presented on Jesus’ hands and feet, all coming into the one scar located at His side😯☦️
If you look at the pentagram, inside of it is a pentagon, in which if you unite the dots will became an inverted pentagram, if you unite the dots of the pentagon inside the inverted one you will get an upside pentagram again, so is fractal that goes on forever. This makes me think about, especially that the Tao of Yin Yang represents something like this. The Father is a representation of masculine carrying the seed, so I guess it should come first, but once the seed gets into the womb (which I guess you could say it comes second) the child arises. So the two become one again. I had a moment once when I've felt like I was in my mother's womb, something similar, air became like fluid to me and it was so peaceful and I thought then, that we are still inside of a womb now, all of us, waiting to be born as one. Maybe it will be on a higher dimension, and the trinity will be like a shadow, the same way the shadow is the only true 2 dimensionality we have here. For me, this is such a beautiful way to visualize infinity...
Did anyone else notice that in each star's middle lies a pentagon? The "white magic" star has a pentagon pointing down & the "black magic" star has one pointing up. Reminds me of the dots in the ying yang symbol.
Love this, but it got me thinking: could an inverted pentagram, when stripped off of its Satanic connotations, ever describe a just struggle against (devilish) tyranny? I say this because I heard Jonathan speak of how an inverted pentagram is the symbol of defiance of something which is above oneself. And of course, in relation to our times, I'm sure many of us have felt out of place even for things as simple as telling the truth or defending all stages and forms of human life. Would that mean we stand closer to the inverted pentagram rather than the straight pentagram in those ocasions? Thank you.
Symbols are ultimately what you make them. Some ‘edgy’ goths and satanists like to wear upside down crosses as a sign of them mocking Christianity, however in Orthodox and Catholic traditions the upside down cross is a symbol of Saint Peter (he was crucified upside down in his martyrdom) so you will see Catholic Christians wearing an upside down cross in memory of Peter’s sacrifice for the early church.
@@EmilyMottesheard That makes sense. I had read a bit about St. Peter's Cross as well, I feel that one's an even more blatant subversion of an otherwise benign symbol.
Peter cut the ear off a soldier who came to arrest Christ and was reminded that He did not come to lead a rebellion. No, the temptation to fight fire with fire must never be succumbed to. Instead we must wait for a miracle at times, to not defeat our enemies but overcome them, which you do with love, patience, long-suffering, and truth. This is the value of symbols like this: they act as what we would call "accountability partners" or "rules of thumb" or "role models". When you see how much you align with the point at the bottom, you know you aren't oriented rightly, even though it seems right at the time. There is a way that seems right to a man, but it's end is destruction. Keep your point up.
Telling the truth and fighting for the lives of others are things that are above you. They are values, ideals that many must work towards to create a greater “spirit” or attitude in a society. This would be many elements working towards a higher purpose and thus, still, an upright pentagram.
If you think of the the four sideways points as material, and the fifth point (either up or down) as the spiritual then you can place different situations on it accordingly. If the situation starts in the spirit of the individual and ends in the material world it is upside down. If the situation starts in the material of the world and leads to unity with the spiritual it is upright. Or you can look at each of the four points as pieces of a whole, and fifth directional point as the representation of the whole. So, an upside down pentagram would represent the things that require breaking the whole apart; and, the upright pentagram would represent the things that require uniting different pieces together.
It is my prayer for the powers of the abyss to absorb and consume all into the void until everything comes back to a state of silence like it was at the beginning 🙏
Golem from The Lord of the Rings is a symbol of the residue/inverted pentagram. Gandalf repeatedly refused let let people kill Golem despite Golem being evil. Gandalf knew he had some part to play in the story. I wonder if evil in our current culture will destroy itself in a similar, helpful, manner.
Interesting thought. I think evil always brings about its own ruin. But we still need to struggle against it to lessen the damage on this world we've inherited from the Almighty. We still need to be Frodo who endeavor's to take the ring to Mount Doom, even if we fail at the final test, God will find a way to aid us in victory. At least that is what I hope.
@@nathankeller256 well said. I agree. We need to play our part too. Thinking about these things gives me some compassion for evil. It would be miserable to play the part of Golum, or Screwtape or the Devil in the cosmic drama.
Thank you for this. Really illuminating content! Is it me or is there some sort of parallel between the cross and the non-inverted pentagram? Both, if inverted, are seen as satanic, and the human body can be projected onto both? I also see the emmanation/emmergence principle in both symbols, except that in the inverted pentagram, it is more of an illusion of control.
The upside down pentagram is satanic, the upside down cross is anti-christian. 'Satanic' doesn't mean to worship Satan, it means to act as if self-creation is possible. The upside down cross is not an absence of the Good Truth, it is an inverted rejection of the salvation of Christ, it is anti-christ. Of course, it can also the the cross of St. Peter. But I assume you mean in our modern context.
E Pluribus Unum is basically the motto of the US and was affixed to the Great Seal of the United States from the beginning. That is a bit scary. "Out of many, one."
Yeah it's all part of the gnostic and alchemical tradition. It's historical fact that many of the forefathers were part of various secret societies, like Jefferson in the Illuminati. There are letters in the library of Congress from Washington discussing the Illuminati in earnest. We can't be sure of much except that these societies came from the alchemical traditions that had to go underground before the Enlightenment.
What if the world emerges out of chaos, without any from of unity at the top, but rather towards a form of unity at the top rather than at the bottom? Hard not to think that it all didn't start at the bottom and then the top slowly emerged and manifested itself as we evolved.
My brother put me on to you Jonathon. He’s a pretty intelligent fellow so I thought I’d give this a go. I am classically educated, traditional Roman Catholic and generally a very open minded person. I am also poetic and musical and try very hard to be well rounded. I subscribe to Aristotle and Aquinas in the main though by no means would I say they have all the answers. That being said, I am having a hard time following your general approach to the symbolic world. I find the arguments vague and scattered, but my primary objection is that I can’t find objectivity in symbols. I of course see the meanings you point out, but I can often find other meanings, not all of which are compatible with each other, and it leaves me wondering how you favor one meaning over the other. I’m generally left feeling that the whole endeavor is somewhat arbitrary. I’m not saying I don’t believe in symbols, but I’m wondering how useful they really are as a science (classical sense) if they’re not objective. If they are objective, what limitations does the symbolic approach present? More specifically, does the symbolic world welcome other modes of knowing? It seems to me that there is somewhat of an animosity between the symbolic world and modern science. My second objection is that I don’t see any causal significance in symbols, and to give them the sort of weight you give them seems to me to be fairly disruptive of the Aristotelian worldview. But I admit I’m new and willing to understand better what you’re getting at. If I’m not seeing this rightly, can you suggest a video or podcast or book which might help better understand how this all ties in to the broader picture? Thanks and God Bless!
If you remove the lowermost point, you can see an inverted pentagram in the Microsoft logo, the remaining points represented by red, blue, green, yellow.
The symbol that changes depending on how you look at it...i.e on a chain around your neck looking at yourself in the mirror then looking down the chain around your neck and see it differently....a different (left) way to see things if you can pay attention.
Though it looks spooky, that Golden Dawn ritual is actually full of Christian mysticism. One of the things they associated the upright pentagram to was the name of Jesus in Hebrew, and they would intone this name while performing rituals.
"St. Maximus the Confessor interpretes this passage allegorically, stating that the act of eating the fruit of this tree symbolizes improper usage of one’s senses, which leads to insanity."
“There is something which unites magic and applied science (technology) while separating them from the "wisdom" of earlier ages. For the wise men of old, the cardinal problem of human life was how to conform the soul to objective reality, and the solution was wisdom, self-discipline, and virtue. For the modern, the cardinal problem is how to conform reality to the wishes of man, and the solution is a technique.” -CS Lewis
Not related but related: I want to order t shirts and sweatshirts as gifts on the symbolic world but what's up with the sizing? Which measurement does "width" correspond to - chest? waist?...I can't be the only one with this question - I'm thinking this might be slowing down some orders on these items.
There is a Presbyterian Church in my town of Port Chalmers, Dunedin- called Iona Church. It too has a beautiful inverted pentagram stained glass window at the rear of the church above the altar. I’ve been wondering why it is there, and unfortunately no one has been able to explain to me the significance of it from a Christian perspective. Since it faces the southwest, this is technically the area of the church that doesn’t see any sunlight so your explanation is the only logical one I have heard so far.
I found it interesting his comment on democracy. I wonder what would be its proper replacement (for the world in its corrupted state, not in an ideal state).
Glad to hear that criticism of democracy. Growing bolder! Cheers. I apologize for having been too harsh in the past if you ever read my comments. I still stand by a lot of what I said, but you're right in that Christianity isn't revolutionary. It's about forgiving the body for not being up to the task of the Spirit... and still maintaining the supremacy of the Spirit.
Madonna uses an inverted pentagram above a cross in her performance of Die Another Day in her Celebration Tour. She is also dressed in all black with a wide brimmed black hat.🤔
It’s almost like the mind set on the Spirit symbolically functions as the right-side up pentagram, while the mind set on the flesh symbolically functions as the upside down pentagram. ”Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace. The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God.“ Romans 8:5-7
Hello Jonathan! Could you make a video explaining your thoughts on sacred geometry? Also, as a Christian who has been more and more interested in symbology, I wonder where your ideas come from?
What makes an inverted pentagram satanic? People saying so. Just like any other symbol, the interpretation is in the eye of the beholder, with their own background, perspectives, and other ideas.
Question - Is there content on the star of David? I have heard that the source of this symbol is from the old testament tabernacle, that the elements of blood from the sacrifice, fire from the heavens that consumed it when it would be acceptable to God, and then water from the lavar that the priest would essentially baptise themselves in would form the first triangle (could also be the formation of our three primary colors - blood=red, water=blue, fire=yellow). The second triangle is formed from the candlesticks (with 66 bowls, knops and flowers - 22 of each - also representing the Light of the world, the Bible, knowledge of God, etc), the alter of incense, and the table of shewbread... I could go on, however, if there is already a video I would love to hear an additional take... I love this type of content.
Thanks for the Intel, I'm an Atheist and wanted to check if my pentagram necklace bumps with the lack of my believe, wouldn't wanna give anyone the wrong idea. Contractory to some believe I'm actually really interested in mythology, religious or otherwise I just don't take that stuff as serious or literal as you. Good video ✌🏻
The outer court outside the temple represents those without …this represents the fallen world in which one must be saved… something that can only be accomplished by entering into the temple itself ..
They are the monsters on the edge of the church. They guard the church. Monsters are beings that don’t fit into a known category, they are often hybrids and as such exist in the buffers between categories. When you leave a known space, you encounter monsters, or beings you cannot contain in any one category. Tricky to wrap your head around at first but the basic idea is that monsters exist between categories, and they both threaten the categories if they were to enter, but they also protect the category from other monsters trying to enter it. So the gargoyle finds its proper place on the edge of the church, guarding it from other more monstrous beasts. Between every category exists hybrid monsters that do not fit into any one space.
As a patron, I support this being made public
Thank you! I will become a Patron once I am earning money again!
God bless you!
Agreed, I would even support all patron-only releases being made public after a few months.
I follow a lot of .... words? .... intellectual/philosophers ... people who reflect on the nature of our modern world with a different point of vue. JP is the ONLY one I intend to support, even though this religion-angle is necessarily biased. Bias does not mean wrong, and the symbolic study is SO precious!
I subbed to Patreon just for this video. Now it's free! I bet I would have plenty of other patron only content to enjoy but I'm listening to Laurus on audible now.
An embarrassment of riches
Power in multiplicity: "diversity is our strength."
Ikr immediately noticed that too
"United we stand" actually
The pentagram being in the window that is never lit, that’s kinda genius
Perhaps also fitting to that thought: within the tridentine rite the gospel is read northwards so that the lands not (yet) illuminated by the Light of +Christ shines within the darkness.
@@Investmentmessiah an excellent point.
@6meegz I found a circle with a star inside outside my back door, in a concealed spot. Sort of etched into cement ground. Not sure what to make of it. How do I know if it's inverted?
Edit: on a wall, window or in a book I can see being able to tell which edge is UP. But on the ground? Hmmm. Oh!! Would it be direction? If one point of the star points north?
@6meegz oh no you’ll probably explode or something
Hearing the words "Christ is stronger than all of this" warmed my heart this am:) I know He is, but still, it is good to hear those words spoken.
Yes! Chris is truly stronger than all of this, he is the "fulfillment of the law". The symbol for Israel is the Star of David. I have heard that the source of this symbol is from the old testament tabernacle, that the elements of blood from the sacrifice, fire from the heavens that consumed it when it would be acceptable to God, and then water from the lavar that the priest would essentially baptize themselves in would form the first triangle (could also be the formation of our three primary colors - blood=red, water=blue, fire=yellow). The second triangle is formed from the candlesticks (with 66 bowls, knops and flowers - 22 of each - also representing the Light of the world, the Bible, knowledge of God, etc), the alter of incense, and the table of shewbread... and ultimately, Jesus fulfilled what God laid out as a symbolic pattern of worship and spiritual growth toward God in the old testament. I could go on, however, if there is already a video I would love to hear an additional take from Jonathan Pageau... I love this type of content.
People love having their beliefs repeated back to them. You're definitely not alone in that
christ is a symbol of weakness
@@thesunisflatorganizationJesus Chirst is our God and Saviour✝️. Allmighty, allpowerfull God
To offer an alternate explanation, the four lower points represent the four elements, earth air fire and water, while the upper point represents spirit. The inverted pentagram was considered a symbol of evil because it placed the four lower elements above the element of spirit, representing valuing the material world, the intellectual world, the sensual world, or the emotional world above the spiritual world.
That isn't alternate, that's exactly what Jonathan is saying here
@@EamonBurke alright ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
@@porteal8986 there are 5 elements in some cultures. Air, water, metal, wood, fire. I forget but I know metal and wood were in there instead of Earth
@@recoveringsoul755That's Chinese elements instead of our western ones.
@@user-wp3tr3ns4l yes. Like they don't just have Year of the dragon. It's year of the metal dragon or water pig or whatever, ,based on the year and stuff. Plus they give weight to blood types as well, which also affects a personality
The pentagram is a symbolic representation of the golden ratio. If you take the longer and shorter lines it equals thirds. It was used by Pythagoreans.
First, a Pentagram is a star alone, the Pentacle is the star with a circle around it. Both symbols predate Christianity by thousands of years, it is in fact the oldest symbol of worship on earth. It was first stated to be evil in 1855 when a Catholic church leader was kicked out of the church and wrote a book on magic. For nearly 600 years prior this symbol was a symbol used by the Catholic church. Its primary linkage to evil was in the mid-60s when the atheistic group called "the Church of Satan" took an inverted Pentacleas their official symbol.
Thank you!! People really see something and run with it without actually researching any history 🥴
Amazing info. Ty.
Exactly! Old Christian churches in Europe have "inverted" pentacles and pentagrams, as do some Mormon temples. It was considered a symbol of Venus, "The Morning Star" - a name given to Jesus in the Bible. As you say, in popular American culture it wasn't considered "evil" until LaVey used it for the "Church of Satan." Movie makers and rock/metal bands grabbed onto that and made that (and the inverted cross) part of popular culture, cementing the idea that those are inherently evil symbols...
U are delusional
Sounds like “our diversity is our strength”
Our diversity is their strength.
@@IVespidI our divergence certainly is
Not having anything in common is our strength 🙄
"United we stand" actually
This made me think about the inverted hermeneutic of the creation account employed by gnostics, in which they view the serpent as a liberating figure from a tyrannical God who has entrapped and enslaved mankind.
What I find to be a fascinating consistency with the Devil is that he can not create. He can only corrupt and pervert what God has created.
This whole idea of the upside-down/ backwards/ inverted/ opposite in relation to Satanism is seemingly a bottomless rabbit hole.
Yes, as you said they cannot create and this their ONLY play is the subversion
Wait so opposing the government on jabs is inverted pentagram thinking?
Well call me a sinner then.
It's the new (state) religion now.
So repent your sin!
Wear 18 masks, while distancing yourself 666feet.
The normal Pentagram also refers to the Pentagrammaton in esotericism. So makes sense for Satanists to invert it.
Right-side pentagram was also used in the medieval romance of Sir Gawain. In this romance it is said to represent 5 knightly virtues.
I really like your videos Jonathan, I want to thank you for sharing your wisdom with us. You and Jordan Peterson have rescued me from my reductionist atheism.
Jordan Peterson imposes a false Christianity. Do not follow this false idol.
I really love how you dedramarize this tvings, presenting simpel fact, without any dwelling or drama in it. Without most of the dark apokalyptic scenario we usually see, and even bring out Hope from it. Thank You for that.
You are so wise and interesting and your deliveryis also perfect. I find the time i listen to you the best spent time of my day.
The old intro gave me so much nostalgia lol I still love it
The five points of the pentagram also form the head, two arms and two legs on Da Vinci's Vituvian Man. If it is right-side up, the head is on top, indicating that is what is ruling. If it is upside down, what organ is doing the ruling?
The feet!
@@mysigt_ This is why I think worrying about the meaning of some lines put together is pretty idiotic.
@@Nekrumorfiini1 to be fair, a swastika is also some lines put together, but I see your point
@@mysigt_ You don't even know what a swastika means, do you?
@@Nekrumorfiini1 bla bla symbol of peace or whatever, primitive way of drawing the sun bla bla. I was trying to make a point about symbolism and association but yes, let’s derail this entirely
All the introduction is also an explanation of the Mesoamerican symbol commonly called the "quincunx", which also appears as a flower with four petals and repeats itself further in the "volador" dance or dance of the flyers. This is awesome, great explanation, thanks.
🙂 Loved the discussion of the north transept in Cathedrals. Going to check some out in the spring, God willing.
It's insane that there are people who see themselves as conservatives who dont see the upside down nature of democracy
Propaganda is effective. Constant repetition of "our democracy...our democracy...our democracy..." never "our republic" because of what that would entail.
You don't like democracy? What are you, some kind of Nazi/Commie?
/s
Democracy is literally "what're we going to do with OUR stuff". Hoppe is right about monarchy being better than democracy. No contest.
@@kriegjaeger People constantly talk about this republic.
What would you replace it with?
Yeah, basically, what is more believable? That there is God, and we were created by Him - or that life just happen to "occur" on its own? But, somehow, by atheist logic, it is we who have to prove something.
Exactly if we are created creatures then logically we have a Creator
@@jhoughjr1 Only you can't explain how, and won't be able to. Imagine someone saying to you: "If you believe in God, it's pretty obvious that we were created." You don't understand that you are saying the same thing. If something has a chance of happening of 1 in a googolplex, and people think that is what really happened, you can only call that - faith.
It would be interesting to see Jonathan's interpretation of I Pet Goat.
agreed!
I second this
The pentagram as the image of a human is helpful. The upside down pentagram is literally flipping the world upside down. Feet up, head down.
the inverted pentagram is an ancient symbol that was often used by the Sumerians to denote their "shining ones" who were to my understanding their gods. A inverted pentagram symbolizes lucifer after his fall from heaven and him becoming satan. A upright pentagram symbolizes luficer before the fall (in my opinion)
@@marblemarble7113 I just like the simplicity of thinking of it as a symbol for upside down. Its the inversion of the natural hierarchy.
@@06rtm that's fine I'm just showing you the ancient connection to Satan that the symbol has
Why we suffer by the billions then die a ugly dried up smelly stinking death as old and rot. Stinks and wonder why we deserve such none fathomable make of Control over us forced to be human with a spirit it say's most likley to be doomed. then gives us no benifit of the dougt. pray for somthing that promissed to answer does not. may be some kind we think came from our own conscience.
@@trafficjon400 What about love?
St. Peter, the head of the Church, asked to be crucified upside down, and was, deeming himself unworthy to be crucifies as Christ was. In addition to that explicit symbolism, does it have other meanings?
Your solo videos are so much better than the interviews and talks…
HEY, you can use the symphonic recording again? Cool! I really like your friends' small ensemble renditions (even the heavy metal one) but the original remains powerful!
As someone knowledgeable of symbology enough.
I share no concern for inverted crosses or standard Pythagorean Pentagrams.
I'm concerned with their users and them simply being pretentious, AND them simply ignoring the importance of symbols withheld.
St. Peter's Cross (the inverted cross) is a Christian symbol of such superiority, that it's disappointing to see its misuse.
You mention that your knowledgeable on symbology, recently I've gotten interested in the topic and am looking for books to read. So I guess that's my question, what books do you suggest I look into so I can learn about the subject?
@@TheZalor check out jonathan's brother's book ''the language of creation''
@@victorborbalima I'm about halfway through it. It's very good.
I also recomend jordan petersons book maps of meaning.
St Peter asked for permission to be crucified upside down, as didnt think of himself as worthy of being crucified like Jesus. So sure thing, they dont think of them selfes as worthy of Jesus Christ. Ironic when you mentioned this.
@@niklassarri108 well now I just feel sorry for users of inverted symbols lol, maybe devil worshipers just need a good hug.
I saw Dune the other day, I realised it can never be a truly satisfying/wholesome experience and Tolkien was right in disliking it. Dune is an inverted pentagram, It doesn't have a redemption story arc. But being a child of the 90s and ex-goth it is still a guilty pleasure.
Yea it lacks heart but outstanding in every other field
Dune is phenomenal. I haven't seen the new film yet(American here) but the religious themes and sex/gender images are powerful. The conslusion of Herbert's Dune is a story about Chani as much as Paul. Paul exists in relationship to Chani. The old movie got it exactly, completely wrong in it's apotheotic moment.
When taken as a whole it could maybe be a redemption story, not of a single character, as Paul is not a hero in the first books, but of humanity. Great books! A warning about the cult of personality.
Tolkein died in 1904 and therefore had no opinion of Dune.
@@harmonicresonanceproject wtf dude
I am a Muslim, love to watched your video
Thank you for illuminating these things it helps me to put into perspective and context these symbols from the past.
5 points on the star and you only need to “rotate” 20% to be in error. The 80 % door being wide.
The lines of the pentagram follow the golden rule (phi) and harmonic scales in music.
Also the alignment-points between earth and venus form a pentagram.
So it's highly associated with beauty and balance.
Pythagoreans used the Pentagram for mystical geometry (before middle ages) probably for the reasons listed above.
You don’t have to invert a pentagram to turn it upside down, rotating it plus or minus 36 degrees will give you the same result.
It's interesting that the upside-down pentagram also looks like a normal pentagram tilted to the left.
And (not coincidentally) also tilted to the right …
Just saying - both sides are a distortion of the Total Truth
@@glenholmgren1218 True. Thanks.
The Crucifixion itself even has pentagram imagery. The four nail-scars presented on Jesus’ hands and feet, all coming into the one scar located at His side😯☦️
This is interesting and remind me of rosicrucian symbolism
If you look at the pentagram, inside of it is a pentagon, in which if you unite the dots will became an inverted pentagram, if you unite the dots of the pentagon inside the inverted one you will get an upside pentagram again, so is fractal that goes on forever. This makes me think about, especially that the Tao of Yin Yang represents something like this.
The Father is a representation of masculine carrying the seed, so I guess it should come first, but once the seed gets into the womb (which I guess you could say it comes second) the child arises. So the two become one again. I had a moment once when I've felt like I was in my mother's womb, something similar, air became like fluid to me and it was so peaceful and I thought then, that we are still inside of a womb now, all of us, waiting to be born as one. Maybe it will be on a higher dimension, and the trinity will be like a shadow, the same way the shadow is the only true 2 dimensionality we have here. For me, this is such a beautiful way to visualize infinity...
Did anyone else notice that in each star's middle lies a pentagon? The "white magic" star has a pentagon pointing down & the "black magic" star has one pointing up. Reminds me of the dots in the ying yang symbol.
Love this, but it got me thinking: could an inverted pentagram, when stripped off of its Satanic connotations, ever describe a just struggle against (devilish) tyranny? I say this because I heard Jonathan speak of how an inverted pentagram is the symbol of defiance of something which is above oneself. And of course, in relation to our times, I'm sure many of us have felt out of place even for things as simple as telling the truth or defending all stages and forms of human life. Would that mean we stand closer to the inverted pentagram rather than the straight pentagram in those ocasions?
Thank you.
Symbols are ultimately what you make them. Some ‘edgy’ goths and satanists like to wear upside down crosses as a sign of them mocking Christianity, however in Orthodox and Catholic traditions the upside down cross is a symbol of Saint Peter (he was crucified upside down in his martyrdom) so you will see Catholic Christians wearing an upside down cross in memory of Peter’s sacrifice for the early church.
@@EmilyMottesheard That makes sense. I had read a bit about St. Peter's Cross as well, I feel that one's an even more blatant subversion of an otherwise benign symbol.
Peter cut the ear off a soldier who came to arrest Christ and was reminded that He did not come to lead a rebellion.
No, the temptation to fight fire with fire must never be succumbed to. Instead we must wait for a miracle at times, to not defeat our enemies but overcome them, which you do with love, patience, long-suffering, and truth.
This is the value of symbols like this: they act as what we would call "accountability partners" or "rules of thumb" or "role models". When you see how much you align with the point at the bottom, you know you aren't oriented rightly, even though it seems right at the time. There is a way that seems right to a man, but it's end is destruction.
Keep your point up.
Telling the truth and fighting for the lives of others are things that are above you. They are values, ideals that many must work towards to create a greater “spirit” or attitude in a society. This would be many elements working towards a higher purpose and thus, still, an upright pentagram.
If you think of the the four sideways points as material, and the fifth point (either up or down) as the spiritual then you can place different situations on it accordingly. If the situation starts in the spirit of the individual and ends in the material world it is upside down. If the situation starts in the material of the world and leads to unity with the spiritual it is upright.
Or you can look at each of the four points as pieces of a whole, and fifth directional point as the representation of the whole. So, an upside down pentagram would represent the things that require breaking the whole apart; and, the upright pentagram would represent the things that require uniting different pieces together.
Strangely enough, the northern side is where the Eucharist (namely the Oblation and part of the Divine Liturgy) commences.
The four beasts happen to be Aquarius, Taurus, Leo, and Aquila/ Scorpio
As seen on the Tarot card of the Hierophant and the Universe in Crowley's/Harris' Tarot.
That is some symbolism, I would like JP to delve into..
And the "wheels" are an esoteric description of what an armillary sphere measures. It's about the ecliptic planes, constellations, etc.
Hmm, those are the "fixed" signs.
The fixed sign symbols were taken from the book of Ezekiel and used to symbolize the 4 apostles of the Gospels.
@@hh8222 they are also listed in revelation 4:7. It's more like the many allegorical references symbolize the fixed signs.
It is my prayer for the powers of the abyss to absorb and consume all into the void until everything comes back to a state of silence like it was at the beginning 🙏
Golem from The Lord of the Rings is a symbol of the residue/inverted pentagram. Gandalf repeatedly refused let let people kill Golem despite Golem being evil. Gandalf knew he had some part to play in the story. I wonder if evil in our current culture will destroy itself in a similar, helpful, manner.
Gollum, not golem.
Interesting thought. I think evil always brings about its own ruin. But we still need to struggle against it to lessen the damage on this world we've inherited from the Almighty. We still need to be Frodo who endeavor's to take the ring to Mount Doom, even if we fail at the final test, God will find a way to aid us in victory. At least that is what I hope.
@@nathankeller256 well said. I agree. We need to play our part too. Thinking about these things gives me some compassion for evil. It would be miserable to play the part of Golum, or Screwtape or the Devil in the cosmic drama.
@@strategicgamingwithaacorns2874 haha. I gave it my best guess. Thanks for the correction.
@@riggel8804 Yeah it is sad when people give themselves over to evil or to crippling doubt.
Thank you for this. Really illuminating content!
Is it me or is there some sort of parallel between the cross and the non-inverted pentagram?
Both, if inverted, are seen as satanic, and the human body can be projected onto both?
I also see the emmanation/emmergence principle in both symbols, except that in the inverted pentagram, it is more of an illusion of control.
The upside down pentagram is satanic, the upside down cross is anti-christian. 'Satanic' doesn't mean to worship Satan, it means to act as if self-creation is possible. The upside down cross is not an absence of the Good Truth, it is an inverted rejection of the salvation of Christ, it is anti-christ.
Of course, it can also the the cross of St. Peter. But I assume you mean in our modern context.
For anyone curious, an arrangement of five points into the 4-corner-1-center configuration described here is called a quincunx.
The star could represent the sun. The star facing up is the rising sun (light/day) and the upside down star is the falling sun (darkness/night)
You should do a video on Magen David or "star" of David
E Pluribus Unum is basically the motto of the US and was affixed to the Great Seal of the United States from the beginning. That is a bit scary. "Out of many, one."
Yeah it's all part of the gnostic and alchemical tradition. It's historical fact that many of the forefathers were part of various secret societies, like Jefferson in the Illuminati. There are letters in the library of Congress from Washington discussing the Illuminati in earnest.
We can't be sure of much except that these societies came from the alchemical traditions that had to go underground before the Enlightenment.
What if the world emerges out of chaos, without any from of unity at the top, but rather towards a form of unity at the top rather than at the bottom? Hard not to think that it all didn't start at the bottom and then the top slowly emerged and manifested itself as we evolved.
@Ameretat010 I don't think 2 and 2 exists without intelligence
My brother put me on to you Jonathon. He’s a pretty intelligent fellow so I thought I’d give this a go.
I am classically educated, traditional Roman Catholic and generally a very open minded person. I am also poetic and musical and try very hard to be well rounded. I subscribe to Aristotle and Aquinas in the main though by no means would I say they have all the answers.
That being said, I am having a hard time following your general approach to the symbolic world. I find the arguments vague and scattered, but my primary objection is that I can’t find objectivity in symbols. I of course see the meanings you point out, but I can often find other meanings, not all of which are compatible with each other, and it leaves me wondering how you favor one meaning over the other. I’m generally left feeling that the whole endeavor is somewhat arbitrary. I’m not saying I don’t believe in symbols, but I’m wondering how useful they really are as a science (classical sense) if they’re not objective. If they are objective, what limitations does the symbolic approach present? More specifically, does the symbolic world welcome other modes of knowing? It seems to me that there is somewhat of an animosity between the symbolic world and modern science.
My second objection is that I don’t see any causal significance in symbols, and to give them the sort of weight you give them seems to me to be fairly disruptive of the Aristotelian worldview.
But I admit I’m new and willing to understand better what you’re getting at. If I’m not seeing this rightly, can you suggest a video or podcast or book which might help better understand how this all ties in to the broader picture?
Thanks and God Bless!
I just noticed there is a right-side-up pentagon at the heart of an upside-down pentagram. And vice-versa.
If you remove the lowermost point, you can see an inverted pentagram in the Microsoft logo, the remaining points represented by red, blue, green, yellow.
Was this recorded a while back? In the video you mention it being lent. I was like, did I miss something in the calendar? Hehe
From other comments, it's a patreon video re-published for everyone
Thanks Jonathan! Really good! God bless🙏🙏🙏❤❤❤
"truth will always win in the end"
yet the lies keep on coming. What does winning _look like_ because I don't know how to recognize it anymore.
Everybody dies. You’ll find out then
The symbol that changes depending on how you look at it...i.e on a chain around your neck looking at yourself in the mirror then looking down the chain around your neck and see it differently....a different (left) way to see things if you can pay attention.
The devil has his hour god has his day
Though it looks spooky, that Golden Dawn ritual is actually full of Christian mysticism.
One of the things they associated the upright pentagram to was the name of Jesus in Hebrew, and they would intone this name while performing rituals.
"We can then say that the five is the symbol of form, of the schemes seen not by the eyes of the body, but by the eyes of intelligence"
fig leaves = five lobes
"St. Maximus the Confessor interpretes this passage allegorically, stating that the act of eating the fruit of this tree symbolizes improper usage of one’s senses, which leads to insanity."
Look at the Hollywood tv channel logo. Its an inverted pentagram in blue. At 2:25 I call that a Pentacle.
Thank you for making this public
An inverted pentagram is for a second level witch does not mean it’s satanic
“There is something which unites magic and applied science (technology) while separating them from the "wisdom" of earlier ages. For the wise men of old, the cardinal problem of human life was how to conform the soul to objective reality, and the solution was wisdom, self-discipline, and virtue. For the modern, the cardinal problem is how to conform reality to the wishes of man, and the solution is a technique.” -CS Lewis
I'd like to see a comparison with the six presented in the star of Israel
You bearer of light,
Thanks 4 shedding some.
Make a video on the symbolism of alchemy, particularly the “first matter”
Super video! Would have been great if the mathematical principles where also explained in this video in depth with the geometric shapes
You miss the mark when you don’t recognize the inherent evil in all cathedral use of symbolism as a place of worship.
Not related but related: I want to order t shirts and sweatshirts as gifts on the symbolic world but what's up with the sizing? Which measurement does "width" correspond to - chest? waist?...I can't be the only one with this question - I'm thinking this might be slowing down some orders on these items.
Update: width = measurement from armpit to armpit. You're welcome 😊
Comment
Reply.
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Sarcastic Retort
@@shaft9000 Admonishment. Support
Blocked and reported. 😤
Eden is a mountain. Eden has four sides/slopes/watersheds in which flow the four rivers. Ergo, Eden is a right-side-up pentagram?
A right-side-up 4-sided pyramid
Excellent Jonathan. Thank you.
There is a Presbyterian Church in my town of Port Chalmers, Dunedin- called Iona Church. It too has a beautiful inverted pentagram stained glass window at the rear of the church above the altar. I’ve been wondering why it is there, and unfortunately no one has been able to explain to me the significance of it from a Christian perspective. Since it faces the southwest, this is technically the area of the church that doesn’t see any sunlight so your explanation is the only logical one I have heard so far.
I found it interesting his comment on democracy. I wonder what would be its proper replacement (for the world in its corrupted state, not in an ideal state).
Theocratic dictatorship, Matt Walsh style?
sarcasm
Blessings, your words do not fall on deaf ears 💙
Great video! I feel like I now understand better many seemingly unrelated things when understanding this symbol.
Missing metal intro. Tragic.
💜🤝ty for uploading this bruv
Check out the book by Robert Bennett - I am Not Afraid and his companion Afraid.
I was looking forward to this video a lot!
I agree with that, but I like to call it The Pentacle. (It has a circle around it)
Glad to hear that criticism of democracy. Growing bolder! Cheers. I apologize for having been too harsh in the past if you ever read my comments. I still stand by a lot of what I said, but you're right in that Christianity isn't revolutionary. It's about forgiving the body for not being up to the task of the Spirit... and still maintaining the supremacy of the Spirit.
Madonna uses an inverted pentagram above a cross in her performance of Die Another Day in her Celebration Tour. She is also dressed in all black with a wide brimmed black hat.🤔
A lot of my favorite bands use it, black metal bands from Norway/Scandinavia. I don't buy much into it but cool looking imagery.
That last bit was very encouraging to me as a former atheist-turned New Ager who is now returning to Christ.
It’s almost like the mind set on the Spirit symbolically functions as the right-side up pentagram, while the mind set on the flesh symbolically functions as the upside down pentagram.
”Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace. The mind governed by the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so. Those who are in the realm of the flesh cannot please God.“
Romans 8:5-7
So inverted pentagram symbolizes rebellion?
And the original rebel, Satan.
@@lilithacc how so
Symbols, like words, don’t have intrinsic meaning, only usages
Not true at all
This is so interesting. Great video! Thank you!
this is awesome, thanks for this Jonathan
What about the angle of inversion (36 degrees)?
Is there a good collection of illustrations like the one of the chariot that someone can recommend?
Great timing. I'm teaching Faust and this will help me to explain why the pentagram is hateful to Mephistopheles.
The subculture or "residue" is fascinating to many people!
E uno plura - “from one many” vs
e pluribus unum - “from many one”
Hello Jonathan! Could you make a video explaining your thoughts on sacred geometry? Also, as a Christian who has been more and more interested in symbology, I wonder where your ideas come from?
There is a reading list on his website.
Reminds me of the big bang theory/heliocentric model...
What makes an inverted pentagram satanic? People saying so. Just like any other symbol, the interpretation is in the eye of the beholder, with their own background, perspectives, and other ideas.
Question - Is there content on the star of David? I have heard that the source of this symbol is from the old testament tabernacle, that the elements of blood from the sacrifice, fire from the heavens that consumed it when it would be acceptable to God, and then water from the lavar that the priest would essentially baptise themselves in would form the first triangle (could also be the formation of our three primary colors - blood=red, water=blue, fire=yellow). The second triangle is formed from the candlesticks (with 66 bowls, knops and flowers - 22 of each - also representing the Light of the world, the Bible, knowledge of God, etc), the alter of incense, and the table of shewbread... I could go on, however, if there is already a video I would love to hear an additional take... I love this type of content.
Thanks for the Intel, I'm an Atheist and wanted to check if my pentagram necklace bumps with the lack of my believe, wouldn't wanna give anyone the wrong idea.
Contractory to some believe I'm actually really interested in mythology, religious or otherwise I just don't take that stuff as serious or literal as you. Good video ✌🏻
So why are there gargoyles or other "evil" looking figures on the sides of churches like mentioned at 16:13?
The outer court outside the temple represents those without …this represents the fallen world in which one must be saved… something that can only be accomplished by entering into the temple itself ..
They are the monsters on the edge of the church. They guard the church. Monsters are beings that don’t fit into a known category, they are often hybrids and as such exist in the buffers between categories. When you leave a known space, you encounter monsters, or beings you cannot contain in any one category. Tricky to wrap your head around at first but the basic idea is that monsters exist between categories, and they both threaten the categories if they were to enter, but they also protect the category from other monsters trying to enter it. So the gargoyle finds its proper place on the edge of the church, guarding it from other more monstrous beasts. Between every category exists hybrid monsters that do not fit into any one space.