Exactly Sram GX Eagle (12x) on my Main MTB, NX Eagle (12x) on my Fun-MTB Shimano 105 on my All-Road (It is a Gravel Frame, but at least 65% used on Raod, with a 2by setup etc.)
Agreed, but if we had only the three options, and had to kill one, as much as I love mechanical shifting, and it's what I'm CHOOSING for my next mtb build, I would kill it off too if electronic were the only other 2 options. And I want to add: I love mechanical shifting. I have many bikes that I love riding with it.
it's all mechanical in that shifting is accomplished by moving a cage and thereby forcing the chain up and down a set of gears. The difference lies solely in how the cage is moved. Calling any groupset "electronic" is not telling the whole story.
Having worked in the industry, I can say from experience that it is easy to lose the customer's perspective. We know that most people who buy a bike after not riding for years typically ride their new bike a lot for a couple seasons and then it generally sits in storage, only coming out once in a while for casual rides, if at all. The primary reason for this isn't so much attention span as it is in maintaining riding fitness. Riding is like dieting; you don't have to stop doing it very long before you are back where you started from. When your focus is on bikes all the time, you can lose sight of the fact that for most people their bikes are an accessory to their life. They expect it to be like a lawn mower, just sitting quietly, waiting to roar back to life when the grass needs cutting again. Electronic shifting is likely to fail to meet the average user's long term expectations. Sure, it will be fine for that first two seasons, and the recharge requirements are pretty light, especially considering the overhead people are used to applying to their cell phones. But when that rider decides to get back to riding again after the bike has been sitting idly from the last really nice day in September, to when the work load lightened up in June, will the battery even take a charge? What if the bike sits unridden for two years? Three? How much will the replacement batteries cost, and will the total service charge estimate be so much that the customer will simply decide not to fix the bike and to do something else, instead? At our local bike co-op, we see a lot of bikes come in that have sat unridden anywhere from a couple years to multiple decades. If we think it's a bike someone will want to ride again, we can always bring it back to life. There are ten year old groupsets for which manufacturers no longer carry replacement parts, so when these electronic groupsets reach that point, I have no expectation that replacement batteries and cables will be available. I expect that as electronic shifting becomes more widespread, we will see sporadically used five year old bikes that need hundreds of dollars in parts and labor to get them shifting again. So, don't kill off mechanical groupsets. Their low overhead means they are the only thing that make sense for most people.
First of all, mechanical groupsets are simply fantastic. They work, and it's affordable. Electronics are just out of my range. It's easy for you guys actually not paying for anything. We poor chumps Pay for our stuff. In any case I own all three brands, Shimano is much more refined than Sram, Sram system is different but not bad in any way. Campagnolo is outright beautiful eye candy, great looking.
Apart from the price tag, I will never ever charge any battery for a bike ride (except when I am due to switch to an E-Bike). Never. I hate batteries on bikes.
May I ask you, what Groupsets you are using? For the Gravel and Road Groupsets I am with you. But for MTB Groupsets I think the shifting is a bit smoother.
Couldn't agree more, Shimano Ultegra R8000 is an absolute winner,it is absolutely flawless. You never have to worry about dropping your chain or running out of power or being stuck in one gear because the system has failed. I've got SRAM force AXS on one of my bikes and it's absolute rubbish, wished I had never purchased it,had nothing but problems with it.
@@jeremyowens441 I have Ultergra Di2 12sp and 11sp SRAM Apex 1x on my bikes and both are absolutely fantastic, but once I experienced electronic shifting I am never going back. It is just so much nicer, easier, more precise and surprisingly lower maintenance then mechanical stuff. .. I rode 2.5K with it so far and had to charge it once, It did drop chain once, but to be honest even mechanical 1X done that couple of times. Di2 is precise crisp and smooth shifting with minimal effort and no hustle of cables and constant adjustment to have smooth shifting. And you have to change cables each 3 or 4 years as they do get bit "sticky" and stop downshifting crisply.. Di2 is completely pointless performance wise, but so nice to use.
Veloce 9 speed was my introduction to road cycling and Campagnolo. I recently did a deep cleaning on my old groupset, that was going on a Trek 2300 build. I also degreased the chain, cassette, and chainrings so I can go full wax. Even though Veloce was the third tier groupset in its day, all cleaned up, it looks like a million bucks, and shifts like a dream all tuned up. No modern electronic groupset can get me this excited on a build or ride.
There's something for everyone, truly. I love Srams Axs for many reasons. But that does NOT mean it's for everyone. I love a good beauty of an old bike as well. Saw one recently that was a DE Rosa 90s frame that was still lugged, and he took off all the paint, repainted it, polished the lugs, put Sram Rival 22 on it, scraped off all the paint with a dremel, and did some dope anodizing..... then on top of that he switched the internals from 22 to 24 with Ratio Technology
Véloce was also my first groupset on a Bianchi. I have only upgraded my Campagnolo groupset from then on. Love Campagnolo, but all you here about from them is the outrageously expensive super record. They have lost touch.
Campy was always too steep for me, and they never really had anything truly commuter, but I still have a campy tattoo on my calf to honour the man who gave us the derailleur.
I have been riding/racing on Campagnolo since 1984 and it has always served me well. Every catastrophic failure I have had has been Shimano. Just put the Ekar gravel set on my bike and have had great luck with it. I am willing to spend the money for them.
I love the mechanical campagnolo. My gripe with campagnolo has always been their wheel incompatibility with shimano and sram. I love mechanical groups because I don’t race and cycling is about being off the grid and not on it. I love just taking one of my bikes at random and going out for a ride. Not worried about whether there’s enough charge in the battery.
Campag sell Shimano versions of all their wheels and Brand S 11 or 12 speed cassettes work fine with Campy shifters and derailleurs. That said, Campy chains and cassettes are harder steel and last longer.
Campagnolo have lost their way. Their product decisions make no sense, are user hostile, are shop hostile, are OEM hostile... they have no idea who they are or who they care about anymore. The leadership and product management needs complete replacement.
Notice that at 3:27, the guy who would kill off Campy says what his favorite thing in the world would be - 12sp mechanical rim brake Campy. Doesn’t that exist?
Bought the 11s 105 (5800?) groupset for like £299 at evans on some sale back in the days. Absolutely ridiculous value considering what groupsets cost these days.
I was very doubtful about Campa and their wheels until I put a pair of Shamal on my bike, which now literally flies over gravel. Sure they're expensive, but damn, they know their sh*t.
Wanted to love it but they seldom sell their stuff where it's made tho 🥹 I'm literally in Taiwan and can't get hold of their stuff easily enough for me to get it working for the long term.
I have campa mechanical 12s on my bike with campa bora wto 60 mm wheels for 3 years now. Kind of hard to set up properly but once you do it works amazing + I don't want to go wireless and disc brakes any time soon.
My 21 year old Shimano RX 100 dual pivot caliper rim brakes still provide excellent braking and im 85 kg. My 21 year old steel bike, a George Longstaff i had made to measure now has been upgraded to mechanical 12 speed Campag. Chorus. Functionally it works as well as my 11 speed Shimano Grx, both work very well. This subject can be overanylized. Just keep the drivetrain well adjusted and properly lubed, ditto brakes, whether rim or hydraulic.
We didn't kill mechanical shifting, the bike industry did. All the new high end frames are electronic shift only, and that's to keep their manufacturing costs down and profits up.
I have Super Record 12s mechanical rim brakes on my steel frame, Super Record WRL wireless on my newer titanium. I think the mechanical stuff is superb when dialed in, and I prefer the ergonomics of the mechanical shifter. Not in terms of shifting point placement (we humans turn out to be able to learn/re-learn how to shift across platforms pretty easily), but in terms of the shape of the unit. The mechanical unit just fits effortlessly into my hands. It is probably the most comfortable brake/shifter in the history of life. All brake/shifter units that need to house a hydraulic cylinder are going to be bulkier, so this is an across-the-board type of thing regardless of manufacturer. My reason to switch to WRL is simple--electric shifting does not aggravate my arthritis. And as much as I like the lightweight simplicity of rim brakes, there really is nothing like the modulation and sheer power of disc brakes, and on this front Campagnolo really is the class leader. I never got on with SRAM discs. I have only used 1st gen Shimano discs with their finicky Ice Tech discs, the ones that warped and squeaked and rubbed beyond acceptability. I am told the 2nd gen discs are much better. If I had non-arthritic fingers, I'd build a bike with Super Record mechanical with disc brakes, but for me at this stage of my riding career, count me in for wireless shifting. And that battery thing? What on paper might seem to be an issue is really not in the real world. Just keep it properly charged like you would your head unit or lights. I doubt anyone's going to be putting in 600 km in one ride. This is not going to be put on adventure and touring bikes. And a word about Super Record wireless shifting. The thing is brilliant. It is blazingly quick and accurate and intuitive, and even though it is rated for a 29 tooth cog max, I put on an 11-32 for my gravel set up--and I do take this on gravel--with no problem. Just make sure to have the proper chain wrap for a 32 when installing the chain. Other than that, simply adjust the B-screw tensioner and you're off. I mention this only because if you were to go by what RUclips early reviews have said, the shifting was dodgy and unreliable. I have no idea who put their group set together. In 2 months of riding, I have *never* missed a shift, whether grinding up steep climbs, out of the saddle in a sprint, or powering through the cogs into a headwind. Either the press-release versions were undeveloped or they were assembled hastily/improperly. Can't tell whether WRL or Di2 or e-Tap is faster. If one has faster shifts as measured in a lab, it is in the millisecond range, far faster than any human is ever to feel in operation. They're all excellent, although I prefer Di-2 button placement the least. With full fingered gloves it is hard to distinguish one from the other. But I am unfamiliar with the system. No doubt using it more will make it easier. But WRL is very intuitive. Even with lobster gloves, finding the correct shift button is intuitive. About the Levante wheel set. Yes, it is cup-and-cone, as are most of Campagnolo's wheels . . . and Shimano's Dura Ace wheels, btw. Do they allow more grit to enter their bearings? Perhaps, but I don't live in the mud and rain of the UK. But the thing with cup-and-cone? Properly adjusted and lubed, they are smoother than sealed bearing hubs. More servicing to be sure. That said, I usually use my sealed-bearing wheel set with WRL, but that's because I've become addicted to Onyx's absolute quietness and instant engagement. So to answer the underlying question of which component manufacturer to kill off: why is this even a question? In what world do we want fewer instead of more choices?
Some have made external shields for cup and cone bearings. Back in the day people would use a section of curved pipe cleaner put in place to keep out grit. Now there are even better solutions.
Campagnolo Record Ti 10 speed, I'm still riding that about 3000km a year. Bought new in 2000. Maintained in perfect condition. If I buy any electric groupset now it won't be working 24 years from now I'm afraid... And the old record will still be going as long as I can get a few parts for the shifters, cassettes and chains
Maybe oldskool and/or cheap, but my old 105 Rim brakes are 12 years old going strong. A good fettling regime, swapping out pads and cables when needed, and still rides beautiful and stops like new. Do we know how much stock shimano hold and do i have to buy a replacement set?
I still ride older steel frame bikes with period equipment. Nothing in that era compared to Campagnolo. Totally beautiful execution. I can see how those who ride more modern bikes aren't happy with Campy, but it's a form of what is called a first-world problem. I ride for pleasure, not competitively.
I had always loved Campagnolo groupsets and wheelsets. I had Ergopower Record from 93, 95, 97, 98, 00 and few others (couldn't quite remember after obtaining too many). I still love the early versions the most which look powerful and are also actually robust.
I ride grx di2 and the last mechanical ultegra. I only notice the difference when I need to change gears all the way from the biggest to the smallest ring. Otherwise it's just a fancy gimmic =O
OK I'm not a sporting cyclist, just your ordinary love cycling guy, back in the 70s I had an altercation with a volvo whilst riding to work, the resulting insurance settlement enabled me to have a hand built frame made for me and I splashed out on Campag dérailleurs and hubs and here we are in 2024 and those components are still operating perfectly. The quality of manufacture is literally second to none in my opinion, long live Campag 🎉🎉
Until the battery fails (which batteries will) mid ride then you're screwed because no one brings spare Shimano batteries during rides. Great thing about Sram is that you have 2 batteries already and you can bring 1 spare which can work on either FD or RD.
@nop790 I've never had a Di2 battery fail. A couple of times I've had batteries run so low mid-ride that I can only use the rear derailleur. I avoid that by charging up my batteries at the beginning of each month (two bikes). I could go quite a bit longer between charges, but this way I never forget. I've never actually tried a Sram electronic. I once road a Sram mechanical for a day, and it was perfectly fine (after about five minutes to get used to it). I would not hesitate to buy a bike with Etap.
After 20 years with campag, I am done with them after the introduction of the WRL. Sram axs works very well and I like the extended gearing with 12 speed. And love the simplicity as well.
Campagnolo is like any high-end Italian stuff -- when it's working, it's a dream and it's beautiful and superior to the competition. When it's not working, you ask why did you get it?
To slag off Campagnolo now is a disservice to the company and to it's many users. Sure Campagnolo moves at a slower development pace but for good reason. Kit doesn't get outdated in a couple of years and finding replacement parts is easy and parts are serviceable. Not so for Shimano and SRAM. Sure Campagnolo may cost more up front, but it'll outlast Shimano and SRAM by a long shot. Yes, I've been on Campagnlo for decades, but I have lots of friends who use the other two and say it works better, lighter, yadda yadda but when it breaks, which is inevitable, they are paying to replace, not repair. THAT is the big advantage Campy has.
I am a huge Campag fanboy. Unfortunately I can't afford it now. I still have Super Record on my 2013 Venge. Now I'm a Di2 fan. I also have SRAM Rival and Force, I still like the Shimano better. It's just a little smoother.
FYI Wiggle are still very much alive and kicking. Hopefully a buyer will be found (if not already) but in the meantime i have still been using them and still receiving the same excellent service. I find it a shame that large parts of the cycling media seem to have completely written them off already. As a consumer I want to see them continue, if only to keep the marketplace competitive.
Tragically, they're not posting to Australia, at least currently. When I hopped on the website a few weeks ago and got that message, I nearly went and had a stiff drink to mourn....
Love Shimano - because it's reliable af, regardless of the gen, you can always be sure that their products hold up to a certain standard (unless you go for something like Tourney, or mixed components). They look really good and slick, and just feel right on any bike. Tolerate SRAM - I mean tolerate wouldn't be precise here, because I really like SRAM, they are so creative and are always innovating, pushing the boundaries. I would go as far as to say that without SRAM, Shimano would sit way too comfortably on their products and the quality and development of new technologies would drop considerably. On top of that, I really like brake modulation when riding down the trails on my MTB. I don't like the black cassettes on MTB tho, and some Road components look weird. Kill Campagnolo - yeah, some components look amazing, but some look really outdated but in a weird way, because they try to mix the classic look with modern stuff creating a weird hybrid that doesn't really work. Functionality is pretty good, but you can't compare it to the other two. Plus, it's expensive af. For me this brand died 20 years ago, they just haven't gotten the memo yet.
I've had Campy carbon gravel wheelset twice through the mud at Unbound without a hitch. Also have Ekar which is great and super light plus 13 speed. I'll never go to wireless until there's a real advantage to doing so
Dura Ace -> electronic, Ultra -> electronic, 105 -> electronic/mechanic, SRAM except Apex -> electronic only, Campagnolo mechanic and electronic. I guess the choices for an actual up to date mechanical group sets are very limited.
@@RekiemerWell Apex is tho only group set which is electronic or mechanical. Apex is a great budget Group set. The only turn of for me is the DOT Fluid. You'll have to change every two years which is a little bit of effort if you do it by yourself.
When one adds electricity to a bicycle it becomes an e-bike, thus no longer a bicycle. It becomes an electric moped. Adding hydraulic fluid makes it even more dubious.
Never used Campag, so I can't comment on them, really. They seem super fancy. If I was going mechanical, I'd go for Shimano. I prefer the shifting, I prefer the brakes and it's just so modular. Going electronic? SRAM or Shimano. Whichever is cheaper at the time.
I personally don't like the proprietary practices of Campagnolo, like their cable housings. Shimano, SRAM, Jagwire, etc. Brake: 5 mm Shift: 4 mm Campagnolo on the other hand Brake: 4.9 mm Shift: 4.1 mm Even their replacement BB bearings are different too. It's basically a 6805 bearing, but it needs to be 6 mm thick instead of 7 mm. I don't know if it's just me, but I don't find Campagnolo ErgoPower to be ergonomic for me. For their EPS groupsets, I don't like how they tie wires as part of each component and their connector heads aren't small either.
Currently on 11 spd 105 rim on my winter bike and just got a time alpe d'huez with chorus 12spd disc on that. Used ultegra 11 spd rim too. All i can say is the shimano ones are great for reliability and ease of use and maintenance. The chorus is new for me but the few rides ive been out on (when its dry) it feels lovely...plus it looks amazing!
I have Shimano 2x11 Ultegra disc on my Roubaix, works really well, lovely quiet gearchange-I did however have the crank failure but changed it and binned the broken one before Shimano came up with the exchange scheme. My mtb has SRAM Eagle 12 on it which just works-but it is a clunky mechanical sounding gearchange. My gravel bike has a SRAM 1x11 Force groupset which has been fine until fairly recently but now changes to a higher gear often hang and require 2 clicks to get the change to happen followed by 1 back otherwise the gear’s will decide to go up again at some inappropriate time. The bike is just over 3 years old and has 6700 miles on it and it’s been doing this for the last 1,000 miles roughly. Chainwheel is fine, block is fine, chain is within limits, I replaced the inner cable and it has a full length outer so shouldn’t be any issues there-I will get there eventually-but in the meantime I just manage it and ride my bike……
I still love the SRAM Red 10 speed tap system I been using since 2008. I never got used to Shimanos combinated braking and gearing on the same shiftlevel. Especialy the left one . Instead of shifing it became a emergensybraking.
Disc brakes, electronic shifting group and integrated cockpit just make the wheels expensive and more difficult to maintain. No normal driver needs something like that.
Ridden and raced exclusively campagnolo for the last 15 years. Mechanical groups are far and above anything else. Their wheels are truly underrated as well. Their current offerings (WRL specifically, having been riding it since its launch) seem to be missing the mark. They are not offering enough solutions, and their top, 'luxury' groupset (WRL) is good, but doesn't cross into that great territory that their mechanical groups and even EPS did
Problem with etap is the connection from shifters to the system. Had this problem with two bikes now. Love the possibility to shift up and down on the derailleur when the batt is dead
Isn't the mindset to kill mechanical shifting reinforcing the current higher expense of bikes? It wasn't a few weeks back this group was bashing GCN for their view on high-end bikes, but at the same time, never ever would you be able to have a quality $500-1000 bike with electronic shifting. Even if the prices get better, APEX AXS is still $1000 today. That would have to get down to $100-200 for an entire groupset to make its way onto entry bikes. Even though Di2 is my favorite feelings, I'd love SRAM, tolerate mechanical, and kill Shimano. One of the biggest advantages of electronic is wireless. Imagine the home mechanic and bike shop efficiencies that could come from just slapping on a new derailleur, shifter, etc. The SRAM ecosystem (even though I prefer Shimano feel) is just so consumer friendly when it comes to upgrading and barrier to entry and ability to upgrade components over time individually.
Campag bora and bora wto wheels are brilliant. Mine have had a battering over the years and seen some shit weather. I’m no lightweight either and they have been flawless. Rim brake with red Campag pads also been great even in the Dolomites and the Alps and in the wet, they’ve no right to be but they just are.
Electronic shifting 👎. It’s a bicycle, not a calculator. I believe there are a lot of cyclists who would agree that fully analog bikes are a kind of Platonic ideal
I have no idea what you guys are saying regarding 11 speed mechanicals. I just upgraded from Campy Athena 8s to their silver 11 speed Centaur. The shfiting is fantastic and the braking with the Scirroco wheels is par excellente and it is just plain beautiful.
Hell no. I'll take my rim brake Campag centaur over electronic groupsets anyday. It works well, it never requires adjustment and it is made so you can repair it with ease.
I haven't used SRAM but I've been around many who do / have and my impression is that it isn't all that reliable and robust but that may not be a fair assessment as the guys I know who use it break most things. I use Shimano exclusively on my mountain bikes and have always been happy with it, for road and gravel I've used both but predominantly Campag. I appreciate 105 on my utility/travel bike because it's easy to get parts and cheap to fix almost anywhere. For my latest build I've gone Campag wireless if only to future proof the new road rig even if I'm not particularly a fan of electronic shifting. Hopefully I'm not disappointed as (as everyone has said) the prices are eye watering. My retired road bike had Campag Super Record mechanical and was as close to perfect as any group I've had. So it's a tough one. I've always been a big fan of Campag and Colnago and even though I'm dropping new levels of hard earned cash on that combo I do feel like both companies have kind of lost their way when it comes to actual cyclists and are "levelling up" to the guys who buy Lamborghinis and put 200 km a year on a bike while leaving us regular folk behind. Waiting for the news release about Campag being bought by LVMH.
My sentiments entirely. I was a die-hard Campy fan. During COVID I built my dream Colnago with a 12sp Super Record mechanical groupset, and to be honest, was so underwhelmed, both by the Colnago and the groupset. I am now sold on the simplicity of Sram AXS, and the new Red upgrade that has been leaked online looks really promising(from an aesthetic point of view).
@@quentendeclercq4792 Firstly the finish of the carbon on the groupset doesn't look great. TBH, it looks more like plastic than carbon. My previous 10spd Ultra Torque groupset was beautiful. Secondly, I had two front mechs break with a few hundred K's on each of them. The first one didn't even break while riding. I left it in the big ring overnight and in the morning it was broken. The aluminium failed due to the spring tension. The second broke in exactly the same place during a ride. Have you tried lately to get a replacement front derailleur from your local bike shop? I waited a few weeks for one (but I am in Australia). Luckily I had my old 10 spd FD to keep me going. As for the Colnago, it does ride beautifully like all Colnagos do, but my frame has a few spots in the clearcoat that shouldn't be there on such an expensive frame. It's a V2-R that I got on special when the V3-Rs got released. Perhaps a C64 would have been better, but at the time was twice the cost.
I never met a mechanic who would kill off mechanical ahifting before. It kinda shock me to hear this video. As a mechanic I think electronical shifting is boring and mechanical is golden. If I were a racer, other way around. Also they talk about shifting only. But there are so many other things to consider. Like the different bb and crankset standards. I'd personally fuck Sram to hell with a shotgun with their gxp and sram Dubs.
I like these new shorter bits - the whole podcasts are so long that I don't make it through them. I commented on another video that chapter markers would be amazing.
Campag 12 speed mechanical works really well. Ekar 13s is, even under muddiest conditions more robust than those overestimated disc brakes which deteriorate quicker than a dry cookie. Both systems require different handling than the others Systems though.
If you told someone 15 years ago that the newest, most advanced Campagnolo groupset is basically a copy of Sram they'd call you insane 😂 oh how have tables turned
I come fron riding Sram Force AXS for two years and now because of an accident a I have been riding a bike with Ultegra mechanical and I can´t be happier... Electronic shifting its nice but this ultegra works great, no worries with bateries and their disc brake system its waaaay better than Sram ones. Do I can live with the mechanical ultegra and race with it? Yesssss!
My favorite setup is a 1x11 Srampagnolo. Campag ergopower shifters (the better one, from 2011-2014). Left shifter gutted to act just as a brake lever. Sram cranks, X-Sync narrow wide. Wheels mfg GXP bottom bracket (don't use sram GXP its crap). KMC chain. 32-12 cassette with a medium cage campag derailleur.
I have always used Shimano, road group sets, both Ultegra and DuraAce, mechanical and DI2. Really love the DI2. Certainly SRAM AXS E Tap certainly has my interest. Campagnolo never used and the prices were always very high. Now with what I have heard reported from time to time with issues with certain Campagnolo group sets, not sure I would ever use, or even consider using on a bike build.
As a former Campag fan I have or all my bikes equiped with them, groupsets and wheels. They are all rim brake mechanicals. I am so disappointed with the path they chose to go right now, and sadly it seems there is no going back. My next build will be sram or shimano even though I hated them, since they seems to be ones that makes sense both in price and product itself.
I recently had to (re) install late generation 11 speed mechanical Campag Chorus 11 speed on a friend's bike with through-bar routing for both brake and gear cables. If you want an object lesson in (a) why Campagnolo lost its way after ten speed and (b) why it is kill for mechanical shifting, there you have it.
The issue with el. shifting is that you pay SO MUCH MORE for just such tiny improvement in overall experience. That amount of extra money spent anywhere else could make you noticeably faster, here you "just" get slightly better feel.
I have Di2, EPS and Etap. Never in almost 8 years of using electronic shifting have I had a battery charge issue. Anyone who has either had a faulty battery or is an idiot who can’t remember basics. They’re the person who’s late because their alarm on their phone didn’t go off.
When I was a kid I dreamed of having a Campy-equipped Reynolds 531 or comparable Columbus road bike but it was completely out of my price range so I settled for a 531 main triangle Trek outfitted with Suntour components. It was nice enough and served me well for over 20 years, but when it was time to get a new bike (bent the fork in an accident and it was nearly impossible to find decent new parts to upgrade it, plus it was just time to move on), I was finally able to fulfill my dream and built myself a mostly Campy-equipped Ti bike. Sure, it was only Centaur and there was some Shimano on there too (I bought the wheels first and they had Shimano hubs, plus I preferred Shimano Ultegra rim brakes and Dura-Ace pedals), but the drivetrain was mostly Campy and that was good enough for me. The only real issue has been getting Shimano cassettes to work with Campy shifters and the rear derailleurs, but I figured out how to adjust the cog spacing to just about make it work without noise. Of course the tech has vastly progressed since then (I built it up just over 20 years ago), but it's still good enough for my needs. When it's time to upgrade, I'll have a lot of thinking to do. But that can wait a while.
Shimano mechanical always works, set it and forget it. How many riders with electronic shifting do you know that got stuck in one gear while out riding. I rode SRAM Red ten speed last summer didn't like the double tap. I replaced it with Shimano Dura-Ace 11 speed front /rear derailleur's, Ultegra rim brake shifters/cassette. No issues.
Electronic shifting should cost half the price of the mechanical groupset. It is much less expensive to make it than mechanical. Just 2 buttons. it is a ripoff.
Jimi Styles! Rockin' the tactical vest, remnant from his combat tour in the Falklands. Emily perched high as if to remember her previous life aboard a helicopter gunship. It's how these two met, after all; war time romance blossoms back home. Nick, the hapless Argentine, with a captioned question mark permanently floating above his head. How can you not love him anyway.
Can take my mechanical groups from my dead cold hands. AXS rear derailleur not shifting? time to spend $$$ to get a new one. Mechanical shifter not shifting? a few screws and you are sorted. In the process of upgrading my ti rim brake road brake to record 12 mechanical. It's gorgeous and i'm confident will last a long time.
I've always wanted Campy but it was expensive and had limitations with applications. I always rode Shimano and loved it. The design and shifting were nice. I didn't like SRAM and the Double-Tap but having a few bikes with AXS, I've become a SRAM convert. All my bikes are now SRAM equipped. I still like the look and shift modes of Shimano, but I just like the simplicity of the SRAM shifting and setup. Although, the latest SRAM AXS looks really nice rivaling that of Shimano. But yeah, Campy had the best looking parts of all.
Ten years ago, I couldn't imagine using anything but Shimano. Today, all my bikes have SRAM. ETAP works so well and it's so easy to work on. Shimano seems to have slowly become worse to work on over the past ten years.
Love my Campy. The only groupset I'll just stare at cause its dead sexy. And I love the battery life I have and the feel of the shifts (12sp EPS, not wireless tho). And still love the mechanical SR 11sp i have on my winter bike. 100% reliable and precise.
Having ridden and wrenched all three in mechanical form over the years, I've never had any long-term issues of performance or maintenance w/ Campag on road or gravel. SRAM and Shimano are terrible shifting performers for road. Maybe that's changed with their electronic groups considering they can "tune" the slop out of their shifters and derailleurs that way. SRAM double tap is just bad. For MTB, I'd stick with Shimano XT line . Best bang for the buck regarding longevity, maintenance, and variability. Easy to maintain and repair (to a degree) when on bike camping /touring trips. It's also truly daft for these guys to champion killing off mechanical shifting as if the ONLY market for cycling is high end riders and clients they wrench for without any consideration to how 90% of riders out there like the reliability and price point of mechanical shifting. If you're deep into and the batteries die or malfunction you're SOL. My 2005 Chorus grouppo still shifts and rides flawlessly. That's not something you can say about the electronic shifting.
always had campa mid range groups, now also ultegra 11sp for my commuter. Build quality is a massive disappointment, but campa has no alternative near the price anymore and fast becoming irrelevant I fear if they don't change and innovate.
Is this the same Jimmy that constantly complains about the cost of new bikes who is now recommending killing off mechanical shifting? Electric groupsets cost more than my entire bike.
I think it’s to early to discuss about the Electronic Shifting because we don’t know how long it will last until it stops working. And many mechanical groupsets still working after a 10 years of using. And the electronic if it doesn’t work you have to change the component. For a mechanical there so many part that can replace and more cheap to fix, obviously.
![Seungmin "그렇게, 천천히, 우리(As we are)" | [Stray Kids : SKZ-PLAYER]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/kAzmhLHePqU/mqdefault.jpg)
SRAM if you’re running a 1x, Shimano if a 2x, Campagnolo if you’ve run out of ideas to spend money
Never had a Problem with my 2 by Force or my Campa Ekar.
Perfect 👍👍
😂
Exactly
Sram GX Eagle (12x) on my Main MTB, NX Eagle (12x) on my Fun-MTB
Shimano 105 on my All-Road (It is a Gravel Frame, but at least 65% used on Raod, with a 2by setup etc.)
Rim Chorus 12 is the best bang for your buck road groupset on the market.
The price of the bike today. Killing the mechanical shifting would be a dumb idea.
Agreed, but if we had only the three options, and had to kill one, as much as I love mechanical shifting, and it's what I'm CHOOSING for my next mtb build, I would kill it off too if electronic were the only other 2 options. And I want to add: I love mechanical shifting. I have many bikes that I love riding with it.
From the perspective of the ones that get everything paid for them of course they promote wireless and electronic....
it's all mechanical in that shifting is accomplished by moving a cage and thereby forcing the chain up and down a set of gears. The difference lies solely in how the cage is moved. Calling any groupset "electronic" is not telling the whole story.
China got $500 electronic groupsets.
@@michaeltsui3435 so do Shimano and Sram. They are just charging you three times what they cost.
Having worked in the industry, I can say from experience that it is easy to lose the customer's perspective. We know that most people who buy a bike after not riding for years typically ride their new bike a lot for a couple seasons and then it generally sits in storage, only coming out once in a while for casual rides, if at all. The primary reason for this isn't so much attention span as it is in maintaining riding fitness. Riding is like dieting; you don't have to stop doing it very long before you are back where you started from. When your focus is on bikes all the time, you can lose sight of the fact that for most people their bikes are an accessory to their life. They expect it to be like a lawn mower, just sitting quietly, waiting to roar back to life when the grass needs cutting again.
Electronic shifting is likely to fail to meet the average user's long term expectations. Sure, it will be fine for that first two seasons, and the recharge requirements are pretty light, especially considering the overhead people are used to applying to their cell phones. But when that rider decides to get back to riding again after the bike has been sitting idly from the last really nice day in September, to when the work load lightened up in June, will the battery even take a charge? What if the bike sits unridden for two years? Three? How much will the replacement batteries cost, and will the total service charge estimate be so much that the customer will simply decide not to fix the bike and to do something else, instead?
At our local bike co-op, we see a lot of bikes come in that have sat unridden anywhere from a couple years to multiple decades. If we think it's a bike someone will want to ride again, we can always bring it back to life. There are ten year old groupsets for which manufacturers no longer carry replacement parts, so when these electronic groupsets reach that point, I have no expectation that replacement batteries and cables will be available. I expect that as electronic shifting becomes more widespread, we will see sporadically used five year old bikes that need hundreds of dollars in parts and labor to get them shifting again.
So, don't kill off mechanical groupsets. Their low overhead means they are the only thing that make sense for most people.
Real world perspective.
First of all, mechanical groupsets are simply fantastic. They work, and it's affordable. Electronics are just out of my range. It's easy for you guys actually not paying for anything. We poor chumps Pay for our stuff. In any case I own all three brands, Shimano is much more refined than Sram, Sram system is different but not bad in any way. Campagnolo is outright beautiful eye candy, great looking.
Apart from the price tag, I will never ever charge any battery for a bike ride (except when I am due to switch to an E-Bike).
Never.
I hate batteries on bikes.
May I ask you, what Groupsets you are using?
For the Gravel and Road Groupsets I am with you. But for MTB Groupsets I think the shifting is a bit smoother.
Couldn't agree more, Shimano Ultegra R8000 is an absolute winner,it is absolutely flawless. You never have to worry about dropping your chain or running out of power or being stuck in one gear because the system has failed. I've got SRAM force AXS on one of my bikes and it's absolute rubbish, wished I had never purchased it,had nothing but problems with it.
@@viktor1511 GRX for my gravel, Altus for my commuter, SRAM Rival for my road, and Campi Record for my racer. No MTB yet.
@@jeremyowens441 I have Ultergra Di2 12sp and 11sp SRAM Apex 1x on my bikes and both are absolutely fantastic, but once I experienced electronic shifting I am never going back. It is just so much nicer, easier, more precise and surprisingly lower maintenance then mechanical stuff. .. I rode 2.5K with it so far and had to charge it once, It did drop chain once, but to be honest even mechanical 1X done that couple of times. Di2 is precise crisp and smooth shifting with minimal effort and no hustle of cables and constant adjustment to have smooth shifting. And you have to change cables each 3 or 4 years as they do get bit "sticky" and stop downshifting crisply.. Di2 is completely pointless performance wise, but so nice to use.
Veloce 9 speed was my introduction to road cycling and Campagnolo. I recently did a deep cleaning on my old groupset, that was going on a Trek 2300 build. I also degreased the chain, cassette, and chainrings so I can go full wax. Even though Veloce was the third tier groupset in its day, all cleaned up, it looks like a million bucks, and shifts like a dream all tuned up. No modern electronic groupset can get me this excited on a build or ride.
There's something for everyone, truly. I love Srams Axs for many reasons. But that does NOT mean it's for everyone. I love a good beauty of an old bike as well. Saw one recently that was a DE Rosa 90s frame that was still lugged, and he took off all the paint, repainted it, polished the lugs, put Sram Rival 22 on it, scraped off all the paint with a dremel, and did some dope anodizing..... then on top of that he switched the internals from 22 to 24 with Ratio Technology
Véloce was also my first groupset on a Bianchi. I have only upgraded my Campagnolo groupset from then on. Love Campagnolo, but all you here about from them is the outrageously expensive super record. They have lost touch.
Campy was always too steep for me, and they never really had anything truly commuter, but I still have a campy tattoo on my calf to honour the man who gave us the derailleur.
I like to rely on myself and the mechanical system, not firmware updates.😅
I have been riding/racing on Campagnolo since 1984 and it has always served me well. Every catastrophic failure I have had has been Shimano. Just put the Ekar gravel set on my bike and have had great luck with it. I am willing to spend the money for them.
I love the mechanical campagnolo. My gripe with campagnolo has always been their wheel incompatibility with shimano and sram. I love mechanical groups because I don’t race and cycling is about being off the grid and not on it. I love just taking one of my bikes at random and going out for a ride. Not worried about whether there’s enough charge in the battery.
Campag sell Shimano versions of all their wheels and Brand S 11 or 12 speed cassettes work fine with Campy shifters and derailleurs. That said, Campy chains and cassettes are harder steel and last longer.
@@Up2L842moro I'll check it out. Love campy. Maybe dress my old Bianchi cross concept with the ekar group
Campagnolo have lost their way. Their product decisions make no sense, are user hostile, are shop hostile, are OEM hostile... they have no idea who they are or who they care about anymore. The leadership and product management needs complete replacement.
They run it like the Ferrari F1 team. Even when they are winning they try really really hard to lose and they win at that😂
I sell Campagnolo. I love the brand but II can not disagree on that. They need to remove the management.
If I’m not mistaken, I have heard that Campi isn’t even going to be on bikes in the Tour De France this year😳
Notice that at 3:27, the guy who would kill off Campy says what his favorite thing in the world would be - 12sp mechanical rim brake Campy. Doesn’t that exist?
I have 9 year old Campagnolo Super Record on one of my bikes and it’s the only bike that categorically will never ever be for sale from my collection
11 speed Shimano 105 was perfect groupset.
still is
Bought the 11s 105 (5800?) groupset for like £299 at evans on some sale back in the days. Absolutely ridiculous value considering what groupsets cost these days.
I was very doubtful about Campa and their wheels until I put a pair of Shamal on my bike, which now literally flies over gravel. Sure they're expensive, but damn, they know their sh*t.
Microshift for the win
Wanted to love it but they seldom sell their stuff where it's made tho 🥹 I'm literally in Taiwan and can't get hold of their stuff easily enough for me to get it working for the long term.
I have campa mechanical 12s on my bike with campa bora wto 60 mm wheels for 3 years now. Kind of hard to set up properly but once you do it works amazing + I don't want to go wireless and disc brakes any time soon.
Campagnolo has never failed me. That's all I need to know.
Like Shimano would have failed you..?
@@tr4nnel752 I don't miss the rattle from past STI levers and I've seen enough reports of failed Shimano cranks to believe otherwise.
My 21 year old Shimano RX 100 dual pivot caliper rim brakes still provide excellent braking and im 85 kg. My 21 year old steel bike, a George Longstaff i had made to measure now has been upgraded to mechanical 12 speed Campag. Chorus. Functionally it works as well as my 11 speed Shimano Grx, both work very well. This subject can be overanylized. Just keep the drivetrain well adjusted and properly lubed, ditto brakes, whether rim or hydraulic.
We didn't kill mechanical shifting, the bike industry did. All the new high end frames are electronic shift only, and that's to keep their manufacturing costs down and profits up.
I am quite confident electronic groupsets are more expensive than a few holes and maybe mounting points for internal cable routing...
I have Super Record 12s mechanical rim brakes on my steel frame, Super Record WRL wireless on my newer titanium. I think the mechanical stuff is superb when dialed in, and I prefer the ergonomics of the mechanical shifter. Not in terms of shifting point placement (we humans turn out to be able to learn/re-learn how to shift across platforms pretty easily), but in terms of the shape of the unit. The mechanical unit just fits effortlessly into my hands. It is probably the most comfortable brake/shifter in the history of life. All brake/shifter units that need to house a hydraulic cylinder are going to be bulkier, so this is an across-the-board type of thing regardless of manufacturer.
My reason to switch to WRL is simple--electric shifting does not aggravate my arthritis. And as much as I like the lightweight simplicity of rim brakes, there really is nothing like the modulation and sheer power of disc brakes, and on this front Campagnolo really is the class leader. I never got on with SRAM discs. I have only used 1st gen Shimano discs with their finicky Ice Tech discs, the ones that warped and squeaked and rubbed beyond acceptability. I am told the 2nd gen discs are much better.
If I had non-arthritic fingers, I'd build a bike with Super Record mechanical with disc brakes, but for me at this stage of my riding career, count me in for wireless shifting. And that battery thing? What on paper might seem to be an issue is really not in the real world. Just keep it properly charged like you would your head unit or lights. I doubt anyone's going to be putting in 600 km in one ride. This is not going to be put on adventure and touring bikes.
And a word about Super Record wireless shifting. The thing is brilliant. It is blazingly quick and accurate and intuitive, and even though it is rated for a 29 tooth cog max, I put on an 11-32 for my gravel set up--and I do take this on gravel--with no problem. Just make sure to have the proper chain wrap for a 32 when installing the chain. Other than that, simply adjust the B-screw tensioner and you're off. I mention this only because if you were to go by what RUclips early reviews have said, the shifting was dodgy and unreliable. I have no idea who put their group set together. In 2 months of riding, I have *never* missed a shift, whether grinding up steep climbs, out of the saddle in a sprint, or powering through the cogs into a headwind. Either the press-release versions were undeveloped or they were assembled hastily/improperly. Can't tell whether WRL or Di2 or e-Tap is faster. If one has faster shifts as measured in a lab, it is in the millisecond range, far faster than any human is ever to feel in operation. They're all excellent, although I prefer Di-2 button placement the least. With full fingered gloves it is hard to distinguish one from the other. But I am unfamiliar with the system. No doubt using it more will make it easier. But WRL is very intuitive. Even with lobster gloves, finding the correct shift button is intuitive.
About the Levante wheel set. Yes, it is cup-and-cone, as are most of Campagnolo's wheels . . . and Shimano's Dura Ace wheels, btw. Do they allow more grit to enter their bearings? Perhaps, but I don't live in the mud and rain of the UK. But the thing with cup-and-cone? Properly adjusted and lubed, they are smoother than sealed bearing hubs. More servicing to be sure. That said, I usually use my sealed-bearing wheel set with WRL, but that's because I've become addicted to Onyx's absolute quietness and instant engagement.
So to answer the underlying question of which component manufacturer to kill off: why is this even a question? In what world do we want fewer instead of more choices?
Some have made external shields for cup and cone bearings. Back in the day people would use a section of curved pipe cleaner put in place to keep out grit. Now there are even better solutions.
Campagnolo Record Ti 10 speed, I'm still riding that about 3000km a year. Bought new in 2000. Maintained in perfect condition. If I buy any electric groupset now it won't be working 24 years from now I'm afraid... And the old record will still be going as long as I can get a few parts for the shifters, cassettes and chains
Maybe oldskool and/or cheap, but my old 105 Rim brakes are 12 years old going strong. A good fettling regime, swapping out pads and cables when needed, and still rides beautiful and stops like new. Do we know how much stock shimano hold and do i have to buy a replacement set?
I still ride older steel frame bikes with period equipment. Nothing in that era compared to Campagnolo. Totally beautiful execution. I can see how those who ride more modern bikes aren't happy with Campy, but it's a form of what is called a first-world problem. I ride for pleasure, not competitively.
I had always loved Campagnolo groupsets and wheelsets. I had Ergopower Record from 93, 95, 97, 98, 00 and few others (couldn't quite remember after obtaining too many). I still love the early versions the most which look powerful and are also actually robust.
I have never tried electronic shifting yet you guys are talking about phasing out mechanical😢
I ride grx di2 and the last mechanical ultegra. I only notice the difference when I need to change gears all the way from the biggest to the smallest ring. Otherwise it's just a fancy gimmic =O
OK I'm not a sporting cyclist, just your ordinary love cycling guy, back in the 70s I had an altercation with a volvo whilst riding to work, the resulting insurance settlement enabled me to have a hand built frame made for me and I splashed out on Campag dérailleurs and hubs and here we are in 2024 and those components are still operating perfectly. The quality of manufacture is literally second to none in my opinion, long live Campag 🎉🎉
Shimano Di2 is flawless in my experience. But so is my mechanical GRX.
Until the battery fails (which batteries will) mid ride then you're screwed because no one brings spare Shimano batteries during rides.
Great thing about Sram is that you have 2 batteries already and you can bring 1 spare which can work on either FD or RD.
I like my GRX 2x11, I've setup a few sram rivals with double tap, not a fan
@@nop790just keep it charged? The bike computer will even tell you when the battery is low (
@nop790 I've never had a Di2 battery fail. A couple of times I've had batteries run so low mid-ride that I can only use the rear derailleur. I avoid that by charging up my batteries at the beginning of each month (two bikes). I could go quite a bit longer between charges, but this way I never forget. I've never actually tried a Sram electronic. I once road a Sram mechanical for a day, and it was perfectly fine (after about five minutes to get used to it). I would not hesitate to buy a bike with Etap.
What would have been nice is USB ports for charging so you can do it anywhere. USB cables are like rat's, you are never more than 10 ft from one.
I use a 12spd mechanical rim-brake Campagnolo SR on a steel bike, I use it... beat it, I also hang the bike on a wall... It's a N=1 bike! Love it!
After 20 years with campag, I am done with them after the introduction of the WRL. Sram axs works very well and I like the extended gearing with 12 speed. And love the simplicity as well.
Campag needs a comeback
Campagnolo is like any high-end Italian stuff -- when it's working, it's a dream and it's beautiful and superior to the competition. When it's not working, you ask why did you get it?
I love your creativity when it comes to these games. This time it's _love/tolerate/hate_ . I bet the whole cycling RUclips will again follow this 👍
To slag off Campagnolo now is a disservice to the company and to it's many users. Sure Campagnolo moves at a slower development pace but for good reason. Kit doesn't get outdated in a couple of years and finding replacement parts is easy and parts are serviceable. Not so for Shimano and SRAM. Sure Campagnolo may cost more up front, but it'll outlast Shimano and SRAM by a long shot. Yes, I've been on Campagnlo for decades, but I have lots of friends who use the other two and say it works better, lighter, yadda yadda but when it breaks, which is inevitable, they are paying to replace, not repair. THAT is the big advantage Campy has.
They’re all fine. But if you like Campag it’s the law that you have to always reference it in all conversations and that must be exhausting
I am a huge Campag fanboy. Unfortunately I can't afford it now. I still have Super Record on my 2013 Venge. Now I'm a Di2 fan. I also have SRAM Rival and Force, I still like the Shimano better. It's just a little smoother.
FYI Wiggle are still very much alive and kicking. Hopefully a buyer will be found (if not already) but in the meantime i have still been using them and still receiving the same excellent service. I find it a shame that large parts of the cycling media seem to have completely written them off already. As a consumer I want to see them continue, if only to keep the marketplace competitive.
Tragically, they're not posting to Australia, at least currently. When I hopped on the website a few weeks ago and got that message, I nearly went and had a stiff drink to mourn....
With no experience of Campagnolo, I have a fantasy on it. Someday!!
Love Shimano - because it's reliable af, regardless of the gen, you can always be sure that their products hold up to a certain standard (unless you go for something like Tourney, or mixed components). They look really good and slick, and just feel right on any bike.
Tolerate SRAM - I mean tolerate wouldn't be precise here, because I really like SRAM, they are so creative and are always innovating, pushing the boundaries. I would go as far as to say that without SRAM, Shimano would sit way too comfortably on their products and the quality and development of new technologies would drop considerably. On top of that, I really like brake modulation when riding down the trails on my MTB. I don't like the black cassettes on MTB tho, and some Road components look weird.
Kill Campagnolo - yeah, some components look amazing, but some look really outdated but in a weird way, because they try to mix the classic look with modern stuff creating a weird hybrid that doesn't really work. Functionality is pretty good, but you can't compare it to the other two. Plus, it's expensive af. For me this brand died 20 years ago, they just haven't gotten the memo yet.
Unless it's Ultegra o Duraace literally falling apart
I've had Campy carbon gravel wheelset twice through the mud at Unbound without a hitch. Also have Ekar which is great and super light plus 13 speed. I'll never go to wireless until there's a real advantage to doing so
Dura Ace -> electronic, Ultra -> electronic, 105 -> electronic/mechanic, SRAM except Apex -> electronic only, Campagnolo mechanic and electronic.
I guess the choices for an actual up to date mechanical group sets are very limited.
what about APEX? considering grx822 1x12 vs Apex 1x12 for my new bike
@@RekiemerWell Apex is tho only group set which is electronic or mechanical. Apex is a great budget Group set. The only turn of for me is the DOT Fluid. You'll have to change every two years which is a little bit of effort if you do it by yourself.
When one adds electricity to a bicycle it becomes an e-bike, thus no longer a bicycle. It becomes an electric moped. Adding hydraulic fluid makes it even more dubious.
Campag's downfall began when it tried to _compete_ with SRAM and Shimano rather just than be different from them.
Never used Campag, so I can't comment on them, really. They seem super fancy.
If I was going mechanical, I'd go for Shimano. I prefer the shifting, I prefer the brakes and it's just so modular.
Going electronic? SRAM or Shimano. Whichever is cheaper at the time.
I personally don't like the proprietary practices of Campagnolo, like their cable housings.
Shimano, SRAM, Jagwire, etc.
Brake: 5 mm
Shift: 4 mm
Campagnolo on the other hand
Brake: 4.9 mm
Shift: 4.1 mm
Even their replacement BB bearings are different too. It's basically a 6805 bearing, but it needs to be 6 mm thick instead of 7 mm.
I don't know if it's just me, but I don't find Campagnolo ErgoPower to be ergonomic for me.
For their EPS groupsets, I don't like how they tie wires as part of each component and their connector heads aren't small either.
Currently on 11 spd 105 rim on my winter bike and just got a time alpe d'huez with chorus 12spd disc on that. Used ultegra 11 spd rim too. All i can say is the shimano ones are great for reliability and ease of use and maintenance. The chorus is new for me but the few rides ive been out on (when its dry) it feels lovely...plus it looks amazing!
Unless the price of wireless is going down there will always be a place for mechanical shifting.
I have Shimano 2x11 Ultegra disc on my Roubaix, works really well, lovely quiet gearchange-I did however have the crank failure but changed it and binned the broken one before Shimano came up with the exchange scheme. My mtb has SRAM Eagle 12 on it which just works-but it is a clunky mechanical sounding gearchange. My gravel bike has a SRAM 1x11 Force groupset which has been fine until fairly recently but now changes to a higher gear often hang and require 2 clicks to get the change to happen followed by 1 back otherwise the gear’s will decide to go up again at some inappropriate time. The bike is just over 3 years old and has 6700 miles on it and it’s been doing this for the last 1,000 miles roughly. Chainwheel is fine, block is fine, chain is within limits, I replaced the inner cable and it has a full length outer so shouldn’t be any issues there-I will get there eventually-but in the meantime I just manage it and ride my bike……
Same thing with the but with AXS. One gear just does not want to shift quite right.
I still love the SRAM Red 10 speed tap system I been using since 2008.
I never got used to Shimanos combinated braking and gearing on the same shiftlevel.
Especialy the left one . Instead of shifing it became a emergensybraking.
Disc brakes, electronic shifting group and integrated cockpit just make the wheels expensive and more difficult to maintain.
No normal driver needs something like that.
Ridden and raced exclusively campagnolo for the last 15 years. Mechanical groups are far and above anything else. Their wheels are truly underrated as well. Their current offerings (WRL specifically, having been riding it since its launch) seem to be missing the mark. They are not offering enough solutions, and their top, 'luxury' groupset (WRL) is good, but doesn't cross into that great territory that their mechanical groups and even EPS did
Race for 15 years?! I see you didn’t saying winning. Campag is done. Absolute garbage compared to either Shimano Di2 or SRAM AXS.
@@LifeCycle1978 😂 def not winning. Just 3 am wins to my name, 1 cat3 and 2 cat1/2, maybe it is the campys fault I suck! Never thought of that!
Super Record/Record mechanical rim brake groupset on my Litespeed Titanium frame.
That was the group set to own. However, it's hard to get parts and it's a little fininky to set up and keep running.
As a longtime Campy rider, I totally agree with your assessment about the current state of the company.
Problem with etap is the connection from shifters to the system. Had this problem with two bikes now. Love the possibility to shift up and down on the derailleur when the batt is dead
campagnolo forever
Isn't the mindset to kill mechanical shifting reinforcing the current higher expense of bikes? It wasn't a few weeks back this group was bashing GCN for their view on high-end bikes, but at the same time, never ever would you be able to have a quality $500-1000 bike with electronic shifting. Even if the prices get better, APEX AXS is still $1000 today. That would have to get down to $100-200 for an entire groupset to make its way onto entry bikes.
Even though Di2 is my favorite feelings, I'd love SRAM, tolerate mechanical, and kill Shimano. One of the biggest advantages of electronic is wireless. Imagine the home mechanic and bike shop efficiencies that could come from just slapping on a new derailleur, shifter, etc. The SRAM ecosystem (even though I prefer Shimano feel) is just so consumer friendly when it comes to upgrading and barrier to entry and ability to upgrade components over time individually.
I've been running a Shimano XT M770 HollowTek 2 crank since 2008. It still has the original middle and large chainrings😁👍👍
Campag bora and bora wto wheels are brilliant. Mine have had a battering over the years and seen some shit weather. I’m no lightweight either and they have been flawless. Rim brake with red Campag pads also been great even in the Dolomites and the Alps and in the wet, they’ve no right to be but they just are.
Electronic shifting 👎. It’s a bicycle, not a calculator. I believe there are a lot of cyclists who would agree that fully analog bikes are a kind of Platonic ideal
question: If you were ordering a time ADHX, would you choose the force group and nicer vision wheels or the e group with the stock vision wheels
I have no idea what you guys are saying regarding 11 speed mechanicals. I just upgraded from Campy Athena 8s to their silver 11 speed Centaur. The shfiting is fantastic and the braking with the Scirroco wheels is par excellente and it is just plain beautiful.
You are right about Dura ace 9 speed. My first road race bike had that group, and i wish i kept it.
Still riding it❤
Hell no. I'll take my rim brake Campag centaur over electronic groupsets anyday. It works well, it never requires adjustment and it is made so you can repair it with ease.
I haven't used SRAM but I've been around many who do / have and my impression is that it isn't all that reliable and robust but that may not be a fair assessment as the guys I know who use it break most things. I use Shimano exclusively on my mountain bikes and have always been happy with it, for road and gravel I've used both but predominantly Campag. I appreciate 105 on my utility/travel bike because it's easy to get parts and cheap to fix almost anywhere. For my latest build I've gone Campag wireless if only to future proof the new road rig even if I'm not particularly a fan of electronic shifting. Hopefully I'm not disappointed as (as everyone has said) the prices are eye watering. My retired road bike had Campag Super Record mechanical and was as close to perfect as any group I've had. So it's a tough one. I've always been a big fan of Campag and Colnago and even though I'm dropping new levels of hard earned cash on that combo I do feel like both companies have kind of lost their way when it comes to actual cyclists and are "levelling up" to the guys who buy Lamborghinis and put 200 km a year on a bike while leaving us regular folk behind. Waiting for the news release about Campag being bought by LVMH.
My sentiments entirely. I was a die-hard Campy fan. During COVID I built my dream Colnago with a 12sp Super Record mechanical groupset, and to be honest, was so underwhelmed, both by the Colnago and the groupset. I am now sold on the simplicity of Sram AXS, and the new Red upgrade that has been leaked online looks really promising(from an aesthetic point of view).
what didn't you like about the colnago and the group? we are talking about 2 of the most iconic brands of cycling products. genuine question btw.
@@quentendeclercq4792 Firstly the finish of the carbon on the groupset doesn't look great. TBH, it looks more like plastic than carbon. My previous 10spd Ultra Torque groupset was beautiful. Secondly, I had two front mechs break with a few hundred K's on each of them. The first one didn't even break while riding. I left it in the big ring overnight and in the morning it was broken. The aluminium failed due to the spring tension. The second broke in exactly the same place during a ride. Have you tried lately to get a replacement front derailleur from your local bike shop? I waited a few weeks for one (but I am in Australia). Luckily I had my old 10 spd FD to keep me going. As for the Colnago, it does ride beautifully like all Colnagos do, but my frame has a few spots in the clearcoat that shouldn't be there on such an expensive frame. It's a V2-R that I got on special when the V3-Rs got released. Perhaps a C64 would have been better, but at the time was twice the cost.
I never met a mechanic who would kill off mechanical ahifting before. It kinda shock me to hear this video. As a mechanic I think electronical shifting is boring and mechanical is golden. If I were a racer, other way around.
Also they talk about shifting only. But there are so many other things to consider. Like the different bb and crankset standards. I'd personally fuck Sram to hell with a shotgun with their gxp and sram Dubs.
I like these new shorter bits - the whole podcasts are so long that I don't make it through them. I commented on another video that chapter markers would be amazing.
Campag 12 speed mechanical works really well. Ekar 13s is, even under muddiest conditions more robust than those overestimated disc brakes which deteriorate quicker than a dry cookie. Both systems require different handling than the others Systems though.
If you told someone 15 years ago that the newest, most advanced Campagnolo groupset is basically a copy of Sram they'd call you insane 😂 oh how have tables turned
Not a copy. They made the front shifting work.
@@ultimobici.are u the same ultimobici from weightweenies?
@@ultimobici. 👍🤣
I had Sram Rival 10sp and my front derailleur was constently dropping my chain. Now 105 11sp and won't look back.
Campagnolo is the go to shimano works well great on my MTB bikes Sram been there not again
Shimano wears out, Campagnolo wears in. SRAM road hydraulic brakes SUCK.
They all wear out.
Campagnolo worked with Magura to build their brakes, so they benefited from Magura experience and power. Campy disc brakes are the best.
I come fron riding Sram Force AXS for two years and now because of an accident a I have been riding a bike with Ultegra mechanical and I can´t be happier... Electronic shifting its nice but this ultegra works great, no worries with bateries and their disc brake system its waaaay better than Sram ones. Do I can live with the mechanical ultegra and race with it? Yesssss!
My favorite setup is a 1x11 Srampagnolo. Campag ergopower shifters (the better one, from 2011-2014). Left shifter gutted to act just as a brake lever. Sram cranks, X-Sync narrow wide. Wheels mfg GXP bottom bracket (don't use sram GXP its crap). KMC chain. 32-12 cassette with a medium cage campag derailleur.
I have always used Shimano, road group sets, both Ultegra and DuraAce, mechanical and DI2. Really love the DI2. Certainly SRAM AXS E Tap certainly has my interest. Campagnolo never used and the prices were always very high. Now with what I have heard reported from time to time with issues with certain Campagnolo group sets, not sure I would ever use, or even consider using on a bike build.
As a former Campag fan I have or all my bikes equiped with them, groupsets and wheels. They are all rim brake mechanicals. I am so disappointed with the path they chose to go right now, and sadly it seems there is no going back. My next build will be sram or shimano even though I hated them, since they seems to be ones that makes sense both in price and product itself.
Me particularly don’t need electronic shift
I recently had to (re) install late generation 11 speed mechanical Campag Chorus 11 speed on a friend's bike with through-bar routing for both brake and gear cables. If you want an object lesson in (a) why Campagnolo lost its way after ten speed and (b) why it is kill for mechanical shifting, there you have it.
The issue with el. shifting is that you pay SO MUCH MORE for just such tiny improvement in overall experience. That amount of extra money spent anywhere else could make you noticeably faster, here you "just" get slightly better feel.
I have Di2, EPS and Etap. Never in almost 8 years of using electronic shifting have I had a battery charge issue. Anyone who has either had a faulty battery or is an idiot who can’t remember basics. They’re the person who’s late because their alarm on their phone didn’t go off.
Me neither, all good all year round
When I was a kid I dreamed of having a Campy-equipped Reynolds 531 or comparable Columbus road bike but it was completely out of my price range so I settled for a 531 main triangle Trek outfitted with Suntour components. It was nice enough and served me well for over 20 years, but when it was time to get a new bike (bent the fork in an accident and it was nearly impossible to find decent new parts to upgrade it, plus it was just time to move on), I was finally able to fulfill my dream and built myself a mostly Campy-equipped Ti bike. Sure, it was only Centaur and there was some Shimano on there too (I bought the wheels first and they had Shimano hubs, plus I preferred Shimano Ultegra rim brakes and Dura-Ace pedals), but the drivetrain was mostly Campy and that was good enough for me. The only real issue has been getting Shimano cassettes to work with Campy shifters and the rear derailleurs, but I figured out how to adjust the cog spacing to just about make it work without noise. Of course the tech has vastly progressed since then (I built it up just over 20 years ago), but it's still good enough for my needs. When it's time to upgrade, I'll have a lot of thinking to do. But that can wait a while.
The question what is the issues with Shimanos GRX groupset after 6-9months.
Had Rival double tap loved it donkeys years ago now 1x rival etap just never do anything else
Shimano mechanical always works, set it and forget it. How many riders with electronic shifting do you know that got stuck in one gear while out riding. I rode SRAM Red ten speed last summer didn't like the double tap. I replaced it with Shimano Dura-Ace 11 speed front /rear derailleur's, Ultegra rim brake shifters/cassette. No issues.
Microshift??
Modern friction based Mechanical all the way. Bike drivetrains should not be battery powered.
Electronic shifting should cost half the price of the mechanical groupset. It is much less expensive to make it than mechanical. Just 2 buttons. it is a ripoff.
Jimi Styles! Rockin' the tactical vest, remnant from his combat tour in the Falklands. Emily perched high as if to remember her previous life aboard a helicopter gunship. It's how these two met, after all; war time romance blossoms back home. Nick, the hapless Argentine, with a captioned question mark permanently floating above his head. How can you not love him anyway.
I really want to try the Campagnolo Ekar, but it's just not compatible with anything that's already on my bike.
used to run sora, 105, and ultegra mechanical, then gotten an option to buy etap axs and no, I don't think I'll miss the mechanicals honestly.
Can take my mechanical groups from my dead cold hands. AXS rear derailleur not shifting? time to spend $$$ to get a new one. Mechanical shifter not shifting? a few screws and you are sorted.
In the process of upgrading my ti rim brake road brake to record 12 mechanical. It's gorgeous and i'm confident will last a long time.
I've always wanted Campy but it was expensive and had limitations with applications. I always rode Shimano and loved it. The design and shifting were nice. I didn't like SRAM and the Double-Tap but having a few bikes with AXS, I've become a SRAM convert. All my bikes are now SRAM equipped. I still like the look and shift modes of Shimano, but I just like the simplicity of the SRAM shifting and setup. Although, the latest SRAM AXS looks really nice rivaling that of Shimano. But yeah, Campy had the best looking parts of all.
Ten years ago, I couldn't imagine using anything but Shimano. Today, all my bikes have SRAM. ETAP works so well and it's so easy to work on. Shimano seems to have slowly become worse to work on over the past ten years.
Cancel electronic shifting
Love my Campy. The only groupset I'll just stare at cause its dead sexy. And I love the battery life I have and the feel of the shifts (12sp EPS, not wireless tho). And still love the mechanical SR 11sp i have on my winter bike. 100% reliable and precise.
You may have TRIED to kill off the penny farthing - I use it on my commute and just bought a new one.
Still alive baby 😈💪
That would be a video worth watching - you going to work on it.
Agree, Campag is king, shimano i ride with and sram would never touch
Having ridden and wrenched all three in mechanical form over the years, I've never had any long-term issues of performance or maintenance w/ Campag on road or gravel. SRAM and Shimano are terrible shifting performers for road. Maybe that's changed with their electronic groups considering they can "tune" the slop out of their shifters and derailleurs that way. SRAM double tap is just bad.
For MTB, I'd stick with Shimano XT line . Best bang for the buck regarding longevity, maintenance, and variability. Easy to maintain and repair (to a degree) when on bike camping /touring trips.
It's also truly daft for these guys to champion killing off mechanical shifting as if the ONLY market for cycling is high end riders and clients they wrench for without any consideration to how 90% of riders out there like the reliability and price point of mechanical shifting. If you're deep into and the batteries die or malfunction you're SOL.
My 2005 Chorus grouppo still shifts and rides flawlessly. That's not something you can say about the electronic shifting.
It's funny how modern tech can leave you feeling like you're handcranking a car just by having mechanical shifters.
I have 9speed mirage groupset its been great, better than all my shimano bikes
always had campa mid range groups, now also ultegra 11sp for my commuter. Build quality is a massive disappointment, but campa has no alternative near the price anymore and fast becoming irrelevant I fear if they don't change and innovate.
Is this the same Jimmy that constantly complains about the cost of new bikes who is now recommending killing off mechanical shifting? Electric groupsets cost more than my entire bike.
It's almost like he's been peddling the idea that 500 quid bikes are perfect just to go against the industry grain and create content for the masses.
I think it’s to early to discuss about the Electronic Shifting because we don’t know how long it will last until it stops working. And many mechanical groupsets still working after a 10 years of using.
And the electronic if it doesn’t work you have to change the component. For a mechanical there so many part that can replace and more cheap to fix, obviously.
SRAM all the way. Easiest to live with. That is so important. The practicality and simplicity of SRAM wins every time.