Brilliant analysis. So helpful and detailed for evaluating the board shape details as they relate specifically to several different Foil Drive foiling disciplines (not wing only, prone only or paddle up only). Typically we hear about one board or brand at a time and have to try to assimilate these into a coherent understanding. This discussion of a diverse range of boards from different builders SIDE-BY-SIDE was so useful for really comparing and understanding the different features for use with Foil Drive. Really great. I watched the whole thing and even enjoyed the outtakes.
Awesome Dom! And not boared at all! Fascinating insights - thank you! . I‘m sure you thought about reviewing mid size downwind boards for lightwind winging. (Amos Sultan Wing, Axis Hybrid, appletree Skipper etc) This could answer the question if, when and what for displacement features in hull shapes make sense…..
Watched till the end and garnered heaps from your input. Like the look of your DC and design characteristics. Can imagine the number of outakes to put this together. HAHA big effort
Great review. Do you have any experience or thoughts with the Appletree Skipper Prone Foil Board vs. the Appletree Pro-foil Surf V2. The Skipper has a different hull concept. It looks flatter on the bottom so I think it would plane better with FD and maybe use less battery??? I was thinking about the 4'5" 28L Skipper. I currently have the Armstrong 4'5" 34L Wing Surf board which I can get up on even with about 15% battery remaining but need to kick my legs. I am looking for a light weight prone foil board that gets up even faster and easier with less battery power in the ocean. I am 65kg and use the Unifoil Progression 170 (1100 sq. cm) and Progression 140 (900 sq. cm) front wings. Thx!
I haven’t used the skipper or the Armstrong boards, but of you give me the widths of all the boards I can hazard a guess for you. Pictures of the board outlines (top and bottom view) would help a lot. If you want you can send them on messenger (Dominic Hoskyns)
I'll be trying it for winging soon. I'm expecting it to be quite tippy so maybe hard to get up to my feet, but should be easy to get on foil when on my feet. TBH it'll be hard to beat the Axis Froth 55ltr. It's short and wide (4'6" x 24") so super stable on the water. Because of it's width I can get on foil with it in very light wind, yet because it's so short it feels very responsive when on foil so it's great for high wind as well.
@@dominichoskyns9091 I really struggled with my narrow and slightly longer wing board. But loved the performance so much, I fought through it, and now it’s easy. Worth the effort.
thx a lot for this great and interesting review. Worth to mention that the Axis hybrid do not have any plugs to mount the foildrive. So you need to build these plugs into the board or you cut off the pads and mount the low anchor.
Hello Dom and thank you for the in depth review. I have a rather odd question regarding wing foiling using the E foil assist. Am a total beginner and weight around 73kg looking to make the learning Curve as easy as fast as possible. I have three different foils to choose from, slingshot hoverglide 76 and 84 and f one gravity 2200. I also after a little bit of research i bought the slingshot LTF inflatable board. I haven't tried anything yet because of weather and work commitment but i couldn't help to think if adding an E foil assist would help Speed up the learning curve especially in marginal wind when getting on the foil would be the challenging part. I appreciated if you could advise as what would be the best option for learning. Many thanks.
Hello Dominic. Do you think the Jimmy Lewis Superfly board (5'0" x 19" 38L) could be a good choice for a downwind board for a lighter rider (67kg or 148lbs) who doesn't go that far off the coast for downwinding -- 1km or less. Thanks
hey Dom, what do think about the slingshot flying fish line up 4,2 32 lt x 21 3/4 , 4,6 35 lt x 22 , 5,0 39lt x 22 Too wide. for a 55kg rider, prone and DWing.
Not too wide. Not the best performance maybe but perfect for learning and progressing. However the hull and rocker is very important and I don’t know those boards at all. To much rocker makes getting on foil very difficult with foil assists. Flat hull best all the way to the back of the board but that’s not quite as important as having a fairly minimal rocker (ie very little curve/almost flat from the mid section to the back of the hull)
Thanks for the very in-depth review!! Regarding displacement vs planing: for the type of foils generally used for flat water pumping (by non very advanced riders), doesn't lift-off occur before reaching planing speed?
@@dominichoskyns9091 When I wrote the above I had not foil drived yet. In the meantime my FD has arrived and, after 2 sessions on a 4'8 19" 36liter board, now I understand why you gave so much importance to planing on this video. My mistake was thinking in terms of wingdinging, where hanging onto the wing helps to pop up and not to fall while pumping still at displacement speed on a small prone board. But, without the support of a wing, planing speed is required, just like a normal surfboard. And I guess it's required even with huge foils, because what dictates the limit is not the ability to come onto foil (which can be easily achieved at non-planing speeds), but the ability to pop up and remain in balance immediately after, for which planing speed is required when using a tiny board, right?
Thanks a lot for the review! For learning flatwater pumping with FD, do you think that will work with the 75 liter 5'0 that I use as wing board with FD Plus mounted in the back or is that making the process very difficult and you would recommend going directly to something like Axis Pump 37 liter?
You can definitely use a 75ltr board to learn to pump. It will make it much easier to get on foil while you are learning that technique, and when you get more experienced at that you will then be ready to move down to a smaller board which will then make pumping easier.
enjoyed your insight .........not sure if I heard you correctly, but regarding your 5' green custom.........you mentioned that it's fiberglass....(no carbon wrap?)........if so what is the glassing schedule for that board.......and if you don't mind sharing the nose and tail rocker specs......thank you for sharing your expertise......
On the Axis 4'2, do you place the box using an insert and still have enough space for your front foot, or have to use dual lock nearer the tip of the board? (I'm considering getting one :)) Thanks again for all of the info that your channel provides
Awesome looking board and design. Do you know the weight of it? Is it full carbon construction or some other materials? I am attempting to have a local foil board shaper in the USA make one for me and trying to get some more details. Thanks!
It’s 3.6kg. Made of S glass - slightly stronger and stiffer than regular fibreglass - sort of between fibreglass and carbon fibre in stiffness, strength and cost
Hello Dom. For your DC Foils 55L Downwind Board -- how much does it weigh and how thick is it? I have thought about getting into the downwind thing and did research on the longer / narrower boards (barracuda style) with paddle but I love my foil drive and it makes more sense to go with 4'10" to 5'2" x 19" wide board for downwinding and just use FD with it. I am 6'0" tall and weigh 67kg. Do you recommend I just get the exact same board you have or would you do any minor adjustments? I live in North Carolina (East Coast USA -- smaller surf). I don't have downwind experience but a lot of foiling experience and a lot of FD experience with low volume boards in the swell / surf. Thx!
The green and white DC board is 5’ x 19” x 55ltrs. I don’t know the exact thickness but I’m sure it’s over 4”, possibly 5”. At 67 kg you could easily drop to 50ltrs to make it a bit thinner. Note that the mast tracks are a bit further forward compared to true prone designs, similar to the proper DW board designs
Sorry for the multitude of questions but I got one more regarding your 5'0" x 19" (55L) prone downwind board. You say that you are very confident in the future there will be a lot of boards of this style coming out for public consumption. I really would like a board very similar to this -- any idea or guess how long before a company produces a prone downwind board like this for Foil Drive users? 1 month, 3 months, 6 months? Thx!
Awesome!!! I was thinking that you might be working with Axis on a board range. I was even guessing like 3 boards somewhere in the 4'10" to 5'2" length at 19" wide and 50L to 60L in volume. Call them Dom's Downwind Boards. I think they will sell very well to FD riders -- got 2 other friends ready to buy. I love wing foiling but if it's blowing side shore at 20-25 kts, then I really want to take a board with FD attached further out in the ocean to practice down winding and learning how to read and catch the bumps or swell. Axis has a great variety of boards but I do have one request for Dom's Downwinder Board. Can you make it a different color than red to distinguish it from all the other Axis boards. @@dominichoskyns9091
Interesting stuff! What do you think of your 55 litre board for wing? I am eyeing up a similar design but in a 80-85 litre version for light wind wing and/or DW (wing).
Brilliant analysis. So helpful and detailed for evaluating the board shape details as they relate specifically to several different Foil Drive foiling disciplines (not wing only, prone only or paddle up only). Typically we hear about one board or brand at a time and have to try to assimilate these into a coherent understanding. This discussion of a diverse range of boards from different builders SIDE-BY-SIDE was so useful for really comparing and understanding the different features for use with Foil Drive. Really great. I watched the whole thing and even enjoyed the outtakes.
Thanks so much Paul. Really appreciate the feedback, especially as this one took so long to get right👍
Some of the tips you gave me the other day make a bit more sense after listening to you speak on your different boards. great breakdown. 🤙🤙
Thank you! I’m excited to hear what you find in your FD tests with Winging boards.
U get my thumb fore the effort and outtake🎉
You deserve a good cuppa after that effort! Thanks for sharing your thoughts... 👍
Thank you Dom. Thorough as always.
Awesome Dom! And not boared at all! Fascinating insights - thank you! . I‘m sure you thought about reviewing mid size downwind boards for lightwind winging. (Amos Sultan Wing, Axis Hybrid, appletree Skipper etc) This could answer the question if, when and what for displacement features in hull shapes make sense…..
Watched till the end and garnered heaps from your input.
Like the look of your DC and design characteristics.
Can imagine the number of outakes to put this together.
HAHA
big effort
Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate it 👍
They just want a great quiver. What do u think of a 100l Armstrong FG (cause that’s what I want for winging)?
Great review. Do you have any experience or thoughts with the Appletree Skipper Prone Foil Board vs. the Appletree Pro-foil Surf V2. The Skipper has a different hull concept. It looks flatter on the bottom so I think it would plane better with FD and maybe use less battery??? I was thinking about the 4'5" 28L Skipper. I currently have the Armstrong 4'5" 34L Wing Surf board which I can get up on even with about 15% battery remaining but need to kick my legs. I am looking for a light weight prone foil board that gets up even faster and easier with less battery power in the ocean. I am 65kg and use the Unifoil Progression 170 (1100 sq. cm) and Progression 140 (900 sq. cm) front wings. Thx!
I haven’t used the skipper or the Armstrong boards, but of you give me the widths of all the boards I can hazard a guess for you. Pictures of the board outlines (top and bottom view) would help a lot. If you want you can send them on messenger (Dominic Hoskyns)
Your ideal DC board is also the ideal dimensions for efficient wing boards in my experience.
I'll be trying it for winging soon. I'm expecting it to be quite tippy so maybe hard to get up to my feet, but should be easy to get on foil when on my feet. TBH it'll be hard to beat the Axis Froth 55ltr. It's short and wide (4'6" x 24") so super stable on the water. Because of it's width I can get on foil with it in very light wind, yet because it's so short it feels very responsive when on foil so it's great for high wind as well.
@@dominichoskyns9091 I really struggled with my narrow and slightly longer wing board. But loved the performance so much, I fought through it, and now it’s easy. Worth the effort.
thx a lot for this great and interesting review. Worth to mention that the Axis hybrid do not have any plugs to mount the foildrive. So you need to build these plugs into the board or you cut off the pads and mount the low anchor.
Yeah good point - I wish I'd mentioned which boards have inserts and what mounting solutions are possible for each board. Oh well, next time...
Hello Dom and thank you for the in depth review.
I have a rather odd question regarding wing foiling using the E foil assist.
Am a total beginner and weight around 73kg looking to make the learning Curve as easy as fast as possible.
I have three different foils to choose from, slingshot hoverglide 76 and 84 and f one gravity 2200. I also after a little bit of research i bought the slingshot LTF inflatable board.
I haven't tried anything yet because of weather and work commitment but i couldn't help to think if adding an E foil assist would help Speed up the learning curve especially in marginal wind when getting on the foil would be the challenging part.
I appreciated if you could advise as what would be the best option for learning.
Many thanks.
Hello Dominic. Do you think the Jimmy Lewis Superfly board (5'0" x 19" 38L) could be a good choice for a downwind board for a lighter rider (67kg or 148lbs) who doesn't go that far off the coast for downwinding -- 1km or less. Thanks
hey Dom, what do think about the slingshot flying fish line up
4,2 32 lt x 21 3/4 ,
4,6 35 lt x 22 ,
5,0 39lt x 22
Too wide.
for a 55kg rider, prone and DWing.
Not too wide. Not the best performance maybe but perfect for learning and progressing. However the hull and rocker is very important and I don’t know those boards at all. To much rocker makes getting on foil very difficult with foil assists. Flat hull best all the way to the back of the board but that’s not quite as important as having a fairly minimal rocker (ie very little curve/almost flat from the mid section to the back of the hull)
Thanks for the very in-depth review!!
Regarding displacement vs planing: for the type of foils generally used for flat water pumping (by non very advanced riders), doesn't lift-off occur before reaching planing speed?
Yes, the huge foils generate so much lift at low speed, which is why they can be used with such tiny boards
@@dominichoskyns9091 When I wrote the above I had not foil drived yet. In the meantime my FD has arrived and, after 2 sessions on a 4'8 19" 36liter board, now I understand why you gave so much importance to planing on this video. My mistake was thinking in terms of wingdinging, where hanging onto the wing helps to pop up and not to fall while pumping still at displacement speed on a small prone board. But, without the support of a wing, planing speed is required, just like a normal surfboard. And I guess it's required even with huge foils, because what dictates the limit is not the ability to come onto foil (which can be easily achieved at non-planing speeds), but the ability to pop up and remain in balance immediately after, for which planing speed is required when using a tiny board, right?
@@nickrhodes3378 yes that’s correct. Glad what I said actually makes sense 😂
Thanks a lot for the review! For learning flatwater pumping with FD, do you think that will work with the 75 liter 5'0 that I use as wing board with FD Plus mounted in the back or is that making the process very difficult and you would recommend going directly to something like Axis Pump 37 liter?
You can definitely use a 75ltr board to learn to pump. It will make it much easier to get on foil while you are learning that technique, and when you get more experienced at that you will then be ready to move down to a smaller board which will then make pumping easier.
enjoyed your insight .........not sure if I heard you correctly, but regarding your 5' green custom.........you mentioned that it's fiberglass....(no carbon wrap?)........if so what is the glassing schedule for that board.......and if you don't mind sharing the nose and tail rocker specs......thank you for sharing your expertise......
I have no idea, sorry
On the Axis 4'2, do you place the box using an insert and still have enough space for your front foot, or have to use dual lock nearer the tip of the board? (I'm considering getting one :)) Thanks again for all of the info that your channel provides
All the Axis Pump boards have footstrap inserts in the perfect position to use a mounting plate to position the box next to my front foot
Awesome looking board and design. Do you know the weight of it? Is it full carbon construction or some other materials? I am attempting to have a local foil board shaper in the USA make one for me and trying to get some more details. Thanks!
It’s 3.6kg. Made of S glass - slightly stronger and stiffer than regular fibreglass - sort of between fibreglass and carbon fibre in stiffness, strength and cost
Hello Dom. For your DC Foils 55L Downwind Board -- how much does it weigh and how thick is it? I have thought about getting into the downwind thing and did research on the longer / narrower boards (barracuda style) with paddle but I love my foil drive and it makes more sense to go with 4'10" to 5'2" x 19" wide board for downwinding and just use FD with it. I am 6'0" tall and weigh 67kg. Do you recommend I just get the exact same board you have or would you do any minor adjustments? I live in North Carolina (East Coast USA -- smaller surf). I don't have downwind experience but a lot of foiling experience and a lot of FD experience with low volume boards in the swell / surf. Thx!
The green and white DC board is 5’ x 19” x 55ltrs. I don’t know the exact thickness but I’m sure it’s over 4”, possibly 5”.
At 67 kg you could easily drop to 50ltrs to make it a bit thinner. Note that the mast tracks are a bit further forward compared to true prone designs, similar to the proper DW board designs
What is the distance from the back of the board to the back of the tracks? You mention they are forward. Thank you! @@dominichoskyns9091
Sorry for the multitude of questions but I got one more regarding your 5'0" x 19" (55L) prone downwind board. You say that you are very confident in the future there will be a lot of boards of this style coming out for public consumption. I really would like a board very similar to this -- any idea or guess how long before a company produces a prone downwind board like this for Foil Drive users? 1 month, 3 months, 6 months? Thx!
Adrian and I have designed a range which we hope will be ready either just before or just after the new year
Awesome!!! I was thinking that you might be working with Axis on a board range. I was even guessing like 3 boards somewhere in the 4'10" to 5'2" length at 19" wide and 50L to 60L in volume. Call them Dom's Downwind Boards. I think they will sell very well to FD riders -- got 2 other friends ready to buy. I love wing foiling but if it's blowing side shore at 20-25 kts, then I really want to take a board with FD attached further out in the ocean to practice down winding and learning how to read and catch the bumps or swell. Axis has a great variety of boards but I do have one request for Dom's Downwinder Board. Can you make it a different color than red to distinguish it from all the other Axis boards. @@dominichoskyns9091
Interesting stuff! What do you think of your 55 litre board for wing? I am eyeing up a similar design but in a 80-85 litre version for light wind wing and/or DW (wing).
I haven’t used it for winging yet but I will post my thoughts on that as soon as I’ve given it a try