It was some nice wood paneling, never seemed to get damaged that is clearly where the thought went into the Galaxy class, fine wood finish at tactical no chipboard or MDF there :)
Im into electronics and want to become an electronics engineer. I love analog gauges and voltmeters and such. I always have them mounted on power supplies i make
It seems like, even outside of the types of catastrophic failures that are 100% common, the LCD panels would also be more likely to stop functioning in extreme temperatures. Buttons and knobs work a LOT better when it's 20 below!
Love the look of the Delta Flyer, but I have to admit it is pretty much the sonic screwdriver of Voyager... it happens to be able to do whatever they need it to.
I'm going to say one thing about the buttons+levers+dials vs. LCARS debate...LCARS do not exist in real-life, but buttons+levers+dials exist in real-life, and we don't see them exploding in showers of sparks constantly but LCARS do explode constantly on-screen. Buttons+levers+dials 4 life.
+MKDumas1981 consoles explode because of the plasma conduits running through it. With knobs, you will still have the same plasma conduits. The whole ship runs on plasma.
"We need a new larger shuttle for the show." "That's easy, boss. We can use the Aeroshuttle attached to the ventral saucer sect....." "Woah woah woah... the what? You don't know what you're talking about. Now do as your told and make me a new shuttle!"
Wimpoman. Well the plot DID call for a very specifically capable shuttle in that episode. An interesting thing might have been losing the aero shuttle at some point and converting its cove into a drop bay for the Delta Flyer. I think seeing more hacks amd modifications to the ship throughout the seasons would have been great, most basically existed in dialogue ( new shields and weapons, modifications to the warp drive etc) and with the move to CG the door was open to significant exterior changes.
I've always seen the schematics for AeroShuttle, but now I actually got to see it was actually viable, they even did a cg cut for it. Wonder why the never used it in the show?
He does not. as someone else said in the comments, it's pronounced 'El-cars" not 'La-cars". Not trying to be a dick, just trying to help for future reference.
I have a feeling he pronounced it "m'LON" just to piss off some stiff grammar nazis. Like, anyone that's seen the show knows the pronunciation, and Lore has a history of snarking at rules lawyers.
It's almost like this guy hasn't watched the shows and does his research online and maybe books. These videos look like a cynical way to make money off of a fandom.
Paris always seemed to be more of a "hands on" guy, he wanted to feel things. Even Scotty referenced he could tell how fast the Enterprise was going by the feel of the deck plates (TNG "Relics"). So it's not too far removed from switches and such in his generation. In Star Trek we often see the best ships, not even the real run down, civilian ships and what they may have.
About nobs and buttons. One important thing to consider is the instant feedback of something like a joy stick. I wonder how many times a ship would roll the wrong way by hitting the wrong button in combat
@@chimaican01 Don't get anyone started on ST: I... we don't have enough time for the sensible critiques to describe the sheer amount of ways that movie was stupid.
I thought it was professionally pronounced as “El-cars” according to the Star Trek sound bite on the “lcarscom dot net” website that’s still operational. Check it out 🤓
The LCARS issue is brought up in the novel "Indistinguishable From Magic", where the Enterprise E finds the NX-07 Intrepid, lost in the Earth-Romulan War. LaForge comments on the buttons that "It's better for when there is no light and power, because the switch still works" (Paraphrasing of course).
What if they let Paris design a capital ship…? After all the Flyer was his baby, designed and constructed with limited resources, imagine if he got an entire team after returning to the Alpha quadrant.
I always found it weird that we see the Delta Flyer in the series, and yet we never see the Captain's Yacht. You'd have thought they'd have used that and modified it accordingly.
The Captains Yacht was/is a _massively_ under-utilised part of the Trek universe. I mean, every ship _has_ one, yet I can't name a single episode where one features, not even an episode where the crew need to abandon ship (surely the Yacht could take a decent number of crew if push came to shove, so why was it never part of rescue or evacuation procedures?). Even in almost every video breaking down the layout and design of Star Trek ships, the _one_ part _nobody_ ever mentions, let alone breaks down and shows the design/layout, is the Captains Yacht. It's a shame really, cos they could have featured it far more and actually _used_ the damn thing, instead of it always being just another "random bit" of the main ships hull.
Lore Reloaded Absolutely. Though maybe I should give them some sort of condolence. You know, since Janeway blamed them for being polluters and proceeded to blow up their containment pods, doubtlessly causing a massive ecological disaster that the Malon were keeping contained by comparison. Goddamn, Janeway does really stupid things...
LCARS were packed with C4. any bit of battle damage would have shrapnel blown in to your face... who thought having the electronics on a starship directly powered by the EPS should be taken out back and vaporized :)
Yeah, LCARS kills, and not in a merciful way. Unlike a full-fledged Claymore, some crew live long enough to get the Final Words (usually inspiring, and not "This job BDM").
To be fair we saw in Star Trek 2 that Starfleet had exploding consoles even before LCARS. (And that they felt the need to simulate this on their bridge simulators, to the point where the simulator can actually break itself)
Well, I have a thousand hours in a plane with "steam" gauges and 2000 hours in a glass cockpit aircraft, and I will tell you, the LCD screens are a bit less reliable. They fizzle out, loose colors and do all kinds of crap. They are just easier replaced and a lot nicer while working. Also, I loved the shuttle, but I agree with EAX that the shuttle was too large for the bay. And if this shuttle is composed of 70% Crashonium, just how much are the Runabouts from DS9 made of? I wonder if they can even get coverage for them things anymore.
The Delta Flyer is in my top ten of ships. I also prefer good ol' fashioned knobs and buttons. While LCARS is useful, you constantly have to look at it. Knobs, dials, buttons, you can manipulate without looking at if you know the layout well enough. That, and they just look cool.
The Delta Flyer is cool, but I think the Colonial Blackbird episode from BSG had a much better build-up and payoff. I generally love "custom-built _____" centric episodes of any series. I really enjoy the camaraderie that these episodes usually show.
It's hard to convey time on television & film well, in my opinion, and the Blackird's construction was about the Chief and crew as well as the ship they were creating. The building of the Blackbird had the feel of building a car in a garage for the first time, and while sleek looking, it didn't have the 'fresh off the factory floor' appearance that the Flyer had. The Flyer's main window was pretty sweet looking and broke from the usual aesthetic we see inside Voyager. But clearly it's welded with explodium, or something that makes the propulsion system tilt off-center and crash... But seeing the cargo containers trailing behind the Delta Flyer when Paris & Torres tied the knot with "Just married" on the hull made me chuckle!
I love the Delta Flyer, and I also love what Tom did with the knobs and buttons. Both as a teenager and even know as an adult, I prefer something that I can physically move, over a touch screen. Feed back is a very welcome thing when you are driving/flying, and you develop muscle memory for where the most used buttons and switches are located. Kind of difficult to do that with a touch screen, more so when there may be multiple menus to go through. This is one of the many reasons I can not stand modern cars, I hate touch screens.
It's a big part of why I miss physical keyboards and genuinely can't understand why phones moved away from them. With a physical keyboard, it'd take no time to type a message without looking at the screen. With touch, it doesn't matter how good you are, those mistakes are inevitable, especially with autocorrect.
On the topic of consoles, I've always had a problem with exploding workstations in Star Trek.. Doesn't anyone in the future know what a fuse is? Why are they running the kind of power that can blow bulkheads out to run control panels?? I feel better now.
I think I would have gone with a dual joystick and pedal control configuration much like that of an attack helicopter coupled with a visor mounted heads up display for Tactical Systems targeting. The pedal switch control rotation, 1 lever weed control pitch tilt and yaw as well as lateral movement and the other Leever could control the vertical movement. The visor mounted heads up display would be worn by the Tactical officer to provide a more intuitive targeting display.
When designing the delta flyer in the holodeck it seems Tuvok was getting annoyed with tom and just needed a reason to chastise him. Which he did when he added tail fins and then they were removed. It seemed like Tuvok just generally annoyed with him in this episode and looked for any reason to chastise him in that episode.
Tom Paris is the smartest person on Voyager and if he ever went rogue would be a danger. Tuvok presumably knows this and likes to stop his ego getting too big and keep him acting professional.
@@farshnuke I can see where he is coming from but look at it from Tom Paris's prospective he is a pilot and gets to design a ship of his own as it were something that it seems he was mostly in charge of IIRC. And when Tuvok reprimands him he seems to in a nice way tell him to stfu. I liked the delta flyer only issue i had was IIRC the warp nacelles extended out or something.
@@illuminat4838 Tuvok is the 'stop having fun' guy so I understand your attitude but I sympathise with his position generally as humour can be subjective and I sometimes find it annoying or mean. (Though Tom seldom goes there) As I said my issues was that I had convinced myself through hazy half remembered viewing that the Delta Flyer was sent by Star Fleet as a super ship and the actual origin is lame by comparison
It's not that LCARS panels are more reliable - it's just that smartphones / tablets / other touchscreen technologies have become so ubiquitous by that era that people have forgotten how to use buttons and levers. Though, honestly, given Starfleet's track record I'm surprised nobody took it a stage further and used Holodeck technology to create superconfigurable 3D-projected controls that could look and feel like whatever you wanted, but were constructed with 350% additional explodium. You could have Holodeck episodes without ever leaving the bridge!
You don't "forget" how to use a well designed lever or button, touchscreens are both cheaper and easier to use in a mass production setting where you may or may not want to incrementally improve or change whatever you are producing. It's happening present day in car production, more and more cars have more and more of their controls within the infotainment system, it's much easier to reprogram the ECU to add or alter features for new models and in theory only having one failure point (the screen) is preferable to having many individual controls from a reliability and cost perspective. The downside is that the system is reliant on having power available to the unit in order for the unit to function so that if it fails EVERYTHING has effectively failed and in a Combat/Star Trek type setting they would be vulnerable to hacking or other electronic attacks that would be impossible with a simple mechanical switch. The show uses it because it looks modern and is probably much easier from a set building point of view but i seriously doubt that any military vehicle would not have at least physical and mechanical backups at the very least in a realistic setting, even far into the future especially where an enemy may be able to seize control of your systems. Of course it is possible the screen run off the same systems as the artificial gravity and so almost never fail anyway......
The knobs and buttons also allow for eye-off operations, as a physical, tactile interface does not require constant watching to know where the smooth virtual buttons are. Military personnel have previously railed against the touch-screen aesthetic of Starfleet for that reason.
They're also a lot nicer for piloting/driving. A control stick seems more natural and easier to use then pressing depictions of buttons on a touchscreen.
I would guess that the consoles would have some type of haptic feedback that would let you know where your fingers were and what you were touching. But I agree that with you and would much prefer physical buttons/levers for easier muscle memory and all.
Janeway didn't even know how to use a keyboard -_- ancient earth tech my ass. you don't just make QWERTY obsolete with touchscreens. Some fan made fun to the Joystick in that one TNG movie. i was like "Yes see manual control exists" well enough though that joystick woud still require the computer to steer but I digress
I think a lever actually makes sense for speed adjustments and a control stick for steering. Okay, you'd have to have their equivalent for power steering sure. However, pressing buttons on a flat screen just isn't the same as holding a control stick. Imagine driving not with a steering wheel etc. but with flat buttons for everything. To me, that would be unnatural and even dangerous. Sometimes (but not always) simpler can be better. And let's face it, looking at those LCARS displays, they don't seem to make much sense. They may allow the user to do a lot more. However, they seem overly complicated.
Building the Delta Flyer is known as field expediency. The rear ramp is similar to the one on the old M113 armored personnel carrier(APC). The Flyer's inside is more like "Doctor Who"'s TARDIS. Mal means bad (Latin), so the name Malan makes sense.
I always loved the Delta Flyer. The Flyer alone, even without the rest of Voyager, ranks pretty high on my list of favorite space ships in science fiction.
I grew up with knobs, dials, and levers so using the touch screens of today I have to look at what I'm doing as I don't have the tactile sensation of the knobs, buttons, and levers. Now, going by the new touch interfaces that are in science and tech museums in Tokyo that simulate the tactile feelings makes me unsure about future touchscreens... There's that... So it falls into the realm of, "I dunno" for me.
I love LCARS, but realistically, I don't think we'll ever see a world in which touchscreens are just as good as physical controls. I do think it works in Star Trek, because to an extent, they're all about breaking the "rules" to demonstrate that humanity has advanced to an inconceivable degree (see the Federation school system, which appears to teach quantum theory to very young children).
Yeah, seems unlikely. You're starting to see some aircraft have touchscreen interfaces, but not exclusively. Primary flight controls are still like they've always been, and even secondary/minor controls have physical buttons as backup in spite of the touchscreens... But really it depends on how good the touchscreens get, and the degree of automation. Primary problem with touchscreens is lack of tactile feedback. Primary advantage is dynamically reconfigurable controls. Meaning not only can you reduce clutter, since you don't need dedicated buttons for literally everything, and can alter the available controls depending on context. (eg. irrelevant controls are never visible.), but you can also alter control elements dynamically, reconfigure, update and otherwise modify interfaces without having to make any hardware alterations whatsoever. It has a lot of advantages, but... There just isn't enough tactile feedback. Or any at all, really. Current designs are literally only usable if you're looking at them. Which is often not acceptable for vehicle controls... Or typing for that matter...
Yeah you're right... remember in year of hell when Tuvok was blind and he was able to tell the computer to turn on tactile interface, then was able to read information from the panel? I imagine that what he wanted to activate was an interface which would convey tactical information to him... but LCARS panels always have a kind of haptic feedback as standard
I'm with you there. I learned to drive a car with stereo and Air-Conditioning/heating. The new cars where everything is integrated into the infotainment system throws me off badly. The idea that control interface layouts change with the touch of a button and additional controls are hidden inside nested menus is not a good thing when you're performing a MISSION CRITICAL task like driving. To make things worse, some of the newer cars are actually moving things like the gear shift away from a manual lever with positive feedback to a little digital knob with no feedback... It's what's believed to have killed Anton Yelchin. The idea that all the movement controls of a vehicle would be built into a modifiable touch-screen UI is not good. Shows like Star Trek really need the touch of an ergonomics usability engineer to make things look more plausible.
Why they had to invent this and convince us that it fits into a tiny shuttle bay when there was already a pretty capable and better looking aeroshuttle fitted to the underside of the saucer section I'll never know.
According to Star Trek lore; Voyager was on her alleged shakedown cruise prior to being drafted to chase the Maquis that Tuvok Infiltrated and launched with many of her crew and gear not yet installed. The aero shuttle was the "newest" shuttle to grace the intrepid line that was more or less in line with the Captain's Yacht that was installed in the Galaxy and Sovereign classes. The producers of the show nixed the aeroshuttle idea because they wanted the "captain's yacht" reveal on the Sovereign class USS Enterprise E in the movie to be a big impact on screen. The fact that there were schematics of the captain's yacht installed in the Galaxy Class Enterprise D on most tech manuals years BEFORE the reveal of the one on the E apparently didn't enter their minds at the time, making the "impact" moot. Suffice to say, the Delta Flyer class shuttle is roughly bigger than their smallest class 4 man capacity shuttle and roughly smaller than their biggest runabout. So it's somewhere in between the two in regards to actual size. While the runabout class is a multi-role shuttle, the Delta Flyer is more speciallized as it doesn't have the interchangeable modules that widened the runabout's role. The closest thing I can compare the Delta Flyer to is a recon-attack craft. It's got enough "teeth" to survive semi-long range missions, but only just.
Well, a (perhaps modified) aeroshuttle would have been very cool, but I suspect it was a lot easier to fit something Delta Flyer's shape and size onto sets and store it as opposed to something kind airplane-sized/needing to be CGIed in everywhere.
I am creating a fanfic series set three decades after VOY and your channel is a major one I use for research purposes. One assumption I'm making is that a successor to the Delta Flyer is a standard small shuttle for long-range exploration ships. (I also presume by that time a lot of controversy is erupting over letting something the size of the Cardassian Union into the Federation).
Yes, yes, yes. Levers and Knobs are superior interfaces! Why? You don’t have to look at them while operating. You can train a person to a degree, where operating levers and knobs becomes a reflex. Meaning that in a crisis situation, you have much quicker response time. Ever tried using an lcd panel in a car while driving? It’s a danger to the driver and the traffic as a whole, as the driver must divert his glance back from the street to the stupid panel. It escapes me how legislation allows lcd panels in cars to control basic functions such as air conditioning, heating, radio, music, etc. It’s a traffic hazard.
Concerning the knobs and switches Paris even states that they are better than the touchpad primarily a pilot does have time to look down and see what button he is pushing. The knobs and switches allow for instant feedback through touch while eyes stay glued to the "road."
Gahhhhh!!!!! Voyager did many things well. Voyager also did many things very badly. Voyager was such a mixed bag that it's no wonder I have such a love hate relationship with it. The Delta flyer totally made sense from the stand point that they were still essentially using shuttles from TNG, that were not altogether different from the original series shuttle craft. A new shuttle was desperately needed in the series. I highly question however how the craft came into being. Problems abound. I also have many cringe inducing moments with how the craft is employed. As a ship, I love the Delta Flyer. A++. I just wish it had a backstory to match it's awesome lines. And I wish they had kept the Fins that Paris originally included. Cause that look was sick.
Voyager has many faults, but the flyer made a lot of sense, it outperforms every Starfleet shuttle and would even outclass a ronabout in both speed and firepower. It was incredibly interesting to see and fascinating to watch on screen. Also, the Intrepid wasnt a pure science vessel. The Intrepid class was designed to be easily made for multiple purposes, kind of like a chassis shared by different vehicles such as Chevy trucks having the same chassis as Chevy Vans. Intrepid class vessels could be outfitted for science, medical, diplomatic, and various combat roles, this allowed Star Fleet to field a larger fleet that could be built faster and maintained more easily while still having the diversity of so many classes. Essentially, they did what every other faction had done. Star fleet purpose built every class prior to Intrepid, while the Romulans, Cardassians, Klingons and even the Vulcans in the 22nd century had built only a few classes of vessels that could be outfitted for separate purposes, this is far simpler and easier to do. Voyager specifically was built as a combat scout and escort vessel, its outfitted with a high speed warp drive so as to catch its opponents and is equipped with Type 10 torpedoes as of launch to have the firepower to back itself up. It is also equipped with over a dozen shuttles so it can act as a small carrier in combat situations or carry out scientific research during off time. Since Starfleet didnt like dedicated warships, voyager was still equipped with scientific equipment to carry out basic scientific and astronomical studies.
I liked the flyer, it’s design diverges from established convention in a similar fashion to voyager, but I couldn’t help but think it was explicitly added to reduce the shows budget, why have 20 people a 3 sets, when you can have 1 people and 1 set. And to be fair Voyager crashed a lot too, seems the 24th century can allow you to travel 70,000 light years in less than a decade, but that last 20km are really troublesome.
The flyer to me is great. It is what a basic workhorse shuttle should be. I would love to (in the future) see variants based on this or even a new version that was a bit larger but had more modular construction for mission specialization - including combat. To me there is no doubt that Section 31 would - after Voy's return or even while they have been in contact via the array - have made their own covert versions based on it's schematics. The problem with exploding consoles should be a video by itself. Part of the problem is that they are powering their control systems with warp plasma? This would be like back lighting your laptop with molten salt and then having a tank of fluoride under your keyboard. I mean...YOU COULD...but you can do a lot of things that are stupid and pointless. Delta Flyer = Good , LCARS = futuristic look compared to TOS and given special effects budget and capabilities of the time, Exploding Plasma Conduits = starfleet engineer revenge for not being in the command path. yeah we'll show those flybois!
I designed an experimental ona-of-a-kind vehicle's dasboard. First idea: We are going to implement a bunch of functions, so just put a large touchscreen there, where we can add anything later if need be. That was one of the firt design choices that went out of the window right after the first tests. It simply gives no reasonable feedback to the operator, what is not good if there is any stressful sutiation expected...
I love the Delta Flyer, one of my fav star trek ships ... all though I always thought of it as more of an attack shuttle and the whole deal with the "Borg inspired weapons" was that they used 7's borg knowledge to make Voyagers Delta Flyer's weapons pack more of a punch then what you would normally see on a ship of its size. Also while I get why people would say its warp speed is between 3 to 5 I always thought of it as faster then that just by the way the show was constantly saying how fast it was. I know most of its is prolly just in reference to it's sub-light ability but between references in the show and my assumptions of what you would want on a shuttle that is planned to be on its own away from Voyager in dangerous space I always thought its cruise was warp 5 with it able to push warp 7, maybe even warp 8 in a real pinch if it wasn't for too long. Then again if it has a Borg transwarp coil then perhaps its speed to show up where ever when ever needed could put touted to that? Voyagers shuttles while looking super cool compared to what we saw on TNG seemed to be insanely weak. in TNG we saw shuttles attacked, even by romulan warbirds and not being as squishy as what it seems Voyagers shuttles were. Guess they made them sleeker and smaller and 500% more splodier? Could you perhaps do a break down of StarFleet shuttles comparing and contrasting the different kinds we see and maybe even include the Flyer & Runnabouts?
Interesting video, thank you! Seeing homegrown new technology that actually lasts longer than the episode (or mid-season arc) that birthed it is kind of unique in long-running sci-fi episodic serials like Trek, so it's interesting to see how they approached this little craft. Based on the other comments here, I plan to adopt the pronunciation "La-Cars" for the touch-screen control interfaces immediately, simply because it seems to wind people up so much.
"When designing the Delta flyer in 2375, Tom Paris and Seven of Nine included photonic missiles in the vessel's armament." The missiles they use are apparently of borg design. This is from Memory Alpha btw.
My theory is the LCars is favored by the Federation because can be used easily by multiple species, while manual controls would have to be limited to only a few species per version of the controls. For a kimited crew ship like Voyager, manual controls make a ton more sense.
There is no inherent difference in reliability between a mechanical button and electronic one. In fact, when you think about the extreme electronic reliability required to contain an antimatter reaction or a stable warp bubble so that everyone doesn't die, it seems absurd to think they could not make a very reliable LCARS. I have personally worked on aircraft controls and can tell you that buttons and knobs break all the time.
Love how everyone always goes to the consoles exploding - but considering what they use for power aboard star trek ships. Plasma (generated by antimatter/matter reaction) I think for efficiency its not changed/harnessed until its actually utilized so all the consoles and everything else that uses power has plasma either feeding to it or running through it (EPS relay) so yeah horrible things happen when containment fails (now why they don't use say a converter for a section say the bridge and low voltage components for lighting and controls and the plasma equivalent of relays is beyond me other then it doesn't make for exiting tv). On the DeltaFlyer it would be a runabout class of ship (oversize shuttle or small personal space yacht). The weapons were "borg enhanced" (as someone else pointed out) and while similar to the standard variants had greater outputs and yields. Most exploration/research ships did have another class of subcraft called waverider, aeroshuttle or sometimes just captains yachts but other then brief views were never actually shown on screen
To be real, there is *no* logical reason the consoles should explode like that. They shouldn't require much power and even in the era of TOS we had the tech to keep electrical surges from doing that. Imagine what future tech could do. Hell, fiberoptics for the data(and to help shield from interference) plus a damn surge suppressor would solve most of the problems.
It might make sense to use levers and knobs for any function that you always need available (manual maneuvering, impulse power, even a handy lever to pull to initiate Red Alert and cycle power away from nonessential systems to shields, weapons, etc). But the LCARS are highly modulable, adapting it's outputs and inputs to your current needs. You can literally run the entire ship from one console if you need to. It's just unfortunate that LCARS are made of explodium.
"Can accommodate up to five people extremely comfortably." As long they never need sleep. Or they hot swap turns in the one bio-bed. Or they can replicate (and de-replicate) large furniture when needed. Otherwise they're all gonna doze off in those nicely cushioned bridge chairs or just pass out on the floor.
In an episode of Voyager, they had it go to warp 10 or trans-warp. FYI, TNG described trans-warp completely different in the 1st episode that featured The Traveler.
Good video subject choice! I like the design of the shuttle, a more appealing runabout shape. A couple of points as you pointed out... --- that retro control panel is would be okay but It's Not even Labeled! Only the penal officer who designed it would know how to truly operate it, as well as even modern flight avionics have touch screens with operable buttons! --- the only other thing is the speed experiments were good. They could even have worked in a prototype federation[born inspired] slip stream coil in an episode to rescue a party whee only a shuttle could fly into but needed to be there YESTERDAY! Instead of warp 5 max then maybe warp 7 to max warp 8.8. Thanks for the bid lore and enjoy Deadpool for me!
Question, do you have the TNG Technical manual, it explains how the displays and what not work in Star Trek, did you know they have tactile feedback, they feel like buttons when your fingers are over them... They are NOT LCD panels.
I don't, I would love that book though. But I'm required to tell you that isn't considered canon and we know they don't have tactical feedback because when tuvok becomes blind in voyager, he tells the computer to make the console have tactile response - meaning it doesn't normally have that.
In the TNG Tech manual it explains that all consoles are can be configured to the users preferences, and those preferences persist as the officer moves about the ship from console to console... you should consider spending the 2 to 20 bucks for it. www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Next-Generation-Technical/dp/0671704273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1526693305&sr=8-1&keywords=star+trek+technical+manual
I mean, this is a pretty good, and very information dense book. from hull, to replicators, and shield and beyond... what each phaser setting does, what every button the tricoder does.... Im honestly surprised you dont have it already
You may want to consider this as well. www.amazon.com/BLUEPRINTS-STAR-GENERATION-NCC-1701-D-Generation/dp/0671500937/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1526694058&sr=1-2&keywords=star+trek+blueprints Blueprints of every deck of the enterprise, did you know there was almost an entire deck for cetaceans?
If there's one thing I've learned while editing these videos, it's that the blueprints in those books, while interesting, can be very inaccurate at times - especially when it comes to technical details. The authors/publishers just make up what they don't know, including ship measurements. The blue prints in this very episode came from a licensed book and were inaccurate. The books are great fun (I have The History of the Federation: The First 150 Years and The Star Trek Encyclopedia) but they're not cannon. They simply can't be because they so often contradict the cannon. I'm not trying to bust your balls, I've just spend the last month reading and editing stuff from licensed books and I've had to edit out incorrect info (or simply not use something) several times. I'm not saying it can't be used, I love to put blue prints into the videos. When it doesn't contradict cannon sources or when we include beta cannon, it's very handy.
I get the distinct impression that the Argo type shuttle took in-universe inspiration from the Delta. The Type 11 shuttle, and maybe even the Venture class scout, certainly seem to have taken inspiration, out of universe.
Using LCARS to navigate a ship is like using a cell phone screen to play and Control Skyrim, sure you can do it but the Mouse and Keyboard/ Controller feels better.
Weren't they generally just typing in coordinates and the ship followed remotely... I know there were sticks at least one of the new move ships for manual.
Personally, I believe the Delta Flyer to be a gunship type of vessel. If you think about it, it's too big to be a shuttle in all honesty but too small to be a runabout type ship as runabouts include a spacious living area in aft. I think that the 'Borg inspired weapon system' that is talked about is the photon missile launchers as they don't seem to need reloading making it either an energy based weapon or micro replicators build the missiles in the launchers as they are photon missiles not proton torpedoes(no antimatter required).
An even bigger problem with touchscreens: no tactile feedback! Just try using a remote app on your phone without constantly looking down at it. It just doesn’t work; you can only estimate where your digits are supposed to be on a large flat surface.
AWriterWandering. We can assume the L CARS are somewhat more advanced than a current I phone lol. Whats really impressive is that utterly alien characters have no problem with fed consoles and the feds have no issues with using never before seen alien consoles. So obviously the science of intuitive interfaces has reached new heights! But seriously, I wonder how many of those transporter accidents were due to finicky touch screen sliders? If they are a fraction as glitchy as the volume or answer sliders on my phone the thought is ghastly.
In the Year of Hell Tuvok could still operate the LCARS while he was blind, so either LCARS has only a Braille support or has full fledged tactile feedback.
Tuvok explicitly ordered the computer to configure his console with haptic interface in that episode. But most operators aren't blind yet hardly ever glance at their consoles, even though placing their hands just slightly off position from the correct "buttons" could result in disastrously wrong inputs. I'm guessing these LCARS panels can "display" tactile output at different intensities, so the operator can feel where the controls actually are, even if the normally subtle tactile surface/texture is cleverly designed so it can't be seen without close scrutiny. And I'm guessing these LCARS panels can also "sense" tactile inputs at different intensities, so the operator can gain a finer degree of control with gentle touches or hard presses, etc. I have no explanation for why these screens explode every time there's a power surge. It's just the usual television/cinema idiocy, far more dramatic than unpowered black displays or a system crash/error message.
just a little update Crew dragon uses a lcars style lcd control for flying an maneuvering. only for backup rudimentary old style controlls. and it works fine
I always disliked the bog-standard Federation shuttles Delta Flyer is a long overdue upgrade .. now if B'elanna and Tom decided to take on a similar upgrade of the Danube Class runabouts . . .
C4-laced technology, @@LoreReloaded, seems about right. Man... one little energy surge in one panel could kill literally everyone within ten feet of the panel explosion. Fuses and circuit breaker technologies must of been outlawed or "forgotten" like darn near all of Tesla's various technologies and energy based discoveries.
In The Expanse, touchscreen controls near your fingertips are essential given the crushing velocities of the ships they travelled. One thing that The Next Generation series may have gotten right on the practicality of the technology being broadcasted. On the other hand, the Star Trek universe of ships used inertial dampeners to offset those lethal Gee forces..... so, going back to more tactile control schemes would be more practical than just having only touchscreens.
People talking about how the Delta Flyer being too big to fit into the shuttle bay just kind of forget that the Laws of Physics just stand aside and let Janeway do whatever she wants, lest the Laws of Physics draw her Ire their way. This is a series where of the 40 Photon Torpedos that this ship class is able to be stocked with maximum... they use something like 300. This is a series where the ship class typically has three shuttles available--and they managed to crash like twenty before even starting work on the Delta Flyer. This is a series where the captain's weapon of choice was repetitively ejecting the Warp Core at people. Which--is a VERY persuasive argument to make. "Yeah... we are not going to attack that ship... last time it ejected five Warp Cores at us. And Janeway was just MILDLY perturbed about us bothering that ship." This is a series which brought back the Star Trek classic of old ideal... but instead of breaking the Prime Directive to bang aliens... the captain instead breaks the Prime Temporal Directive to fuck reality. Which it was reality's fault for getting in the way of her having her Black Coffee. Reality should have known better. This is a series where when the Q Continuum decide that Janeway is the ultimate example of creation and the ideal to model the continuum upon... it kind of just makes sense, that Q fan girls over Janeway. If there was ever a Star Trek series that resembled Gurren Lagann, it is Voyager. Janeway is either an abomination... or the most bad ass of bad asses imaginable. Depends entirely on if you think The Federation is a bunch of wankers.
Katrina Payne janeway is the best captain along with baldy I think ..... that black guy is rubbish and so was shitner.... no that is spelled correctly .... shitner was shit
+Mike H Just saw this message... and crap. This is shit I cannot say, as people just accuse me of "not being a real Star Trek fan" and "getting my facts from Buzzfeed"... you know, because boobs or something. I just kind of gave up after a while, and moved to talking about it like this instead. As I still enjoy Voyager... but when I say shit like you do--people respond like I am a stupid doofus.. and well... that gets hard to deal with after a while.
Katrina Payne I gotta say that you adding the whole ‘cause I have boobs/buzzfeed thing was quite non-sequitur. Star Trek is sadly notorious for its ‘gatekeeping’ fandom. However to take someone’s (admittedly mild) counter to your point as an attack on you as a woman fan... is a bit much. Because correct me if I’m wrong but he never mentioned you being a woman in his reply. Also as I’m sure you’re aware people love ‘Trek to an obsessive degree at times. That obsession can often come off as haughty or rude. Now! was saying that you sound like you never watched the series a nice thing to comment... not really. (Though the means of text-only communication often leads to lack of context) For the record I believe you have watched Voyager to a significant degree and agree with most of what you had to say. See, the great thing about an open forum of ideas is that you can either refute his point with evidence, ignore his comment (or that one particular observation) or a multitude of other responses! Simply throwing your toys out of the pram and whining that it’s all because you’re a woman actually goes to lend more credence to the stereotype about women in fandoms. Ultimately, I ask, what would Janeway do if confronted with that reply? In her being a strong Captain (though her being a woman is irrelevant in my arriving to that belief, honestly) in her actions she definitely shows an example of real egalitarian principles and strength. Because Janeway was a relatable and enduring Starfleet officer first and her being a woman was a simply an aspect of her as a person. It wasn’t her sole identity and wasn’t used to push an agenda. This form of egalitarian with merit and fortitude of character first when being evaluated, not simply minority status. THESE are the things that we should be working towards as a society. Not a backwards purple haired SJW victim-mentality/agenda driven narrative like what was seen in the character ofVice Admiral Holdo in TLJ. Anyways I hope you have a great day as well as my wish that you live long and prosper! 🖖🏼
About the switches and toggles......In Star Trek Insurrection Riker used a Joystick to maneuver the enterprise during the end of the briar patch battle..I agree switches and levers would be better to pilot a ship. Just try to play a FPS game using a keyboard instead of a mouse.
Probes are disposable, as is every other unmanned gizmo they launch into space. But some items are harder to replace than others, some materials are too exotic for replicators, some tech is too complex for replicators. And Voyager had limited resources, with no access to Federation-manufactured replacements.
I have no idea how the touch screens don't crack with all the rocks flying around during battle. It makes as much sense as not having thrusters in all 6 directions on a spacecraft to slow it down and dock.
Well I imagine they’d use transparent aluminum or something even stronger... especially since they’ve had the technology in the trekverse since the twentieth century thanks to Scotty’s meddling.
Saying as the Delta Flyer was built in a rush, it never sat well with me that they created a completely new design. Wouldn't it have more sense to build a modified Runabout? The design was in use well before Voyager's trip to the Delta Quadrant and had proven it could handle itself.
The delta flyer did it's job. It looked cool on screen. Considerations like where it fit a power source that could make all those phasers, torpedoes, shields, and shuttle-race winning engines (not to mention where it fit all those weapons) as well as all that empty space for, you know, people to live and work don't matter. It looked cool on screen. Who cares what the dimensions of the Voyager's shuttlebay doors are? It LOOKS COOL ONSCREEN! (And there's a little extra money in the budget). That's the only consistent rule for Star Trek canon that matters (to the show's producers, anyway). It's not like there's an actual Delta Flyer they have to crane into an actual shuttlebay. Just shrink the 3D model and fudge it.
I wonder if the 24th century touch screens are actually plasma screens. Not like the modern ones, but straight superheated plasma... It would certainly explain the tendency to explode violently with tons of shrapnel if you damage them moderately.
its an advanced shuttle with seven of nine and a team from voyager used to thinking outside the box to make the delta flyer so badass it would win vs two danube shuttles and be fine!
The LCARS panels are filled with metal, rocks and explodium in TNG so any chance to avoid the helm blowing up in your face is always a bonus.
Helm seemed to be one of the safer ones. Tactical was the worst. How often what’s someone flipping over that wood paneling
It was some nice wood paneling, never seemed to get damaged that is clearly where the thought went into the Galaxy class, fine wood finish at tactical no chipboard or MDF there :)
Richard Hawkins you can see your face in that glossy finish as the escaping plasma melts your skin off
Richard Hawkins
Oberth - 100% explodium content. Handle with extreme care.
you wouldn't go near a console in those things without a bomb-proof suit and a notarised will
I’m an engineer myself. I love levers, switches, buttons and steering columns, anything that connects one to the machine one is operating.
Im into electronics and want to become an electronics engineer. I love analog gauges and voltmeters and such. I always have them mounted on power supplies i make
Idk, networked digital controls seem more practical and less complicated for more complex machines. Obviously requires solid software as well.
This made me realize why I like old cars.
This... is why we drive stick.
It seems like, even outside of the types of catastrophic failures that are 100% common, the LCD panels would also be more likely to stop functioning in extreme temperatures. Buttons and knobs work a LOT better when it's 20 below!
After seeing half a million LCD Consoles blow up
No, theyre not safe.
Underated comment here...
I think the LCD Consoles caused more casualties than all of Star Fleet's wars and various battles combined, @@flaviomonteiro1414.
They're made of explodium
Why they put the EPS conduits behind the all the consoles.
even if they did not constantly explode it makes sense to have buttons and levers as a backup.
Love the look of the Delta Flyer, but I have to admit it is pretty much the sonic screwdriver of Voyager... it happens to be able to do whatever they need it to.
Does it work on wood?
Only if the plot needs it to.
from the times it has crashed .. it seems to go through trees like a brick through butter...
so it's a big ass version of the tricorder. Whatever you need, it can do it.
'Cept wood.
I'm going to say one thing about the buttons+levers+dials vs. LCARS debate...LCARS do not exist in real-life, but buttons+levers+dials exist in real-life, and we don't see them exploding in showers of sparks constantly but LCARS do explode constantly on-screen.
Buttons+levers+dials 4 life.
Strictly speaking it's not the LCARS consoles themselves that explode but the EPS conduits they're connected to.
BLDs don't need no stinking EPS.
buttons and levers = moving
moving = higher failure rate.
Just think of a fighting stick on an old style arcade, and how often those get broken.
TentaclePentacle Maybe, but, think about how many times consoles have exploded, and killed poor bastards like Kurt Bendera.
+MKDumas1981
consoles explode because of the plasma conduits running through it. With knobs, you will still have the same plasma conduits. The whole ship runs on plasma.
Disregarding its operational history, I love the design of the Delta flyer. It's one of the few Starfleet shuttles that as actually looks good.
I think the Federation should have adopted the Delta Flyer design for all future shuttles.
"We need a new larger shuttle for the show."
"That's easy, boss. We can use the Aeroshuttle attached to the ventral saucer sect....."
"Woah woah woah... the what? You don't know what you're talking about. Now do as your told and make me a new shuttle!"
#genious
Wimpoman. Well the plot DID call for a very specifically capable shuttle in that episode. An interesting thing might have been losing the aero shuttle at some point and converting its cove into a drop bay for the Delta Flyer. I think seeing more hacks amd modifications to the ship throughout the seasons would have been great, most basically existed in dialogue ( new shields and weapons, modifications to the warp drive etc) and with the move to CG the door was open to significant exterior changes.
But Voyager had the most powerful modification of all time..the reset button. XD
I've always seen the schematics for AeroShuttle, but now I actually got to see it was actually viable, they even did a cg cut for it. Wonder why the never used it in the show?
It was used on a different ship, not sure which one.
May-lon and L cars, sorry trek OCD kicked in.
Look at it this way; at least you didn't start the post with "Well, actually..." ;)
He says lcars right thought....
He does not. as someone else said in the comments, it's pronounced 'El-cars" not 'La-cars". Not trying to be a dick, just trying to help for future reference.
I have a feeling he pronounced it "m'LON" just to piss off some stiff grammar nazis. Like, anyone that's seen the show knows the pronunciation, and Lore has a history of snarking at rules lawyers.
It could be accent, the way i read, or trolling to get people to point it out, you guys decide..
It's "MAY-LON"
It's almost like this guy hasn't watched the shows and does his research online and maybe books. These videos look like a cynical way to make money off of a fandom.
Cuckoorus I've watched a few of these, and that's my impression as well.
Also, 'L' CARS, not LaCars.
i was just going to put a comment about that lol basic trekkie right there lol
Justice Gaming haha hoping that would be pointed out lol
Paris always seemed to be more of a "hands on" guy, he wanted to feel things. Even Scotty referenced he could tell how fast the Enterprise was going by the feel of the deck plates (TNG "Relics"). So it's not too far removed from switches and such in his generation. In Star Trek we often see the best ships, not even the real run down, civilian ships and what they may have.
About nobs and buttons. One important thing to consider is the instant feedback of something like a joy stick. I wonder how many times a ship would roll the wrong way by hitting the wrong button in combat
evasive pattern delta: presses the corresponding command button, and watches how the thing is being flown by the computer, lol
But don't get me started on ST: Insurrection and Riker telling the computer he wants manual control and a joystick comes out of the deck plating.
@@chimaican01 Don't get anyone started on ST: I... we don't have enough time for the sensible critiques to describe the sheer amount of ways that movie was stupid.
And it is "L-CARS"
Meh
i was just going to put a comment about that lol basic trekkie right there lol
I had to hear what he was saying SEVERAL times to realize he was mispronouncing LCARS.
I thought it was professionally pronounced as “El-cars” according to the Star Trek sound bite on the “lcarscom dot net” website that’s still operational. Check it out 🤓
Justice Gaming bwhaaa😂 u rock for that...ty👍🏻
The LCARS issue is brought up in the novel "Indistinguishable From Magic", where the Enterprise E finds the NX-07 Intrepid, lost in the Earth-Romulan War. LaForge comments on the buttons that "It's better for when there is no light and power, because the switch still works" (Paraphrasing of course).
I think she'd look better with dynametric tail fins. XD
yea, it's amazing they didn't add those.. #vulcansarestupid
But...but...but...its not a "hot rod"
And Flames... it needs painted on flames too.
I'm all in for the dynametric tailfins and a flame paint job!!! :-)
What if they let Paris design a capital ship…?
After all the Flyer was his baby, designed and constructed with limited resources, imagine if he got an entire team after returning to the Alpha quadrant.
actually having an analog lever/button as a backup seems like a common sense idea
Heh, just noticed it looks like the Goa'ould Al'Kesh when you look at it from the front.
It's pronounced "May-Lon"
Anyone who's actually seen the show would know this.
I always found it weird that we see the Delta Flyer in the series, and yet we never see the Captain's Yacht. You'd have thought they'd have used that and modified it accordingly.
The Captains Yacht was/is a _massively_ under-utilised part of the Trek universe. I mean, every ship _has_ one, yet I can't name a single episode where one features, not even an episode where the crew need to abandon ship (surely the Yacht could take a decent number of crew if push came to shove, so why was it never part of rescue or evacuation procedures?). Even in almost every video breaking down the layout and design of Star Trek ships, the _one_ part _nobody_ ever mentions, let alone breaks down and shows the design/layout, is the Captains Yacht. It's a shame really, cos they could have featured it far more and actually _used_ the damn thing, instead of it always being just another "random bit" of the main ships hull.
I'd join the chorus of corrections, but the Malon were a stupid species and I won't give them the dignity of proper pronunciation.
'Chorus'...you'll forgive me if I dont care much either
Lore Reloaded Absolutely. Though maybe I should give them some sort of condolence. You know, since Janeway blamed them for being polluters and proceeded to blow up their containment pods, doubtlessly causing a massive ecological disaster that the Malon were keeping contained by comparison.
Goddamn, Janeway does really stupid things...
A few of the individual Maylon characters were interesting, but yeah, the overall stories with them were not among the better episodes in the series.
The Delta Flyer was of the few things Voyager actually kept on as actual development for their show.
LCARS were packed with C4. any bit of battle damage would have shrapnel blown in to your face... who thought having the electronics on a starship directly powered by the EPS should be taken out back and vaporized :)
mak10z You forgot the rocks :)
Those were petrified tribbles :D
That's where I hide my nerds
Yeah, LCARS kills, and not in a merciful way. Unlike a full-fledged Claymore, some crew live long enough to get the Final Words (usually inspiring, and not "This job BDM").
To be fair we saw in Star Trek 2 that Starfleet had exploding consoles even before LCARS. (And that they felt the need to simulate this on their bridge simulators, to the point where the simulator can actually break itself)
Well, I have a thousand hours in a plane with "steam" gauges and 2000 hours in a glass cockpit aircraft, and I will tell you, the LCD screens are a bit less reliable. They fizzle out, loose colors and do all kinds of crap. They are just easier replaced and a lot nicer while working. Also, I loved the shuttle, but I agree with EAX that the shuttle was too large for the bay. And if this shuttle is composed of 70% Crashonium, just how much are the Runabouts from DS9 made of? I wonder if they can even get coverage for them things anymore.
The Delta Flyer is in my top ten of ships. I also prefer good ol' fashioned knobs and buttons. While LCARS is useful, you constantly have to look at it. Knobs, dials, buttons, you can manipulate without looking at if you know the layout well enough. That, and they just look cool.
The Delta Flyer is cool, but I think the Colonial Blackbird episode from BSG had a much better build-up and payoff. I generally love "custom-built _____" centric episodes of any series. I really enjoy the camaraderie that these episodes usually show.
Patrick Hobbs The Blackbird felt like it was built by people. Delta Flyer always felt like it was built by robots.
It's hard to convey time on television & film well, in my opinion, and the Blackird's construction was about the Chief and crew as well as the ship they were creating. The building of the Blackbird had the feel of building a car in a garage for the first time, and while sleek looking, it didn't have the 'fresh off the factory floor' appearance that the Flyer had. The Flyer's main window was pretty sweet looking and broke from the usual aesthetic we see inside Voyager. But clearly it's welded with explodium, or something that makes the propulsion system tilt off-center and crash...
But seeing the cargo containers trailing behind the Delta Flyer when Paris & Torres tied the knot with "Just married" on the hull made me chuckle!
I love the Delta Flyer, and I also love what Tom did with the knobs and buttons. Both as a teenager and even know as an adult, I prefer something that I can physically move, over a touch screen. Feed back is a very welcome thing when you are driving/flying, and you develop muscle memory for where the most used buttons and switches are located. Kind of difficult to do that with a touch screen, more so when there may be multiple menus to go through. This is one of the many reasons I can not stand modern cars, I hate touch screens.
It's a big part of why I miss physical keyboards and genuinely can't understand why phones moved away from them.
With a physical keyboard, it'd take no time to type a message without looking at the screen. With touch, it doesn't matter how good you are, those mistakes are inevitable, especially with autocorrect.
On the topic of consoles, I've always had a problem with exploding workstations in Star Trek.. Doesn't anyone in the future know what a fuse is? Why are they running the kind of power that can blow bulkheads out to run control panels?? I feel better now.
Dude, it's pronounced "May-lon," not "Muh-lon."
I think I would have gone with a dual joystick and pedal control configuration much like that of an attack helicopter coupled with a visor mounted heads up display for Tactical Systems targeting. The pedal switch control rotation, 1 lever weed control pitch tilt and yaw as well as lateral movement and the other Leever could control the vertical movement. The visor mounted heads up display would be worn by the Tactical officer to provide a more intuitive targeting display.
When designing the delta flyer in the holodeck it seems Tuvok was getting annoyed with tom and just needed a reason to chastise him. Which he did when he added tail fins and then they were removed. It seemed like Tuvok just generally annoyed with him in this episode and looked for any reason to chastise him in that episode.
Tom Paris is the smartest person on Voyager and if he ever went rogue would be a danger. Tuvok presumably knows this and likes to stop his ego getting too big and keep him acting professional.
@@farshnuke I can see where he is coming from but look at it from Tom Paris's prospective he is a pilot and gets to design a ship of his own as it were something that it seems he was mostly in charge of IIRC. And when Tuvok reprimands him he seems to in a nice way tell him to stfu. I liked the delta flyer only issue i had was IIRC the warp nacelles extended out or something.
@@illuminat4838 Tuvok is the 'stop having fun' guy so I understand your attitude but I sympathise with his position generally as humour can be subjective and I sometimes find it annoying or mean. (Though Tom seldom goes there)
As I said my issues was that I had convinced myself through hazy half remembered viewing that the Delta Flyer was sent by Star Fleet as a super ship and the actual origin is lame by comparison
It's not that LCARS panels are more reliable - it's just that smartphones / tablets / other touchscreen technologies have become so ubiquitous by that era that people have forgotten how to use buttons and levers.
Though, honestly, given Starfleet's track record I'm surprised nobody took it a stage further and used Holodeck technology to create superconfigurable 3D-projected controls that could look and feel like whatever you wanted, but were constructed with 350% additional explodium. You could have Holodeck episodes without ever leaving the bridge!
Well i mean DS9 did have a mention of holgram interfaces. it was in that one episode with Jake and the future rubberband thing
You don't "forget" how to use a well designed lever or button, touchscreens are both cheaper and easier to use in a mass production setting where you may or may not want to incrementally improve or change whatever you are producing.
It's happening present day in car production, more and more cars have more and more of their controls within the infotainment system, it's much easier to reprogram the ECU to add or alter features for new models and in theory only having one failure point (the screen) is preferable to having many individual controls from a reliability and cost perspective.
The downside is that the system is reliant on having power available to the unit in order for the unit to function so that if it fails EVERYTHING has effectively failed and in a Combat/Star Trek type setting they would be vulnerable to hacking or other electronic attacks that would be impossible with a simple mechanical switch.
The show uses it because it looks modern and is probably much easier from a set building point of view but i seriously doubt that any military vehicle would not have at least physical and mechanical backups at the very least in a realistic setting, even far into the future especially where an enemy may be able to seize control of your systems.
Of course it is possible the screen run off the same systems as the artificial gravity and so almost never fail anyway......
There is also an assumption in the video that the screens are still LCD and not something new and much more reliable. :D
Nah fam we all know that they are Galaxy Note 7s
I think in real life 3d projected controls are not so far off in the future...
The knobs and buttons also allow for eye-off operations, as a physical, tactile interface does not require constant watching to know where the smooth virtual buttons are. Military personnel have previously railed against the touch-screen aesthetic of Starfleet for that reason.
They're also a lot nicer for piloting/driving. A control stick seems more natural and easier to use then pressing depictions of buttons on a touchscreen.
Funny enough those touch screen came with a brail setting. (year of hell and blind Tovok)
I would guess that the consoles would have some type of haptic feedback that would let you know where your fingers were and what you were touching. But I agree that with you and would much prefer physical buttons/levers for easier muscle memory and all.
Janeway didn't even know how to use a keyboard -_- ancient earth tech my ass. you don't just make QWERTY obsolete with touchscreens. Some fan made fun to the Joystick in that one TNG movie. i was like "Yes see manual control exists" well enough though that joystick woud still require the computer to steer but I digress
I think a lever actually makes sense for speed adjustments and a control stick for steering. Okay, you'd have to have their equivalent for power steering sure. However, pressing buttons on a flat screen just isn't the same as holding a control stick. Imagine driving not with a steering wheel etc. but with flat buttons for everything. To me, that would be unnatural and even dangerous. Sometimes (but not always) simpler can be better.
And let's face it, looking at those LCARS displays, they don't seem to make much sense. They may allow the user to do a lot more. However, they seem overly complicated.
Building the Delta Flyer is known as field expediency. The rear ramp is similar to the one on the old M113 armored personnel carrier(APC). The Flyer's inside is more like "Doctor Who"'s TARDIS.
Mal means bad (Latin), so the name Malan makes sense.
The retractable impulse engines are actually "impulse thrusters". It still has standard impulse engines.
I always loved the Delta Flyer. The Flyer alone, even without the rest of Voyager, ranks pretty high on my list of favorite space ships in science fiction.
I’ve never heard it pronounced “La-cars” I’ve always heard ‘L-cars’
He also couldn't pronounce "Malon"....
Ahem *adjusts horned-rim glasses*.
It's MAY-lon, thank you very much.
I grew up with knobs, dials, and levers so using the touch screens of today I have to look at what I'm doing as I don't have the tactile sensation of the knobs, buttons, and levers. Now, going by the new touch interfaces that are in science and tech museums in Tokyo that simulate the tactile feelings makes me unsure about future touchscreens... There's that... So it falls into the realm of, "I dunno" for me.
I love LCARS, but realistically, I don't think we'll ever see a world in which touchscreens are just as good as physical controls. I do think it works in Star Trek, because to an extent, they're all about breaking the "rules" to demonstrate that humanity has advanced to an inconceivable degree (see the Federation school system, which appears to teach quantum theory to very young children).
You'll never see any real world aircraft, ship, or military vehicle that are controlled with touch screens alone.
Yeah, seems unlikely.
You're starting to see some aircraft have touchscreen interfaces, but not exclusively. Primary flight controls are still like they've always been, and even secondary/minor controls have physical buttons as backup in spite of the touchscreens...
But really it depends on how good the touchscreens get, and the degree of automation.
Primary problem with touchscreens is lack of tactile feedback.
Primary advantage is dynamically reconfigurable controls.
Meaning not only can you reduce clutter, since you don't need dedicated buttons for literally everything, and can alter the available controls depending on context. (eg. irrelevant controls are never visible.), but you can also alter control elements dynamically, reconfigure, update and otherwise modify interfaces without having to make any hardware alterations whatsoever.
It has a lot of advantages, but... There just isn't enough tactile feedback.
Or any at all, really. Current designs are literally only usable if you're looking at them.
Which is often not acceptable for vehicle controls...
Or typing for that matter...
Yeah you're right... remember in year of hell when Tuvok was blind and he was able to tell the computer to turn on tactile interface, then was able to read information from the panel?
I imagine that what he wanted to activate was an interface which would convey tactical information to him... but LCARS panels always have a kind of haptic feedback as standard
I'm with you there. I learned to drive a car with stereo and Air-Conditioning/heating. The new cars where everything is integrated into the infotainment system throws me off badly. The idea that control interface layouts change with the touch of a button and additional controls are hidden inside nested menus is not a good thing when you're performing a MISSION CRITICAL task like driving. To make things worse, some of the newer cars are actually moving things like the gear shift away from a manual lever with positive feedback to a little digital knob with no feedback... It's what's believed to have killed Anton Yelchin. The idea that all the movement controls of a vehicle would be built into a modifiable touch-screen UI is not good.
Shows like Star Trek really need the touch of an ergonomics usability engineer to make things look more plausible.
How many shuttles are on voyages
Yes
that actually made me laugh out loud
Lore Reloaded then i did my job, keep up the great videos
Depends on how many courts there are and their positions in relation to the nets.
Ba-da-boom, chhhhhhhh!
My good sir, I daresay it exceeds nine thousand. (Tachyon Monocle)
I believe I counted one time, as I have no life. If my count was correct, it was 13 not including the delta flyer
Why they had to invent this and convince us that it fits into a tiny shuttle bay when there was already a pretty capable and better looking aeroshuttle fitted to the underside of the saucer section I'll never know.
Levent Taskan Voyager's wasn't installed yet. That was supposed to be there by Tuesday.
Barry Bend. The problem with tuesday is its always over booked.... so everything inevitably gets pushed til next tuesday....
DrewLSsix If you removed Tuesday from the week Starfleet wouldn't be able to resupply itself.
According to Star Trek lore; Voyager was on her alleged shakedown cruise prior to being drafted to chase the Maquis that Tuvok Infiltrated and launched with many of her crew and gear not yet installed. The aero shuttle was the "newest" shuttle to grace the intrepid line that was more or less in line with the Captain's Yacht that was installed in the Galaxy and Sovereign classes. The producers of the show nixed the aeroshuttle idea because they wanted the "captain's yacht" reveal on the Sovereign class USS Enterprise E in the movie to be a big impact on screen.
The fact that there were schematics of the captain's yacht installed in the Galaxy Class Enterprise D on most tech manuals years BEFORE the reveal of the one on the E apparently didn't enter their minds at the time, making the "impact" moot. Suffice to say, the Delta Flyer class shuttle is roughly bigger than their smallest class 4 man capacity shuttle and roughly smaller than their biggest runabout. So it's somewhere in between the two in regards to actual size. While the runabout class is a multi-role shuttle, the Delta Flyer is more speciallized as it doesn't have the interchangeable modules that widened the runabout's role. The closest thing I can compare the Delta Flyer to is a recon-attack craft. It's got enough "teeth" to survive semi-long range missions, but only just.
Well, a (perhaps modified) aeroshuttle would have been very cool, but I suspect it was a lot easier to fit something Delta Flyer's shape and size onto sets and store it as opposed to something kind airplane-sized/needing to be CGIed in everywhere.
The buttons and knobs are much better, and safer. Starfleet consoles are made of Explodium since at least TNG it appears.
And they spew rocks all over during attacks
@@michaelswitzer2121 Tritanium was in short supply, so they've had to use cement instead.
as a
UNITED STATES NAVAL
AVIATOR
AUGUST 1994
TO
JANUARY 2009
I APPRECIATE THE
MANUAL CONTROLS
But arrow keys are clearly Superior. Why wouls federation use them.
I am creating a fanfic series set three decades after VOY and your channel is a major one I use for research purposes. One assumption I'm making is that a successor to the Delta Flyer is a standard small shuttle for long-range exploration ships. (I also presume by that time a lot of controversy is erupting over letting something the size of the Cardassian Union into the Federation).
not being nit picky, but it's pronounced may-lon. ok being nit picky
That bothered me too just a bit.
Congratulations, then, you fell for it.
Yes, yes, yes. Levers and Knobs are superior interfaces! Why? You don’t have to look at them while operating. You can train a person to a degree, where operating levers and knobs becomes a reflex. Meaning that in a crisis situation, you have much quicker response time. Ever tried using an lcd panel in a car while driving? It’s a danger to the driver and the traffic as a whole, as the driver must divert his glance back from the street to the stupid panel. It escapes me how legislation allows lcd panels in cars to control basic functions such as air conditioning, heating, radio, music, etc. It’s a traffic hazard.
I'm fairly certain it's pronounced 'El-Cars'
I've never heard it called L'Cars.
Nah..I refuse to accept that.
Even with evidence..
It's pronounced Yanny.
birdoprey5. No it's Laurel
noooo, it's Laurel.... re-listening, damn, now it's Yanny
Hes right how he says it
Concerning the knobs and switches
Paris even states that they are better than the touchpad primarily a pilot does have time to look down and see what button he is pushing. The knobs and switches allow for instant feedback through touch while eyes stay glued to the "road."
So the flyer is a lite version of the defiant sorta
But did it come built with an astrometric suit?
Gahhhhh!!!!!
Voyager did many things well. Voyager also did many things very badly. Voyager was such a mixed bag that it's no wonder I have such a love hate relationship with it.
The Delta flyer totally made sense from the stand point that they were still essentially using shuttles from TNG, that were not altogether different from the original series shuttle craft. A new shuttle was desperately needed in the series. I highly question however how the craft came into being. Problems abound. I also have many cringe inducing moments with how the craft is employed. As a ship, I love the Delta Flyer. A++. I just wish it had a backstory to match it's awesome lines. And I wish they had kept the Fins that Paris originally included. Cause that look was sick.
are the analog consoles made with less dynamite than standard star trek controls?
Voyager has many faults, but the flyer made a lot of sense, it outperforms every Starfleet shuttle and would even outclass a ronabout in both speed and firepower. It was incredibly interesting to see and fascinating to watch on screen.
Also, the Intrepid wasnt a pure science vessel. The Intrepid class was designed to be easily made for multiple purposes, kind of like a chassis shared by different vehicles such as Chevy trucks having the same chassis as Chevy Vans. Intrepid class vessels could be outfitted for science, medical, diplomatic, and various combat roles, this allowed Star Fleet to field a larger fleet that could be built faster and maintained more easily while still having the diversity of so many classes. Essentially, they did what every other faction had done. Star fleet purpose built every class prior to Intrepid, while the Romulans, Cardassians, Klingons and even the Vulcans in the 22nd century had built only a few classes of vessels that could be outfitted for separate purposes, this is far simpler and easier to do. Voyager specifically was built as a combat scout and escort vessel, its outfitted with a high speed warp drive so as to catch its opponents and is equipped with Type 10 torpedoes as of launch to have the firepower to back itself up. It is also equipped with over a dozen shuttles so it can act as a small carrier in combat situations or carry out scientific research during off time. Since Starfleet didnt like dedicated warships, voyager was still equipped with scientific equipment to carry out basic scientific and astronomical studies.
I had to watch just bc the title had me cracking up!--crashium😂😂😂😂
I liked the flyer, it’s design diverges from established convention in a similar fashion to voyager, but I couldn’t help but think it was explicitly added to reduce the shows budget, why have 20 people a 3 sets, when you can have 1 people and 1 set.
And to be fair Voyager crashed a lot too, seems the 24th century can allow you to travel 70,000 light years in less than a decade, but that last 20km are really troublesome.
The flyer to me is great. It is what a basic workhorse shuttle should be. I would love to (in the future) see variants based on this or even a new version that was a bit larger but had more modular construction for mission specialization - including combat. To me there is no doubt that Section 31 would - after Voy's return or even while they have been in contact via the array - have made their own covert versions based on it's schematics.
The problem with exploding consoles should be a video by itself. Part of the problem is that they are powering their control systems with warp plasma? This would be like back lighting your laptop with molten salt and then having a tank of fluoride under your keyboard. I mean...YOU COULD...but you can do a lot of things that are stupid and pointless.
Delta Flyer = Good , LCARS = futuristic look compared to TOS and given special effects budget and capabilities of the time, Exploding Plasma Conduits = starfleet engineer revenge for not being in the command path. yeah we'll show those flybois!
I designed an experimental ona-of-a-kind vehicle's dasboard. First idea: We are going to implement a bunch of functions, so just put a large touchscreen there, where we can add anything later if need be. That was one of the firt design choices that went out of the window right after the first tests. It simply gives no reasonable feedback to the operator, what is not good if there is any stressful sutiation expected...
I love the Delta Flyer, one of my fav star trek ships ... all though I always thought of it as more of an attack shuttle and the whole deal with the "Borg inspired weapons" was that they used 7's borg knowledge to make Voyagers Delta Flyer's weapons pack more of a punch then what you would normally see on a ship of its size. Also while I get why people would say its warp speed is between 3 to 5 I always thought of it as faster then that just by the way the show was constantly saying how fast it was. I know most of its is prolly just in reference to it's sub-light ability but between references in the show and my assumptions of what you would want on a shuttle that is planned to be on its own away from Voyager in dangerous space I always thought its cruise was warp 5 with it able to push warp 7, maybe even warp 8 in a real pinch if it wasn't for too long. Then again if it has a Borg transwarp coil then perhaps its speed to show up where ever when ever needed could put touted to that? Voyagers shuttles while looking super cool compared to what we saw on TNG seemed to be insanely weak. in TNG we saw shuttles attacked, even by romulan warbirds and not being as squishy as what it seems Voyagers shuttles were. Guess they made them sleeker and smaller and 500% more splodier? Could you perhaps do a break down of StarFleet shuttles comparing and contrasting the different kinds we see and maybe even include the Flyer & Runnabouts?
Interesting video, thank you! Seeing homegrown new technology that actually lasts longer than the episode (or mid-season arc) that birthed it is kind of unique in long-running sci-fi episodic serials like Trek, so it's interesting to see how they approached this little craft. Based on the other comments here, I plan to adopt the pronunciation "La-Cars" for the touch-screen control interfaces immediately, simply because it seems to wind people up so much.
Isn't a photon torpedo like the size of a coffin? are these like mini torps? never heard of them
Pretty sure they use micro-torpedos
Presumably they could be stored in a transporter buffer and materialized as needed.
"When designing the Delta flyer in 2375, Tom Paris and Seven of Nine included photonic missiles in the vessel's armament."
The missiles they use are apparently of borg design. This is from Memory Alpha btw.
Ahhh Photonic missiles. The image of a screaming EMH as he flails haplessly towards the target.
The Only Liverpool Ninja omfg 😂
My theory is the LCars is favored by the Federation because can be used easily by multiple species, while manual controls would have to be limited to only a few species per version of the controls. For a kimited crew ship like Voyager, manual controls make a ton more sense.
May Lon, El cars. Pronunciation
There is no inherent difference in reliability between a mechanical button and electronic one. In fact, when you think about the extreme electronic reliability required to contain an antimatter reaction or a stable warp bubble so that everyone doesn't die, it seems absurd to think they could not make a very reliable LCARS. I have personally worked on aircraft controls and can tell you that buttons and knobs break all the time.
Love how everyone always goes to the consoles exploding - but considering what they use for power aboard star trek ships. Plasma (generated by antimatter/matter reaction) I think for efficiency its not changed/harnessed until its actually utilized so all the consoles and everything else that uses power has plasma either feeding to it or running through it (EPS relay) so yeah horrible things happen when containment fails (now why they don't use say a converter for a section say the bridge and low voltage components for lighting and controls and the plasma equivalent of relays is beyond me other then it doesn't make for exiting tv). On the DeltaFlyer it would be a runabout class of ship (oversize shuttle or small personal space yacht). The weapons were "borg enhanced" (as someone else pointed out) and while similar to the standard variants had greater outputs and yields. Most exploration/research ships did have another class of subcraft called waverider, aeroshuttle or sometimes just captains yachts but other then brief views were never actually shown on screen
To be real, there is *no* logical reason the consoles should explode like that. They shouldn't require much power and even in the era of TOS we had the tech to keep electrical surges from doing that. Imagine what future tech could do.
Hell, fiberoptics for the data(and to help shield from interference) plus a damn surge suppressor would solve most of the problems.
If Starfleet had The Delta Flyer or at least the data and specs the Dominion War would've been over sooner without needing the To help
Lore Reloaded - Only 70% Sodium Chloride
David Simpson Jr haha
It might make sense to use levers and knobs for any function that you always need available (manual maneuvering, impulse power, even a handy lever to pull to initiate Red Alert and cycle power away from nonessential systems to shields, weapons, etc). But the LCARS are highly modulable, adapting it's outputs and inputs to your current needs. You can literally run the entire ship from one console if you need to.
It's just unfortunate that LCARS are made of explodium.
Wait where the hell is it keeping all those weapons
space jesus
It's all stored in plot space along with plot hardpoints as it's being shielded by plot armour.
Same place the federation keeps them on full sized ships, under the L-cars panels. That's why they explode so much.
"Can accommodate up to five people extremely comfortably."
As long they never need sleep. Or they hot swap turns in the one bio-bed. Or they can replicate (and de-replicate) large furniture when needed. Otherwise they're all gonna doze off in those nicely cushioned bridge chairs or just pass out on the floor.
It seems to have 8 Phaser strips that I can count.
In an episode of Voyager, they had it go to warp 10 or trans-warp. FYI, TNG described trans-warp completely different in the 1st episode that featured The Traveler.
Good video subject choice! I like the design of the shuttle, a more appealing runabout shape. A couple of points as you pointed out...
--- that retro control panel is would be okay but It's Not even Labeled! Only the penal officer who designed it would know how to truly operate it, as well as even modern flight avionics have touch screens with operable buttons!
--- the only other thing is the speed experiments were good. They could even have worked in a prototype federation[born inspired] slip stream coil in an episode to rescue a party whee only a shuttle could fly into but needed to be there YESTERDAY! Instead of warp 5 max then maybe warp 7 to max warp 8.8.
Thanks for the bid lore and enjoy Deadpool for me!
It was a really good addition to the series.
Question, do you have the TNG Technical manual, it explains how the displays and what not work in Star Trek, did you know they have tactile feedback, they feel like buttons when your fingers are over them... They are NOT LCD panels.
I don't, I would love that book though. But I'm required to tell you that isn't considered canon and we know they don't have tactical feedback because when tuvok becomes blind in voyager, he tells the computer to make the console have tactile response - meaning it doesn't normally have that.
In the TNG Tech manual it explains that all consoles are can be configured to the users preferences, and those preferences persist as the officer moves about the ship from console to console... you should consider spending the 2 to 20 bucks for it. www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Next-Generation-Technical/dp/0671704273/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1526693305&sr=8-1&keywords=star+trek+technical+manual
I mean, this is a pretty good, and very information dense book. from hull, to replicators, and shield and beyond... what each phaser setting does, what every button the tricoder does.... Im honestly surprised you dont have it already
You may want to consider this as well. www.amazon.com/BLUEPRINTS-STAR-GENERATION-NCC-1701-D-Generation/dp/0671500937/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1526694058&sr=1-2&keywords=star+trek+blueprints Blueprints of every deck of the enterprise, did you know there was almost an entire deck for cetaceans?
If there's one thing I've learned while editing these videos, it's that the blueprints in those books, while interesting, can be very inaccurate at times - especially when it comes to technical details. The authors/publishers just make up what they don't know, including ship measurements. The blue prints in this very episode came from a licensed book and were inaccurate.
The books are great fun (I have The History of the Federation: The First 150 Years and The Star Trek Encyclopedia) but they're not cannon. They simply can't be because they so often contradict the cannon.
I'm not trying to bust your balls, I've just spend the last month reading and editing stuff from licensed books and I've had to edit out incorrect info (or simply not use something) several times.
I'm not saying it can't be used, I love to put blue prints into the videos. When it doesn't contradict cannon sources or when we include beta cannon, it's very handy.
I get the distinct impression that the Argo type shuttle took in-universe inspiration from the Delta. The Type 11 shuttle, and maybe even the Venture class scout, certainly seem to have taken inspiration, out of universe.
Love this ship! Maybe sometimes you could add in footage of the weapons firing or shield hits when you do these types of video's
I agree with knobs and levers. LCARS panels had a tendency to explode often. Lol
Using LCARS to navigate a ship is like using a cell phone screen to play and Control Skyrim, sure you can do it but the Mouse and Keyboard/ Controller feels better.
John Quigley III actually you could have replaced mouse and keyboard with controller and you have a better comparison.
Some people prefer a mouse and keyboard, as it does have actual feedback. Unlike using a touch screen, but I understand what are saying.
Or a proper control column like those on the Roger Young in Starship Troopers.
Weren't they generally just typing in coordinates and the ship followed remotely... I know there were sticks at least one of the new move ships for manual.
Yeah I think so actually, it seems interesting how the ships pretty much are GPS guided.
Personally, I believe the Delta Flyer to be a gunship type of vessel. If you think about it, it's too big to be a shuttle in all honesty but too small to be a runabout type ship as runabouts include a spacious living area in aft. I think that the 'Borg inspired weapon system' that is talked about is the photon missile launchers as they don't seem to need reloading making it either an energy based weapon or micro replicators build the missiles in the launchers as they are photon missiles not proton torpedoes(no antimatter required).
An even bigger problem with touchscreens: no tactile feedback! Just try using a remote app on your phone without constantly looking down at it. It just doesn’t work; you can only estimate where your digits are supposed to be on a large flat surface.
AWriterWandering. We can assume the L CARS are somewhat more advanced than a current I phone lol. Whats really impressive is that utterly alien characters have no problem with fed consoles and the feds have no issues with using never before seen alien consoles. So obviously the science of intuitive interfaces has reached new heights!
But seriously, I wonder how many of those transporter accidents were due to finicky touch screen sliders? If they are a fraction as glitchy as the volume or answer sliders on my phone the thought is ghastly.
In the Year of Hell Tuvok could still operate the LCARS while he was blind, so either LCARS has only a Braille support or has full fledged tactile feedback.
Tuvok explicitly ordered the computer to configure his console with haptic interface in that episode. But most operators aren't blind yet hardly ever glance at their consoles, even though placing their hands just slightly off position from the correct "buttons" could result in disastrously wrong inputs.
I'm guessing these LCARS panels can "display" tactile output at different intensities, so the operator can feel where the controls actually are, even if the normally subtle tactile surface/texture is cleverly designed so it can't be seen without close scrutiny.
And I'm guessing these LCARS panels can also "sense" tactile inputs at different intensities, so the operator can gain a finer degree of control with gentle touches or hard presses, etc.
I have no explanation for why these screens explode every time there's a power surge. It's just the usual television/cinema idiocy, far more dramatic than unpowered black displays or a system crash/error message.
AWriterWandering actually, you could add tactile interface to the panels on command. So that's not correct.
just a little update Crew dragon uses a lcars style lcd control for flying an maneuvering. only for backup rudimentary old style controlls. and it works fine
malon (may-lon)
Thanks
I always disliked the bog-standard Federation shuttles
Delta Flyer is a long overdue upgrade
.. now if B'elanna and Tom decided to take on a similar upgrade of the Danube Class runabouts . . .
Anyone else think this looks like Gizmoduck?
The Flyer is FIRE! I'd sell my Granny to take that sweet ride for a buzz around the block!
Yep they where magic. “Panel roles for explosive death bolt, critical, gold/red shirt instant fatality”
They did enjoy their c4-laced technology
Lore Reloaded yeah that sounds like sfdebris jayneway.
don't forget the lethal electric arc weapon installed in every panel
Horribly, it might just be that all the explosions are some sort of self-cleaning function.
C4-laced technology, @@LoreReloaded, seems about right. Man... one little energy surge in one panel could kill literally everyone within ten feet of the panel explosion. Fuses and circuit breaker technologies must of been outlawed or "forgotten" like darn near all of Tesla's various technologies and energy based discoveries.
I knew the Delta Flyer was a reference to the common wagon toy, but I just realized that the "Delta" also referred to "Delta quadrant" lmao
UNDERWATER? It's been a while since I've watched Voyager.
indeed
This Episode: memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Thirty_Days_(episode)
Yeah there is an episode where they find an ocean in space.
@@Shapes_Quality_Control and as usual Tom Paris is being a bad boy
bdel80 Yeah Tom Paris was way off base on this one. I love it when Janeway’s ultra-libertarianism kicks in. 😍
In The Expanse, touchscreen controls near your fingertips are essential given the crushing velocities of the ships they travelled.
One thing that The Next Generation series may have gotten right on the practicality of the technology being broadcasted. On the other hand, the Star Trek universe of ships used inertial dampeners to offset those lethal Gee forces..... so, going back to more tactile control schemes would be more practical than just having only touchscreens.
People talking about how the Delta Flyer being too big to fit into the shuttle bay just kind of forget that the Laws of Physics just stand aside and let Janeway do whatever she wants, lest the Laws of Physics draw her Ire their way.
This is a series where of the 40 Photon Torpedos that this ship class is able to be stocked with maximum... they use something like 300.
This is a series where the ship class typically has three shuttles available--and they managed to crash like twenty before even starting work on the Delta Flyer.
This is a series where the captain's weapon of choice was repetitively ejecting the Warp Core at people. Which--is a VERY persuasive argument to make. "Yeah... we are not going to attack that ship... last time it ejected five Warp Cores at us. And Janeway was just MILDLY perturbed about us bothering that ship."
This is a series which brought back the Star Trek classic of old ideal... but instead of breaking the Prime Directive to bang aliens... the captain instead breaks the Prime Temporal Directive to fuck reality. Which it was reality's fault for getting in the way of her having her Black Coffee. Reality should have known better.
This is a series where when the Q Continuum decide that Janeway is the ultimate example of creation and the ideal to model the continuum upon... it kind of just makes sense, that Q fan girls over Janeway.
If there was ever a Star Trek series that resembled Gurren Lagann, it is Voyager. Janeway is either an abomination... or the most bad ass of bad asses imaginable. Depends entirely on if you think The Federation is a bunch of wankers.
Katrina Payne janeway is the best captain along with baldy I think ..... that black guy is rubbish and so was shitner.... no that is spelled correctly .... shitner was shit
+Mike H
Just saw this message... and crap. This is shit I cannot say, as people just accuse me of "not being a real Star Trek fan" and "getting my facts from Buzzfeed"... you know, because boobs or something.
I just kind of gave up after a while, and moved to talking about it like this instead. As I still enjoy Voyager... but when I say shit like you do--people respond like I am a stupid doofus.. and well... that gets hard to deal with after a while.
Katrina Payne I gotta say that you adding the whole ‘cause I have boobs/buzzfeed thing was quite non-sequitur. Star Trek is sadly notorious for its ‘gatekeeping’ fandom. However to take someone’s (admittedly mild) counter to your point as an attack on you as a woman fan... is a bit much. Because correct me if I’m wrong but he never mentioned you being a woman in his reply. Also as I’m sure you’re aware people love ‘Trek to an obsessive degree at times. That obsession can often come off as haughty or rude.
Now! was saying that you sound like you never watched the series a nice thing to comment... not really. (Though the means of text-only communication often leads to lack of context) For the record I believe you have watched Voyager to a significant degree and agree with most of what you had to say.
See, the great thing about an open forum of ideas is that you can either refute his point with evidence, ignore his comment (or that one particular observation) or a multitude of other responses!
Simply throwing your toys out of the pram and whining that it’s all because you’re a woman actually goes to lend more credence to the stereotype about women in fandoms. Ultimately, I ask, what would Janeway do if confronted with that reply? In her being a strong Captain (though her being a woman is irrelevant in my arriving to that belief, honestly) in her actions she definitely shows an example of real egalitarian principles and strength. Because Janeway was a relatable and enduring Starfleet officer first and her being a woman was a simply an aspect of her as a person. It wasn’t her sole identity and wasn’t used to push an agenda. This form of egalitarian with merit and fortitude of character first when being evaluated, not simply minority status. THESE are the things that we should be working towards as a society. Not a backwards purple haired SJW victim-mentality/agenda driven narrative like what was seen in the character ofVice Admiral Holdo in TLJ.
Anyways I hope you have a great day as well as my wish that you live long and prosper! 🖖🏼
🤣😂seems that way.
Katrina Payne considering that Janeway was able to scare fear, I chose badass.
Love your videos as always! Especially liked the part about the nobs and buttons vs the LCD ;)
Well only 50% of the delta flyer type shuttles survived Voyager's journey back to earth.
LCARS (/ˈɛlkɑːrz/)... it's an acronym not French.... sheesh
Wut
Standard starfleet computer interfaces are apparently a French design
Well isn't Pairs the location of the Federation's capital on Earth. So maybe.
About the switches and toggles......In Star Trek Insurrection Riker used a Joystick to maneuver the enterprise during the end of the briar patch battle..I agree switches and levers would be better to pilot a ship. Just try to play a FPS game using a keyboard instead of a mouse.
Magic...its always magic
It needed more explodium to meet Starfleet regulations.
Isn't a probe supposed to be sacrificial?
never thought of it that way honestly.
You think they can just replicate a new one.
Apparently the multi spacial probe was *special*
How special is it?
Probes are disposable, as is every other unmanned gizmo they launch into space.
But some items are harder to replace than others, some materials are too exotic for replicators, some tech is too complex for replicators.
And Voyager had limited resources, with no access to Federation-manufactured replacements.
I have no idea how the touch screens don't crack with all the rocks flying around during battle. It makes as much sense as not having thrusters in all 6 directions on a spacecraft to slow it down and dock.
Memi Mori. They do have thrusters in all 6 directions....
On the models?
Well I imagine they’d use transparent aluminum or something even stronger... especially since they’ve had the technology in the trekverse since the twentieth century thanks to Scotty’s meddling.
Does it have a bathroom?
...mother of god..
Not that we saw and apparently you slept in the seats on long trips.
maybe the transporters where upgraded as well and beamed it right out of you.
Plot bathrooms
Use the escape pod in a pinch...
Saying as the Delta Flyer was built in a rush, it never sat well with me that they created a completely new design. Wouldn't it have more sense to build a modified Runabout? The design was in use well before Voyager's trip to the Delta Quadrant and had proven it could handle itself.
The delta flyer did it's job. It looked cool on screen. Considerations like where it fit a power source that could make all those phasers, torpedoes, shields, and shuttle-race winning engines (not to mention where it fit all those weapons) as well as all that empty space for, you know, people to live and work don't matter. It looked cool on screen. Who cares what the dimensions of the Voyager's shuttlebay doors are? It LOOKS COOL ONSCREEN! (And there's a little extra money in the budget). That's the only consistent rule for Star Trek canon that matters (to the show's producers, anyway). It's not like there's an actual Delta Flyer they have to crane into an actual shuttlebay. Just shrink the 3D model and fudge it.
I wonder if the 24th century touch screens are actually plasma screens. Not like the modern ones, but straight superheated plasma... It would certainly explain the tendency to explode violently with tons of shrapnel if you damage them moderately.
its an advanced shuttle with seven of nine and a team from voyager used to thinking outside the box to make the delta flyer so badass it would win vs two danube shuttles and be fine!
Lcars consoles were made of explodium and packed with rocks. Tom was on to something...