I just graduated today! And I am 100% burnt out from the CACREP requirements and hundreds of hours of unpaid required internship hours. Several people in my cohort quit their jobs to complete internship hours and over half of us are so burned out that we aren’t rushing to get into an associate license and the huge expense of paying a supervisor for 2+ years.
Congratulations on graduating!🎉 I'm currently doing my internship and it's definitely overwhelming sometimes. You made a key point about the finances and hours we have to intern without pay.
Well, congratulations on finishing!!!! I’m beginning my unpaid internship in January for an entire year…And it def makes me feel really uncomfortable not getting paid for this kind of work. Although my site says they are working on paid internships, it may not happen while I’m there. But yes, the road to licensure afterwards does seem long!
It took me six years after graduation to start my license. I just was able to find extremely well paying jobs without the need of a license or was continuously on active duty orders for the military. I only now can afford to pay for supervision and working on my own private practice.
@@jberndt88 That is exactly how you are taught to think working at counseling agencies. The only thing they cared about where I worked was billable hours and client retention. If you did not meet the quota they will fire you.
As someone who just recently reached full licensure after 4 years I'm not surprised. The process to full licensure is difficult with low-paying jobs and the expenses such as supervision, CEs, etc. If you go the private practice route, it takes forever because we can't take insurance and building as a private pay therapist is difficult for even fully licensed professionals. When looking at the process, the reward of full licensure doesn't feel worth it.
As post-grad MHC intern, I was paid $15/hr. by the only companies who would hire non-licensed. And it took 7 months to get the job in the first place. Not a living wage. That is a systemic problem when they know we have no other choice. Meanwhile, they billed clients $85/hr. I was inundated with a full caseload of 35 clients a week. Plus all the paperwork. It was exhausting. Bright side, I did earn all of my hours. My struggle really was in studying for the NCMHCE. I spent months studying, paying for study and practice programs only to continuously fail. The fail rate is 40-60% for the NCMHCE. I can’t tell you how many times I was told to take the exams soon after graduating because working in the field is so different. That’s insane. It’s a struggle all the way through after spending tens of thousands on school in the first place. Let’s not forget the cost of supervision. Of the five people that I was close to when I was in school, none obtained their license. It’s disgusting. And Florida has five-year cap on intern status. So yea, I can vouch for that article.
I am at my last semester of Mental Health MA programm, I also already passed my NCE exam. I am holding a MA in psychology from my country and was working full time as Recruiter in the Global Company during this process. The only reason that I was able to survive financially is because of my husband support and that I was able to save some money while working full time. I found the whole process ridiculously complicated and frustrating. I can't even imagine how young therapists could survive through it. The internship is a slavery, when young therapist have to work 30 hours weekly BY FREE and being 100% dependable on their supervisor. THE SYSTEM HAS TO BE CHANGED.
In some states, social workers, have to take not one but two license exams with two license applications. It is a very complicated, confusing, expensive process.
My counseling graduate program actually included a passing NCE score as part of the requirements for program completion/graduation. My understanding is that there are a lot of other programs out there that work the same way, which is going to skew the heck out of the statistic. Seems like a pretty important fact to remember. As far as ideas for solving the issues creating barriers to licensure, I have one thing to contribute, and it is the hill I will die on: We. Need. More. Paid. Internships. Out. There. End of story. I could go on regarding this topic, but it would almost certainly become a rant. (I probably need my own RUclips channel for that. Or a podcast maybe.)
Definitely an easier process for transfer of license. I moved states & not sure if I’ll get my license here, though I am trying. I was licensed in my former state, but idk. We’ll see if it works out or if I stay with only life coaching (which I’m also trained/certified in). 🤷🏼♀️ financially, it can be a STRUGGLE when we just start. That makes a difference, too. It’s why I left CA after grad school & went somewhere I could be paid for my post graduation trainee hours without needing a second or third job. If we’re burned out, we can’t give the best services
I graduated in 2022, have a private practice, have no issues with getting clients and am already looking for a full time corporate job. I have had nothing but criticism and comments from "licensed" therapists about what I should and should not be doing. Some were even my own personal therapists! Its hard enough sitting with clients and feeling like you know what you are doing but to add that other layer it is just too much. I will continue towards licensure very very slowly on the side. It's hard to not feel like you have failed though with all of that Masters Degree work and time.
@@Joyhopefaithlove In the State of Oregon I can be a state registered intern (prelicensed intern) where I am required to have a number of hours of supervision. I am not required to work in a group or do agency. I overall can't take insurance unless it's medicaid.
I went to graduate school at Liberty University and a requirement of graduation was that you sat for and passed both the NCE and CPCE. If you didn't pass the exams they put you in a class that was dedicated to passing those exams. So at Liberty University the graduation : licensure ratio is 100% because you can't get the degree without passing the licensure test. I think every school should do that.
@@jbenjamin7528 I see that a lot of the comments in this video are reflecting on the topic as you mentioned above. I am reflecting on the research data presented that 43% of "psychotherapy master's graduates" are not taking licensure exams that same year. Getting independently licensure is a bit of a broken process in my opinion for sure.
Passing the exams doesn't mean you get licensed. That's the easiest part frankly for those good at taking tests. Add on 3,000 hours of supervised hours and that's the issue.
@@josephinerobertson2946 you are correct. To my understanding, this study was looking purely at master's degree earned vs license exams taken and that ratio was 43%>
I just quit my graduate program in counseling after completing nearly all of my coursework (really just the practicum/internship left to do) because I started doing the math on my loans so far, the unpaid labor I was about to do as an intern, the unreasonable licensure process, and my potential earning power after graduating and obtaining a license and... the the math was not mathing! I've been a fitness instructor for the past 2 decades and I realized I can actually make more money right now as a full-time fitness teacher than I probably ever would as a therapist. Unbelievable. I'm passionate about mental health and serving others, but the system is so broken
Almost same I did all my classes but internship but my school kicked me out because they don’t think I’m a counselor but after doing practicum even if I was paid I hated the job after 4 months of internship. So maybe I was saved in away.
@Theunderratedapologist Financially I would need to work 40 hours, but then also complete 10 to 15 hours for practicum and internship for a little over a year to get all hours. That feels very stressful to me.
Sadly, I'm not surprised by any of this. I work directly with burnt out healthcare professionals that are wanting to leave the field because they are just done. They're overworked, underpaid, and struggling to find any sort of balance in their life. The beautiful thing about therapists is the transferrable skills are out the roof. And in some ways, I wonder if Master's Level Therapists are able to find other opportunities that fill that "need to help others" space without working for entry-level incomes.
Hi Marie. Thanks for covering this topic. I’m a licensed mft and clinical supervisor and I think this is our profession’s dirty little secret, how very hard it is not just to get licensed but also how to have a rewarding career as a MH professional. It’s the most unique profession, unlike being an MD (we train just as long) or other professional careers where you can expect not just to barely make a living but actually to earn good money. There’s such a demand for MH services and how can we be expected to meet the demand if over half never get licensed?! I have so much to say about this, it really is infuriating!!!
I graduated in 2021. I just got my LPC in May after working in community mental health and in my private practice. It was a very hard road and the only reason I think I made it is because I’d invested myself into this field only to find out I had to fork over so much money before I even started making any. I definitely understand the % and I’m surprised it’s this high because paying for exams, paying for supervision, counting hours, paying for ceu’s, paying for licenses, paying paying paying and all agencies pay is 35-40k is damn exhausting
The internships/field practicums need to be paid. There are students who have to work to pay their bills and have to carry a full course load and field practicum. This leads to being overworked. I think that it has to do with what is valued in our culture as well. We need to see young clinicians entering the field as professionals. Medical students are paid during their residency on average 64k to cover personal costs. This is what I finally made when I was a Masters level post license.
Yes!!! Louder!! Internships have exploitative and abusive work culture for sure- especially omh’s. Therapists need to be paid for their billed services- it is illegal to demand work without pay.
The barrier to entry continues to grow. The counselors before me had to complete 33 credits in their graduate program. I had to complete 49 credits. Now programs are upwards of 60 credits. (More student loans) Add that the supervised hours have jumped from 2000 to 3000 hours. My state just changed the required supervision from 50 hours a year to 100 hours a year, which the new graduate has to pay for. Supervision averages around $125 around here. So that could be $1000 a month in supervision. Many are just saying "screw it" and becoming life coaches. There's zero barrier to entry to be a life coach. No state boards. No tests. No supervision.
@@ashleythetherapist7831 Same here. It took me four years to do a two year master's in counseling: one extra year because getting a practicum/internship placement was a nightmare when my program gave me zero placement assistance, and one extra year doing the chemical dependency counseling certificate my advisor pressured me into because (wait for it; he said this *to my face*) "You don't present well." - Ableist professor to neurodivergent me
@@meganm.matthewslpcccgt6120 ridiculous and no masters program is giving out scholarships so that was more debt. ATP I’m surprised it’s anybody in the field
I got my degree in 2019 and am still working toward my LPC. I have about 1800 of 3000 hours. One problem is I was only a part-time counselor for the first two years at a college clinic that was just starting. Plus, since it was a community college with state funds, I could ONLY work 19 hours a week - including indirect time. So I only averaged about 160 direct hours annually for two years. Once I was hired full time, I got hours faster and passed the 500 mark to where indirect hours could count as well. Then the pandemic slowed things down. For much of 2020 I only saw a few clients a week. Fortunately, they picked back up. UNfortunately, a change in the college president created a work situation that was unsustainable for me so I launched into private practice... and six months later I'm still trying to get my first client. But, I'm using some of the time to try and pass the NCMHCE to at least take care of 500 hours. Now that I'm thinking about the numbers, though, I'm starting to sweat because I basically have 2024 to get 500 hours assuming I pass the NCMHCE.
One thing that appears to have been left out is the effects of the pandemic. It definitely made obtaining training harder. The rise of remote therapy has led to increased isolation and lack of support for therapists. It also caused a dramatic increase on mental health among therapists. I am personally still experiencing increased issues with anxiety and depression due to the stress caused by working during the pandemic and the negative effects that it has had on me. I have thought about leaving the profession due to the low pay and the high number of no-shows and last minute cancellations at my agency. I have also experienced frequent issues with burnout. I feel that I will only be able to work as a therapist for only a little longer due to constantly feeling drained and tired.
I graduated ma in mft in 2020, the start of the pandemic. 💀 😢 3 intense and tedious years of grad school and didn’t even get a proper graduation ceremony.
Amen to all of this. I finally got licensed in 2022, but there were times I wasn't sure if I could make it. I got super burned out at my first job while being underpaid, and ended up leaving to take an even lower paying job at a hospital where I wasn't so burned out. I'm not sure how I would have made if I didn't have significant family support (which is a huge privilege). Life is much better these days and I have my own practice, but I still struggle with feeling underpaid by insurance companies. My personal capacity is around 15 clients a week and that's not a super great living. Sending love to all the pre-licensed therapists trying to make it to licensure!
The amount of shame and guilt around making as a trainee and associate around pay was also a problem. I complained about pay in my first 2 associateships (either agency, or PP group practice) and they said that being an associate was not "suppose" to pay the bill. They advocated getting multiple jobs because that was what was "suppose" to happen. I worked had 3 different jobs spread around 4 sites. 3 were PP group practices what wasn't getting me enough clients. They said that I needed another job to make a living wage. Whenever i complained about pay to some of my school peers, I was told that this is a noble profession and that I shouldn't be doing it for the money... So.... how is that suppose to work? I eventually got licensed and turned things around but never again...
I thought for the longest time I wanted to be a therapist, and I was in the top university with the top program and totally rocking it (the head of the program and department tried talking me out of it because she saw my potential)... but I couldn't justify going into $60+K of debt to get there while seeing the low pay and post grad years to get your hours.... I have a child with special needs (lots of medical expenses adding to the financial strain), and so I knew sticking to life, relationship, and recovery coaching was a better fit for me and my family long-term in terms of finances, scheduling, and types of clients I'd see. I truly wish the healthcare/wellness care system were different. Unfortunately the most important professions to society often have the highest barriers to attaining those professions.
Getting licensed is not worth it nowadays; waste of time, money and energy. You also get paid pennies as an intern. The best option is to take cash only and deal with high functioning clients that can afford it. Just speaking the facts people.
@BleddyBear81 35 an hour per session? Or working 40 hours a week. Regardless Goodluck paying rent or mortgage, loans, kids and food on that. This field isn't worth the money you make unless you break free from the license nonsense and I have my lmhc and phd license. Wasn't worth it. I never use either and make way more money taking cash.
@@cvc2907 I made 35 per hour full time. I support two children and paid child support. Perhaps I was incredibly blessed. However, I made it through the dredges. And now I am on clear skys at the moment. For me it worked, but I understood the truth behind to concept of sacrifice. Too many people whine that they have to give up their cigarettes and coffee to survive.
life coaches are not licensed. Certs only. The laughable thing to me is therapists and people that went to school but are not licensed would be more qualified based on education than someone that took a cert program.
Perhaps it's a bit like the way a huge percentage of seminarians decide they are actually atheists. The idea of doing clinical work is not the same as doing it and committing to figuring out how to get beyond our low pay and all the work to get the supervised hours in etc.
This was a great topic. I had the toughest time getting licensed. It was infuriating. I lived in New Jersey and got licensed first in Texas by submitting the same information.
Hi, I am also in NJ. NJ has 4500 hour rule. I am also thinking should I pick a state that has 3000 hours for licensure. Can you tell me a little bit more about the process you went through?
As an experienced supervisor, I have much to say but can't say it all here. So much needs to be changed. Unpaid internships should be illegal. Counseling programs in my area barely teach interventions, let alone the art of counseling. Many counseling centers aren't legally meeting the requirements of supervising and supervisees, and this greatly affects their development. The thing that is truly concerning is that we aren't vetting potential therapists for the profession. Over the years i've had more interns that have extensive, largely unaddressed mental health issues that NEED therapy before they go into therapy and potentially harm clients. I am not their therapist, and putting the brakes on somebody because of this is a very dicey situation for a supervisor. I realize I'm all over the place in this comment, but there are so many issues.
My counseling program woefully lacked teaching interventions. It was largely theory, how to be multiculturally competent, and getting a feel for diagnosing by working through wildly complex vignettes.
This is making me not want to become a therapist anymore. Whats the point if you have struggle financially, mentally, emotionally for years and years with low pay and no health benefits in the end AFTER your masters degree. “It’s fulfilling” isn’t gonna pay my bills.
Dr. Fang, thank you so much for summarizing our findings so well, and for highlighting this critical issue! When I was working toward my license as a LMFT, supervision had to be in-person, and the closest clinical supervisor was a two-hour drive away from my rural Georgia town. I spent hours each week driving back and forth to my supervisors office. Once states began allowing virtual supervision, I started Motivo to (hopefully) make it a little easier for therapists who came behind me. And you TOTALLY said the name right! It's Mo-tee-vo!
Love your videos! Can you do a video on the CACREP vs. Non-CACREP pros and cons? I am in Colorado and they require the degree to be from a CACREP accredited program Or equivalent coursework.
I have been a licensed counselor for 25 years. My internship experience might not relate to what students experience today. I certainly hope not. We were expected to work full-time for zip no pay. And this was how it was. No matter where you looked, the standard was because you were a learner and getting supervision. They didn’t need to pay you. And it was tough then. Same as now. I was a single parent with no one else to help financially. Over 25 years later, I am still struggling to catch up financially from those years. I still have some student loans to pay off. I have worked very hard my entire career. I chose to work in a rural community, and that does impact my income. However, I think we need to do better by therapist across the board and yes, especially for those who are. Trying to get licensed
Hello! I am halfway through a masters in mental health counseling program. I asked one of my teachers about this issue of having to work a whole extra job and accumulating my licensure hours through essentially volunteering. He said the only time you should be doing counseling for free is during your in program internship. Once you can put your program, you should be making good money while getting your hours for licensure. From that, I think it's a matter of finding the right fit for a job under someone who can provide you that individual and triadic supervision. I'm really nervous about burn out because I don't know how much capacity I will have for seeing clients and whether or not I'll be able to collect my hours fast enough but we shall see. Never really know until you try. And I'll get better as I get more experience. Anyway, thank you for all of your awesome videos, Marie
I waited a few years after receiving my masters to get licensed. I was making $86k a year in wait I was doing at the time without a license. I licensed a year before completing PhD.
Just finished my Internship/Practicum (barely made it financially and Mentally). I now have a job that I am super grateful for BUT its a rare positionand if I dont build a required caseload I will be losing it in 3 months, while paying for supervision at a low rate of $125an hour. IT.IS.NOT.AN.EASY.PROCESS!! Lemme add the amount of student loans I have to start paying in Jan are insane!! Im also learning how lonely of a career path I have chosen.
The reason for this statistic is pretty simple: 1.) Research finds no correlation between "licensing" and quality of care. None. In fact, you can make the argument that most "licensed therapists" aren't very good therapists. 2.) We live in a day and age of specialization. And, any therapist or counselor looking to go cash pay (which is most nowadays) will be encouraged by a mentor to "niche down." Now, why would anyone want to go through the hassle of umbrella "licensing" when that individual specializes in one area? Why do I want to seek licensing if the only thing I care about is treating people with grief and I already hold a Ph.D. in the field, along with a couple of notable certifications? Licensing has become a bit of a farce.
Been gearing up to begin my masters in clinical counseling and, by far, the most daunting aspect of licensure for me appears to be the worry of how am I to work on these 3000 hours on the side. It doesn’t seem feasible to give up my full time job that keeps a roof over my family’s heads to get the hours done faster vs hoping to find the hours outside of my current job and pays anything at all for the time. I can’t imagine nurses going through a similar process, though the stakes for them tend to be higher in their profession.
Wait. You mean the Social Justice component required by CACREP doesn’t make the profession and programs just? It’s a great rhetorical strategy to confront the profession/organization-“Here are your stated values…” Very disappointing to hear this statistic. Work without pay is not just.
I supervise interns and sometimes will supervise them post grad.....it is really hard for them to commit the time and money to complete all the hours, and I dont charge that much! Back when I was getting my hours completed I was living with my parents so I could afford it. It took 2 years of weekly supervision sessions to complete it....I could not have done it if I had to also pay rent :( I also am a school counselor and clinical licensure is not required, just the department of Ed license.
I’m not surprised at all by this. I wanted to drop out of grad school my first year because it was so overwhelming. Full time school, unpaid internship, and work to pay for school. I was blessed and lived at home during this time. I’m glad I completed it and got licensed, but it was rough. And now working as a therapist for the county; we’re underpaid and under valued. I’ve contemplated PP but don’t know if it’s worth it. And not to mention everyone’s a therapist these days; actors/actresses, everyday people. I feel like we’ve lost a lot of street cred and people would much rather listen to the advice from a celebrity than trained professionals. I love what I do, but often think it’s time for a career change.
My first job as an LLPC paid $13/hr. (Inflation adjusted $17/hr today). The experience was invaluable, but if I didn't have the licensing supervision I did (cus the job supervisor was horrendous) I wouldn't have lasted to job #2.
I lost my job to complete 450 hours of internship and I cannot count how many times this calling make you question yoir decisions. Grateful to have found this page.
This truly was a fantastic review, thanks so much for sharing. I've been licensed for 10 years and reflect on how much and what has changed in the world that makes it so much harder for new clinicians. Glad I got into this when I did though it was still difficult financially. I hope this changes with more advocacy and support.
I have been dreaming about and working towards applying to grad school for counseling or social work. But I just submitted my first application and feel terrified. I worry I am not going to be a hood therapist or will be ill-prepared through my training. I don't know what else I would do 🥺
You will always be I'll-prepared after grad school. They can't cover everything. Supervision is what really helps you improve beyond the basics. And most therapists worry about doing a good job early on. That actually is evidence that you would probably do a good job - you care.
As a therapist who went from earning $50K while unlicensed to then drop to $36K in a period of a couple of years, I can tell you that the thought of leaving the profession crossed my mind several times. I guess I was lucky and hard-headed enough to keep at it and get licensed while my husband took care of most of our home expenses. It was super difficult but I made it. Now I work for an insurance company earning a decent salary (not earning six figures yet but close). But I am not planning to go back to the hassle of working directly with high risk, difficult clients and earning much less than what I’m making now. Our profession is highly underrated, underpaid, and under-appreciated compared to more technical ones and the hassle of getting through school then doing internship and taking the exam while getting paid close to minimum wage will continue to make it less and less appealing to future professionals 😢
@@molly2frodo222 I review mental health disability claims. There are several companies with a behavioral health department as far as I know (Aflac, MetLife, Hartford, Sun Life, just to name a few)
Current clinical mental health counseling graduate student here. My professor brought this article for my entire cohort to read in class a few weeks ago. It shocked me as I started pointing it out to my classmates that 43% attain full licensure. I can definitely see the cracks in the system as I am wrapping up my 2nd to last semester of school. Excited for the future and yet grateful for the awareness this article provides. Love the content and glad you’re talking about this topic!
I lived under constant fear after license that i was going to lose my apartment and had to constantly borrow just to eat. Then i got a job working at a hospital that provided free, but woefully inadequate supervision. The burnout was real though. When i got my full licensure, my workload actually increased when i moved to community mental health, doing 40 to 45 hours a week. Only now, after 7 years, have i gotten into a job that wont let me do more than 35 hours a week and is paying me an authentic liveable wage.
I just graduated in August and got licensed in October. The cost of licensure was incredibly expensive. I was also exhausted from all the hours of Practicum and two internships. I have secured a supervisor. I have a job. However, if you break down the hours that I’m working versus the pay… It is sad. I also work driving for Walmart delivery and other gig job so that I can pay the bills. I love this profession, so I am not leaving. I am even starting my PhD program in January. However, I think finances are a huge part of why people don’t get licensed. In North Carolina, where I live, the average pay for a newly graduated therapist is around 36,000 to see 22 to 25 clients a week.
This was an incredible video! A solution that would be helpful is that some of the better paying therapy jobs are solely for licensed therapist, when I see these job postings I often think “what about unlicensed clinicians?”, it’s a shame. There’s so much red tape and liability fears in this professions, which ultimately hold back great clinicians who are ready to work. By the time I got my license, I was ready to quit. I couldn’t even believe it when it came in the mail.
This is the exact video I needed to see as I plan my schedule for next week. My schedule will be completely clear. Burnout is a real as Im sure you're all very aware of. I'm in the midst of full licensure about another year and it is frustrating. The amount of hours needed in nj (4500) is baffling. And while i appreciate and understand the importance of supervision, 4500 is like climbing mt everest. But here we are. Take care of yourselves!
PSLF in fewer years- definitely not ten! Seven years is probably too much also, imho. I am two years post licensure, so i would add to the tally expenses such as ceus and insurance, which i really had not fully considered before entering the field.
I have been licensed for 18 years. It took me many years to become fully licensed because of the rules in Texas at that time. You had to complete all your internship hours before taking the Texas LPC exam. It had a very high failure rate. It was so discouraging. I had given up until I started working at a site that provided supervision. I passed the Texas LPC test on my first try however the challenges of being a mental health professional at this time have led me to question if i made the right choice to be a counselor
I just graduated and really want to get licensed so bad, but it is so hard along with raising children it is super hard to afford it. The transitional period is hard and it's super hard to find a job when you have a master's in counseling.
I am an independently licensed MFT in the state of Ohio. Ohio has a two-tier licensing system - you get a license when you graduate that allows you to work under supervision. After you complete certain requirements, you can become independently licensed and work without supervision. I needed 200 hours of supervision in order to become independently licensed as an MFT. It took me just over three years. I paid two separate supervisors to help me reach those hours. I really wanted that license, so I was motivated to get it, but there were a large number of students from my program that never pursued getting independently licensed as an MFT because it was too difficult.
I’m glad the racial aspect was mentioned because the ASWB for social workers released stats on the pass/fail rates and it’s horrendous for AA/BA social workers. I really like what Texas did for associate LPCs where they can start their own practice as long as they have supervision. I would love that as it would give me more autonomy while also receiving adequate supervision. I know there are a lot of cons to it but at least I have a say of when, how often, who, what, and where.
What definitely helped me get to licensure as an LPC in Colorado was that I climbed up the CAT/CAS/LAC path as an addiction counselor and had a paying job for every internship because of the addictions field.
@@brittneej5486 thanks. You could be right but I feel like its usage became “mainstream” within the behavioral sciences somewhat recently and I just can’t discern what the reason would be.
I just graduated today! And I am 100% burnt out from the CACREP requirements and hundreds of hours of unpaid required internship hours. Several people in my cohort quit their jobs to complete internship hours and over half of us are so burned out that we aren’t rushing to get into an associate license and the huge expense of paying a supervisor for 2+ years.
Congratulations on graduating!🎉 I'm currently doing my internship and it's definitely overwhelming sometimes. You made a key point about the finances and hours we have to intern without pay.
I was one of those people who quit my job to go work for free in an internship. It was a lot of days I thought I was being punked.
Well, congratulations on finishing!!!! I’m beginning my unpaid internship in January for an entire year…And it def makes me feel really uncomfortable not getting paid for this kind of work. Although my site says they are working on paid internships, it may not happen while I’m there. But yes, the road to licensure afterwards does seem long!
It took me six years after graduation to start my license. I just was able to find extremely well paying jobs without the need of a license or was continuously on active duty orders for the military. I only now can afford to pay for supervision and working on my own private practice.
@@jberndt88 That is exactly how you are taught to think working at counseling agencies. The only thing they cared about where I worked was billable hours and client retention. If you did not meet the quota they will fire you.
As someone who just recently reached full licensure after 4 years I'm not surprised. The process to full licensure is difficult with low-paying jobs and the expenses such as supervision, CEs, etc. If you go the private practice route, it takes forever because we can't take insurance and building as a private pay therapist is difficult for even fully licensed professionals. When looking at the process, the reward of full licensure doesn't feel worth it.
As post-grad MHC intern, I was paid $15/hr. by the only companies who would hire non-licensed. And it took 7 months to get the job in the first place. Not a living wage. That is a systemic problem when they know we have no other choice. Meanwhile, they billed clients $85/hr. I was inundated with a full caseload of 35 clients a week. Plus all the paperwork. It was exhausting. Bright side, I did earn all of my hours. My struggle really was in studying for the NCMHCE. I spent months studying, paying for study and practice programs only to continuously fail. The fail rate is 40-60% for the NCMHCE. I can’t tell you how many times I was told to take the exams soon after graduating because working in the field is so different. That’s insane. It’s a struggle all the way through after spending tens of thousands on school in the first place. Let’s not forget the cost of supervision. Of the five people that I was close to when I was in school, none obtained their license. It’s disgusting. And Florida has five-year cap on intern status. So yea, I can vouch for that article.
I am at my last semester of Mental Health MA programm, I also already passed my NCE exam. I am holding a MA in psychology from my country and was working full time as Recruiter in the Global Company during this process. The only reason that I was able to survive financially is because of my husband support and that I was able to save some money while working full time. I found the whole process ridiculously complicated and frustrating. I can't even imagine how young therapists could survive through it. The internship is a slavery, when young therapist have to work 30 hours weekly BY FREE and being 100% dependable on their supervisor. THE SYSTEM HAS TO BE CHANGED.
In some states, social workers, have to take not one but two license exams with two license applications. It is a very complicated, confusing, expensive process.
also a lot of social workers are macro focused, meaning they don't need a license in the first place to work!
My counseling graduate program actually included a passing NCE score as part of the requirements for program completion/graduation. My understanding is that there are a lot of other programs out there that work the same way, which is going to skew the heck out of the statistic. Seems like a pretty important fact to remember.
As far as ideas for solving the issues creating barriers to licensure, I have one thing to contribute, and it is the hill I will die on: We. Need. More. Paid. Internships. Out. There. End of story. I could go on regarding this topic, but it would almost certainly become a rant. (I probably need my own RUclips channel for that. Or a podcast maybe.)
Definitely an easier process for transfer of license. I moved states & not sure if I’ll get my license here, though I am trying. I was licensed in my former state, but idk. We’ll see if it works out or if I stay with only life coaching (which I’m also trained/certified in). 🤷🏼♀️ financially, it can be a STRUGGLE when we just start. That makes a difference, too. It’s why I left CA after grad school & went somewhere I could be paid for my post graduation trainee hours without needing a second or third job. If we’re burned out, we can’t give the best services
I graduated in 2022, have a private practice, have no issues with getting clients and am already looking for a full time corporate job. I have had nothing but criticism and comments from "licensed" therapists about what I should and should not be doing. Some were even my own personal therapists! Its hard enough sitting with clients and feeling like you know what you are doing but to add that other layer it is just too much. I will continue towards licensure very very slowly on the side. It's hard to not feel like you have failed though with all of that Masters Degree work and time.
How do you have a practice without a license if you don't mind me asking?
@@Joyhopefaithlove In the State of Oregon I can be a state registered intern (prelicensed intern) where I am required to have a number of hours of supervision. I am not required to work in a group or do agency. I overall can't take insurance unless it's medicaid.
@@CourageousSoulCounseling thanks for taking the time to reply.
I went to graduate school at Liberty University and a requirement of graduation was that you sat for and passed both the NCE and CPCE. If you didn't pass the exams they put you in a class that was dedicated to passing those exams. So at Liberty University the graduation : licensure ratio is 100% because you can't get the degree without passing the licensure test. I think every school should do that.
Just want to point out that passing the licensure test is different than getting one's license, which this video was speaking on the latter.
@@jbenjamin7528 I see that a lot of the comments in this video are reflecting on the topic as you mentioned above. I am reflecting on the research data presented that 43% of "psychotherapy master's graduates" are not taking licensure exams that same year. Getting independently licensure is a bit of a broken process in my opinion for sure.
@@jbenjamin7528 some added context: I'm am LPC in the NC/SC area and the licensure exam for those states is the NCE.
Passing the exams doesn't mean you get licensed. That's the easiest part frankly for those good at taking tests. Add on 3,000 hours of supervised hours and that's the issue.
@@josephinerobertson2946 you are correct. To my understanding, this study was looking purely at master's degree earned vs license exams taken and that ratio was 43%>
I just quit my graduate program in counseling after completing nearly all of my coursework (really just the practicum/internship left to do) because I started doing the math on my loans so far, the unpaid labor I was about to do as an intern, the unreasonable licensure process, and my potential earning power after graduating and obtaining a license and... the the math was not mathing! I've been a fitness instructor for the past 2 decades and I realized I can actually make more money right now as a full-time fitness teacher than I probably ever would as a therapist. Unbelievable. I'm passionate about mental health and serving others, but the system is so broken
Almost same I did all my classes but internship but my school kicked me out because they don’t think I’m a counselor but after doing practicum even if I was paid I hated the job after 4 months of internship. So maybe I was saved in away.
I also just quit because the math was not mathing. Completed one year of grad school. I could not see myself working a year unpaid.
@@Naturalexperience78 The program you were in didn't have the flexibility to work still a current job and as well as gain your experience?
@Theunderratedapologist Financially I would need to work 40 hours, but then also complete 10 to 15 hours for practicum and internship for a little over a year to get all hours. That feels very stressful to me.
@@Naturalexperience78Oh, I see! Understandable.
Sadly, I'm not surprised by any of this. I work directly with burnt out healthcare professionals that are wanting to leave the field because they are just done. They're overworked, underpaid, and struggling to find any sort of balance in their life. The beautiful thing about therapists is the transferrable skills are out the roof. And in some ways, I wonder if Master's Level Therapists are able to find other opportunities that fill that "need to help others" space without working for entry-level incomes.
Hi Marie. Thanks for covering this topic. I’m a licensed mft and clinical supervisor and I think this is our profession’s dirty little secret, how very hard it is not just to get licensed but also how to have a rewarding career as a MH professional. It’s the most unique profession, unlike being an MD (we train just as long) or other professional careers where you can expect not just to barely make a living but actually to earn good money. There’s such a demand for MH services and how can we be expected to meet the demand if over half never get licensed?! I have so much to say about this, it really is infuriating!!!
Count up the number of hours over the number of years and tell me again we train as long as MDs lmao
I graduated in 2021. I just got my LPC in May after working in community mental health and in my private practice. It was a very hard road and the only reason I think I made it is because I’d invested myself into this field only to find out I had to fork over so much money before I even started making any. I definitely understand the % and I’m surprised it’s this high because paying for exams, paying for supervision, counting hours, paying for ceu’s, paying for licenses, paying paying paying and all agencies pay is 35-40k is damn exhausting
The internships/field practicums need to be paid. There are students who have to work to pay their bills and have to carry a full course load and field practicum. This leads to being overworked. I think that it has to do with what is valued in our culture as well. We need to see young clinicians entering the field as professionals. Medical students are paid during their residency on average 64k to cover personal costs. This is what I finally made when I was a Masters level post license.
Yes!!! Louder!! Internships have exploitative and abusive work culture for sure- especially omh’s. Therapists need to be paid for their billed services- it is illegal to demand work without pay.
The low pay and required, unpaid internships not worth the ROI. Simple.
The barrier to entry continues to grow. The counselors before me had to complete 33 credits in their graduate program. I had to complete 49 credits. Now programs are upwards of 60 credits. (More student loans)
Add that the supervised hours have jumped from 2000 to 3000 hours.
My state just changed the required supervision from 50 hours a year to 100 hours a year, which the new graduate has to pay for. Supervision averages around $125 around here. So that could be $1000 a month in supervision.
Many are just saying "screw it" and becoming life coaches. There's zero barrier to entry to be a life coach. No state boards. No tests. No supervision.
And more time. The time it took me to get through my 60 hour program I could’ve had two masters
@@ashleythetherapist7831 Same here. It took me four years to do a two year master's in counseling: one extra year because getting a practicum/internship placement was a nightmare when my program gave me zero placement assistance, and one extra year doing the chemical dependency counseling certificate my advisor pressured me into because (wait for it; he said this *to my face*) "You don't present well." - Ableist professor to neurodivergent me
@@meganm.matthewslpcccgt6120 ridiculous and no masters program is giving out scholarships so that was more debt. ATP I’m surprised it’s anybody in the field
I agree with your thought that many are probably going the life coach route. It is tempting.
My state requires 4,000 hours!
I got my degree in 2019 and am still working toward my LPC. I have about 1800 of 3000 hours. One problem is I was only a part-time counselor for the first two years at a college clinic that was just starting. Plus, since it was a community college with state funds, I could ONLY work 19 hours a week - including indirect time. So I only averaged about 160 direct hours annually for two years. Once I was hired full time, I got hours faster and passed the 500 mark to where indirect hours could count as well. Then the pandemic slowed things down. For much of 2020 I only saw a few clients a week. Fortunately, they picked back up. UNfortunately, a change in the college president created a work situation that was unsustainable for me so I launched into private practice... and six months later I'm still trying to get my first client. But, I'm using some of the time to try and pass the NCMHCE to at least take care of 500 hours. Now that I'm thinking about the numbers, though, I'm starting to sweat because I basically have 2024 to get 500 hours assuming I pass the NCMHCE.
One thing that appears to have been left out is the effects of the pandemic. It definitely made obtaining training harder. The rise of remote therapy has led to increased isolation and lack of support for therapists. It also caused a dramatic increase on mental health among therapists. I am personally still experiencing increased issues with anxiety and depression due to the stress caused by working during the pandemic and the negative effects that it has had on me. I have thought about leaving the profession due to the low pay and the high number of no-shows and last minute cancellations at my agency. I have also experienced frequent issues with burnout. I feel that I will only be able to work as a therapist for only a little longer due to constantly feeling drained and tired.
I graduated ma in mft in 2020, the start of the pandemic. 💀 😢 3 intense and tedious years of grad school and didn’t even get a proper graduation ceremony.
Amen to all of this. I finally got licensed in 2022, but there were times I wasn't sure if I could make it. I got super burned out at my first job while being underpaid, and ended up leaving to take an even lower paying job at a hospital where I wasn't so burned out. I'm not sure how I would have made if I didn't have significant family support (which is a huge privilege). Life is much better these days and I have my own practice, but I still struggle with feeling underpaid by insurance companies. My personal capacity is around 15 clients a week and that's not a super great living. Sending love to all the pre-licensed therapists trying to make it to licensure!
It is tough to make a living because we are just trading time for money. We can only work so many hours a day.
And for women who become moms during the process... the time constraint could be a huge barrier.
The amount of shame and guilt around making as a trainee and associate around pay was also a problem. I complained about pay in my first 2 associateships (either agency, or PP group practice) and they said that being an associate was not "suppose" to pay the bill. They advocated getting multiple jobs because that was what was "suppose" to happen. I worked had 3 different jobs spread around 4 sites. 3 were PP group practices what wasn't getting me enough clients. They said that I needed another job to make a living wage. Whenever i complained about pay to some of my school peers, I was told that this is a noble profession and that I shouldn't be doing it for the money... So.... how is that suppose to work? I eventually got licensed and turned things around but never again...
I thought for the longest time I wanted to be a therapist, and I was in the top university with the top program and totally rocking it (the head of the program and department tried talking me out of it because she saw my potential)... but I couldn't justify going into $60+K of debt to get there while seeing the low pay and post grad years to get your hours.... I have a child with special needs (lots of medical expenses adding to the financial strain), and so I knew sticking to life, relationship, and recovery coaching was a better fit for me and my family long-term in terms of finances, scheduling, and types of clients I'd see.
I truly wish the healthcare/wellness care system were different. Unfortunately the most important professions to society often have the highest barriers to attaining those professions.
The counseling profession reminds me sometimes of the teaching profession and the issues they face with pay.
Getting licensed is not worth it nowadays; waste of time, money and energy. You also get paid pennies as an intern. The best option is to take cash only and deal with high functioning clients that can afford it. Just speaking the facts people.
At my internship I was making $35 an hour, with full benefits, holiday vacation, sick, and even a birthday holiday. Not Pennies…
@BleddyBear81 35 an hour per session? Or working 40 hours a week. Regardless Goodluck paying rent or mortgage, loans, kids and food on that. This field isn't worth the money you make unless you break free from the license nonsense and I have my lmhc and phd license. Wasn't worth it. I never use either and make way more money taking cash.
@@cvc2907 I made 35 per hour full time. I support two children and paid child support. Perhaps I was incredibly blessed. However, I made it through the dredges. And now I am on clear skys at the moment. For me it worked, but I understood the truth behind to concept of sacrifice. Too many people whine that they have to give up their cigarettes and coffee to survive.
@@cvc2907you have a private practice?
Meanwhile "Life Coaches" are making a mint without even a degree...what are the steps to getting the license? Any vlogs on this?
life coaches are not licensed. Certs only. The laughable thing to me is therapists and people that went to school but are not licensed would be more qualified based on education than someone that took a cert program.
Perhaps it's a bit like the way a huge percentage of seminarians decide they are actually atheists. The idea of doing clinical work is not the same as doing it and committing to figuring out how to get beyond our low pay and all the work to get the supervised hours in etc.
This was a great topic. I had the toughest time getting licensed. It was infuriating. I lived in New Jersey and got licensed first in Texas by submitting the same information.
Hi, I am also in NJ. NJ has 4500 hour rule. I am also thinking should I pick a state that has 3000 hours for licensure. Can you tell me a little bit more about the process you went through?
As an experienced supervisor, I have much to say but can't say it all here. So much needs to be changed. Unpaid internships should be illegal. Counseling programs in my area barely teach interventions, let alone the art of counseling. Many counseling centers aren't legally meeting the requirements of supervising and supervisees, and this greatly affects their development. The thing that is truly concerning is that we aren't vetting potential therapists for the profession. Over the years i've had more interns that have extensive, largely unaddressed mental health issues that NEED therapy before they go into therapy and potentially harm clients. I am not their therapist, and putting the brakes on somebody because of this is a very dicey situation for a supervisor. I realize I'm all over the place in this comment, but there are so many issues.
My counseling program woefully lacked teaching interventions. It was largely theory, how to be multiculturally competent, and getting a feel for diagnosing by working through wildly complex vignettes.
You're not all over the place. It's valuable to hear a supervisor's perspective.
This is making me not want to become a therapist anymore. Whats the point if you have struggle financially, mentally, emotionally for years and years with low pay and no health benefits in the end AFTER your masters degree. “It’s fulfilling” isn’t gonna pay my bills.
What job would you get to pay more?
Dr. Fang, thank you so much for summarizing our findings so well, and for highlighting this critical issue!
When I was working toward my license as a LMFT, supervision had to be in-person, and the closest clinical supervisor was a two-hour drive away from my rural Georgia town. I spent hours each week driving back and forth to my supervisors office. Once states began allowing virtual supervision, I started Motivo to (hopefully) make it a little easier for therapists who came behind me.
And you TOTALLY said the name right! It's Mo-tee-vo!
Love your videos! Can you do a video on the CACREP vs. Non-CACREP pros and cons? I am in Colorado and they require the degree to be from a CACREP accredited program Or equivalent coursework.
I have been a licensed counselor for 25 years. My internship experience might not relate to what students experience today. I certainly hope not. We were expected to work full-time for zip no pay. And this was how it was. No matter where you looked, the standard was because you were a learner and getting supervision. They didn’t need to pay you. And it was tough then. Same as now. I was a single parent with no one else to help financially. Over 25 years later, I am still struggling to catch up financially from those years. I still have some student loans to pay off. I have worked very hard my entire career. I chose to work in a rural community, and that does impact my income. However, I think we need to do better by therapist across the board and yes, especially for those who are. Trying to get licensed
Hello! I am halfway through a masters in mental health counseling program. I asked one of my teachers about this issue of having to work a whole extra job and accumulating my licensure hours through essentially volunteering. He said the only time you should be doing counseling for free is during your in program internship. Once you can put your program, you should be making good money while getting your hours for licensure. From that, I think it's a matter of finding the right fit for a job under someone who can provide you that individual and triadic supervision. I'm really nervous about burn out because I don't know how much capacity I will have for seeing clients and whether or not I'll be able to collect my hours fast enough but we shall see. Never really know until you try. And I'll get better as I get more experience. Anyway, thank you for all of your awesome videos, Marie
Thank you for sharing this. This data is important and some changes need to happen ASAP.
I waited a few years after receiving my masters to get licensed. I was making $86k a year in wait I was doing at the time without a license. I licensed a year before completing PhD.
Wow really
Just finished my Internship/Practicum (barely made it financially and Mentally). I now have a job that I am super grateful for BUT its a rare positionand if I dont build a required caseload I will be losing it in 3 months, while paying for supervision at a low rate of $125an hour.
IT.IS.NOT.AN.EASY.PROCESS!! Lemme add the amount of student loans I have to start paying in Jan are insane!!
Im also learning how lonely of a career path I have chosen.
The reason for this statistic is pretty simple: 1.) Research finds no correlation between "licensing" and quality of care. None. In fact, you can make the argument that most "licensed therapists" aren't very good therapists. 2.) We live in a day and age of specialization. And, any therapist or counselor looking to go cash pay (which is most nowadays) will be encouraged by a mentor to "niche down." Now, why would anyone want to go through the hassle of umbrella "licensing" when that individual specializes in one area? Why do I want to seek licensing if the only thing I care about is treating people with grief and I already hold a Ph.D. in the field, along with a couple of notable certifications? Licensing has become a bit of a farce.
Been gearing up to begin my masters in clinical counseling and, by far, the most daunting aspect of licensure for me appears to be the worry of how am I to work on these 3000 hours on the side. It doesn’t seem feasible to give up my full time job that keeps a roof over my family’s heads to get the hours done faster vs hoping to find the hours outside of my current job and pays anything at all for the time. I can’t imagine nurses going through a similar process, though the stakes for them tend to be higher in their profession.
Wait. You mean the Social Justice component required by CACREP doesn’t make the profession and programs just? It’s a great rhetorical strategy to confront the profession/organization-“Here are your stated values…” Very disappointing to hear this statistic. Work without pay is not just.
I supervise interns and sometimes will supervise them post grad.....it is really hard for them to commit the time and money to complete all the hours, and I dont charge that much! Back when I was getting my hours completed I was living with my parents so I could afford it. It took 2 years of weekly supervision sessions to complete it....I could not have done it if I had to also pay rent :(
I also am a school counselor and clinical licensure is not required, just the department of Ed license.
I’m not surprised at all by this. I wanted to drop out of grad school my first year because it was so overwhelming. Full time school, unpaid internship, and work to pay for school. I was blessed and lived at home during this time. I’m glad I completed it and got licensed, but it was rough. And now working as a therapist for the county; we’re underpaid and under valued. I’ve contemplated PP but don’t know if it’s worth it. And not to mention everyone’s a therapist these days; actors/actresses, everyday people. I feel like we’ve lost a lot of street cred and people would much rather listen to the advice from a celebrity than trained professionals. I love what I do, but often think it’s time for a career change.
My first job as an LLPC paid $13/hr. (Inflation adjusted $17/hr today). The experience was invaluable, but if I didn't have the licensing supervision I did (cus the job supervisor was horrendous) I wouldn't have lasted to job #2.
I lost my job to complete 450 hours of internship and I cannot count how many times this calling make you question yoir decisions. Grateful to have found this page.
This truly was a fantastic review, thanks so much for sharing. I've been licensed for 10 years and reflect on how much and what has changed in the world that makes it so much harder for new clinicians. Glad I got into this when I did though it was still difficult financially. I hope this changes with more advocacy and support.
I have been dreaming about and working towards applying to grad school for counseling or social work. But I just submitted my first application and feel terrified.
I worry I am not going to be a hood therapist or will be ill-prepared through my training. I don't know what else I would do 🥺
You will always be I'll-prepared after grad school. They can't cover everything. Supervision is what really helps you improve beyond the basics. And most therapists worry about doing a good job early on. That actually is evidence that you would probably do a good job - you care.
As a therapist who went from earning $50K while unlicensed to then drop to $36K in a period of a couple of years, I can tell you that the thought of leaving the profession crossed my mind several times. I guess I was lucky and hard-headed enough to keep at it and get licensed while my husband took care of most of our home expenses. It was super difficult but I made it. Now I work for an insurance company earning a decent salary (not earning six figures yet but close). But I am not planning to go back to the hassle of working directly with high risk, difficult clients and earning much less than what I’m making now. Our profession is highly underrated, underpaid, and under-appreciated compared to more technical ones and the hassle of getting through school then doing internship and taking the exam while getting paid close to minimum wage will continue to make it less and less appealing to future professionals 😢
What do you do at the insurance company?
@@molly2frodo222 I review mental health disability claims. There are several companies with a behavioral health department as far as I know (Aflac, MetLife, Hartford, Sun Life, just to name a few)
Current clinical mental health counseling graduate student here. My professor brought this article for my entire cohort to read in class a few weeks ago. It shocked me as I started pointing it out to my classmates that 43% attain full licensure. I can definitely see the cracks in the system as I am wrapping up my 2nd to last semester of school. Excited for the future and yet grateful for the awareness this article provides.
Love the content and glad you’re talking about this topic!
I lived under constant fear after license that i was going to lose my apartment and had to constantly borrow just to eat. Then i got a job working at a hospital that provided free, but woefully inadequate supervision. The burnout was real though. When i got my full licensure, my workload actually increased when i moved to community mental health, doing 40 to 45 hours a week. Only now, after 7 years, have i gotten into a job that wont let me do more than 35 hours a week and is paying me an authentic liveable wage.
I just graduated in August and got licensed in October. The cost of licensure was incredibly expensive. I was also exhausted from all the hours of Practicum and two internships.
I have secured a supervisor. I have a job. However, if you break down the hours that I’m working versus the pay… It is sad. I also work driving for Walmart delivery and other gig job so that I can pay the bills. I love this profession, so I am not leaving. I am even starting my PhD program in January.
However, I think finances are a huge part of why people don’t get licensed. In North Carolina, where I live, the average pay for a newly graduated therapist is around 36,000 to see 22 to 25 clients a week.
This was an incredible video! A solution that would be helpful is that some of the better paying therapy jobs are solely for licensed therapist, when I see these job postings I often think “what about unlicensed clinicians?”, it’s a shame. There’s so much red tape and liability fears in this professions, which ultimately hold back great clinicians who are ready to work.
By the time I got my license, I was ready to quit. I couldn’t even believe it when it came in the mail.
This is the exact video I needed to see as I plan my schedule for next week. My schedule will be completely clear. Burnout is a real as Im sure you're all very aware of.
I'm in the midst of full licensure about another year and it is frustrating. The amount of hours needed in nj (4500) is baffling. And while i appreciate and understand the importance of supervision, 4500 is like climbing mt everest. But here we are.
Take care of yourselves!
I am looking at MA/MS in Psychology and would only go for a PhD after that, no PsyD for me.
PSLF in fewer years- definitely not ten! Seven years is probably too much also, imho. I am two years post licensure, so i would add to the tally expenses such as ceus and insurance, which i really had not fully considered before entering the field.
I have been licensed for 18 years. It took me many years to become fully licensed because of the rules in Texas at that time. You had to complete all your internship hours before taking the Texas LPC exam. It had a very high failure rate. It was so discouraging. I had given up until I started working at a site that provided supervision. I passed the Texas LPC test on my first try however the challenges of being a mental health professional at this time have led me to question if i made the right choice to be a counselor
Fully resolved? No. The financial part would be great but some of the systems are still so archaic and that largely contributes to burnout too.
I just graduated and really want to get licensed so bad, but it is so hard along with raising children it is super hard to afford it. The transitional period is hard and it's super hard to find a job when you have a master's in counseling.
I am an independently licensed MFT in the state of Ohio. Ohio has a two-tier licensing system - you get a license when you graduate that allows you to work under supervision. After you complete certain requirements, you can become independently licensed and work without supervision.
I needed 200 hours of supervision in order to become independently licensed as an MFT. It took me just over three years. I paid two separate supervisors to help me reach those hours. I really wanted that license, so I was motivated to get it, but there were a large number of students from my program that never pursued getting independently licensed as an MFT because it was too difficult.
I am thinking about an MFT program is it really worth it? Can I expect to be making 6 figures in private practice?
Many clinicians don’t want the independent licensure.
I’m glad the racial aspect was mentioned because the ASWB for social workers released stats on the pass/fail rates and it’s horrendous for AA/BA social workers. I really like what Texas did for associate LPCs where they can start their own practice as long as they have supervision. I would love that as it would give me more autonomy while also receiving adequate supervision. I know there are a lot of cons to it but at least I have a say of when, how often, who, what, and where.
What definitely helped me get to licensure as an LPC in Colorado was that I climbed up the CAT/CAS/LAC path as an addiction counselor and had a paying job for every internship because of the addictions field.
I'm in Colorado, getting ready to start my program. Hopefully, they have good placements to increase the hours needed to get licensed.
Genuine question: why the word “folks” instead of “people”? It seems like this is a recent thing and it sounds unnatural
Super common use if you're from a Geman family or the upper Midwest.
@@brittneej5486 thanks. You could be right but I feel like its usage became “mainstream” within the behavioral sciences somewhat recently and I just can’t discern what the reason would be.
It’s a single-syllable, gender-inclusive replacement for “guys.” At least that’s why I made the switch!
@@PrivatePracticeSkills I see, thanks for the clarification
What do you consider to be a full case load in your private practice?