FUTURE PROOF ARMORS: Far Savior Tier List
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 13 июл 2024
- Which Far Savior should you build? What does the meta look like? How do you measure who is better? We'll answer all those questions.
#feh #fireemblem #fireemblemheroes
🌟 Hello summoners and welcome to another episode of FEHology, the study of Fire Emblem Heroes. We're talking about the far savior tier list today.
🎬 Unit Reviews Playlist:
• Unit Reviews
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Footage:
MR.PNGRNG's Pirate Surtr Video:
• Pirate Surtr
Zeshado's Nagi Video:
• Nagi is the Most Under...
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
⌛Timestamps
0:00 Ultimate Savior
0:24 ---B Tier---
0:40 Arden
1:56 Pirate Surtr
2:43 Halloween Myrrh
3:17 ---A Tier---
3:27 Nagi
3:53 Ascendant Idunn
4:28 Ascendant Fjorm
5:09 Brave Hector
6:04 ---S Tier---
6:14 Halloween Robin(m)
6:52 Duma
7:30 Fallen Rhea
8:14 Final Tier List
9:10 Investment Suggestions
10:45 Simulation Numbers
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
👾 Come chat with us about it on Discord: / discord
🐦 / fehology
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
🎶 Music
Music: Marginal Crisis
Composer: Mitsuo Singa
Album: The Legend of Heroes: Kuro no Kiseki Original Soundtrack
Copyright© Nihon Falcom Corporation
Music: Unreasonable Beast
Composer: Mitsuo Singa
Album: The Legend of Heroes: Kuro no Kiseki Original Soundtrack
Copyright© Nihon Falcom Corporation
Music: Popping Smile
Composer: Mitsuo Singa
Album: The Legend of Heroes: Kuro no Kiseki Original Soundtrack
Copyright© Nihon Falcom Corporation
Music: Get Rid of the Urgent Menace
Composer: Yukihiro Jindo
Album: The Legend of Heroes: Kuro no Kiseki Original Soundtrack
Copyright© Nihon Falcom Corporation
Music: The Enthusiasm Sought by the Times
Composer: Mitsuo Singa
Album: The Legend of Heroes: Kuro no Kiseki Original Soundtrack
Copyright© Nihon Falcom Corporation
▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬
Simulation: arcticsilverfox.com/feh_sim/
CHALLENGER LIST
Hector (Brave) (5*+1 +res)
Weapon: Maltet
Special: Aegis
A: Ostian Counter
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Deflect Magic 3
Upgrade Path: 5
Rhea (BC) (5*+1 +hp)
Weapon: Ruinous Frost
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Distant Stance
B: True Dragon Wall
C: AD Far Save 3
S: Quickened Pulse
Arden (5*+10)
Weapon: Arden's Blade
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Svalinn Shield
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: DR Far Save 3
S: Deflect Magic 3
Upgrade Path: 5
Myrrh (LB) (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Spirit Breath
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AD Far Save 3
S: Atk Def Form 3
Upgrade Path: 5
Tiki (LD) (5*+1 +def)
Weapon: Divine Mist
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Atk Spd Ideal 4
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: With Everyone 2
S: Deflect Magic 3
Upgrade Path: 5
Idunn (ASC) (5*+1 +atk -res)
Weapon: Dew Dragonstone
Special: Aegis
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: DR Far Save 3
S: Atk Res Form 3
Idunn (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Demonic Breath
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: DR Far Save 3
S: Distant Def 3
Upgrade Path: 5
Edelgard (Brave) (5*+1)
Weapon: Flower Hauteclere
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: DR Far Save 3
S: Deflect Magic 3
Nagi (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Ethereal Breath
Special: Aegis
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: DR Far Save 3
S: Atk Res Form 3
Fjorm (ASC) (5*+1 +atk -spd)
Weapon: Nifl's Bite
Special: Ice Mirror
A: Svalinn Shield
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Deflect Magic 3
Surtr (PS) (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Sea-Sear Lance
Special: Aegis
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AD Far Save 3
S: Atk Def Form 3
Edelgard (FW) (5*+1 +hp)
Weapon: Twin-Crest Power
Special: Sacred Cowl
A: Svalinn Shield
B: Armored Wall
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Quickened Pulse
Idunn (FF) (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Zephyr Breath
Special: Iceberg
A: Distant Stance
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Distant Def 3
Robin(M) (SB) (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Moonstrike Breath
Special: Aegis
A: Distant Storm
B: Hardy Fighter 3
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Atk Def Form 3
Duma (5*+1 +atk)
Weapon: Fell Breath
Special: Glimmer
A: Distant Stance
B: Dragon Wall 3
C: AR Far Save 3
S: Atk Res Form 3
Upgrade Path: 5
ENEMIES - CUSTOM LIST
Chrom (HM) (5*+10 +atk)
Weapon: Destiny's Bow
Special: Deadeye
A: Atk Def Unity
B: Lull Atk Def 3
C: Time's Pulse 3
S: Blade Session 3
Sonya (HGS) (5*+10 +atk)
Weapon: Magic Rabbits
Special: Blazing Flame
A: Life and Death 4
B: Windsweep 3
C: Spd Res Hold
S: Life and Death 3
Yuri (5*+10 +atk)
Weapon: Honorable Blade
Special: Lethality
A: Atk Spd Ideal 4
B: Lull Atk Def 3
C: Time's Pulse 3
S: Blade Session 3 
Игры
![DANCING QUEEN!?! | Refresher & Dancer Tier List [FEH]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/2mZZ9KunKC0/mqdefault.jpg)
![DANCING QUEEN!?! | Refresher & Dancer Tier List [FEH]](/img/tr.png)
![UNKILLABLE?!? Ultimate Far Savior Tier List 2023 [FEH]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/uqKdPb2FVY4/mqdefault.jpg)
![Veeze - F.A.F (ft. Rylo Rodriguez) [Official Music Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/7hlz2S2GmIY/mqdefault.jpg)
![Natanael Cano x Oscar Maydon - Giza [Official Video]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eXCS6-MSQ_Y/mqdefault.jpg)
I have a couple corrections. Honestly, this was 2 weeks worth of sims, and I got a couple of them mixed up 😅.
1) Duma has Dragon wall in his B skill, not hardy fighter.
2) I state that Idunn almost beats Duo Chrom. The sim in the graphic shows the correct matchup. She demolished him.
Thank you all for watching!
How high is Summer El right now?
Since Dist Counter Seal now exists, maybe the A skill should be S.Shield?
As a catch-all Far Save tier list, this is some quality content and analysis.
We just have to keep in mind that AR-O, AR-D, and SD Far Saviors all want to do very different things. For example, Arden is one of the best AR-D Far Saviors because he lives and can kill Lethality Yuri even on turn 1 (before Hardy Fighter would trigger). In AR-O, though, he struggles deeply because of the necessary multiple engagements. V!Robin is also one of the best Far Save units on AR-O, but is a little worse on SD. Brave Hector is great on AR-D and often on SD, but may struggle on AR-O at times due to top-tier teams running counters (sometime multiple counters) to him.
Love this content! So well made, well thought-out, and immaculately edited.
This is by far the best point made here, utilization is key. I have a B!Hector that I've not to give far save to because there are so many counters to him with colour advantage. In terms of far save investment you should either go green or colourless imo. Red armours get dunked on by Miciah. Blue armours get destroyed by L!MByleth. Green has the least magical counterplay aside from duo Lief
Thank you so much! I was an idiot and posted this video right before I left town. I honestly didn’t think it would do that well, because it’s so numbers heavy. I saw that actually fielded a few questions. That was incredibly kind of you. I love your content and alway look forward to the weekly defense replays. ☺️
@@FEH great video. you can feel all the effort put in and it seems to be well received. You're doing great with these tier list
on a side note Rhea vs Idunn has been something I've been thinking of and I'm curious on your mindset .Why is it that you view Rhea better as a far save when things like deadeye or lethality is on the range side, while the falchion users on the near save side tend to be red ?
Ive been debating with myself back and forth on which path I should take for each( ironically my Rhea is -res and Idunn is -defense lmao )
It puts a smile on my face to see Halloween Male Robin at the top, he was my first seasonal +10 and I always swore by him and told others he's a lot better than people give him credit for
Well said fellow Halloween Male Robin enjoyer!
So true! I just recently got him by luck a few weeks ago and he's been so fun to use.
I'm surprised that Valentine's Robin didn't even make the Tier List she seems like a great Far Save once you put the investment into her.
Also Legendary Tiki given her prf Save Skill
V!Robin and L!Tiki didn’t do well in these matchups, but they can both perform well with the right supports.
A Fallen Rhea montage you say?
YYYYEEEEEEEESSSS!!!!!!
I honestly expect Nagi to be the best armor once she receives her refine in a few months, even if she only gets something like armor nullification, then she will be outrageously strong.
I think she’s going to be something special.
I hope so, I have a +3 nagi from pity breaks over the years (and a focus units)
Great vid dude. FANTASTIC breakdown.
Thank you 😊
Thank Seiros for this guide. Have 1 farsave fodder Ive been holding off since I have no clear cut idea who to give it to. Massive help!!
I’m glad I could help!🙂
This was just the video we all wanted. Thanks Joel.
I’m glad it could help 🙂
Pro tip: Sometimes securing counterattacks isnt needed when the Far Save’s main purpose is to protect the main killer/carry. Distant Defense 4 in exchange for not being able to counterattack is a really good trade off especially when it comes to Duo Dagr congalines and ensuring your save unit can protect against it.
Yeah, I think the metrics on this tier change depending on if DD4 is used or not.
Big agree. I'm using Fallen Rhea as Far Saver with her Stance Skill in A. She can't counter attack but she doesn't get damaged either, can tank whole teams and every unit not killed takes up a spot another enemy can't get into. Afterwards she leans back as Bridal Lilina takes care of the killing. It's great.
DD4 is an excellent skill on a far savior, but it didn’t change anything for these units. If I had included Duo Dagr in the benchmarks, that would’ve changed that dramatically.
The Trails music, your energy and informative content is just fantastic
Thank you!😊
This was a really good video! Always happy to see our boy Arden appear SOMEWHERE on a tier list. You may say he came in last but I counter with there were tons of armors who didn't even make B tier.
Shoot. I think that every unit on this tier list is amazing. Arden is just showing how strong and tough he really is.
Well he came in last in the far save category which is to be expected since he has like 0 res
@@felicepompa1702 He survives a lot more things than you would think. He may only have 20 some res at max investment before skills but his HP pool is insane. He does better than a lot of armors with higher res because of that and his weapon.
If you haven’t already! I’d love to see a a near save tier list next!
I will try. These take a lot of time, but they’re very fun.
This was an awesome tier list, I can wait for Nagi refine!
It’s going to be bonkers.
Hardy Fighter 3 does NOT Trigger Halloween Male Robin's Healing btw.
If that were the case, then Valentine / OG Hector would've been S Tier too.
I’m going to continue to use A!Fjorm as my main hardy fighter unit. I recently got an extra copy, so I will wait on some refines to make a decision on who to fodder to.
My jaw DROPPED when I saw the SoV style unit display - ITS BEAUTIFUL. I need that style in all my FE games. There is mountains of effort put into this video and it truly shows. This entire video is a feast for the eyes, it's truly amazing stuff. This video is like an early Christmas gift, I'm a huge fan of tier lists! I simply can't wait for more Fehology content!
Thank you so much. Your comments always put a smile on my face. You make content creation fun.
Did you consider distant defense 4 or a stance skill as A slot options? Sure most of these units will no longer be able to kill on retaliation, but in summoner duals, surviving and letting another unit get the KO can be a better option.
DD4 can be an excellent solution, but for these specific benchmarks, it makes the performance worse. That would change dramatically is I included Duo Dagr.
Hmm... Great video, but, was this testing done with Chrom's Deadeye not charged? Duma in particular, I really can't imagine him surviving the Deadeye - and a quick sim confirmed it - and a good part of the danger of Duo Chrom is that his Deadeye is, for all intents and purposes, always charged. That definitely swings the Duma matchup, and likely the Rhea one as well if they're not running Hardy. Probably Fjorm also.
There's also a bit of an odd choice where some units are tested here with Svalinn and some aren't. I think if you want to get good data on how strong each option is, they should be tested once with Svalinn and once without.
@@ZainRenault Yeah, agreed.
i did the sim completely with Deadeye charged (my comment should be somewhere in the comment section) and it seems that Fehology's testing was not done with Deadeye charged. It doesn't change every single matchup but for some units it would completely change their placing in the tier list.
@@ZainRenault i think the main thing was that most of them dont have DC in their weapons and in Fehology's opinion it was more important to run DC. The only one without DC who ran Svalinn was Arden. It might change some matchups but they would only be focused on surviving
@@BIGstonks Yeah, I’ve done extensive sims with Far Saves against Duo Chrom myself - I was being a little deliberately gentle with my wording, but, I knew Duo Chrom wasn’t pre-charged.
Wouldn’t make a big difference for Bector or Idunn, but, it would be a huge deal for the current top three and Fjorm. Not accounting for the single most important factor that makes Duo Chrom so absurdly hard to tank seems like a pretty big oversight, honestly.
Not counterattacking if it means you survive can often be the better option, in truth. For SD in particular. But, that’s a very case by case basis, and varies a lot unit to unit (Rhea and Duma are probably most optimal with Hardy Fighter + Aegis + DC, for instance).
How does Sonya in your test runs get -3 CD if she has LnD seal?
I currently use Fjorm as my go to Far saver but she's just a placeholder for whoever I decide to fodder Hardy Fighter to. I was considering making A!Idunn a merge project... but you kinda killed the wind out of my sails there. Oh boy. But thank you for the good work. Now I'll continue to flounder in despair on what to spend my orbs on.
Thank you for the kind words 🙂
I still think A!Idunn is an excellent merge project. The not-an-armor status is just so good. I had a whale-worthy tier list not too long ago. She was S tier then and I still think she’s up there.
@@FEH I suppose I'm letting your prediction that IS will be introducing dragon counters in the coming months get to me. I usually do a +10 run each year to bring my barracks back up to speed to compete with the current meta and I've been meaning to do a summoning run to finish a full colorset on a Mythic Banner. Had it not been for L!Nanna (who no one rolled for) and Duo Chrom, I would have +10ed Medeus/Elimine/L!Micaiah. With your standards of taking on the nukes Yuri and Duo Sonya as well, I'd need a combination of units that could take on 3/4 of those units (and I wouldn't mind throwing down months worth of orbs for). So we'll see depending on what kind of combination Idunn shows up in cause... this video pretty damning.
Hey Fehology how would you rate the new Caineghis?
that's such a good question. without doing the sims, i'd probably put him in B tier. i'm waiting anxiously for ASF to put out an update so i can check it out.
My personal go-to Far Saver is Valentine's Robin. She has yet to fail me (or Brave Dimitri, for that matter)
Same, and my near saver is V!Lucina haha…I’m a fan of these characters
@@BlackCatCards She's one of my go-to Near Savers! The combo of being a Dodge Tank with Near Save is something that i feel isn't as dreaded as it should be.
With Hardy Fighter fodder banner expiring in a few hours, we should think again to get it haha
It’s such a good b skill for armors.
I am both surprised and amazed to see duma actually being really good. I maybe should invest since I have a couple of duma sitting around.
His biggest problem is that he’s not very good in standard aether raids. If you need a unit for SD or Chaos raids, he’s amazing!
My best takeaway here is that I should probably get Harmonic Sonya lol
I would love to see a near save list tho. No honourable mentions? I was wondering if base Idunn would make it to the list.
I expect fallen Rhea be on top of that list since her near save build is better than far save ones
Harmonic Sonya is just excellent, but her value might drop as we get more dragons with AoE damage reduction.
I use Caineghis as my far save tank and he's very good at the job, i speed stack with him and use both Hardy Fighter with Sacred Cowl and Savvy Fighter with Noontime, DC on his weapon let me use the A for other things
Caineghis gang! I can’t wait to see his refine.
I have no idea when Caineghis is getting his refine; and I am probably biased in saying this, but he has actually gotten better thanks to the newer skill pool. Unfortunately for the most consistency all around he still needs Svalinn Shield but is an absolute stat ball otherwise, I managed to get him to +5 (+15 flowers) with a few months of stored orbs this time around. Base 34 spd is a bit low but him already having built-in DC really helps him to focus on any kind of stacking instead. Probably won't frag out in high level smn duels right now but he does consistently handle Duo Lif, Chrom, and Yuri with hardy (otherwise if he can outspeed everyone decently I just use Saavy Fighter) in AR-O
What's more interesting is that because he's a beast unit, you really can decide on how he should intercept attacks in modes like Duels, he only gets DC when transformed and can be used as just a deterrent from the opponent overextending, Distant Defense 4 on base kit is very useful these days
Knowing what I know about armor refines past 2020 and his beast typing, he can potentially become an impenetrable wall again, if they gave him the brave hector treatment but I wouldn't hold my breath for it lol
this is the video i've been waiting for! i've got 2 far saves and 1 hardy fighter... maybe i'll finally make a decision 👀
I’m glad you liked it!
my far savior has been robin recently. the debuffs and healing are so good. did get a merge on fjorm tho, so she's +atk/spd. could see more of both of them
ooh she's not here, but trust me. stacking in combat debuffs with other support units is so good
Robin can perform quite well in AR, but she struggles vs these folks. The nice think is, with the right team it’s easy to overcome her weaknesses, and she has so many strengths.
This tierlist is one month old and out of the sudden there is Kjelle, which I believe could make at least A Tier on this list of properly built haha.
Also was kinda surprised to see Arden here comparatively to some other units which are meant to be far savers but didn’t even made the cut, especially because Ardens stats leans much more into being a top tier near saver - seems like at least is insane HP pays off enough to also work decently as far saver haha. :D
This video helped me decide against building B!Hector lol far too many green nukes in the game atm and to come until he's obsolete like B!Ike.
Poor B!Ike. We were theorycrafting some builds the other day, and he’s just not great right now.
B! Hector has been my guy ever since he came out, it's crazy how well his A skill still holds up. With the recent hero fest banner I was finally able to get him hardy fighter and I really don't regret it, I will never stop investing in this unit he's just too good.
Like you I didn't invest into Bector, I kept assuming that IS would counter him, and they just ... haven't. Meanwhile, everything that could counter him also counters other budget far save armors, so he remains immaculate (despite being only B tier by your rankings). Of course, to get him to B Tier you need to feed him premium fodder, so nothing is really "budget"
Most of these guys are really expensive. I guess that makes it good that IS seems to be committed to keeping them good. I honestly still wonder if I should +10 B!Hector 🤣
Og hector is my go-to near save unit, I find that instant bonfire with steady breath deletes just about everything, the only matchups I’ve ever seen him lose consistently is against V!Palla as well and L!Sigurd if he has his special precharged. Everyone else doesn’t even deal enough damage to leave a mark on him after healing 30 hp from bonfire
He’s an excellent unit with an amazing refine. I know Levin still uses him as well.
I invested in hector on his first ever run on a weekly revival - a month before his refine, hoping for something awesome. 600 orbs for the last 6 copies. Man it was worth it. Hes still my best and most used unit
Best investment of the game when you consider the amount of orbs. Congrats!
Well I will be looking for the Valentine Rudolf refine to see if he can be better
Since I got him on the hall of forms
You and me both.
I'm confused... about a lot of things.
Why dont these calcs seem to be done with Chrom's Deadeye pre-charged? (if they are, why doesnt the video match?)
How did Arden do any dmg in the Chrom and Yuri matchups if he cant counter while running svalinn shield?
The Male Grima section entirely:
- If hes using a defensive special to go with Hardy Fighter he wont get the healing. I dont understand why this is considered to be such a boon when in this case it wont be used.
- If he does ditch the defensive special and hardy fighter, i dont think he will have any chance tanking a pre-charged Chrom or Yuri. Maybe he might have a chance with sonya if he uses dragon wall...
- Why does the build shown use distant storm? Is he just banking on one shots?
- Why is the video that is playing in the background showcasing a grima that just initiates on Chrom and Yuri instead of trying to tank them?
I have some other questions about the video in the background but im trying to not be too nitpicky since you probably dont have all of these units built the exact way you have shown
I laso have overall questions about the sim results too but I'll double check everything since you have provided what builds you used in the sim
Yes, Halloween Male Grima is totally confusing me. I've looked into him as a far savior before, but just wasn't very thrilled with the calculations. This video made me think I missed something, but then when I checked the video and the artic fox links, I don't think I did. The main benefit Grima has is the slaying in his weapon, as the healing gimmick is a moot point when he's running defensive specials.
Also, the other two S tier colorless dragons do actually survive better with Hardy Fighter / Aegis build if they have to take a pre-charged Deadeye from Duo Chrom to the face.
Overall this was a very interesting video. I did like it.
Actually, Duma needs some kind of Special acceleration like quicken pulse to have Aegis ready before combat, otherwise he totally dies.
I’m sorry I’m so late with answers! I was out of town. Facing Chrobin without Deadeye procced on the first hit is a very common scenario in all modes, but especially arena and AR. In SD, this is likely on turn one, but generally, he has deadeye procced on day 2.
The videos were just the closest thing I could get on the matchups. I don’t have the resources to build all of the units, although I wish I did.
H!Robin(m) wasn’t simmed with the healing. That’s just a bonus that you get with the unit and other builds, much like when I mentioned Duma’s ability as a catapult.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
I use winter lissa because i love Lissa and was building & using her since her banner launced in dec 2017. Shes my near saver not far. Prfless armour is rough, especially axe because
1. Not many good save weapons
2. Lots of meta competition
But i love her and shes been the core of my arena and AR teams
Hey, if you’re using your favorites, you’re doing it right, but please! IS! Give us better inheritables!
Nice! this list is more about SD than AR right? F!Rhea sounds amazing, I have one at 40+1. I probably use her for AR-O tho, my W!Felix can't tank Corn.
The list is really a start to your quest to find the perfect far savior. Since I’m not sure what everyone has, it’s easier to do no supports, but the results give you a good idea how the inits will work once they are supported.
The chrom calcs somehow got messed up, he doesn't have precharged deadeye or the +6 attack he gets from his kit. I noticed it at fjorm because I've done calcs on that matchup before and I know that even at Uber max investment she only lives death blow 7 lull atk/def chrom at like 1 hp.
This is by design. The sims were done without any outside sources of buffing which would include Chrom using To Change Fate on another unit. Once I open that floodgate, the calculations become situationally subjective.
The other piece is, it’s fairly easy to bait Duo Chrom out before he uses To Change Fate in every mode not named summoner duels.
I’m so happy to see F!Rhea so high on this list. I feel so many people just dismissed her because she wasn’t the player phase monster Fedel was and is. My +1 has been amazing and although I prefer spreading my resources out for variety’s sake I’m seriously tempted to save for her return because she’s gorgeous and strong af.
How much is +10 required for most of these units to do well in the longer term?
Honestly, you only need to +10 units if you want them for scoring. That being said, she’s be an excellent scorebot.
The nice thing about waiting for her rerun is that you’ll know by then what kind of counters that IS is releasing.
my favorite armor is future fondness lucina. Lucina is my fave out of the awakening series and she was one of my first 5 stars i pulled when i started playing this game like a few weeks ago.
My Save armor unit is none other than B Edelgard i gave her both Far and Near Save in case i need to switch it up a bit. Also i have a spare spring idunn and recently got the fallen rhea so i have options well i have dragon options lol.
You didn't mention mach ups against the ninja duos and harmonic Lysithea tho which are very common threats that destroy hardy fight armor thanks to the brave hit. (At least if the armor don't run deflect seal)
I actually simmed all of these vs Ninjorrin, and was going to include them, but it didn’t create a lot of separation. For the builds I’m showing, I think all these units beat her.
Thoughts on original idunn as far save? What build if so?
I ran the sims, and she’d be a tier below these other folks, but she’s still very useable in AR where you can patch up things with supports. Did you see that dragons are getting DC in a seal?
@@FEH how would you build idunn?
@@FEH yeah! So many more possibility with the DC seals. I did not expect that
TL;DR:
Seems like Chrom doesn't have Deadeye pre-charged in the calcs used in the video. I believe that it is more that reasonable that a Chrom with Time's Pulse will have Deadeye pre-charged for these sims, so my calculations will have Chrom pre-charged.
According to my calcs and the tier guidelines at 0:28, 3:18 and 6:07 this tier list should be changed a little. Fallen Edelgard and Duma (Dragon Wall) should be removed from this tier list. Fjorm, and Male Grima should be moved to B tier (also there is no point in running Svalinn's Shield on Fjorm if your goal is to counter Duo Chrom. She dies anyway). Duma (Hardy Fighter + Sacred Cowl) should be added to this list and put in B tier.
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
I have recreated the sim from this video to the best of my ability. I looked at the stats shown in the video to figure out that just about everyone had max dragon flowers and Summoner Support at S. If there was a skill that had certain conditions to activate, I enabled/maxed them so they were in full effect. I turned on all Start of Turn effects (this makes Magic Rabbits and Hardy Fighter work). I gave Sonya 1 Pre-charge, Chrom 2 Pre-Charge, and Yuri 3 Pre-charge. I gave Sonya, Yuri and Chrom a +6 Atk buff because of what was said at 11:07. Last but not least, I turned on Fallen Edelgard's transformation.
Also I added Duma with Hardy Fighter and Sacred Cowl (the rest of the kit is the same as the Dragon wall build) to this sim because I think he performs better for this tier list than the dragon wall version does. It also has usage outside of this tier list, not completely sure if it will be better than dragon wall in those cases.
Compared to the matchup table at 10:49 here is what I got.
*Arden* : (it seems none of the enemies have summoner supports in this particular case)
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching **
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - Same outcome; Different numbers (13-45)
*Fallen Edelgard* : (in video it says she is +Atk but the sims were using +HP)
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (10-13) _(If Edelgard is not +HP, then the outcome is different; Yuri will end up killing (0-50))_
Chrom - *Different outcome; Chrom now kills due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
*Surtr* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (0-9)
*Myrrh* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - Same outcome; *Different numbers due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
*Nagi* :
Sonya - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (39-0)
Yuri - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (11-4)
Chrom - Same outcome; *Different numbers due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
*Idunn* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (38-8)
Chrom - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers due to Deadeye (44-0)
*Fjorm* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - *Different outcome; Chrom now kills due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
*Hector* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (46-0)
Chrom - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (52-8)
*Duma* : (Dragon Wall + Glimmer)
Sonya - *Different outcome; Sonya kills (0-50)* _(if Sonya doesnt have a +6 buff to atk , then the outcome is unchanged and the numbers match exactly)_
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - *Different outcome; Chrom now kills due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
*Duma* : (Hardy Fighter + Sacred Cowl) since Dragon Wall duma would basically be not on this tier list at all
Sonya - Sonya wins (0-50)
Yuri - Duma wins (26-0)
Chrom - Chrom wins (0-50)
*Male Grima* :
Sonya - Same outcome; numbers are probably matching
Yuri - Same outcome; numbers are exactly matching
Chrom - *Different outcome; Chrom kills due to surviving Grima's counter, not sure why (0-4)*
*Rhea* : She heals 7 HP after combat btw
Sonya - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (25-0)
Yuri - Same outcome; Slightly different numbers and idk why (8-0) -gets her to 1 hp but loses this is so sad-
Chrom - Same outcome; *Different numbers due to Deadeye one-shotting (0-50)*
** Note: What I mean by "probably matching" is that I can't tell what damage Sonya did during the AOE and what she did in combat in the sims that Fehology did. Still, in these scenarios she kills and, for the most part, thats what matters.
Where would you put a Refined, +1 Cainheghis on this list? He'd have DD4, Hardy Fighter 3, and Far Save 3. Which tier?
He’s definitely S tier. I’ve done the sims, and he is a monster, just remember that he has to stay transformed. That can be tough depending on what mode you use him in.
@@FEH Hey, thanks a lot for checking! That's helpful! Might try to play around with him in a team with A!Idunn Near Save, Muspell, and maybe some other dragon or beast I have laying around...
Caineghis is my far saver, since he works with my beast emblem team really well
When he gets his refine, he’s going to be scary. I think that’s coming pretty soon.
Honestly Brave Hector never ceases to amaze me. I've been lucky to incidentally summon him enough to have him at +5 as a F2P account and It's so crazy that he's still in such a good place after so long
i think at this point, he's got to be top 5 all time in good investments.
testing was kinda suspicious. testing save units without the save skills activating is a little confusing. plus they often use form skills or other adjacent to ally effects that arent demonstrated. as well as not showing the saves with their ranged tank save target. good video but i feel like the testing doesnt accurately reflect the characters strengths. maybe im missing something?
anyways my go to near save is actually Sheena btw. she still actually slays. she tanks and one shots B!Eirika.
Pref Axe
2 CD Bonfire
Close Defense 4
Slick fighter
D/R N Save
Sturdy Breath
my far save is B!Hector who i just finished the +10 on the latest hero fest. supports i like to use Astrid and Nifl. everyone obviously makes their own save ball teams with their own support i jus thought it was bizarre that you showed the save units not saving anything or having support for their testing.
The short answer is that the numbers you see on screen are correct, while the gameplay isn't 100% mirroring the simulation. That is because all the numbers are run with the proper supports and in the exact situation we are expecting them to perform, but actually capturing footage of that is not only difficult but would require having all these save units built AND building defense teams to combat them. Then you get into enemy AI and not being able to capture every likely enemy team with varieties of support structures... it's just easier to let the numbers be real and the graphics show a smaller, less hard to set up fight.
The visuals are just meant to help you conceptualize how they perform at a basic level. The numbers beside them actually show the real application in your typical situation you would be using them in. I know it may look like inaccurate testing but it's not, it is just the visuals not being 100% true to the math behind the outcome.
@@illialidur8244 i dont think the tests involving Duo Chrom are realistic because he seems to not have deadeye pre-charged in all of his calcs. For a time's pulse chrom the pre-charge is almost expected. Adding in the pre-charge would change a couple of rankings according to this tier list's guidelines, such as Fallen Edelgard being taken off the list entirely due to dying to Sonya and Chrom and surviving but not killing Yuri.
As for calcs not involving Chrom, I actually have gotten a few different calcs in a few instances, though I'm not sure why. I did my calcs trying to emulate everything exactly the way it seemed it was emulated by you guys (except for making sure Chrom was pre-charged). I made a whole entire comment about it, though I'm not sure if its visible because someone else said it might've been marked as spam by RUclips.
@@BIGstonks Precharged Deadeye absolutely shakes this list up. The number of units who can realistically tank a deadeye chrom is really, really low. I guess for the sake of having a list at all you need to make certain assumptions, like having a Pulse Smoke or Pulse Tie unit on deck somewhere or using positioning to attempt to get Chrom to not instantly fire off Deadeye. In a lot of these cases though, Chrom has an autofollowup weapon and none of these armors really have a way of stopping that because the ones with Wary effects are slow. So 1 cooldown, precharged, either way he's shooting you twice. Surviving that as an armored unit is a feat regardless of whether or not he actually uses his special.
Leaving the special at 1 definitely favors units who have guard, being able to stop Deadeye from activating. But be real, would dropping Arden from the tier list make it a BETTER list?
@@illialidur8244 Believe it or not, I found that Arden actually still survived a pre-charged Chrom with an otherwise same exact kit. The outcome was 13-45 bc it seemed that you guys didnt include summoner support for arden's calcs but even if chrom did have summoner support he would survive. He does surive far better if its not pre-charged of course but what matters for this list is that he does survive and stays on the list in B tier.
As for everyone else... yeah youre completely right lol. Only Bector and Idunn can survive Chrom since they have both null armor effectiveness and Wary + Hardy Fighter. Maybe some more would survive if they had svalinn's shield too. Not sure if that would suddenly allow yuri to kill some of them though...
The skills are active, but they don’t export in the sim. It’s a wonderful tool, but keep in mind, it’s fan made. Arctic Silver Fox is amazing.
I assume the introduction of DC Dragon might bump Idunn to S tier? She can run a lot of A slots that Bector and other armors cant. I think the only real downside is not being able to run deflect magic which could hurt.
Our beloved Far save H!M!Robin getting the recognition he deserves!
He’s real good.
My go-to armor is Zelgius, the guy just decimates everything, he has a severe weakness against blue res targeting units but even then, if he survives the first hit, he kills them.
Black Luna just never gets old. I have a BK that I still use, and he’s amazing.
the fact that there is no one beats all solution is a sign that IS still has somewhat of a grip on the meta. But its still not a good look when Arden is the only F2P option that is some what usable.
Arden was my first +10 Grail unit and I've never been disappointed in the guy.
Honestly, we need some better inheritables.
What about Valentine's Robin? Actually maybe she doesn't do well due to her being more focused on support
This is quite a nice list, but I do wish that Picnic Felicia, Valentines Robin, and Winter Ephraim ranked, because I feel they all are unique enough to justify having their results against Yuri, Sonya, and Chrom shown
Not every armor was on the list, I personally wanted him to add Benny but he said "For an armor to make the cut they have to at least win 1 matchup." Which isn't exactly true looking at the results but the point is that if they were not included on this list, they probably didn't do terribly well in the sims. That or he forgot them, which is also entirely possible.
I apologize. It was a matter of time. I can tell you that I ran them, and in these matchups, they don’t do well, but with the right support they can perform very well.
I have Zelgius Far Save rn, he’s pretty good.
I have BK and Black Luna just never gets old.
B!Hector was my first 5* exclusive +10 unit. I never regretted investing into him.
As soon as he started to slump, he got a refine and rebounded. And now, I use him every single day.
It's like he doesn't care about the meta at all...
Halloween Myrrh is my go-to for both near and far save. But if i need both then i use Myrrh as far save and Lucina as near save.
that's a great combo. H!Myrrh really did get a fantastic refine and you can't beat Lucina's Future Vision.
@@FEH My hopes is to summon ascended fjorm and spring sonya so i can get the hardy fighter miracle lucina in Sdr/s. Seems like a busted combo based on the other videos ive seen from you
I use H!M!Robin a lot and he always carry me but I didn't expect see him in S tier. He is more stronger than I thought :O
He’s fantastic. Congrats on the great unit!
We don't have many blue ranged nukes at the moment. Hapi might be the closest we get, but still.
I expected Hapi to age well, but she just hasn’t. I’m wondering if Blulina can fill that role.
I actually considered using Duma as a far save in AR D just to free up a slot. No mythic buffs kinda hurts his survivability tho....
That’s a rough one, and I’ve gotten some flack for putting him here for that very reason. You can look at the sims, but I don’t think he’s a good AR-D far savior outside of his bonus season. He’s great in arena and SD, though.
So here’s a thought, I’m sitting on 300 orbs right now, do you all think I should pend them and maybe get a +4 or +5 rhea?
i'll be honest. Rhea is good at +1 or at +10. if you've already got the +1, I'd just save for her return. she'll make an excellent score bot if that's the way you want to go.
@@FEH k thanks!
@@FEH 240 orbs later I have one brave Claude, uno Leila, one fallen Edelgard and two fallen Rheas one of which is sparked
@@luisan776 and 60 orbs to save for your next project! Not a bad haul.
Using this as a guide on how to make Micaiah kill more armors
🤣
That is an excellent use of the guide.
Well, now I feel glad that I invested like 200 orbs to get my Hector from +5 to +9 together with B! Ephraim from +5 to +8
I love those 2 units and even if they are not that good for Arena/Aether Raids I still use them for a lot of other content in the game
B!Hector will probably stay good for a long time still, especially when you consider the next set of counters should be dragon effective.
Best Far Save unit is Picnic Flora because I love her
W!Sothis will get the resepct she's due... someday...
Refine when?
Could you get near save tier list? :)
I will try. I Iove to do these, but they’re very time consuming. 🙂
@@FEH I understand whenever you have a time slot for it hahaha! I've been thinking about which near save unit to main you see and whether or not it's worth maining a near save unit or a far save one instead :)
Winter Ephraim is a very underrated far save
Follow up is not a problem for him bc he can just brave on enemy phase and kill everyone. Besides, he can just heal himself after the combat
Im using him EXTREMELY BUDGET and he works really well: dc (no distant storm), shield pulse (no hardy fighter) and dr far save (no ar far save)
I did calcs for him and hes not able to kill Chrom or Yuri even at max invest due to not getting his brave attack off. Chrom even kills him on the follow up after using deadeye on a Hardy Fighter charged Aegis.
What were the armours that didn't quite make it onto the list? FEdelgard, DIdunn, BEdelgard?
Also, DUMA?!
ps. loved the video
Fallen Edelgard was on the list but yeah I agree, Duo Idunn is really powerful.
If they didn’t make the list, they didn’t get at least 2 inconclusive results… or I just screwed up 😅
Someone already found a good build for W!Sothis that I should’ve included.
Oh right, FEdelgard was there 🤦♂️
@@FEH did you look at a Hardy Fighter for DIdunn? I think she regularly takes down Sonya, Yuri is very close and can go either way depending on skills, and she takes down Chrom if she can activate her duo skill (else she loses)
Far save Duma, huh. I did get 2 Fjorms and Duma is now +1. Intriguing.
I can’t believe how good he is.
Just wait for the thracir refine and remix to knock all these dragon saves
AND THE NAGA REFINE!!!!
With the addition of Distant Counter (D), dragons are even better Far Save tanks, as they can free up their A slot to further boost their survivability or offense.
I’ve been digging into that. It’s actually not the case at max investment. The new seal provides an excellent budget method to get DC on dragons, but the updated DC A skills provide more stats. That combined with the increased quality of seals means that your missing out on a lot of valuable stats. The only thing you could gain is guard form a stance skill, but from what I’ve been simming, I’d rather have the stats.
of course not everyone will have maxed out powerhouses like these, its good to know that my boy Zelgius is able to beat out duo chrom due to an extra helping of burger king black luna
got to love Black Luna!! i still use my BK. he's a lot of fun.
I don't play the game competitively anymore, but yeah B!Hector is my only +10 5* exclusive.
He’s a great one to have
my go to armor will always be idunn and ascended idunn
7:27 I see that Yuri did that Noice 69 damage to Duma.
you need to consider Brave effect
Good thing I built up Brave Eliwood. The fact he can bust these armours makes me feel priveleged. The more dragon armours that come out, the stronger he becomes and I am all for that.
Also, most invested armour is my humble LA!Eliwood. No regrets.
He is a fantastic unit. I’m scared every time I see him on the map.
Robin's healing only works with damaging specials.
I completely spaced out on that and misspoke 😅
* cries in plus 10 Brave Edelgard *
Keep the faith! Refine coming soon!
@@FEH I'm seriously looking forward to it ^.^
ugh, it's so sad that legendary tiki isn't on here. can she really not take on any of them?
Ok, but here’s the thing. L!Tiki scales better with support than these other units due to her preference C skill.
I couldn’t include support units because of how hard it is to baseline, but you can look at it in the sims.
@@FEH that's fair to say.
Tiki with Hardy fighter actually should make it into B tier. I think...
Meanwhile, my poor Xmas Artur gets murked by anything Red.
Dragons lets gooo
🐲🐉
that fallen rhea build looks so sexy
She’s so much fun to use.
@@FEH i hadn't thought about using quicken pulse with sacred cow special. Any reason why you choose +Hp over Res/Atk/Def?
We are in dragon meta already?? When was the last time it was dragon meta?
Can some old players enlighten me?
Around CYL1 and the release of the weapon refinery, enemy-phase dragons with Lightning Breath, Aether, Steady Breath, and Quick Riposte dominated the meta.
The last time we saw a small surge was when W!Sothis hit. I remember how much of a terror she was!
Fjorm doesn't have enough spd.
One can even say this is the bane of Distant Counter weapons: none of them really stands out.
Fjorm's NCD is decent in ARO, but almost irrelevant in SD, meaning 2 effects of her prf is irrelevant in SD.
She can work quite well in SD, and can be a sneaky off meta pick, but you’re right about the speed. It’s the reason she works better in AR: you can speed stack.
Oh wow, good thing I got a F!Rhea. I would have killed her if True Dragon Wall is inheritable but now I'm almost happy that it isn't.
If dragon wall was inheritable, she’d be amazing fodder!
The main thing I learnt from this video is that I need to invest in a Sonya
the funny thing is, she's amazing at +0. it's a pretty cheap investment.
I think the biggest takeaway from this list is that Yuri is kinda overrated
He’s definitely the reason hardy fighter is so necessary. Without a damage reduction special, he just destroys people.
I hope valentines eliwood will get a good refine, but it probably won't be enough
Seasonal Grail units do not get a weapon refine, sadly.
@@infantrypulse hopefully that's changes 😭
I only have 1 Ascended Fjorm so i REALLY don't want to give Hardy Fighter to anyone else.
i use zelgius as my far save unit
Black Luna is so good!
@@FEH been running aether for tthhr most part for pve content
Naga Remix could scramble this whole list around
Wait......people are still having trouble killing F.Rhea *eyes dart around* Granted, not everyone has invested Res Nukes but like.....am I literally the only one just running around AR with a low invested +10 Canas that can breach her RES at +10 and 1 shot her on an Iceberg?
Surprised L!Hector isn't on the list. He's an underrated Far Save unit w/ and without Hardy Fighter 3.
I tried so hard to get him to work, because he’s a favorite of mine. He just didn’t stack up against these benchmarks.
@@FEH Going to disagree with that (luckily) since he's workable or better than those who you considered in the B Tier. Even from my experience, I'm chilling in Vault of Heaven during Fire Season because of him.
A few good things about L!Hector compared to several armors is that his Flexbility is Good and that his Non-Special damage output is High while using Hardy Fighter 3
And since True/Special Damage based on ATK is all over the place, He (and H!Myrrh) have the benefit of reducing people's Attack by -10, which is a huge number. Stack it with an Ashnard and/or Flier Hinoka and Foes will deal little to no Damage. Not to mention people need to work with the fact that this guy has Damage Reduction on First Hit (Always Triggers unlike P!Surtr/V!Gustav), Anti-Follow Up and even Hardy Fighter's Neutralize Follow Up. People are forced to have Null Follow-Up instead of Auto-Follow up.
You can go for builds such as:
- Hardy Fighter w/ Sacred Cowl
The Armored B!Ike:
- Crafty / Slick w/ Deflect Magic 3
Or the "I'm H!Myrrh now":
- Hardy Fighter w/ Aegis. (First hit trigger Thunder Armads, Second Hit Triggers Aegis)
Try it. I still have no regrets for Fully Investing him.
I might agree that he's better for Near Save, but he's still a solid Far Save unit from what I know.
Yuri and duo chrom is match in heaven just love the bois
They are fantastic when they’re on your team 🙂
Are you trying to say that the 4-star, and F2P, armors are so bad we shouldn't even consider them?
I’m saying that they will take a lot of work, and your matches will be tough. Arden and BK are the two that come to mind that might be exceptions.
joel i love you but what is this 😭😭😭
My attempt to capture one of the most confusing things you can rank 🤣