I am old enough to have seen three of the four live in late career recitals [Callas and Tebaldi] or staged opera [Dimitrova]. With Tebaldi and Dimitrova the voice was all that there was and it was certainly more than enough. However, with Callas the voice was so enhanced by her physical movements, emotive tone, and characterization through sound that it was on a different plane of experience even at the end of her career. Seeing her ability to shape her body and her face in the same way she could shape her voice to match a character allowed me to appreciate how unbelievable she must have been when all three abilities were at their zenith.
The depth of sorrow and matchless musicality of Callas in terrific voice. The sheer beauty of Tebaldi’s voice is a lifelong love affair (at least for me).
4 great Giocondas. Milanovs association with the role was long and distinguished, from 1935 to 1962. No one sang it with greater beauty. In the house it was a marvel so very touching. I have so much respect 4 this great lady.
1. Callas 2. Milanov 3. Tebaldi 4. Dimitrova. Callas is superior is multiple ways in these samples. It is, after all, the telling of a painful story and her voice with its myriad colors conveys the emotions far, far better than the others. As well, Callas’ voice sound full, powerful and easy here. This was a great role for her. These were 4 greats, for sure…….where can we hear such great singers today?
La Callas puso a la Gioconda a la altura de las grandes óperas del repertorio italiano. María entendió perfectamente no solo el personaje, sino la mente de Ponchielli (dramáticamente, musicalmente). Las demás sopranos todas son maravillosas. Hoy, afortunadamente contamos con la versión de Saioa Hernández. Gracias.
Todo eso yo lo se,solo me refiero a su primer grabacion completa de la opera. La. Gioconda para la. Fonit. Cetra en 1952. Me explico?me entiendes?gracias.
Hablo se su primera grabacion de la opera. La. Gioconda,no de su oficial debut en. Italia,en. La. Arena de. Verona en 1947. Todo eso esta documentado y todo eso yo lo se.
The final excerpt is from the Dec. 30, 1939 Met performance. It was the first "Gioconda" of the season. Zinka Milanov's first high C in the Trio is especially notable.
@@equinox6651 Sorry for the late reply, I had a delightfully long conversation with my grandmother about this topic, I'll try to sumarize what I was told about these Giocondas. Even though all of these singers were in the dramatic side of the soprano voice the volume edge was probably given to Tebaldi, whose timbre was also probably the most beautiful, she gave a very compelling and exciting show. My grandmother had the inmense honor of being in attendance to one of not so many performances by La Divina Callas of this opera, the sheer depth of the musical interpretation and her vocal acting were something else, the voice was in better shape in the late forties, and she was absolutely great and rather unique, she tells me that from that performance on she would always be a Callas admirr. I understand that she heard Milanov in several occasions over almost 20 years, from the mid-late forties to the earliest sixties, mostly in Verdian operas (where she possibly reigned supreme at her best) but in Gioconda she became a standard for a reason, she had a heavy spinto instrument (Mdme Milanov would have said "Not terribly dramatic") that could unleash great power and volume yet at the same time she had the greatest piani and pianissimi out of these four, while always singing in an almost immaculate, beautiful way. Dimitrova was of course a student of Cigna (another wonderful Gioconda) and had a large instrument that overpowered the singers that performed alongside her, she might have shown some minor technical or musical mistakes, but she was able to be as exciting as a singer could be through the right use of her god given instrument, she was also a ver convincing actress and an intelligent musician, my granny thinks (and I agree with her) that Dimitrova had a rather gorgeous timbre, although it isn't always evident in her recordings. If you have any questions I would be happy to ask my grandmother for you, I think she likes remembering those times and becomes a beautiful storyteller.
@@juliovicsilvaaray My GOD, what a life your grandmother lived! Has she seen Callas again after those great Giocondas? If so, how was the experience? ❤
@@NLidar Hello! I apologize, I didn't get s chance to respond until now. My grandmother "chased" Madame Callas after the first time they saw her in Italy, so over the late forties and fifties she had the chance to listen to her many times in many roles, from Belcanto to Verismo, it has made her very happy to listen to these very early recordings of Madame Callas as in the past they were not available, the only recordings one could find were from after her vocal prime, so she (who knew what the real experience was) was often unsatisfied with the recordings one could purchase for private listening. I can tell you that generally she prefers Callas independently from the role, she remains after more than seventy years her absolute favourite.
@@gr__msk Funny that you wrote at this time, I just sat to listen to some music after putting her to sleep. She heard her live as a very young girl for the first time in 1948 in Buenos Aires, and several times in Italy and America, she heard her in different stages of her career in most of her big roles, including Tosca, Gioconda, Aída, Norma, Turandot, Medea, Lucia, Elvira, and especially Violetta, my grandparents followed her avidly in general terms, her public were true fanatics.
@@kbhprinsesse I see the appeal of Hernandez. But yes it is as if I can see the gears in her head turning in real time as she calculates what to do technically.
Callas and Milanov in the 40’s are in great vocal shape and offer excellent performances. I very much enjoy Dimitrova’s dramatic soprano in this role. Perhaps Tebaldi was better in-house but I find her tone hard throughout most of her top voice. She should have taken on the role earlier but the top was never her glory. I heard Tebaldi sing late in her MET career and there were still many lovely moments in Boheme, Chenier and Otello even at late stage. The audience adored her.
@@kgarmaker123 I'm not surprised. A dramatic role like Gioconda was too heavy for Tebaldi. Even in studio recordings in her prime, for instance her 1955 "La forza del destino", you can hear how she gets tired if she sings too heavy repertoire.
I love the fans coming out in support of their favourite. Let’s have a vote on who is prettier - a blonde, brunette or redhead. We could quite happily start world war 3. My conclusion is they ALL sing better than I do.
Yes, yes, this high C (both) is better or worst in this or another singer, but for me there's a true "punto micidiale" and is "Amatevi! Siate feli-i-ici". That part defines why opera as a musical art was created: the expression of the affetti, the way to write them musically and the way to sing and speak them: changes of colours, use of the emotion with art. For me, Dimitrova don't understand this, only voice, voice, like a magnificent loudspeaker. The one I like most is obvious.
LOTS AND LOTS OF LIVE GIOCONDAS ON UTUBE ALL WITH TEBALDI IN TOP FORM.....THERE IS ONE WITH THE .....ENZO ADORATO AH COME TAMO.....SHE STARTS MEZZO PIANO THEN SUSTAINS A PIANISSIMO FOR 10 SECONDS...AS GOOD AS THE PIANISSIMI IN HER FIRST RECORDINGS 15 YEARS EARLIER......STUNNING.
I means a commercial recording. That's what am talking about. She got her royalties and finito. Commercial recording,not a live performance. Got it?good!!
Luigi Corvi Someone else has finally remarked on this Tebaldi performance! I was astounded when I heard the piano high note, thinking she had lost this ability after the early 60’s. She always sounded much better in live performances than recorded ones. This is certainly true of ‘Gioconda’. She is not in particularly convincing voice here, whereas the Met performances are fantastic. This music was in her genes, and she was going for broke at the end of her career. (I might note that she sang this music with a large cut in the middle in NY.)
@@luigicorvi1661 I was amazed when I first heard this tape, since I thought she had completely lost the high pp. Her studio recording is otherwise miscast and a pale presentation of her fabulous stage performances.
@@ransomcoates546 Apparently Corelli was supposed to record Gioconda with her, but he made some comment to her during a Met curtain call that she would never be as good a Gioconda as Callas. So Bergonzi appeared instead. This is according to the Rene Seghers book.
I heard Dimitrova’s Gioconda in the house in the early 80’s. I found her loud, certainly, but vocally crude. And how much I would love Milanov if she had only kept under control that glissando scooping she did so much. (This recording shows her in very good voice aside from the splayed C.)
I actually like her high C here the best, especially the one at 11:58. Others just skipped over it, even Callas (even though she sure could hold it for a bit longer).
@@equinox6651 I think it's a tough phrase, especially after an evening of long and heavy singing. One needs to move nimbly through the passage without accumulating too much weight and then reach up towards (what is for the genuinely spinto or dramatic voices) the top of one's range. Not that different from the high C in O patria mia, although that one of course much more exposed.
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 I agree. I'm a huge Callas fan, but I think Cerquetti's recording is the best studio recording of Gioconda when it comes to the combination of the singers.
Renata Tebaldi è la migliore. Lasua voce si fonde a meraviglia con la musica e interpreta molto bene tutti i risvolti del carattere complicato di Gioconda..
Dimitrova was the real voice of. Gioconda!!a truly dramatic soprano. I saw her in. Giiconda at the. Met in. New. York. City. She was fantastic!! I don't know who her partners are.
Yes. Dimitrova said that in her experience, Gioconda was the most difficult role for a dramatic soprano to perform, saying that even Norma wasn't as difficult.
EILEEN FARRELL sang GIOCONDA in her all too brief MET career. Farrell was the singer Nilsson feared that would challenge her when she came to New York, with good reason : SHE WAS GREAT. I never understood that Columbia with both Farrell and Richard Tucker plus Leonard Bernstein never recorded this opera or LA FANICIULLA DEL WEST. What a waste and missed opportunity.
Milanov who the master!! She was past 50 in this recording,that was made in the late 50s. Well,wait a minute!!this is a life performance from the 40s I guess!!
This recording is from 1939. Milanov is very thrilling here. She does fermata on the first high C. Taking into consideration for how long she had been singing Gioconda and how many times she perfromed it altogether, it is safe to say she probably was the greatest interpreter of this role in the 20th. century.
Per carità , di Soprani eccezionali ce ne sono stati diversi e qui lo sono tutti.Ma se parliamo di espressività oltre il limite previsto da orecchio umano e che insieme trasfiguri l aspetto vocale terreno in qualcosa di " alto" inafferrabile , io credo che ce ne sia solo uno che abbia compiuto questo miracolo ( al di là di ogni rigore filologico, che pure Le apparteneva) E che ,fra 200/300 anni lo farà ricordare insieme al solo Caruso. A voi la risposta.Ah, aggiungo che non parlo per massimi sistemi o tantomeno per tifoseria. Cordiali saluti
Apples, oranges, peaches etc. All these great singers were wonderful in their day, only we keep using superlatives for this one or that one. How about we start looking at some great talent that's around today?
For me The best total is Maria Callas. Tebaldi the high note in terzzeto is terrible. Its again amazing Dimitrova with youre big voice but I dont like her vibrato. Its very good in there role Milanov. I prefeer Maria Callas is the best.
@@johnpickford4222 go clean your ears. If this is Callas in 1959, the mezzo should be the young Cossotto - does she really sound like this? No. This is from Callas' 1952 studio recording, and the mezzo is Barbieri.
Zinka Milanov, la mejor gioconda de todos los tiempos, lástima que muchos ponen opiniones sin haberla escuchado, Milanov una voz perfecta, legato perfecto, una voz broncinea de una belleza única, impresionante en los graves, medios y agudos, la única que podía hacer filados sul fiato solo Ponselle se puede equiparar a ella, en cuanto Callas a la que tengo gran respeto es quizas la interprete mas grande de todos los tiempos, pero vocalmente deja mucho que desear, Tebaldi una hermosa voz muy pareja en toda la ópera, y me parece que Dimitrova la más cercana a nosotros en el tiempo, no esta la altura de las anteriores.
Apologies for this rudimentary question, but is the tenor in the Dimitrova excerpt Pavarotti? I think so, but I'm not sure because he is in the distance. Either he is standing far away from the mic, or he is just being swamped!
@@judygarland7186 I haven’t listened to enough recordings to judge. Of the one’s I’ve heard, I find her interpretations the most compelling, but I think the role was heavy for her. Vocally, I like young Milanov in this role. I like Tebaldi too, but it was heavy for her as well!
@omarsomehow69 you act as if you are surprised Tebaldi is flat here. She was usually flat and she screamed the high notes, especially high C. She is also incredibly flat in the famous Gioconda B-flat
Poor old Zinka, as Callas called her, sounds like someone’s grandma and Renata is right there with her as far as old tired singing goes. Callas is spot on here and the rest are forgettable.
Milanov was the greatest Gioconda of 20th century. Callas was extraordinary, but I don't think she cared much about that role, having in mind she sang it only a few times on stage.
@@equinox6651 I'm not sure about Callas not caring about this role but when she finished her 1959 studio recording she said "It's all there for anyone who cares to understand or wishes to know what I was about" maybe you prefer the more conventional singing of Milanov but even Tebaldi which voice can't hardly tell apart from Zinka's (they're both spinto sopranos) when heard Maria's version while preparing for this role said that this was way better than Milanov's and asked manager why didn't he showed to her earlier, I think we all know why 😀
@@jadalmatamoros6368 I think it came to late for Tebaldi. In my opinion, the definitive recordings of Gioconda are the one with Callas from 1953 and the one with Milanov from 1946 (Live recording).
“Someone’s grandma,” “Renata right there with her” show you don’t know Italianate style. They actually both sound blazingly sexy and terrifying. Secure, columnar, resonant, powerful, feminine.
Callas was Gioconda. The rest sang the role more less well. I put Tebaldi as second then Milanov(much lighter voice than Tebaldi). Dimitrova doesn’t even belong in this list. She is so overrated!
@@draganvidic2039 Milanov was a lyric soprano. Far far farrrrr from a dramatic soprano. Where are your ears? Tebaldi had a bigger voicr than Milanov and most certainly bigger than Dimitrova. Dimitrova is to me a THROATY spinto soprano. But a real Spinto. Smaller voice Tebaldi for sure.
Milanov is generally considered a dramatic voice. She herself said that she was a dramatic voice, but not “terribly dramatic”. Her greatest roles are Amelia and Gioconda and both roles are prototypes of Italian dramatic repertoire. She had success with Norma (peak of dramatic repertoire) and sang Turandot and Wagner heroines with success. A lyric voice could never successfuly do such roles, not in their wildest dreams. To my ears lyric voices are: Lily Pons, te Kanawa, Sills, Moffo, Dessay and Netrebko. When this voice type tries to sing anything dramatic, vocal wreck usually ensues (Netrebko is a living example). Milanov was far more capable and bigger voice than any of the aforementioned. A friend of mine who has heard all of the greats, said Milanov was the biggest voice in MET’s italian wing, Flagstad and Nilsson being the biggest in german wing. He wasn’t impressed by Callas’ vocal size (he saw her in person at her debut in Norma in 1956, and even greeted her afterwards). He said she was extremely intelligent and thrilling, intuitive and carismatic and could do thrilling vocal ‘fireworks’. In terms of vocal size, he says it was a medium sized voice, smaller than both Milanov and Tebaldi, but that it probably was as big or even bigger prior to her drastic lifestyle switch. Dimitrova was an enormous voice. At La Scala there was even an ailment called “ghenite”, that is, others were not audible when paired with Dimitrova. It is even said one could hear her singing outside of Scala, in the streets - that’s how potentnher voice was. All in all, if one gives a listen to e.g. Non tremare or In mia man by Callas, Milanov or Ponselle, it becomes evident that a lyric voice (e.g. Pons, Sills...) could never, ever do justice to those notes, not even Tebaldi, whom I consider a classic example of spinto.
Callas , una voz árida y cascada y chillona en los agudos. Tebaldi, una voz redonda, bella, apolínea. Dimitrova, una voz grande, dramática, pero con un vibrato poco agradable. Milanov, una voz apropiada al rol, pero con un timbre muy eslavo.
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 scusa ho letto male il commento sopra... Ho letto "est trop belle" 🤣. Certo, Serafin ammirava la Callas come nessuna, giustamente
I am old enough to have seen three of the four live in late career recitals [Callas and Tebaldi] or staged opera [Dimitrova]. With Tebaldi and Dimitrova the voice was all that there was and it was certainly more than enough. However, with Callas the voice was so enhanced by her physical movements, emotive tone, and characterization through sound that it was on a different plane of experience even at the end of her career. Seeing her ability to shape her body and her face in the same way she could shape her voice to match a character allowed me to appreciate how unbelievable she must have been when all three abilities were at their zenith.
The depth of sorrow and matchless musicality of Callas in terrific voice. The sheer beauty of Tebaldi’s voice is a lifelong love affair (at least for me).
4 great Giocondas. Milanovs association with the role was long and distinguished, from 1935 to 1962. No one sang it with greater beauty. In the house it was a marvel so very touching. I have so much respect 4 this great lady.
1. Callas 2. Milanov 3. Tebaldi 4. Dimitrova. Callas is superior is multiple ways in these samples. It is, after all, the telling of a painful story and her voice with its myriad colors conveys the emotions far, far better than the others. As well, Callas’ voice sound full, powerful and easy here. This was a great role for her. These were 4 greats, for sure…….where can we hear such great singers today?
Idiotav
Milanov has my vote on this one. She always had a sort of pleading in her voice that fit this role perfectly.
"pathos"
Pathos stonato😂😂😂😂😂
No.
Хочется слушать всегда
🎉🎉🎉
La Callas puso a la Gioconda a la altura de las grandes óperas del repertorio italiano. María entendió perfectamente no solo el personaje, sino la mente de Ponchielli (dramáticamente, musicalmente). Las demás sopranos todas son maravillosas. Hoy, afortunadamente contamos con la versión de Saioa Hernández. Gracias.
Callas in her first. Gioconda in 1952. Gianni. Poggi and. Fedora. Barbieri. Her best. Gioconda!!!
Callas' Gioconda started in 1947, at Verona. Those, unfortunately, were not recorded.
Todo eso yo lo se,solo me refiero a su primer grabacion completa de la opera. La. Gioconda para la. Fonit. Cetra en 1952. Me explico?me entiendes?gracias.
Hablo se su primera grabacion de la opera. La. Gioconda,no de su oficial debut en. Italia,en. La. Arena de. Verona en 1947. Todo eso esta documentado y todo eso yo lo se.
@@alfredoloyola921 Tu tienes toda la razón. Su vibrato ,su actuación, su explendida voz. Todo es un expletáculo en esa mujer. La amo.
1 Callas 2 Tebaldi 3 Milanov 4 Dimitrova
The final excerpt is from the Dec. 30, 1939 Met performance. It was the first "Gioconda" of the season. Zinka Milanov's first high C in the Trio is especially notable.
Sorry I like all four without feeling the need to name the "best". Boy what I would not give to hear any one of them today!
I have the pleasure of having my dear granny who heard all of them in the role live.
Share her thought!
@@equinox6651 Sorry for the late reply, I had a delightfully long conversation with my grandmother about this topic, I'll try to sumarize what I was told about these Giocondas. Even though all of these singers were in the dramatic side of the soprano voice the volume edge was probably given to Tebaldi, whose timbre was also probably the most beautiful, she gave a very compelling and exciting show. My grandmother had the inmense honor of being in attendance to one of not so many performances by La Divina Callas of this opera, the sheer depth of the musical interpretation and her vocal acting were something else, the voice was in better shape in the late forties, and she was absolutely great and rather unique, she tells me that from that performance on she would always be a Callas admirr. I understand that she heard Milanov in several occasions over almost 20 years, from the mid-late forties to the earliest sixties, mostly in Verdian operas (where she possibly reigned supreme at her best) but in Gioconda she became a standard for a reason, she had a heavy spinto instrument (Mdme Milanov would have said "Not terribly dramatic") that could unleash great power and volume yet at the same time she had the greatest piani and pianissimi out of these four, while always singing in an almost immaculate, beautiful way. Dimitrova was of course a student of Cigna (another wonderful Gioconda) and had a large instrument that overpowered the singers that performed alongside her, she might have shown some minor technical or musical mistakes, but she was able to be as exciting as a singer could be through the right use of her god given instrument, she was also a ver convincing actress and an intelligent musician, my granny thinks (and I agree with her) that Dimitrova had a rather gorgeous timbre, although it isn't always evident in her recordings. If you have any questions I would be happy to ask my grandmother for you, I think she likes remembering those times and becomes a beautiful storyteller.
@@juliovicsilvaaray My GOD, what a life your grandmother lived! Has she seen Callas again after those great Giocondas? If so, how was the experience? ❤
@@NLidar Hello! I apologize, I didn't get s chance to respond until now. My grandmother "chased" Madame Callas after the first time they saw her in Italy, so over the late forties and fifties she had the chance to listen to her many times in many roles, from Belcanto to Verismo, it has made her very happy to listen to these very early recordings of Madame Callas as in the past they were not available, the only recordings one could find were from after her vocal prime, so she (who knew what the real experience was) was often unsatisfied with the recordings one could purchase for private listening. I can tell you that generally she prefers Callas independently from the role, she remains after more than seventy years her absolute favourite.
@@gr__msk Funny that you wrote at this time, I just sat to listen to some music after putting her to sleep. She heard her live as a very young girl for the first time in 1948 in Buenos Aires, and several times in Italy and America, she heard her in different stages of her career in most of her big roles, including Tosca, Gioconda, Aída, Norma, Turandot, Medea, Lucia, Elvira, and especially Violetta, my grandparents followed her avidly in general terms, her public were true fanatics.
Numéro 1 Renata Tebaldi !!!
All this does is remind me of the total dearth of great sopranos in the world today.
There aren’t any Gioconda’s, that’s for certain.
We have Saioa Hernandez who manages pretty well with her developed big lyric voice.
@@draganvidic2039 no she doesn't. She's never really "together" musically, she's so preoccupied with the physical mechanics of singing.
@@kbhprinsesse I see the appeal of Hernandez. But yes it is as if I can see the gears in her head turning in real time as she calculates what to do technically.
Callas number one !
Nell'ordine Milanov Tebaldi Callas Dimitrova
No, Callas e Tebaldi poi Milanov e Dimitrova.
@@luigipirsavele9373 ridicoloso. Il ruolo della Gioconda era troppo pesante per la Tebaldi.
Tebaldi...
The supreme voice of all Time.... Callas ❤️🙏🔥👑🌏
Thats is the bestt answer. I rely love Maria Callas.
not quite
@@jeanhaughton537 😂😂😂😂😂Callas =SUPREME VOICE OF ALL TIME ❤️👑😄
Callas, Callas, Callas - indomitable
Callas and Milanov in the 40’s are in great vocal shape and offer excellent performances. I very much enjoy Dimitrova’s dramatic soprano in this role. Perhaps Tebaldi was better in-house but I find her tone hard throughout most of her top voice. She should have taken on the role earlier but the top was never her glory. I heard Tebaldi sing late in her MET career and there were still many lovely moments in Boheme, Chenier and Otello even at late stage. The audience adored her.
I heard Tebaldi, sing Gioconda on a Met Tour performance... it was screamed.
@@kgarmaker123 I'm not surprised. A dramatic role like Gioconda was too heavy for Tebaldi. Even in studio recordings in her prime, for instance her 1955 "La forza del destino", you can hear how she gets tired if she sings too heavy repertoire.
I love the fans coming out in support of their favourite. Let’s have a vote on who is prettier - a blonde, brunette or redhead. We could quite happily start world war 3.
My conclusion is they ALL sing better than I do.
Quando canta la Renata tutti in piedi...
Yes, yes, this high C (both) is better or worst in this or another singer, but for me there's a true "punto micidiale" and is "Amatevi! Siate feli-i-ici". That part defines why opera as a musical art was created: the expression of the affetti, the way to write them musically and the way to sing and speak them: changes of colours, use of the emotion with art. For me, Dimitrova don't understand this, only voice, voice, like a magnificent loudspeaker. The one I like most is obvious.
To me, this sounds like Milanov's 1939 broadcast with Bruna Castagna and Giovanni Martinelli. The 46 broadcast had Rise Stevens and Richard Tucker.
Callas and Milanov!
Callas is so superior both vocally and dramatically.
Agreed. There is no equal (here at any rate)
Tebaldi at 45!!in her only her only recording of
Gioconda. Partnered by. Marilyn. Horne and. Carlo. Bergonzi.
LOTS AND LOTS OF LIVE GIOCONDAS ON UTUBE ALL WITH TEBALDI IN TOP FORM.....THERE IS ONE WITH THE .....ENZO ADORATO AH COME TAMO.....SHE STARTS MEZZO PIANO THEN SUSTAINS A PIANISSIMO FOR 10 SECONDS...AS GOOD AS THE PIANISSIMI IN HER FIRST RECORDINGS 15 YEARS EARLIER......STUNNING.
I means a commercial recording. That's what am talking about. She got her royalties and finito. Commercial recording,not a live performance. Got it?good!!
Luigi Corvi Someone else has finally remarked on this Tebaldi performance! I was astounded when I heard the piano high note, thinking she had lost this ability after the early 60’s. She always sounded much better in live performances than recorded ones. This is certainly true of ‘Gioconda’. She is not in particularly convincing voice here, whereas the Met performances are fantastic. This music was in her genes, and she was going for broke at the end of her career. (I might note that she sang this music with a large cut in the middle in NY.)
@@luigicorvi1661 I was amazed when I first heard this tape, since I thought she had completely lost the high pp. Her studio recording is otherwise miscast and a pale presentation of her fabulous stage performances.
@@ransomcoates546 Apparently Corelli was supposed to record Gioconda with her, but he made some comment to her during a Met curtain call that she would never be as good a Gioconda as Callas. So Bergonzi appeared instead. This is according to the Rene Seghers book.
I heard Dimitrova’s Gioconda in the house in the early 80’s. I found her loud, certainly, but vocally crude. And how much I would love Milanov if she had only kept under control that glissando scooping she did so much. (This recording shows her in very good voice aside from the splayed C.)
I actually like her high C here the best, especially the one at 11:58. Others just skipped over it, even Callas (even though she sure could hold it for a bit longer).
@@equinox6651 You’re right about the usually fudged one. By the by, as I recall her stage performances Tebaldi sang this trio with a big cut.
I agree about Dimitrova. She was a one-trick-pony, singing loudly all the time.
@@equinox6651 I think it's a tough phrase, especially after an evening of long and heavy singing. One needs to move nimbly through the passage without accumulating too much weight and then reach up towards (what is for the genuinely spinto or dramatic voices) the top of one's range. Not that different from the high C in O patria mia, although that one of course much more exposed.
Where is Cerquetti?
Anitta Cerquetti, opera singer
She is missing in this video. Her studio recording is great.
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 I agree. I'm a huge Callas fan, but I think Cerquetti's recording is the best studio recording of Gioconda when it comes to the combination of the singers.
Renata Tebaldi è la migliore. Lasua voce si fonde a meraviglia con la musica e interpreta molto bene tutti i risvolti del carattere complicato di Gioconda..
Gioconda era troppo pesante per la Tebaldi.
I’ll be glad to see them marked in order somewhere, not that I can’t recognise Ghena... :)
Callas
Tebaldi
Dimitrova
Milanov
I think. Dimitrova partner is. Pavarrotti.
Que 4 patas para una mesa!!!
imaginate ver las 4 seguidas en una semana ... sale uno nuevo
Dimitrova was the real voice of. Gioconda!!a truly dramatic soprano. I saw her in. Giiconda at the. Met in. New. York. City. She was fantastic!! I don't know who her partners are.
Yes. Dimitrova said that in her experience, Gioconda was the most difficult role for a dramatic soprano to perform, saying that even Norma wasn't as difficult.
EILEEN FARRELL sang GIOCONDA in her all too brief MET career. Farrell was the singer Nilsson feared that would challenge her when she came to New York, with good reason : SHE WAS GREAT. I never understood that Columbia with both Farrell and Richard Tucker plus Leonard Bernstein never recorded this opera or LA FANICIULLA DEL WEST. What a waste and missed opportunity.
Dimitrova just sang loud. That's all she could do. So boring.
@@kbhprinsesse you must be kidding because dimitrova has the best dynamic control and pianissimi
@@judygarland7186 now YOU are the one who's kidding.
Callas said that Act 4 in this recording was the best example of her art.
Конечно, первон место по качеству звучания, красоте, музыкальность и точности отдаю Рената Тебальди. Второе место- М. КАЛЛАС
What year was the Tebaldi? Early 60s Decca recording?
1967
1967.
Tebaldi Callas Dimitrova Milanova
Tebaldi, Callas, Milanov, Dimitrova for my taste, but they were all important Giocondas.
Milanov who the master!! She was past 50 in this recording,that was made in the late 50s. Well,wait a minute!!this is a life performance from the 40s I guess!!
This recording is from 1939. Milanov is very thrilling here. She does fermata on the first high C. Taking into consideration for how long she had been singing Gioconda and how many times she perfromed it altogether, it is safe to say she probably was the greatest interpreter of this role in the 20th. century.
LEYLA GENCER
Per carità , di Soprani eccezionali ce ne sono stati diversi e qui lo sono tutti.Ma se parliamo di espressività oltre il limite previsto da orecchio umano e che insieme trasfiguri l aspetto vocale terreno in qualcosa di " alto" inafferrabile , io credo che ce ne sia solo uno che abbia compiuto questo miracolo ( al di là di ogni rigore filologico, che pure Le apparteneva) E che ,fra 200/300 anni lo farà ricordare insieme al solo Caruso. A voi la risposta.Ah, aggiungo che non parlo per massimi sistemi o tantomeno per tifoseria. Cordiali saluti
So much reverb on the Callas recording!
Yes, unfortunately the transfers of those old Cetra recordings often contains lots of reverb.
In a word, Tebaldi.
Gioconda = Callas 1952❤️
Apples, oranges, peaches etc. All these great singers were wonderful in their day, only we keep using superlatives for this one or that one. How about we start looking at some great talent that's around today?
Tebaldi The best Gioconda!
For me The best total is Maria Callas. Tebaldi the high note in terzzeto is terrible. Its again amazing Dimitrova with youre big voice but I dont like her vibrato. Its very good in there role Milanov. I prefeer Maria Callas is the best.
Rolf Steyer: Callas’ top is none too steady. This is Callas in ‘59 NOT ‘49!!!
@@johnpickford4222 go clean your ears. If this is Callas in 1959, the mezzo should be the young Cossotto - does she really sound like this? No. This is from Callas' 1952 studio recording, and the mezzo is Barbieri.
Nie bylo leprzej Giocondy od CALLAS
LEYLA GENCER The best interpretation!
Zinka Milanov, la mejor gioconda de todos los tiempos, lástima que muchos ponen opiniones sin haberla escuchado, Milanov una voz perfecta, legato perfecto, una voz broncinea de una belleza única, impresionante en los graves, medios y agudos, la única que podía hacer filados sul fiato solo Ponselle se puede equiparar a ella, en cuanto Callas a la que tengo gran respeto es quizas la interprete mas grande de todos los tiempos, pero vocalmente deja mucho que desear, Tebaldi una hermosa voz muy pareja en toda la ópera, y me parece que Dimitrova la más cercana a nosotros en el tiempo, no esta la altura de las anteriores.
Tebaldi!!!
Too heavy for her.
Apologies for this rudimentary question, but is the tenor in the Dimitrova excerpt Pavarotti? I think so, but I'm not sure because he is in the distance. Either he is standing far away from the mic, or he is just being swamped!
do you find Callas the best La gioconda ever?
@@judygarland7186 I haven’t listened to enough recordings to judge. Of the one’s I’ve heard, I find her interpretations the most compelling, but I think the role was heavy for her. Vocally, I like young Milanov in this role. I like Tebaldi too, but it was heavy for her as well!
Callas is divine but Tebaldi is La Gioconda, we all know who shouldn’t be included here!
Who? #bullsh*t
Tebaldi
Tebaldi is the best Gioconda, her recording prove it. She has the voice and power for Gioconda.
Huzzah, YES.
She scream and cheats listen thé high B flat Enzo adorato line
All other three have it easier in this role than her…
Nonsense, the recording proves that Gioconda was too heavy for her.
ONLY CALLAS SORRY
Leyla Gencer
A pushed-up lyric? Hardly.
The trio work is terrible in all but the Callas. The others are painful and annoying to hear!
We should have such voices today. Now it's impossible to find a competent cast for Gioconda.
Callas...only Callas. Basta!
parole sante.
Se parliamo di voce in teatro un nome Gena dimitrova!
All she could do was sing loud. Very boring.
@@kbhprinsesse boring are you
@@francodegrandis7531 oh dear, someone gets insulted if others don't agree with him. Call your mother and get her to change your diaper.
Tebaldi s high C is flat
@Noack Somewhere there ain't such a thing as the "best day for Tebaldi s voice" 😆😜
As usual...
@omarsomehow69 so? That doesn't make her high notes less flat.
@omarsomehow69 you are right. It's forbidden to comment on RUclips. Idiot.
@omarsomehow69 you act as if you are surprised Tebaldi is flat here. She was usually flat and she screamed the high notes, especially high C. She is also incredibly flat in the famous Gioconda B-flat
Poor old Zinka, as Callas called her, sounds like someone’s grandma and Renata is right there with her as far as old tired singing goes. Callas is spot on here and the rest are forgettable.
Milanov was the greatest Gioconda of 20th century. Callas was extraordinary, but I don't think she cared much about that role, having in mind she sang it only a few times on stage.
@@equinox6651 I'm not sure about Callas not caring about this role but when she finished her 1959 studio recording she said "It's all there for anyone who cares to understand or wishes to know what I was about" maybe you prefer the more conventional singing of Milanov but even Tebaldi which voice can't hardly tell apart from Zinka's (they're both spinto sopranos) when heard Maria's version while preparing for this role said that this was way better than Milanov's and asked manager why didn't he showed to her earlier, I think we all know why 😀
@@jadalmatamoros6368
I think it came to late for Tebaldi. In my opinion, the definitive recordings of Gioconda are the one with Callas from 1953 and the one with Milanov from 1946 (Live recording).
“Someone’s grandma,” “Renata right there with her” show you don’t know Italianate style. They actually both sound blazingly sexy and terrifying. Secure, columnar, resonant, powerful, feminine.
@@jadalmatamoros6368
Milanov was a dramatic
Callas was Gioconda. The rest sang the role more less well. I put Tebaldi as second then Milanov(much lighter voice than Tebaldi). Dimitrova doesn’t even belong in this list. She is so overrated!
Milanov was a dramatic and Tebaldi a spinto.
Why are you confused about this?
Do you think Dimitrova was a lyric coloratura too?
@@draganvidic2039 Milanov was a lyric soprano. Far far farrrrr from a dramatic soprano. Where are your ears? Tebaldi had a bigger voicr than Milanov and most certainly bigger than Dimitrova. Dimitrova is to me a THROATY spinto soprano. But a real Spinto. Smaller voice Tebaldi for sure.
Milanov is generally considered a dramatic voice. She herself said that she was a dramatic voice, but not “terribly dramatic”. Her greatest roles are Amelia and Gioconda and both roles are prototypes of Italian dramatic repertoire. She had success with Norma (peak of dramatic repertoire) and sang Turandot and Wagner heroines with success. A lyric voice could never successfuly do such roles, not in their wildest dreams. To my ears lyric voices are: Lily Pons, te Kanawa, Sills, Moffo, Dessay and Netrebko. When this voice type tries to sing anything dramatic, vocal wreck usually ensues (Netrebko is a living example). Milanov was far more capable and bigger voice than any of the aforementioned. A friend of mine who has heard all of the greats, said Milanov was the biggest voice in MET’s italian wing, Flagstad and Nilsson being the biggest in german wing. He wasn’t impressed by Callas’ vocal size (he saw her in person at her debut in Norma in 1956, and even greeted her afterwards). He said she was extremely intelligent and thrilling, intuitive and carismatic and could do thrilling vocal ‘fireworks’. In terms of vocal size, he says it was a medium sized voice, smaller than both Milanov and Tebaldi, but that it probably was as big or even bigger prior to her drastic lifestyle switch. Dimitrova was an enormous voice. At La Scala there was even an ailment called “ghenite”, that is, others were not audible when paired with Dimitrova. It is even said one could hear her singing outside of Scala, in the streets - that’s how potentnher voice was. All in all, if one gives a listen to e.g. Non tremare or In mia man by Callas, Milanov or Ponselle, it becomes evident that a lyric voice (e.g. Pons, Sills...) could never, ever do justice to those notes, not even Tebaldi, whom I consider a classic example of spinto.
@@beachfanatic2010 ZZzzzzz...
@@equinox6651 Thanks!
Callas , una voz árida y cascada y chillona en los agudos. Tebaldi, una voz redonda, bella, apolínea. Dimitrova, una voz grande, dramática, pero con un vibrato poco agradable. Milanov, una voz apropiada al rol, pero con un timbre muy eslavo.
Lastima que la parte superior de Tebaldi no es la mejor pero si es buena.
@@Pachinanonim tug
Todas buenas pero callas Divina!!!÷'
Today is 😂😂
la voix de Callas pas trop belle.
Ahahahahahahahahahah! Serafin, Zenatello e Rossi Lemeni non sono d'accordo con te.
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 Serafin non è d'accordo? Ma che dici?
@@Tkimba2 Al Maestro Serafin piaceva molto il canto della Callas.
@@BaroneVitellioScarpia1 scusa ho letto male il commento sopra... Ho letto "est trop belle" 🤣.
Certo, Serafin ammirava la Callas come nessuna, giustamente
@@Tkimba2 In realtà penso che la bellezza vocale della Callas sia sottovalutata.
None of them impressive.
One has to laugh! “None impressive?”
Add Ponselle and Cerquetti to Milanov, Callas, and Tebaldi and you have virtually the only Giocondas (Gioconde?).
@@michaeldslipp1078
She’s a great troll only
I agree they're not impressive, they're superb
Well, if you meant Dimitrova, then I agree with you. But Milanov and Tebaldi are very impressive, and Callas is just perfect.
@@michaeldslipp1078, se parli in italiano, Gioconde. In English, better Giocondas.