2021 7.3 dually with 4:30 gears. Under 20,000 pounds it’s a game changer no need for a diesel. No other gas competition in this category. The 10 speed is magic. My 5th wheel is right at 18,000 and live in western North Carolina mountains. Never have to push it hard. Great setup. Cheaper to buy cheaper to maintain and time in service is non existent compared to any diesel. 7.3 and 10 speed will work for 80% of all people pulling out there.
I am looking at the 7.3 dually with 4.3 as an option for me. It will not be a daily driver but I am still wondering about unloaded and loaded mileage. What are you getting?
2022 F350 with 7.3, 4.30 gears, standard bed pulls my 16,500 5er just fine! Only been in the midwest so far but have spent plenty of time in big hills of the Ozark mountains. I'm watching my towing/payload weights carefully as we are full timers. Payload is plenty at 4K and the truck has ZERO issues pulling my RV! Very happy with the choice I made!
I went with a gas 2500 HD (6.6 L) to pull my 13k 5th wheel. Getting about 8 MPG. It handles it just fine, but down shifts a lot going uphill. The biggest issue I have with it is not being able to go through the truck lanes to refuel. It is an absolute nightmare when getting close to E and having to navigate the crowded narrow gas lanes to refuel with the 5th wheel attached.
The fixing that issue is getting a trailer with two landing gears and not one. Take 3 trailers would be an issue. All you have to do is drop the trailer… fill and go back to the Diesel pad to connect and go.
My neighbor owns a diesel repair shop. He has a large 5th wheel and bought a gasser for his tow vehicle. He said newer diesels don’t last like the pre-emission trucks did and they are expensive to repair.
Gas has always been an acceptable option for towing. Diesel of course is the end all answer to towing, but gas towing only briefly stopped being a "thing" in the mid to late 2000s because of advances in diesel tech and the diesel trucks becoming top of the line luxury models. A good example is the truck that rolled into our shop a few days ago to get a hitch. Late 90s dually crew cab chevy with a big gas motor, that the guy was going to use to tow a fifth wheel that had a 16700 gvwr. Plenty capable, plenty doable. Heck, towing with a full size car or wagon was common up into the 90s. If your issue is going up and down hills, slow down and downshift. How you drive > any advantage diesel or gas may provide.
100%. I have the same thing, a '98 Chevy crew cab dually with the 454. Buddy has an 03 CTD. We can keep up with each other just fine. Maybe if we both towed at the top of our tow ratings, he might do a bit better, but we don't. He does get 2x the fuel mileage I do, empty or loaded, but the premium he paid for the truck will buy me a LOT of gasoline. Ultimately, we're both very happy with our trucks, and that's what matters.
@@om617yota8 This. You can debate specifications and theories all day long, but either one will work for you unless you're absolutely maxing out your trucks towing capacity.
Your points are spot on ! Over the last 45+ years I have owned numerous trucks & rv's. My 2021 F350 was ordered with a 7.3l. I did not want a diesel. I am currently towing a 9k # tt . We recently returned from a 4k mile trip over hills & mtns with a friend that has a GMC diesel & simular tt. He averaged ~1.5 mpg'd better, but was paying $.70 to $1 more per gal than I was as well. I can buy a lot of gas for the $9k+ upfront additional diesel engine, option let alone the fuel difference. I had no issues keeping up or down hills & mtns. If I were towing over 12k # then I'd get one. The accountant in me has looked up a 4 & 5 year old trucks and compared the average list price new vs current value. Yes the diesel sells for more but it cost more to begin with. You're still facing the same % of depreciation though. So you are not gaining anything.
Just traded my 17 250 diesel for a 22 250 7.3. Was nervous about the towing experience but have been truly impressed. I need my truck more for higher payload than towing capacity so it made sense to go gas this time. With the ten speed transmission it keeps the rpm’s lower so your engine isn’t screaming up hills like gas engines of the past. So far in my calculations if diesel stays 50 cents more a gallon than regular gas. I come out ahead having a gasser in costs per mile. Obviously everyone uses there trucks differently and will have different outcomes but I am very happy with my truck so far. Also you said how everyone loves that diesel sound, I would say I am much preferring this gas engine sound over the diesel. I also don’t miss the oily diesel pumps.
@@denverbasshead '21 F-250 Tremor. 7.3L with 4.30 gears. Payload is 2770. 15k bumper pull, 18.7k 5th wheel. Rumor has it that Tremor 3/4 and 1 tons are the same truck, but tagged different for registration purposes.
So timely a discussion! I think most people looking to buy a truck are considering what they plan to tow and may be making decisions to go with something smaller or lighter that a well-equipped gas truck can safely tow. If camping only on weekends or one big summer trip, the gas truck, if also used as a commuter truck, may be the better choice for the next couple years, especially if resale value holds.
Agreed. the exhaust brake is by far the best towing accessory.... I can tow my 5th wheel 16k# down a 5% grade and never use my mechanical brakes.. it auto holds speed...
After owning a diesel I don’t see myself going back to a gas truck. Fuel is more expensive but I love the power and sound of my Cummins with some parts missing
I’ve owned both and my current set up is a 2007 F250 gas with the V10 and 6 speed manual transmission, I absolutely love it, I pull my travel trailer, my boat or farm equipment, trailer weights are from 5000 to 14000 and it handles them all very well. It’s cheaper to maintain and operate and my mpg runs between 8 mpg (heaviest trailer) and 13 mpg (empty at highway speed). Oh, my truck has 4:10 gears. I only drive my truck around 5000 miles per year, I have a company truck that I drive the majority of time.
I think the technology of the new diesel trucks have really made a difference in the maintenance costs and decisions people make. The old 7.3 and 12 valve Cummins where very easy to work on and the parts are cheap and readily available.
Another relevant video. I have a 6.7 Power Stroke and yes I love it. However it was our choice when we were pulling a 16k lbs toy hauler. We've moved back to a TT and this F350 Power Stroke is overkill and expensive to run and maintain. It would be different if today's diesels we're damn near bullet proof like they were 20 years ago but that just no longer the case. If trucks ever become more reasonable I'll trade in for a 7.3 gasser. Well done again JD. You've become my favorite RUclipsr.
I currently own a 22 Ram 3500 6.7 CTD (standard output). I previously owned a Ram 2500 6.4. On the highway/interstate I get 21+ mpg out of the diesel. I couldn't have dreamed of getting anything better than 16-17 mpg's out of the 6.4. Towing I was getting around 7.5 - 8.5 with the gas and I now get 10.5 - 11.5 with the diesel (towing a 38' 5th wheel around 12,500 pounds). Just throwing this out here for people since I've experienced both in the last year. The gas was a great, capable truck, but she drank fuel like crazy.
Timely video. When I’m ready to retire and travel more I’ll probably upgrade to 3/4 for extra payload on longer trips. My TT is around 6k as I travel with max rating of 7k. Even before the surge I was leaning to 7.3l and don’t see me going for diesel. I’d also rather have extra payload in truck vs heavier engine. Gas is definitely option some folks should consider in a superduty.
Just picked up a 22 F-250 godzilla and love it. I've always wanted a new 6.7 powerstroke but I decided gas was a better option for me. I'm planning on buying a bumper tow toy hauler for camping, with my sxs and all loaded up it will be between 11-12k. I had an f 150 ecoboost that had a bunch of power but that kind of weight is not safe with a half ton. I've been impressed with the power and towing capability of the 7.3 gas. I will only tow heavy a handful of times per year so saving 10K over buying the diesel was a good option. I was also able to get into a nicely loaded lariat for less than a base XLT powerstroke. I also did not want to deal with the maintenance of a new diesel, down the road when I have more available time to tow more often maybe I'll get a diesel but for now the gas was just a smarter option for me.
Used to do this with the trash bins all the time with an ATV. And then used two S-Hooks from straps with a steel ring holding them together to pull the second one.
This was my biggest debate when I got my truck. I ended up with a ram 14 2500 6.4 with the 4.10 gears mb 6 years ago. I can currently sell my truck for what I paid for it. My TT was only 7500lbs and I really don't tow that much. Perfect truck for my needs. Buy the truck for your needs, not fuel prices.
The biggest trailer I tow is a 7x16 utility trailer and loaded to the max it weight is about 9500 pounds which my F250 with the 6.2L gas engine can tow no problem.
I think a lot of people think that diesel engines are more robust than gas engines. Modern diesel engines that require DEF fuel are not as relabel as older diesel engines. If you are towing a heavy trailer a diesel engine is required but check out well maintained older rigs. For towing lighter trailers stay with gas engine. Modern gas engines are better than older gas engines. This has been my experience and two cents worth.
Spot on with the weight range. I went with a gas 2500HD since I’m pulling a 11,000 travel trailer. Anything heavier would definitely need a diesel. When I bought my truck the difference between gas and diesel models was closer to $20k.
I tow 10,000 lbs 50 hours a year with a F250 gas and I live very close to work. That's all I use the truck for so gas fits my lifestyle perfectly. Thanks for the great video. And yes lots of payload with gas and that's was important for me because I can carry four passengers, generator and wood along with pin weight and still have room.
sorry add more think about I have see youtubes get flat bed truck and welding brackets to hole the truck camper down. plus side you can make cablet on side of truck camper ( where truck side would be )
I would probably get a gasser if you're also not going to be towing a lot. You'll get the higher payload that you need for the camper with a gas truck.
Yup! Also crunch the numbers... There are additional costs of a diesel to consider (e.g. oil change) however this can help in making the decision. "Miles to break even" = "cost of diesel engine option" / ("diesel cost per gallon" / "diesel mpg" - "gas cost per gallon" / "gas mpg")
Don't forget emissions, If that DPF filter gets clogged or breaks you're looking anywhere from 4 to 10k dollars getting it replaced. I have a 2014 Chevy Cruze 2.0l diesel and just this week was quoted 3k dollars to get the dpf filter replaced, at 130k miles. I found a company that cleans dpf filters and they cleaned it up for 550 dollars but I had to take it off and then put it back on myself, or you have to pay a shop to do that which would probably be another 500 dollars. I talked to the guys cleaning the dpf filter and they said they do a lot of work for semi drivers who get their stuff cleaned every 100k miles, probably just as preventive maintenance so they don't get stranded, but if you assume something similar on a diesel truck that's probably 1,500 or more every 100k miles just another cost to consider. Plus the actual dpf fluid. If it was 2017 and you could still just get deleted at your local mechanic that'd be one thing but not anymore unless you really know someone who trusts you.
Just picked up a 2022 f350 dually with the 7.3 and 430 gears. Can’t wait to hook up my 13,000 lb fifth wheel and test it out. Coming from a 99 dually it should be night and day. I really hope I don’t regret not getting the diesel.
Please keep us updated on your new truck. I just ordered the same setup (dually F350 7.3 4:30). I will be towing a 14k FW. I am really interested in how it performs.
Yes, keep us posted. This is the setup I am looking at. I will be towing a 5th wheel that is 8,300 pounds empty but want the payload to load a toy on a roof deck over the cab. Won’t be my daily driver but am interested in empty and loaded mileage.
Just got my goose box on the fifth wheel and took it for a test run with the new 7.3. Boy was I impressed by the performance of this truck. I don’t regret it at all. The run was from vegas south towards phoenix and back. It was mostly hills and interstate. Truck did well and 10 speed was more than capable of handling the 13000 lb rig. 430 gears was the right choice I think.
Hello JD. Great video, and great challenge! We did the work, and went HD Diesel. Price of entry? Steep but manageable. We gave ours a name: (La Bête = The Beast in English). We attached our ORV HD TT (La Belle = The Beauty in English). Price of Diesel: high everywhere! Price of our lives when towing? Priceless! Peace of mind while towing… always! Safe driving friends = no price can be put on security! Remi (Canada)
I have a 2019 2500hd 6.0 gas, the trailer is a 297qb, going down hill the Trans brake kicks in, and does a good job, but like you said. The exhaust brake is better, have no issues towing. Love my set up
I have an F150 and a 2500 with a Duramax. We go to south Florida for fishing trips each year and I pull a 21' bass boat. Not heavy for sure but I have made the trip 20 times in the past using the 2500. This year I switched to the F150. Similar mpg but gas prices are $1 or more lower than diesel. That adds up on a 1500 mile trip. Another thing is that so many truck stops are just tiny. The F150 is a bit more "nimble" in tight spots.
I’ve just slowed down recently, 60mph gets me good mileage and I generally never have to slow down. It sucks at first but isn’t so bad once you get used to it.
In a way it is very nice (slowing down). Now (you're) driving slow enough for good mileage and let all the "crazy" drivers fly by you because they have to go somewhere, but not so slow that "a stick in the mud" as long as you stay to the right side of the road (in the US). 🙂
In my opinion there is zero reason to buy a 3/4 ton diesel. You lose 1000 lbs of payload with a diesel leaving you with 1800-2100 of total payload. That's going to severely limit what you can tow. Forget about a 5th wheel or gooseneck unless it's a really light one. 2 adults and some tools in the cab and you have about 1500 lbs of payload left to work with. Fine for a decent sized travel trailer, but a well equipped 1/2 ton could pull it as well. At least with a gas 3/4 ton you have 3000 lbs or more of payload to work with. That opens up some decent sized 5th wheels as an option. As long as you can keep pin weight around 2300-2400 lbs. Anyways, that's my opinion on 3/4 ton trucks.
3/4 ton short bed diesel trucks are the most useless thing I've ever seen people spend money on lol. At least get the long bed, but yeah going to a 1 ton might be a couple thousand dollars more but you're really opening up your payload capacity. I have a 2018 GMC Sierra Crew Cab Long Bed SLE 4x4 6.0l gasser payload is 4k pounds max towing is 14k pounds, unless it's some kind of weirdly loaded trailer you can not max out the payload if you stay at 14k pounds or less. It's the perfectly balanced truck like all trucks should be but these guys wanna tow 17k pounds with their 3/4 ton diesel truck with a short bed extended cab on rubber band tires, a 6" lift and the hood praying to Jesus lol. Obviously they failed math class.
@@Ken_Koonz That is pretty good for a 3/4 diesel. Many of the 3/4 diesel trucks I looked at had payloads of 1900 to 2200 lbs. My 350 diesel lariat had 3600lb payload. Just depends how much payload you need. In my case the tongue weight of the travel trailer and gear we wanted to bring required a hefty payload number.
My experience (2013 f250 work truck with 6.2 gas engine), the truck runs out of suspension before running out of motor. Tow 12-13,000 with it and haul as much as 4000 in the bed. Neither done daily. If I were to tow much more, I would want a diesel, but also the extra suspension and tires on a dually.
I have a RAM 3/4 ton with 6.4 Hemi and 3.73 gears. My toy hauler is 7800lbs dry and 11k-12k loaded. The camper weight loaded vs unloaded makes almost no difference in fuel mileage or strain on the motor. The wind makes all the difference, though. The hemi doesn't like fighting the wind. I get 5-7.5mpg with the camper depending on wind.
That is some super information JD. I am like you, I have the option to use our GMC Terrain. Because of the cost of diesel I have been thinking of selling our RV and trading my truck for a mid size gas truck. That totally tick me off. I get the best mileage I have even gotten with truck with my diesel truck gets when not towing 14.9 to 15.6 MPG. I never got that good of mileage with a gas engine truck. Thanks for all the video reviews you do and I really enjoy watching the improvements around your new property. Thanks JD
I would add how often and how far you plan on traveling makes a big difference in engine choice. If you are camping 2 or 3 times a year and traveling less than 300 miles I would consider a gas a lot higher in the current market.
definitely this, especially with the mountains. Ive seen diesels get up to 5-6mpg difference in real world testing while towing. When you go on trips 800+ miles that makes a difference and this huge price difference won't stay forever. Not to mention the peace of mind of knowing my brakes are 100% in the mountains because of the exhaust brake.
Where I live in Crescent City, CA it costs me $145 to fill my 04 F250 with the V10. It tackles any task that I throw at it. It’s also easy to work on vs a diesel in my opinion.
Bucket on the tractor and a strap is my favorite method for moving the trash to the street. I can put them both in the bucket and drop em right where they need to be
I have farms and we haul a lot so our trucks are 2500 diesels. The current Duramax diesels we operate get 17 mpg in daily running and 21 mpg at highway speeds (empty and no trailer). I would love to operate 1/2 ton gassers but they don't haul.
If I am towing under 10K, I will opt for the gas engine unless I am towing most of the time. I will be content to let the engine rev up the grades. The difference in fuel costs and dramatic increase in maintenance costs for diesel makes it a no brainer for me.
Great video! Can you do an update video on your front/rear bumpers? Wanted to see how well they are holding up, would you paint them again, and would you buy again?
I've had a 2020 F250 7.3 Tremor since Jan 2020. Tows a 30ft toy hauler loaded about 9500lbs. Tall and widebody trailer with zero issue. Glad I went 7.3
I went with a f350 with the 7.3 gas and 4.30 gears 15mpg empty and 10.5mpg pulling 14k dump trailer. If you go over 26,000 gcvwr you will need a class A CDL. with this truck that means a max trailer weight of 15,000lbs. Something to consider if you do not have a CDL.
You only need a CDL if towing commercially/for hire. There are many people out there hauling over 26000 GCWR with no CDL. Some states do require a different license when towing that heavy.
I bought mine 2022 ram 3500 diesel because I was towing my 13k 5th wheel, well now I traded my fiver in for a 2022 gas motorhome so now I really don't need to pull heavy and going with gas will be a good ideal. I like my diesel ram and I will probably keep it but just drive it less, I just bought a new Hyundai Venue to tow behind my MH so I might just drive that more. Awesome video sir I love your channel.
I have a 2020 F450 with a 68 gallon upgraded tank. Yes it hurts to fill my tank, but I tow a 14k 5th wheel all over the country many times in the mountains. The piece of mind and safety factor of having an exhaust brake and the torque of a diesel motor pulling through the mountains far outweigh the savings of a gas engine equivalent truck. Possibly having more payload and towing capacity with a gas engine HD truck sounds great on paper, but stopping or braking that rig in the mountains would be a nail biting experience in my opinion. I will always go with a diesel. There is no price to pay for safety. Plus getting gas at a gas station vs diesel at a truck stop with a large 5th wheel would be a nightmare getting in and out of the station.
Currently I'm towing a 6000lbs with a '99 f350 6.8L V10 is typically OK except for uphill at altitude since the truck is screaming with wide-open throttle and I'm losing 5-10mph speed-wise. I love that truck to death but it's still doesn't have the grunt that a diesel may have potentially. While at the pump it's still painful since it gets 10-12mpg unladen and about 5-7mpg towing.
Even when the price of fuel between gas and diesel is the same, the cost of ownership is still less with gas than it is with diesel. The question that needs to be answered should always be, do I need the extra towing capacity of the diesel for the type of trailer and terrain I am towing.
Depending on your mileage, that's not going to be true. Say a diesel gets 11.0 mpg towing, and gasser gets 8.0 mpg doing the same. At $5/gallon for gasoline vs $6/gallon for diesel, you'd still see a payback with diesel in about 100k-150k. For me, that's about 5 or 6 years of driving, since I drive my truck for work. But since diesel isn't always more expensive, I doubt it will remain that much more expensive, you will see a payback likely much sooner. Also, there's other cost savings, mainly brakes. With a diesel exhaust brake, I'd burn through front brakes every 20k miles, rear brakes a little longer. With an exhaust brake, I could more than double or even triple the life of my brakes, which is thousands in savings over a 150k miles, which alone pays for the diesel premium. Other things are more expensive with diesel, but that's give and take. Oil changes, DEF add cost but just negligible, diesel EGR service is expensive, but so are turn ups and whatnot for gas engines. Basically, it comes down to how hard you work your truck. With diesel, you get significantly better mpg whiles towing and hauling, along with longer brake life. However, if you don't do much with your truck, you'll never see the payback.
One of the biggest pains with towing a big trailer with a gas truck is it's not always easy to find a gas station you can fit in. Alot easier to just pull into any truck stop and get diesel.
DIESEL 100%! I just went to St Augustine florida from northern VA in ONE TANK OF GAS ⛽️. I have a 2023 F250! Most amazing trick ever. So much towing power! Love it 😍 😊
The new 6.6l gas Chevy pulls 20,000 lbs and has more payload depending on package and rearend. I pull a 15,000 lbs 5th wheel with no issues. Timbren springs really improved stability as well.
I tow a 12500lbs 5th wheel keystone with my 16 ram 2500 6.4l 4x4. I went with a gas. Sure a diesel would tow better but I want reliability. Every diesel I've had in the past 10 years has eaten my checking account up. Diesels are just not that reliable anymore.
I have a 2018 ram 3500 gasser. No real complaints except when towing up steep grades. Still averaging about 8 mpg. Wish the transmission had the 8 gears like the newer ones.
@@pete9026 it don't help has much you would think. Still pulls up hill a 7200lb camper at 45-5000 rpm at 65mph. Cruising on flatter ground at 70mph stays around 2300rpm
My brother tows a 16k 5th wheel with a 7.3 gas engine. It holds its own and doesn’t complain until you get to altitude. It has really complicated my thought process on what my next truck will be.
I agree with a lot of what you said. Another point that’s worth adding is if the truck also serves as a daily driver what kind of driving conditions will it be driven in. For me, I have a relatively short trip to work so my truck gets driven 30 miles a day. That’s a little tough on new diesels with their emissions and one of the main reasons I chose a gas engine this time around. I have a 2022 Chevy 2500 with the 6.6 gas. I had a 2020 Chevy 2500 with the Duramax. It got about 2 mpg better both empty and towing my enclosed car trailer. So the fuel mileage difference is not nearly as much as people think. Atleast mine wasn’t. Payload is not that much different in the GM trucks however because of the increased GVWRs. Most gas trucks have a 10650 GVWR and most diesels have a 11350 GVWR. So that’s not much of a concern with GMs.
Until last week I had a 2019 F-150 FX4 3.5L EB and it came with engine break. I loved it. In 4 years I only drove it less than 18k miles. To increase my payload now I am looking for a F250 6.2 gas. Is going to be more than enough... at least for me.
Hey JD, I recently traded my 2018 6.2 F-250 for a 2019 6.7 F-250. I’ve had some work done to the engine, and unloaded the truck gets 24MPG at a cruise of 60MPH. The truck has had a 600HP tune for about 6 months now with no issues. I run hotshot secret EDT and I’ve also covered a square hole in the air filter housing that allows the engine to intake hot air from the engine bay. That also helps the fuel mileage of the 6.7L.
The diesel arms race means the overall durability of the engines isn’t what it used to be. Sticker shock has led me to keep a 7.3 liter diesel way longer than I should’ve. I’m likely to go from a 7.3 liter diesel to a 7.3 liter gas.
Even with the cost of diesel, I am very happy that we have a '20 F350 DRW Powerstroke. It is a beast and makes this #flatlander capable of pulling our 43' 14k fifth wheel through the Rockies. The pulling power is amazing, but what has made the biggest difference is the engine/exhaust brake. That is the benefit of the diesel motor that I would miss the most. And I make these comments AFTER a 4,000 mile trip to California, spending about $2300 on just fuel.
It’s not just the added cost of purchasing a diesel truck and diesel fuel. It’s the cost of DEF then the additional cost and maintenance of the after treatment, on a consistent basis our diesel’s require some kind of maintenance on the after treatment. Our diesel vehicles are far more costly to maintain than gas.
Talking about safety with exhaust brakes,…I started thinking about the Jake Brake on the converted Kenworth that I used to own. When going down steeper hills,…I’d only have to downshift one full gear. All other hills was 17th gear, or just let it Jake Brake in 18th.
Another thing to consider is the repair cost when it breaks. I had an '89 Chevy van with the 6.2 diesel and the fuel pump started leaking one day. It was difficult to find a repair shop, and was very expensive to have it rebuilt. My '14 Chevy van has the 6.0 gas engine and tows my 7,000lb travel trailer just fine. Any reasonably competent mechanic can repair it and parts are cheap and easy to find. Personally, having had both I would only buy a diesel if my trailer was so large there was no gas option to pull it.
Maintenance, Def refuel, parts, yes price on Diesel, purchase price off the start, pay load, hard fine diesel in remote areas, and winter start can be a problem..Better off with gas if towing under 5 ton..My opinion..
This is my second year with a 41 foot 5th wheel,, I Love fueling at truck stops ( pull throughs) I couldn't imagine swinging that trailer around gas pumps! They are so crowded and everyone is in a hurry.
I got a 2005 f-250 6.0 diesel King Ranch with 241k miles on it. It has heavy duty rear suspension and i tow a 2022 Grand Design Reflection 31mb with it. When towing i get between 10 and 12 mpg and when im not towing i get about 17 mpg.
I miss my 3.0l Sierra, downsized back to a Tacoma. Currently my town diesel is 5.79 and gas is 4.60. And Ct just increased the tax on diesel by 9 cents.
The difference in fuel economy is hands down worth the $10k. Up here in Canada diesel is $9.07/gal. My 2020 Super Duty F250(HCTTP) 4x4. Just the truck is getting average 22-24mpg on the highway. 13mpg towing a 8500lb fifthwheel and a 3500lb second trailer. I test drove 4 different 7.3s and NOT ONE could hold a candle to the 6.7 and my towing mileage is near the empty milage of the 7.3.
Don’t forget also that when you buy a heavy duty truck, most people keep them for quite a while. After 10 years and let’s assume about 180 to 200,000 miles the diesel will be worth quite a bit more that’s when you make your money back.
i have an 2021 f350 7.3 gas srw 4.30 gears crewcab 8 ft long box lariat towed 600 miles at 11,000 lbs trailer load with a 2020 f250 6.7 l turbo diesel srw 3.73 gears 6ft box crewcab lariat loaded the same with 11,000 lbs trailer and we were 1 mpg different in fuel. 10.7 mpg gas vs 11.6 mpg diesel , absolutely game changer , the f350 weighs 9100lbs (2250 heavier) the way i have it optioned up . the diesel weighs 6850 lbs . we since traded the diesel for another gas 7.3 .
Where I live in Colorado, the price of the lowest octane gas is about 50 cents less than diesel, but the price of premium gas is about 40 cents more than diesel. Mid grade and high grade gas is very expensive, much like diesel, so that really affects the choice.
I see alot of companies using gasser duallys for their service trucks, i got a gasser 1 ton and its great for the payload. I never tow so it works out as intended.
all depends on where you live and how they treat emissions, I'm in Cali and its very irritating, especially working on a military base where all they have is hummvee and five tons blowing diesel no def
Gas is $2 per gallon cheaper than diesel here in Tennessee. And when I was touring Australia the savings in diesel was completely destroyed by the extra servicing costs for diesel.
If you're more concerned about payload than you don't tow enough to warrant a diesel. Anyone that tows knows that there is not a lot of weight on the hitch if it is balanced correctly. If you want that long bed and high payload than towing isn't your main priority. I used to think 3/4 ton gassers were the most useless things I've ever seen. You're paying for the body of a towing vehicle then getting a gas engine that kills it towing capacity. It's so backwards just get a 1/2 ton w/ a towing package, but now that the price of diesel is so high it starts to make more sense. I've also never seen the need for such a high payload if equipment can be easily moved in a trailer. Maybe if you're using a utility bed that makes sense but I haven't heard of one of those weighing 4k lbs.
Love my 7.3 250. I don't tow over 10k, and runs around town and idles, would be worried doing that with modern emissions. If I towed more often and heavier I would go diesel.
I have an 01 5.9 Cummins with 107,500 miles. I will never get rid of it. No emissions crap. Yes it really hurt last month when I filled it up but he said in his video he has a daily driver as do I. Ford Escape. The sheer power and torque of a diesel is unmatched. Also the sound of my 4” straight exhaust is awesome.
@@SteelJM1 Yes but mine is not stock. 67mm CW/TW turbo, 4” straight back exhaust, 150hp injectors, Quadzilla V2 tuner, upgraded auto tranny with billet torque converter, ARB AirLocker differential.
Many of the newer gas models offer the ability to use cruise control while towing and offer a good amount of engine breaking. TFL tested a F350 7.4 on their Ike Gauntlet test not too long ago towing about 13K. It offered some of the best engine "breaking" out of many of the trucks they have tested including diesels. They don't use cruise control when doing this test and the cruise control system is actually supposed to offer even better breaking. That being said, the diesel would be my choice on anything over 18K in weight.
The one thing that you didn’t mention in gas versus diesel at least I didn’t pick it up… Was longevity of the engine. With the gas truck it’s likely to last me 280,000 miles. With a diesel it’s very likely I can go 480,000. The investment that you’re putting into the purchase price can be extended into twice the life of the vehicle. It’s makes it worth it to go diesel. At least It should be factored in the decision.
Other bigger issue with modern diesels is the exaust after treatment system that will leave you stranded on the highway someday, maybe on Christmas night travels like me and my wife. Oh, that was fun!!!
I'm backwards from most people. I own an ex U-Haul 2005 GMC C-5500 8.1 gas with 26' flatbed and a 2005 Volkswagen beetle TDI. I only use the GMC for hauling 10k lbs of pallets and use the VW for daily.
I bought a 19 f350 lariat diesel with 23k miles last October for $65k. I traded it last week and dealer gave me $70k in trade. Said they just can’t get HD trucks on the lot. I sold my heavy travel trailer and went back to F150.
When you say "towing" (regarding mileage) does that also include heavy payload situations, like carrying a heavy truck camper in the bed? If not, then getting a gasser for that situation is a double bonus, since it would allow for a heavier payload while also getting better mileage.
That's not exactly towing since the weight is primarily being carried over the axle and not pulled behind it. That said, it certainly is a comparable situation in terms of wear on the truck.
@@BigTruckBigRV Cool, thanks for the response! Does that mean similar mileage to towing as well? Apologies if this is one of those things "everyone knows", I've never owned a truck and have zero clue.
I'm not a big believer in changing big ticket items because some other factor changed. I made a decision and I live with it. Usually, the cycle flips back anyhow.
There’s so many aftermarket packages that are cheaper than from the Stealerships! With enough horsepower a gas engine that’s large enough with twin turbos can make diesel torque!! You can also down to them for a few icon me when you’re not towing something heavy!?
2021 7.3 dually with 4:30 gears. Under 20,000 pounds it’s a game changer no need for a diesel. No other gas competition in this category. The 10 speed is magic. My 5th wheel is right at 18,000 and live in western North Carolina mountains. Never have to push it hard. Great setup. Cheaper to buy cheaper to maintain and time in service is non existent compared to any diesel. 7.3 and 10 speed will work for 80% of all people pulling out there.
Your 💯 % correct. This new 7.3 gas engine with the 10 speed is a game changer. Most these guys with a diesel are just mall crawling anyway.
I am looking at the 7.3 dually with 4.3 as an option for me. It will not be a daily driver but I am still wondering about unloaded and loaded mileage. What are you getting?
@@slaytanic921 un loaded at 75mph I’m at 15.5 to 16. Loaded idk yet. Around town I’m at 9.5
@@beerbelly6670 awesome, long bed crew cab? How are tire rotations with the extra wheels?
@@slaytanic921 I’m a short box srw. With 4:30 gears. It has been a power house so far. Very impressed with the acceleration on the freeway
2022 F350 with 7.3, 4.30 gears, standard bed pulls my 16,500 5er just fine! Only been in the midwest so far but have spent plenty of time in big hills of the Ozark mountains. I'm watching my towing/payload weights carefully as we are full timers. Payload is plenty at 4K and the truck has ZERO issues pulling my RV! Very happy with the choice I made!
I went with a gas 2500 HD (6.6 L) to pull my 13k 5th wheel. Getting about 8 MPG. It handles it just fine, but down shifts a lot going uphill. The biggest issue I have with it is not being able to go through the truck lanes to refuel. It is an absolute nightmare when getting close to E and having to navigate the crowded narrow gas lanes to refuel with the 5th wheel attached.
Agreed - been in some pretty funny (as in not-funny!) refueling situations with our gas pickup and long trailer.
I've ran out of gas several times, when the light comes on you better be looking for a gas station
That's why I love Bucees. Plenty of room at the gasoline pumps
You gotta be aggressive at the gas stations. People wont give you the time of day, but you're the one with the combined 23000lbs
The fixing that issue is getting a trailer with two landing gears and not one. Take 3 trailers would be an issue. All you have to do is drop the trailer… fill and go back to the Diesel pad to connect and go.
My neighbor owns a diesel repair shop. He has a large 5th wheel and bought a gasser for his tow vehicle. He said newer diesels don’t last like the pre-emission trucks did and they are expensive to repair.
Gas has always been an acceptable option for towing. Diesel of course is the end all answer to towing, but gas towing only briefly stopped being a "thing" in the mid to late 2000s because of advances in diesel tech and the diesel trucks becoming top of the line luxury models.
A good example is the truck that rolled into our shop a few days ago to get a hitch. Late 90s dually crew cab chevy with a big gas motor, that the guy was going to use to tow a fifth wheel that had a 16700 gvwr. Plenty capable, plenty doable. Heck, towing with a full size car or wagon was common up into the 90s.
If your issue is going up and down hills, slow down and downshift. How you drive > any advantage diesel or gas may provide.
100%. I have the same thing, a '98 Chevy crew cab dually with the 454. Buddy has an 03 CTD. We can keep up with each other just fine. Maybe if we both towed at the top of our tow ratings, he might do a bit better, but we don't. He does get 2x the fuel mileage I do, empty or loaded, but the premium he paid for the truck will buy me a LOT of gasoline.
Ultimately, we're both very happy with our trucks, and that's what matters.
@@om617yota8 This. You can debate specifications and theories all day long, but either one will work for you unless you're absolutely maxing out your trucks towing capacity.
Your points are spot on ! Over the last 45+ years I have owned numerous trucks & rv's. My 2021 F350 was ordered with a 7.3l. I did not want a diesel. I am currently towing a 9k # tt . We recently returned from a 4k mile trip over hills & mtns with a friend that has a GMC diesel & simular tt. He averaged ~1.5 mpg'd better, but was paying $.70 to $1 more per gal than I was as well. I can buy a lot of gas for the $9k+ upfront additional diesel engine, option let alone the fuel difference. I had no issues keeping up or down hills & mtns. If I were towing over 12k # then I'd get one. The accountant in me has looked up a 4 & 5 year old trucks and compared the average list price new vs current value. Yes the diesel sells for more but it cost more to begin with. You're still facing the same % of depreciation though. So you are not gaining anything.
Well reasoned and explained 👍
Just traded my 17 250 diesel for a 22 250 7.3. Was nervous about the towing experience but have been truly impressed. I need my truck more for higher payload than towing capacity so it made sense to go gas this time. With the ten speed transmission it keeps the rpm’s lower so your engine isn’t screaming up hills like gas engines of the past. So far in my calculations if diesel stays 50 cents more a gallon than regular gas. I come out ahead having a gasser in costs per mile. Obviously everyone uses there trucks differently and will have different outcomes but I am very happy with my truck so far. Also you said how everyone loves that diesel sound, I would say I am much preferring this gas engine sound over the diesel. I also don’t miss the oily diesel pumps.
What's your payload capacity?
@@denverbasshead I have a 2020 F350 7.3 Crew cab payload is 4104 hitch rated 15k gooseneck/5er 20k F250 should be 1k less
@@denverbasshead '21 F-250 Tremor. 7.3L with 4.30 gears. Payload is 2770. 15k bumper pull, 18.7k 5th wheel. Rumor has it that Tremor 3/4 and 1 tons are the same truck, but tagged different for registration purposes.
@@jaynen ok cool, my 250 is a crew cab long bed with the 7.3 and mine is 3003
3005 lbs. old truck was 2100
So timely a discussion! I think most people looking to buy a truck are considering what they plan to tow and may be making decisions to go with something smaller or lighter that a well-equipped gas truck can safely tow. If camping only on weekends or one big summer trip, the gas truck, if also used as a commuter truck, may be the better choice for the next couple years, especially if resale value holds.
Agreed. the exhaust brake is by far the best towing accessory.... I can tow my 5th wheel 16k# down a 5% grade and never use my mechanical brakes.. it auto holds speed...
After owning a diesel I don’t see myself going back to a gas truck. Fuel is more expensive but I love the power and sound of my Cummins with some parts missing
I’ve owned both and my current set up is a 2007 F250 gas with the V10 and 6 speed manual transmission, I absolutely love it, I pull my travel trailer, my boat or farm equipment, trailer weights are from 5000 to 14000 and it handles them all very well. It’s cheaper to maintain and operate and my mpg runs between 8 mpg (heaviest trailer) and 13 mpg (empty at highway speed). Oh, my truck has 4:10 gears. I only drive my truck around 5000 miles per year, I have a company truck that I drive the majority of time.
I have a '21 F-250 Tremor with the 7.3L and 4.30 gears. I get 15mpg at highway speed unloaded. 14.5 mpg on the interstate.
I think the technology of the new diesel trucks have really made a difference in the maintenance costs and decisions people make. The old 7.3 and 12 valve Cummins where very easy to work on and the parts are cheap and readily available.
Another relevant video. I have a 6.7 Power Stroke and yes I love it. However it was our choice when we were pulling a 16k lbs toy hauler. We've moved back to a TT and this F350 Power Stroke is overkill and expensive to run and maintain.
It would be different if today's diesels we're damn near bullet proof like they were 20 years ago but that just no longer the case.
If trucks ever become more reasonable I'll trade in for a 7.3 gasser.
Well done again JD. You've become my favorite RUclipsr.
I currently own a 22 Ram 3500 6.7 CTD (standard output). I previously owned a Ram 2500 6.4. On the highway/interstate I get 21+ mpg out of the diesel. I couldn't have dreamed of getting anything better than 16-17 mpg's out of the 6.4. Towing I was getting around 7.5 - 8.5 with the gas and I now get 10.5 - 11.5 with the diesel (towing a 38' 5th wheel around 12,500 pounds). Just throwing this out here for people since I've experienced both in the last year. The gas was a great, capable truck, but she drank fuel like crazy.
I just purchased a “daily driver” 2020 GMC 1500 SLT with the 3.0 Diesel, I just like diesels. I will keep my F250 diesel for pulling the fifth wheel.
In the end thats all it is. Sheer preference.
Timely video. When I’m ready to retire and travel more I’ll probably upgrade to 3/4 for extra payload on longer trips. My TT is around 6k as I travel with max rating of 7k. Even before the surge I was leaning to 7.3l and don’t see me going for diesel. I’d also rather have extra payload in truck vs heavier engine. Gas is definitely option some folks should consider in a superduty.
I can remember when diesel fuel was cheaper than gas. I’m not an old man either.
It happened way back in 04 after the hurrican Katrina gas spike, it didn't last very long though
I remember. It was right before I bought my first diesel truck. But the reason I’ll never buy another, they are garbage now, even the GM motors.
Just picked up a 22 F-250 godzilla and love it. I've always wanted a new 6.7 powerstroke but I decided gas was a better option for me. I'm planning on buying a bumper tow toy hauler for camping, with my sxs and all loaded up it will be between 11-12k. I had an f 150 ecoboost that had a bunch of power but that kind of weight is not safe with a half ton. I've been impressed with the power and towing capability of the 7.3 gas. I will only tow heavy a handful of times per year so saving 10K over buying the diesel was a good option. I was also able to get into a nicely loaded lariat for less than a base XLT powerstroke. I also did not want to deal with the maintenance of a new diesel, down the road when I have more available time to tow more often maybe I'll get a diesel but for now the gas was just a smarter option for me.
Used to do this with the trash bins all the time with an ATV. And then used two S-Hooks from straps with a steel ring holding them together to pull the second one.
This was my biggest debate when I got my truck. I ended up with a ram 14 2500 6.4 with the 4.10 gears mb 6 years ago. I can currently sell my truck for what I paid for it. My TT was only 7500lbs and I really don't tow that much. Perfect truck for my needs. Buy the truck for your needs, not fuel prices.
You can sell it for what you bought it for 6 years ago..?
@Midwest Entertainment I got mine used for $30k. Has110,000 miles on it
My 7.3 godzilla does fine and I don't have to use unicorn piss in the exhaust
My diesel truck doesn't use it either.
@@GMCJay_lly same here.
Also it sounds better :P
The biggest trailer I tow is a 7x16 utility trailer and loaded to the max it weight is about 9500 pounds which my F250 with the 6.2L gas engine can tow no problem.
I think a lot of people think that diesel engines are more robust than gas engines. Modern diesel engines that require DEF fuel are not as relabel as older diesel engines. If you are towing a heavy trailer a diesel engine is required but check out well maintained older rigs. For towing lighter trailers stay with gas engine. Modern gas engines are better than older gas engines. This has been my experience and two cents worth.
I've been in a dilemma about the issues you covered. What a great job you did! Thanks
Spot on with the weight range. I went with a gas 2500HD since I’m pulling a 11,000 travel trailer. Anything heavier would definitely need a diesel. When I bought my truck the difference between gas and diesel models was closer to $20k.
I tow 10,000 lbs 50 hours a year with a F250 gas and I live very close to work. That's all I use the truck for so gas fits my lifestyle perfectly. Thanks for the great video.
And yes lots of payload with gas and that's was important for me because I can carry four passengers, generator and wood along with pin weight and still have room.
Thanks for the clear, concise information! It’s very helpful. I’m researching a 1 ton dually rig for a truck camper. I appreciate your videos!
sorry add more think about I have see youtubes get flat bed truck and welding brackets to hole the truck camper down. plus side you can make cablet on side of truck camper ( where truck side would be )
Watch runaway roses channel
I would probably get a gasser if you're also not going to be towing a lot. You'll get the higher payload that you need for the camper with a gas truck.
Honestly I wish Ford would sell me a F450 for the better turning radius but with the 7.3
Another benefit of a diesel truck is having the ability to fill up at a truck stop in the truck lanes.
My experience in a turbocharged diesel, is fuel mileage is much more dependent on how you drive compared to a gasoline engine.
Yup! Also crunch the numbers... There are additional costs of a diesel to consider (e.g. oil change) however this can help in making the decision. "Miles to break even" = "cost of diesel engine option" / ("diesel cost per gallon" / "diesel mpg" - "gas cost per gallon" / "gas mpg")
Don't forget emissions, If that DPF filter gets clogged or breaks you're looking anywhere from 4 to 10k dollars getting it replaced. I have a 2014 Chevy Cruze 2.0l diesel and just this week was quoted 3k dollars to get the dpf filter replaced, at 130k miles. I found a company that cleans dpf filters and they cleaned it up for 550 dollars but I had to take it off and then put it back on myself, or you have to pay a shop to do that which would probably be another 500 dollars. I talked to the guys cleaning the dpf filter and they said they do a lot of work for semi drivers who get their stuff cleaned every 100k miles, probably just as preventive maintenance so they don't get stranded, but if you assume something similar on a diesel truck that's probably 1,500 or more every 100k miles just another cost to consider. Plus the actual dpf fluid. If it was 2017 and you could still just get deleted at your local mechanic that'd be one thing but not anymore unless you really know someone who trusts you.
Just picked up a 2022 f350 dually with the 7.3 and 430 gears. Can’t wait to hook up my 13,000 lb fifth wheel and test it out. Coming from a 99 dually it should be night and day. I really hope I don’t regret not getting the diesel.
Please keep us updated on your new truck. I just ordered the same setup (dually F350 7.3 4:30). I will be towing a 14k FW. I am really interested in how it performs.
Yes, keep us posted. This is the setup I am looking at.
I will be towing a 5th wheel that is 8,300 pounds empty but want the payload to load a toy on a roof deck over the cab.
Won’t be my daily driver but am interested in empty and loaded mileage.
If you regret it call me just what Im loiking for
Just got my goose box on the fifth wheel and took it for a test run with the new 7.3. Boy was I impressed by the performance of this truck. I don’t regret it at all. The run was from vegas south towards phoenix and back. It was mostly hills and interstate. Truck did well and 10 speed was more than capable of handling the 13000 lb rig. 430 gears was the right choice I think.
Hello JD. Great video, and great challenge! We did the work, and went HD Diesel. Price of entry? Steep but manageable. We gave ours a name: (La Bête = The Beast in English). We attached our ORV HD TT (La Belle = The Beauty in English). Price of Diesel: high everywhere! Price of our lives when towing? Priceless! Peace of mind while towing… always! Safe driving friends = no price can be put on security! Remi (Canada)
I have a 2019 2500hd 6.0 gas, the trailer is a 297qb, going down hill the Trans brake kicks in, and does a good job, but like you said. The exhaust brake is better, have no issues towing. Love my set up
I have an F150 and a 2500 with a Duramax. We go to south Florida for fishing trips each year and I pull a 21' bass boat. Not heavy for sure but I have made the trip 20 times in the past using the 2500. This year I switched to the F150. Similar mpg but gas prices are $1 or more lower than diesel. That adds up on a 1500 mile trip.
Another thing is that so many truck stops are just tiny. The F150 is a bit more "nimble" in tight spots.
I’ve just slowed down recently, 60mph gets me good mileage and I generally never have to slow down. It sucks at first but isn’t so bad once you get used to it.
In a way it is very nice (slowing down). Now (you're) driving slow enough for good mileage and let all the "crazy" drivers fly by you because they have to go somewhere, but not so slow that "a stick in the mud" as long as you stay to the right side of the road (in the US). 🙂
In south Texas the fuel prices are not as steep as other areas such as CA, gas or diesel.
In my opinion there is zero reason to buy a 3/4 ton diesel. You lose 1000 lbs of payload with a diesel leaving you with 1800-2100 of total payload. That's going to severely limit what you can tow. Forget about a 5th wheel or gooseneck unless it's a really light one. 2 adults and some tools in the cab and you have about 1500 lbs of payload left to work with. Fine for a decent sized travel trailer, but a well equipped 1/2 ton could pull it as well. At least with a gas 3/4 ton you have 3000 lbs or more of payload to work with. That opens up some decent sized 5th wheels as an option. As long as you can keep pin weight around 2300-2400 lbs. Anyways, that's my opinion on 3/4 ton trucks.
3/4 ton short bed diesel trucks are the most useless thing I've ever seen people spend money on lol. At least get the long bed, but yeah going to a 1 ton might be a couple thousand dollars more but you're really opening up your payload capacity.
I have a 2018 GMC Sierra Crew Cab Long Bed SLE 4x4 6.0l gasser payload is 4k pounds max towing is 14k pounds, unless it's some kind of weirdly loaded trailer you can not max out the payload if you stay at 14k pounds or less. It's the perfectly balanced truck like all trucks should be but these guys wanna tow 17k pounds with their 3/4 ton diesel truck with a short bed extended cab on rubber band tires, a 6" lift and the hood praying to Jesus lol. Obviously they failed math class.
My wife's diesel 250 has a payload of 2747 pounds.
@@Ken_Koonz That is pretty good for a 3/4 diesel. Many of the 3/4 diesel trucks I looked at had payloads of 1900 to 2200 lbs. My 350 diesel lariat had 3600lb payload. Just depends how much payload you need. In my case the tongue weight of the travel trailer and gear we wanted to bring required a hefty payload number.
My 2021 F250 diesel has a payload capacity of 2795lbs.
@@danielfalcon1989 Is Ford increasing the GVWR of the new 250's over 10,000 lbs? What trim package is your 21 250 6.7?
My experience (2013 f250 work truck with 6.2 gas engine), the truck runs out of suspension before running out of motor. Tow 12-13,000 with it and haul as much as 4000 in the bed. Neither done daily. If I were to tow much more, I would want a diesel, but also the extra suspension and tires on a dually.
I have a RAM 3/4 ton with 6.4 Hemi and 3.73 gears. My toy hauler is 7800lbs dry and 11k-12k loaded. The camper weight loaded vs unloaded makes almost no difference in fuel mileage or strain on the motor. The wind makes all the difference, though. The hemi doesn't like fighting the wind. I get 5-7.5mpg with the camper depending on wind.
That is some super information JD. I am like you, I have the option to use our GMC Terrain. Because of the cost of diesel I have been thinking of selling our RV and trading my truck for a mid size gas truck. That totally tick me off. I get the best mileage I have even gotten with truck with my diesel truck gets when not towing 14.9 to 15.6 MPG. I never got that good of mileage with a gas engine truck. Thanks for all the video reviews you do and I really enjoy watching the improvements around your new property. Thanks JD
I would add how often and how far you plan on traveling makes a big difference in engine choice. If you are camping 2 or 3 times a year and traveling less than 300 miles I would consider a gas a lot higher in the current market.
definitely this, especially with the mountains. Ive seen diesels get up to 5-6mpg difference in real world testing while towing. When you go on trips 800+ miles that makes a difference and this huge price difference won't stay forever. Not to mention the peace of mind of knowing my brakes are 100% in the mountains because of the exhaust brake.
Where I live in Crescent City, CA it costs me $145 to fill my 04 F250 with the V10. It tackles any task that I throw at it. It’s also easy to work on vs a diesel in my opinion.
Bucket on the tractor and a strap is my favorite method for moving the trash to the street. I can put them both in the bucket and drop em right where they need to be
I have farms and we haul a lot so our trucks are 2500 diesels. The current Duramax diesels we operate get 17 mpg in daily running and 21 mpg at highway speeds (empty and no trailer). I would love to operate 1/2 ton gassers but they don't haul.
If I am towing under 10K, I will opt for the gas engine unless I am towing most of the time. I will be content to let the engine rev up the grades. The difference in fuel costs and dramatic increase in maintenance costs for diesel makes it a no brainer for me.
Great video! Can you do an update video on your front/rear bumpers? Wanted to see how well they are holding up, would you paint them again, and would you buy again?
I've had a 2020 F250 7.3 Tremor since Jan 2020. Tows a 30ft toy hauler loaded about 9500lbs. Tall and widebody trailer with zero issue. Glad I went 7.3
I went with a f350 with the 7.3 gas and 4.30 gears 15mpg empty and 10.5mpg pulling 14k dump trailer.
If you go over 26,000 gcvwr you will need a class A CDL. with this truck that means a max trailer weight of 15,000lbs.
Something to consider if you do not have a CDL.
You only need a CDL if towing commercially/for hire. There are many people out there hauling over 26000 GCWR with no CDL. Some states do require a different license when towing that heavy.
You are very wrong about the need for a class A or B CDL for an RV, any RV. An RV is exempt by the FMVSA from needing a CDL regardless of weights.
You can tow with a class 8 tractor not for hire or private vehicle no cdl
The solution is a pre-emissions diesel
They are going the way of dinosaurs now. Extinct
@@MrRod632 No, they aren’t
Pre emission diesels re sale has gone way up after the epa crack down on deleting my 2001 f350 is selling for more than the original sticker price
I bought mine 2022 ram 3500 diesel because I was towing my 13k 5th wheel, well now I traded my fiver in for a 2022 gas motorhome so now I really don't need to pull heavy and going with gas will be a good ideal. I like my diesel ram and I will probably keep it but just drive it less, I just bought a new Hyundai Venue to tow behind my MH so I might just drive that more. Awesome video sir I love your channel.
I have a 2020 F450 with a 68 gallon upgraded tank. Yes it hurts to fill my tank, but I tow a 14k 5th wheel all over the country many times in the mountains. The piece of mind and safety factor of having an exhaust brake and the torque of a diesel motor pulling through the mountains far outweigh the savings of a gas engine equivalent truck. Possibly having more payload and towing capacity with a gas engine HD truck sounds great on paper, but stopping or braking that rig in the mountains would be a nail biting experience in my opinion. I will always go with a diesel. There is no price to pay for safety. Plus getting gas at a gas station vs diesel at a truck stop with a large 5th wheel would be a nightmare getting in and out of the station.
Currently I'm towing a 6000lbs with a '99 f350 6.8L V10 is typically OK except for uphill at altitude since the truck is screaming with wide-open throttle and I'm losing 5-10mph speed-wise. I love that truck to death but it's still doesn't have the grunt that a diesel may have potentially. While at the pump it's still painful since it gets 10-12mpg unladen and about 5-7mpg towing.
0:17 Thank you! This will really help a family member of mine when I’m not able to take out their trash.
Even when the price of fuel between gas and diesel is the same, the cost of ownership is still less with gas than it is with diesel. The question that needs to be answered should always be, do I need the extra towing capacity of the diesel for the type of trailer and terrain I am towing.
You can buy an entirely brand new 7.3 godzilla crate motor straight from ford for the 8k more the powerstroke costs over it new
Depending on your mileage, that's not going to be true. Say a diesel gets 11.0 mpg towing, and gasser gets 8.0 mpg doing the same. At $5/gallon for gasoline vs $6/gallon for diesel, you'd still see a payback with diesel in about 100k-150k. For me, that's about 5 or 6 years of driving, since I drive my truck for work. But since diesel isn't always more expensive, I doubt it will remain that much more expensive, you will see a payback likely much sooner.
Also, there's other cost savings, mainly brakes. With a diesel exhaust brake, I'd burn through front brakes every 20k miles, rear brakes a little longer. With an exhaust brake, I could more than double or even triple the life of my brakes, which is thousands in savings over a 150k miles, which alone pays for the diesel premium.
Other things are more expensive with diesel, but that's give and take. Oil changes, DEF add cost but just negligible, diesel EGR service is expensive, but so are turn ups and whatnot for gas engines.
Basically, it comes down to how hard you work your truck. With diesel, you get significantly better mpg whiles towing and hauling, along with longer brake life. However, if you don't do much with your truck, you'll never see the payback.
This. Towing is a pricey thing to do considering what you need to do it safely and mileage you get doing it with gas or diesel.
One of the biggest pains with towing a big trailer with a gas truck is it's not always easy to find a gas station you can fit in. Alot easier to just pull into any truck stop and get diesel.
I bought 2500 hd diesel for my landscaping company and it is totally worth it, you can pull more and you get at least 30% more mpg
DIESEL 100%! I just went to St Augustine florida from northern VA in ONE TANK OF GAS ⛽️. I have a 2023 F250! Most amazing trick ever. So much towing power! Love it 😍 😊
The new 6.6l gas Chevy pulls 20,000 lbs and has more payload depending on package and rearend. I pull a 15,000 lbs 5th wheel with no issues. Timbren springs really improved stability as well.
I tow a 12500lbs 5th wheel keystone with my 16 ram 2500 6.4l 4x4. I went with a gas. Sure a diesel would tow better but I want reliability. Every diesel I've had in the past 10 years has eaten my checking account up. Diesels are just not that reliable anymore.
I have a 2018 ram 3500 gasser. No real complaints except when towing up steep grades. Still averaging about 8 mpg. Wish the transmission had the 8 gears like the newer ones.
@@pete9026 it don't help has much you would think. Still pulls up hill a 7200lb camper at 45-5000 rpm at 65mph. Cruising on flatter ground at 70mph stays around 2300rpm
So many good points were covered. Excellent video.
My brother tows a 16k 5th wheel with a 7.3 gas engine. It holds its own and doesn’t complain until you get to altitude.
It has really complicated my thought process on what my next truck will be.
I agree with a lot of what you said. Another point that’s worth adding is if the truck also serves as a daily driver what kind of driving conditions will it be driven in. For me, I have a relatively short trip to work so my truck gets driven 30 miles a day. That’s a little tough on new diesels with their emissions and one of the main reasons I chose a gas engine this time around.
I have a 2022 Chevy 2500 with the 6.6 gas. I had a 2020 Chevy 2500 with the Duramax. It got about 2 mpg better both empty and towing my enclosed car trailer. So the fuel mileage difference is not nearly as much as people think. Atleast mine wasn’t.
Payload is not that much different in the GM trucks however because of the increased GVWRs. Most gas trucks have a 10650 GVWR and most diesels have a 11350 GVWR. So that’s not much of a concern with GMs.
Until last week I had a 2019 F-150 FX4 3.5L EB and it came with engine break. I loved it. In 4 years I only drove it less than 18k miles.
To increase my payload now I am looking for a F250 6.2 gas. Is going to be more than enough... at least for me.
Hey JD, I recently traded my 2018 6.2 F-250 for a 2019 6.7 F-250. I’ve had some work done to the engine, and unloaded the truck gets 24MPG at a cruise of 60MPH. The truck has had a 600HP tune for about 6 months now with no issues. I run hotshot secret EDT and I’ve also covered a square hole in the air filter housing that allows the engine to intake hot air from the engine bay. That also helps the fuel mileage of the 6.7L.
The diesel arms race means the overall durability of the engines isn’t what it used to be. Sticker shock has led me to keep a 7.3 liter diesel way longer than I should’ve. I’m likely to go from a 7.3 liter diesel to a 7.3 liter gas.
Even with the cost of diesel, I am very happy that we have a '20 F350 DRW Powerstroke. It is a beast and makes this #flatlander capable of pulling our 43' 14k fifth wheel through the Rockies. The pulling power is amazing, but what has made the biggest difference is the engine/exhaust brake. That is the benefit of the diesel motor that I would miss the most. And I make these comments AFTER a 4,000 mile trip to California, spending about $2300 on just fuel.
It’s not just the added cost of purchasing a diesel truck and diesel fuel. It’s the cost of DEF then the additional cost and maintenance of the after treatment, on a consistent basis our diesel’s require some kind of maintenance on the after treatment. Our diesel vehicles are far more costly to maintain than gas.
Talking about safety with exhaust brakes,…I started thinking about the Jake Brake on the converted Kenworth that I used to own. When going down steeper hills,…I’d only have to downshift one full gear. All other hills was 17th gear, or just let it Jake Brake in 18th.
Around here in the PNW Gas and diesel are the same price. Right now, diesel is cheaper since gas is over $5 per gallon 6/2023
Another thing to consider is the repair cost when it breaks. I had an '89 Chevy van with the 6.2 diesel and the fuel pump started leaking one day. It was difficult to find a repair shop, and was very expensive to have it rebuilt. My '14 Chevy van has the 6.0 gas engine and tows my 7,000lb travel trailer just fine. Any reasonably competent mechanic can repair it and parts are cheap and easy to find. Personally, having had both I would only buy a diesel if my trailer was so large there was no gas option to pull it.
There's also DEF to consider as part of the fuel cost.
Maintenance, Def refuel, parts, yes price on Diesel, purchase price off the start, pay load, hard fine diesel in remote areas, and winter start can be a problem..Better off with gas if towing under 5 ton..My opinion..
This is my second year with a 41 foot 5th wheel,, I Love fueling at truck stops ( pull throughs) I couldn't imagine swinging that trailer around gas pumps! They are so crowded and everyone is in a hurry.
I got a 2005 f-250 6.0 diesel King Ranch with 241k miles on it. It has heavy duty rear suspension and i tow a 2022 Grand Design Reflection 31mb with it. When towing i get between 10 and 12 mpg and when im not towing i get about 17 mpg.
I miss my 3.0l Sierra, downsized back to a Tacoma. Currently my town diesel is 5.79 and gas is 4.60. And Ct just increased the tax on diesel by 9 cents.
The difference in fuel economy is hands down worth the $10k. Up here in Canada diesel is $9.07/gal. My 2020 Super Duty F250(HCTTP) 4x4. Just the truck is getting average 22-24mpg on the highway. 13mpg towing a 8500lb fifthwheel and a 3500lb second trailer. I test drove 4 different 7.3s and NOT ONE could hold a candle to the 6.7 and my towing mileage is near the empty milage of the 7.3.
3:27 never heard a 454 called a 7.4L lol. The number 454 is just too iconic!
Don’t forget also that when you buy a heavy duty truck, most people keep them for quite a while. After 10 years and let’s assume about 180 to 200,000 miles the diesel will be worth quite a bit more that’s when you make your money back.
Gas engines can make so much more torque than they used to end as much power as you need!!
i have an 2021 f350 7.3 gas srw 4.30 gears crewcab 8 ft long box lariat towed 600 miles at 11,000 lbs trailer load with a 2020 f250 6.7 l turbo diesel srw 3.73 gears 6ft box crewcab lariat loaded the same with 11,000 lbs trailer and we were 1 mpg different in fuel. 10.7 mpg gas vs 11.6 mpg diesel , absolutely game changer , the f350 weighs 9100lbs (2250 heavier) the way i have it optioned up . the diesel weighs 6850 lbs . we since traded the diesel for another gas 7.3 .
Where I live in Colorado, the price of the lowest octane gas is about 50 cents less than diesel, but the price of premium gas is about 40 cents more than diesel. Mid grade and high grade gas is very expensive, much like diesel, so that really affects the choice.
I brought a 2022 F350 XLT crewcab LB 4x4 with a 7.3 fully loaded for 62K
Stop buying used vehicles for msrp,
I see alot of companies using gasser duallys for their service trucks, i got a gasser 1 ton and its great for the payload. I never tow so it works out as intended.
all depends on where you live and how they treat emissions, I'm in Cali and its very irritating, especially working on a military base where all they have is hummvee and five tons blowing diesel no def
Gas is $2 per gallon cheaper than diesel here in Tennessee. And when I was touring Australia the savings in diesel was completely destroyed by the extra servicing costs for diesel.
If you're more concerned about payload than you don't tow enough to warrant a diesel. Anyone that tows knows that there is not a lot of weight on the hitch if it is balanced correctly. If you want that long bed and high payload than towing isn't your main priority. I used to think 3/4 ton gassers were the most useless things I've ever seen. You're paying for the body of a towing vehicle then getting a gas engine that kills it towing capacity. It's so backwards just get a 1/2 ton w/ a towing package, but now that the price of diesel is so high it starts to make more sense. I've also never seen the need for such a high payload if equipment can be easily moved in a trailer. Maybe if you're using a utility bed that makes sense but I haven't heard of one of those weighing 4k lbs.
Love my 7.3 250. I don't tow over 10k, and runs around town and idles, would be worried doing that with modern emissions. If I towed more often and heavier I would go diesel.
I have an 01 5.9 Cummins with 107,500 miles. I will never get rid of it. No emissions crap. Yes it really hurt last month when I filled it up but he said in his video he has a daily driver as do I. Ford Escape. The sheer power and torque of a diesel is unmatched. Also the sound of my 4” straight exhaust is awesome.
The current 7.3 gasser is putting out about as much torque as the late 90's 5.9C's. And more power.
@@SteelJM1 Yes but mine is not stock. 67mm CW/TW turbo, 4” straight back exhaust, 150hp injectors, Quadzilla V2 tuner, upgraded auto tranny with billet torque converter, ARB AirLocker differential.
Many of the newer gas models offer the ability to use cruise control while towing and offer a good amount of engine breaking. TFL tested a F350 7.4 on their Ike Gauntlet test not too long ago towing about 13K. It offered some of the best engine "breaking" out of many of the trucks they have tested including diesels. They don't use cruise control when doing this test and the cruise control system is actually supposed to offer even better breaking. That being said, the diesel would be my choice on anything over 18K in weight.
The one thing that you didn’t mention in gas versus diesel at least I didn’t pick it up… Was longevity of the engine. With the gas truck it’s likely to last me 280,000 miles. With a diesel it’s very likely I can go 480,000. The investment that you’re putting into the purchase price can be extended into twice the life of the vehicle. It’s makes it worth it to go diesel. At least It should be factored in the decision.
Other bigger issue with modern diesels is the exaust after treatment system that will leave you stranded on the highway someday, maybe on Christmas night travels like me and my wife. Oh, that was fun!!!
I'm backwards from most people. I own an ex U-Haul 2005 GMC C-5500 8.1 gas with 26' flatbed and a 2005 Volkswagen beetle TDI. I only use the GMC for hauling 10k lbs of pallets and use the VW for daily.
If only we had a President that could make us energy independent....🇺🇲
Let's go Brandon 🇺🇲
Lmao… We never were energy independent. Go off I guess
Funny how all the energy independent places completely run out of gas and frequently see prices 2-3x greater than what we have here.
I bought a 19 f350 lariat diesel with 23k miles last October for $65k. I traded it last week and dealer gave me $70k in trade. Said they just can’t get HD trucks on the lot. I sold my heavy travel trailer and went back to F150.
When you say "towing" (regarding mileage) does that also include heavy payload situations, like carrying a heavy truck camper in the bed? If not, then getting a gasser for that situation is a double bonus, since it would allow for a heavier payload while also getting better mileage.
That's not exactly towing since the weight is primarily being carried over the axle and not pulled behind it. That said, it certainly is a comparable situation in terms of wear on the truck.
@@BigTruckBigRV Cool, thanks for the response! Does that mean similar mileage to towing as well? Apologies if this is one of those things "everyone knows", I've never owned a truck and have zero clue.
I'm not a big believer in changing big ticket items because some other factor changed. I made a decision and I live with it. Usually, the cycle flips back anyhow.
There’s so many aftermarket packages that are cheaper than from the Stealerships!
With enough horsepower a gas engine that’s large enough with twin turbos can make diesel torque!!
You can also down to them for a few icon me when you’re not towing something heavy!?
We pull a 7000 pound travel trailer. 1/2 ton gas makes more sense to me because 80% is without trailer