that is why i've quitted wow is useless all teams that play have already good teams we need to play with low geared people not going anyfurther this game is useless.
Hard. I tried to sell WOW pvp to many friends with which I play competitive games(mobas, fps...) most of them just can't stand the pace, the complexity, the number of abilities... and with all that you have to level up, gear up... I love this game, especially PVP, but it is just overwhelming for most players.
I'm a wow player and even I can't stand the gear. I really really wish they just made a gearless stand alone version of arena -- I could probably get my friends to actually play that.
haha, absolutely man! if I hadn't checked out Smash's (melee) esports-scene after some random gamescom clip I watched a few years ago, I definitely would have now
I have a very big issue with having not only to memorize the conduits on top of the spells (since there are a bunch of conduits that have some insane interactions like the Feral Frenzy autoproc) but also the fact that certain conduits and abilities on top of everything have a different PvP scaling that is nowhere written until you join arena with exactly the same class and spec yourself. It is fine for the game to be mechanically demanding, but it shouldn't have that many unnecessary things you need to know, it should be designed more intuitive in mind. Like the spinning crane proc, you only see it when you have Weak Aura for that. How does it look at AWC game for a spectator for example? Oh monk does his spin and somebody gets oneshotted. And sometimes instead of getting oneshotted he takes no damage. It is making game complicated where it shouldn't be.
I’m good friends with the guy in RL who played Kidney, a rogue who played on a finals team in one of the first Blizz con competitions. Playing with him was crazy, when he started playing again he was like, “hold up heirlooms help you level?! Sweet! Let me ask some friends for gold to buy them,” so he messaged peekaboo and Hotted, Peeka responded first with enough gold for us both to buy looms but Hotted offered to show him the ropes of what he’d been missing. Kidney was known for stealthing and the /sleeping while stealthed in arena to pop up on people and taking big risks with bigger payoffs. If this was the days of twitch the guy would have had a following but this was when you only watched RUclips video compilations set to music of your favorite players. Ultimately Kidney’s team lost the finals that year he played because the other team just played better. My friend had amazing reaction time not to mention showmanship, but ultimately it only took him so far.
@@drift8021 I was aligning an experience with the point of the video. Kidney’s showboating and risk taking got him noticed and a fan base, his gameplay got him to the final round but ultimately it was the team that had the more well-rounded kit that won the championship.
you don't know what's actually hard then lol. Like any of the games they used as example take a million times more grind to get good at. Past arena glory is one thing but then WoD and beyond arena is just a meme of what it once was.
It is hard so I gave up. Every part of the game is hard. I just let other players kill me in bgs now, nothing I can do about it. Since honor gear is guaranteed and easier to get I got the full set and im done gearing for the entire expac. Cant get conquest gear, can't do mythic plus, can't do raiding outside lfr. Even world content is hard. I give up.
I quit it a few days ago, the amount of time wasted waiting for groups to form and everyone leaving after each match was dreadful,plus switching covs/legendaries is toxic.
Thank you SC! I bought your service during season 1. No gear and new to the game after 6 years. I came late season 1, with 6 weeks left. I just got my duelist last week and setting my sights on gladiator!!!
Bro duelist is fun to get, getting 2.4 50 wins is the nightmare due to lfg. My experience i had to wait 3-4+ hours in lfg to find teammates after duelist
@@thekiller4000s thank you! I am fortunate to have found teammates. Every good session I would ask if they wanted to play again. I meet some glads in Alts that we’re willing to play and I asked a lot questions. All happy to teach:)
11:31 you miss something about this match. There was penalty for barcelona last minute. they more than prooved that a good attack is also a good defense. And that wins titles.
Just like I said on forums; Before watching: You can’t compare WoW skill to another game. They all require different mindsets & awareness. Post Watch: Pretty solid. But saying you need to memorize countless comps & patterns isn’t necessarily true. Patterns aren’t static between players. Also glad you pointed out that you can’t always be a zug player and sometimes need to understand when a game needs to go 10-15 mins. Would’ve also used a lot more SC2 references when going over Aggression vs Defensive. It’s pretty straight forward for people to understand how the same strategy can fail in the same circumstances. And thank you for pointing out that people don’t understand what skill means in this game. I despise people who think that’s a static topic and that “you just have to do x” to be a super insane player. Overall, 9/10. Well done & thought out.
Hey Skill Capped, another excellent video! This truly made me think of an answer to your question of "How can I choose the most consistent option?" and I think I found the optimal solution! Cobra Shot, Flayed Shot, Kill Shot. Oh, and don't forget to backpedal! WoW PvP is really hard, I agree. Even if you have oppressive damage that compensates for lack of game knowledge or mechanical ability, it's most certainly difficult for everyone :)
@@OverlordMoon kk I just dont know how you think bm is that easy when our ladder have a bunch of arms/ww Ye, bm is kinda easy but war/dh/ww is wayyy more easy than bm
@@GuilhermeDishzz Stop right there, war/ww is easier? KEKW. They are more viable than BM are but that doesn't make it any easier. You can easily climb to 2.2k at least even with one button macros cast sequences, that's how braindead BM can be played. As for him not being gladiator (who knows he is), maybe he doesn't have the teammates for it, PUG takes time and patience to reach to gladiator.
Gear-UI-Reflexes if you that out you can compete in WoW. The difference between you and the best becomes a lot more tight. Doesn't you'll win the championship but you'll be good.
I think a better way to put it is how the Fighting game community faces the same problem. It requires a ton of knowledge and alot of experience to get to a place where you can actually start playing the game. Below that point is a ton of cheese and insta gib strats that will absolutely smoke you if you're lacking in the knowledge department on how to deal with it. Fighting games are the same way, if you run into someone who has really good setups and mixups and you can't stop them from getting in you're going to probably get steamrolled into the floor. But if you just anti air all their jumps and check their deceptively unsafe links you're probably gonna win. WoW actually also has the added problem of gear. In games like Injustice 2 nobody plays with gear on because it adds stupid advantages nobody wants to deal with. People could probably actually learn the game if they didnt immediately get erased cause their gear isnt up to par. It's one of the only competitive activities across all of gaming where people actually accept the unfair advantage of gear in a competitive environment.
If they would ease off of the burst, maybe more teams could take the approach of strategy over centering around gogogogogogogogo. Offense excites people but defense feels rewarding.
I don't know i played many mmorpgs and in my experience wow felt very static. The global cd made it depend on learning a rota for diffrent enemy classes. I come from aion and there you have double the amount of skills without any global cd so the game is more about reactions on the enemy than pushing your rota out. In my opinion wow is very slow and depends on learning the right order of your Skills. And everybody just plays human.
I absolutely adore defensive-reactive-strategic play. Which is a big part of why I hate lfg. Everyone wants to play fast and aggro and wind up getting themselves killed. As a mage I have so many strong defensive tools paired with a strong burst window, but it doesn't matter if I can't keep my partner alive. Very frustrating.
Wow takes skill for sure but there is so much important things that you can't control just like rng proc doing crazy dmg. Also you need to learn pretty much all spells in the game (offensive / defensive /utility such as reverse/sanctuary etc and a lot more) and also the covenant/soul bind one. Also you have to play with addon otherwise you can't play the game. And ofc you have to learn how to play your class/spec properly and some like rogue got a ton of macro/spells to keep in mind.
Blizzard's big mistake was choosing arena instead of rbgs for their esport. Wow arena will NEVER lend itself to being viewed in the same way as s tier esports. The problem is that in wow, the micro outplays aren't that obvious to newbie viewers, and making the meta faster does not change that. In rbgs, kills are constantly happening, and even newbies can understand the objectives. Tldr stop destroying arena for the esport dream. Not going to happen. If you're going to make the meta faster, make it reasonable, and do it to make the game more fun for the players, not the viewers.
The conclusion is misleading, especially comparing WoW to chess. In chess both opponents begin on equal footing with equal potential opportunities. With WoW it depends on your comp, and some comps just have more options than others. CC is undeniably powerful in small-scale pvp like arena, and immunity defensives like iceblock or divine shield can be determining factors. Then, there's mobility, which only a few classes possess to the extreme while others lag behind. To conclude that skillful play is "slow and steady" is a generic statement that doesn't consider that some classes are not well-equipped for such an approach. Outlier classes with unique abilities that do not have common counters add an "x-factor" that needs to be considered, and in all of the other games you compared WoW to, none of them allow for such large discrepancies amongst the players. WoW was not designed for small-scale PvP it was designed for BG style pvp. It is unfortunate that we continue pretending that comps like RMP are skillful when they primarily skate by due to having high CC, high defensive/immunities, and high burst AND sustained damage. There is definitely a skill factor involved but it has nothing to do with defensive play or aggressive play - it primarily how well the team coordinates its actions, and whether they are on the same page in terms of how to react to the actions of the opponents. Cheesing wins with "hit-n-run" style play can work, but it doesn't mean you are "skilled". In a boxing match, one guy can choose to keep jogging around the ring avoiding engaging the opponent, only occasionally stepping in for a few shots. Perhaps it wins, but it's hardly testing your skill. Just like shooting someone who challenged you to a fist fight... you "won" the fight but you never tested your hand-to-hand combat skills.
The hard part is finding good players. There's like 1 every 10 players that actually know what they're doing and what enemy team is doing. Some people go for boosts simply to skip the bad players.
They need an alternative version of pvp. Ranked games should take your gear into account. There should also be unranked games where everyone is given a standard ilvl. And let you earn the base conquest sets this way. That way i. ranked you still need to push a high ranking to get the elite sets. But all pvpers can gear and play in a setting where to no life’s don’t have an unfair advantage over normal people with lives.
Wow is easy mode its tab targeting. PVP is all about knowing skills and talents! Plus the meta. It really is that simple. And it's the main reason why most new PVP players don't stick around long enough to learn them all. Reason why so many carries are noticeable. Every casual has left, and the people getting carried are 1800 with gold but couldn't be fucked getting one shot with no teammates with gear.
def hard that's why i love it. i completely abandoned pve starting in SL and it's best decision i've ever made. Went from a 1600 player to a 2.2k player. Still a long long way to go but i'm constantly improving. kinda funny tho i just randomly watched blizzcon 2015 yesterday
Idk, i have mixed feelings about this video. Sure it's 100% how it is on higher levels of play, but all of us, filthy casuals, still exist. And there are a lot of shit in shadowlands, that almost completely nullifies our possibilities: gear difference, overturned specs, etc. It's good overview, but it doesn't mean you won't die to hunter spamming 2 buttons or ww spinning crane kick by applying tips from this video. And devs react so slow with fixing those issues that i, and im sure many others, don't have motivation to get better.
Also boosting. Gear walls are now build so that you have to buy gold and pay a booster if you are average and want good gear. The ranked gear is a thought out money maker. I boosted for a bit and most players are paying for 1400-1600. They just want some gear to make the game manageable. Sad.
omg the Barca vs inter reference seriously made me sad. It is probably something we should advocate. Soccer players or industry make tons of money because billions of people watch soccer, but if every team plays like Mourinho then I deeply think it is bad for the entire industry. And tbh 2009-2010 was a little unfortunate, Ibra kinda isn't a good fit for Barca. If it was 2010-2011 barca i doubt who would win. Also this affect on industry is way more obvious in WoW. Soccer has huge fan base. WoW community is much much smaller comparing to soccer fans. And in BFA, I deeply think C9 alone lowered arena participation by a lot and made WoW community even smaller. The viewer count through last 3 years of AWC decreased quite a lot. Also during 8.2-8.3, everytime I watch C9 game during AWC i just fall asleep. So later on whenever it is c9 i just close the stream and do something else. Then later who meta is pretty dampening so i just stopped watching. By the end of the day, not every person is trying to make a living off WoW. And WoW pro player is probably not enough to make a living comparing to pro players in other game. I play a game to have fun and relieve myself from work/life pressure. Dampening play style is not fun, and does not help me in anyway. I truly believe this play style should not be encouraged at all.
an the skill comes from the gear most games arent balanced to well from what i have seen on 9 classes so far reaching doing only arena. A few stand out that was really easy an others struggle till max gear. regardless ive played for 15 years an have watched wow crumble from lack of dev work. Great game dying from ion an holinka an the new guy. #fireionanholinka lets go
The PvP World of WoW is challenging and if you want to get involved, Just know you gotta get yo ass fucked up before you do the fuckin, To all my fellow PvP mains that made it to high cr, Dont forget what you went through to get there. Remember the Times 💪💯
@@BansheeKing22 the unfortunate reality is that PVP is only for the dedicated and the wicked, to be good at PVP you have to pay your dues, and those dues are paid in *tilt* by seeing the graveyard over and over and over again until one day something in you clicks and you start to destroy everything that comes in your way... And as you do you'll find yourself in a position where nobody will intimidate you in any PVP situation to the point where when you actually go up against your equal or greater it becomes exciting, big names such as Xaryu, Pikaboo, Venruki, Bajheera, Cdew, Hansol etc, They all had to pay their dues when they first started and yes some become good at pvp and some become great but then you have the gifted as listed above, PVP isnt for the weak and if you keep at it you'll eventually become goated, Good luck!
Wow does not care about defense nor does pvp community proof tanks are hated in pvp and never given to much thought. When they do start to shine most of community shuns them and wow nerfs them into unplayable.
A: easy with lots of add-ons and hard af with WoWs insanely limited info Default UI My question: why is hiding basic info so fundamental to WoW default UI? Is this actual complexity or fake and unnecessary hiding of basic info to just SIMULATE complexity? I've failed to convince friends and family to play WoW for years mainly due to them having no clue wtf is even happening when I show them WoW.
idk i just got rid of a few of my addons in favor of a more default wow ui and i actually prefer it. I run a lot of weakauras tho. omnibar, gladius, big debuffs. All you really need
"To become better at wow arena first involves recognizing that you might have a misunderstanding on what skill actually means it's, not just doing things fast but instead doing things well "
there is no compatibility in skill with luck ergo RNG. None of the examples provided have any luck tied to it. Dmg modifiers on top of a x2 crit is the prime win condition in arena; it outshines any play or plays you can do. Whaazz doesnt take less dmg for being whaazz if you hit him for 45k @80% HP he is still going to die even if you are a million times worse of a player than him (and this has been proven time and time again in his streams, same can be said of any WoW pro that still plays). Then if you even live it forces defensive CDs you otherwise would not have been forced to use. Remember AWC pros dying with defensives up? that was actually because there was no reason for them to even pop them; their healers were not in CC, they also had big instant heals and their own defensives up pro players know this, hell even just glad players. But then you just die out of air from full HP and there was not the slightest window for reaction or anything you could've possibly done to counter your opponents' luck. And there is literally 100 billion more combinations in chess than something as unilaterally obvious as WoW; you actually cant memorize them at all chess pros' skill cap is how many moves they can think forward using the least chronometer time because there's so many you can't know out of memory alone that comparison is cringetopia worth tbh. Sorry to say but you're drowning in copium WoW skill-cap is a meme by modern esport standards like mechanical skill doesnt even exist; you can't miss your skills so any 0 cr baboon can burst if they write their swifty macro right.
I didn't like the direction you took with this topic. I was hoping to dive into how many keybinds a rank 1 player uses, how fast you need to press the keys, how many decisions you have to make, etc. and compare that to other games.
I used to love wow's pvp in Legion but since BFA i dont have the time or will to grind for gear. I tried gearing in the beginning of SL but after being crushed during an entire day farming for honor gear i gave up, not a single game i felt usefull for the team, i didnt even felt that i was dealing damage. Not to mention i dont think i killed anyone. I mean, can it really be called pvp when theres a difference in HP/damage between players? I dont think so... I dont wanna make part of a shitty system like this. Hope next expansion they focus on skill based pvp.
The problem with wow pvp is the sellers low gear people can't play arena cause there matched with someone with 250+ item full elite set the wow token is ruining wow and the sellers are making it worse
it is complex and fun. But WOW probably is the only competitive PVP that requires addons to be played properly 😌. I know it is very hard to make MMO PVP be that good, but wow was around for ages. Bliz probably should have figured something out better than this imo.
wow pvp is too complicated, i remember BC and Wotlk (i played hard these extention), each class had 2 ability to remember, now it's like 5 to each specilisation, without counting the basic spell and cc. It's too much i can't stand it.
It's totally fine to enjoy what you enjoy but let's not kid ourselves here... There is good reason why the arena community is so small. Most people aren't going to jump through all the hoops required to be competitive in 3v3 arena... simple as that. Too many hoops...; addons, macros, finding a new team every time you lose... the experience for a new player is terrible... So we still have the same 25-30 people competing at blizzcon every year for the past 15 years lol!
Its the most challenging game and thats why I love it. You can also tell that its hard because 90% of the player base are trash and its hard af to find good players 😂
Its hard. Even harder to find teams.
Soloque dreams.
@Music Account Tried, I got so stressed being mongo'd I resigned to being a dps and leaving better people heal.
It's not that hard, lol.
that is why i've quitted wow is useless all teams that play have already good teams we need to play with low geared people not going anyfurther this game is useless.
@@Neutrinos6 That's the dumbest excuse I've ever heard. How have you made it this far in life with that attitude?
Hard. I tried to sell WOW pvp to many friends with which I play competitive games(mobas, fps...) most of them just can't stand the pace, the complexity, the number of abilities... and with all that you have to level up, gear up... I love this game, especially PVP, but it is just overwhelming for most players.
💯
Getting into a moba is as hard
agreed
I'm a wow player and even I can't stand the gear. I really really wish they just made a gearless stand alone version of arena -- I could probably get my friends to actually play that.
Take away the constant grinding of gear, we would have a bigger player base.
I really enjoy these videos where you dive into the history of WoW arena.
that's the good part of it. They cant even defend current arena but at least we can all look back at the good old days.
Absolutely loving the Smash references lmao
haha, absolutely man! if I hadn't checked out Smash's (melee) esports-scene after some random gamescom clip I watched a few years ago, I definitely would have now
I have a very big issue with having not only to memorize the conduits on top of the spells (since there are a bunch of conduits that have some insane interactions like the Feral Frenzy autoproc) but also the fact that certain conduits and abilities on top of everything have a different PvP scaling that is nowhere written until you join arena with exactly the same class and spec yourself.
It is fine for the game to be mechanically demanding, but it shouldn't have that many unnecessary things you need to know, it should be designed more intuitive in mind.
Like the spinning crane proc, you only see it when you have Weak Aura for that. How does it look at AWC game for a spectator for example? Oh monk does his spin and somebody gets oneshotted. And sometimes instead of getting oneshotted he takes no damage. It is making game complicated where it shouldn't be.
Could'nt agree more to this
I second this. The spinning crane kick example hits the nail on the head
BRO.... well done on this . production, set up speech its pretty f++king good! nice work
Did not expect that Inter Milan reference, I actually got a tattoo to remember their 2010 dream season. That was a good year.
I’m good friends with the guy in RL who played Kidney, a rogue who played on a finals team in one of the first Blizz con competitions. Playing with him was crazy, when he started playing again he was like, “hold up heirlooms help you level?! Sweet! Let me ask some friends for gold to buy them,” so he messaged peekaboo and Hotted, Peeka responded first with enough gold for us both to buy looms but Hotted offered to show him the ropes of what he’d been missing.
Kidney was known for stealthing and the /sleeping while stealthed in arena to pop up on people and taking big risks with bigger payoffs. If this was the days of twitch the guy would have had a following but this was when you only watched RUclips video compilations set to music of your favorite players.
Ultimately Kidney’s team lost the finals that year he played because the other team just played better. My friend had amazing reaction time not to mention showmanship, but ultimately it only took him so far.
Woopty doo?
@@drift8021 I was aligning an experience with the point of the video. Kidney’s showboating and risk taking got him noticed and a fan base, his gameplay got him to the final round but ultimately it was the team that had the more well-rounded kit that won the championship.
@@drift8021 go back to battlegrounds troll.
🔥🔥Awesome vid, the nostalgia hit hard in that one. Wow pvp it's definitely challenging though, big learning curve. Keep itup!
Wow pvp is hard period and even harder for new player but it’s still a lot of fun
you don't know what's actually hard then lol. Like any of the games they used as example take a million times more grind to get good at. Past arena glory is one thing but then WoD and beyond arena is just a meme of what it once was.
@@SH4D0WBattousai Yup, you would know.
It is hard so I gave up. Every part of the game is hard. I just let other players kill me in bgs now, nothing I can do about it. Since honor gear is guaranteed and easier to get I got the full set and im done gearing for the entire expac. Cant get conquest gear, can't do mythic plus, can't do raiding outside lfr. Even world content is hard. I give up.
I finally quit WoW pvp bc of getting flamed by LFG players who I would team up with. It was actually affecting my mental health/confidence
I quit it a few days ago, the amount of time wasted waiting for groups to form and everyone leaving after each match was dreadful,plus switching covs/legendaries is toxic.
playing with a duo mate makes wow so much better
@@keevmcpeef5309 And 99% of people can't do that so....
you can just go play something that's actually skill-based lol. I'd bet a 0-glad boost there's even more melee players than arena players nowdays.
Don’t let those losers affect how you live
Thank you SC! I bought your service during season 1. No gear and new to the game after 6 years. I came late season 1, with 6 weeks left. I just got my duelist last week and setting my sights on gladiator!!!
Bro duelist is fun to get, getting 2.4 50 wins is the nightmare due to lfg. My experience i had to wait 3-4+ hours in lfg to find teammates after duelist
@@thekiller4000s thank you! I am fortunate to have found teammates. Every good session I would ask if they wanted to play again. I meet some glads in Alts that we’re willing to play and I asked a lot questions. All happy to teach:)
Amazing video. Skill capped coming through with quality content.
11:31 you miss something about this match. There was penalty for barcelona last minute. they more than prooved that a good attack is also a good defense. And that wins titles.
Barca got an offside goal so that even it out. Over 2 matches inter killed them by defending so the point is all good.
@@willywonka9785 it was prouved it wasnt
this video is crazy good, thanks a lot for making it
Please continue to make these videos for wow pvp
the real problem nowadays is the game is dead af and you need r1 skills at 1800 cuz noone else is playing anymore
Was waiting for this response. The game is not "dead" people are just tired of SL. Maybe dead content at the moment but not a dead game.
@@GeorgeLennon100 look at the sub numbers bro
@@GeorgeLennon100 yeah so its at least 2 more years dead then next xpac will dropp it will suck again and the game is really dead for ever
My fingers are too short for keyboards, and I still don't get used to ctrl and shift+ plus other keys, any advice?
is there a full video of the cata shatter v kfc clip @ 6:20?
Great video! I loved this view on skill and knowledge
great job ! would love to see more videos like this one.
Just like I said on forums;
Before watching:
You can’t compare WoW skill to another game. They all require different mindsets & awareness.
Post Watch: Pretty solid. But saying you need to memorize countless comps & patterns isn’t necessarily true. Patterns aren’t static between players.
Also glad you pointed out that you can’t always be a zug player and sometimes need to understand when a game needs to go 10-15 mins.
Would’ve also used a lot more SC2 references when going over Aggression vs Defensive. It’s pretty straight forward for people to understand how the same strategy can fail in the same circumstances.
And thank you for pointing out that people don’t understand what skill means in this game. I despise people who think that’s a static topic and that “you just have to do x” to be a super insane player.
Overall, 9/10. Well done & thought out.
There is no skill in WoW pvp. Just ilevel, comp, burst.
this was a fantastic video , I dont usually comment on videos but you guys did a great job with this one!
This is such an excellent video!
Method NA has been a powerhouse the last couple awc's too!
You put a lot of time making this video, Respect , loved it, brings back old memories
Great Video!
And iam a great Jamhilli FAN
Epic asf video! You guys have gone from strength to strength with your videos! I love watching them 🤌🏾
Love these kinds of videos!!
One of your best vids so far
great video, althought i dont play wow anymore this video was of great quality and effort. Really well done and informative
Love you guys!!!!
Great video. Thoroughly enjoyed this one
Great video!
Charles 'Tenderloin' Dewland. What a throwback lmao
Hey Skill Capped, another excellent video! This truly made me think of an answer to your question of "How can I choose the most consistent option?" and I think I found the optimal solution!
Cobra Shot, Flayed Shot, Kill Shot. Oh, and don't forget to backpedal!
WoW PvP is really hard, I agree. Even if you have oppressive damage that compensates for lack of game knowledge or mechanical ability, it's most certainly difficult for everyone :)
Sure, If you think is that easy, why you dont play bm to get gladiator? Lmao
lol
@@GuilhermeDishzz Found the BM player
@@OverlordMoon kk
I just dont know how you think bm is that easy when our ladder have a bunch of arms/ww
Ye, bm is kinda easy but war/dh/ww is wayyy more easy than bm
@@GuilhermeDishzz Stop right there, war/ww is easier? KEKW. They are more viable than BM are but that doesn't make it any easier. You can easily climb to 2.2k at least even with one button macros cast sequences, that's how braindead BM can be played. As for him not being gladiator (who knows he is), maybe he doesn't have the teammates for it, PUG takes time and patience to reach to gladiator.
quality content!
Awesome content as always ;)
Great video. Hope it encourages people to give it try
Great video, some delicious food for thought
Actually FYI Floyd was very offensive younger in his career , but once he broke his hands he became defensive
Great video
Really nice video, +10
great video :D
Gear-UI-Reflexes if you that out you can compete in WoW. The difference between you and the best becomes a lot more tight. Doesn't you'll win the championship but you'll be good.
It's hard and that's the beauty of it.
Its hard
Its harder to get geared up for it lol
its rng with gear>skill beautiful!
Its really beautiful that you can play against monks who can oneshot you with 0 setup
@@shvansee216 thats not true you need to set up for monk oneshot spinning crane kick unless ur talking about a new one shot
It's too hard. I give up...
I think a better way to put it is how the Fighting game community faces the same problem. It requires a ton of knowledge and alot of experience to get to a place where you can actually start playing the game. Below that point is a ton of cheese and insta gib strats that will absolutely smoke you if you're lacking in the knowledge department on how to deal with it. Fighting games are the same way, if you run into someone who has really good setups and mixups and you can't stop them from getting in you're going to probably get steamrolled into the floor. But if you just anti air all their jumps and check their deceptively unsafe links you're probably gonna win.
WoW actually also has the added problem of gear. In games like Injustice 2 nobody plays with gear on because it adds stupid advantages nobody wants to deal with. People could probably actually learn the game if they didnt immediately get erased cause their gear isnt up to par. It's one of the only competitive activities across all of gaming where people actually accept the unfair advantage of gear in a competitive environment.
Dang that Lazerchicken!
great video
If they would ease off of the burst, maybe more teams could take the approach of strategy over centering around gogogogogogogogo. Offense excites people but defense feels rewarding.
This video was soo goood
one of the greatest hidden marketing campaigns of all time
All I play is WoW pvp and SSB. Perfect vid.
Who is the one speaking is this video cheers?
Wow, you've been making rock solid videos lately!
I don't know i played many mmorpgs and in my experience wow felt very static. The global cd made it depend on learning a rota for diffrent enemy classes. I come from aion and there you have double the amount of skills without any global cd so the game is more about reactions on the enemy than pushing your rota out. In my opinion wow is very slow and depends on learning the right order of your Skills. And everybody just plays human.
I absolutely adore defensive-reactive-strategic play. Which is a big part of why I hate lfg. Everyone wants to play fast and aggro and wind up getting themselves killed. As a mage I have so many strong defensive tools paired with a strong burst window, but it doesn't matter if I can't keep my partner alive. Very frustrating.
throughout the beginning of the video I had flashbacks to LSD teams pillar humping in wod and legion.
Wow takes skill for sure but there is so much important things that you can't control just like rng proc doing crazy dmg.
Also you need to learn pretty much all spells in the game (offensive / defensive /utility such as reverse/sanctuary etc and a lot more) and also the covenant/soul bind one.
Also you have to play with addon otherwise you can't play the game.
And ofc you have to learn how to play your class/spec properly and some like rogue got a ton of macro/spells to keep in mind.
You can be glad without any add-on at all if you want.
WE NEED SOLO-Q
This video needs to be studied. Great work!
Its actually split into 3 parts. Offence-Defense-Assist.
great vid needed some reckful tho
Blizzard's big mistake was choosing arena instead of rbgs for their esport. Wow arena will NEVER lend itself to being viewed in the same way as s tier esports. The problem is that in wow, the micro outplays aren't that obvious to newbie viewers, and making the meta faster does not change that. In rbgs, kills are constantly happening, and even newbies can understand the objectives.
Tldr stop destroying arena for the esport dream. Not going to happen. If you're going to make the meta faster, make it reasonable, and do it to make the game more fun for the players, not the viewers.
True
Do you guys know 이윤열?
2:07 There is an evidence of Asmongold throwing the crab.
The conclusion is misleading, especially comparing WoW to chess. In chess both opponents begin on equal footing with equal potential opportunities. With WoW it depends on your comp, and some comps just have more options than others. CC is undeniably powerful in small-scale pvp like arena, and immunity defensives like iceblock or divine shield can be determining factors. Then, there's mobility, which only a few classes possess to the extreme while others lag behind.
To conclude that skillful play is "slow and steady" is a generic statement that doesn't consider that some classes are not well-equipped for such an approach. Outlier classes with unique abilities that do not have common counters add an "x-factor" that needs to be considered, and in all of the other games you compared WoW to, none of them allow for such large discrepancies amongst the players. WoW was not designed for small-scale PvP it was designed for BG style pvp. It is unfortunate that we continue pretending that comps like RMP are skillful when they primarily skate by due to having high CC, high defensive/immunities, and high burst AND sustained damage.
There is definitely a skill factor involved but it has nothing to do with defensive play or aggressive play - it primarily how well the team coordinates its actions, and whether they are on the same page in terms of how to react to the actions of the opponents. Cheesing wins with "hit-n-run" style play can work, but it doesn't mean you are "skilled". In a boxing match, one guy can choose to keep jogging around the ring avoiding engaging the opponent, only occasionally stepping in for a few shots. Perhaps it wins, but it's hardly testing your skill. Just like shooting someone who challenged you to a fist fight... you "won" the fight but you never tested your hand-to-hand combat skills.
Yes, nothing requires skill. We got it.
@@sirnicholibraden86 Don't tell me - you facerolled a WW monk to 2K in 2s and believe it was your skill that accomplished this...
The hard part is finding good players. There's like 1 every 10 players that actually know what they're doing and what enemy team is doing. Some people go for boosts simply to skip the bad players.
They need an alternative version of pvp. Ranked games should take your gear into account. There should also be unranked games where everyone is given a standard ilvl. And let you earn the base conquest sets this way. That way i. ranked you still need to push a high ranking to get the elite sets. But all pvpers can gear and play in a setting where to no life’s don’t have an unfair advantage over normal people with lives.
THAT!
Wow is easy mode its tab targeting.
PVP is all about knowing skills and talents! Plus the meta. It really is that simple.
And it's the main reason why most new PVP players don't stick around long enough to learn them all.
Reason why so many carries are noticeable. Every casual has left, and the people getting carried are 1800 with gold but couldn't be fucked getting one shot with no teammates with gear.
def hard that's why i love it. i completely abandoned pve starting in SL and it's best decision i've ever made. Went from a 1600 player to a 2.2k player. Still a long long way to go but i'm constantly improving.
kinda funny tho i just randomly watched blizzcon 2015 yesterday
I just let other players kill me. Cant do anything on any of my toons so I dont try anymore.
u forgot loony who is porbably the best healer ever with the ebst game knowckledge
Idk, i have mixed feelings about this video. Sure it's 100% how it is on higher levels of play, but all of us, filthy casuals, still exist. And there are a lot of shit in shadowlands, that almost completely nullifies our possibilities: gear difference, overturned specs, etc. It's good overview, but it doesn't mean you won't die to hunter spamming 2 buttons or ww spinning crane kick by applying tips from this video. And devs react so slow with fixing those issues that i, and im sure many others, don't have motivation to get better.
oh thats easy: its hard.
Inyu
Also boosting. Gear walls are now build so that you have to buy gold and pay a booster if you are average and want good gear. The ranked gear is a thought out money maker. I boosted for a bit and most players are paying for 1400-1600. They just want some gear to make the game manageable. Sad.
Thats the real problem of wow's pvp...
omg the Barca vs inter reference seriously made me sad. It is probably something we should advocate. Soccer players or industry make tons of money because billions of people watch soccer, but if every team plays like Mourinho then I deeply think it is bad for the entire industry. And tbh 2009-2010 was a little unfortunate, Ibra kinda isn't a good fit for Barca. If it was 2010-2011 barca i doubt who would win.
Also this affect on industry is way more obvious in WoW. Soccer has huge fan base. WoW community is much much smaller comparing to soccer fans. And in BFA, I deeply think C9 alone lowered arena participation by a lot and made WoW community even smaller. The viewer count through last 3 years of AWC decreased quite a lot. Also during 8.2-8.3, everytime I watch C9 game during AWC i just fall asleep. So later on whenever it is c9 i just close the stream and do something else. Then later who meta is pretty dampening so i just stopped watching.
By the end of the day, not every person is trying to make a living off WoW. And WoW pro player is probably not enough to make a living comparing to pro players in other game. I play a game to have fun and relieve myself from work/life pressure. Dampening play style is not fun, and does not help me in anyway. I truly believe this play style should not be encouraged at all.
an the skill comes from the gear most games arent balanced to well from what i have seen on 9 classes so far reaching doing only arena. A few stand out that was really easy an others struggle till max gear. regardless ive played for 15 years an have watched wow crumble from lack of dev work. Great game dying from ion an holinka an the new guy. #fireionanholinka lets go
If you care about rating it's hard, if your like me and just have fun it's easy
The PvP World of WoW is challenging and if you want to get involved, Just know you gotta get yo ass fucked up before you do the fuckin, To all my fellow PvP mains that made it to high cr, Dont forget what you went through to get there. Remember the Times 💪💯
I always lose so I gave up.
@@BansheeKing22 Thats why pvp is only for the few
@@Layerlol well that's stupid. It needs to be easier. It's ridiculous. I cant do anything in this game.
@@BansheeKing22 the unfortunate reality is that PVP is only for the dedicated and the wicked, to be good at PVP you have to pay your dues, and those dues are paid in *tilt* by seeing the graveyard over and over and over again until one day something in you clicks and you start to destroy everything that comes in your way... And as you do you'll find yourself in a position where nobody will intimidate you in any PVP situation to the point where when you actually go up against your equal or greater it becomes exciting, big names such as Xaryu, Pikaboo, Venruki, Bajheera, Cdew, Hansol etc, They all had to pay their dues when they first started and yes some become good at pvp and some become great but then you have the gifted as listed above, PVP isnt for the weak and if you keep at it you'll eventually become goated, Good luck!
Runic mana potion
If you are a caster for example a warlock you have a hard time...
pogU
Wow does not care about defense nor does pvp community proof tanks are hated in pvp and never given to much thought. When they do start to shine most of community shuns them and wow nerfs them into unplayable.
It depends on What class you play xd
A: easy with lots of add-ons and hard af with WoWs insanely limited info Default UI
My question: why is hiding basic info so fundamental to WoW default UI? Is this actual complexity or fake and unnecessary hiding of basic info to just SIMULATE complexity?
I've failed to convince friends and family to play WoW for years mainly due to them having no clue wtf is even happening when I show them WoW.
idk i just got rid of a few of my addons in favor of a more default wow ui and i actually prefer it. I run a lot of weakauras tho. omnibar, gladius, big debuffs. All you really need
"To become better at wow arena first involves recognizing that you might have a misunderstanding on what skill actually means it's, not just doing things fast but instead doing things well "
I gave up. I cant win and im always one shot. I just let the other players kill me. Why try when you already know the outcome.
06:04
WoW is hard! I love it though.
"Turtle all day and do anything reckless" I think I see what you did there :)
there is no compatibility in skill with luck ergo RNG. None of the examples provided have any luck tied to it. Dmg modifiers on top of a x2 crit is the prime win condition in arena; it outshines any play or plays you can do. Whaazz doesnt take less dmg for being whaazz if you hit him for 45k @80% HP he is still going to die even if you are a million times worse of a player than him (and this has been proven time and time again in his streams, same can be said of any WoW pro that still plays). Then if you even live it forces defensive CDs you otherwise would not have been forced to use.
Remember AWC pros dying with defensives up? that was actually because there was no reason for them to even pop them; their healers were not in CC, they also had big instant heals and their own defensives up pro players know this, hell even just glad players. But then you just die out of air from full HP and there was not the slightest window for reaction or anything you could've possibly done to counter your opponents' luck. And there is literally 100 billion more combinations in chess than something as unilaterally obvious as WoW; you actually cant memorize them at all chess pros' skill cap is how many moves they can think forward using the least chronometer time because there's so many you can't know out of memory alone that comparison is cringetopia worth tbh. Sorry to say but you're drowning in copium WoW skill-cap is a meme by modern esport standards like mechanical skill doesnt even exist; you can't miss your skills so any 0 cr baboon can burst if they write their swifty macro right.
I didn't like the direction you took with this topic. I was hoping to dive into how many keybinds a rank 1 player uses, how fast you need to press the keys, how many decisions you have to make, etc. and compare that to other games.
I used to love wow's pvp in Legion but since BFA i dont have the time or will to grind for gear.
I tried gearing in the beginning of SL but after being crushed during an entire day farming for honor gear i gave up, not a single game i felt usefull for the team, i didnt even felt that i was dealing damage. Not to mention i dont think i killed anyone.
I mean, can it really be called pvp when theres a difference in HP/damage between players? I dont think so...
I dont wanna make part of a shitty system like this.
Hope next expansion they focus on skill based pvp.
The problem with wow pvp is the sellers low gear people can't play arena cause there matched with someone with 250+ item full elite set the wow token is ruining wow and the sellers are making it worse
it is complex and fun. But WOW probably is the only competitive PVP that requires addons to be played properly 😌. I know it is very hard to make MMO PVP be that good, but wow was around for ages. Bliz probably should have figured something out better than this imo.
You forgot the other option. "Boring"
wow pvp is too complicated, i remember BC and Wotlk (i played hard these extention), each class had 2 ability to remember, now it's like 5 to each specilisation, without counting the basic spell and cc. It's too much i can't stand it.
Anyone who has tried to push arena rating knows wow pvp is very hard
It's totally fine to enjoy what you enjoy but let's not kid ourselves here... There is good reason why the arena community is so small. Most people aren't going to jump through all the hoops required to be competitive in 3v3 arena... simple as that. Too many hoops...; addons, macros, finding a new team every time you lose... the experience for a new player is terrible... So we still have the same 25-30 people competing at blizzcon every year for the past 15 years lol!
Its the most challenging game and thats why I love it.
You can also tell that its hard because 90% of the player base are trash and its hard af to find good players 😂
It is not by far the most challenging game.. It's hard but there is alot of much harder games out there.
I tried my best but I give up. Tired of being the verbal punching bag for you people.
Eso/bdo/gw2/lost ark not just wow take skill