Have been struggeling to get my foot up to speed with control for many years. Today i tightend my spring from almost the loosest position to almost the tightest. My foot was finally breathing. Balance was so much better. And the speed was easy. And no ghost notes. You are a lifesaver! THX!
And now I have a question for you-can you play ghost notes with the pedal at maximum spring tension? I mean controllable ghost notes, not random quiet hits on the bass drum.
@@Mr.Bagi0 everything is easyer. The tighter spring makes it so the foot is in control. Its like playing on a supertight snare vs a loose one. A loose bassdrumhead gives little rebound. So the tighter spring makes up for that.
I think Evans has offered a number of great items that are affordable for drummers to get the best out of their kick drum, and I use all of them for great results. The Evans EMAD bass drum head. The Evans dampening pillow, that is hinged so when you hit the bass drum with the pedal the pillow pulls off the bass drum head, and then resettles after the note is played. And the Evan Bass drum riser. It helps your bass drum resonate, keeps the drum hoop from damage from the pedal, and ensures the pedal beater hits the bass drum head square on the head perfectly in the center of the drum. I love Evans products because they work great and drummers can afford them. Doesn't hurt to know how to tune your bass drum either.
It does my heart good to see this! I’ve only been playing drums for 45+ years, and in my opinion, EVERYTHING revolves around the bass drum pedal first (playing technique, foot board angle, spring tension, beater throw). Even how high we sit on our throne is determined by these things. EVERYTHING starts here!
Fully agree. Too many drummers, especially in my wheelhouse of metal and heavy genres, make the mistake at the beginning of thinking that higher spring tension = a better kick. There's alot of "proper spring tension" videos out there but yours is on point and succinct. Once again we see that so much of our chosen implement comes down to personal settings that we have to find ourselves most of the time. If we don't have those settings in the ideal position, you end up fighting your gear and yourself.
I ran into the opposite problem recently. I unknowingly had the spring tension so high I had to use full leg for every kick stroke. Turns out I've been training on hard mode. I loosened it to where you recommend and my kick speed/accuracy improved drastically since I can use far less movement to get the same result.
YES YES YES! Finally someone nailed proper foot technique. You could also add that by dropping the heel thru the stroke it not only generates more power but it releases all tension on your leg in between strokes so you can groove in a relaxed way. Burying the beater or “standing” on the pedal Places your whole body under constant tension and kills groove feel. “No bueno”
Ta for the pedal tips Nate. What I’ve found as the biggest factor in improving my bass drum playing quality is thousands, if not millions of bass drum hits. Your foot, calf and the rest of your body will get stronger, more agile, and adapt to the motion. It does take a long time - from starting out, years before your feet are comfortable.
Agreed. I have been working on triplets for months. It was pretty grim for the first bit but now things are coming around. Months in and a lifetime to go!
That was really well done. I am a middle-aged (I’m 60 - maybe “late middle aged” 😁) amateur drummer who has been drumming my entire life. I have never seen or heard an explanation like this before. I am definitely going to try out some of these adjustments both to my kick pedal and to my seat positioning and foot technique. Thanks for this!
These are all valid techniques that work for lots of drummers. Thanks for taking the time to break them down. Personally, I prefer constant release technique, as it gives me a unified technique for hands and feet. It incorporates both heel up & heel down, as well as a third type of stroke. This third stroke type involves starting with the heel up, but dropping the heel & raising the toe at the end of the stroke. I also like to occasionally spend some time with the spring disengaged, to get a better feel of the rebound, and to be sure my foot is following the pedal (Jojo Mayer attributes this practice technique to Buddy Rich). The main reason I use constant release, is that it has built-in rest periods (when I drop my heel at the end of a stroke) that relieve tension in my leg. I believe this helps improve my timing, as my leg is more relaxed, more of the time. Check out Dom Famularo & Jojo Mayer for their explanations of this technique.
Love your videos, my friend.....The foot is the most difficult for beginners..As soon as they have drums,I launch into BD control.Even drummer friends of mine ask about BD control....Colin Bailey wrote the book in the 60's..His videos really get into it....Nice video.
Refining my technique over the last year or so I had similiar conclusions about the kick drum pedal setup and it improved my doubles - it's nice to see it all confirmed from a third party!
Best thing to start with is to remove all the crap inside your bass drum and get a Remo Muffl on the thing ASAP. You will be blown away at how powerful and tight your bass drum will sound.
Really good tutorial. Tganks for taking the time and effort to make it and share the knowledge with us. Truly appreciate it. Now I'll see if i can get rid of the extra kick "gost" that seems to be haunting the bass drum lol
Just paused at halfway and made a few adjustments, at least 20% better on my (longish time) beginner kicks which is massive, and straight away playing on legs alone I can navigate and just let it go from mind to sound which is such a privilege, thanks bro much love to all 💙💜💛
Thank you Nate. I needed this video. I always got confused with this one. My goal was to hit harder (like Jon Theodore), his stick heights make him look so fierce and barbaric hitting those drums, he makes his kit look small. Anyway I’d have no issue hitting harder with the hands, then when it came to the foot, my shin would tense up a lot if I even try to play 5% harder. So this video will definitely make me mess with the spring tension now. Thanks again 🫡
Great to hear someone address the unwanted ghost note issue (especially on e-kit). It makes sense to me that the spring tension should be largely dictated by the weight and angle of the leg while resting. Maybe that’s why I’ve experienced less unwanted ghost notes with the Iron Cobra Cobra-Coil. Can’t wait to try it out!
A pedal brand has way different feels. I used to play with a Pearl cheapo, with no plate or board. The problems were not tension but the fact is it was not a good pedal and i hated the fat mushroom mallets. I had 2. Got used to them on double bass, but now I only have one bass drum and just got an Iron Cobra 900 model double pedal and it is like learning a new instrument. SO FAST. It is faster than me. Now I have to work on controling it. I can't believe the price of a double pedal now a days.
Great video, very helpful! Many years ago I cranked my spring tension very high, and in recent years I've been gradually bringing the tension back down. Do you have any thoughts on avoiding achilles, pain as opposed to shin pain?
Merci pour ce tuto ! Hélas mon niveau d’anglais ne m’a pas permis de comprendre tous les détails. Mais je crois que j’ai retenu l’essentiel : pour la technique du « talon levé », il faut augmenter la tension du ressort, jusqu’à trouver le point d’équilibre pour éviter les doubles coups non désirés. Merci pour tes vidéos ! 😊
Hey Nate I play professionally and often and just feel I can what I need done no matter the pedal. BUT that said I decided to revisit my main pedal and really analyze the technique etc. I put more tension on it and I think im better for it. 👍🏼🙏
definitely going to try it. i have an almost loose spring tension and I am able to control the strokes pretty well both playing heel up or down but without burying the beater. this sweetspothigher spring tension sounds logical and effective.
Yeah, sometimes we never realize how much harder we're working until an adjustment is made and feel the difference. I used to crank my spring tension on my pedals until I got a set of Axis Longboards. I run those fairly low tension and they're so much easier to play than cranked to the nines. Plus, I feel it gives me a ton of range on the pedal for foot placement for various strokes for different patterns.
Yes, I find the same thing after getting my Axis longboard double as well (have a shortboard single of theirs too). Much lighter tension for sure and heel down on a longboard also gives you good bounce. The large smooth board leaves lotsa playing options (good to change around during a long set to avoid cramps). I was always a heel-toe drummer and play heel down for slower, more basic stuff. Heel up is good for dancing on the pedals and that "heel drop" technique he illustrates makes a good approximation of heel-toe but without the heavy heel strike (when wanted). Of course I believe Ghost pedals are the best for H-T and fast and light in general (have several) but for a double the Axis is the best non-boutique pedal!
Great tips, thank you! I've been playing exclusively heal up for decades and have always felt somewhat sheepish admitting I can't play heel down. Has always felt unnatural for me.Meanwhile I've always thought the little elephants in the room the ghost notes between beats resulted from a too-tightly tensioned batter head.
Cool video man. I'm 15 years old and I'm going the way of Jimmy The Rev Sullivan R.I.P. and Aquiles Priester. I started a 60 minutes daily double bass endurance routine about 8 months ago! It is boring and costs much time but it got me playing songs like 'Ashes' by FFDP and many more. I play without triggers and only heel up. Keep it up man🤘🤘🤘
I treat drumming as a sort of dance. It makes the playing more fluent and musical. Hitting the bass with all kinds of combinations and intensities is a big part of it.
I think Evans has offered a number of great items that are affordable for drummers to get the best out of their kick drum, and I use all of them for great results. The Evans EMAD bass drum head. The Evans dampening pillow, that is hinged so when you hit the bass drum with the pedal the pillow pulls off the bass drum head, and then resettles after the note is played. And the Evan Bass drum riser. It helps your bass drum resonate, keeps the drum hoop from damage from the pedal, and ensures the pedal beater hits the bass drum head square on the head perfectly in the center of the drum. I love Evans products because they work great and drummers can afford them. Doesn't hurt to know how to tune your bass drum either. lol
Always fun hearing George’s name when you don’t expect it. Thanks for the video, I’ve been wondering how my tension might be boycotting my best playing and what to do about it recently
I’m mostly self taught and I alternate between heel up and down depending on the pattern. I recently acquired a DW 3000 double pedal and it feels really sluggish to me. Gonna try your recommended formula for spring tension to see if that helps. That and I’ll prolly get some lighter beaters. Great vid - new sub.
One problem with bass drums and players is too many players are trying to see how fast they can play. How many beats a minute they can put into a song. And More notes does not always mean a better song. Usually quite the opposite. There's nothing wrong with kickin' it with the double bass, but 240 BPM is not a song. It's more like a sport competition than music.
I started getting the accidental ghost notes when I went back to my double bass pedal. I figured it'd either need more or less spring tension but haven't gotten to play around with it yet. I'll now be trying more first and see what happens.
There is something that was not really addressed... Heel-to-toe technique and the slide technique (which is more toe-to-heel)... I am a toe-to-heel (slide player) player and I don't have any fatigue and I usually have clean hits, it just feels natural, plus I generate a lot of power. Everything else you said, spot on!
I'm still a beginner. The last month or so I've been working on my foot. I'm definitely getting better. I remember the first time I tried putting a kick on the A of 1 and A 3. I couldn't do it. Now I can basically sneak a kick in wherever I want without my brain saying "you can't do this" lol. I still have a lot of work to do tho. Especially when it comes to speed. Here's my problem tho. I'm concentrating so hard on getting these kicks in at different spots that I'm literally hurting the bottom of my foot if I play for a half an hour or so. It's like I'm so tense, I'm hitting way harder than I need to. Hopefully that gets better with time. Thank you for the video.
My first kit came with a cheap pedal, so the highest tension was lighter than like 10% of my current iron cobra pedal, and I got used to that. When I got the cobra I cranked it up following the same advice, from a previous video. Tried it for a week, but couldnt really get used to it, so I went back to this 10-15% percent, which allowed me to work on my precioson a bit easier and felt good. But now I feel like my fast doubles are lagging and I might crank it up again lol Even if it's just to get out of this being stuck mental state
An interesting tip about adjusting the spring tension, but there are also many pitfalls here: it’s not the spring or the pedal that should be doing the work, but rather the foot itself should move together with the pedal and return with it, so that the beater doesn’t slow down near the drumhead and create unwanted quiet, inertial hits. I remember Billy Cobham once advised practicing pedal playing without the spring at all, just relying on the rebound from the drumhead, so that the foot learns to return with the pedal.
I have had the ghost note issue for over decades. I blamed it on my age and physical issues. I will try adding a bit more tension to see how that may help.
I think I was misinterpreting your advice and expecting the pedal to hold the beater off the head with my foot with heel up on the pedal essentially dead weight, kept adding tension to my Speed Cobras until they were at the max and was getting ghost kicks (but no remaining tension left). Backed it off to where I still have to "help" hold my leg a little with my heel up and I think things are feeling good. Didn't realize how low my tension was until I started fiddling, was definitely using hip flexors more than I am now with the tension cranked!
Greetings from Australia, I may be wrong about this but I heard that Joe Morello was able to play any pedal WITHOUT THE SPRING. It was said he was able to catch the rebound off the bass drum head after the initial stroke. This may be possible with bass drums having "jazz" tuning. HAve you heard of Joe's amazing feat???
This topic is so subjective. I have an unbelievable teacher than slightly lifts his leg the whole time. It's like there's a neutral buoyancy on the pedal, allowing it to come off the head. In videos it looks like Simon Phillips uses the technique. It does take a lot of practice. thanks 80/20-
What about the cain tightness? Because my pedal comes back beating the chain against it and I am not making any release errors, as much as I can see....Can they be adjusted?
I remember watching that John Blackwell video from the early 2000's. Someone asked about his pedal setup and he was like IDK, I just crank the spring until it stops
I LOVE your videos! This helped me a lot just a few minutes after I practiced today. I feel like it doesn’t even matter what pedal I use at home or on gigs now. They all feel great after this video and minor pedal adjustments.
So, higher spring tension can help with hip flexor problems? I call the leg cramps I get after a long session "drummer leg". I will give this a shot. Might help me sleep at night too. Ha!
I recently switched to heel-up in my 16th year of drumming and came to the same conclusions. It's also worth noting that those who play heel-down should sit far enough away from the pedals to allow their knee to rest behind their ankle. In other words; greater than 90 degrees at the knee. This allows for mobility through the shins. If you're switching from heel-down to heel-up you'll need to sit closer than you're used to. You'll likely have a mindless tendency to adjust your throne back because everything feels too close. This will throw off your balance and make playing heel-up very difficult so keep an eye on your throne position. You also might need to re-evaluate the rest of your kit to accommodate for your new throne position.
hey there, Long time fan and follower of your channel. Kudos! The late, amazing Joe Morello totally believed in solid footboard kick pedals, which I have never seen any other jazz drummer use. DW used to produce a model for him. Pretty sure they don't make them anymore. Not a lot of drummers in general use these it seems. Why is this? And why is this type of pedal hardly ever discussed anywhere? I mean when a master like Morello believed it has real value...there must be something to it. Love to hear from you!
Yeah the Ghosts were very popular amongst jazz drummers originally with their solid pedal (what we call longboard these days) design. More inertial control I find as you are balancing in front of the the pivot point, more like riding a surfboard to a degree! When playing heel down in front of pivot means your heel is also moving and adding to stroke and you can dance around the pedal depending on the rhythms you are actually playing. More of a live feel than the static feel of a fixed heel plate I feel.
I have been playing for 25 years and for me I keep my bass pedal pressed on the bass drum head between beats. It works for me, but everyone is different. For me, I feel it helps me deliver a lot more power.
@@epiphanyvideomarketing7541 that’s valid, but it can mask some technique and setup deficiencies. That’s why I like to play as if I’m going to avoid planting the beater to encourage good setup and mechanics, then if I choose to plant the beater for musical reasons I always can.
Hi i'm an advanced drummer with a degree in music. Only heel up playing. Idk why But my kick drum speed is pretty fast when going strait 16th notes , but when I try to do fast chops using my kick suddenly the weight of nearly my whole body is transferred to the kick between the bursts of hands and foot , I shove the beater in the head and that seems to be tiring me and slowing me down by a lot. Prevents me from flying around the kit more than 10 seconds as I build up fatigue really fast. Idk how to explain properly the issue but for me it's a sort of a balance problem. The weight of my body can't stay at my ass and I lose my balance during the fast chops because it's not just straight 16th that I can use anckle motion basketball technique. Never seen anyone adress this issue and Nate I think you may be the one to explain how do I fix this? If I try to transfer my weight on my ass only and use only ankle motion of my foot , then suddenly I can no longer provide enough force on the bass drum and It doesn't sound consistent
sounds like you're not sitting in an optimal position, so it's difficult to reach the pedal with most of the weight through your tailbones. What's more, you're probably not doing the "calf raise" thing; and instead using your hip flexor to pick up your foot, which results in a big weight transfer from your foot to your butt.
I agree that for yourself you could and should optimize everything for yourself. But what do you think about jam or shared situations that just make you think that you should study thinking that you may adapt to any situation?
@@pastrnak8863 DWs are doing something magic with the cams that lets them feel lighter while still not requiring energy to retract them. The same amount of tension on other pedals feels like a lot of resistance. But I agree.
The problem is that when you establish your comfortable footboard angle, now when you re-position the beater, the footboard angle changes..... Im going to try these techniques, but being able to play heel down and heel up might work better for some people.
The first question you should ask of your students pertaining to the kick, is 'what are you wearing on your feet?' The shoe is everything when you want to pedal the pedal. Otherwise, the spring, yes, is everything.
Yeah. Been playing over fifty years and basically use whatever technique works best for a particular song (or part). Heel down for easy stuff. Heel up but just using ankle for faster stuff, heel-toe when I want to really blast it (as the heel impacting gives the loudest bass drum hit with fast rebound-no burying). All about feeling like your dancing on the pedals I find and if the drummer is dancing the audience probably will too!
Also, the length of the kick pedal is a deal breaker...most of them, in the old days, were way too short. Never worried about ghosties, except in the studio with very picky producers.
If the spring is tight enough to support the weight of your leg when you rest on the ball of your foot, how do you step on it hard enough to get a sound?
Yeah, with a long board, heel-toe gives a quick rebound as you are letting pedal freely bounce, you don't resist pedal return. Direct drive works best for this as a chain can bunch up when you do that and give a weird slack in the stroke. When I use Ghosts or Axis I run them at very little tension (cause your heel on the longboard actually works like a higher tensioned spring).
Is it just me or is your playing getting better and better with each video lately? Keep on dude!!!
Its the cymbals jk
ngl ive noticed that too
He is now illuminati 😂
Have been struggeling to get my foot up to speed with control for many years. Today i tightend my spring from almost the loosest position to almost the tightest. My foot was finally breathing. Balance was so much better. And the speed was easy. And no ghost notes. You are a lifesaver! THX!
And now I have a question for you-can you play ghost notes with the pedal at maximum spring tension? I mean controllable ghost notes, not random quiet hits on the bass drum.
@@Mr.Bagi0 everything is easyer. The tighter spring makes it so the foot is in control. Its like playing on a supertight snare vs a loose one. A loose bassdrumhead gives little rebound. So the tighter spring makes up for that.
Getting ready to bring my spring tension up as well, loose is just not serving me well.
I think Evans has offered a number of great items that are affordable for drummers to get the best out of their kick drum, and I use all of them for great results. The Evans EMAD bass drum head. The Evans dampening pillow, that is hinged so when you hit the bass drum with the pedal the pillow pulls off the bass drum head, and then resettles after the note is played. And the Evan Bass drum riser. It helps your bass drum resonate, keeps the drum hoop from damage from the pedal, and ensures the pedal beater hits the bass drum head square on the head perfectly in the center of the drum. I love Evans products because they work great and drummers can afford them. Doesn't hurt to know how to tune your bass drum either.
also try playing your pedal with shoes, and also barefoot to see if you prefer one way or another. You get more feel barefoot, more power with shoes.
It does my heart good to see this! I’ve only been playing drums for 45+ years, and in my opinion, EVERYTHING revolves around the bass drum pedal first (playing technique, foot board angle, spring tension, beater throw). Even how high we sit on our throne is determined by these things. EVERYTHING starts here!
Fully agree. Too many drummers, especially in my wheelhouse of metal and heavy genres, make the mistake at the beginning of thinking that higher spring tension = a better kick. There's alot of "proper spring tension" videos out there but yours is on point and succinct. Once again we see that so much of our chosen implement comes down to personal settings that we have to find ourselves most of the time. If we don't have those settings in the ideal position, you end up fighting your gear and yourself.
I ran into the opposite problem recently. I unknowingly had the spring tension so high I had to use full leg for every kick stroke. Turns out I've been training on hard mode. I loosened it to where you recommend and my kick speed/accuracy improved drastically since I can use far less movement to get the same result.
YES YES YES! Finally someone nailed proper foot technique. You could also add that by dropping the heel thru the stroke it not only generates more power but it releases all tension on your leg in between strokes so you can groove in a relaxed way. Burying the beater or “standing” on the pedal Places your whole body under constant tension and kills groove feel. “No bueno”
As a bassist with over 30 years of experience, I promise you bass players don't underappreciate drummers' "power and precision with the kick drum".
No, but us drummers do underappreciate bass drum precision ...and bass players opinions
When we do that disapproving look to the drummer playing literally fast&loose with his kick patterns 😂
Us drummers have NO real power with our kick drums without bass players placing a note there at the same precise moment.
Can't speak for other drummers but, the bass player is all I care about. Locking right in with them is the best.
@@Employee00765this idea is the beginning concept of a great band
Dang - me too 😄
Playing heel up, and went from very loose spring tension to almost all the way up there.. Thank you 👍
Ta for the pedal tips Nate. What I’ve found as the biggest factor in improving my bass drum playing quality is thousands, if not millions of bass drum hits. Your foot, calf and the rest of your body will get stronger, more agile, and adapt to the motion. It does take a long time - from starting out, years before your feet are comfortable.
Agreed. I have been working on triplets for months. It was pretty grim for the first bit but now things are coming around. Months in and a lifetime to go!
That was really well done. I am a middle-aged (I’m 60 - maybe “late middle aged” 😁) amateur drummer who has been drumming my entire life. I have never seen or heard an explanation like this before. I am definitely going to try out some of these adjustments both to my kick pedal and to my seat positioning and foot technique. Thanks for this!
These are all valid techniques that work for lots of drummers. Thanks for taking the time to break them down. Personally, I prefer constant release technique, as it gives me a unified technique for hands and feet. It incorporates both heel up & heel down, as well as a third type of stroke. This third stroke type involves starting with the heel up, but dropping the heel & raising the toe at the end of the stroke. I also like to occasionally spend some time with the spring disengaged, to get a better feel of the rebound, and to be sure my foot is following the pedal (Jojo Mayer attributes this practice technique to Buddy Rich). The main reason I use constant release, is that it has built-in rest periods (when I drop my heel at the end of a stroke) that relieve tension in my leg. I believe this helps improve my timing, as my leg is more relaxed, more of the time. Check out Dom Famularo & Jojo Mayer for their explanations of this technique.
Thanks Nate! You saved the day once again. I'm looking forward to my hip flexors not being in pain. Yeah!
Spring tension is critical I also adjust the beater angle for a perfect feel. Awesome video and so is your playing nice groove. 🙏
Very Friendly nice light informal yet informative Mr. 80-20, you have my full attention.
Great lesson! I cant wait to apply what I have just learned.
Love your videos, my friend.....The foot is the most difficult for beginners..As soon as they have drums,I launch into BD control.Even drummer friends of mine ask about BD control....Colin Bailey wrote the book in the 60's..His videos really get into it....Nice video.
Refining my technique over the last year or so I had similiar conclusions about the kick drum pedal setup and it improved my doubles - it's nice to see it all confirmed from a third party!
This is a fantastic video! Great topic (and not just intermediate drummers having issues with spring tension). Thanks for sharing this!
Best thing to start with is to remove all the crap inside your bass drum and get a Remo Muffl on the thing ASAP. You will be blown away at how powerful and tight your bass drum will sound.
Thanks mucho. You are right!
Really good tutorial.
Tganks for taking the time and effort to make it and share the knowledge with us.
Truly appreciate it.
Now I'll see if i can get rid of the extra kick "gost" that seems to be haunting the bass drum lol
Just paused at halfway and made a few adjustments, at least 20% better on my (longish time) beginner kicks which is massive, and straight away playing on legs alone I can navigate and just let it go from mind to sound which is such a privilege, thanks bro much love to all 💙💜💛
Thank you Nate. I needed this video. I always got confused with this one. My goal was to hit harder (like Jon Theodore), his stick heights make him look so fierce and barbaric hitting those drums, he makes his kit look small. Anyway I’d have no issue hitting harder with the hands, then when it came to the foot, my shin would tense up a lot if I even try to play 5% harder. So this video will definitely make me mess with the spring tension now. Thanks again 🫡
Great to hear someone address the unwanted ghost note issue (especially on e-kit). It makes sense to me that the spring tension should be largely dictated by the weight and angle of the leg while resting. Maybe that’s why I’ve experienced less unwanted ghost notes with the Iron Cobra Cobra-Coil. Can’t wait to try it out!
A pedal brand has way different feels. I used to play with a Pearl cheapo, with no plate or board. The problems were not tension but the fact is it was not a good pedal and i hated the fat mushroom mallets. I had 2. Got used to them on double bass, but now I only have one bass drum and just got an Iron Cobra 900 model double pedal and it is like learning a new instrument. SO FAST. It is faster than me. Now I have to work on controling it. I can't believe the price of a double pedal now a days.
Fantastic! Glad you mentioned increasing beater angle as a way to increase tension!
Great video, very helpful! Many years ago I cranked my spring tension very high, and in recent years I've been gradually bringing the tension back down. Do you have any thoughts on avoiding achilles, pain as opposed to shin pain?
Merci pour ce tuto !
Hélas mon niveau d’anglais ne m’a pas permis de comprendre tous les détails.
Mais je crois que j’ai retenu l’essentiel : pour la technique du « talon levé », il faut augmenter la tension du ressort, jusqu’à trouver le point d’équilibre pour éviter les doubles coups non désirés.
Merci pour tes vidéos ! 😊
Hey Nate I play professionally and often and just feel I can what I need done no matter the pedal. BUT that said I decided to revisit my main pedal and really analyze the technique etc. I put more tension on it and I think im better for it. 👍🏼🙏
❤ you are a great instructor with a great channel Nate! 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Thank you for sharing your wisdom! Could you do one about posture and snare height and hi hat placement? Because my shoulders hurt every time I play!
Very good video. Thank you sir.
Excellent video, thanks!
definitely going to try it. i have an almost loose spring tension and I am able to control the strokes pretty well both playing heel up or down but without burying the beater. this sweetspothigher spring tension sounds logical and effective.
Yeah, sometimes we never realize how much harder we're working until an adjustment is made and feel the difference. I used to crank my spring tension on my pedals until I got a set of Axis Longboards. I run those fairly low tension and they're so much easier to play than cranked to the nines. Plus, I feel it gives me a ton of range on the pedal for foot placement for various strokes for different patterns.
Yes, I find the same thing after getting my Axis longboard double as well (have a shortboard single of theirs too). Much lighter tension for sure and heel down on a longboard also gives you good bounce. The large smooth board leaves lotsa playing options (good to change around during a long set to avoid cramps). I was always a heel-toe drummer and play heel down for slower, more basic stuff. Heel up is good for dancing on the pedals and that "heel drop" technique he illustrates makes a good approximation of heel-toe but without the heavy heel strike (when wanted). Of course I believe Ghost pedals are the best for H-T and fast and light in general (have several) but for a double the Axis is the best non-boutique pedal!
fantastic video, I can’t believe how well you explained each element.
Great tips, thank you! I've been playing exclusively heal up for decades and have always felt somewhat sheepish admitting I can't play heel down. Has always felt unnatural for me.Meanwhile I've always thought the little elephants in the room the ghost notes between beats resulted from a too-tightly tensioned batter head.
Cool video man. I'm 15 years old and I'm going the way of Jimmy The Rev Sullivan R.I.P. and Aquiles Priester. I started a 60 minutes daily double bass endurance routine about 8 months ago! It is boring and costs much time but it got me playing songs like 'Ashes' by FFDP and many more. I play without triggers and only heel up. Keep it up man🤘🤘🤘
Jharis! Yay! One of the most focused drummers I've ever known. And I'm really old! I've seen a LOT of drummers.
Hey thanks! Been struggling with this!
I treat drumming as a sort of dance. It makes the playing more fluent and musical. Hitting the bass with all kinds of combinations and intensities is a big part of it.
thank you ! Your methods might be just what i need...
I think Evans has offered a number of great items that are affordable for drummers to get the best out of their kick drum, and I use all of them for great results. The Evans EMAD bass drum head. The Evans dampening pillow, that is hinged so when you hit the bass drum with the pedal the pillow pulls off the bass drum head, and then resettles after the note is played. And the Evan Bass drum riser. It helps your bass drum resonate, keeps the drum hoop from damage from the pedal, and ensures the pedal beater hits the bass drum head square on the head perfectly in the center of the drum. I love Evans products because they work great and drummers can afford them. Doesn't hurt to know how to tune your bass drum either. lol
Always fun hearing George’s name when you don’t expect it. Thanks for the video, I’ve been wondering how my tension might be boycotting my best playing and what to do about it recently
Always refreshing! Thank you for the input!
Thank you for this video. I just got a simmons titan 50 4 days ago - total noob here. The kick drum is SO much easier with more spring tension!
I’m mostly self taught and I alternate between heel up and down depending on the pattern. I recently acquired a DW 3000 double pedal and it feels really sluggish to me. Gonna try your recommended formula for spring tension to see if that helps. That and I’ll prolly get some lighter beaters. Great vid - new sub.
One problem with bass drums and players is too many players are trying to see how fast they can play. How many beats a minute they can put into a song. And More notes does not always mean a better song. Usually quite the opposite. There's nothing wrong with kickin' it with the double bass, but 240 BPM is not a song. It's more like a sport competition than music.
One mans scrap is another gold, that is the beauty of our art form.
Exactly what I needed.
Thanks Nate, very helpful, you da man! 👏👏👏🍻🍻🍻
Thank you😊 useful stuff. This is something ive alwauys struggled with🎉
I started getting the accidental ghost notes when I went back to my double bass pedal. I figured it'd either need more or less spring tension but haven't gotten to play around with it yet. I'll now be trying more first and see what happens.
Abe Cunningham drumming analysis one day?? My favorite and (IMO) one of the most underrated drummers.
There is something that was not really addressed... Heel-to-toe technique and the slide technique (which is more toe-to-heel)... I am a toe-to-heel (slide player) player and I don't have any fatigue and I usually have clean hits, it just feels natural, plus I generate a lot of power. Everything else you said, spot on!
I'm still a beginner. The last month or so I've been working on my foot. I'm definitely getting better. I remember the first time I tried putting a kick on the A of 1 and A 3. I couldn't do it. Now I can basically sneak a kick in wherever I want without my brain saying "you can't do this" lol. I still have a lot of work to do tho. Especially when it comes to speed. Here's my problem tho. I'm concentrating so hard on getting these kicks in at different spots that I'm literally hurting the bottom of my foot if I play for a half an hour or so. It's like I'm so tense, I'm hitting way harder than I need to. Hopefully that gets better with time. Thank you for the video.
Great explanation 👍
My first kit came with a cheap pedal, so the highest tension was lighter than like 10% of my current iron cobra pedal, and I got used to that. When I got the cobra I cranked it up following the same advice, from a previous video. Tried it for a week, but couldnt really get used to it, so I went back to this 10-15% percent, which allowed me to work on my precioson a bit easier and felt good. But now I feel like my fast doubles are lagging and I might crank it up again lol
Even if it's just to get out of this being stuck mental state
An interesting tip about adjusting the spring tension, but there are also many pitfalls here: it’s not the spring or the pedal that should be doing the work, but rather the foot itself should move together with the pedal and return with it, so that the beater doesn’t slow down near the drumhead and create unwanted quiet, inertial hits. I remember Billy Cobham once advised practicing pedal playing without the spring at all, just relying on the rebound from the drumhead, so that the foot learns to return with the pedal.
I have had the ghost note issue for over decades. I blamed it on my age and physical issues. I will try adding a bit more tension to see how that may help.
I think I was misinterpreting your advice and expecting the pedal to hold the beater off the head with my foot with heel up on the pedal essentially dead weight, kept adding tension to my Speed Cobras until they were at the max and was getting ghost kicks (but no remaining tension left). Backed it off to where I still have to "help" hold my leg a little with my heel up and I think things are feeling good.
Didn't realize how low my tension was until I started fiddling, was definitely using hip flexors more than I am now with the tension cranked!
Greetings from Australia, I may be wrong about this but I heard that Joe Morello was able to play any pedal WITHOUT THE SPRING. It was said he was able to catch the rebound off the bass drum head after the initial stroke. This may be possible with bass drums having "jazz" tuning. HAve you heard of Joe's amazing feat???
Thank you
This topic is so subjective. I have an unbelievable teacher than slightly lifts his leg the whole time. It's like there's a neutral buoyancy on the pedal, allowing it to come off the head. In videos it looks like Simon Phillips uses the technique. It does take a lot of practice. thanks 80/20-
Spring tension AND beater angle! But great video still! ❤
I mention that ;)
If you have a long enough pedal, you can also kick with your heel, or the ball. Which means you have to give a little on the spring(s).
Great video
What about the cain tightness? Because my pedal comes back beating the chain against it and I am not making any release errors, as much as I can see....Can they be adjusted?
I remember watching that John Blackwell video from the early 2000's. Someone asked about his pedal setup and he was like IDK, I just crank the spring until it stops
How does this work with the hi-hat? Are your foot equal on both pedals? I seem now to tension the spring of the hi-hat
I LOVE your videos! This helped me a lot just a few minutes after I practiced today. I feel like it doesn’t even matter what pedal I use at home or on gigs now. They all feel great after this video and minor pedal adjustments.
So, higher spring tension can help with hip flexor problems? I call the leg cramps I get after a long session "drummer leg". I will give this a shot. Might help me sleep at night too. Ha!
I recently switched to heel-up in my 16th year of drumming and came to the same conclusions.
It's also worth noting that those who play heel-down should sit far enough away from the pedals to allow their knee to rest behind their ankle. In other words; greater than 90 degrees at the knee. This allows for mobility through the shins.
If you're switching from heel-down to heel-up you'll need to sit closer than you're used to. You'll likely have a mindless tendency to adjust your throne back because everything feels too close. This will throw off your balance and make playing heel-up very difficult so keep an eye on your throne position. You also might need to re-evaluate the rest of your kit to accommodate for your new throne position.
hey there, Long time fan and follower of your channel. Kudos! The late, amazing Joe Morello totally believed in solid footboard kick pedals, which I have never seen any other jazz drummer use. DW used to produce a model for him. Pretty sure they don't make them anymore. Not a lot of drummers in general use these it seems. Why is this? And why is this type of pedal hardly ever discussed anywhere? I mean when a master like Morello believed it has real value...there must be something to it. Love to hear from you!
Yeah the Ghosts were very popular amongst jazz drummers originally with their solid pedal (what we call longboard these days) design. More inertial control I find as you are balancing in front of the the pivot point, more like riding a surfboard to a degree! When playing heel down in front of pivot means your heel is also moving and adding to stroke and you can dance around the pedal depending on the rhythms you are actually playing. More of a live feel than the static feel of a fixed heel plate I feel.
I have been playing for 25 years and for me I keep my bass pedal pressed on the bass drum head between beats. It works for me, but everyone is different. For me, I feel it helps me deliver a lot more power.
@@epiphanyvideomarketing7541 that’s valid, but it can mask some technique and setup deficiencies. That’s why I like to play as if I’m going to avoid planting the beater to encourage good setup and mechanics, then if I choose to plant the beater for musical reasons I always can.
@@8020drummer I’ll have to try your method
Hi i'm an advanced drummer with a degree in music. Only heel up playing. Idk why But my kick drum speed is pretty fast when going strait 16th notes , but when I try to do fast chops using my kick suddenly the weight of nearly my whole body is transferred to the kick between the bursts of hands and foot , I shove the beater in the head and that seems to be tiring me and slowing me down by a lot. Prevents me from flying around the kit more than 10 seconds as I build up fatigue really fast. Idk how to explain properly the issue but for me it's a sort of a balance problem. The weight of my body can't stay at my ass and I lose my balance during the fast chops because it's not just straight 16th that I can use anckle motion basketball technique. Never seen anyone adress this issue and Nate I think you may be the one to explain how do I fix this? If I try to transfer my weight on my ass only and use only ankle motion of my foot , then suddenly I can no longer provide enough force on the bass drum and It doesn't sound consistent
sounds like you're not sitting in an optimal position, so it's difficult to reach the pedal with most of the weight through your tailbones. What's more, you're probably not doing the "calf raise" thing; and instead using your hip flexor to pick up your foot, which results in a big weight transfer from your foot to your butt.
@@8020drummer Yeah I would definetely try to pay attention more on less hip flexor pick up and more calf raise. Thanks!
What do you use for internal kick drum muffling?
THE big thing most drummers get wrong about it is calling it a KICK drum in the first place. 🙄
You PLAY it, you don’t kick it.
what about the type of shoe you wear? Hard sole or soft sole? flip flops?
This. Makes. So. Much. Sense.
Hutch has a great course about feathering
I agree that for yourself you could and should optimize everything for yourself. But what do you think about jam or shared situations that just make you think that you should study thinking that you may adapt to any situation?
@@iskandercespedes7305 that’s important too
Thomas Pridgen said he uses his DW pedal right out of the box. No adjustments. It feels good that way to me as well
@@pastrnak8863 DWs are doing something magic with the cams that lets them feel lighter while still not requiring energy to retract them. The same amount of tension on other pedals feels like a lot of resistance. But I agree.
Johnathan Moffett said that's how he played them, so that's what I used to do too. It just works.
George Kollias mentioned!
This is the number one thing I find getting behind someone else's kit. It sucks because I don't want to mess with their spring tension!
The problem is that when you establish your comfortable footboard angle, now when you re-position the beater, the footboard angle changes.....
Im going to try these techniques, but being able to play heel down and heel up might work better for some people.
The first question you should ask of your students pertaining to the kick, is 'what are you wearing on your feet?' The shoe is everything when you want to pedal the pedal. Otherwise, the spring, yes, is everything.
I’m interested.
Whenever I play a house kit , I always need to increase the spring tension. I always thought I used more than most players?
can you link the video of the song starting at 1.55?
Right on time cuz that is a huge weakness of mine.
Gotta be honest, I like having easier ghost notes. Just gotta keep 'em under control.
This _might_ explain everything wrong with my kick technique. I have to try this some time.
6:40 awesome cat legs :)
I play heel down depending on song tempo. Higher tempos I play heel up.
Yeah. Been playing over fifty years and basically use whatever technique works best for a particular song (or part). Heel down for easy stuff. Heel up but just using ankle for faster stuff, heel-toe when I want to really blast it (as the heel impacting gives the loudest bass drum hit with fast rebound-no burying). All about feeling like your dancing on the pedals I find and if the drummer is dancing the audience probably will too!
damn caught u on a shorts day
Also, the length of the kick pedal is a deal breaker...most of them, in the old days, were way too short. Never worried about ghosties, except in the studio with very picky producers.
A It's a drum SET
B It's a BASS drum
nice rational funk reference
If the spring is tight enough to support the weight of your leg when you rest on the ball of your foot, how do you step on it hard enough to get a sound?
@@Frodohotep gotta wind up ;)
What about heal/toe? ( I play that with low spring tension)
Yeah, with a long board, heel-toe gives a quick rebound as you are letting pedal freely bounce, you don't resist pedal return. Direct drive works best for this as a chain can bunch up when you do that and give a weird slack in the stroke. When I use Ghosts or Axis I run them at very little tension (cause your heel on the longboard actually works like a higher tensioned spring).