Homosexuality in Ancient Egypt? The Tomb of Khnumhotep and Niankhkhnum
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- Опубликовано: 30 сен 2024
- This 5th Dynasty Tomb from ancient Egypt was discovered in the 1960s and still sparks controversy today! Were Khnumhotep and Niankhkhnum lovers? Brothers? Twins? Is this a case of queer erasure in history? Check out the video and resources below and let me know what you think in the comments.
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RESOURCES
Egyptian Twins by John Baines: ora.ox.ac.uk/o...
'Sentiment conjugal et figuration 'a l'Ancien Empire' by Nadine Cherpion
dial.uclouvain...
Same-Sex Desire, Conjugal Constructs, and the Tomb of Niankhkhnum and Khnumhotep by Greg Reeder www.jstor.org/...
A Mystery, Locked in Timeless Embrace, New York Times by John Noble Wilford www.nytimes.co...
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#ancientegypt #Archaeology #egypt #lgbtq
omg they were tombmates
😂😂
🤣🤣
😂😂
As my grandmother said: "There's nothing new at this world, maybe hidden but...existent." Thank for the video that shows the reality of the world as it was.
The Bible also says that theirs nothing new under the son ..but just because some politicians practiced it it doesn't mean it's a saintly thing to do politicians royal families etc are known to be corrupted people you wouldn't want your child to grow up to be that
"Nothing new under the sun" every thing is recycled!
It's possible that Khnumhotep and Niankhkhnum, if asked, "Are you lovers, or brothers?" would have just said, "Yes."
I really hope that level of sass existed in the ancient world. I’m sure it did
@@DigItWithRaven I was in Africa sometime ago and I saw two men holding hands as they were talking....they were not homosexual...the point is, that our idea of homosexuality is our modern understanding and we should be careful to project it to the past
@@pentz1 exactly. I come from a culture where you see man holding hands and sometimes sitting on eachothers lap all the time!
Based on my knowledge of ancient Egypt, my first thought whenever it was asked whether they were lovers or relatives was "Why not both?"
Incest was only common amongst Egyptian royalty whilst taboo amongst ordinary people.
Da! Of course there are homosexuals going back to beginning of humans, far far earlier than Egyptians.
Two men being groomers / hairdressers of the Pharaoh and being depicted as lovers, how much info do you need, Raven?
My vote is lovers 💕 the lotus flower and positioning are the biggest clues. Also, Conjoined twins would have had a low probability of living to adulthood, or even to puberty.
We can't ignore the possibility that evidence has purposely been destroyed to approve that it was allowed.
it could be that ancient egyptians may not have thought homosexual relationships as noteworthy so they dont talk about it much in their records. they may not have thought it was a big deal.
💡
The room just “Ohhhh” to your comment. 👏 love this
That’s your perverted fantasy and corruption of history to fit your gay agenda. The existence of other sexualities like bisexualities and trans and pansexualities would have been non-existent and too destructive of the Egyptian blood family.
Or too ashamed of them to record it
@VanquisherOfTroonsBecause only heterosexual couple perceived as normal and not for the other ones
Love this! While I love the conjoined twins theory, I believe the sniffing of the lotus flower to be the “smoking gun”. Another compelling video. Great work!
When I read the conjoined theory, it blew my mind! Would never have thought of that one
I am a Dutch historian with a great love for ancient Egypt. Often the egyptologists talk a bit dull but you put fire into the story. I love it. Keep up the good work!
LONG LIVE KIANKHKHNUM & KHNUMHOTEP!
The lotus flower and the hand placement *bingo* 🏳️🌈❤
Great video! Conjoined twins is hilarious to me 😂 🤯
Love the channel. Welcome back.
Yeah, not conjoined twins. The survivability would have been pretty damn low in that period. From the depictions I'd definitely go with gay.
Also--and for the first 2/3 I was "what's going on with Raven's nails"? and then I made the connection, thanks to my slow, old brain. (It was very distracting by the way.)
And, maybe I missed it, but as the names share the 'khmun', what do -'hotep' and 'Niankh-' mean, and is there a connection?
Another, unrelated thing--since you don't focus your camera in a way that I can read the titles of your books--can you do a "reading-list" video or something?
Again (again), love your channel. Be well.
Gotta be manicured when talking about manicurists! 💅 though I did pick a particularly bright and distracting colour haha
I’ll have to look more into the names, but I’m not sure what hotep and Niankh mean right off the bat… my ancient Egyptian hasn’t been used in a few years. And I can definitely do a reading list/bookshelf tour video! I’ve got one for my top archaeology books on my channel if you’re interested 😊
@@DigItWithRaven Hotep means peace or satisfaction. It's a loaf of bread on an offering table. Khnumhotep then means Khnum is satisfied or at peace. Ankh means life. Niankhkhnum means life belongs to Khnum.
LGBTQ has always been here. I'm bisexual/ queer and honor it. Even though I choose to harness my sexual energies.
I remember showing this to one of my colleagues and he said that they are kissing each other on the cheeks and are probably friends. I afterwards said, sarcastically, "and they were also roomates!" I hope someone does write a story about these two one day, it sounds perfect for a forbidden love story!
Cue that TikTok song about history hating lovers 🎶
He probably was his friend an why people have to think wickness that's why my GOD Jesus Christ called it an abomination. If people can be delivered off it it's just bad spirits ( demons in people) God will deliver you if u pray about it an repent an get baptized in Jesus Christ name Amen Acts2:38-42. People choose to live like that I didn't .I don't think about it anymore more because I have done it.for 3years but what so sad I knew better I knew it was wrong.but God will take people disgusting ways away from them I'm a testament of it . Amen
As a queer Egyptian, I really feel shamed when the government and archeologist keep lying about it. Ancient Egypt was very queer, and gay people exists in history and in every civilization. Only religion, colonization and oppression which keep hiding and obliterating it.
Sthu none of this existed back then and if it did it was only lgb. nothing more than that.
Homosexuality was forbidden in Egypt and would have gotten any a death sentence…
@@In-Gall_Tegidda_n_Tesemt Exactly and they keep on trying to jump to the conclusion that they're gay and they were brothers
@@AshyKnucklez757
The Egyptians were Hamites, and like their modern tribal counterparts such as the Maasai, homosexuality is a no no... That kind of thing was regarded as extremely backward, and by Egyptian standards immoral... That's why they never make any mention of it...
"After all these people are human as well", i like that. History is the story of all of us with our flows, kinks, habits, dreams... When historians get too serious they sometimes forget that. It's nice that there are guys that remind us to stay human and open minded even from beyond the grave
Glad to see you back at your regular content :)
So happy to be back! Lots more to come :)
they were tombmates
The detail of the lotus flower made me smile like crazy! I'm going to side with those who think that they are a gay couple, it's too sweet to imagine the tomb builders and the artists working to represent them in a way that makes them happy!
Thank you for this video!
Not being an archeologist or historian I'm free to ship these boys ;^)
This was on the history of ancient egypt podcast years ago! Ive been dying for it to get more attention
Such a great podcast! I've been wanting to make this video for a while, so I'm glad others are making content about them too :D
Thank you very much for sharing your marvelous curiosity and open mind in regard to archaeology. It seems that often there is way too little actual insight and actual vision in archaeology. You are lovely. Keep us informed by continuing to share with us.
Aweee thank you! Very glad that you liked the video. I'm hoping that archaeology continues to grow and evolve with more open discourse and the addition of new perspectives - it's the only way we'll be able to get a more holistic view of the past!
Thank you so much for this! I came upon it in researching a song cycle we're working on called 'Madmen In Love" - re-Queering Gay couples throughout history who've been erased. It's a project that started after making "Love Is On Our Side," the Love story between 13th century Islamic scholar/Sufi founder/adored poet Rumi and the dervish Shams of Tabris (- it is here: ruclips.net/video/bvf_FCGkDxE/видео.html ). Niankhkhnum and Khnumhotep are next on the list. Thank you for the history and for your wonderful perspective - on the greay area magic, and on how interpreting history can include non-literal exploration and - a suggestion that I've never heard before and thank you for - humour.
Isn't there a papyrus that's the oldest recorded instance of erotic art and it's done by ancient Egyptians where there's depictions of every kind of combination of sex play possible and impossible? That's not the same thing as a romantic pairing of men as described here. If, that papyrus does unambiguously depict men enjoying each other's company, it may be worth another video. :)
As a queer history lover I’m so glad that I live in a time where people are reconsidering their biases in history and archeology. I always imagine closeted victorian historians face palming every time their colleagues called sappho or achillies straight but not being able to say anything to the contrary. Of course we shouldn’t just run wild and not use our critical thinking skills and assume everyone was gay because that is just as biased as assuming everyone throughout time was perfectly straight. Loved the video Raven!
Thanks so much, Cara! 😊 and I agree, it’s all about finding that balance and being aware of your own inherent bias. It’s great that all these areas are opening up and we’re able to look at history through another lens without being shunned (or worse)
Queer history ? Lmao is that even a real term? Or is it the trendy label that replaced the label goth?
@@l_a_u_y8916
When i say Im a queer history lover i mean that i am queer (not straight) and also a history lover.
Also what do goths have to do with any of this, thats a whole other subculture that arose in the 1970s and 1980s around goth music and fashion.
An GOD still felt the same it's an abomination to him that's why he destroyed Rome an sadom and gamorh. This wickedness has spread like wild fire .praying for you that you find Jesus Christ before it's to late .it will cause you to go to hell . Acts2:38-42.Acts4:10-12 he loves u all find him before it's to late . Repent!
@donnalewis3975 people with a heart of light would not try to belittle people due to personal insecurities and trying to feel better about themselves from a fictitious text that has slavery as a good concept. That does not represent Devine Light and unconditional love. This is the only truth.
Love is Love I’m just tired of everything being labeled. Just mind your business. Love the Lord and be a good person. Just Love!! ❤
Them both being manicurists should be a dead giveaway that they are more than friends 😉
If they were conjoined, I would expect death to occur to both within a small time frame. That would have made for a really weird mummy, and there may have been issues with the canopic jars as some organs may have been shared.
As for the wife, it is possible she was erased as death occurred before the tomb could be properly finished. Alternatively, or in conjunction with above, a workman may have made a mistake during the carving and it was easier and more expedient to simply plaster over. Of course most likely plans were changed during construction, which is certainly not unheard of for ancient Egypt.
I have haven't heard of this tomb, I'm quite interested to find out what grave goods were found.
Thanks for the Vid. Maybe i missed it but is there information regarding their remains? I presume the grave was robbed or they have rotted away, else at least the conjoined twins theory would be easy to prove or disprove and maybe even the twin theory.
I forgot to mention in the video, but unfortunately their remains weren’t found in the tomb so there’s not biological way to confirm the sibling or twin theory
They were conjoined twins.
So how did they get to opposite ends of that long banquet table?
🤔
I have nothing to say other than good video. Just commenting to boost engagement. This channel deserves way more views.
I really appreciate this! Thank you so much 😊
Great Video!!!
I am a gay (cis) male. I am also someone who loves and has studied history all my life. I have always been fascinated with Ancient Egypt for as long as I can remember. (Along with Greece, Rome, Persia, Asia, Africa, Europe, and on and on infinitum.)
I would, of course, LOVE it if this was an actual tomb of an Ancient Egyptian gay couple! That said… I (unfortunately) don’t think there’s enough evidence to conclusively prove it, or disprove it. I wish there were. I do think/believe that there is undoubtedly enough evidence to easily support the gay couple conclusion.
I do find myself very intrigued with the conjoined twins hypothesis as well. There is definitely enough evidence to support that conclusion just as much as the gay couple possibility. I do agree with others here that have said that it would be extremely unlikely for conjoined twins to have survived into adulthood back then. Although - if they had, it would fit with all the facts that we do know. They would pretty much have had to have had the same job - it’s not like they could go their separate ways in the morning after breakfast. They would also have surely died within the same timeframe, especially if they had shared organs, but even if they didn’t share any organs… surviving while conjoined to a literal rotting corpse would not be a likely possibility for any extended period of time… nor would there be a good chance of surviving a surgery to separate you from your deceased twin. Shared organs aside, surviving any surgery back then - especially something that serious (if they could even do it at all)… would be an extremely unlikely result. So: being that they would likely have died very close together, it makes perfect sense for them to not only be buried together, but for them to share a tomb as well. Tombs, burial, and all things death related were very expensive. Sharing a tomb etc. would have not only have made for a common sense decision, but good financial sense as well. I think the depictions of them in the tomb make perfect sense as well, for either result - couple or conjoined. It was not customary for artists then to depict realism, in some cases/times it was even outright forbidden. Instead, the artists depicted an idealized version of people and things. After all… especially with tomb art… this was how you were going to be seen and remembered for all eternity. I don’t recall ever seeing a papyrus or tomb painting showing anyone fat, or old, or disfigured. Everyone is shown in profile (make sure and get my good side hehehe) looking young and strong and thin and healthy and happy. So… not showing them as actually being conjoined isn’t really surprising at all -> in fact it would be extremely surprising, shocking even, if they were shown that way. Of course the same can be said about showing them actually kissing or in a sexually suggestive pose if they were a gay couple. That can also explain the feast table painting. If the intention were to show the wife seated behind him… wouldn’t it also make sense to show the other man the same way? Yet he is seated with his back to a wall, with no room for a wife (or anyone) behind him. This could be taken in two ways: 1. The fact that one of them was seated against a wall with no room for his wife behind him - would both unbalance the image and make them seem like one was more important than the other. After all, the art is supposed to be idealized and balanced. So the wife was covered over. OR!!! - 2. Maybe it wasn’t his wife sitting behind him. Maybe it was the two of them sitting together. This would also be something totally unacceptable too. Not only would it again make the painting unbalanced, but it would have shown something completely unacceptable! Again it would have appeared to show one man as more important than the other… the one seated behind the other would appear to be in a lesser position. OR it would have shown the one behind as being in a sexual partner’s role - which would be absolutely forbidden to show. OR it would have shown them as actually being conjoined twins… which again would not be allowed at all. So therefore it would only make sense for them to both be shown as seated at the two heads of the table - no one behind them, as same and equal. This however doesn’t explain only one of them smelling the lotus flower. That could just be artistic expression. It was not something that was not allowed, just not common at that time (it did become a common thing later). Or it could be a very obvious and intentional image to show that they are indeed lovers.
Well… I have gone on long enough. I will end this tldr comment here with this parting observation. Whether these two men were Lovers / Conjoined Twins / Brothers / Friends / or whatever: No matter what - they BOTH worked for, and were in direct contact with the Pharaoh! They BOTH were in a role of responsibility to and for the Pharaoh. So they were BOTH - Very Important Men. They BOTH would have been powerful enough, and wealthy enough to be able to have a lavish tomb and burial. Either way - as a Gay Couple, or Conjoined Twins… they are BOTH equally as fascinating, equally important, and equally worthy of our interest, discussion, and admiration! Finally, and Most Importantly - no matter who they were or what their relationship to each other was or is -> they BOTH accomplished their goal!
They achieved immortality!!!
Here we are… still talking about them… remembering them… saying their names… all of these thousands of years later - after they died!
Maybe?!?!?! - it’s best that we don’t have the answers. While it would be amazing to know that we are in fact seeing the first and only known tomb of an Ancient Egyptian gay couple! - and it would be amazing as well to know that we are looking at the first ever tomb of a set of Conjoined Twins who beat all the odds and survived! The fact is: Not Knowing makes it a mystery, and keeps our interest alive. It gives them BOTH the very immortality they sought out and deserve, and thanks to us - they achieved.
what's with all that yapping you weirdo💀
Thanks for your balanced presentation. I was wondering how I may give you a link to another of my papers on the tomb you should add to your bibliography? Not sure if links are allowed in your comments section. Thanks for mentioning my work in your video.
Thank you so much for speaking up for the lgbtq+ community and being so respectful and full of wit!❤
Raven! My FAVORITE Canadian expatriate! You know I'm an actor. So I have some awareness. When humming a Cole Porter tune...one can remember that he was married BUT preferred the "company" of males. In the movie NIGHT AND DAY, the Cole Porter story starring Cary Grant, one of his in real life friends was Monty Woolley, was also gay and his companion was described as "courier-secretary-travelling companion". So there were clues. Then while watching a RUclips reactor reacting to WEDNESDAY, she was shocked and a bit upset that Enid was chasing a male. Even though nothing hinted at a sexual attraction to Wednesday. Also, personally, I would possibly only make the "hot buns" comment to a lady after I married her. Possibly before.
I think we all need a “courier-secretary-travelling companion” in our lives!
So glad you're back and being awesome!
So glad to be back!!
The conjoined twins theory work very well to explain the unicity of the finding, I have a hard time imaging a lot of such twins reaching such a hig position in society and, by consequence, having the money to commission a non-standard tomb. But the gay lover One Is so much sweeter.
I think we need two fanfictions, one suitable for children and the other ... not so much.
It’s really interesting to look at how different ancient cultures viewed and treated people with disabilities. In many cases they were celebrated and reached higher positions. I’m no expert but there’s a lot of work being done in this field lately
@@DigItWithRaven very interesting.
Just shows gay people always existed! But humans often tried to deny it! 🌈💪🔥👍🌈
If they're conjoined, why would they depict them at a banquet sitting on opposite side of the table?
Unless the erased figure
Was not the wife, but the conjoined twin could they have wanted to be separated in the afterlife?
Ridiculous. They were brothers. Kings are depicted in the same embrace with gods/divinities. Yet another falacy to justify why only traditional African perspectives correctly care-take the legacy of Kemet as it should be revered. Not debauchery for the sake of entertainment.
I am curious as to how many references(good, bad or indifferent) to same sex couples there are in Egyptology. I can't really find anything outside of these two. The thing is that there is such a bias against it in that part of the world, and in the western world in general that we could just be denied any actual depictions by those that want to see the world one way. Until that portion of the world becomes less controlled by the sons of Abraham I fear we won't know a lot about what actually went on there.
I would like to remind at the possibility that there is way way way more evidence of homosexuality being normal back then that could have been purposely destroyed by archeologists later.
Everytime an American says Michael Angelo instead of Michelangelo, ten puppies die.
Did they find the mummies? That could answer some questions.
We’ve been gay since the beginning of time all this is hidden to us but now newer generations can piece together what we now can draw our own conclusions. I believe gay famous and peoples of prestige had open gay relationships
Loved this video!! Thank you Raven, welcome back!
AS A GAY PERSON I DPMT UNDERSTAND WHY PEOPLE IN ANY TIME HAVE A PROBLEM WITH WHO I LIKE AS A PERSON
808 Pacocha Squares
Okay you’re my favorite RUclips historian now
OMG thank you so much!!!
Girl you deff need to read Ennead
“This ain’t no bro hug okayyy”😂😂😂
THANK YOU FOR THIS VIDEO AND YOU ARE A PRETTY WOMAN APPRECIATE YOUR KNOWLEDGE
Greeks weren’t the first folks to “go Greek”. If it hadn’t been happening no one would’ve thought to prohibit it, just the same as prostitution. Both reduced the likelihood of higher birth rates.
Something to consider is that sexuality, especially between family members, was not necessarily frowned upon. Especially in the upper Escalon (sp?). It was even encouraged, according to some, which is one of the things that directly lead to the fall of the civilization. Plus don't forget that in a number of societies, homosexuality wasn't even really a thing. I don't mean that it wasn't there, it was more of a "Love whomever you're with!" kind of situation. It was definitely prevalent in Buddhist sects.
I'm all for the interpretation that they were couple, though of course I'm not unwilling to also consider other interpretations. I'm a trans woman and an archaeology student and for my own thesis next year I'm hoping to discuss a Roman burial that may or may not represent a trans individual in the Roman Empire, so I love to see more of these sorts of queer interpretations of ancient archaeology and see that we (queer folks in general) have always existed no matter the time, place or culture.
Oh wow your thesis sounds so interesting!!
@@DigItWithRaven it should be, just hoping I'll get the appropriate permissions to work with the remains of this individual and properly investigate the questions I'd need to look into. Even if not it'll be a good case study to jump into a wider review of trans identity in Roman culture
Emperor Elagabalus was known to have male lovers and asked his main one to call him His wife. He is also “reported” to be the first person in history to ask Roman doctors if they could perform a transgender operation on him.
What was the likelihood that the mother of one was wetnurse to the other - with the wetnurse's son being raised as compaion whipping boy in lieu of the other?
The brothers theory holds the least water imo. Queer or conjoined are the ones I find the most plausible, but that's of course taking into account that I literally know barely anything about the subject.
Scandalous! Oh my
It looked like I meant that they were a reflection of each other, but ofc we can only speculate
As far as cojurned twins, couldn’t they just look at the buried bodies? Enjoyed the the video
We don’t have any burial remains unfortunately 😭
Ever watch those documentaries where twins who are apart sometimes have same jobs or names. Pretty interesting.
The part where the wife was edited out of the banquet scene...
And it was the more masculine of the 2 who had to edit her out.
Meanwhile the more feminine one is sittin pretty on the other end
holding his flower...
Does this need a fanfic?
🫢
RUclips suggested me this video and i am so glad it did, even if Khnumhotep and Niankhkhnum were twins or brothers they still can be lovers, correct me if i am wrong, but love and marriage between siblings were pretty normal in ancient Egypt, right?! so Khnumhotep and Niankhkhnum can be twins and lovers too and i totally agree with you on what you have mentioned @4:35 these are people from different times and cultures which lots of archaeologists and people seem to forget and want them to fit into our modern society norms.
thank you so much Raven, you are awesome 💖💖💖💖💖
Siblings marriage weren't common in ancient Egypt among non-royals, however I don't think it was banned either. Anyway, they are men, so it could be treated different.
Love the nails, so eye-catching. I loved this video, keep it up! Currently taking an Archaeology of Death course for my history degree and it's all so extremely fascinating.
Ahh thank you!! 💅 they’re even brighter in person haha. That arch course sounds amazing! As someone who focussed on funerary archaeology, I’m biased but I think it’s the best 😉
That sounds like a fascinating class! So jealous!!
I loved this! ❤
Pure lies thats his_story u talking about not fubu..
????? Where do you see any lie?
Great topic! Great video! Great to hear so many amazing things seem to be coming together for you professionally, academically -- Come again? What's that now? Lean in a little closer. I've got your Oxford comma around here somewhere -- and personally.
Keep rocking the boat in the not-yet-sufficiently-free world!
Never been more excited about an Oxford comma comment!!
Heyyy you.....
I just missed you........🌸🌸
Hey hey! Glad to be back!
"The gays of this culture during this time aren't like they are today...." [sic] is an example of Philosophical Bias in history/anthropology/sociology. Please show me this supposedly monolithic experience of being LGBTIQ+ today? I mean LGBTIQ+ peoples are so diverse there's a "+" symbol in the descriptor. Likewise the experience of being a person who fits within that very broad group of descriptions of human sexuality doesn't even mesh within the same culture and between class structures, or sub-cultures; little alone across the 6,000+ cultures of the planet today.
Established same sex coupling in not a modern construct. So, the danger of imposing one's modern perception or interpretation bias does not necessarily have to be an issue.
They were manicurists i mean come on now. Lets Occam's razor this.
🚩⚗️🚩
It is great that you are filming again. Very interesting video
😂"they were manicurist"😂 ok that says it all😂
Interesting.
Glad you think so!
Come on … they were manicurists
🏳🌈🏳🌈🏳🌈
and it's LGBT history month in the UK!
No Greeks have that title!!!
You are so cute 😂❤
I ship it-
I think that there have always been people who are gay . No big deal , but how far do we approve of this ideal ? Just a thought.
Where are their bodies?
Missing.
Thats a reach thats not what i see in the paiting.
In painting there are two men who noses touch each other. That is ancient depicting of kiss. You can speculate wheter relationship was platonic or romantic, but images depict kiss.
@@pendragonsxskywalkers9518they are brother and i was talking about the cave paiting. Its a paiting of aman running. We accept diverse sexuality we dont have to lie about it.
@@elski5067 There is no evidence they are brothers. Their parents are not named in tomb. They could be brothers or lovers - both interpretations are possible.
@@pendragonsxskywalkers9518 yes there is it's a tomb with their parents also buried in. Even gods do this embrace in Egypt. Bet you didn't even read about the topic you just wish it could be true lol
@@elski5067 There is no tomb of their parents. Their parents are unknown. ' Even gods do this embrace in Egypt.' - It's not about embrace, it's about noses toiching. This was what lovers did. And I assure you - I read about topic. That's how I know they parents tomb was not found. And actually, if they would be conjoined twins, that would be super excitement to me - as it would be interesting medical example of two unseparable twins surviving into adulthood. But there is no proof to this.
💜
Outstanding presentation !!!
Thank you so much!
💅
Based on the inscription, i would say TWINS
Only problem with your theory is:
1. Lotus flowers
2. One of them saying the other's backside was "lovely"
That is a homosexual couple, but any measure or definition.
@@goUkraine Only problem with your theory is the inscription..."he came forth with me from the womb on the same day."
@@pentz1 That is not about THIS couple. It was about other couple she was talking about.
This is what happens when people plagarise Nubian/African stories and artefacts. Anything seen and drawn on walls, floors, doors or else where should be considered as plagiarism, from early vandals
bro they didnt even kiss 💀💀💀💀💀
Touching noses meant kiss in ancient Egyptian art.
If one conjoined twin dies, surely the other will die at the same time or soon after. That would explain them being buried together perhaps?
Adam and Steve 😜
Fascinating video!
Glad you liked it!!
The ancient Egyptians did not embrace homosexuality, as evidenced by references in their Pyramid Texts and the Book of the Dead. It is important to acknowledge their historical customs and practices without imposing modern perspectives. African cultures, including the ancient Egyptians, generally held a unanimous stance against homosexuality. It is essential to approach this topic with respect and appreciation for their cultural heritage.
I didn't realize how wicked this world until u start searching for history.i know that Africa will put u in jail or kill u for laying with another man but i read on egyptians an homosexuals did do that in Roman an Arabs times..they both he ad a lot of homosexual but not as much as romans .but the gays could be lying to make those men look bad but i doubt not romans was wicked people . They all were they all believed to n other Gods except one but Romans finally stop that others God's an had Jesus Christ. The white supremacy Jesus Christ not all but the majority..alot of hatred out there . Amen I pray for the world that they all find God an follow his commandments an be obedient to him 🙏♥️ Acts2:38-42Acts4:10-12.
This text interpretation is uncertain. There is no evidence of any penalty on male lovers in ancient Egypt either.
these are twin brothers dont spread misinformation on cushitic peoples ancient forefathers
There is absolutely no evidence they were twins. It is possible, of course, but unproven. Also - it's Egypt, not modern world. They could be twins and lovers...
@@pendragonsxskywalkers9518 they were for sure twins brotherly love u realize ancient egypt is not a western culture it was in africa and next to middle east both areas which never supported same sex relationships infact were very much against it
@@pendragonsxskywalkers9518 the modern world is the one that promotes this bs while ancient cultures didnt only rome/egypt did which western cultutre comes from if u look at egypt its close to levent and saudi where the 3 abrahamic relgions come from which are all against homosexuality all afro asiatic tribes are even today which ancient egyptians would fall under the cushitic and semeitic groups never did this
@@cushitic173 'they were for sure twins brotherly love' - No evidence to that.
'ancient egypt is not a western culture' - It isn't modern Africa/Middle East either. There is no evidence of penalty to same gender relationship in ancient Egypt.
@@pendragonsxskywalkers9518 ancient africa and ancient middle east had the same viewpoint on homosexuality it was never allowed i know ancient egypt well they wouldnt allow it
The thing is not all cultures view men hugging or kissing as a romantic thing. If you've spent time to Europe or Middle East and Asia, men do show affection to eachother in different ways even among those continents it differes greatly. Also most cultures use honorifics such as "brother" & "sister" to those were not related too. I think we have to remember to take our western bias lens out of this, its hard to understand if you haven't lived amongst these cultures.
Yes! Completely agree. We need so much more discourse between cultures so we can do our best to rewrite a lot of history that was assumed under a western bias
True, but what is your point?
This tomb had two men depicted not only in intimate embrace, but also with Lotus flowers. Oh, and one of them remarked that the other's backside was "lovely". They were also buried together for all eternity. Oh, and no references to offspring. At all.
You are BLIND and WILLFULLY SO.
You can try and twist it as much as you like, but that is a homosexual couple. Or at least bisexual.
You are right, however in ancient Egypt this type iconogrpahy was restricted to couples. Also, in Egypt lovers did reffer each other as 'brother and sister'. Even in today cultures it happens - form example word 'soulmate' in my language means 'brotherly soul'.
They are not the first but rather the people of Lut who are during the sumerian era during Abraham and they were the ones God sent his wrath on for this act. So egyptian are not the first.
People are putting too much in this. It merely represents team work. It reminds me of the time I was in the Army and one of the guys made a comment in a group that I had a nice body. It was a true statement and merely an observation not a declaration. Everyone present was straight and nothing was meant by it.
But here you don't have any statement. You have image of two guys touching by noses - which in Egypt usually meant kiss of married couple. Now, it does not mean they certainly were lovers - however that is why we think they could be in first place.
How accurate is it to leave a historical event where there is sketchy information / data , to modern interpretation? are you saying that ancient Egyptian culture is the same of our modern culture? no data to support.
Homosexuality is not as modern as you think
I love when contemporary political activism gets injected into history. Just kidding. Actually I hate everything about it.