So most of the macro should be coming from fat? So in other words, your meat should have as much fat in it as possible? If that is true, what are the best sources of fat so as not to spike blood sugar in carb rich fats.
GREAT video! Thank u! A couple of questions for seniors' & vegetarians' considerations: is vegan collagen beneficial? What about other types of protein powders like casein?
According to research, berberine appears to have a downregulating effect on insulin-like growth factor 1 (IGF-1) levels, primarily by inhibiting the IGF-1 receptor (IGF-1R), which can be beneficial in managing conditions like diabetic cardiomyopathy where excessive IGF-1 signaling can contribute to fibrosis; however, the exact impact can depend on the tissue and context, with some studies showing potential for berberine to increase IGF-1 levels in certain situations.
Nice video Rimon, I enjoyed watching it. Very interesting. I am interested to discover more about effective cycling the building of the resistance training days and the balance of garbage collection in the autophagy days 🏋️♂️
Just a thought: maybe if you want to build more muscle, listen to people who have built a lot of muscle. None of these ”experts” do. If you want to live long, then your guess is as good as mine, since none of these experts have done that either.
Some thoughts. 1. Your personal example of muscle gain doesn't prove anything. It is expected for skinny guys to gain up to 20-25 lbs of almost purely lean mass in the first several months of hypetrophy training. 2. It is true that muscles desensitize to protein intake if you increase it, but it's not like it makes protein synthesis in the cells worse, it just makes extra protein redundant. 3. You site all these people who say their own protein requirements, yet none of them are experts in building muscle. We have several meta analysis showing you can expect to see increases in muscle gains with up to 1.6 g of protein per kg, depending on individual. Granted, there is some new research suggesting that protein from whole food sources has a more anabolic effect and you might need less of it, but it's early to tell and there are no direct studies on muscle gain yet. 4. Link beetwen protein intake and age is still far from clear. For example, even though autophagy decreases with higher protein intake, cell's protein turnover is still high - meaning that we have reasons to expect the cells to still recycle old proteins. You can also increase your autohpagy while eating high protein - be exersising and/or decreasing your calories. Longo's FMD is interesting and promising theraputic intervention, but I do wonder how important is macronutrient composition of FMD. I don't think Longo did any studies trying high protein, for example. 5. You showed that protein deruction reduces IGF-1, but a) it's serum levels, which tells very little by itself, since we are interested in it's effect in the cell b) IGF-1's contribution to aging is a purely mechanistic assumption as far as I know. Do we have studies at least in mice that show causation? 6. If I were to accept your premice, it doesn't clear to me how I should translate that to my muscle building goals. Must I take protein in cycles? How would that look like? How would I know what cycle lengh and what protein intake is ok? You say that we should take more protein on exercising days, but then correctly add that on the following day our protein requirements are still higher than evarage. Well, if I train 3 times a week, which is a standart beginner strategy, then I pretty much have to eat extra protein every day, so what's the point to cycle? Taking all these poinst into account, I don't see any reason to take less than 1.6 g per kg if my goals are to maximize muscle gain. Yeah, I would probably still gain majority of potential muscle with, for example, 1 g per kg, but if there are no downsides to taking 1.6 (besides extra money spent), why would I eat less? If I missed something in your video please correct me.
This is very good reasoning. For me consuming 1.6g of protein would lead to uric acid increase (purines), and that is biomarker going in the wrong direction.
@EVanDoren Search a video "How Fast Can Skinny Guys Build Muscle Naturally?" by Bony to Beasty. He has been coaching skinny guys for 10 years, started off as skinny himself, he explains all of it and shows examples.
@ If for you specifically this is bad, then sure, it's your choice. But uric acid is a metabolic byproduct of protein turnover, so it is expected to increase with increases protein consumption. If you don't have any other symptoms, than it's just your kidney doing their job.
So, the general take away seems to be, cycle between a high fat low protein diet (for autophagy and fat loss), and a high protein moderate fat diet (for muscle growth and maintenance)... and never eat a high carb diet. Then the more specific recommendation is, emphasize the high protein moderate fat cycle after 65 to avoid sarcopenia. In specific food terms, an example diet would be eating a big daily salad of non-starchy veggies (goes with either cycle). Accomplishing high fat low protein would be something like a breakfast of 3-4 egg yolks with perhaps one egg white, scrambled with a few pads of cream cheese. Then a lunch of 80/20 beef (not much) mixed with a cup of sour cream and maybe salsa. Then the big salad for dinner. After a few weeks of that 'autophagy diet', switch to higher amounts of protein by using full eggs, and more meat in your lunch (or more nuts or beans if you're vegetarian). Am I getting this?
At 20:56 Dr. Patrick indicates that previous studies "...were using tools that were underestimating the losses of amino acids...", but I don't think I have heard that they really have repeated these studies from Dr. Layne Norton who is an expert in protein because these studies are very hard to do. Now this does not mean that those studies were final but I would like to see Dr. Patrick's source.
How much protein one needs depends, all other criteria being equal, is related to whether a person is an ectomorph (more protein), a mesomorph (moderate amount), or endomorph (smaller amounts.)
What are some potential benefits of TMG? TMG may help improve heart health, TMG may help boost athletic performance, TMG may help regulate insulin levels, and TMG may help reduce inflammation.
Food for thought - at 70 Kgs, 70 yo, 172.5 cms, I've used approx 70 x 1.5 = 100 gms protein daily. But my lean body mass is 39 Kgs, so that's only 50 gms protein on work out days. As you say, I'm eating twice what I need. That means increasing fat to maintain energy. As a Ketovore, this looks very much like Prof Seyfrieds' anti cancer diet. Love some feedback !
It would seem that smart doctors would analyze their patients' stool for undigested protein, and then develop a dosing of HCl for meals, shakes, etc. - and then follow that with the same kind of process for digestive enzyme supplementation. Also, IIRC GH is what stimulates the liver production of IGF-1, is it not? I'm 72 y.o. and one of the winning combinations for me is a shake of full spectrum collagen and EAA powder - and on workout days I make sure I take EAAs about an hour before bedtime. It seems as though I get the gains fairly quickly without any symptomatic downsides. RLT also helps, of course.
I have read many books, I listened to many RUclips videos by many of the world's leading gurus and health experts but nothing came close to the hidden herbs by anette ray. I recommend everyone giving it a read.
Hi Rimon, can you please also do longevity research for other macronutrients - Fat and Carbohydrates? So it will make a total of 100% in ratio of these 3 macronutrients? Thank you
So carbs and sugars reduce autophagy. You say that we need less protein intake because autophagy will make up the rest. But therefor only on a low carb diet? This means you need energy from elsewhere, eg fat. Right? I'm disappointed that you never discussed fasting, eg, deliberate autophagy (instead of somehow magically getting your diet right so that it is "fasting mimicking"). I'm wondering about higher proteine intake when active, cycling to lower intake for Igf1 sensitivity and autophagy COMBINED with fasting. Even further, could the weak autophagy elderly experience be due to high carb lifestyles all their life? Could low carb all their life change it? What if deliberate fasting trains autophagy like a "muscle" so that when you become elderly your are "fitter". You also didn't go into why Attia worries about protein, which is that it is a big problem for the elderly to have lost muscle, since muscle protects in various ways . You could've discussed higher proteine intake with low carb to build muscle when you're young (which seems to reduce longevity), but because you have more muscle, it will protect you when older, thus increasing longevity
I have doubts that a higher intake of protein for people over 65 or 75 as suggested is really needed. My parents who did not do any sport, who did not live really healthy, live(d) to 90+. For SURE their protein intake was below 1g/kg bodymass for a very long time if not for their livetime. It would be interesting to research if autophagy really will be less effective (fasting not usefull anymore?) in aging people and WHY.
Too high carb you shut down autophagy thereby increasing protein requirements. Too little carb you increase lean tissue breakdown to provide your brain and glucodependant organs and cells with glucose. So what is the sweet spot as far as carb intake is concerned?
You're 100% right. Zero carb will eat your lean tissues too. We start a course on that today (first session) together with me live. You will customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE: wellnessmessiah.com
Looking at it from another perspective, Gary Fraser and Walter Willet PhDs are expert researcher on effects of diet on health and longevity. None of their finding point to a high protein diet as helpful for health or longevity.
I corrected all of the following health problems by eating the correct human diet: obesity, prediabetes, loose teeth, bleeding gums, sensitive teeth cold sores, blocked sinuses, mouth breathing, left eye twitches (tetany) heartburn, calf cramps, yellow stool, blood in stool edema below the knees, painful feet when walking, sunburn is less shoulder, back and neck pain after waking, lower back pain and stiffness Yes, we are carnivores so eat more meat! 6+ Years on the carnivore lifestyle now :) Eat Meat, Not Too Little, Mostly Fat
@@markaguilera493 Mostly Beef, Lamb, Pork, Kangaroo, Eggs then less of Cheese, Dairy, Fish, Chicken. I'm still addicted to chocolate so I will have some chocolate about 4 to 6 times per year but overall not much of that.
@@markaguilera493 I tried grapes for a week once but only managed 5 days and found that I was very unsatisfied after eating and my teeth started getting sensitive again. I had some fruit in Feb 2024 when I was testing a continuous glucose monitor but other than those or a cheat meal no. I do sometimes add a potato or an onion into a stew but not always :) So very little vegetables and just about zero fruit. When I have a binge, I plan and do it properly with chocolate.
Why don't you interview Dr. Stu Phillips or Gabrielle Lyons. This video is very one sided and biased towards a low protein diet. Why would I take advice on protein intake from someone that is significantly underweight?
Haha. High protein is 1-1.25 g per lb of BW? That is actually a low protein diet unless you follow the USDA guidelines. If you follow those guidelines, you'll probably become a diabetic, so your protein intake will become irrelevant. So, in other words, don't listen to the USDA or the info from this video
kilo, not lb. We start a course on that today (first session) together with me live. You will customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE: wellnessmessiah.com
I find adjusting the speed of RUclips videos to be really helpful. With videos like this, I pause, rewind, slow down, and speed up at different parts so that I make sure I am fully understanding what I am hearing.
Which "expert" is right on protein? The correct answer; Dr Micael Greger. Read vis messet book on the Longevity topic HOW NOT TO AGE and find out how protein restriction to 0,8 g/kg bodymass/day (1,0 for seniors) is the only method that effects all eleven hallmarks of aging in a positive way. Even better for sting If all proteins comes from plants.
I don't see the point of your experiment. It only proves that if you are deficient in protein and then get back to what you need. Muscles will grow. This is not groundbreaking and is the same for caloric consumption.
The way this presentation is handled this guy thinks every BODY is the same some of his ideas are maybe some what possibly true a lot of his ideas are questionable at best .
i know my comment will probably get burried somewhere but for everyone reading this go find the hidden herbs book by anette ray. you can come back and thank me later
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
wellnessmessiah.com
So most of the macro should be coming from fat? So in other words, your meat should have as much fat in it as possible?
If that is true, what are the best sources of fat so as not to spike blood sugar in carb rich fats.
For everyone reading this, finding the banned book called “the hidden herbs” by anette ray should be your top priority
This is a unique insight that I've never heard anybody else say.
What a fantastic breakdown, explained so well! Thank you so much! ❤
Respect for the hard work.
Thanks for your attention and abiity to recognize hard work
Excellent presentation!
High IQ and production value video, thanks for the summary ❤
Love Brazil. Thanks for your attention and abiity to recognize IQ and production
GREAT video! Thank u! A couple of questions for seniors' & vegetarians' considerations: is vegan collagen beneficial? What about other types of protein powders like casein?
According to research, berberine appears to have a downregulating effect on insulin-like growth factor 1 (IGF-1) levels, primarily by inhibiting the IGF-1 receptor (IGF-1R), which can be beneficial in managing conditions like diabetic cardiomyopathy where excessive IGF-1 signaling can contribute to fibrosis; however, the exact impact can depend on the tissue and context, with some studies showing potential for berberine to increase IGF-1 levels in certain situations.
Nice video Rimon, I enjoyed watching it. Very interesting. I am interested to discover more about effective cycling the building of the resistance training days and the balance of garbage collection in the autophagy days 🏋️♂️
We do that here:
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
WellnessMessiah.com/
Just a thought: maybe if you want to build more muscle, listen to people who have built a lot of muscle. None of these ”experts” do. If you want to live long, then your guess is as good as mine, since none of these experts have done that either.
Simpleton
Some thoughts.
1. Your personal example of muscle gain doesn't prove anything. It is expected for skinny guys to gain up to 20-25 lbs of almost purely lean mass in the first several months of hypetrophy training.
2. It is true that muscles desensitize to protein intake if you increase it, but it's not like it makes protein synthesis in the cells worse, it just makes extra protein redundant.
3. You site all these people who say their own protein requirements, yet none of them are experts in building muscle. We have several meta analysis showing you can expect to see increases in muscle gains with up to 1.6 g of protein per kg, depending on individual. Granted, there is some new research suggesting that protein from whole food sources has a more anabolic effect and you might need less of it, but it's early to tell and there are no direct studies on muscle gain yet.
4. Link beetwen protein intake and age is still far from clear. For example, even though autophagy decreases with higher protein intake, cell's protein turnover is still high - meaning that we have reasons to expect the cells to still recycle old proteins. You can also increase your autohpagy while eating high protein - be exersising and/or decreasing your calories. Longo's FMD is interesting and promising theraputic intervention, but I do wonder how important is macronutrient composition of FMD. I don't think Longo did any studies trying high protein, for example.
5. You showed that protein deruction reduces IGF-1, but a) it's serum levels, which tells very little by itself, since we are interested in it's effect in the cell b) IGF-1's contribution to aging is a purely mechanistic assumption as far as I know. Do we have studies at least in mice that show causation?
6. If I were to accept your premice, it doesn't clear to me how I should translate that to my muscle building goals. Must I take protein in cycles? How would that look like? How would I know what cycle lengh and what protein intake is ok? You say that we should take more protein on exercising days, but then correctly add that on the following day our protein requirements are still higher than evarage. Well, if I train 3 times a week, which is a standart beginner strategy, then I pretty much have to eat extra protein every day, so what's the point to cycle?
Taking all these poinst into account, I don't see any reason to take less than 1.6 g per kg if my goals are to maximize muscle gain. Yeah, I would probably still gain majority of potential muscle with, for example, 1 g per kg, but if there are no downsides to taking 1.6 (besides extra money spent), why would I eat less?
If I missed something in your video please correct me.
This is very good reasoning.
For me consuming 1.6g of protein would lead to uric acid increase (purines), and that is biomarker going in the wrong direction.
20-25? You are delusional.
@EVanDoren Search a video "How Fast Can Skinny Guys Build Muscle Naturally?" by Bony to Beasty. He has been coaching skinny guys for 10 years, started off as skinny himself, he explains all of it and shows examples.
@ If for you specifically this is bad, then sure, it's your choice. But uric acid is a metabolic byproduct of protein turnover, so it is expected to increase with increases protein consumption. If you don't have any other symptoms, than it's just your kidney doing their job.
Mostly just concerned about high uric acid concentrations in blood which may potentially lead to gout and kidney stones.
So, the general take away seems to be, cycle between a high fat low protein diet (for autophagy and fat loss), and a high protein moderate fat diet (for muscle growth and maintenance)... and never eat a high carb diet. Then the more specific recommendation is, emphasize the high protein moderate fat cycle after 65 to avoid sarcopenia. In specific food terms, an example diet would be eating a big daily salad of non-starchy veggies (goes with either cycle). Accomplishing high fat low protein would be something like a breakfast of 3-4 egg yolks with perhaps one egg white, scrambled with a few pads of cream cheese. Then a lunch of 80/20 beef (not much) mixed with a cup of sour cream and maybe salsa. Then the big salad for dinner. After a few weeks of that 'autophagy diet', switch to higher amounts of protein by using full eggs, and more meat in your lunch (or more nuts or beans if you're vegetarian). Am I getting this?
Not an expert, but that sounds delicious and nutritious.
At 20:56 Dr. Patrick indicates that previous studies "...were using tools that were underestimating the losses of amino acids...", but I don't think I have heard that they really have repeated these studies from Dr. Layne Norton who is an expert in protein because these studies are very hard to do. Now this does not mean that those studies were final but I would like to see Dr. Patrick's source.
How much protein one needs depends, all other criteria being equal, is related to whether a person is an ectomorph (more protein), a mesomorph (moderate amount), or endomorph (smaller amounts.)
Thank you, Rimon. This was a high quality video with useful information. Thanks again.
What are some potential benefits of TMG? TMG may help improve heart health, TMG may help boost athletic performance, TMG may help regulate insulin levels, and TMG may help reduce inflammation.
Another great presentation, including what looks like a ten pack!
Food for thought - at 70 Kgs, 70 yo, 172.5 cms, I've used approx 70 x 1.5 = 100 gms protein daily.
But my lean body mass is 39 Kgs, so that's only 50 gms protein on work out days.
As you say, I'm eating twice what I need.
That means increasing fat to maintain energy.
As a Ketovore, this looks very much like Prof Seyfrieds' anti cancer diet.
Love some feedback !
We do that here:
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
WellnessMessiah.com/
It would seem that smart doctors would analyze their patients' stool for undigested protein, and then develop a dosing of HCl for meals, shakes, etc. - and then follow that with the same kind of process for digestive enzyme supplementation. Also, IIRC GH is what stimulates the liver production of IGF-1, is it not? I'm 72 y.o. and one of the winning combinations for me is a shake of full spectrum collagen and EAA powder - and on workout days I make sure I take EAAs about an hour before bedtime. It seems as though I get the gains fairly quickly without any symptomatic downsides. RLT also helps, of course.
Great content!
I'm 72 so I could have just watched the last 3 minutes of this 39 minute video 😮
In fairness, Rimon did say at the beginning that "if you're over 65, this is not for you".
Into everyone’s life a little rain must fall…
Better to understand the whole thing. Otherwise, tips won't get you very far - you need to exand your mind. I'm saying it with true caring.
Great video, ty
Are you suggesting to do protein cycling to enhance muscle usage of amino acids? Maybe will give it a go. Just need to figure out the cycling amounts.
We do that here:
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
WellnessMessiah.com/
What are your IGF numbers before or after you built additional lbs of muscle?
excellent
I track my food but don’t target any macronutrient and I’m surprised that my protein intake always averages 17%.
Is it true too much I-GF1 causes prostate enlargement?
I have read many books, I listened to many RUclips videos by many of the world's leading gurus and health experts but nothing came close to the hidden herbs by anette ray. I recommend everyone giving it a read.
Hi Rimon, can you please also do longevity research for other macronutrients - Fat and Carbohydrates? So it will make a total of 100% in ratio of these 3 macronutrients? Thank you
Yes, We do that here:
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
WellnessMessiah.com/
@@WellnessMessiah thank you. I will definitely check you link.
Just look at Bryan Johnson's diet. It's basically cruciferous vegetables, beans, lentils, nuts, seeds, berries and collagen peptides.
So carbs and sugars reduce autophagy. You say that we need less protein intake because autophagy will make up the rest. But therefor only on a low carb diet? This means you need energy from elsewhere, eg fat. Right?
I'm disappointed that you never discussed fasting, eg, deliberate autophagy (instead of somehow magically getting your diet right so that it is "fasting mimicking").
I'm wondering about higher proteine intake when active, cycling to lower intake for Igf1 sensitivity and autophagy COMBINED with fasting. Even further, could the weak autophagy elderly experience be due to high carb lifestyles all their life? Could low carb all their life change it?
What if deliberate fasting trains autophagy like a "muscle" so that when you become elderly your are "fitter".
You also didn't go into why Attia worries about protein, which is that it is a big problem for the elderly to have lost muscle, since muscle protects in various ways . You could've discussed higher proteine intake with low carb to build muscle when you're young (which seems to reduce longevity), but because you have more muscle, it will protect you when older, thus increasing longevity
I have doubts that a higher intake of protein for people over 65 or 75 as suggested is really needed. My parents who did not do any sport, who did not live really healthy, live(d) to 90+. For SURE their protein intake was below 1g/kg bodymass for a very long time if not for their livetime.
It would be interesting to research if autophagy really will be less effective (fasting not usefull anymore?) in aging people and WHY.
Too high carb you shut down autophagy thereby increasing protein requirements. Too little carb you increase lean tissue breakdown to provide your brain and glucodependant organs and cells with glucose. So what is the sweet spot as far as carb intake is concerned?
You would only break down muscle for gluconeugenesis if your caloric needs aren't met from protein and fat.
You're 100% right. Zero carb will eat your lean tissues too.
We start a course on that today (first session) together with me live. You will
customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
wellnessmessiah.com
Looking at it from another perspective, Gary Fraser and Walter Willet PhDs are expert researcher on effects of diet on health and longevity. None of their finding point to a high protein diet as helpful for health or longevity.
1.94 or 194 to 152...please ck
I corrected all of the following health problems by eating the correct human diet:
obesity, prediabetes, loose teeth, bleeding gums, sensitive teeth
cold sores, blocked sinuses, mouth breathing, left eye twitches (tetany)
heartburn, calf cramps, yellow stool, blood in stool
edema below the knees, painful feet when walking, sunburn is less
shoulder, back and neck pain after waking, lower back pain and stiffness
Yes, we are carnivores so eat more meat!
6+ Years on the carnivore lifestyle now :)
Eat Meat, Not Too Little, Mostly Fat
So just meat or also eggs, fish, seafood, dairy?
@@markaguilera493 Mostly Beef, Lamb, Pork, Kangaroo, Eggs then less of Cheese, Dairy, Fish, Chicken.
I'm still addicted to chocolate so I will have some chocolate about 4 to 6 times per year but overall not much of that.
@@Meathead-10810 Have you experimented with adding fruit or tubers?
@@markaguilera493 I tried grapes for a week once but only managed 5 days and found that I was very unsatisfied after eating and my teeth started getting sensitive again.
I had some fruit in Feb 2024 when I was testing a continuous glucose monitor but other than those or a cheat meal no.
I do sometimes add a potato or an onion into a stew but not always :)
So very little vegetables and just about zero fruit.
When I have a binge, I plan and do it properly with chocolate.
@Meathead-10810 How long did it take for you to adapt?
Older people who love alcohol need a high protein alcohol drink.
Why don't you interview Dr. Stu Phillips or Gabrielle Lyons. This video is very one sided and biased towards a low protein diet. Why would I take advice on protein intake from someone that is significantly underweight?
Haha. High protein is 1-1.25 g per lb of BW? That is actually a low protein diet unless you follow the USDA guidelines. If you follow those guidelines, you'll probably become a diabetic, so your protein intake will become irrelevant. So, in other words, don't listen to the USDA or the info from this video
kilo, not lb.
We start a course on that today (first session) together with me live. You will
customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
wellnessmessiah.com
Presentation is much too fast!
I find adjusting the speed of RUclips videos to be really helpful. With videos like this, I pause, rewind, slow down, and speed up at different parts so that I make sure I am fully understanding what I am hearing.
put it on 0.8 speed
Which "expert" is right on protein? The correct answer; Dr Micael Greger. Read vis messet book on the Longevity topic HOW NOT TO AGE and find out how protein restriction to 0,8 g/kg bodymass/day (1,0 for seniors) is the only method that effects all eleven hallmarks of aging in a positive way. Even better for sting If all proteins comes from plants.
Dr Greger seems to suffer of sarcopenia
Great video BUT I will have to study this quite a bit. I am 68, in great condition but do have bone loss so lets try some of these suggestions.
Yes, We do that here:
Customize your protein intake here + get my muscle mass protocol for FREE:
WellnessMessiah.com/
have you tried DHEA and vitamin K2 (both MK-4 and MK-7)?
I don't see the point of your experiment. It only proves that if you are deficient in protein and then get back to what you need. Muscles will grow. This is not groundbreaking and is the same for caloric consumption.
The way this presentation is handled this guy thinks every BODY is the same some of his ideas are maybe some what possibly true a lot of his ideas are questionable at best .
thank you. it seems like you need to be your own doctor these days. for everyone reading this i recommend the book the hidden herbs by anette ray
i know my comment will probably get burried somewhere but for everyone reading this go find the hidden herbs book by anette ray. you can come back and thank me later
It’s crazy no one here is talking about the hidden herbs by Anette Ray…
Everyone watching this go find the book the hidden herbs by anette ray