CS2 Surf is Broken and We Need Valve's Help
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 8 июн 2024
- The Launch of CS2 Surf - • CS2 Surf is HERE, Can ...
Big Thanks to! - @__xen @DarthElmo @DiniSurf @Infranix
My recommended CS2 Server Browser - cs2browser.com/
2nd song by lateflight - / lateflight
The CS2 Surf discord, where you can learn to map, start porting, or help in any way you like! Content creators much appreciated :) - / discord
CS2 Surf Rampbugs are rampant. Most CSGO Surfers are reporting that rampbugs, and other bugs in cs2 surf, are negatively impacting the surf experience. In this video, we cover the cause of said rampbugs, and we need Valve's help to fix the problem. 
Игры
Glad you made a video on this.
Brutal how bad the ramp glitching is, was a real bummer the first day I got to try out surf after the workshop update.
Dont forget the hardcoded 64 tick limit custom servers currently. I've heard people found workarounds in workshop maps, so maybe its possible if surf maps were remade to run on specific ticks.
But I remember ramp bugs were more frequent on 64 tick, rather than 66 tick (and higher tickrates like 100) - It wasnt just acceleration that benefited from tickrate.
It does seem like either a sub-tick issue (most of the times ive seen ramp bugs, is exactly when packet loss occurs) alyx doesnt run sub-tick after all.
u cant blame tickrate for everything xD
So all community servers are 64 tick? Does that mean that bhop servers are that ass because they run on 64 tick?
@@henrygg295 That is correct. It's hardcoded into the client, so the client will never send anything more than 64 tick. Workarounds are being made both for surf and bhop by the community, im not sure if sub-tick works on community hosted servers either. - which would be bad if it didnt.
Cant find information on that however, so I assume it does - in which case maybe its a matter of getting used to it after fixes are applied.
This happens in competitive as well, it's very common to get stuck running along walls or clip some pebbles while jumping. CS2 movement sucks very much rn
Or surf down a wall when you’re just trying to jump and you get stuck
Looking at the source docs I can see Valve they still use BSP for the physics calculations as part of the VMAP format. In all the examples on the video, it looks like forward axis movement is halted during the bug, but movement in the adjacent axis continue abruptly (a bit like hitting a wall). With that in mind I have a few ideas:
- What if CS2s "fix" for collisions adds a bit more bias for what is and isn't a wall, and curved surfaces are falling foul of this? This is one where Valve would have to help.
- If CS2s "fix" is a camera space collision test. Playing with the collision mesh vertex order & windings may provide a way to get around this.
- Maybe there is a bug in converting from CSGO to CS2 VMAP (specifically the collision mesh). We could test by creating a basic surf curve from scratch to see if the bug still happens.
I imagine someone will figure it out eventually, or valve will just give us a flag to disable the additional collision smoothing. Hope it gets resolved soon.
Could be on to something as the fix was targetting areas like the tunnel to b from t spawn on ancient
Where do you see they use BSP trees for collision detection and physics? As far as I can see it uses octrees for geometry partitioning. While you could use separate partitions for dynamic and static objects, it would not make sense to mix different schemes (i.e. BSP trees vs. octree). It would be very error prone, if even feasible, and given the flexibility of octree that BSP lacks, it would not make much sense.
I think you may have read this wrong in the documentation.
Am coder. Made my own replica of the source engine movement and surf mechanics in unity by porting the source engine code to c#. Ramp bugs happen because players have box colliders for geometry instead of capsule colliders, and the corners of those boxes catch the corners of ramps, even if a ramp is perfectly flat floating point isn't precise, so the corners collide.
I'm sure other people have done or attempted this already, but as a layman who knows basically nothing about coding I'd appreciate if you or really anyone else worked on fixing or minimizing this issue and then if you get good results, make some noise about it.
And it should resolve the collision by pushing the player out in such a way to minimize the displacement. But I suspect the variable tickrate, combined with a lot of small mouse movement, results in many low-time-delta updates that are more likely to produce situations in which the vector pointing out of the collision is not what the player would expect. In other words, with a lower time delta you're more likely to end up overlapping a model you're approaching in the direction of your movement less compared to the perpendicular direction.
your channel is growing like crazy, keep this shit up bro ;) I love informational videos on movement gamemodes
Thanks for bringing this problem up! It's been very frustrating transitioning from CSGO to CS2 with this bug keep happening to me! Keep up the great work!
Really, really wish they never took down the CSGO like how they never take down CSS or 1.6
thank you for making a video on this. my friend and i started surfing 3 or 4 days ago and had no idea if we were doing something wrong or not
so glad you made a video on this, use to hop on surf and play for hours now I hop on, hit like 14 ramp bugs in like 6 mins and log off
Lovely video, thanks for bringing this to the puplic ❤
I'm wondering right now if the 2 edges between ramp segments would be connected into 1 edge (which is possible in source 2),
if this would make a difference. In that case, the ramp would (in theorie) behave like a clean model ramp made in blender.
But i think the issue probably comes from something else here.
.edit You can reduce compiling a map for hours to probably seconds when you disable some things you don't need for testing like light and vis.
Clean ramps are in fact WORSE. The ramp I made (shown at 6:20) is a single mesh with no open edges. And even though the clip is from 6 months ago, it still applies today.
I tried that, but it doesn't make it better. Maybe even worse.
What seems to help is making the overlap of the two ramps wayyy bigger than you usually would, but maybe its just placebo.
It feels like the player sometimes bugs through the next ramp on collision and then the game fixes that by bumping you out
Lol all talk no mapping experience
@@Ethiixx ok
I'm so glad I saw this, I was starting to think I was crazy. Great video btw :D
Well let's hope we either find a way around it or Valve gets on it soon. Goddamn do i want to make more maps that hopefully aren't terrible.
Man I was hoping for an official surf mode in CS2 for the longest time. But if Valve doesn't seem to be caring about surf much then that dream's probably dead :( It would be so fun to have Trackmania style surf matchmaking
this
Considering how they ruined Gun Game i'd rather they didn't.
They''d fuck it up.
Could be related to the "Rubber banding" that they somehow fixed for Spawn movement
The comparison to what Gabe said in the HL documentary was spot on
i thought i was going crazy thank you for making this
hope its fixed soon. i just started playing cs a few months ago and surf a few weeks. wish i could play a smooth map. still alot of fun, great vid man
I was excited to try my hand at surfing again with the new engine but was turned off very quickly by the very frequent ramp bugs.
Hope this give enough push these bugs are killlinnnggg meee. thanks for the video and keep up the good shit bro
Your channel got me to try surfing again last night, and I was trying surf_rookie. The bugs on that curved ramp were driving me crazy, turns out you make this video and highlight the issues a day later. Hope valve can help.
movement is important in competitive cs, so whatever fix they got for surf, it will have a benefical impact on the competitive aspect
Hope you survive this big life problem
Can you do a video on momentum mod map types and how to play them. Idk what ahop is
I wonder if the bug is from Valve patching the surfing on Overpass? Or if they changed how clipping curved surfaces works because of sub tick.
I'm so glad you posted this. I couldn't figure out for the life of me why the rampbugs were so bad. I stopped surfing a few months back due to the transition from GO to CS2 and was so excited to get back into it last weekend. Needless to say I was incredibly frustrated as the amount of times i've flown off of curves on mesa or utopia while shaking the rust off far surpassed anything i experienced in GO.
I stream surf to my friends in discord as a means of sharing my passion to my friends in an attempt to get them into it too! The sheer abundance of rampbugs was an absolutely terrible look and my only explanation to them was map port issues as I had no idea how bad things truly were. Thanks for the report, Repster.
Play on CSS
Cool video. You know, I don't play much CS 2 / GO, but I'm wondering if this bug is the same as that found in Quake 3 Arena. Even if a mapper has the edge of both brushes perfectly placed this seems to happen for some reason or another. I've always assumed perhaps some sort of Floating Point limitation, but I have no clue honestly.
Not an expert but people smarter than me in these comments seem to have confirmed it has to do with the floating point precision errors so yea youre probably right lol
great vid dude
Jesus I thought I just encountered some very glitchy servers or something. I hope this does gets fixed, CS Surf is one of those things that can really chill me out after a long day.
Also random auto tabbing out, it is even worse then the edgebugs. It seems to only affect dual monitor setups.
They also need to give us back the yaw speed console command, I hated having to rely on a 3rd party tool just to use slower turnbinds.
surf_dragon bonus be like
💀
Crazy, I just hopped on a surf server last night for the first time in years and ts happened
From what i can tell the ramp bug does hurt some standard jumps and boosts on maps like nuke
Is rampbug same bug that hapoens since cs 1.6 when bhopping between two slopes will randomly stop you?
I have the CS:GO legacy version still installed just for surf servers.
cs2 never ceases to amaze me
commenting to boost algo so volvo can see this and address this
important stuff.
I'm porting a kz map rn and when I hug a straight wall and bhop along it while strafing towards it I get stuck atleast 1/5 jumps
They should just add the ability to emulate csgo movement and a way to disable subtick and change ticktate..
Damn I was playing surf and it felt like shit no wonder, what’s crazy is during when I first got beta access it felt prettty dang good I heard in a csnades video that it might’ve been due to a bug fix in mirage that fucks with strafing
He tryna surf the ring to Mordor
3:58 Look mom! I made it into a Repster video!!!
Valve for sure gonna be looking at this before tf2
when will you make another guess the rank?
Kitsune and the deathstar were the only "perfect" maps I've seen with no rampbugs, but I found mesa to be the worst with rampbugs
I play on Surf Haven in csgo Legacy beta. There are alot of players out there still surfin. I'm new to surfing but im grinding T3 alot of fun. :)
great video but its important to note its not a physics issue. its a bug in the movement code (technically a bug of a bug) The movement in CSGO and CS2 is not controlled by the physics engine (in source 1 havok, in source 2 rubikon) the movement is controlled entirely by code (which is why gabe follower was able to with much success port over the core of CSGO to S&box like a year ago)
hopefully Momentum Mod releases soon
I'll use this as an opportunity to explain that TF2 still has surf servers running. Obviously there's still some ramp bugs here and there, but that's typical for source engine surfing.
Hopefully CS2 ramps see a fix, but TF2 is a decent alternative for the time being. (There's even some alternative movement maps out there like jump and jurf maps.)
i still cant load into cs2 surf servers i dont know if its cuz im from oce or they just dont work
now we can test if they are truly a pillar of the game dev industry
its not just curves though. ive been really annoyed because of kitsune's straight ramps stopping me completely way too often, like every other run
was the same problem is csgo back in 2012-2013. It was caused by 128tick, eventually they fixed it if im not mistaken..
Straight ramps create a lot of ramp bugs too.
Momentum mod needs to release soon. Surf is complete as far as i know, and there is no further development on the gamemode.
In my opinion, this is an opening go with Momentum Mod further, than try do this on Source 2 (unless it is separate project not inside CS2)
No wonders why even on normal maps, when u jump+w I often get blocked by some random pixel on the ground which should not be existed in the first place, nor it physically exists!
Time to play momentum mod!!
I have been getting a bit of ramp bugs on kitsune :(
they even screwed the binds. you can't use +left/ +right, or should i say, +turnleft, because this new shit command turns your camera at lightspeed, so you basically become a tornado.
also the +strafe bind, which would allow you to strafe with your mouse, which was great for surf combat as it allowed you to do some tricks with it.
Is any of this fixed? I've recently started playing CS2 and surfing looks like a lot of fun. I'm shit at it though, is that because of the bugs or just me?
its the bugs, not really worth surfing on cs2 now... if you really want to learn play legacy csgo surf servers :(
Valve may ignore this for long, they have all the focus on competitive mecanics
has anyone tried porting hl:a player/server settings over to cs22
I think surf is super cool and wanted to start a week ago and played a bit. Its so much fun but I cannot handle these frustrating stops it destroys everything for me :(
I play on T2/T3 maps and I cant complete some maps because of rampbugs.
Personally i have just been using the csgo legacy version to surf, because surf heaven still have servers up (and cybershoke but normally the ping is too high for me). Until they fix ramp bugs, I'm not coming back to cs2 surf
5:41 lmao
Im currently surfing on ksf and there are very so few servers and theyr running the worst maps in existence.
A true nightmare...
Wow now I have the other reason to blame instead my crappy hands
I was surfing on cs2 and thought it's my shit internet causing this issue
I concur
what about tickrate tho? bhop can be much harder with 64tick.
ngl the issue with surfing made me redownload css for now until everything is fixed
and i was thinking of porting some of my maps to cs2 😔
your maps in cs2 would look FIRE, but yeah aquaflow would be one big rampbug.
greensway could work tho
@@Repster lol yeah
thanks)
@@NoVIcE_Source please port them they will look amazing i will dodge all curves idgaf
@@Chkris i may try to make the ramps straight-
Nice video
I told you it wasn't fixed during our coaching session Lol.
oh, i was wondering why i somehow stopped even tho i was doing well
"cs2 map compilation benchmark collection" link please? :)
would you like the results? I can actually send that, its also in the "CS2 Surf" Discord if you dont want to wait.
i miss surf but mostly cache and train. I think they should have let us stay in csgo1
bro said "hammer 2 editer" XD VALVe help SAVE TF2
I thought this is a porting issue of the maps and is less on valves fault, guess i was wrong...
I cant find any surf,bhop or whatever Server with Maps not official. some one some solutions?
try cs2browser.com
I loved CSGO so much. I played almost every game mode and have a 4k inventory. Since CS2 I don't even play anymore. I still can't believe they killed CSGO.
hehe thats me at 2:01 :3
6:36 niko
This is honestly a good opportunity to consolidate the entire community in CSS, lets be real, it's always been the better game for movement anyways.
While that's true, I do prefer it being fixed in CS2 so the community can grow. Both in mappers and players.
if they made CSS free i would agree.
@@ZmBzRALIVE it's $0.99 every sale.. lol
@@mathias5233 Point is how accessible it is.
CSS is cheeks
i started sutfing this year. i gave up becuase 60% i was glitching
as soon as surf was available on cs2 i jumped in a server and experienced the ramp bugs too often, haven't played the game since... ive got thousands of surf hours clocked up on surf in csgo. fuck cs2 they should of made it a separate game instead of killing a whole game for a lot of players... i may aswel go back and surf in 1.6. at least that works
CS started life as a mod. Surfing has been a major element of CS since for like 20 years. I know this is going to sound very first-world problem-y but I don't know how else to put it. Basically, valve knows we mod their games. We've been doing it for so long that at this point, they know that it's going to happen day-1 and they plan for it. I'm not expecting them to go out and test a million surf maps when it's not even their primary content, but they could have at least experiemented with it to see how the S2 engine works in those environments. It's really not just surf that has this problem. Regular comp maps have a lot of geometry issues and clipping bugs that had to be addressed. CS2 is just a generally buggy game and there's no excuse for it.
Valve has unlimited money at this point and there was zero timeline for CS2. Somehow, despite no crunch, unlimited budget, and no outward focus on any other titles, they still screwed it up. CS2 is by far the worst installment of CS. The thing that pisses me off the most about this whole situation, is that they got rid of GO so they could focus on the skin market. Look at the playerbase of CS from it's release to now - it's a stark reminder of how prioritizing money over quality will destroy your franchise.
In the 25th anniversary video, Gabe said "delayed is only for a little while, but suck is forever". They certainly didn't live by that motto when making CS2 otherwise it wouldn't have been released when it was.
valve dont care about community servers, unfortunately they dont even want to fix server searcher that is in the game and even if they do, they have othere things to fix in mainc core of game, sadly they forgot that cs is not only matchmakings, ranks, points etc but i still get it, that is main core
why bro looks so high in the thumbnails
i feel like valve is the only company to endorse bugs and glitches in their games, and even fix them for the community. i'm sure valve will fix it.
Yeah, i mean surfing is technically a glitch/bug like edgebugs for example, it shouldnt exist but it does! Andd it makes the game a bit more fun.
"We need Valve's help"... Hahahahaha, good luck!
up the community
kz is also pretty tragic tbh, can't imagine bhop is great either...
I'm going to say subtick is to blame
Totally called that CS2 would kill surf, wish it wasn't the case though. Most of the good surf servers are either dead now or have 1/4 the population they had in CS:GO.