@@da5hainy556 Had you not been so selfish your little girlfriend's death would of been quick and painless but now that you really pissed me off, I'm gonna finish her.. nice and slow, Mj and I we're gonna have a hell of a time.
Here's the real truth: there are 8 million people in this city, and those teeming masses exist for the sole purpose of lifting the few exceptional people onto their shoulders. You and me, we're exceptional. I could squash you like a bug right now... but I'm offering you a choice: join me; imagine what we could accomplish together, what we could create... or we could destroy! Cause the deaths of countless innocents in selfish battle again and again and again until we're both dead - is that what you want? THINK ABOUT IT, HERO!
While the game tried to make the player believe that they were playing a “demon”, that wasn’t the case. Venom was the most heroic character in the game. He saved a group of child soldiers, he rescued animals, he turned his staff into welcomed family members, and he even let Huey go free without punishment. He was far from evil.
He brought child soldiers into outer heaven, raising them to be a part of his private army. Especially with how - SPOILER ALERT ⚠️ to anyone who hasn't played MGSV or the original MGS In the og mgs you infiltrate "outer heaven" and kill "the boss", however this is not the boss that you kill, and it's not outer heaven. You infiltrate the copy of outer heaven, the Phantom of it, and you kill venom snake, as venom was the public face of the boss, diverting attention from the real Boss while he built Outer Heaven.
@@themanager1485 when you bring the children from the mine back ocelot explicitely states that you arent raising them as soldiers, that they would have an actual chance at a normal life. it was only because of eli that they ever returned to being child soldiers
Dude. U lost the forest for the trees. The thing I love about big boss, is that he made his own philosiphy. Its not evil and its not good, just a damaged man trying to do what he deems best.
One of the main plot points of V was to show how the world begun to see Big Boss as a terrorist leader. He stayed true to his conviction, but the times changed, yesterday's ally is today's enemy.
The game does not see Venom Snake as a villain, that is how he views himself. If you do a pacifist run and choose to spare Quiet, rescue kids and prisoners and not kill anyone, that still works thematically as Venom being a good person who still sees himself as a villain for killing his sick men and (apparently) killing Eli. However, if you DO chose to play as a bastard, that would also work thematically as he would, indeed, be a villain. Edit: the people commenting "uh, akshually he didn't kill Liquid" unfortunately don't know the meaning of the word "apparently".
Big Boss isn’t “bad” either. Every mission a perfect run means no killing. That’s the most canon set of events then. Big Boss was like a “Dr. Manhattan” type character. He united the world to defeat one enemy: Him. He never actually employed child soldiers, he never actually nuked anyone, he never actually killed anyone important. The worst he did was try to kill his sons because he thought they were un natural abominations. He arguably was a “greater good” type of character 💯
I agree, I think the story is about him seeing himself as a villain and more importantly losing his humanity in the chase for revenge against skull face and cipher (I got this from all the moby dick referencing), but if you choose to be a good guy I think it works as him trying to become the hero of the story, he wants to save people but in the end, because he is simultaniously big boss with (i think) naked snake he has no choice in the end because he himself is lost and he is in another mans body and life.
Actually, you can't go the whole game with killing. When Mother Base is infected, you have to take the lives of your men who are infected and the game forces you to do this
Also is not like killing is the only thing that would make him evil, he literally rescues kid soldiers to put them in outer heaven and zanzibar land, also commits war crimes by stealing enemy resources, the diamond dogs staff are mostly guys who you fultoned and Ocelot TORTURED THEM into making you their idol and leader, literal brain wash, you also send your guys on dispatch missions hurting them and killing them just for little money and resources that aren't really worth that much
@@DaveGamerOFICIAL firstly, he isn’t a soldier of a government and isn’t held accountable for war crimes, taking the child soldiers to mother base is way better than being a child soldier, as they get 3 hot meals a day, an education, and don’t risk their lives; they didn’t have freedom back there. The resources stolen are fuel, metals, chemicals, and precious materials, which are not vital to the survival of the Russians and Africans. The torture bit is pretty bad, but it’s also said that other methods of convincing are used, and the soldiers can and do leave if they want to
@Fegger Queen most of the dispatch missions are actually more than just "for a few resources" They are more like "Overthrow corrupt regime" "Provide support to hurricane victims" and stuff like that. Diamond Digs do a lot of humanitarian aid, potentially dying in the process in these hostile lands.
@@DaveGamerOFICIAL *Spoilers* The character you play as is actually a result of this very conditioning, he’s basically the hugest fanboy 😂. Ahab is actually Big Boss and the player character is just some random medic they brainwashed into taking over for Big Boss.
“Venom snake is still evil” Venom snake: *saves world from a parasite made to kill anyone who speaks a different language * Also venom snake: *understands that the soldiers he’s fighting are just mercenaries working for PFs and decides to give them a second chance at mother base and eventually even falls in love with one* Also also venom snake: *defeats and captures one of the most advanced metal gears in the series and advises his men to not let Huey go anywhere near it so it can’t threaten peace* Also also also venom snake: *saves children from an active battlefield despite his contract to eliminate them* Did we even play the same game
Also Venom Snake: leads outer heaven, follows Big Boss’s goal and tries to start a never ending war. Venom and Big Boss’s idea was noble but at the end of the day they were still bad.
@@eduardoalbornoz2718 not necessarily brainwashed. Think about it, Big Boss is a legend among mercenaries and PMCs around the world and he resurfaced after many years. What mercenary wouldn’t want to work for the legend himself? For the soldiers he takes from the field, I’m sure working for Diamond Dogs is a helluva lot better than working for the army or other PMCs
I always presumed it was snakes inward feelings. He feels guilty for lots of these things, or maybe he even felt like he was living a lie. It’s really hard to say
I think this plays perfectly though into MGS' themes of misinformation and perception though, the whole point of every character throughout the entire series is that they're not as they seem or they're not like the legends/myths that are made about them
The series is a postmodern masterpiece in this way. It is hands down top 2 video game stories, in terms of quality and using narrative, ludonarrative harmony, and context to create deeper meaning. I'm thinking RDR2 is close up there, but I can't think of any more 🤔
Kind of like how Big Boss percieved Zero, throughout most of his life, and he was the villain. But little did Big Boss know, his motives were pure in his own mind, and he idolized Big Boss. Big Boss is a villain in the eyes of most, but from his perspective his motives make sense and he’s a good guy. All comes down to perspective and perception, and what the legends around said person are.
The only missions that outright require killing are the ones involving Enemy Helicopters. Most of those are side-ops though which don't need to be played for story progress. I don't remember if there's a bit in any of the story levels where blowing up a helicopter can't be subverted or isn't optional.
@@madara992I'm not sure if I missed something, but I didn't have to kill any of my guys. I sent everyone that spoke Kikongo to quarantine where they died of the disease until I got that situated, but I didn't personally kill any of them. Was this something implied that I missed, because that wouldn't surprise me.
@@winermine9029 Since making the comment, I've completed the game. And yeesh, yeah that was some pretty rough stuff. Didn't think Koji could outdo the microwave hallway, but he sure as shit found a way.
I would say that almost no one in the MG verse is bad , they just don't see eye to eye. For example Big Boss kept a nuclear weapon that made him a threat while also being a mercenary, so to someone else Big Boss may seem as a bad guy, but he isn't. At the end of the day it's all about anti heros making their image of the world and their home a reality.
@@cocob0l0 I stated almost no one. Skullface was a child solider that was taken from his home and had to assimilate with every culture due to the Imperialism time period. He had everything taken from him and after Zero betrayed him as well and left him with Cypher, he turn tail behind their backs. During such, he knew everything Paz did and every lie she said as a snake. In fact Paz only ever followed Zero's wish which is why she was still with Big Boss. So SF took her to find out all she knew about the Major. Chico part was the only truly bad thing he did now that I think about it.
More like "noone in MG verse is actually good". The two inheritor of Boss' will got it so warped that they became evil in the process and lost their ways. Big Boss became a hypocrite at the end. He loathes the US government because it treated The Boss and him as tools to be discarded after use and yet he did the exact same thing to Venom Snake and Diamond Dogs. Creating an endless war where soldiers will always be needed so they wont get discarded is the most deplorable thing to do. On the other hand, you have Zero, Patriots and all below him who all became control freaks. Zero created the Patriots because he wants absolute unity and total control of the masses which spirals out of control when we reached MGS 2 and 4. These two supposedly "good men" has committed and responsible, directly or indirectly, for the worst crimes possible. And then theres Volgin, Liquid and Skullface who are just straight up evil. Only Solid Snake, Otacon and Raiden who might be genuinely good. Even then im still not sure with Solid Snake and Raiden. The only genuinely good person was The Boss and Otacon really
The story doesn't necessarily treat you as a villain. You save kidnapped prisoners, spare people, make child soldiers get educated instead of fighting and disarm nukes. The game rewards you for that, and punishes you for killing.
To be fair, the real reason we are treated as a bad guy is because we are still abducting enemy soldiers and getting them to work for us, though then again they do have a choice about it. Then there's when Huey was exiled and Miller said that Huey would spread talk about the "Black Hearted Diamond Dogs" and whatnot. Venom canonically uses the *1 AM D114 Handgun and *1 AM MRS-4 Assault Rifle, w/o Silencer, in the cutscenes, no matter what weapons you actually use. So that means he is always using lethal weapons and we do know he kills people.
"... You can go the entire game without killing a single person" Yeah, it's not like there was a mission where I had to kill my soldiers because they had a parasite ascendant of Fox Die in their throats, of course the problem was that and not the fact that the game is basically incomplete and the story doesn't explains basic things like why Ocelot is an ally if he was an annoying kid in the last game we saw him
To answer your question of why Ocelot is an ally if he was an annoying kid. The main reason is that he’s a simp for Naked Snake and is only loyal to him MSG3 Snake Eater took place in 1964, MSG5 took place in 1984. Ocelot was born in 1944 so he was 20 when we first saw him and 40 when we saw him in MGS5. The bigger question is why does he look like he’s in his 70s or 80s when he’s middle aged but I guess war does that to soldiers As for other questions, the audio tapes Snake collects throughout the game provide exposition dumps as needed.
It explains that in 3. Ocelot was actually a double agent and was on your side the entire time. You were supposed to meet an agent code named Adam, but he didn’t show and instead you met Eva. Turns out Eva sabotaged the meeting and was a Chinese double agent, and Ocelot was Adam.
I think the story does a great job of showing you no matter how noble you try to be if it’s all for revenge you can only ever end up going down one path. The path of violence, death, and destruction. If you choose to be a bad guy it doesn’t sugar coat anything and says “yeah you got what you wanted but also this is really fucked up.” And if you play a pacifist run it says “you tried to be good but you can’t really be a good guy when your end goal is revenge”
Tbh, you don't need to do an evil playthrough for Venom to be evil if you think about it. Big Boss created his army to help end conflicts and prevent something like the PW incident happening, at least until he gave up and gave the title to Venom. Venom made it solely with the purpose of revenge, and gets to the point of making his own nuclear deterrents, and then does what he did up to Metal Gear, plus having to carry the weight of everything the real Snake probably got up to during that time slot.
I mean, I wanted revenge and to rebuild the legend of big boss, so being the guy who took down a massive metal gear, a deadly plague, told the soviets to fuck off, built nukes and made a massive PF sounds cool
@@user-ut4tk4ph5z well yes, but actually no. I did do it for big bosses glory, but I thought I was big boss, and technically I am, so I was doing it for ne
It was just a fake controversy because Konami just removed kojima. Mgs v was complete. Nothing is left to be known. And if you know, the end credits isn't where the game ends. You have to do more missions for one final big reveal. People don't even know that and they just complaint. Atleast have enough mind to understand the story.
@@breakthebad1770 The game was supposed to have 3 chapters not 2. MGSV is an amazing game, but unfinished. And that is very disappointing. With more time and money it could have been an amazing game :/
@@breakthebad1770 atleast have enough mind to know what the fuck people are talking about. Entire plot points remain unfinished in the game, and you would only find out what happned if you watched the bonus disc. That is literally unfinished. game is str8 garbage, mgs4 was peak gameplay too.
@@Insanepie it's not even a review he just about a talked flaw in the game or even can be considered a plot hole or have another meaning do you even know what's a review
I know people have said this hundreds of times already here but, he's not evil. He's literally doing good things throughout the game. He's used by Big Boss to be his copy basically, but Big Boss isn't evil either. He may be an enemy in game, because his views and methods are drastic at times, but that doesn't make him evil.
"The story treats you as a bad guy" Venom after sparing Huey's life despite everything he has done, as well as Quiet's, the children, Liquid, and many more: Am I a joke to you?
The story treat us as the villain because it tells a meaning, it doesn't give us the choice just like real life, that what the creator wanted to make a game were any action good or bad will be seen as being bad because that how to world would see it, there are a lots like this in history we people had to make questionable action to reach there goals even if it was meant for good.
@@G-DORA Who said anything about making a change you donut? I just gave my idea on a pretentious comment. Also, I hope you realize the irony of your comment here.
kojima probably wanted to do more, konami wanted to kill his career and legacy, sadly it seems they did after survive happened, kojima at least still has a gaming career though
Don't be sad man. I've heard rumors that Kojima and Sony are trying to obtain a license or the IP to MGS and when they do, they wanna rehire the former staff and remake the game to completion with everything Kojima wanted to add with Sony blessings. The problem is that it's a rumors and unconfirmed by any sources. I've heard this rumors about 2 years ago but nothing seems to pop up. Just pray for it to happened
What are you talking about? Venom literally spends the whole game saving people, Kaz, Quiet, Huey, the kids...how can he be evil? Well, perhaps, he's actually morally better than the real Big Boss
It's not a flaw in the game, it's a staple of the franchise. Metal Gear seeks to have you feel the weight of killing people. Know that when Venom appears as the villian in MG that it is from the perspective of a young SS. But rarely are villains all _bad_ and rarely is the hero all _good._
The biggest flaw was not putting act 3 in and tying up all the loose ends with Eli. That error essentially gives us a game with an unsatisfying ending. I like how it explained how Big Boss died twice in two Metal Gear games but that last English parasite needed to be included. It would have been better to play it than to read it through supplemental materials.
Are they? A lot of the time you’re just fighting Russian or Congo soldiers, sure some of the time you fight some depraved fuckers, but the Russian soldiers are just (mostly) young guys in a war they didn’t want. If you listen in on the conversations with them they’ll complain about the war and what they do. In one of the earlier missions you have to kill/extract a Soviet commando and he tells his men that if a commander told him to kill a civilian he’d kill them instead.
I think it works out great. The feeling I get from Venom is that he wants to be a good person, but he’s forced to do terrible things because of the role he’s been put into.
Of course he is a bad guy, he is the Big Boss you kill in the very first game. It's basically how they explained how Big Boss wasn't dead and returned later on in MGS4. Yes we play as 3 different Snakes through the series.
That's the point, no matter what venom does, he is perceived as a bad guy, In the children mission, forgot the name, snake doesn't kill or harm kids, and it will be so throughout the game, but In later timeline, V is referenced as a guy who arms kids and uses them
Venom is literally shown as an absolute angel throught the entire game : didn't kill Quiet, spared Huey, made diamonds from fallen men, broke down after the quarantine massacre.
Or, you know, the fact that the story was literally cut short at like 66%. I would call that a flaw. Or how it was made to be amazing for the first 20 hours and then be a crappy grind for another 60 hours.
Yeah, and how the story was told, with those audios, and how you are forced to repeat the Chapter 1 missions, now in Chapter 2. And how Venom Snake was so boring, and the map almost empty, and how the game is so much better if you just skip the cutscenes. But hey, "only one major flaw".
In my eyes for the moment Venom Snake did everything he could to build mother base from the ground up and tried to bring everyone together no matter the cost. He truly cared for his soldiers and his close friends. He went to extreme lengths to do something better even when others doubted him. To me Venom Snake is in the shadow of the legendary Big Boss.
You can be pacifist in other mgs games Edit: Forgot to mention that not killing is even "recommended" sense in most mgs games if you get 0 alerts and 0 kills you get "stealth" that allows you to go invisible
If I remember right, only MGS3 really punishes the player if they kill the soldiers as we see in the battle with The Sorrow. I don’t remember MGS1, 2, or 4 having consequences for killing enemies. Even Peace Walker didn’t seem to have repercussions. The only punishment for MGS5 is getting Demon Snake but that’s about it
Venom Snake isn't really evil as he seems. At least compared to Big Boss, he himself chose to spare Huey, Canonically Quiet and saved the kids instead of killing them like the Mission intended
I really missed Hayter's iconic voice in V, but actually I understand why he wasn't in it. Sutherland did an excellent job and I wouldn't change the voices even if I could.
@@solesoulsorrow eh, David could of atleast played real boss. (Spoilers for all 5 people that didn't know you don't play as real snake in 5 but the bro dude Solid Snake kills in Metal Gear (not solid) 2.
I mean Venom was written as a villainous character since metal gear 1... mgs 5 demonstrated how and why Venom cracked mentally, destined to live the rest of his life angry at the world.
The worst problem in the game is it gives you all these weapons, tactics, and equipment to go full Rambo yet it punishes you for it and wants you to just crawl around everywhere and tranq everyone
I never felt "punished" as there's no negative effect to your character. You can say that you get the evil ending, but honestly who cares. You're just a doppelganger at the end of the day and no matter how you play the game it won't change the fact that you're a victim of the real big boss.
Well while Venom himself is a good guy - if you want him to be - he’s still propped up as Big Boss’ double, so it makes sense that he’s treated that way. Venom accepts his fate in the end
"Even though you can go the entire game without killing anyone"
**cough** **cough**
*Mission 43 - Shining lights, even in death*
First thing that came to mind.
PTSD kickin in
u: kill some1
gmae: u r the bad guy now
@@dhananjayjoshi2922 Fr. Doing a second play through of the game rn.
@@devduthk3816 a real shame the game story was incomplete
Are my eyes deceiving me, or did you just put in a clip of Hunt Down the Freeman?
hunt the down the free man
Ehhh, you wake up in a hospital build a private army in the sea and get betrayed at the end of the story
Close enough
Hunt down the refund
Hunt down the refund
Black mEsa
Ah, yes. Big Boss and his famous quote of "You fucked up my face!" XD
"I grant you permission to die"
@@jumper7625 *Moans*
I mean, would it be wrong?
Im crying omfg
THE ALIENS ARE COMING! WE'VE BEEN COMPROMISED!
"In spite of everything you've done for them eventually they will hate you"
“Misery, misery, misery, that’s what you’ve chosen.”
@@Alucard_Q_KazooI offered you friendship and you spat in my face
@@BIGBOSSGAMING2007You've spun your last web, Spider-Man.
@@da5hainy556 Had you not been so selfish your little girlfriend's death would of been quick and painless but now that you really pissed me off, I'm gonna finish her.. nice and slow, Mj and I we're gonna have a hell of a time.
Here's the real truth: there are 8 million people in this city, and those teeming masses exist for the sole purpose of lifting the few exceptional people onto their shoulders. You and me, we're exceptional. I could squash you like a bug right now... but I'm offering you a choice: join me; imagine what we could accomplish together, what we could create... or we could destroy! Cause the deaths of countless innocents in selfish battle again and again and again until we're both dead - is that what you want? THINK ABOUT IT, HERO!
While the game tried to make the player believe that they were playing a “demon”, that wasn’t the case. Venom was the most heroic character in the game. He saved a group of child soldiers, he rescued animals, he turned his staff into welcomed family members, and he even let Huey go free without punishment. He was far from evil.
He brought child soldiers into outer heaven, raising them to be a part of his private army. Especially with how -
SPOILER ALERT ⚠️ to anyone who hasn't played MGSV or the original MGS
In the og mgs you infiltrate "outer heaven" and kill "the boss", however this is not the boss that you kill, and it's not outer heaven. You infiltrate the copy of outer heaven, the Phantom of it, and you kill venom snake, as venom was the public face of the boss, diverting attention from the real Boss while he built Outer Heaven.
@themanager1485 he's not training them to be mindless killers. He's training them so they won't be taken advantage of when they rejoin society.
@@themanager1485 when you bring the children from the mine back ocelot explicitely states that you arent raising them as soldiers, that they would have an actual chance at a normal life. it was only because of eli that they ever returned to being child soldiers
That's the point, but common folks are too stupid to understand that.
@Weyland Punani So Metal gear solid 3 snake eater is not a MGS?
Dude. U lost the forest for the trees. The thing I love about big boss, is that he made his own philosiphy. Its not evil and its not good, just a damaged man trying to do what he deems best.
That's not big boss.
That’s what I was thinking
@@colinnixon7739 “I am big boss, and you are too. No, he’s the 2 of us”
@@outdoorscholar6016 he's still not the original big boss
@@prncerou but still a big boss
"The aliens are coming! We've been compromised!"
"SETTLE DOWN CORPORAL!"
@@cxruckus8407 "aw colonel, we are so fucked"
Legend
We are so fucked
So guys-
DEADASS USED FOOTAGE OF HUNT DOWN THE FREEMAN.
No the devs of that shit show made hdtf look like mgs5
💀💀💀
you fucked up my face
I did a fucking double take
@@pebbleboyshorts765 hunt down the freeman was an awful game. The story was awful. The gameplay was so poorly done and it generally just sucked
You’re not the villain in TPP, you’re actually the victim.
I’m the same person
@@Ohyeahitsnotme Isn't it strange that in 1987 Metal Gear you're actually lulling your own self in a way?
A victim of Big Boss
Dan fact if you place data of your birthday in this game and put this date or ware for your birthday game will congratulations to you
Real
One of the main plot points of V was to show how the world begun to see Big Boss as a terrorist leader. He stayed true to his conviction, but the times changed, yesterday's ally is today's enemy.
The game does not see Venom Snake as a villain, that is how he views himself. If you do a pacifist run and choose to spare Quiet, rescue kids and prisoners and not kill anyone, that still works thematically as Venom being a good person who still sees himself as a villain for killing his sick men and (apparently) killing Eli. However, if you DO chose to play as a bastard, that would also work thematically as he would, indeed, be a villain.
Edit: the people commenting "uh, akshually he didn't kill Liquid" unfortunately don't know the meaning of the word "apparently".
your horn also grows longer (shown in the quarantined platform cutscene to be an illusion venom himself sees) if you commit evil
Big Boss isn’t “bad” either. Every mission a perfect run means no killing. That’s the most canon set of events then.
Big Boss was like a “Dr. Manhattan” type character. He united the world to defeat one enemy: Him.
He never actually employed child soldiers, he never actually nuked anyone, he never actually killed anyone important. The worst he did was try to kill his sons because he thought they were un natural abominations. He arguably was a “greater good” type of character 💯
I agree, I think the story is about him seeing himself as a villain and more importantly losing his humanity in the chase for revenge against skull face and cipher (I got this from all the moby dick referencing), but if you choose to be a good guy I think it works as him trying to become the hero of the story, he wants to save people but in the end, because he is simultaniously big boss with (i think) naked snake he has no choice in the end because he himself is lost and he is in another mans body and life.
He never kill Eli, Eli is liquid snake from mgs 1
Exactly. Venoms self hatred isn't a spawn of his actions, only a perception that further explains his character.
Actually, you can't go the whole game with killing. When Mother Base is infected, you have to take the lives of your men who are infected and the game forces you to do this
Also is not like killing is the only thing that would make him evil, he literally rescues kid soldiers to put them in outer heaven and zanzibar land, also commits war crimes by stealing enemy resources, the diamond dogs staff are mostly guys who you fultoned and Ocelot TORTURED THEM into making you their idol and leader, literal brain wash, you also send your guys on dispatch missions hurting them and killing them just for little money and resources that aren't really worth that much
@@DaveGamerOFICIALbullshit
@@DaveGamerOFICIAL firstly, he isn’t a soldier of a government and isn’t held accountable for war crimes, taking the child soldiers to mother base is way better than being a child soldier, as they get 3 hot meals a day, an education, and don’t risk their lives; they didn’t have freedom back there. The resources stolen are fuel, metals, chemicals, and precious materials, which are not vital to the survival of the Russians and Africans.
The torture bit is pretty bad, but it’s also said that other methods of convincing are used, and the soldiers can and do leave if they want to
@Fegger Queen most of the dispatch missions are actually more than just "for a few resources"
They are more like "Overthrow corrupt regime" "Provide support to hurricane victims" and stuff like that. Diamond Digs do a lot of humanitarian aid, potentially dying in the process in these hostile lands.
@@DaveGamerOFICIAL *Spoilers*
The character you play as is actually a result of this very conditioning, he’s basically the hugest fanboy 😂. Ahab is actually Big Boss and the player character is just some random medic they brainwashed into taking over for Big Boss.
"You may do good things but you'll still be treated like a bad guy" isn't that just reality with extra steps
This nigga spittin'
Life is pain
@@Smelly556 phantom pain
@@miguelealo8468 no no, this pain is real and still here
@@pebbleboyshorts765 n o
The road to hell is paved with good intentions
- Kojima
lol as if Kojima came up with this quote.
“Venom snake is still evil”
Venom snake: *saves world from a parasite made to kill anyone who speaks a different language *
Also venom snake: *understands that the soldiers he’s fighting are just mercenaries working for PFs and decides to give them a second chance at mother base and eventually even falls in love with one*
Also also venom snake: *defeats and captures one of the most advanced metal gears in the series and advises his men to not let Huey go anywhere near it so it can’t threaten peace*
Also also also venom snake: *saves children from an active battlefield despite his contract to eliminate them*
Did we even play the same game
Yes
To be fair venom was ready to turn the kids into child soldiers
Also Venom Snake: leads outer heaven, follows Big Boss’s goal and tries to start a never ending war.
Venom and Big Boss’s idea was noble but at the end of the day they were still bad.
also also also also: construtcted housing and save native wildlife in warzones
Yes… we did soldier
"This is the only problem in MGS5"
*Shows a soldier with a cat on top of his head*
That sounds like a feature
@@blacklite911 "It just works"
im pretty sure thats a mod.
@@Zenviticit’s from the battle points store of metal gear survive
Isn't the cat from the MGO MB Coins store?
"Devoted their lives for you"
By devoted do u mean kidnapped
From animals to hoooman
kidnapped and prob brainwashed
@@eduardoalbornoz2718 not necessarily brainwashed. Think about it, Big Boss is a legend among mercenaries and PMCs around the world and he resurfaced after many years. What mercenary wouldn’t want to work for the legend himself? For the soldiers he takes from the field, I’m sure working for Diamond Dogs is a helluva lot better than working for the army or other PMCs
@@outdoorscholar6016 ok that covers a lot, now what about the conscripted Russians who likely have families back home?
Iirc, Ocelot actually does mention he brainwashes the troops
Fun fact: The piece of metal stuck in Big Boss' Head actually grows longer the more people you kill.... It signifies a demon's horn
"Pacifist run"
My brother you tortured a deadly injured man with a skin condition to death
He deserves it tbh.
Deserved it tbh
You lost me there
He put a bomb in a teenager and aided in genocide in order to conduct human experiments on Innocents???
Didn't huey kill him though?
I always presumed it was snakes inward feelings. He feels guilty for lots of these things, or maybe he even felt like he was living a lie. It’s really hard to say
I thought you were going to mention how it's literally unfinished.
I mean I would say that would be the only issue that I can think of at least
@@XPert9000 Don't forget the super cool tank the game hypes up but never lets you use.
2015: unfinished
2022: unfinished
@@user-ul3kk6hr5i can't exactly finish a game when the creator doesnt even work with the publisher nor does he want to
@@jimmyjohnjohnson9803 bruh
I think this plays perfectly though into MGS' themes of misinformation and perception though, the whole point of every character throughout the entire series is that they're not as they seem or they're not like the legends/myths that are made about them
Glad someone else sees it that way
I disagree but alright
The series is a postmodern masterpiece in this way. It is hands down top 2 video game stories, in terms of quality and using narrative, ludonarrative harmony, and context to create deeper meaning. I'm thinking RDR2 is close up there, but I can't think of any more 🤔
Kind of like how Big Boss percieved Zero, throughout most of his life, and he was the villain. But little did Big Boss know, his motives were pure in his own mind, and he idolized Big Boss. Big Boss is a villain in the eyes of most, but from his perspective his motives make sense and he’s a good guy. All comes down to perspective and perception, and what the legends around said person are.
@DRIV3R
Agreed
I love the fact that the clips in the background are from donkey’s video
I came to the comments just to point out that it’s lifted directly off his channel
Who the FUCK is donkey
Sounds like a dunkey clone
@@ezachleewright2309 its dunkey but autocorrected
@@Cybersomnia no shit 😐
@@jedwademberpants4531 exactly?
"You can be a pacifist" *The mandatory killing missions*: Yes.
The only missions that outright require killing are the ones involving Enemy Helicopters. Most of those are side-ops though which don't need to be played for story progress.
I don't remember if there's a bit in any of the story levels where blowing up a helicopter can't be subverted or isn't optional.
@@AzelfandQuilava i think he's talking about the mission with the infected mother base soldiers
@@madara992I'm not sure if I missed something, but I didn't have to kill any of my guys. I sent everyone that spoke Kikongo to quarantine where they died of the disease until I got that situated, but I didn't personally kill any of them. Was this something implied that I missed, because that wouldn't surprise me.
@@WickedWeaseification you're too early in the game, they're talking about mission 43
@@winermine9029 Since making the comment, I've completed the game. And yeesh, yeah that was some pretty rough stuff.
Didn't think Koji could outdo the microwave hallway, but he sure as shit found a way.
I would say that almost no one in the MG verse is bad , they just don't see eye to eye. For example Big Boss kept a nuclear weapon that made him a threat while also being a mercenary, so to someone else Big Boss may seem as a bad guy, but he isn't. At the end of the day it's all about anti heros making their image of the world and their home a reality.
No there are some very deplorable characters in this series. Skullface literally forced Chico (a child) to sexually assault Paz.
@@cocob0l0 I stated almost no one.
Skullface was a child solider that was taken from his home and had to assimilate with every culture due to the Imperialism time period. He had everything taken from him and after Zero betrayed him as well and left him with Cypher, he turn tail behind their backs. During such, he knew everything Paz did and every lie she said as a snake. In fact Paz only ever followed Zero's wish which is why she was still with Big Boss. So SF took her to find out all she knew about the Major. Chico part was the only truly bad thing he did now that I think about it.
More like "noone in MG verse is actually good". The two inheritor of Boss' will got it so warped that they became evil in the process and lost their ways. Big Boss became a hypocrite at the end. He loathes the US government because it treated The Boss and him as tools to be discarded after use and yet he did the exact same thing to Venom Snake and Diamond Dogs. Creating an endless war where soldiers will always be needed so they wont get discarded is the most deplorable thing to do.
On the other hand, you have Zero, Patriots and all below him who all became control freaks. Zero created the Patriots because he wants absolute unity and total control of the masses which spirals out of control when we reached MGS 2 and 4. These two supposedly "good men" has committed and responsible, directly or indirectly, for the worst crimes possible.
And then theres Volgin, Liquid and Skullface who are just straight up evil. Only Solid Snake, Otacon and Raiden who might be genuinely good. Even then im still not sure with Solid Snake and Raiden. The only genuinely good person was The Boss and Otacon really
The story doesn't necessarily treat you as a villain. You save kidnapped prisoners, spare people, make child soldiers get educated instead of fighting and disarm nukes. The game rewards you for that, and punishes you for killing.
But the grander story of the series treats Venom Snake as a villain.
@@elijahmeilak2906 no just wrong Venom snake dosen't even reappear it's not venom the Bad Guy it's Big boss
@@slimboarder.o7he does appear in metal gear 1, posing as big boss I believe
@@slimboarder.o7Venom does re appear, he is the final boss in MG1, and he served his purposed to be a decoy for Big Boss.
Venom saved good boy D-Dog, He can't be a bad person
“Every interaction can play out a million different ways.” Bullshit, they always end with me dying.
Just get better
did you throw enough empty ammo clip?
@@snartgaming4922 hmmmm
@@snartgaming4922 elitist detected lethal force authorised
@@notaspider4084 lethal force engaged, fire
Best thing about this game is when Venom holds Kaz at gun point and says "You fucked up my face" and shoots him out his Mother Base
The whole point of the 1 ending is that even if your evil or good it would not matter because war never changes
To be fair, the real reason we are treated as a bad guy is because we are still abducting enemy soldiers and getting them to work for us, though then again they do have a choice about it.
Then there's when Huey was exiled and Miller said that Huey would spread talk about the "Black Hearted Diamond Dogs" and whatnot.
Venom canonically uses the *1 AM D114 Handgun and *1 AM MRS-4 Assault Rifle, w/o Silencer, in the cutscenes, no matter what weapons you actually use. So that means he is always using lethal weapons and we do know he kills people.
I think they don't render the silencer in the cutscenes because sometimes these happens at the end of a mission, so the silencer may have broken
Bro really showed Hunt Down the Freeman 💀
Where broo??
"... You can go the entire game without killing a single person"
Yeah, it's not like there was a mission where I had to kill my soldiers because they had a parasite ascendant of Fox Die in their throats, of course the problem was that and not the fact that the game is basically incomplete and the story doesn't explains basic things like why Ocelot is an ally if he was an annoying kid in the last game we saw him
To answer your question of why Ocelot is an ally if he was an annoying kid. The main reason is that he’s a simp for Naked Snake and is only loyal to him
MSG3 Snake Eater took place in 1964, MSG5 took place in 1984. Ocelot was born in 1944 so he was 20 when we first saw him and 40 when we saw him in MGS5. The bigger question is why does he look like he’s in his 70s or 80s when he’s middle aged but I guess war does that to soldiers
As for other questions, the audio tapes Snake collects throughout the game provide exposition dumps as needed.
It explains that in 3. Ocelot was actually a double agent and was on your side the entire time. You were supposed to meet an agent code named Adam, but he didn’t show and instead you met Eva. Turns out Eva sabotaged the meeting and was a Chinese double agent, and Ocelot was Adam.
>descendant of foxdie
Wait what? Isn’t mgs1 way after mgs5?
Kojima say the story satisfies him how it is.
@@speedweednfeed6721 just fixed that, thank you for telling me
I like how you said "venom snake is still a villain if you do a pacifist run" IN THIS VIDEO making your entire point worthless.
I don't think we are meant to see venom snake as a villain but as a tragic hero who despite all his goodness it's all in vain
He only saw himself as a monster like in misson 43, he blames himself for what happened that day
You’re forced to shoot two XOF soldiers in the prologue.
I think the story does a great job of showing you no matter how noble you try to be if it’s all for revenge you can only ever end up going down one path. The path of violence, death, and destruction. If you choose to be a bad guy it doesn’t sugar coat anything and says “yeah you got what you wanted but also this is really fucked up.” And if you play a pacifist run it says “you tried to be good but you can’t really be a good guy when your end goal is revenge”
footage from dunkey and a whole different game…good content
I really felt it when snake said" Turn the ship. We’re going to Borealis"
Snake is not a villain…he’s the opposite in the whole story
Tbh, you don't need to do an evil playthrough for Venom to be evil if you think about it.
Big Boss created his army to help end conflicts and prevent something like the PW incident happening, at least until he gave up and gave the title to Venom.
Venom made it solely with the purpose of revenge, and gets to the point of making his own nuclear deterrents, and then does what he did up to Metal Gear, plus having to carry the weight of everything the real Snake probably got up to during that time slot.
That's also a player choice actually.
I mean, I wanted revenge and to rebuild the legend of big boss, so being the guy who took down a massive metal gear, a deadly plague, told the soviets to fuck off, built nukes and made a massive PF sounds cool
Venom didnt make it for revenge, he was forced to do it for big boss' revenge,
@@user-ut4tk4ph5z well yes, but actually no.
I did do it for big bosses glory, but I thought I was big boss, and technically I am, so I was doing it for ne
@@Smelly556
Do u really think no brainwashing to do what they wanted venom to do happened ?
“One major flaw” they literally released a game that wasn’t even finished lmao
It was just a fake controversy because Konami just removed kojima.
Mgs v was complete. Nothing is left to be known. And if you know, the end credits isn't where the game ends. You have to do more missions for one final big reveal.
People don't even know that and they just complaint.
Atleast have enough mind to understand the story.
@@breakthebad1770 there are literally unfinished cutscenes with a more proper conclusion to Liquid and retrieving Metal Gear but ok
@@breakthebad1770 The game was supposed to have 3 chapters not 2.
MGSV is an amazing game, but unfinished. And that is very disappointing.
With more time and money it could have been an amazing game :/
@@breakthebad1770 atleast have enough mind to know what the fuck people are talking about. Entire plot points remain unfinished in the game, and you would only find out what happned if you watched the bonus disc. That is literally unfinished. game is str8 garbage, mgs4 was peak gameplay too.
@@hgfjhfgify chapter 2 is not even a chapter, just disjointed stuff put together
"I'll just rip my footage from everyone else, they won't know I never played the game"
-this clown
One person but okay, sorry I didn’t record my own footage for a game I played 5 years ago
Plus i could’ve got footage from a million other people nobody would have noticed I chose dunkeys as a joke
Why are you complaining? Bruh 90% of youtube is cut and paste content nowadays, and the video isn't needed here at all its all audio
@@Hermit0 why you reviewing a game you haven’t played for 5+ years? bruh you just be a 🤡
@@Insanepie it's not even a review he just about a talked flaw in the game or even can be considered a plot hole or have another meaning do you even know what's a review
I know people have said this hundreds of times already here but, he's not evil. He's literally doing good things throughout the game. He's used by Big Boss to be his copy basically, but Big Boss isn't evil either. He may be an enemy in game, because his views and methods are drastic at times, but that doesn't make him evil.
"The story treats you as a bad guy"
Venom after sparing Huey's life despite everything he has done, as well as Quiet's, the children, Liquid, and many more: Am I a joke to you?
The story treat us as the villain because it tells a meaning, it doesn't give us the choice just like real life, that what the creator wanted to make a game were any action good or bad will be seen as being bad because that how to world would see it, there are a lots like this in history we people had to make questionable action to reach there goals even if it was meant for good.
Wtf you mean in real life you dont have a choice ? That is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.
@@denizcan6032 they're talking about how people are perceived in history you plonker.
@@G-DORA ...or it is pretentious, pompous, and "deep" bullshit. My bet is on that.
@@denizcan6032 thank you deniz can, for your input on art. You will change history forever because of your comment on a phantom pain video.
@@G-DORA Who said anything about making a change you donut? I just gave my idea on a pretentious comment. Also, I hope you realize the irony of your comment here.
my man used hunt down the freeman footage in a mgsv video 💀
Ah yes my favorite Snake, “Mitchell”, from MGS5:HDTF.
Yes, there Ishmael, Ahab and Mitchell. The third Big Boss is a little special because it has infinite stealth cammo
He kills his infected soldiors which is why he sees himself as a demon, also kills skull face
Correction: He leaves Skullface to die, but Huey kills him anyways
Big Boss was only portrayed as a villain in the V's. In PW and MGS3 he was just like Solid Snake
I love MGSV, I really wish Konami and Kojima were able to finish the game, before they parted ways😓
Kojima is satisfied with the game
@@Cakemarvelous BUT IM NOT
kojima probably wanted to do more, konami wanted to kill his career and legacy, sadly it seems they did after survive happened, kojima at least still has a gaming career though
Don't be sad man. I've heard rumors that Kojima and Sony are trying to obtain a license or the IP to MGS and when they do, they wanna rehire the former staff and remake the game to completion with everything Kojima wanted to add with Sony blessings. The problem is that it's a rumors and unconfirmed by any sources. I've heard this rumors about 2 years ago but nothing seems to pop up. Just pray for it to happened
@@wololoman3314 bless you dude
Euuuh, I remember kidnapping a bunch of folk and I'm pretty sure I didn't convince them to join with a box of cookies.
Not just a box of cookies. A CARDBOARD box of cookies!
They basically just convince them after you Fulton them so you better hope ocelot is really persuasive
They were communists not people
I'm not a bad man, my angel points just got so high they reset to 0!
What are you talking about? Venom literally spends the whole game saving people, Kaz, Quiet, Huey, the kids...how can he be evil? Well, perhaps, he's actually morally better than the real Big Boss
It's not a flaw in the game, it's a staple of the franchise. Metal Gear seeks to have you feel the weight of killing people.
Know that when Venom appears as the villian in MG that it is from the perspective of a young SS.
But rarely are villains all _bad_ and rarely is the hero all _good._
the most painful part is raiden refusing his sword
I don’t think Venom is inherently evil, he just took the position he could take, with the cards he was dealt.
No,he is not
it's just Venom and Big Boss goals piss the US government.
@@uchophamxuan6515Not true , did you even understood why big boss created outer heaven in the first place.
the hdtf clip lmaoo
Don't forget the game was never truly finished
The biggest flaw was not putting act 3 in and tying up all the loose ends with Eli. That error essentially gives us a game with an unsatisfying ending. I like how it explained how Big Boss died twice in two Metal Gear games but that last English parasite needed to be included. It would have been better to play it than to read it through supplemental materials.
Well, the parts that kojima did, the parts that he didn't planned for are just down right rushed and bad
Yeah the game definitely varies from extremely well polished to rush job depending on the section
which parts would those be?
Damn, Hunt down the Freeman is in MGS5
Where?
@@tracark2255 bruh in the post
The aliens are coming! We’ve been compromised!
Why does that make him a bad or evil person? He's fighting other bad guys. Who cares what his motivation is?
Are they? A lot of the time you’re just fighting Russian or Congo soldiers, sure some of the time you fight some depraved fuckers, but the Russian soldiers are just (mostly) young guys in a war they didn’t want. If you listen in on the conversations with them they’ll complain about the war and what they do. In one of the earlier missions you have to kill/extract a Soviet commando and he tells his men that if a commander told him to kill a civilian he’d kill them instead.
And he’s manipulated in believing he’s someone he’s not.
The content creator seems to not know that Venom isn’t Big Boss
The only flaw I see is that it doesn't always save, because there's not enough save points. So I have to force save it.
He sees himself as a villain because of his philosophies in mgs3 with the whole “soldier without a country” stuff
I feel like you have never played the game. You even had to put Donkey's clips
Didn’t have to just did it for fun.
"Evil" when the people calling you a bad guy are the major governments of the world, you're probably the hero.
I mean no matter how good he is he is still living for big boss's sins. Also making a nuclear military state in the ocean. You're not the best guy.
He is the villain to the eyes of the public and because is key to the mission the "real big boss " gave him
I think it works out great. The feeling I get from Venom is that he wants to be a good person, but he’s forced to do terrible things because of the role he’s been put into.
I like that you snuck in "Hunt Down the Feeeman" footage
I wonder if it's snuck or he just forgot the game and thought hdtf was a part of it
Actually there's at least two problems. The one you mentioned and the one where the game is incomplete.
Of course he is a bad guy, he is the Big Boss you kill in the very first game. It's basically how they explained how Big Boss wasn't dead and returned later on in MGS4. Yes we play as 3 different Snakes through the series.
That's the point, no matter what venom does, he is perceived as a bad guy, In the children mission, forgot the name, snake doesn't kill or harm kids, and it will be so throughout the game, but In later timeline, V is referenced as a guy who arms kids and uses them
Venom is literally shown as an absolute angel throught the entire game : didn't kill Quiet, spared Huey, made diamonds from fallen men, broke down after the quarantine massacre.
Exactly
I recognize that gameplay. Videogamedunkey made half of the clips shown in the video.
Or, you know, the fact that the story was literally cut short at like 66%. I would call that a flaw. Or how it was made to be amazing for the first 20 hours and then be a crappy grind for another 60 hours.
Yeah, and how the story was told, with those audios, and how you are forced to repeat the Chapter 1 missions, now in Chapter 2. And how Venom Snake was so boring, and the map almost empty, and how the game is so much better if you just skip the cutscenes. But hey, "only one major flaw".
In my eyes for the moment Venom Snake did everything he could to build mother base from the ground up and tried to bring everyone together no matter the cost. He truly cared for his soldiers and his close friends. He went to extreme lengths to do something better even when others doubted him. To me Venom Snake is in the shadow of the legendary Big Boss.
The only flaw i can think of it that you can’t reset the game and start from the beginning
The only flaw of Metal Gear Solid 5 is the existences of lady Morbius which is Quiet
“Only had one major flaw” my dude. I think you meant to say “only had one thing goin for it. The gameplay” everything else about it was shit.
You can be pacifist in other mgs games
Edit: Forgot to mention that not killing is even "recommended" sense in most mgs games if you get 0 alerts and 0 kills you get "stealth" that allows you to go invisible
If I remember right, only MGS3 really punishes the player if they kill the soldiers as we see in the battle with The Sorrow. I don’t remember MGS1, 2, or 4 having consequences for killing enemies. Even Peace Walker didn’t seem to have repercussions.
The only punishment for MGS5 is getting Demon Snake but that’s about it
@@outdoorscholar6016 exactly also the Sorrow "boss fight" is even longer if you killed a lot (I think).
In my opinion mgs3 was the best.
this is a good argument, but the “Hunt Down The Freeman” clip devalues your words
How? The game basically copied MGSV, not exactly a difference lol
Venom Snake isn't really evil as he seems. At least compared to Big Boss, he himself chose to spare Huey, Canonically Quiet and saved the kids instead of killing them like the Mission intended
Im pretty Venom just sees himself as a demon no matter what because of what he has been through.
That’s actually kinda good. We see him as a good guy but he’s a villain
I mean, the story of HDTFM is literally a ripoff of MGSV
"This is the only problem with Metal Gear Solid V"
David Hayter's absence.
I really missed Hayter's iconic voice in V, but actually I understand why he wasn't in it.
Sutherland did an excellent job and I wouldn't change the voices even if I could.
@@solesoulsorrow eh, David could of atleast played real boss. (Spoilers for all 5 people that didn't know you don't play as real snake in 5 but the bro dude Solid Snake kills in Metal Gear (not solid) 2.
I mean Venom was written as a villainous character since metal gear 1... mgs 5 demonstrated how and why Venom cracked mentally, destined to live the rest of his life angry at the world.
any decent player in mgsv: *does pacifist run*
medical platform: *exists*
The problem with MGSV is that it's unfinished
The worst problem in the game is it gives you all these weapons, tactics, and equipment to go full Rambo yet it punishes you for it and wants you to just crawl around everywhere and tranq everyone
I never felt "punished" as there's no negative effect to your character. You can say that you get the evil ending, but honestly who cares. You're just a doppelganger at the end of the day and no matter how you play the game it won't change the fact that you're a victim of the real big boss.
I might have too many useless memories, pretty sure most gameplay footage was from Videogamedonkey
yeah and hunt down the freeman
it would be even better if it was a finished product
I hope Peace Walker is included in the collection, it would be a pretty stupid decision not to have it in the collection.
"you dont need to kill anyone through the entire game"
MISSION 43
Well while Venom himself is a good guy - if you want him to be - he’s still propped up as Big Boss’ double, so it makes sense that he’s treated that way. Venom accepts his fate in the end
"You can go the whole game without killing anyone"
Meanwhile my run:Total play time 499:51:32. Kills:12339
Well one major flaw second to the main one that it’s not fully finished
Considering the existence of Mission 43 I'm not sure that the phrase "pacifist run" really has that much meaning