[DOOM] Sandy Petersen's Level Design
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- Опубликовано: 27 сен 2024
- id Software's most prolific level designer of the "DOOM" era, Sandy Petersen tends to be overlooked by many, if not outright forgotten. However, his groundbreaking contributions helped shape the original DOOM games into the timeless classics we all know and love. This video discusses what set him apart from John Romero and the rest of the crew at id and also shows off some of his most unique and innovative levels.
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![[DOOM] John Romero's Level Design Rules](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/ptHurafdCoQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Whoa! I'm humbled and embarrassed a bit by this. But thanks a million. You correctly call out that I was not an artist, but a designer, hence my less-gorgeous levels. But when I started, there was no such thing as a "level designer". I guess I was one of the first ever.
well well well, if isn't THE MAN himself. Thanks for helping shape my child hood Mr. Peterson :)
@@IDontReadReplies42069 You are forgiven for spelling my last name wrong. I hope my effect on your childhood was positive.
Sandy of Cthulhu i want to thank you, Romero and John carrack but mostly you for creating my favorite game of all time I love doom and the community and the levels you designed are some of my favorite and I just can’t stop thanking you man your a god damn legend I love your vids and I love DOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMM!!!! Your a legend man🤟
@@sargentd6780 it was a team effort.
Thanks for your excellent work. You helped make a very fond period of my childhood gaming exploring these expertly crafted demonic labyrinths. I really missed your design philosophy with DOOM Eternal which 80 percent of the time is hallway> battle arena> cross invisible trigger> entrance seals> demons spawn in = repetitive battle arena gameplay. I miss the old days of old school level design.
The fake exit was genuinely one of the scariest moments I've experience playing a video game. That was brilliant.
Ive been replaying the Dooms for the first time in 15 years. That level had me yelling obscenities.
It's ironic that the media said that Doom promotes satanism, but Sandy Peterson is a Mormon who did most of the hell levels lmao
Slayer are christians and Black Sabbath wrote pro-Christianity lyrics in "Master of Reality." Image isn't everything.
@@UnchainedEruption Well, Tom Araya is Catholic. King is extremely atheist. Not sure about the others in Slayer.
I still don't see how ravaging Hell and slaying demons is pro-satanism.
The demons are the bad guys.
@@tankerd1847 I guess it's got to do with showing all the symbols and shit.
But those ppl are morons, like a lot of religious ppl are.
Since Romero made a new set of levels for Doom called Sigil
We should ask Petersen if he could make a set of new levels for Doom 2 if he wants to
I kinda would like to play that
Sadly, it'll probably never happen. From a Reddit AMA he did several years ago:
[Makhauser
] "Hi, Sandy, thanks for all the stuff you have created. Haven't you thought about making a level/wad for DooM as JR did some time ago? Your levels were rather remarkable, admire playing them even now."
[SandyPetersen] "Thank you so much for the praise! There are so many levels for Doom out there - and so many excellent fan-based ones. I'm not sure that my input is particularly needed."
Here's the link if you want to check it out (I originally said it was in the video description, but it turns out this is a different AMA):
www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/50j8k4/iama_sandy_petersen_a_professional_game_designer
@@Chubzdoomer modest of him to say but not true, im sure you can find levels better designed than romeros but that was never the point, as a very long time doom fan i enjoy their classic ways of making levels. his input would be more than welcome, i can just imagine what he could create today.
@@Gebora i dont think his levels can beat romeros at all
@@Chubzdoomer I would love to play a new SP map. Too bad all the whiny "SANDY PETERSIN IZ BAYUD MAPPEAR" plebs most likely drove him away from doing so. Heck, he could make one and send it to me privately if he wants, I'd be most grateful!
@@MySocksAreOnFire-b4c check out my new board game Planet Apocalypse which is literally about soldiers killing demons. Even has a spider rmastermind
The thing that people need to understand is that Petersen is actually a really good level designer. But the poor man only had 3 months! 3 months to not only learn how to build 3D levels for the first time in his life on the most unique and advanced game engine up to that point, but also be required to build the majority of the levels! That's why he used many of Tom Hall's levels as a launch pad to help speed up the process. Even though he had more time to work on the levels for Doom II, the amount however were still about the same as before and this time he would have to make all of them from scratch.
So the question is this: What if he only needed to worry about building a small handful of levels in a larger space of time? Like...lets say: 7 levels over 7 months? Well, he did. He made 7 levels for episode 4 in Quake 1, which are not only some of the best levels in that game in terms of design and also in art style (proving that he can indeed make levels that aren't always ugly), but some of the best levels to ever come from id Software in my opinion.
I just posted about Episode 4, those maps are mind-blowing, definitely a must play. Only to be surpassed by the ones in Scourge of Armagon expansion pack. (by the same guys who later on designed the maps on Sin)
I started on Doom in August 1993. Man there was a lot of work to do.
@@SandyofCthulhu Holy Cow! It's Sandy! :D
@@GTXDash and Dash!
As someone who first played Doom and Doom II on release, and not knowing anything about the development team, I never once thought "Man, these Petersen levels suck ass". Instead, every episode of the game had its own unique look and feel, which in my opinion mirrored the development of Super Mario Bros 3 in terms of offering diversity in environments and new spins on gameplay even though the fundamental mechanics stayed the same. It's a masterpiece of design and there's a reason why so many people are still playing Doom to this day. You feel like there's a natural progression to the game and there isn't the feeling of being dropped into a soulless sandbox where everything looks procedurally generated like the games of today.
After watching Civvie 11's videos on Doom while I do agree with most of his criticisms with Peterson's levels this video did make me appreciate him way more then I use to.
I really like E2M6's paths for finding the red and yellow skull keys, it was like a treasure hunt.
This Civvie guy is obnoxious. I don 't understand why people keep listening to him. He does not delve into the essence of the games he plays, remaining in the populist opinion
@@Jackfromshack that's the point, dummy.
Civvie sucks. I don’t agree with him on anything.
@@magicjohnson3121I personally like Civvie but he isn't the best player ever which can be infuriating so I can understand if seeing him blow up seems unjust.
edit: heck I disagree with the city levels being "bad", map 17 is forgettable but I love maps 14, 15, 16, 18 and 20
@@Jackfromshack But he's "The Pinnacle of Online Entertainment"!
I may not have vibed with Sandy's maps but I have a huge amount of respect for the sheer work he put in and the creativity he brought to the table. A key part of DOOM, for sure!
Mt Erebus is the bomb. It’s one of my top 5 doom levels
What I love about Mt Erebus is I always thought it was suppose to be the front cover of Doom with it's hellish wasteland aesthetic.
For years I had no idea how you were supposed to access the secret exit. Like, I knew where it was (or at least I deduced it because I realized that blue box at the top of the map otherwise had no purpose), but I just "cheated" and would activate the switch from the other side. It took me a long time to realize you were supposed to rocket jump. It went against my gamer instincts of doing something that is ultimately suicidal, even if the invulnerability sphere is there.
I've always liked that map not just how open it is, but because it's the first time in the game you had to do something that is otherwise very contradictory to advance to another map.
4:18 "arguably one of his greatest achievements is map 13,downtown"
well when i played it first time,i was walking around for hours figuring out what to do and listening my favorite DOOM music
yeah I struggled finding my way around but I think its cool to see a city as its hell on earth after all
haha same
@@DJL3G3ND eternal still does it better. Downtown felt empty and boring, no interesting wall textures. Less hell on earth, more abandoned city.
G E T G U D
@@cro-magnum7642 Eternal level design are just boring linear arenas while Downtown have actual exploration. Just because you have an awful sense of direction doesn't mean the map isn't good.
(inb4 "hurr durr the arrow on the floor")
He made some of my Favorite levels and so did John Romero
“But most importantly! Make sure that whatever your designing looks NOTHING like what it’s supposed to!”
Sandy’s awesome but….COME ON, still a awesome level designer and this is a awesome video
He also worked on Quake and gave the idea for the Lovecraftian monsters.
Hall's of the damned is his level? I LOVE THAT ONE! its got a lot of amazing traps, and fortress of mystery is a super fun level. Heck actually all the ones you listed are my favorites. Ha! never knew.
thanks!
Romero is only credited with the original E1 maps in Doom 1. He did the first two maps of E4, IIRC. Everything else was credited to someone else. This is one of the reasons the E2 and E3 maps have a very different look and feel.
So... this guy made all of my favorite doom levels, basically. "Halls of the damned" is one my most terrifyingly memorable map from any game, that fake exit is just so...cruelly hellish. Megakudos to him
Sandy is seriously an unrecognized genius 👏 for God sake, he has his own song!
I'm sure this has been pointed out before but I feel that Sandy's maps really have that old school d&d sensibility to them. Was not surprised at all to find out he had a long respectable history in pen and paper game design prior to doom.
Doom levels are so elegant. Puzzles, traps, tricks, fakeouts, obstacles, secrets and arenas all built into the geometry.
Doom II cities' levels are seriously my favourite in the OG Doom. Complately packed with enemies and traps, and you run and backtrack A LOT. That's my preferred Doom experience.
Badass. This gives new meaning to Into Sandys City
1:33 and also it teaches the observant player about intentional in-fighting by showing dead cacao in the hell knight room and dead hell knights in the cacao room. I immediately restarted the level after I went into the 2nd room and realized what I was supposed to do. Def some of the most memorable levels mechanically
E2M8 builds on this concept by showing dead barons strung up on the wall, but there are no cacodemons. This is a clue that whatever is on this map is going to be much tougher than the barons (who up until the cyber-demon are the toughest enemies in the game).
There's actually a good deal of visual storytelling in Doom, more than it often gets credit for.
This was a very informational video. Of all the years of playing Doom and map packs, I never knew just how many maps Sandy was responsible for in the original games! I knew more of his maps from Quake but didn't realize so many of my favorite Doom maps were by him. Without him, Doom 1 and 2 just would have been completely different experiences. Sometimes it just takes one person to make an entire vision for a game.
Great sum-up of Sandy's Doom stuff, I'm not one of those guys that instantly know the layout of a Doom map when its name and number is mentioned, so this was a great jog of memory through some of my absolute favorite Doom maps, with their author's due credit duly strengthened.
Fortess Of Mystery also shows another of Sandy's talents as a designer: visual storytelling. The hint that you're supposed to use in fighting is that the Baron room is full of Cacodemon carcasses, and the Cacodemon room has got Barons chained up on the walls bleeding to death. A hint that these two enemies don't like each other, perhaps....
The open and sandbox levels are one of the greatest and in a way define Doom, making it stand out as not just corridor shooter. In a way Serious Sam was the first game that tried to recrate that when the technology was there to do it in 3D.
The Chasm is literally the entire speedrunning communities bane of existence
In the level the Chasm i remember room with green walls.
I know a lot of people really hate Petey's levels but honestly, I beg to differ. In fact i think some of his levels are honestly top notch, even surpassing Romero at some points. He's responsible for some of my favorite maps, including: Spawning Vats (my favorite id-made doom map), Command Center, Containment Area, Halls Of the Dammed, Pandemonium, Refueling Base, Monster Condo, And Many More! If the man himself is spotted here, what is one piece of advice you would give for level design.
Unpopular opinion, but I actually liked his city maps in Doom 2. As a kid, they were the most realistic maps of a city or town in a game I had seen at the time, and they were always fun to explore.
Sandy didn't make levels to look at or be visually satisfying for screenshots, but made levels for pure gameplay and experience. A Sandy level loves to keep you on your toes, misdirect you and force you into tight spots where you need to think for just a second. Tricks and Traps imo is the quintessential Sandy level, it doesn't need to make any sense for the forces of hell to have such a building it just needs to be a challenge and fun.
Thanks for the mapping ideas, SP, and thanks for publicizing them more chubz
Wait I was supposed to make them infight in fortress of mystery not pistol start and kill all of them manually? #_#
There is no "wrong way" to play. Whatever works for you is fine. But yes, the "intent" was to have the enemies engage in in-fighting and then all the stragglers. This concept was used again in "Tricks & Traps," when there's a room with a cyber-demon and a lot of barons.
I think what’s best about Sandy’s more experimental maps is just how influential and groundbreaking they are. People may hate the Chasm and find something like Nirvana and Monster Condo annoying but that kind of weird but striking design, “realistic” visuals and unique set pieces really set a precedent for map makers at the time. It showed that not everyone had to be a standard hell level or a standard tech base, etc. Some of his levels might not be my favourites, but Doom (especially Doom 2) wouldn’t be the same without them
I remember playing a lot of those levels and really enjoyed them. Some were my fav's. I can appreciate the work he did on these levels. It was one of the inspirations that eventually contributed to me doing some level design later in life for another game. I don't do anything professional but just as a hobbyist. Level design can be very satisfying when things work and the level is just fun to play with replay value as well. So, thanks to Sandy Petersen. Also, thanks for making this video. I definitely appreciate level designers.
Downtown was the raddest deathmatch level too, heaps of items, weapons, places to hide. We used to race each other to the berserker pickup 👊
Don't forget that Sandy made a lot of these maps in a very short span of time ( 7 weeks to release if I am not mistaken). That is an incredible feat.
I have a lot of respect for Sandy. His work on doom was great and you can see how hard he works to make things work with Age of Empires 2's perfect balance. Great experimentor - great learner
Anyone else think Chub sounds like Don S. Davis at times during this video? I almost thought i was watching a SG1 review of Doom.
I've recently rediscovered my love for the first two Doom games, and am really enjoying your videos on their level design!
What always amazes me is how much was Sandy able to do in the incredibly limited time he had. That speaks volumes about talent, creativity and pure skill - especially when we consider that FPS genre was very much literally in its infancy and there was a lot of ground nobody ever walked on before.
Sandy Petersen also designed the majority of levels for Episode 4, "The Elder World" of Quake 1 (all except the first):
e4m2 The Tower of Despair
e4m3 The Elder God Shrine
e4m4 The Palace of Hate
e4m5 Hell's Atrium
e4m6 The Pain Maze
e4m7 Azure Agony
e4m8 The Nameless City
No matter how amazing the new wads have in level design, none of them feel as fun as the maps from Doom 1 and 2.
Thanks Sandy, for making my favorite Doom and Doom 2 maps. They happen to be the most fun maps for me in multiplayer coop, great times over the modem.
Sandy's levels were more creative, imaginative, and fun to play.
Sandy's levels make me very nostalgic.
Yeppers
WORD
Do not forget his great work on Quake 1!
Loved all his levels so much. They had some kind of abstractnes to them that wasn't found in other Doom levels. I remember reading his guide/principles for creating Doom levels as a section in PC Format that ran over 4 months. I think I still keep those magazines somewhere. You're right, I think his levels are underappreciated perhaps.
I've been playing through Doom and Doom II again recently and definitely noticed the difference in styles between Romero and Petersen. Really awesome game design that still holds up to this day!
Monster Condo still wrecks my brain even after all this time though X-D
Fake exits...spooky... a level in the shape of the hand... Chubz, you just nailed it. This is my personal soapbox by the way. To me, classic Doom is all about the tension...the spooky layouts... pauses where you almost feel safe and get caught admiring the level as you are suddenly swarmed by baddies. The newer games often suffer from this lack of organic ebb and flow. I simply can't enjoy the nuances of a game when I'm constantly running and shooting to save my skin. Long live classic Doom and those that keep it alive today! And it goes without saying... Thank you Sandy Peterson!
This was a fantastic video Chubz. I had no idea that Sandy Peterson was responsible for so many of my favorite levels, especially in Doom 2.
I never really paid attention to who designed what levels. But 'tricks and traps' and 'warrens' are both in my top 5. I also adore Halls of the Damned. Go sandy!
2:35 I can’t believe I missed this level! Guess it’s time to play Doom 1 again
Some of the best designs of all time. Seriously I'm new to doom but it's such an incredible game. Everything makes so much sense it's brilliant.
Downtown is one of my favorite Doom levels, even with the relatively primitive abstract graphics at the time it had this extremely memorable and oppressive "city under siege" feel to it
I'll be honest, some of Petersons maps in Doom I wasn't my favourite but in Doom II I loved basically all of them
Despite I really dislike The Chasm, Mt Erebus was a masterpiece. Petersen's work deserves much more love from the community.
Turns out that my most beloved Levels of the Games are all designed by Petersen.
Good recap of one of the most understated contributors to modern shooters.
Honorable mention to Quake episode 4 also designed by Sandy, if you can look pass the horrid Spawns everywhere, I just turn on godmode to deal with these. There are some legitimately jaw-dropping moments in these maps. I didn't know E1M8 was made by him, that must be the map that caused the most impact on me as a kid playing at the time, what a closer for the shareware episode, bravo!
"The Chasm" - random secret placement. That I remember the most.
Great video - Sandy was pretty influential regarding Doom. E3M6 made me fall in love with Doom.
Thanks for the video Chubz, I just want to throw some love to The Chasm --- one of my favourite Doom II levels, even if it has been a bit of an acquired taste. Maps 27, 16 and 18 are also among my favourites.
Maybe not the best looking levels, but they have a strange threatening atmosphere that I love. The abstract visuals mixed with the traps and mind games. So many areas in Sandys maps feel like places you weren't ever supposed to witness or understand as a lowly human, if we are to apply real life logic to Doom guys journey throughout Doom 1 & 2 .
The Chasm is a good example. The place looks unfamiliar and the puzzles and such are kind of rude. My favorite map of Doom 2. I have no sympathy for all the "hate" this one seems to get.
I love levels Entryway, the waste tunnels and Downtown, Nirvana.
I love his work. I didn't even know what he looked like until now!
You can't forget the part where sandy has his own city
Great vid dude!
Interesting that almost every map created by him is my favorite
I remember level 5 The waste tunnels - in this level first appears lost souls and hell knight.
You forgot E1M8, that was a good one for the Shareware version
I'm not a big fan of a handful of his levels (specifically all his episode 2 maps), but I think he better found his footing in Doom 2 with the emphasis on platforming and verticality.
hey Chubz! glad to see you back makin videos to enjoy :D
Mt. Erebus is the best DOOM 1 map, it´s amazing playing it for the first time, very memorable.
It took me an hour or so to find it's exit lmao 🤣
It's funny because Tricks and Traps is timelessly enjoyable for me as a less linear trial hub, but those open air maps like Erebos and Downtown I'd get frustratedly lost for hours in, to this day I start those maps and just lose all sense of direction; I think finding keys and key doors just halts me in my tracks because I never commit the level progression to memory.
Sandy's levels are quite interesting, and actually really enjoyable. The problem I have with them is their weird aesthetics. Texture work is rather questionable, but yeah, apart from the visuals, the levels themselves are quite fun.
I did realize after in chapter 2 and especially in chapter 3 of doom, there are a lot of traps and misleading doors, it ensures that you're always on edge.
Hell yeah chubz keep ripping and tearing! You and Sandy inspired me to make maps!
The only time I’ve ever heard someone say anything positive about Slough of Despair
Petersen may not have made the coolest maps in the Doom series but you gotta give it to the man as he made some memorable maps in the first Doom and most of the maps of Doom 2. Heck he was even the driving force in creating Quake maps.
my favs where petersons. and that fake exit. amazing
I hated tricks and traps bc the exit room where the stairs descended one after another I fell into the acid multiple times and RIPd. The room with all the he'll knights and cyberdemon was kewl
I remember Cyberdemon and all monsters on Doom 2.
Romero may have some of the iconic and cooler looking maps, but Petersen's levels were the more entertaining ones.
Mt. Erebus is one of the first levels I think of besides E1M1 when Doom 1 comes to mind
Excellent video Chubz. Greatly enjoyed it.
"some level of respect"!! I think he is amazing and you are right to give him his due credit.
While I respect the amount of work Sandy put into both DOOM games and the fact that he was trying to push forward interesting level design that tried to prove that "go here, collect keys, kill this, leave level" wasn't the only thing that the engine was capable of; I do find a lot of traps he made were down right dickish some times. However, I will say that they are mostly dickish due to the physical structor of rooms they are in and not just unfair shit being thrown at you. In other words, they're not Plutonia levels of dickish.
As a side note for those of you that didn't know, Sandy was also a game designer for a few Age of Empire games as well.
Well, now I know how made every single one of my favorite levels.
MAP13 is certain one of the most hated maps in Doom 2.
Map 13 on Doom 2 is Downtown.
Though a lot was started by Hall, I always felt like Sandy's was more thematic then Romeros.
I appreciate Petersen's stuff honestly.
After a man named Sue, there came a man named Sandy.
4:22 "Pro tip kids: If you need a giant arrow to tell the players where to go, it's not good level design."
has he ever spoke on the weird underwater area in map31?
Sandy Petersen seems to get a lot of flak for his less-liked levels like The Chasm and episode 4 of Quake, but he has made some brilliant contributions and, apparently, was the one who first came up with the concept of the Archvile.
Regarding the Satanic imagery and the like, when he was brought on, he was asked if he was okay with the fact that the game is set in Hell, and he responded he was fine, because the demons are the bad guys!
So cool. Great vid.
I loved the trap rooms.
I love your doom design videos. Very helpfull in my work. I would like to see more content like this.
I can hear civvie laughing at this video because you're praising petersen.
I was thinking the same thing lmao. He did so many great one-liners for Sandy's levels xD
I don't feel like civie outright hates his levels, he did state that he deserves credit due to a lack of expierence for doom 1
civvie is a moron
I don't think all of his maps hit the mark, but I definitely respect the ideas
Downtown was my all time favorite level.
@Chubzdoomer - Check out the map "Brigandine" if you haven't already. I've played so many DOOM wads and maps over the years and this still blows me away.
I find that Sandy and John fell into two different cloths of designer, John was more of aesthetic Level Designer whereas Sandy was more of a Experimental Level Designer, if My own recent and work in progress sewer mini-slaugter map is anything to go by, I am more of a Trap based level designer as I focus more so on traps that catch the player off guard, but I also seem to be something of a Prefabs and Tight Claustrophobic areas level designer.
I'm on the fence. Mr Peterson has done GREAT work : Containment area, Deimos lab, Halls of the damned (So good!) , Mt Erebus, Refuelling base, Suburbs, The courtyard, The citadel, Icon of sin.
But on the other had he has made some of the worst levels (IMO) : Fortress of mystery, Slough of despair (fucking hate that level), tricks and traps, Barrels 'o fun, The chasm (everyone's favourite, LOL)
Those levels what you hated are one of the best experiences of player expanding the abilities of doom engines to a complete new level bringing totally new gameplay, like the Chasm. It's not that hard level anyway if you're just careful, but the added dimension what it brought to gameplay was totally groundbreaking and new.
Your least favorite levels are some of my favorites and vice versa! I loved Fortress of Mystery, Tricks and traps, honestly like Barrels of fun, but my 3 least favorites are probably Suburbs, Refueling Base, and one other I can’t remember lmao
I remember now, Nirvana (ofc)
I guess I built something for everyone.
I actually like barrel's o fun and tricks and traps lol