"Hey Claudius do you think we should write down what these things are used for?" "Have you been drinking from the lead cups again Maximus?" Its obvious what they are used for there is no need."
When I was learning to tig weld, one of the learning challenges was to cut thin sheet metal pieces and weld them into geometric shapes. To me this looks like a proud craftsman making a bauble to show off his skill.
All the basic operations are visible. Fabricating sides, brazing them together, engraving, making holes, (probably as a demonstration of being able to make your own drills, files, ect.,) and brazing decorations to the piece. When you are done, it’s useless but you can show all your buddies how clever you are. Also this explains why they are similar but not all the same. (Perhaps in a military armorer’s guild or similar.)
As one comment suggests, it seems to just be a way for craftsman to show off their skill, the fancier it is the more skilled the craftsman. Which would answer why there’s no written use for them. Cause there is no use, it’s just a random doohickey.😂
One Monty Python skit suggests a possible function. The dodecahedra were used to verify the identity of emissaries from Rome. Bigus Dickus would fit the largest hole, Minimus Penus would fit the smallest one, etc.
I’m sold on the idea of this being used for spring planting just because it seems so much like those “as-seen-on-TV” gadgets that do some simple task that would be done more easily with an ordinary kitchen knife.
A coin-gauge. The most common way of messing with coinage was shaving the outside edge. You'd keep the small amount of valuable metal, then pass off the coin at its nominal value. That's why many coins eventually developed milled edges, so you could immediately tell if they'd been altered. So if, in any given region (or even across the empire), coins were minted in standard sizes, you could try a coin of a given denomination against the appropriately-sized hole. If it was too small, you rejected it as altered. The biggest, often oval-sized hole, was to more easily shake the coin out through if you accidentally dropped it inside. The indicators for which coin was to be gauged in which hole, were simply painted-on and have been lost. There's my theory.
That's a surprisingly realistic theory, but it seems more likely they would just make a flat, plane with approximately sized holes instead of a dodecahedron so it was lightweight and easier to transport.
@@KyleOchoa-k6e it doesn't need to travel compactly. It's probably for use by serious money-lenders, merchants, paymasters, etc. Otherwise you'd find a lot more of them. And if it's going to sit on your desk, a 3-d shape works better, since it has empty space inside. You'd have to pick the thing up to use it, if it were flat. This way, you just spin it around until the relevant facet faces you. The big shaking-out hole is always down against the surface of the desk or whatever. Edit: Also, thank you for the compliment.
If the holes match the common coin diameters of the day you might be right. The examples shown range from plain to rather elaborate and even the plainer ones would have been pretty intricate and difficult to make. That fancy, engraved one screams "banker" though.
I bought a replica and, as an experienced round loom knitter, I tried it - the round bobbles are too shallow to hold thick enough wool to make effective fingers as far as I'm concerned. You _can_ make a glove, but it's a pretty lacey endeavour, even if you can get the yarn to stay on while you're forming stitches. I have no proof for this, but my theory is that they are stands for the little round-bottomed glass perfume and makeup bottles from the same era. They came in different sizes, like the holes in the doohickey, and a quick test with a similarly sized object shows that it would enable such a bottle to stand upright. So, a bottle stand for a round-bottomed bottle.
There’s another RUclipsr who’s probably solved it. The holes are for holding different size wooden dowels and the knobs are used with the dowels to twist gold wire into braided jewelry chains. Should be able to find the video by searching for Roman dodecahedron gold jewelry chain
Thats what i was thinking when reading @Nyctophora comment but then wouldnt there be examples of woven gold items in museums? I cant find any such thing from museums@@MasterShake9000
@@MasterShake9000 Except that method of making jewellery dates to centuries after these and moreover the collapse of the empire in the west. That none of these show up in areas well known for this type of jewellery further counters the argument.
This is probably the only suggested use I've seen that seems to fit the design (as in another design would make more sense for most other suggestions). Whether perfume or medicine or whatever: round-based bottles, or would work for cones too, this would make a useful stand for mixing etc. The bobbles would help it stand securely on an uneven surface.
July 2024, jeweler/ knitter made a compelling RUclips video where she demonstrated the use of dodecahedron combined with wooden dowel to create cable jewelry. Great explanation, look it up!
@@tigertaylor1327 Wait, SIMON WHISTLER on his PODCAST SHOW (in England) said MANY of the Balls were found in Roman homes, around Roman military Camps & also in cemetaries.
Simon... you get those by Delving ! You slot a Fossil into them, which allows you to craft your Items... That's like... Path of Exile 1on1 knowledge ^^*
A few years ago I got a small metal thing online. It’s a cube, roughly an inch to a side with a 3/8 inch square hole in the center of each side and small nubs in various positions around each hole. When it was delivered, I couldn’t help but think of the Roman dodecahedrons. I wonder if in another thousand years archaeologists might be scratching their heads wondering what these things were for, having no idea that they fit on a ratchet and were used to compress the brake cylinders on various cars 😂
In a German/Czech SciFi-Show for children ("Návštěvníci" / "Die Besucher" / "Adam 84") there is a scene where they exactly play on that. In the show a team of scientists from the year 2484 travel back in time to 1984. When the historian of the team sees a child pulling a wooden duck with wheels along the street he says "We have one of those in our museum. We always thought that it was a religious icon."
If you really want to confuse future anthropologists, leave a note in your will that you want to be buried with the cube in your hand or in your mouth.
I bought one of those when I was in high-school. Being poor, I did all of my own car maintenance. From what I remember, it was a much cheaper alternative to the "standard" tools needed. I still have it in my toolbox. I have used it to change brake pads on 5 or 6 cars/trucks.
This and the idea they're in the military camps makes me think they had to do with adjusting devices to measure distance. Didn't they use to have some stuff that marked off the miles for the roads?
You'd be surprised how common it is for archaeologists to not have any clue what to make of an artifact or symbol. The usually go to it scour the entire rest of the planet for anything similar & read up on either the known use or theories for that & present that as a "to our current understanding" placeholder. These are just one of those rare instances where we don't even have that.
The dodecahedrons were used in military camps on top of the middle tent poles to fasten the tent canvas. The different hole sizes were made to accomodate different pole sizes. This made it easier to travel light and faster to chop down poles where they camped while still easy and fast to fasten the canvas.
If you look at cheap awnings nowadays you get these little plastic balls with holes and strings through them which are used to quickly and cheaply tension the covering to the supports.
Number found, along with cost and effort to produce would tend to deny this as a possible explanation. literally thousands of these would have been produced over the millennia that the Roman Empire and it's legions existed. Even if use of these was restricted to commanding officer's tents [lower ranks using a similar object in wood for example] far more would have been produced than have been found, and why are they always found only in singular, a Roman tent for a commanding officer would need more than one. As they were found in tombs, then sets of them would have been added to the burial, Not just the one. also, one example had no holes at all along with curved, rather than straight edges and in all, The balls on the corners were too small to be used as winding points for tent ropes. If it were a rope tensioner, we STILL run into the issue of numbers, and cost of production.
I really like the second last suggestion: a metal smith’s demonstration of quality. Metalsmithing was huge in Gaul, even before the Romans arrived, but not so much in the Eastern Mediterranean. It could have doubled as a measuring device for industrial standards. But I can absolutely see how an apprentice smith would need to perfect something to graduate.
Roman soldiers were also often doing construction work. The Egyptians had a measuring tool for right angle called a twelve knot cord. This have to be calibrate to work correctly. With this dodecahedron you can do this.
Simon, regarding a coin hoard in the UK: if Time Team has taught me anything it’s that it doesn’t even have to be hundreds of coins, thirteen or more coins in a single place is considered a hoard.
bored legionnaires putting treats inside and rolling it round to see who gets one like a weird version of pass the parcel, I've seen bored squadies do stranger things
It's a debating object. In a meeting the person holding the object gets to talk and everyone else has to be quiet and listen. Not just meetings but other situations too. Basically, if you're holding it everyone has to shut up and pay attention to whoever is in charge. "Listen to Dad he's just picked up the dodecahedron".
They're called resonators and are used to reroll mods, increasing or decreasing the chance for certain types of mods to appear. Can only be used on rare items though
Honestly the idea that they're a combo of fancy fidget spinners for rich people and a token/proof of craftsmanship for the creator is probably the best idea I've heard out forth so far
They could have some accompanying parts or bits that didn't survive because they were made from other materials like wood, paper, leather, etc. It could be part of some game where the unbalanced weight was part of the purpose, perhaps gambling. Rolling the object and betting on the less common outcomes would have a higher payoff. Wear on the knobs is consistent with them being tossed or rolled. Could also be used in some kind of lawn bowling where the shape and imbalance added to the challenge. The rarity could be attributed to most of them being made from different materials that don't survive, but only the deluxe versions made from bronze.
They did like their board games back then. Several were played throughout the empire, this might have been a niche Gaelic game. I used to lean towards a measuring or sighting tool, but I can't get info on all the hole sizes to make any educated guess. Those stone balls they find up north, with the swirls and circles carved in them, that looks like a ball game to me.
Or a cipher to write a coded message. The knobs are to hold in place the normal alphabet and then a dial on a axle to plug in a hole. 12 different dials so you can use a different one each time making deciphering very difficult.
I'm glad he said fidget spinner because I've always kinda assumed it was something similar. As a student of archaeology, I was always fascinated by all these unexplained items. But it sometimes helps to look at what humans still do, and humans have always loved a little trinket to play around with, so it's not a stretch to think that these were just items held in the pockets to run your fingers against if you were anxious or whatever.
"Fidget spinners are the product of a godless world" is not a take I ever expected to have unironically, but here we are! Fidget spinners are the product of a godless world. We used to be a lot more religious. A lot more superstitious. Sure, if you want to calm down *today* then a geometric shape covered in knobs or a lil spinny disk thing make sense... but if you were running your fingers over something to calm you down 2000 years ago, it probably would have been an *icon* or a *totem* with some religious/superstitious significance. Who in the Roman empire is going to be rubbing a dodecahedron to steel their nerves rather than a little statuette of Mars or Jupiter or something, y'know?
Just imagine what Titus Marullus would say if he saw you in the military camp seeking comfort from a meaningless geometric shape instead of Mars. Shameful. Far from soothing your anxiety, you'd live in perpetual fear of being caught.
@@rushi5638fidget toys are pretty popular among religious people too though? I don't really believe they're fidget toys but I don't think I agree with your reasoning
So many of the theories in the comments completely ignore the fact that he metal does not show wear on almost any of the surfaces at all, except sometimes the nubs on one face, the presumed habitual or significant 'bottom'. Not to mention that they're of a variety of sizes, with varying sizes of holes in them, and some without any holes at all. We can safely infer that they spent the majority of their time sitting upright, and weren't excessively handled. Something used regularly like a tool would show wear patterns. Not to mention that they would have been expensive due to the cost of material and craftsmanship, and several were found stashed with coins. So it was a valuable, rarely-handled object of prevalence, but which was omitted from records either intentionally or due to ubiquity.
@@isaacwainwright5895 That wouldn't explain the expensive tooling, frequency, or inclusion with valuables. Best guesses are religious item, badge of rank and/or demonstration of skill, or some kind of visual measuring device. A more recent theory is that they were an encryption device, in which string was wound around and through the device to spell out messages.
@@JustGaming117we got people tossing giant slabs of crap in the middle of the desert. I can see someone in ancient Rome being "... Imma mess with people in the future." I mean they were full of lead
Knitting is cool, but spinning is really magic. You take a pile of fluffy stuff of some kind, put a twist in it, and now you have yarn, or twine, or thread, or whatever. Sure, you can use wool and cotton and all that. Got a pet that sheds a lot of undercoat (German shepherd anyone) and you can make it a winter coat out of its own fluff. Making felted toys is even better, you take a big pile of cheap wool and stab it a lot with a big needle until it's a squirrel or whatever.
'you take a big pile of cheap wool and stab it a lot with a big needle until it's a squirrel or whatever.' Best out of context description of felting ever.
As a metal worker, i imagine it as a standard demonstration that smiths would use to demonstrate proficiency in their craft. A complex shape that incorporates all the expected skills a bronze smith or a metal shop should be expected to have. Over time, they became collectible and decorative to show off finer skills.
Considering that they seem to be found in places associated with the military, I'm thinking that it's somehow associated with gambling. Roman soldiers were notorious gamblers.
The Roman’s gambled profusely so I wouldn’t doubt it. If it’s not for gambling I’d say it was something for astrology, seeing as they were also a highly religious society who had a habit of adding gods to the pantheon and merging deities to romanize them.
If that were the case, there would be more of them, and made of cheaper materials. And like Simon pointed out, they'd be badly weighted and unsuitable for dice.
The fact that all the holes are different sizes suggests they were used to measure diameters of round things - balls, disc's or cylinders. My thought: drill bits. For example, a wagon maker might make wheel spokes that should be all the same size, but until the idea of industry standards catches on, the wheels don't have to be the same size between wheel makers. So the wheel maker only needs to be standard among his own products, not with other shops.
or maybe for standardizing i.e. arrow gauges. you can make relatively standard dowels by drilling through a metal plate and bashing a stick through that hole. maybe this was for checking arrows etc, not for making them given there was no wear on the faces, and brass seems frail to use as a mass production cutting edge.
It seems a bit too fancy to just be a gauge, we shoud find simpler versions of this then, like a plate plate or a box with the same holes in a row. Also, why woud there be some made of gold or given as gifts.
So far as I'm aware (maybe wrong) only the single icosahedron was a precious metal, and only one of those was ever found. It's an outlier (so far as we can tell at this point), so it may not be a good guide to apply to others. Also, re their complex design. The knobs ensure that the topmost face will be parallel to the workbench, and knows for feet instead of a flat "D12" shape ensures it won't roll easily once placed down on the bench. To me this looks like a light industry work jig of some sort that would be used briefly during a complicated set of assembly steps or something like that. After a thousand years of developing tech at the shop level, they were bound to have shops more complicated than what we modern people imagine based on our limited 18th and 19th century recollections.
I love the idea that we’re all coming together to figure this out and one possibility might be as simple as a bronze decorative pineapple with Live Laugh Love on it. It makes you wonder all of today’s things that are so obvious to us but might be uncovered in the future.
Wood bending/straightening tools (after steaming) weapons- bow, arrow/spear shafts or boatmaking/chariot repair The knobs could be for cordage to get the right curve tensioned until it dried.
I use these for holding down rolled thin paper I use for sketching so it lies flat. They look quite like this, with the rounded tips so they don't distress the paper, vellum or scrapings of hide by making little contact. When you pick them up, the paper rolls right back up into a tight roll like a large scroll, map or wrapping paper. You use the different sized holes to measure the thickness of the pad when rolled or hold it tight while you bind it. Edit: I own three, one for each side of the rolled paper that your arm doesn't restrain. Only one has holes in it. I was given these for this purpose. I suspect that they're a replica of these relics, and may not be their original purpose, but they do work well.
@@MamaKittieKat Literally! I think mine were modeled after these Roman relics, to be honest. They do look exactly the same, and were given to me for this purpose (a fancy paperweight that doesn't damage rolled art paper that can hold it while you bind it). I have three, one for each side of the paper except for the right bottom corner, where your writing/drawing hand would be. Only one has holes in it. I have no idea if this was their original purpose.
Maybe later they added holes for marking distances on the maps. The one without holes could measure and hold the paper down but not so easy to mark a spot under it, so you put a hole through it.
Every soldier and household had one. 3 sticks to make a pyramid foundation, once elevated underneath the hedron, you made fire, then like a coatrack other stick go in the left over holes. This way you have a cookingstation/drying-rack for clothes, the drying of meats, fix something onto it when alone and in need of a 3rd hand The holes have diverse sizes, for branches/wooden poles. The studs are a remnant of fabrication which in turn were left to make for easy binding. Function followed form It's a camping/survival tool. I bet there were more found outside than inside communities. For those who think in images, imagine this thing at the top of crossing sticks(like a tipi), locking them in place at the junction. Or maybe think in ways of the building scaffolding. It ensured.
@@gamerjaqi7873 correct, some would have been found charred or dirty but every last one has been unused. So whatever they were for it wasnt for a heavy use object
@@gamerjaqi7873 i like your thinking, but how do you know they weren't charred? Maybe they were, that why you made them out of metal. And not sure how you meant the heavy part? But joints usually are sturdier/heavier a material than the stuff they hold up. You have got me thinking, but not yet off my thing. 👍✌️ *more. Bring more! Truth matters more than me being right..
Ancient Rome used a lot of ropes. Ropes for canopies, ropes for tents, ropes for ship sales, ropes for stage levers, ropes of all different parameters. That means having to adapt and re-adapt ropes of different diameters for the purpose that's needed, from smaller rope. They are not always dodecahedrons, and they do not always have holes, but they always have a spoke or circular pattern on the sides, (5:50) which hints at how they worked through rotation. The holes are largely for reference, and the "dodecahedron" that has no holes also has less spokes - because it was used to manufacture smaller rope.
Because it was used by merchants and entertainers, who had ample use for rope of different sizes to overcome the limitations of the quality of the rope they had back then. It's something that would fall out of use as rope became longer lasting, of better quality, and methods and treatments became more specialized for their uses.
@@luismovil5341 I find this to be one of the better explanations. It's one of those things Romans probably thought were so obvious to know that they did not bother writing it down.
It's also weird that they didn't find any of these in the Italian Peninsula (even Spain, which I always thought is one of their important colonies) yet they can be found in Austria, Belgium, France, Germany, Hungary, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United Kingdom.
I like your content so much more lately. Gone is the overly affected voice. You seem to be talking in your natural cadence and tonal emphasis. It's great!
1:35 - Chapter 1 - Max hedron 7:25 - Chapter 2 - Great hedron collider 8:00 - Chapter 3 - Go get a weave on 12:05 - Chapter 4 - Dodeca have fun 13:00 - Chapter 5 - Foe better heed ron 13:40 - Chapter 6 - Dodecoration 15:50 - Chapter 7 - Mo better seed run 18:40 - Chapter 8 - Zodeca creed on 22:40 - Chapter 9 - Don't make a weird one 23:25 - Chapter 10 - Dodec ancillaries PS: Those puns are so bad i want to drink a whole bottle of Rhome !
The speculation in here reminds me of Motel of the Mysteries - where a future archeologist finds a well preserved roadside motel, and goes about speculating how different objects were used.
I remember that book in my Elementary School library! I think about it whenever archaeological mysteries like this emerge! Something probably completely prosaic but unknowable. I couldn't remember the name of the book, it's nice to be able to find out again!
@@danielsims6483You know, until you mentioned his name here, I never made the connection that that David Macaulay is the same one that wrote The Way Things Work (the book with the mammoths).
Looks a bit like a fancy tea stove, even has a spacing so that the candle doesn't burn the table. But I guess it's possible that it had attachments made of animal parts or wood or something else organic, that has since rotten away. Just that we only found metal and stone ones, also doesn't mean that poor people didn't have wooden or bone versions. So many possibilities, I love it.
Without knowing anything about these, my first thought is used to help make segmented tents. Pole goes in the bottom, smaller poles go out from it and the bulbs are where they pressed the fabric down to keep it secure.
But this theory is my personal favorite. Makes the most sense to me. Maybe tent fabric had loops or tie strings at the tips, in order to loop around one of the outside baubles, to get the fabric to hang onto as another point of attachment.
That sounds like a good theory. I thought maybe a tool for making cordage and rope. Maybe passing the size core you want through the hole and the nubs could hold the twisting cordage separated until ready to slide it back and start wrapping the center core.
I saw a couple theories below that I liked. The gambling device with the wooden ball inside and as a tool for measuring widths of bits, spokes or maybe if may add, arrow shafts. As far as the one shown without any holes, perhaps the rings could have been used for the same purpose just by sizing it against the size of the engraved circle.
Lots of great ideas. They were used like a Rolex or a medal/reward. These were extremely complicated to make and were cherished by those that owned them. Usually they were placed in the open in a home, or dwelling, but were also awarded too officers. Due to the value of the items they were used when discussing movements or other military marks to basically show off. This is why some appear more worn than others. They were also tossed about on the floor like legos to catch people not wearing their little sandal thingies. Roman we known for their great sense of humor when they weren’t walking around conjuring stuff. Honestly….i have no clue what they are🤷♂️
I'm pretty sure they're gauges of some kind. The shaved coin detector is plausible, but the perfectly circular holes aren't necessary when simple slots would suffice. I think that they're more likely for certain craftsmen, likely woodworkers, to check for circularity and size uniformity down the length of dowels. There's no point in the largest hole being circular since it's only there to let something pass through from its opposite hole. Placement of the other sizes doesn't really matter as long as there's always a larger hole opposite. The knobs would be handy for grip to pull it back off when a dowel got stuck. Sure. You could do this with a set of rings but it'd be much easier to lose one of those than these clunky things. What's really puzzling is the 20-sided one. I can't tell if the holes are all the same size or not. But that one may be something based on a similar premise for some kind of fine craftsman. It's important to note that the sides on that one are curved and also that the triangles on the opposite side would not be in the same orientation. So, you wouldn't be able to pass something through one of the corner holes and out the opposite face, but the curve could be enough to allow something from that corner hole through the center hole on the next face adjacent to the opposite one. Damn. Now I want to get my hands on these to test my theories. I wonder if you can get accurate replicas somewhere.
We have the exact same things now, only made out of plastic. We use them to measure out serving sizes for spaghetti noodles and such. The ones with smaller holes would be very useful for trading varying gauges of wire for chain mail production and other industries that used different thicknesses of wire.
Yes, spaghetti measure - with different sizes depending on how hungry, how many, etc. (Please, just totally ignore that the first mention of it was in the Talmud in the 5th century AD.)
It's a candle holder. Candles were probably made in non standard sizes, especially if you traveled a lot, so if you had one of these, you could always prop up a candle to see in the dark.
What if they dig up an ancient ssd in 599 years from now. The 5 tb ssd has nothing but all Simon Whistler videos from his 9k different channels. Would they be in awe of the incredible knowledge this ancient man had and assume him to be some great genius and diety? Would they pity us after seeing how stupid we are and having Simon as our intellectual leader?
The connection to finding them with coin bags and military. Definitely you tend to store an item with what it’s used for. Game: Ancient Bocce (They did play it in Slovenia as well) This dodecahedron was the Pallino. Toss the pallino a distance away. Take turns throwing a coin or rock with player’s mark at the pallino. Closest to the pallino wins the money - this why it’s found in money pouches. The nibs are there to create some randomness as to how the pallino lands. There are dog balls we create today so that when the ball hits the ground it goes in a different direction to what the dog expects. In fact using this theory and reversing the above game rules would really create a more random game of chance. - players toss their coins first and the player throws the dodecahedron/pallino and if the pallino lands closest to your coin. You’re the winner.
Spin it like a dreidel with coins inside, although the solid sided ones would prevent that. Or it's more like a rosary, the nodes are reminders of prayers, the holes and rings for each god on the pantheon, perhaps personalized to the owner preference as to which gods to play to. Like a Buddhist Prayer Wheel.
My best guess is that its a lunar calendar. Twelve circles of different sizes. Twelve full moons in a year with the moon having different apparent sizes. If you put it over a candle the circle at the top would project a specific sized 'moon' on the ceiling that corresponds to a specific lunar month. Something else I found interesting is that there is one shown in this video with triangular faces. That's an icosahedron, it has twelve vertices and 20 faces. It is the dual of the dodecahedron (12 faces and 20 vertices). Notice that the 12 knobs on the vertices of the icosahedron are different sizes. The circles carved on the faces of the icosahedron are all the same size. That's the exact dual of the knobs and circles on the dodecahedron. That isn't a coincidence. It means that 12 is the significant number and 12 circular objects of different sizes.
I vaguely remember an episode of Dr. Who more than 20 years ago which featured a dodecahedron that was central to a planet's energy supply. The script used the word "dodecahedron" almost as many time as the script of this video.
Knitting needles not being invented yet actually supports the idea that these were used for knitting with the easier method not being around. I don't quite get why they think their would be noticeable wear on a metal object from thread. My moms needles doesn't show wear either and she have used them lots. Another potential use would be for making wooden rods (arrows) by drawing a stick through larger to smaller holes.
On the "Imagine finding a coin hoard" bit: I work in a place that buys and sells coins and it gets a lot of customers interested in selling or buy Roman coins. We buy them but we don't really sell a whole lot of them in the stores cause it's not really our main market (mostly we deal in domestic US coinage). But we DO buy them for their numismatic (collectable coin) value just in case we get a request for one. Folks are always shocked to learn how cheap your average denarii (or most old empire coins) actually is because they don't realize that coin value (like most collectibles) is based on rarity far more than it is on age. Uncirculated denarii are pretty frequently found in large deposits whenever doing construction in Europe because this stuff got lost a lot, usually while transporting them to a province somewhere outside the empire. They made so many of them that we couldn't possibly do more than guess how many are out there, hundreds of millions at the very least. So you can easily buy one for under $20 and they aren't usually worth a lot when you sell them.
My personal opinion is they are standard references for building items. In construction you need a gauge or template to make sure the part is the proper size or shape. Being found mostly in the UK it makes sense that anything made there needs to be compatible for maintenance and repair from inside the Empire. i.e. an arrow shaft matches up for putting on an arrow head.
Ah, but if they had been routinely used for gauging crafts, one would expect to see more uneven wear, added markings perhaps, or added modifications from when standards or needs changed.
You wouldn’t need finely crafted ornate metal work for that. Metal would have been incredibly expensive at that time, you’d be much more likely to use a variety of stick length. Plus the inconsistent sizing makes reference weird Personally I really like the idea it’s craftsmen proving their skill, I keep the pieces I built at my uni on display. I hope someday an archaeologist will be questioning my soft robot part, presumably while giggling.
Plausable, BUT they are all different sizes. Not impossible because gages come in different sizes, BUT, the HOLES, if it were a standard measuring device, would have to be the same sizes on all of them, they are NOT, AND there is one example pictured that has NO holes. So, Not diameters. Angles then? Why make an object this complex when it only demonstrates ONE angle? also the example with no holes, ALSO has curved edges, making using it as a Gage tool unlikely. ALSO, the knobs make it problematic for aligning the object with any surface or corner. As a measuring tool of any kind, I think this explanation is a wash.
The different size of the holes makes me think of a calibre meter. While on a longer march, the soldiers would put up a _castrum_ aka a fortification each evening; and for this they had to plant palisades, made from poles that they carried on mules, or wattle walls if wood wasn't available. They had standardized the process of building their camp in such an efficient way, that the construction took one to three hours. The dodekahedron might have served as a tool that helped in the construction, as a kind of swiss knife measuring tool. You could use it as a plumb bob, check whether the stem of a hazel was thick enough to serve as a pole for the wattling, pull a rope along the wall to see if it is straight, or peer through the holes for the same reason, even shove the dodekahedron over the end of a rod that needed some bending or straightening, fasten a rope on the knots, and use the contraption to pull the rod into a specific direction, which is much easier than pushing it with your bare hands, because of a better leverage. Of course this is all alledgedly.
I'm not a roman, but if I was, I would have used one of these to quickly make candles of a specific diameter, to check the gauge of a rope or string, or other tasks of a similar nature. The reason why they were found on battlefields was likely because it's useful to be able to fit your candles in holders or to not have ropes randomly not fit through fasteners because they have a lump or knot in them which you didn't know about.
Well, you dip candles repeatedly and let them dry and soften. I like the measuring tool and rope idea. It looks to me like part of a shaft straightening kit.
"Fidget Spinner" was the first thought i had as well. Something to bring up, the script was talking about the 12-sided version exclusively, but the image you kept showing on screen of the Three Bronze (?) ones in a display case... the one on the bottom right was a 20-sided version. It also had much smaller holes, at least on the visible side. The thought about them being akin to a craftsman's graduation project could also be true. Wander around the programming office of any modern machine shop, and you'll find similar devices like cubes within cubes within cubes all machined out of a single block of metal. Just a thought. Thanks for the video!
When machinists graduate from their classes, they all make a machinist's hammer, because it demonstrates their competency at all aspects of their work: turning, milling, drilling, threading, etc. I think something similar is happening here. These are 'proofs of competence' from student metalworkers. Straight lines, circular lines, bending and welding, bore holes of specific sizes, round parts, flat parts, corners and seams: all the essential metalworking techniques in one place. Many wouldn't have kept their grad projects, but some would have.
Newton's cradle was not invented to be a thing that seats on a desk and looks good but that's what most of them are made for now and I would pay to have a Roman dodecahedron to sit on my desk and makeing a Roman dodecahedron is a big expression of skill.
My guess: I think they are for identifying sticks that have a suitable straightness and diameter to be used for spears and arrows. If a stick can pass all the way through then it is straight enough, and the arrow/spears could be organised based on the hole diameter. Would explain their location too, as arrowheads and spearheads can be reused but sticks would constantly need replacing. It's unlikely that all spearheads were made equal so it would help to have a tool for checking and sorting different diameters.
@@thehudsonforge71even though wood is softer than metal, tiny amounts are still rubbed off. I like this hypothesis about it being a stick measurement device, but the lack of wear inside the holes doesn't fit with the hypothetical use case.
Those holes are for measuring width. That way you can standardize width and mass produce things such as tools and arrow and spear heads based on that width without having to make it custom to every shaft. Each hole is a different width for a different purpose. If a shaftmaker for example finishes a spearshaft he pushes it through the hole used for that and can see if the width is right. The thing would be on the ground and the "feet" are so it doesn't topple/rolls or moves when he pushes a shaft in it. At the same time a dedicated spearhead factory can use a mold based on those dimensions and for the legionairies it would be very easy and quick to assemble a spear in camp with both components. The decorated one with small holes is perhaps for use on a table and for pins, needles, and spikes
@@BrandonDenny-we1rw I was also thinking for Roman jugs and amphora. Which have a tapered point bottom. So it could just have them standing on the ground/table.
They do. Look up the article "History Mystery: Ancient Dodecahedron's Purpose Remains Secret", they have a broken one from which you can see inside.@@BrandonDenny-we1rw
They were used for gambling. Put the coins in from all players and roll the thing. The coins that fit through the hole that lands downward(and raised up by the nubs to allow them fall out) will fall out and that player keeps those coins then on to the next player to roll and so on. It then changed to no holes, and bids just put on the table because they would fall out of other holes prior to the thing stopping and this fixed that unfairness issue
I personally like the idea of a fancy candle holder. As candles would be all hand made they'd invariably all have slightly different diameters. So having a candle holder with different sized holes that you could quickly rotate to find the right sized hole for any particular sized candle would be very practical. And the complicated nature of it's construction would also serve as a bit of a flex for the upper class.
Have to disagree, sorry. Candles, made from tallow, were an extremely expensive item in ancient Rome, and were pretty much the domain of the very wealthy. As these devices were found mainly in army camps, it's highly unlikely they had anything to do with candles. On the whole, the Romans used terracotta oil lamps because olive oil was plentiful and cheap.
To me it's so clear what this is. It's a gambling device/game. The way the game worked was the inside was filled with coins by the players. The coins were of differing sizes like coins today. The varying holes in the sides corresponded to the size of various Roman coinage. The players take turns throwing it, if you are lucky, on your turn, some sort of coin will fall out. The little knobs are feet that hold the surface of the dodecahedron off of the floor to allow coins to fall out. That's why some were found with worn knobs where they came into contact with the ground when thrown. As Simon said, if you put coins in, it will be annoying to shake them out- That's the point of the game! This explanation explains why the were found with large hordes of coins and also why they were found in military camps, because soldiers gambled with one another. As far as the 12 sides, this makes sense since there were other Roman games with the number 12 theme. One popular dice game (That I found on Wikipedia) was known as Twelve Lines, Twelve Signs, Twelve Points, Twelve Writings and was similar to backgammon. So, what do I win??
On top of that, given by the different sizes holes, a certan size of object would have a certan chancese to fell through. And gambling is all about controlling chances and odds and the rewards. What I assume how it plays out, is that a dealer would prepare a dodecahedron and various size balls/stones for the player to choose, the larger the stone, the higher the reward and vice versa. Say if a player chooses a stone that can only pass through the largest hole, meaning the winning odd is almost about 1/12, then the dealer can profit by simply set the prize money for choosing the largest ball be 12 times the entry fee, given that the stone won't always fall through even with larger holes. and for example if the player chooses a stone that can pass through 6 of 12 holes, the dealer can ensure profit by setting prize money be 2 times the entry fee. And other people can also bet in the same game with set odd.
@@kingeric1992 very interesting idea. I’m inclined toward the idea of using coins but what you said is definitely possible. It would be interesting to know if any such balls or marbles were ever found nearby a dodecahedron. I prefer the idea of coins because these dodecahedrons have been found near large amounts of coins. I had another thought that maybe there is a dealer (as you mentioned) and he’s acts as the house. He fills the dodecahedron with his some of own coins to start the game and the players add coins to play. The more coins that are added, the greater chances, it seems, that a player has to win but because of the odds, of course, the dealer keeps filling the dodecahedron with the players coins and rarely gives back any. It’s like those games in the arcade where you think your coin will make the huge pile of coins fall over the edge but of course, you always lose and the house always wins.
So far my favorite guess (being that it is often found with treasure) is that it was used as a money certificate. The six different size holes represent the Roman numerals I - V -X - L - C - M. String wrapped around the hole indicates how many of each. Wax is applied to be imprinted with a seal. Two of each size would indicate silver and gold. It is an interesting guess.
I'm pretty sure the holes were used to gauge distance. If you look at a 3d scan, i really recommend you do, you will see that the opposite side is either smaller or larger. You can take a known unit of measure like a yard stick or a meter stick and walk it out to determine distance very quickly. Distance of two known points can give you all kinds of geometry in relation to the known points.
Maybe they are scroll or map holders. Speaking of unexplainable objects. Imagine 1000 years from now unearthing a kitchen cabinet with 30 Stanley tumblers. "Why on earth would anyone have so many?"
My theory is that they were fancy paperweights for wealthy Romans. Since only 100 have been found, I don't think this was a common item, I think they were all made by the same person, it was their signature product. At some point, they experimented with adding various sized holes to add further functionality, perhaps as a coin gauge as some have suggested. But the main purpose was as an ornamental weight to hold down scrolls or maps or other forms of paper.
I think you may be correct. The different size holes could also be used to hold various sized tools on a person's desk, adding more function to the paperweight.
It's for making rope chains as in jewelery. It's a lacing and drawing tool to reduce the diameter of the finished chain. You put a wood rod into it to lace the wire around. Once you complete the sinnet you remove the rod and use the holes largest to smallest to draw it to a narrow chain made from gold wire
I am pretty certain it is some sort of gambling device. Romans loved games of dice and contests. Many such things wouldn't have been recorded in their historical record, because people gambling and having fun aren't important events, really. I could imagine there being some sort of pellet inside and multiple people would make bets on which hole it fell out of when sent flying. The larger the hole the more likely, but the smaller the hole, and the fewer bets, the more to win. Even if that's not how it was used, that it was found in many different places and in soldier's camps in particular would support this being some kind of gaming or gambling device. Soldiers tend to play games when there's little else to do. While not entirely the same thing, when I was in the Norwegian artillery I played a lot of poker and pool with the others. I've never really been a big poker or pool player, but in the army, with lots of spare time, we played games. Also, such games aren't only played by soldiers. I am pretty certain this is some sort of gaming or gambling device.
Treasure and salvage/recovery rules are quite different in the US/CA, and it ranges from everything is seized, everything is yours, everything is seized at your expense, you are fined for disturbing artifacts, or no one cares. Varies by state and province. There are also a few cases where you really need to treat the find as top secret until you've fully excavated and documented it. Otherwise there's a tendency for various 3 letter agencies agencies to run overnight operations and come back with "well turns out there's no treasure, tough luck. Ignore the multiple excavators, drag marks, refilled pit and the convoy of armoured vehicles that left here throughout the night."
I know exactly what those are. Glove looms. I saw a TV show a few years ago with a guy who 3D printed one and played around with yarn on it It's actually super useful. The different sizes holes are for different sizes of fingers and you can customize the glove made for children, women, men, or even people missing fingers. Believe it or not!
@@ezekielbrockmann114you got me there, I can't explain the ones without holes. But I've seen pictures of dozens with, and only a few without. I bet it was used as some kind of tool though and not some useless artifact. They wouldn't put the effort in to making something this complicated without a purpose. There were probably jigs of some sort made of wood so they could get the pieces aligned which all would have decayed by now. The romans had most of the tech to make many modern objects but didn't put things together for them. They knew about silver salts and camera obscuras and could have invented photography. They could make pipes and sheet metal and basics of hot cooking fats, they could have invented deep fryers. They knew a lot about hydrodynamics, ceramics and did invent the simplest form of toilet, a seat with a hole over a stream. If they put more thought into it, they could have made modern toilets. Their biggest problems included using lead to make pipes, wine goblets and water jugs. "Hey Caesar, that's not sweetness, that's your brain going nuts!" Lead is bad. The Roman word for lead is the root word for plumbing.
One person made viking knit chain using one & hypothesized they were used to make ropes & jewelry using the same weaving method with different materials. That would explain finding with coins & on military bases. As for one's without holes, could be a blank for casting? No clue but I was amazed at how quickly and uniformly she made the viking knit chain. Those things are hard to make!
She made a really good argument, including presenting a photograph of a Roman jewelry display from the same Era. A gold viking knit chain. The the nubs were used to anchor the weave & the holes were used to reduce the chain/rope. Every pass through would tighten the weave & reduce the diameter. She hypothesized that the holes were waxed to lubricate the process and protect the material from friction.
When I see these I’m reminded of a spoon I use for measuring spaghetti. These objects have the same size facing holes right? The little hole is a child’s portion, let’s say. Push the pasta through it and cook the entire thing. Add more dodecahedron with appropriate portion sizes for the other guests. To allow more space in the cooking pot for more food, as the spaghetti softens you twirl the dodecahedron with the topmost nodules, so for large feasts there can be several of these in one pot. When cooked the nodules are used to pick up the spaghetti and spin it in the sauce, as some kind of fun alternative to a fork. Or just a measure for a portion, not for the cooking part. Perhaps this was an innovation that never really caught on and only a few hundred were made.
I always enjoy videos like this one finding objects that we can only wager what they once had a use for. I like to agree with the 'ancient bocce' because it seems to make the most sense, seeing that some of the dodecahedra were found with money pouches.
1. note that there are several kinds. 2. note that one of these kinds has carefully-sized holes, such that holes on opposite-sides form 2 rings of a cone. 3. look through those, such that you're seeing those edges as concentric, and you should get a specific, controlled, angle. 4. the ones without the specially-sized circular holes were not used for measuring angles ( if you know the angle, & you know how many yards it was from you to the something you're looking at, then you can calculate its size ), those fake ones are just trinkets, same as we have fake devices, now, for people to pretend they've got some fancy thing, or other, like children's toys. 5. look to see if those circles-of-visual-cones form a pattern of fractions, in their angles, or a specifically-useful set of visual-angles, whose calculations are easier with Roman numerals.
"Hey Claudius do you think we should write down what these things are used for?"
"Have you been drinking from the lead cups again Maximus?" Its obvious what they are used for there is no need."
no need to show you Mr Simpson you invented it!
This is exactly why there's no record of what they do.
"Everyone knows what they are used for, why ever would we write it down?"
Fidgetus Spinnerus
to mesurew if
coins were shaved
When I was learning to tig weld, one of the learning challenges was to cut thin sheet metal pieces and weld them into geometric shapes. To me this looks like a proud craftsman making a bauble to show off his skill.
All the basic operations are visible. Fabricating sides, brazing them together, engraving, making holes, (probably as a demonstration of being able to make your own drills, files, ect.,) and brazing decorations to the piece. When you are done, it’s useless but you can show all your buddies how clever you are. Also this explains why they are similar but not all the same. (Perhaps in a military armorer’s guild or similar.)
These are cast not welded, there are no signs of any kind of welding but many of casting
@@grindcorgz I do understand that. Welding was my experience. I was saying my experience was similar. Not the technique.
This makes the most sense considering there’s no documentation of what they are. Because they’re just a doohickey to show off skill.
As one comment suggests, it seems to just be a way for craftsman to show off their skill, the fancier it is the more skilled the craftsman. Which would answer why there’s no written use for them. Cause there is no use, it’s just a random doohickey.😂
The very best thing about this story is learning that your dad knits. As a knitter, I applaud this. You should buy him some nice yarn.
They both spin yarns
@@andyh5978 😆💚
Yes, I'd heard they had something to do with yarn.
I missed that bit. I'm pleased his father is still alive. The grim reaper is an obnoxious beast.
One Monty Python skit suggests a possible function. The dodecahedra were used to verify the identity of emissaries from Rome. Bigus Dickus would fit the largest hole, Minimus Penus would fit the smallest one, etc.
That actually sounds believable for Romans lol
I’m sold on the idea of this being used for spring planting just because it seems so much like those “as-seen-on-TV” gadgets that do some simple task that would be done more easily with an ordinary kitchen knife.
A coin-gauge.
The most common way of messing with coinage was shaving the outside edge. You'd keep the small amount of valuable metal, then pass off the coin at its nominal value. That's why many coins eventually developed milled edges, so you could immediately tell if they'd been altered.
So if, in any given region (or even across the empire), coins were minted in standard sizes, you could try a coin of a given denomination against the appropriately-sized hole. If it was too small, you rejected it as altered.
The biggest, often oval-sized hole, was to more easily shake the coin out through if you accidentally dropped it inside.
The indicators for which coin was to be gauged in which hole, were simply painted-on and have been lost.
There's my theory.
That's a surprisingly realistic theory, but it seems more likely they would just make a flat, plane with approximately sized holes instead of a dodecahedron so it was lightweight and easier to transport.
Oooo I like that idea!
Good idea
@@KyleOchoa-k6e it doesn't need to travel compactly. It's probably for use by serious money-lenders, merchants, paymasters, etc. Otherwise you'd find a lot more of them.
And if it's going to sit on your desk, a 3-d shape works better, since it has empty space inside. You'd have to pick the thing up to use it, if it were flat. This way, you just spin it around until the relevant facet faces you. The big shaking-out hole is always down against the surface of the desk or whatever.
Edit: Also, thank you for the compliment.
If the holes match the common coin diameters of the day you might be right. The examples shown range from plain to rather elaborate and even the plainer ones would have been pretty intricate and difficult to make. That fancy, engraved one screams "banker" though.
Last time I checked there was an Ilithid inside it, and a Githyanki prince.
spoiler alert come on man
Squid games but different
Huh?
It's really clingy
Probably a DnD reference@@tavonfenwick-yb5xv
I bought a replica and, as an experienced round loom knitter, I tried it - the round bobbles are too shallow to hold thick enough wool to make effective fingers as far as I'm concerned. You _can_ make a glove, but it's a pretty lacey endeavour, even if you can get the yarn to stay on while you're forming stitches.
I have no proof for this, but my theory is that they are stands for the little round-bottomed glass perfume and makeup bottles from the same era. They came in different sizes, like the holes in the doohickey, and a quick test with a similarly sized object shows that it would enable such a bottle to stand upright. So, a bottle stand for a round-bottomed bottle.
There’s another RUclipsr who’s probably solved it. The holes are for holding different size wooden dowels and the knobs are used with the dowels to twist gold wire into braided jewelry chains.
Should be able to find the video by searching for Roman dodecahedron gold jewelry chain
Holy crap that makes complete sense. 🤦♀️
Thats what i was thinking when reading @Nyctophora comment but then wouldnt there be examples of woven gold items in museums? I cant find any such thing from museums@@MasterShake9000
@@MasterShake9000 Except that method of making jewellery dates to centuries after these and moreover the collapse of the empire in the west. That none of these show up in areas well known for this type of jewellery further counters the argument.
This is probably the only suggested use I've seen that seems to fit the design (as in another design would make more sense for most other suggestions). Whether perfume or medicine or whatever: round-based bottles, or would work for cones too, this would make a useful stand for mixing etc. The bobbles would help it stand securely on an uneven surface.
July 2024, jeweler/ knitter made a compelling RUclips video where she demonstrated the use of dodecahedron combined with wooden dowel to create cable jewelry. Great explanation, look it up!
Seen it and many more videos showing the same knitting. But there should be thousands of them and none have been found in Rome
@@tigertaylor1327 Wait, SIMON WHISTLER on his PODCAST SHOW (in England) said MANY of the Balls were found in Roman homes, around Roman military Camps & also in cemetaries.
Simon... you get those by Delving !
You slot a Fossil into them, which allows you to craft your Items...
That's like... Path of Exile 1on1 knowledge ^^*
A few years ago I got a small metal thing online. It’s a cube, roughly an inch to a side with a 3/8 inch square hole in the center of each side and small nubs in various positions around each hole. When it was delivered, I couldn’t help but think of the Roman dodecahedrons. I wonder if in another thousand years archaeologists might be scratching their heads wondering what these things were for, having no idea that they fit on a ratchet and were used to compress the brake cylinders on various cars 😂
Yup i got a few of those and yeah 1000yrs from now that kind of object would be VERY hard for someone who didnt know car brake calipers to figure out
In a German/Czech SciFi-Show for children ("Návštěvníci" / "Die Besucher" / "Adam 84") there is a scene where they exactly play on that. In the show a team of scientists from the year 2484 travel back in time to 1984. When the historian of the team sees a child pulling a wooden duck with wheels along the street he says "We have one of those in our museum. We always thought that it was a religious icon."
If you really want to confuse future anthropologists, leave a note in your will that you want to be buried with the cube in your hand or in your mouth.
I bought one of those when I was in high-school. Being poor, I did all of my own car maintenance.
From what I remember, it was a much cheaper alternative to the "standard" tools needed.
I still have it in my toolbox. I have used it to change brake pads on 5 or 6 cars/trucks.
This and the idea they're in the military camps makes me think they had to do with adjusting devices to measure distance. Didn't they use to have some stuff that marked off the miles for the roads?
That is a sacred artifact of the Githyanki! Aliens from the Astral Plane!
Don't tell the Githzerai 🤭
Got a whole ass prince in their and my lover
@@goreobsessed2308 The Emperor is your lover? Someone is into Hentai.
Wadiyatalkinabeet
Vlaakith will be interested in this.
You'd be surprised how common it is for archaeologists to not have any clue what to make of an artifact or symbol. The usually go to it scour the entire rest of the planet for anything similar & read up on either the known use or theories for that & present that as a "to our current understanding" placeholder. These are just one of those rare instances where we don't even have that.
The dodecahedrons were used in military camps on top of the middle tent poles to fasten the tent canvas. The different hole sizes were made to accomodate different pole sizes. This made it easier to travel light and faster to chop down poles where they camped while still easy and fast to fasten the canvas.
If you look at cheap awnings nowadays you get these little plastic balls with holes and strings through them which are used to quickly and cheaply tension the covering to the supports.
Why are they found in coin hoards then?
Some didn't have holes, and some were made of clay.
Maybe it was a rank thing. Like Medals. Shows who's a colonel, who's not.
Number found, along with cost and effort to produce would tend to deny this as a possible explanation.
literally thousands of these would have been produced over the millennia that the Roman Empire and it's legions existed.
Even if use of these was restricted to commanding officer's tents [lower ranks using a similar object in wood for example] far more would have been produced than have been found, and why are they always found only in singular, a Roman tent for a commanding officer would need more than one. As they were found in tombs, then sets of them would have been added to the burial, Not just the one.
also, one example had no holes at all along with curved, rather than straight edges and in all, The balls on the corners were too small to be used as winding points for tent ropes.
If it were a rope tensioner, we STILL run into the issue of numbers, and cost of production.
I really like the second last suggestion: a metal smith’s demonstration of quality. Metalsmithing was huge in Gaul, even before the Romans arrived, but not so much in the Eastern Mediterranean. It could have doubled as a measuring device for industrial standards. But I can absolutely see how an apprentice smith would need to perfect something to graduate.
Roman soldiers were also often doing construction work. The Egyptians had a measuring tool for right angle called a twelve knot cord. This have to be calibrate to work correctly. With this dodecahedron you can do this.
Romans didn't play D&D - they lived that. These mystery balls were clearly used to catch Pokemon. "Et tu, Butterfree?"
Psyduck!! Psyduck!
Snorlax 🥱 💤
❤️😉😆🤣😂
Maybe they did a version of DND of their ancestors’ time with a sprinkle of fantasy to make it more interesting.
"Veni, Vidi, Voltorb"
Ah yes, VENI VIDI PIKA!
I came, I saw, I got a Pokemon badge.
@@harleyspawnI came, I saw, I caught ‘em all.
Simon, regarding a coin hoard in the UK: if Time Team has taught me anything it’s that it doesn’t even have to be hundreds of coins, thirteen or more coins in a single place is considered a hoard.
They remind me of those dog toys where you put a treat in and they have to move it/work around until the treat falls out.
bored legionnaires putting treats inside and rolling it round to see who gets one like a weird version of pass the parcel, I've seen bored squadies do stranger things
As a 18th Century polish Dictionary stated: ''Horse: Everybody knows what a Horse is.''
Scientists in 4024: *sobbing* ''But I don't''
Somebody needs to write a script for Simon explaining warp weighted looms and ask the question about where and when the heddle was invented.
It's a debating object. In a meeting the person holding the object gets to talk and everyone else has to be quiet and listen. Not just meetings but other situations too. Basically, if you're holding it everyone has to shut up and pay attention to whoever is in charge. "Listen to Dad he's just picked up the dodecahedron".
"live laugh love", but in roman kitsch table decor
Vini vidi vici
😂👏🏼
They're called resonators and are used to reroll mods, increasing or decreasing the chance for certain types of mods to appear. Can only be used on rare items though
Saw the thumbnail and immediately knew what these were, had to check the comments to see if someone else had made this comment :p
Honestly the idea that they're a combo of fancy fidget spinners for rich people and a token/proof of craftsmanship for the creator is probably the best idea I've heard out forth so far
They could have some accompanying parts or bits that didn't survive because they were made from other materials like wood, paper, leather, etc. It could be part of some game where the unbalanced weight was part of the purpose, perhaps gambling. Rolling the object and betting on the less common outcomes would have a higher payoff. Wear on the knobs is consistent with them being tossed or rolled. Could also be used in some kind of lawn bowling where the shape and imbalance added to the challenge. The rarity could be attributed to most of them being made from different materials that don't survive, but only the deluxe versions made from bronze.
They did like their board games back then. Several were played throughout the empire, this might have been a niche Gaelic game. I used to lean towards a measuring or sighting tool, but I can't get info on all the hole sizes to make any educated guess. Those stone balls they find up north, with the swirls and circles carved in them, that looks like a ball game to me.
Or a cipher to write a coded message. The knobs are to hold in place the normal alphabet and then a dial on a axle to plug in a hole. 12 different dials so you can use a different one each time making deciphering very difficult.
They are Resonators from Path of Exile, quite simple really
had to scroll further than I thought I would have to, to find this comment.
@@Logzforlife I didn't comment it fast enough (some comments already had like 50 likes) and I'm not sure what the audience overlap is :D
I think to problem is that the Romans couldn't find any Fossils to slot in ^^
@@LuzariothRomans don't Delve...
This guy delves.
I'm glad he said fidget spinner because I've always kinda assumed it was something similar. As a student of archaeology, I was always fascinated by all these unexplained items. But it sometimes helps to look at what humans still do, and humans have always loved a little trinket to play around with, so it's not a stretch to think that these were just items held in the pockets to run your fingers against if you were anxious or whatever.
"Fidget spinners are the product of a godless world" is not a take I ever expected to have unironically, but here we are! Fidget spinners are the product of a godless world. We used to be a lot more religious. A lot more superstitious. Sure, if you want to calm down *today* then a geometric shape covered in knobs or a lil spinny disk thing make sense... but if you were running your fingers over something to calm you down 2000 years ago, it probably would have been an *icon* or a *totem* with some religious/superstitious significance. Who in the Roman empire is going to be rubbing a dodecahedron to steel their nerves rather than a little statuette of Mars or Jupiter or something, y'know?
Just imagine what Titus Marullus would say if he saw you in the military camp seeking comfort from a meaningless geometric shape instead of Mars. Shameful. Far from soothing your anxiety, you'd live in perpetual fear of being caught.
@@rushi5638fidget toys are pretty popular among religious people too though? I don't really believe they're fidget toys but I don't think I agree with your reasoning
The Roman dodecahedrons are used for crafting in path of exile. You stick fossils in them, to lower or elevate certain modifiers chances.
So many of the theories in the comments completely ignore the fact that he metal does not show wear on almost any of the surfaces at all, except sometimes the nubs on one face, the presumed habitual or significant 'bottom'. Not to mention that they're of a variety of sizes, with varying sizes of holes in them, and some without any holes at all. We can safely infer that they spent the majority of their time sitting upright, and weren't excessively handled. Something used regularly like a tool would show wear patterns. Not to mention that they would have been expensive due to the cost of material and craftsmanship, and several were found stashed with coins. So it was a valuable, rarely-handled object of prevalence, but which was omitted from records either intentionally or due to ubiquity.
Agree.
So paperweight
@@isaacwainwright5895 That wouldn't explain the expensive tooling, frequency, or inclusion with valuables.
Best guesses are religious item, badge of rank and/or demonstration of skill, or some kind of visual measuring device. A more recent theory is that they were an encryption device, in which string was wound around and through the device to spell out messages.
"I think I know how to screw up everyone in the future..."
- Ancient Roman
To the average Roman citizen, Rome was eternal.
But ... Yes ... Funny joke
They was good at screwing people up
Nobody ever considered that ancient people might do a little trolling
@@JustGaming117we got people tossing giant slabs of crap in the middle of the desert. I can see someone in ancient Rome being "... Imma mess with people in the future." I mean they were full of lead
These are clearly lynchpins. Terrance Howard is right! 1X1=2
Knitting is cool, but spinning is really magic. You take a pile of fluffy stuff of some kind, put a twist in it, and now you have yarn, or twine, or thread, or whatever. Sure, you can use wool and cotton and all that. Got a pet that sheds a lot of undercoat (German shepherd anyone) and you can make it a winter coat out of its own fluff.
Making felted toys is even better, you take a big pile of cheap wool and stab it a lot with a big needle until it's a squirrel or whatever.
'you take a big pile of cheap wool and stab it a lot with a big needle until it's a squirrel or whatever.' Best out of context description of felting ever.
If watching Dr Who has taught me anything, it's that any unknown artifact that's found everywhere is somehow related to Cybermen.
The damn cybermen really were the source of all random bs, weren't they. 😂
I think they have messages for the Doctor from River.
As a metal worker, i imagine it as a standard demonstration that smiths would use to demonstrate proficiency in their craft. A complex shape that incorporates all the expected skills a bronze smith or a metal shop should be expected to have. Over time, they became collectible and decorative to show off finer skills.
I love that tangent of someone in your family learning to knit during covid, Simon, lol.
Considering that they seem to be found in places associated with the military, I'm thinking that it's somehow associated with gambling. Roman soldiers were notorious gamblers.
I'm thinking some kind of "Jacks" Game
@@MistahBryanmost are rather too large for that.
That's exactly my guess, it could be used with other wood or bone dice, even with coins or something else.
The Roman’s gambled profusely so I wouldn’t doubt it. If it’s not for gambling I’d say it was something for astrology, seeing as they were also a highly religious society who had a habit of adding gods to the pantheon and merging deities to romanize them.
If that were the case, there would be more of them, and made of cheaper materials. And like Simon pointed out, they'd be badly weighted and unsuitable for dice.
The fact that all the holes are different sizes suggests they were used to measure diameters of round things - balls, disc's or cylinders. My thought: drill bits. For example, a wagon maker might make wheel spokes that should be all the same size, but until the idea of industry standards catches on, the wheels don't have to be the same size between wheel makers. So the wheel maker only needs to be standard among his own products, not with other shops.
Or maybe ropes instead of balls. Rope makers could've used them.
or maybe for standardizing i.e. arrow gauges. you can make relatively standard dowels by drilling through a metal plate and bashing a stick through that hole. maybe this was for checking arrows etc, not for making them given there was no wear on the faces, and brass seems frail to use as a mass production cutting edge.
It seems a bit too fancy to just be a gauge, we shoud find simpler versions of this then, like a plate plate or a box with the same holes in a row. Also, why woud there be some made of gold or given as gifts.
@@metsa6563 good points.
So far as I'm aware (maybe wrong) only the single icosahedron was a precious metal, and only one of those was ever found. It's an outlier (so far as we can tell at this point), so it may not be a good guide to apply to others. Also, re their complex design. The knobs ensure that the topmost face will be parallel to the workbench, and knows for feet instead of a flat "D12" shape ensures it won't roll easily once placed down on the bench. To me this looks like a light industry work jig of some sort that would be used briefly during a complicated set of assembly steps or something like that.
After a thousand years of developing tech at the shop level, they were bound to have shops more complicated than what we modern people imagine based on our limited 18th and 19th century recollections.
I love the idea that we’re all coming together to figure this out and one possibility might be as simple as a bronze decorative pineapple with Live Laugh Love on it. It makes you wonder all of today’s things that are so obvious to us but might be uncovered in the future.
Wood bending/straightening tools (after steaming) weapons- bow, arrow/spear shafts or boatmaking/chariot repair The knobs could be for cordage to get the right curve tensioned until it dried.
I use these for holding down rolled thin paper I use for sketching so it lies flat. They look quite like this, with the rounded tips so they don't distress the paper, vellum or scrapings of hide by making little contact.
When you pick them up, the paper rolls right back up into a tight roll like a large scroll, map or wrapping paper. You use the different sized holes to measure the thickness of the pad when rolled or hold it tight while you bind it.
Edit: I own three, one for each side of the rolled paper that your arm doesn't restrain. Only one has holes in it. I was given these for this purpose. I suspect that they're a replica of these relics, and may not be their original purpose, but they do work well.
Military Camps would have lots of charts and whatnot, I guess. Sounds good to me.
I was guessing portable candle holder but I like your take on it.
Aha! I knew it was a fancy paper weight! 😉🥰
@@MamaKittieKat Literally!
I think mine were modeled after these Roman relics, to be honest. They do look exactly the same, and were given to me for this purpose (a fancy paperweight that doesn't damage rolled art paper that can hold it while you bind it). I have three, one for each side of the paper except for the right bottom corner, where your writing/drawing hand would be. Only one has holes in it.
I have no idea if this was their original purpose.
Maybe later they added holes for marking distances on the maps. The one without holes could measure and hold the paper down but not so easy to mark a spot under it, so you put a hole through it.
Every soldier and household had one. 3 sticks to make a pyramid foundation, once elevated underneath the hedron, you made fire, then like a coatrack other stick go in the left over holes. This way you have a cookingstation/drying-rack for clothes, the drying of meats, fix something onto it when alone and in need of a 3rd hand
The holes have diverse sizes, for branches/wooden poles. The studs are a remnant of fabrication which in turn were left to make for easy binding. Function followed form
It's a camping/survival tool. I bet there were more found outside than inside communities.
For those who think in images, imagine this thing at the top of crossing sticks(like a tipi), locking them in place at the junction. Or maybe think in ways of the building scaffolding.
It ensured.
If that was the use they would have charged on them from fire or smoke. Good theory though.
@@gamerjaqi7873 correct, some would have been found charred or dirty but every last one has been unused. So whatever they were for it wasnt for a heavy use object
Again they can use more common materials and not this very precise dodeca
@@gamerjaqi7873 i like your thinking, but how do you know they weren't charred? Maybe they were, that why you made them out of metal. And not sure how you meant the heavy part? But joints usually are sturdier/heavier a material than the stuff they hold up.
You have got me thinking, but not yet off my thing. 👍✌️
*more. Bring more! Truth matters more than me being right..
Ancient Rome used a lot of ropes. Ropes for canopies, ropes for tents, ropes for ship sales, ropes for stage levers, ropes of all different parameters. That means having to adapt and re-adapt ropes of different diameters for the purpose that's needed, from smaller rope. They are not always dodecahedrons, and they do not always have holes, but they always have a spoke or circular pattern on the sides, (5:50) which hints at how they worked through rotation. The holes are largely for reference, and the "dodecahedron" that has no holes also has less spokes - because it was used to manufacture smaller rope.
But why would you find those among coin hordes?
Because it was used by merchants and entertainers, who had ample use for rope of different sizes to overcome the limitations of the quality of the rope they had back then. It's something that would fall out of use as rope became longer lasting, of better quality, and methods and treatments became more specialized for their uses.
@@luismovil5341 I find this to be one of the better explanations. It's one of those things Romans probably thought were so obvious to know that they did not bother writing it down.
Thank You!!!
This is even better than my explanation. 😊
The problem with this hypothesis is that we know how roman ropes were made and they dont include the dodecohedron.
It's also weird that they didn't find any of these in the Italian Peninsula (even Spain, which I always thought is one of their important colonies) yet they can be found in Austria, Belgium, France, Germany, Hungary, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Switzerland and the United Kingdom.
I like your content so much more lately. Gone is the overly affected voice. You seem to be talking in your natural cadence and tonal emphasis. It's great!
1:35 - Chapter 1 - Max hedron
7:25 - Chapter 2 - Great hedron collider
8:00 - Chapter 3 - Go get a weave on
12:05 - Chapter 4 - Dodeca have fun
13:00 - Chapter 5 - Foe better heed ron
13:40 - Chapter 6 - Dodecoration
15:50 - Chapter 7 - Mo better seed run
18:40 - Chapter 8 - Zodeca creed on
22:40 - Chapter 9 - Don't make a weird one
23:25 - Chapter 10 - Dodec ancillaries
PS: Those puns are so bad i want to drink a whole bottle of Rhome !
The speculation in here reminds me of Motel of the Mysteries - where a future archeologist finds a well preserved roadside motel, and goes about speculating how different objects were used.
I remember that book in my Elementary School library! I think about it whenever archaeological mysteries like this emerge! Something probably completely prosaic but unknowable.
I couldn't remember the name of the book, it's nice to be able to find out again!
Outstanding book by David McCauly (sp?)-- the Do Not Disturb sign as a curse on all who enter was great!
@@danielsims6483You know, until you mentioned his name here, I never made the connection that that David Macaulay is the same one that wrote The Way Things Work (the book with the mammoths).
Sliders had a similar episode.
“Magic fingers” 😳🤷♀️😬
Looks a bit like a fancy tea stove, even has a spacing so that the candle doesn't burn the table. But I guess it's possible that it had attachments made of animal parts or wood or something else organic, that has since rotten away. Just that we only found metal and stone ones, also doesn't mean that poor people didn't have wooden or bone versions.
So many possibilities, I love it.
That's a prime chaotic resonator. You insert fossils into it to reroll affixes on rare items.
Without knowing anything about these, my first thought is used to help make segmented tents. Pole goes in the bottom, smaller poles go out from it and the bulbs are where they pressed the fabric down to keep it secure.
All these suggestions make me think of the Lorax’s THNEED. It does everything. LOL
But this theory is my personal favorite. Makes the most sense to me. Maybe tent fabric had loops or tie strings at the tips, in order to loop around one of the outside baubles, to get the fabric to hang onto as another point of attachment.
That sounds like a good theory. I thought maybe a tool for making cordage and rope. Maybe passing the size core you want through the hole and the nubs could hold the twisting cordage separated until ready to slide it back and start wrapping the center core.
@@deths1679 That's a good one too!
I thought of something for tents as well, a stick through the holes, then ropes around the bulbs to secure in all directions.
I saw a couple theories below that I liked. The gambling device with the wooden ball inside and as a tool for measuring widths of bits, spokes or maybe if may add, arrow shafts. As far as the one shown without any holes, perhaps the rings could have been used for the same purpose just by sizing it against the size of the engraved circle.
I'm going with arrow shaft gauge
I met an old fisherman in Greece years ago that had a number of them of different sizes and he said they were used for making fishing nets.
That sounds very plausible....
They were found in military camps and not along coasts which would have been the case for fishing nets, and why need such large multi sized holes?
Why are they found in coin hoards then?
And they’re not found in Italy (yet) unless there’s no fishermen there at that time.
@@TheLegPumpkinto make it easier to assemble I think
wait then all holes would be the same size probably, I'm wrong, I go with the coin theory
It kinda reminds me of something similar to a tool we use in construction for quickly measuring the thickness of metal or wire.
Lots of great ideas. They were used like a Rolex or a medal/reward. These were extremely complicated to make and were cherished by those that owned them. Usually they were placed in the open in a home, or dwelling, but were also awarded too officers. Due to the value of the items they were used when discussing movements or other military marks to basically show off. This is why some appear more worn than others.
They were also tossed about on the floor like legos to catch people not wearing their little sandal thingies. Roman we known for their great sense of humor when they weren’t walking around conjuring stuff.
Honestly….i have no clue what they are🤷♂️
I'm pretty sure they're gauges of some kind. The shaved coin detector is plausible, but the perfectly circular holes aren't necessary when simple slots would suffice. I think that they're more likely for certain craftsmen, likely woodworkers, to check for circularity and size uniformity down the length of dowels. There's no point in the largest hole being circular since it's only there to let something pass through from its opposite hole. Placement of the other sizes doesn't really matter as long as there's always a larger hole opposite. The knobs would be handy for grip to pull it back off when a dowel got stuck. Sure. You could do this with a set of rings but it'd be much easier to lose one of those than these clunky things. What's really puzzling is the 20-sided one. I can't tell if the holes are all the same size or not. But that one may be something based on a similar premise for some kind of fine craftsman. It's important to note that the sides on that one are curved and also that the triangles on the opposite side would not be in the same orientation. So, you wouldn't be able to pass something through one of the corner holes and out the opposite face, but the curve could be enough to allow something from that corner hole through the center hole on the next face adjacent to the opposite one. Damn. Now I want to get my hands on these to test my theories. I wonder if you can get accurate replicas somewhere.
We have the exact same things now, only made out of plastic. We use them to measure out serving sizes for spaghetti noodles and such. The ones with smaller holes would be very useful for trading varying gauges of wire for chain mail production and other industries that used different thicknesses of wire.
Yes, spaghetti measure - with different sizes depending on how hungry, how many, etc.
(Please, just totally ignore that the first mention of it was in the Talmud in the 5th century AD.)
These chapter titles are fantastic. Brava, Katy!
It's a candle holder. Candles were probably made in non standard sizes, especially if you traveled a lot, so if you had one of these, you could always prop up a candle to see in the dark.
What if they dig up an ancient ssd in 599 years from now. The 5 tb ssd has nothing but all Simon Whistler videos from his 9k different channels. Would they be in awe of the incredible knowledge this ancient man had and assume him to be some great genius and diety? Would they pity us after seeing how stupid we are and having Simon as our intellectual leader?
The connection to finding them with coin bags and military. Definitely you tend to store an item with what it’s used for.
Game: Ancient Bocce (They did play it in Slovenia as well)
This dodecahedron was the Pallino. Toss the pallino a distance away. Take turns throwing a coin or rock with player’s mark at the pallino. Closest to the pallino wins the money - this why it’s found in money pouches.
The nibs are there to create some randomness as to how the pallino lands. There are dog balls we create today so that when the ball hits the ground it goes in a different direction to what the dog expects.
In fact using this theory and reversing the above game rules would really create a more random game of chance. - players toss their coins first and the player throws the dodecahedron/pallino and if the pallino lands closest to your coin. You’re the winner.
Ehm no, it still doesn't explains the different hole sizes. The holes are the key to the mistery.
@@trolojolo6178 there are items in every day life that have designs that serve no other purpose but artistic creativity.
@@trolojolo6178 Whoever gets a coin exactly in the hole wins the jackpot or something.
Spin it like a dreidel with coins inside, although the solid sided ones would prevent that. Or it's more like a rosary, the nodes are reminders of prayers, the holes and rings for each god on the pantheon, perhaps personalized to the owner preference as to which gods to play to. Like a Buddhist Prayer Wheel.
@@trolojolo6178 it does actually it’s either just to make the thing look more fancy like we have in the modern world or it’s the bullseye
My best guess is that its a lunar calendar. Twelve circles of different sizes. Twelve full moons in a year with the moon having different apparent sizes. If you put it over a candle the circle at the top would project a specific sized 'moon' on the ceiling that corresponds to a specific lunar month.
Something else I found interesting is that there is one shown in this video with triangular faces. That's an icosahedron, it has twelve vertices and 20 faces. It is the dual of the dodecahedron (12 faces and 20 vertices). Notice that the 12 knobs on the vertices of the icosahedron are different sizes. The circles carved on the faces of the icosahedron are all the same size. That's the exact dual of the knobs and circles on the dodecahedron. That isn't a coincidence. It means that 12 is the significant number and 12 circular objects of different sizes.
I vaguely remember an episode of Dr. Who more than 20 years ago which featured a dodecahedron that was central to a planet's energy supply. The script used the word "dodecahedron" almost as many time as the script of this video.
Loved that episode!
Knitting needles not being invented yet actually supports the idea that these were used for knitting with the easier method not being around. I don't quite get why they think their would be noticeable wear on a metal object from thread. My moms needles doesn't show wear either and she have used them lots.
Another potential use would be for making wooden rods (arrows) by drawing a stick through larger to smaller holes.
On the "Imagine finding a coin hoard" bit:
I work in a place that buys and sells coins and it gets a lot of customers interested in selling or buy Roman coins. We buy them but we don't really sell a whole lot of them in the stores cause it's not really our main market (mostly we deal in domestic US coinage). But we DO buy them for their numismatic (collectable coin) value just in case we get a request for one.
Folks are always shocked to learn how cheap your average denarii (or most old empire coins) actually is because they don't realize that coin value (like most collectibles) is based on rarity far more than it is on age. Uncirculated denarii are pretty frequently found in large deposits whenever doing construction in Europe because this stuff got lost a lot, usually while transporting them to a province somewhere outside the empire. They made so many of them that we couldn't possibly do more than guess how many are out there, hundreds of millions at the very least. So you can easily buy one for under $20 and they aren't usually worth a lot when you sell them.
My personal opinion is they are standard references for building items. In construction you need a gauge or template to make sure the part is the proper size or shape. Being found mostly in the UK it makes sense that anything made there needs to be compatible for maintenance and repair from inside the Empire. i.e. an arrow shaft matches up for putting on an arrow head.
Ah, but if they had been routinely used for gauging crafts, one would expect to see more uneven wear, added markings perhaps, or added modifications from when standards or needs changed.
You wouldn’t need finely crafted ornate metal work for that.
Metal would have been incredibly expensive at that time, you’d be much more likely to use a variety of stick length.
Plus the inconsistent sizing makes reference weird
Personally I really like the idea it’s craftsmen proving their skill, I keep the pieces I built at my uni on display.
I hope someday an archaeologist will be questioning my soft robot part, presumably while giggling.
So why are these mostly found in coin hoards then? Also they didn't find these in Italy, what, theres no construction going onat those times?
Plausable, BUT they are all different sizes.
Not impossible because gages come in different sizes, BUT, the HOLES, if it were a standard measuring device, would have to be the same sizes on all of them, they are NOT, AND there is one example pictured that has NO holes.
So, Not diameters.
Angles then?
Why make an object this complex when it only demonstrates ONE angle?
also the example with no holes, ALSO has curved edges, making using it as a Gage tool unlikely.
ALSO, the knobs make it problematic for aligning the object with any surface or corner.
As a measuring tool of any kind, I think this explanation is a wash.
The different size of the holes makes me think of a calibre meter.
While on a longer march, the soldiers would put up a _castrum_ aka a fortification each evening; and for this they had to plant palisades, made from poles that they carried on mules, or wattle walls if wood wasn't available. They had standardized the process of building their camp in such an efficient way, that the construction took one to three hours.
The dodekahedron might have served as a tool that helped in the construction, as a kind of swiss knife measuring tool. You could use it as a plumb bob, check whether the stem of a hazel was thick enough to serve as a pole for the wattling, pull a rope along the wall to see if it is straight, or peer through the holes for the same reason, even shove the dodekahedron over the end of a rod that needed some bending or straightening, fasten a rope on the knots, and use the contraption to pull the rod into a specific direction, which is much easier than pushing it with your bare hands, because of a better leverage.
Of course this is all alledgedly.
I'm not a roman, but if I was, I would have used one of these to quickly make candles of a specific diameter, to check the gauge of a rope or string, or other tasks of a similar nature. The reason why they were found on battlefields was likely because it's useful to be able to fit your candles in holders or to not have ropes randomly not fit through fasteners because they have a lump or knot in them which you didn't know about.
Well, you dip candles repeatedly and let them dry and soften. I like the measuring tool and rope idea. It looks to me like part of a shaft straightening kit.
"Fidget Spinner" was the first thought i had as well. Something to bring up, the script was talking about the 12-sided version exclusively, but the image you kept showing on screen of the Three Bronze (?) ones in a display case... the one on the bottom right was a 20-sided version. It also had much smaller holes, at least on the visible side.
The thought about them being akin to a craftsman's graduation project could also be true. Wander around the programming office of any modern machine shop, and you'll find similar devices like cubes within cubes within cubes all machined out of a single block of metal. Just a thought.
Thanks for the video!
When machinists graduate from their classes, they all make a machinist's hammer, because it demonstrates their competency at all aspects of their work: turning, milling, drilling, threading, etc. I think something similar is happening here. These are 'proofs of competence' from student metalworkers. Straight lines, circular lines, bending and welding, bore holes of specific sizes, round parts, flat parts, corners and seams: all the essential metalworking techniques in one place. Many wouldn't have kept their grad projects, but some would have.
Newton's cradle was not invented to be a thing that seats on a desk and looks good but that's what most of them are made for now and I would pay to have a Roman dodecahedron to sit on my desk and makeing a Roman dodecahedron is a big expression of skill.
My guess: I think they are for identifying sticks that have a suitable straightness and diameter to be used for spears and arrows. If a stick can pass all the way through then it is straight enough, and the arrow/spears could be organised based on the hole diameter. Would explain their location too, as arrowheads and spearheads can be reused but sticks would constantly need replacing. It's unlikely that all spearheads were made equal so it would help to have a tool for checking and sorting different diameters.
But that would cause wear and tear that is absent from most of these
@@RealSaintB Wear from being as a measuring tool? How? Wood is softer than metal.
I'm with you, I have a similar tool for making shafts in the field.
It was actually for measuring manly girth.I have a whole demonstration video about it.
@@thehudsonforge71even though wood is softer than metal, tiny amounts are still rubbed off.
I like this hypothesis about it being a stick measurement device, but the lack of wear inside the holes doesn't fit with the hypothetical use case.
Those holes are for measuring width. That way you can standardize width and mass produce things such as tools and arrow and spear heads based on that width without having to make it custom to every shaft. Each hole is a different width for a different purpose.
If a shaftmaker for example finishes a spearshaft he pushes it through the hole used for that and can see if the width is right. The thing would be on the ground and the "feet" are so it doesn't topple/rolls or moves when he pushes a shaft in it. At the same time a dedicated spearhead factory can use a mold based on those dimensions and for the legionairies it would be very easy and quick to assemble a spear in camp with both components.
The decorated one with small holes is perhaps for use on a table and for pins, needles, and spikes
I thought it was for checking coins
If they were used for that they would show wear and tear on the insides.
Which none do
@@BrandonDenny-we1rw I was also thinking for Roman jugs and amphora. Which have a tapered point bottom. So it could just have them standing on the ground/table.
I wouldn't be surprised if they made variants for that as well@@lukeamato423
They do. Look up the article "History Mystery: Ancient Dodecahedron's Purpose Remains Secret", they have a broken one from which you can see inside.@@BrandonDenny-we1rw
In my opinion, it was used to check if coins were are certain size and thus real or fake.
Often found with coins aswell
They were used for gambling. Put the coins in from all players and roll the thing. The coins that fit through the hole that lands downward(and raised up by the nubs to allow them fall out) will fall out and that player keeps those coins then on to the next player to roll and so on. It then changed to no holes, and bids just put on the table because they would fall out of other holes prior to the thing stopping and this fixed that unfairness issue
That's what I was thinking too!
@@irenedebruyn2796 it makes the most sense with the lil evidence we have
I personally like the idea of a fancy candle holder. As candles would be all hand made they'd invariably all have slightly different diameters. So having a candle holder with different sized holes that you could quickly rotate to find the right sized hole for any particular sized candle would be very practical. And the complicated nature of it's construction would also serve as a bit of a flex for the upper class.
Are they older then 500 BCE?
I think you might be onto something, if they came around not long after the candle....
Have to disagree, sorry. Candles, made from tallow, were an extremely expensive item in ancient Rome, and were pretty much the domain of the very wealthy. As these devices were found mainly in army camps, it's highly unlikely they had anything to do with candles. On the whole, the Romans used terracotta oil lamps because olive oil was plentiful and cheap.
@@TheSecretChateau they would also have residue or other some substance stuck to them or perhaps insidd them.
But none of them are ever used
@@lostbutfreesoulI think the holed ones may have been wick caddies to make any bowl a lamp.
As someone who owns a dual sided Nicholas Cage sequin pillow, it is as glorious as it sounds.
Please get help. Lol
@@Hugh-Man0006with that profile name you really don't get to talk 😄
@missgreen101 i pulled this name out of a random name generator. It was this or weaselstrokeRedux
@@Hugh-Man0006lol thats worse, its like fate knew you were a buzzkill 😮
@@missgreen101 it WAS Grendel S Rage...so just as bad.
To me it's so clear what this is. It's a gambling device/game. The way the game worked was the inside was filled with coins by the players. The coins were of differing sizes like coins today. The varying holes in the sides corresponded to the size of various Roman coinage. The players take turns throwing it, if you are lucky, on your turn, some sort of coin will fall out. The little knobs are feet that hold the surface of the dodecahedron off of the floor to allow coins to fall out. That's why some were found with worn knobs where they came into contact with the ground when thrown. As Simon said, if you put coins in, it will be annoying to shake them out- That's the point of the game! This explanation explains why the were found with large hordes of coins and also why they were found in military camps, because soldiers gambled with one another. As far as the 12 sides, this makes sense since there were other Roman games with the number 12 theme. One popular dice game (That I found on Wikipedia) was known as Twelve Lines, Twelve Signs, Twelve Points, Twelve Writings and was similar to backgammon. So, what do I win??
On top of that, given by the different sizes holes, a certan size of object would have a certan chancese to fell through. And gambling is all about controlling chances and odds and the rewards.
What I assume how it plays out, is that a dealer would prepare a dodecahedron and various size balls/stones for the player to choose, the larger the stone, the higher the reward and vice versa.
Say if a player chooses a stone that can only pass through the largest hole, meaning the winning odd is almost about 1/12, then the dealer can profit by simply set the prize money for choosing the largest ball be 12 times the entry fee, given that the stone won't always fall through even with larger holes. and for example if the player chooses a stone that can pass through 6 of 12 holes, the dealer can ensure profit by setting prize money be 2 times the entry fee. And other people can also bet in the same game with set odd.
@@kingeric1992 very interesting idea. I’m inclined toward the idea of using coins but what you said is definitely possible. It would be interesting to know if any such balls or marbles were ever found nearby a dodecahedron. I prefer the idea of coins because these dodecahedrons have been found near large amounts of coins. I had another thought that maybe there is a dealer (as you mentioned) and he’s acts as the house. He fills the dodecahedron with his some of own coins to start the game and the players add coins to play. The more coins that are added, the greater chances, it seems, that a player has to win but because of the odds, of course, the dealer keeps filling the dodecahedron with the players coins and rarely gives back any. It’s like those games in the arcade where you think your coin will make the huge pile of coins fall over the edge but of course, you always lose and the house always wins.
So far my favorite guess (being that it is often found with treasure) is that it was used as a money certificate. The six different size holes represent the Roman numerals I - V -X - L - C - M. String wrapped around the hole indicates how many of each. Wax is applied to be imprinted with a seal. Two of each size would indicate silver and gold. It is an interesting guess.
I'm pretty sure the holes were used to gauge distance. If you look at a 3d scan, i really recommend you do, you will see that the opposite side is either smaller or larger. You can take a known unit of measure like a yard stick or a meter stick and walk it out to determine distance very quickly. Distance of two known points can give you all kinds of geometry in relation to the known points.
The Max Hedron pun was on point.
You're welcome.
It messed me up because they mentioned it but I was just flipping through channels and there was a stream xxx hacked by max headron super weird
You said allegedly!! I was beginning to get nervous. 😂
Such a great word!
Maybe they are scroll or map holders. Speaking of unexplainable objects. Imagine 1000 years from now unearthing a kitchen cabinet with 30 Stanley tumblers. "Why on earth would anyone have so many?"
"Fancy Paper Weights?"
Aye, makes at least as much sense as other hypotheses. 👍
It’s a drinking game! Think bouncing quarters into a shot glass. The different size hole is dependent upon the coin you have😂🙌🏻
Could this have been an award for a specific military campaign? A specific medal of sorts
i love the way your writers address you in the script, it's far more personal than some channels.
My theory is that they were fancy paperweights for wealthy Romans. Since only 100 have been found, I don't think this was a common item, I think they were all made by the same person, it was their signature product. At some point, they experimented with adding various sized holes to add further functionality, perhaps as a coin gauge as some have suggested. But the main purpose was as an ornamental weight to hold down scrolls or maps or other forms of paper.
I think you may be correct. The different size holes could also be used to hold various sized tools on a person's desk, adding more function to the paperweight.
Thought about it a bit more, I think the little nubs are to keep it raised and minimize contact with the paper, so as not to smear fresh ink.
@@NonEuclideanTacoCannon duh i thought that went without saying when you proclaimed it to be a paperweight.
Vellum weight, paper wasn't a thing back then js
@@richardcranium5393 ☝️🤓
me when seeing the thumbnail, “JUST LIKE SHADOWHEART!!!”
It's for making rope chains as in jewelery. It's a lacing and drawing tool to reduce the diameter of the finished chain. You put a wood rod into it to lace the wire around. Once you complete the sinnet you remove the rod and use the holes largest to smallest to draw it to a narrow chain made from gold wire
I am pretty certain it is some sort of gambling device. Romans loved games of dice and contests. Many such things wouldn't have been recorded in their historical record, because people gambling and having fun aren't important events, really. I could imagine there being some sort of pellet inside and multiple people would make bets on which hole it fell out of when sent flying. The larger the hole the more likely, but the smaller the hole, and the fewer bets, the more to win. Even if that's not how it was used, that it was found in many different places and in soldier's camps in particular would support this being some kind of gaming or gambling device. Soldiers tend to play games when there's little else to do. While not entirely the same thing, when I was in the Norwegian artillery I played a lot of poker and pool with the others. I've never really been a big poker or pool player, but in the army, with lots of spare time, we played games. Also, such games aren't only played by soldiers. I am pretty certain this is some sort of gaming or gambling device.
Treasure and salvage/recovery rules are quite different in the US/CA, and it ranges from everything is seized, everything is yours, everything is seized at your expense, you are fined for disturbing artifacts, or no one cares. Varies by state and province.
There are also a few cases where you really need to treat the find as top secret until you've fully excavated and documented it. Otherwise there's a tendency for various 3 letter agencies agencies to run overnight operations and come back with "well turns out there's no treasure, tough luck. Ignore the multiple excavators, drag marks, refilled pit and the convoy of armoured vehicles that left here throughout the night."
Nobody loves Simon more than Simon
Nobody loves you more than you.
Nice comeback. I’ll bet you used 100% of your brain power for that one.
@@billward2855Doesn't take a lot of brain power to state the obvious.
I know exactly what those are.
Glove looms.
I saw a TV show a few years ago with a guy who 3D printed one and played around with yarn on it
It's actually super useful. The different sizes holes are for different sizes of fingers and you can customize the glove made for children, women, men, or even people missing fingers. Believe it or not!
That doesn't explain the ones without any holes at all in them.
@@ezekielbrockmann114you got me there, I can't explain the ones without holes. But I've seen pictures of dozens with, and only a few without. I bet it was used as some kind of tool though and not some useless artifact. They wouldn't put the effort in to making something this complicated without a purpose. There were probably jigs of some sort made of wood so they could get the pieces aligned which all would have decayed by now. The romans had most of the tech to make many modern objects but didn't put things together for them. They knew about silver salts and camera obscuras and could have invented photography. They could make pipes and sheet metal and basics of hot cooking fats, they could have invented deep fryers. They knew a lot about hydrodynamics, ceramics and did invent the simplest form of toilet, a seat with a hole over a stream. If they put more thought into it, they could have made modern toilets. Their biggest problems included using lead to make pipes, wine goblets and water jugs. "Hey Caesar, that's not sweetness, that's your brain going nuts!" Lead is bad. The Roman word for lead is the root word for plumbing.
ChatGPT seems like that friend that just says shit that sounds good. Lmao
One person made viking knit chain using one & hypothesized they were used to make ropes & jewelry using the same weaving method with different materials. That would explain finding with coins & on military bases.
As for one's without holes, could be a blank for casting? No clue but I was amazed at how quickly and uniformly she made the viking knit chain. Those things are hard to make!
She made a really good argument, including presenting a photograph of a Roman jewelry display from the same Era. A gold viking knit chain.
The the nubs were used to anchor the weave & the holes were used to reduce the chain/rope. Every pass through would tighten the weave & reduce the diameter.
She hypothesized that the holes were waxed to lubricate the process and protect the material from friction.
The glove knitting demonstrations are pretty convincing.
When I see these I’m reminded of a spoon I use for measuring spaghetti. These objects have the same size facing holes right? The little hole is a child’s portion, let’s say. Push the pasta through it and cook the entire thing. Add more dodecahedron with appropriate portion sizes for the other guests. To allow more space in the cooking pot for more food, as the spaghetti softens you twirl the dodecahedron with the topmost nodules, so for large feasts there can be several of these in one pot.
When cooked the nodules are used to pick up the spaghetti and spin it in the sauce, as some kind of fun alternative to a fork.
Or just a measure for a portion, not for the cooking part.
Perhaps this was an innovation that never really caught on and only a few hundred were made.
There was no pasta in Europe at that time.
Chaotic Resonators. Typically used with fossils
It looks like a holder for things of different sizes that need to stand straight up, but can't on their own.
I always enjoy videos like this one finding objects that we can only wager what they once had a use for. I like to agree with the 'ancient bocce' because it seems to make the most sense, seeing that some of the dodecahedra were found with money pouches.
Would be helpful making nets.
1. note that there are several kinds.
2. note that one of these kinds has carefully-sized holes, such that holes on opposite-sides form 2 rings of a cone.
3. look through those, such that you're seeing those edges as concentric, and you should get a specific, controlled, angle.
4. the ones without the specially-sized circular holes were not used for measuring angles ( if you know the angle, & you know how many yards it was from you to the something you're looking at, then you can calculate its size ), those fake ones are just trinkets, same as we have fake devices, now, for people to pretend they've got some fancy thing, or other, like children's toys.
5. look to see if those circles-of-visual-cones form a pattern of fractions, in their angles, or a specifically-useful set of visual-angles, whose calculations are easier with Roman numerals.