congrats on being the first channel/influencers to pack a long lens! I could never understand why bike channels were always getting attitude from bike mechanics for close-up with phones when the paps have solved this problem decades ago!
Thanks for your feedback, more real world measurements to come. Simon and the crew are still out filming our next video and probably due a well deserved Aperol Spritz... - Felix
Great point on new Madone being tested with the "aero" bottles vs. the old one being tested without them. 0.1w more efficient with the new bottles. Make of that what you will.
I liked the explanation of why waxed chains aren't often used in pro stage races. The GCN boys always act mystified when they encounter an oiled chain at a race.
Would be interesting to see if the TT bikes for key riders are using wax. Would be worth the logistic hassle there. Just bring a few pre waxed chains for those stages.
@@roadcyclist1 you would need ~150 chains assuming they do a power wash every day. And then ever day need to be sure all 8 bikes have the quick link properly secured for sure. Chains have to be organized to go with each bike because they are different lengths, etc. Even a small extra step or extra logistics is tough in the hectic pace of a stage race. I've seen it first hand at smaller scale domestic races.
Fun fact: waxed chains often doesn't have less friction than good clean oiled chains. The good thing about waxed chains is they don't attract much dirt, so in a long term you have less wear. But if you have a team bus with more new chains than you need, oiled chains are the way to go. If you compare tube typed tires with latex inner tubes and tubeless tires, the first combo is faster. Have a nice tour.
@@peti562 That's where they had their ridiculous interaction with bikeradar - no, you can't take a closer look at the new bike we're riding in public 😂
@@bikeradarvery accommodating or doing what 99% of the other pro teams do? Letting you do your jobs is the bare minimum, stop acting like they did something special; they wouldn’t even let you weigh it
Ineos were very accomodating at this year's Tour, and we think they're still an interesting team to cover 🙂 Appreciate there was a little drama at the Dauphine, but it's all water under the bridge - everyone was just trying to do their job.
@einundsiebenziger5488 I wouldn't be bothered by that at all. Find a big diameter cup to rest it in and you're good. You're still stuck with a bottle that's pretty small though. I really would only want to use these in a race where I know I don't really need to drink. I don't care about 3.5w or even 20w in aerodynamics when I'm out training which is why my aero gear all sits on a wall most of the time.
Was hoping to see some close ups of the Tarmac SL8 in Red Bull livery. Love or hate Spesh, the paint jobs are usually very nice. Seems like all the bikes are so closely matched now it will be down to the ability of the riders for the win! Come on Pog!
Yes, you're right, Visma do have waxed chains this year (and we later found out Lidl-Trek are doing it too). We've got a bike check coming in a video next week - stay tuned! Thanks for watching, Simon
You could be right - really interesting to see teams moving to wider tyres, even with the climbing / GC riders where every gram counts. Thanks for watching, Simon
I'm guessing Canyon slimmed down the seatpost and downtube to make up for the seatpost being stiffer than the one they had the problem with that bound down low in the seat downtube - though - I haven't had any problems with mine...
With a waxed chain you don't need to powerwash it. The wax doesn't come off with water and dirt doesn't stick to it, so you rinse off any crud and off you go again.
You're right, and that's exactly what I do with my bikes/waxed chains at home. The realities of being a pro mechanic on the road are very different, though - they've got dozens of bikes/cars/buses/etc. to wash every single day (on top of everything else they have to do) and so they powerwash everything to make things as efficient as possible. Ultimately, I think it's a bigger logistical challenge than many realise. That's not to say it's doesn't have benefits, and some teams are finding creative ways to fit it into their daily workflows. We'll have more on this in our next TDF video - which should be coming next week - stay tuned! Cheers for watching, Simon
Pinarello say you can't weigh the bike...aha. Ask yourself why? It's because it's quite a bit heavier than they quote...I know it because I ride one. They are extremely aero & hold speed very well...but are not particularly light.
Spot the roadie - re the pro one tyres with the blue accents, Schwalbe do race day versions of their mountain bike tyres for their pros and used to have first ride written on the sidewall in blue, based off that I’d wager these are special race day ( ultra short lifespan but higher performance) versions that will never be sold to public
Thanks for the info - that's really interesting. I've asked Schwalbe a few times and they've always batted me away with "no comment" haha... If that's the case, though, I think that goes against UCI rules (the ones that state all equipment used must be publicly available). Anyone got a number for the UCI Commissaire hotline? I need to report an infringement! 😅 Cheers for watching, Simon
Pinnarello looks mint. Would love to have one, one day. The Dare looks the most futuristic. Parts of it I love, but other parts I'm not so sure. My feeling is that in a few years some of those features will be normal and not so unusual. The Trek... meh
That usually isn't really a thing. I've seen multiple people who swear that "aero bike X is way more uncomfortable than round tube bike Y" subject themselves to a blind test, where they were unable to tell which one they were on. And that was back when 23mm tires at 110psi were the standard.
@@JackMott maybe so yes. As my racing days are over, I feel like I have had enough personal experience with different tube shapes to guide myself to a bit more compliant frame shapes. I don’t doubt the Dare is fast as hell, but it also has to be one of the ugliest bike in the tour this year.
Why do manufacturers bring bikes to the biggest bike races in the world and then say you can't film them? Pinarello did that with the Dogma just a month ago, and now Van Rysel and Canyon. Like we can see the bike. It's on top of your car. Millions of people are going to see it on live TV. Why do you not want to market it? Or weigh it?
It is a play so journalists can mention them twice. First as a sneak peak then a second time with more details and along with racing results. Like "X rider won on stage 10 riding the new McRoadie which is supposedly lighter, stiffer and more aero as per director sportif..."
Brands have release dates. Media and manufacturers receive the product before that date, but it's embargoed until that date. If they let some media film the product on the spot, they themselves will be breaking the embargo agreement.
@@Membrillo81 All good points, but the release date and embargo dates are determined by the manufacturer. They can make it whatever they want. They choose to make it the first day of the race, or after the race, and then tell media "don't look". Just kind of silly imo.
@@sunshinecycling it's not "don't look", it's "don't look too close". They can film and photograph from a distance but the teams are instructed to not let them direct access. Like when they do "10 things we'd like to see in the next generation XXX". They most likely already know how it will be, even have a sample already, but they can't explicitly say what features it will have and what not. Or when they jump like hyaenas after a leak. They are not breaching embargo because they are just informing about a leak or a rumor, not directly from the product itself.
I like Simon;'s look. Seems like a cycling Jesus. "Do you have a few minutes? I wish to speak with you about our lord and saviour Aerolord, the fastest god in the universe. Memberships get you a 3 g seat clamp that saves 0.07 watts. "
7.2kg my arse, over 8kg heavy klunkers, I was a team Mech thirty years, hard hard work, all manufacturers lie, older bikes were much lighter I’m afraid
🤷♂That's what Pinarello says haha... But, yes, it's a bit silly isn't it - I think they could have just said 'the frame weight is essentially the same, but we've made small gains elsewhere'. Hey ho. Cheers for watching, Simon
Your sentence was incomplete: "fewer moulds, fewer costs for the brand MEANS less choice for the customer and more costs for the customer, who is more likely to require bike fitting." In fairness to Trek, Giant started this ball rolling with the TCR compact frame decades ago...
Correct! That's what Trek told us - AFAIK the aero testing was done like this; Madone Gen 8 with aero bottles versus Madone Gen 7 with normal bottles... For me, that's a teeny bit sneaky, because you could obviously put the new aero bottles on the old Gen 7 bike - would it be faster than the Gen 8 one like that? And what about when you use round bottles on the Gen 8 Madone instead? Cheers for watching! Simon
What the deal with the filming BS. Your out in public with a bike. Like showing it in a video is gonna give away all the secrets 😂😂😂 such a ridiculous power trip, SMH
We'd have loved to but unfortunately the teams wouldn't let us handle the bikes - hopefully we'll find out more details soon. Cheers for watching, Simon
Pinarello: same bike as usual. Some "marginal" gains? Dare: no sense bike. That handlebar is useless Trek: copying Specialized's business model, one bike for everything...
Yes, we do 🙂 We know all about chain waxing and wax-based drip lubes - you can read my in-depth guide on the topic here: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain In the case of Ineos, it's sponsored by Muc-Off and AFAIK, Muc-Off doesn't make a wax-based drip lube, so that wouldn't be an option for the team. Of course, it could use wax lube from another brand if it felt the gains were worthwhile, but that risks souring a commercial/professional relationship if that becomes public. As always, it's just worth remembering that even richer teams such as Ineos have to make concessions to commercial factors. Cheers for watching, Simon
@@roadcyclist1 The Pinarello looks like a Dali on one of his worst days, the Dare's head-tube and fork are massive and plain old ugly (and with all tubes being on the thick side, it looks plain old sluggish) and the Trek... oh boy: breaking the lines for that arrow-head combined with Lidl's ugly color-scheme really is horrible for the eye. Now the SL of the RedBull Team: that's a beautiful bike with nice lines and a great paint-job.
@@roadcyclist1 They just look more ugly than all the others. P has not made one half-way good-looking frame since they switched from metal to carbon about 20 years ago.
@einundsiebenziger5488 nope. They look fantastic..hence why thousands of people purchase them. You can complain all you want, but there are countless people who love and enjoy them. I know that urks you to no end.
I don't like the new Madone. Trek's claim of even better aerodynamics? I think not. The main reason is that the Gen 7 has problems with crosswinds, gusts and turbulence, I ride it, I know it. They simply had to respond to the demands of the professional riders, otherwise they would have dropped out of the peloton. That's how Gen 8 was created. But everyone is surprised by the price reduction of Gen 7. I paid 6 weeks ago for ordered and late delivered (7 months waiting) SL 6 Gen 7 by 1500 EUR more than it costs now. I feel cheated and robbed. They must have already known they were going to launch Gen 8, they must have known it would cost less than when Gen 7 launched, and they must have known Gen 7 would come down in price. Yet shamelessly after such a wait they sold me the bike 6 weeks before the sale at full price. In addition, incomplete, with damaged paint, poorly attached derailleur and dry-assembled carbon parts - disgusting. A huge disgrace to the TREK brand in Europe, destroying the value of the purchased bike. TREK never again.
Re Waxed chains: they just need to have 2-3 pre-waxed chains for each rider et voilà. These are pro teams with pro mechanics for the BIGGEST bike race in the world so OF COURSE they could have a suitcase filled with pre-waxed chains
I imagine we'll see more teams doing something like this in the future, but the scale of the job the team mechanics have is a lot larger than many realise - most teams have multiple bikes for every rider and it's a big logistical challenge to do things like this, plus there's a cost of replacing quick-links, etc. If more teams start doing it, though, I'm sure everyone else will have to find ways to make it work rather than be left behind. Cheers for watching! Simon
I wax my own chains! You can read my in-depth guide on the subject here: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain So, yeah, I'm not saying there aren't benefits to waxing chains, simply that I can why a pro team that's on the road, with huge numbers of bikes to clean and maintain every day, might see it as something of a logistical challenge. Thanks for watching, Simon
@@bikeradar ...apologies Simon, your mention of team mechanics not bothering with waxed chains because they would be power washing the wax off the chains, presumes they don't have the wherewithal to remove the chain prior to power washing or even have brought freshly waxed chains for each race day for every bike they brought to the race.
@@OriginalTrev No worries. I think it's just worth remembering that removing the chains off every bike, every day, to then re-wax and re-install everything is a massive logistical challenge. The teams have so many bikes to sort, on top of everything else that needs doing every day. As well as being wasteful of quick-links (no one's going to reuse a quicklink and risk snapping a chain at the Tour), there's also risks of mistakes/errors being made in the process, which could easily negate any potential advantage gained. I completely get the idea that there are 'easy' gains being left on the table, and it can look like low hanging fruit at a glance, but IMO it's a logistics problem first and foremost. Teams are looking for ways to overcome this - Lidl-Trek is working with Cyclowax on a new tool that automates the process, for example (more on this in our next video) - but I think it's a bigger challenge than many realise.
2010 Tour de France PRO Bikes 6.8 kg......Rim brakes, Mechanical groupset !!!! 2024 Tour de France PRO Bikes 8.0 kg ....... Disc Brakes, Electronics.... 👎
More comfortable; faster, more reliable, better braking. It's almost as if all engineering decisions involve comprise and 1.1 or so kg of system weight matter SFA in the grand scheme of things.
@@richardhaselwood9478 "More comfortable" is subjective and in some cases debatable with super-voluminous drop-shaped seatposts and stuff. They are hardly more reliable as the all-internal cable/hose routing is much more finicky and batteries need to be charged, and if any of the proprietary, non-interchangeable parts such as seatposts, stems, spacers and whatnot fails they keep you from riding altogether so your average speed drops to a total zero for days if not weeks because they have to be custom ordered and take so long to be delivered. So of the benefits might serve pros who can maintain speeds where "aero over weight" applies, and they also have professional mechanics who take care of the bikes each and every day. To most recreational riders aero gains, if there are any, are of no use.
These prices are so because these bikes can re-define time and space. Trek can make an hour last 3590 seconds instead of 3600 ("saves ten seconds per hour"), and Specialized can make one bike go faster than another when both are travelling at the very same speed ("SL8 18 seconds faster at 45 kph than SL7"). Or maybe they just need to pay for the drugs of their coked-out marketing departments.
Don’t be jealous about INEOS!! They will always be the best and with the best bike ever! And that is a fact so suck it cry babies!! And Pogi is a cheater!
This is one of the dumbest reviews I’ve witnessed. Any team can have a bucket full of pre-waxed race ready chain at a moments notice, in fact that’s the ideal way to do it anyways. This oil chain being the better choice for the tour is a bunch of nonsense.
Hi Matthew, thanks for your comment. As i've said in replies to other comments on this topic, I think you're underestimating the logistical challenge of having immersively-waxed chains on every bike. That's not to say it can't be done, but pro mechanics on the road have dozens of bikes/cars/buses/etc. to wash and maintain every single day (on top of everything else they have to do) and so they have to make things as efficient as possible. Taking the chain off / re-waxing it /reinstalling it every day not only takes time and resource - something which isn't unlimited, even for the richest teams - but it also brings risks in terms of mistakes being made during installation / inconsistencies in shifting between chains / cost of quick links and so on. It's also worth remembering that many teams have sponsorship arrangements that tie them into using certain lubricants. Ineos is sponsored by Muc-Off, for example, which doesn't do waxed-based lubricants. I appreciate there are potential gains to be had - I didn't say oil was a better choice, and I even wrote BikeRadar's guide to chain waxing: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain - but for a pro team it's not as simple/easy as it looks at face value, in my opinion. Cheers for watching, Simon
![Pinarello Dogma F 2025 dream road bike build [4K ASMR]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YRN8prg0-uc/mqdefault.jpg)
Did you see that sneaky new Van Rysel bike? 👀
Nice looking paint on it
congrats on being the first channel/influencers to pack a long lens! I could never understand why bike channels were always getting attitude from bike mechanics for close-up with phones when the paps have solved this problem decades ago!
The FCR is available on the Decathlon UK site 🤨 Is it old or new?
@@JFomo i think that's the old version
@@treyquattrogrunts on power trips probably
Amazing job, as always Simon. Love real world tyre width measurements. That paint job on Van Rysel looks pretty awesome.
Thanks for your feedback, more real world measurements to come. Simon and the crew are still out filming our next video and probably due a well deserved Aperol Spritz... - Felix
Great insight of this years bikes - absolutely loved the detailed analysis. Well done, great video.
Thanks for your comment! Enjoy the weekend and check back soon for another Tdf bikes video soon 👍
that van rysel looks great, love the colourway there too.
Great point on new Madone being tested with the "aero" bottles vs. the old one being tested without them. 0.1w more efficient with the new bottles. Make of that what you will.
Should we put aero bottles on a load of the best aero bikes to see if they make us faster? Yes or yes?
@@bikeradar I mean, what we need really is more aero humans. Maybe AI can help with that 😆
Nice video! Like the overall flow and insights provided
I liked the explanation of why waxed chains aren't often used in pro stage races. The GCN boys always act mystified when they encounter an oiled chain at a race.
Would be interesting to see if the TT bikes for key riders are using wax. Would be worth the logistic hassle there. Just bring a few pre waxed chains for those stages.
They could easily pre wax 50 chains and have them ready to go
@@roadcyclist1 you would need ~150 chains assuming they do a power wash every day. And then ever day need to be sure all 8 bikes have the quick link properly secured for sure. Chains have to be organized to go with each bike because they are different lengths, etc. Even a small extra step or extra logistics is tough in the hectic pace of a stage race. I've seen it first hand at smaller scale domestic races.
@@JackMott you only do it for your gc guy and maybe a stage hunter
Fun fact: waxed chains often doesn't have less friction than good clean oiled chains.
The good thing about waxed chains is they don't attract much dirt, so in a long term you have less wear.
But if you have a team bus with more new chains than you need, oiled chains are the way to go.
If you compare tube typed tires with latex inner tubes and tubeless tires, the first combo is faster.
Have a nice tour.
Great video! Well done.
Ineos didn't have another meltdown over having the bike on video ??
Steve Cummnigs isn't at the tour, so no.
The bike was on video at the Dauphine. Were you sleeping?
Ineos were very accomodating - I think we're all friends again now 🙂
@@peti562 That's where they had their ridiculous interaction with bikeradar - no, you can't take a closer look at the new bike we're riding in public 😂
@@bikeradarvery accommodating or doing what 99% of the other pro teams do? Letting you do your jobs is the bare minimum, stop acting like they did something special; they wouldn’t even let you weigh it
You shouldn't cover Ineos bikes after the nonsense of them claiming they own all filming rights on public roads globally.
Can you explain what you mean by that?
Check out the Road CC video, not a great look for Ineos.
I agree. If they want to be secretive about their equipment don't give them any airtime and free advertising
This is why they should be covered...especially in public areas😂
Ineos were very accomodating at this year's Tour, and we think they're still an interesting team to cover 🙂 Appreciate there was a little drama at the Dauphine, but it's all water under the bridge - everyone was just trying to do their job.
Nice vid!
What watch is Simon wearing?
Thanks for watching - the watch is a Polar Grit X, with a fabric/velcro strap. Cheers, Simon
Love the weird shaped Lidl bottles
I'm sure they're not fun to put back in during a criterium, if you're super tired or wearing big gloves😂
@@veganpotterthevegan Starts with trying to make them stand upright for easier filling - not possible.
@einundsiebenziger5488 I wouldn't be bothered by that at all. Find a big diameter cup to rest it in and you're good. You're still stuck with a bottle that's pretty small though. I really would only want to use these in a race where I know I don't really need to drink. I don't care about 3.5w or even 20w in aerodynamics when I'm out training which is why my aero gear all sits on a wall most of the time.
I love that Dare
Me too. What a weapon
Was hoping to see some close ups of the Tarmac SL8 in Red Bull livery. Love or hate Spesh, the paint jobs are usually very nice. Seems like all the bikes are so closely matched now it will be down to the ability of the riders for the win! Come on Pog!
It was never the bike that made a winner!
well done
I love the simplicity of the Dogma.
At the very least visma was using wax last year and they change the chain. The chain is waxed in netherlands and shipped over. It was in a GCN video
Yes, you're right, Visma do have waxed chains this year (and we later found out Lidl-Trek are doing it too). We've got a bike check coming in a video next week - stay tuned! Thanks for watching, Simon
I would guess the Pinarello had 30mm tires mounted because at 21mm internal rim width, Continental 30mm tires are 30mm wide.
You could be right - really interesting to see teams moving to wider tyres, even with the climbing / GC riders where every gram counts. Thanks for watching, Simon
I'm guessing Canyon slimmed down the seatpost and downtube to make up for the seatpost being stiffer than the one they had the problem with that bound down low in the seat downtube - though - I haven't had any problems with mine...
in between Canyon adjusted the frame already to make space for the screw on the other side and added a slightly renewed seatpost.
That dare looks extremely fast
With a waxed chain you don't need to powerwash it. The wax doesn't come off with water and dirt doesn't stick to it, so you rinse off any crud and off you go again.
You're right, and that's exactly what I do with my bikes/waxed chains at home. The realities of being a pro mechanic on the road are very different, though - they've got dozens of bikes/cars/buses/etc. to wash every single day (on top of everything else they have to do) and so they powerwash everything to make things as efficient as possible.
Ultimately, I think it's a bigger logistical challenge than many realise. That's not to say it's doesn't have benefits, and some teams are finding creative ways to fit it into their daily workflows. We'll have more on this in our next TDF video - which should be coming next week - stay tuned!
Cheers for watching, Simon
Don't Most and Pinarello measure bars outside to outside, so there is a very good chance that that bar is a 38 on paper
That's an Yoeleo seatpost on the Dare! 🤔
what about the Orbea Lotto-dsney?! no love?!
transparent aluminium warp drives (with anti-gravity climbing #AI) could fit in the enlarged BB area. 🙂
14:50 The hoods remind me of aliexpress bibs on my wee cousin. I hope they revise that.
That Dare is the hottest bike, imo.
how can we buy?
I wonder which company makes the bike for Dare...?
7.46 kg for the trek is imo heavy. But thats mainly due to the bontrager wheels. With some lighter (same height) bike would weigh around 7 kg
Why? You guys make me laugh......absolute nonsense. 15kg is heavy for a bike, 8kg and under is light.....
@@Andy_ATB you can make a lighter rim brake bike for less than half the price
@@Silidons91Careful. They wouldn't want us to save money now would they?
@@Andy_ATB yeah. But not for the todays posibilities.
@@Silidons91 yeah. And no aero and Bad brake and old groupset and no Updates. But for shure its lighter and cheaper
What about crank lengths???
crazy that Dare bike is legal.
The dare bike looks sick but 8 kg for the dura ace build wonder how heavy the cheaper models will be
This is certainly a bike that will be aimed at sprinters and mega watt monsters, so I'd imagine weight won't be too much of a concern for them. Liam
Notice how the Madone has a udh, which means sram is going for t-type on road groups soon
Nice 🖖but we all know pog waxes his chain.
What size Dogma F please
Believe it was a 56cm frame. Cheers for watching, Simon
The DOGMA F frame weights you quoted are not the painted weights.
Also you don't mention fork weights, why not? People want to know.
It seems strange that the Pinarello is almost a full kg more than it could be.
When Jack Luke will post his brown gravel rim brake bike video?
That Van Rysel FCR from afar totally looks like the AEROAD
It looks nothing like an aeroad to my eyes...
those BMWs are great..
Pinarello say you can't weigh the bike...aha.
Ask yourself why?
It's because it's quite a bit heavier than they quote...I know it because I ride one.
They are extremely aero & hold speed very well...but are not particularly light.
🙃
That madone is damn good looking
Much better than its predecessor. The silly seatpost window has become smaller, but still serves no actual purpose.
@@einundsiebenziger5488 previous one most think is far nicer
I wish manufacturers didn't slim down their bikes and found other ways to make them lighter.
Aero bikes just look so much better with deep foils.
What they don’t mention about waxed chains is they are very noisy, oil is very quiet, make your choice
You can buy the Trek in Lidl💪🏻
🛒🛒🛒💨
Spot the roadie - re the pro one tyres with the blue accents, Schwalbe do race day versions of their mountain bike tyres for their pros and used to have first ride written on the sidewall in blue, based off that I’d wager these are special race day ( ultra short lifespan but higher performance) versions that will never be sold to public
Thanks for the info - that's really interesting. I've asked Schwalbe a few times and they've always batted me away with "no comment" haha... If that's the case, though, I think that goes against UCI rules (the ones that state all equipment used must be publicly available). Anyone got a number for the UCI Commissaire hotline? I need to report an infringement! 😅 Cheers for watching, Simon
You need a better zoom lens 😅
Pinnarello looks mint. Would love to have one, one day. The Dare looks the most futuristic. Parts of it I love, but other parts I'm not so sure. My feeling is that in a few years some of those features will be normal and not so unusual. The Trek... meh
I hope a big side wind doesn't blow that thing over
6:06
Dare, probably the most uncomfortable bike in the tour too :s
That usually isn't really a thing. I've seen multiple people who swear that "aero bike X is way more uncomfortable than round tube bike Y" subject themselves to a blind test, where they were unable to tell which one they were on. And that was back when 23mm tires at 110psi were the standard.
@@JackMott maybe so yes. As my racing days are over, I feel like I have had enough personal experience with different tube shapes to guide myself to a bit more compliant frame shapes. I don’t doubt the Dare is fast as hell, but it also has to be one of the ugliest bike in the tour this year.
@@hmudesign imo a great looking bike. Brutal! ;-)
how long will the hair go
Why do manufacturers bring bikes to the biggest bike races in the world and then say you can't film them? Pinarello did that with the Dogma just a month ago, and now Van Rysel and Canyon. Like we can see the bike. It's on top of your car. Millions of people are going to see it on live TV. Why do you not want to market it? Or weigh it?
Tdf bikes are heavier?
It is a play so journalists can mention them twice. First as a sneak peak then a second time with more details and along with racing results.
Like "X rider won on stage 10 riding the new McRoadie which is supposedly lighter, stiffer and more aero as per director sportif..."
Brands have release dates. Media and manufacturers receive the product before that date, but it's embargoed until that date. If they let some media film the product on the spot, they themselves will be breaking the embargo agreement.
@@Membrillo81 All good points, but the release date and embargo dates are determined by the manufacturer. They can make it whatever they want. They choose to make it the first day of the race, or after the race, and then tell media "don't look". Just kind of silly imo.
@@sunshinecycling it's not "don't look", it's "don't look too close". They can film and photograph from a distance but the teams are instructed to not let them direct access.
Like when they do "10 things we'd like to see in the next generation XXX". They most likely already know how it will be, even have a sample already, but they can't explicitly say what features it will have and what not. Or when they jump like hyaenas after a leak. They are not breaching embargo because they are just informing about a leak or a rumor, not directly from the product itself.
I like Simon;'s look. Seems like a cycling Jesus. "Do you have a few minutes? I wish to speak with you about our lord and saviour Aerolord, the fastest god in the universe. Memberships get you a 3 g seat clamp that saves 0.07 watts. "
Thank you! Blessed are the watt savers ✝🙏 Simon
So the dogma has a speed sniffer?
We have a Zoom lense 😂
Be interested in Jersey,Bib,shoes etc
7.2kg my arse, over 8kg heavy klunkers, I was a team Mech thirty years, hard hard work, all manufacturers lie, older bikes were much lighter I’m afraid
5g lighter, really they want to go with that? And what is the variance in frame weight Pinarello, let me guess, its more than 5 grams.
🤷♂That's what Pinarello says haha... But, yes, it's a bit silly isn't it - I think they could have just said 'the frame weight is essentially the same, but we've made small gains elsewhere'. Hey ho. Cheers for watching, Simon
Your sentence was incomplete: "fewer moulds, fewer costs for the brand MEANS less choice for the customer and more costs for the customer, who is more likely to require bike fitting." In fairness to Trek, Giant started this ball rolling with the TCR compact frame decades ago...
It's hilarious Pinarello allowed you to give such a detailed review of the Dogma on video but not weigh it! 😂🤦
THEORY : that trek is only as aero as the old madone with those new bottle cages
Correct! That's what Trek told us - AFAIK the aero testing was done like this; Madone Gen 8 with aero bottles versus Madone Gen 7 with normal bottles... For me, that's a teeny bit sneaky, because you could obviously put the new aero bottles on the old Gen 7 bike - would it be faster than the Gen 8 one like that? And what about when you use round bottles on the Gen 8 Madone instead?
Cheers for watching! Simon
youre kidding that a major team cant have multiple waxed chains to rotate onto the bike
kind of
What the deal with the filming BS. Your out in public with a bike. Like showing it in a video is gonna give away all the secrets 😂😂😂 such a ridiculous power trip, SMH
PLEASE weigh the new AEROAD in this TDF!!
We'd have loved to but unfortunately the teams wouldn't let us handle the bikes - hopefully we'll find out more details soon. Cheers for watching, Simon
Masi bike
Whats next? Fins ala F1? 😂
It's probably been thought about at the very least
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Pinarello: same bike as usual. Some "marginal" gains?
Dare: no sense bike. That handlebar is useless
Trek: copying Specialized's business model, one bike for everything...
Trek destroys the madone
IDK, in the flesh it's a helluva bike
I wish I could listen to his voice for longer than 5 seconds
Does Bikeradar know that drip wax exists?
Yes, we do 🙂 We know all about chain waxing and wax-based drip lubes - you can read my in-depth guide on the topic here: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain
In the case of Ineos, it's sponsored by Muc-Off and AFAIK, Muc-Off doesn't make a wax-based drip lube, so that wouldn't be an option for the team. Of course, it could use wax lube from another brand if it felt the gains were worthwhile, but that risks souring a commercial/professional relationship if that becomes public.
As always, it's just worth remembering that even richer teams such as Ineos have to make concessions to commercial factors. Cheers for watching, Simon
Why is the TREK painted like a LOOK bike?
Lidl sponsor lol
That's no Madone.
The blue Sidewall of the Schwalbe tires means, that they are exclusively for professional riders. So the normal biker doesent get them.
That madone being more aero than the previous one explanation sounds like complete bullshit to me
taking the fugly bikes tour, I see...
Those bikes looked amazing
@@roadcyclist1 The Pinarello looks like a Dali on one of his worst days, the Dare's head-tube and fork are massive and plain old ugly (and with all tubes being on the thick side, it looks plain old sluggish) and the Trek... oh boy: breaking the lines for that arrow-head combined with Lidl's ugly color-scheme really is horrible for the eye.
Now the SL of the RedBull Team: that's a beautiful bike with nice lines and a great paint-job.
@@pl4free the pinarellos are great in a sea of bikes that all look the same
@@roadcyclist1 They just look more ugly than all the others. P has not made one half-way good-looking frame since they switched from metal to carbon about 20 years ago.
@einundsiebenziger5488 nope. They look fantastic..hence why thousands of people purchase them. You can complain all you want, but there are countless people who love and enjoy them. I know that urks you to no end.
Fact: Y've chosen all the ugly frames of the TdF!
That Dare might not be the ugliest bike ever made but there can't be too many that are/were worse.
God, that is fugly!!
I don't like the new Madone.
Trek's claim of even better aerodynamics? I think not. The main reason is that the Gen 7 has problems with crosswinds, gusts and turbulence, I ride it, I know it. They simply had to respond to the demands of the professional riders, otherwise they would have dropped out of the peloton. That's how Gen 8 was created. But everyone is surprised by the price reduction of Gen 7. I paid 6 weeks ago for ordered and late delivered (7 months waiting) SL 6 Gen 7 by 1500 EUR more than it costs now. I feel cheated and robbed. They must have already known they were going to launch Gen 8, they must have known it would cost less than when Gen 7 launched, and they must have known Gen 7 would come down in price. Yet shamelessly after such a wait they sold me the bike 6 weeks before the sale at full price. In addition, incomplete, with damaged paint, poorly attached derailleur and dry-assembled carbon parts - disgusting.
A huge disgrace to the TREK brand in Europe, destroying the value of the purchased bike.
TREK never again.
Never knew that about the crosswinds - is it that bad
Kind of… kind of… kind of… kind of…
HEAD SLAB
clown bikes
Why dont you ever talk about the brakes? Stopping is important...If you cant stop...you die..😂
Re Waxed chains: they just need to have 2-3 pre-waxed chains for each rider et voilà. These are pro teams with pro mechanics for the BIGGEST bike race in the world so OF COURSE they could have a suitcase filled with pre-waxed chains
I imagine we'll see more teams doing something like this in the future, but the scale of the job the team mechanics have is a lot larger than many realise - most teams have multiple bikes for every rider and it's a big logistical challenge to do things like this, plus there's a cost of replacing quick-links, etc.
If more teams start doing it, though, I'm sure everyone else will have to find ways to make it work rather than be left behind.
Cheers for watching! Simon
every single bike is really ugly, bulky and with nasty angles.
It seems the simplicity and performance benefits of chain waxing is completely lost on this presenter
I wax my own chains! You can read my in-depth guide on the subject here: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain
So, yeah, I'm not saying there aren't benefits to waxing chains, simply that I can why a pro team that's on the road, with huge numbers of bikes to clean and maintain every day, might see it as something of a logistical challenge.
Thanks for watching, Simon
@@bikeradar ...apologies Simon, your mention of team mechanics not bothering with waxed chains because they would be power washing the wax off the chains, presumes they don't have the wherewithal to remove the chain prior to power washing or even have brought freshly waxed chains for each race day for every bike they brought to the race.
@@OriginalTrev No worries. I think it's just worth remembering that removing the chains off every bike, every day, to then re-wax and re-install everything is a massive logistical challenge. The teams have so many bikes to sort, on top of everything else that needs doing every day.
As well as being wasteful of quick-links (no one's going to reuse a quicklink and risk snapping a chain at the Tour), there's also risks of mistakes/errors being made in the process, which could easily negate any potential advantage gained.
I completely get the idea that there are 'easy' gains being left on the table, and it can look like low hanging fruit at a glance, but IMO it's a logistics problem first and foremost.
Teams are looking for ways to overcome this - Lidl-Trek is working with Cyclowax on a new tool that automates the process, for example (more on this in our next video) - but I think it's a bigger challenge than many realise.
I find aero bikes ugly
Where's me new bike? ...it's dare (Mancunian accent)
Manchurian* accent
The 'paintjob' on MVDP's bike looks more like vandalism than a factory design.
For the love of God, get someone who doesn't say 'you know' repeatedly.
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2010 Tour de France PRO Bikes 6.8 kg......Rim brakes, Mechanical groupset !!!! 2024 Tour de France PRO Bikes 8.0 kg ....... Disc Brakes, Electronics....
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More comfortable; faster, more reliable, better braking. It's almost as if all engineering decisions involve comprise and 1.1 or so kg of system weight matter SFA in the grand scheme of things.
@@richardhaselwood9478 "More comfortable" is subjective and in some cases debatable with super-voluminous drop-shaped seatposts and stuff. They are hardly more reliable as the all-internal cable/hose routing is much more finicky and batteries need to be charged, and if any of the proprietary, non-interchangeable parts such as seatposts, stems, spacers and whatnot fails they keep you from riding altogether so your average speed drops to a total zero for days if not weeks because they have to be custom ordered and take so long to be delivered. So of the benefits might serve pros who can maintain speeds where "aero over weight" applies, and they also have professional mechanics who take care of the bikes each and every day. To most recreational riders aero gains, if there are any, are of no use.
@@einundsiebenziger5488 “You hit the nail on the head”
all these bikes are a nightmare to work on compared to their lighter, cheaper, faster and better looking rim brake equivalent specs.
Those bikes are hideous. 8KG? 😲😲You couldn't give me any of them. Let alone in exchange for $15K.
It's almost as if they've used mathematics to work out that the aero savings outweigh the weight penalty. Funny that.
These prices are so because these bikes can re-define time and space. Trek can make an hour last 3590 seconds instead of 3600 ("saves ten seconds per hour"), and Specialized can make one bike go faster than another when both are travelling at the very same speed ("SL8 18 seconds faster at 45 kph than SL7"). Or maybe they just need to pay for the drugs of their coked-out marketing departments.
No new Cannondale System6. Damn!
Don’t be jealous about INEOS!! They will always be the best and with the best bike ever! And that is a fact so suck it cry babies!! And Pogi is a cheater!
That dare bike is disgusting. Cheap carbon frame branded to rip you off
Looks aero AF though
I dunno, I like it
This is one of the dumbest reviews I’ve witnessed. Any team can have a bucket full of pre-waxed race ready chain at a moments notice, in fact that’s the ideal way to do it anyways. This oil chain being the better choice for the tour is a bunch of nonsense.
Hi Matthew, thanks for your comment.
As i've said in replies to other comments on this topic, I think you're underestimating the logistical challenge of having immersively-waxed chains on every bike.
That's not to say it can't be done, but pro mechanics on the road have dozens of bikes/cars/buses/etc. to wash and maintain every single day (on top of everything else they have to do) and so they have to make things as efficient as possible.
Taking the chain off / re-waxing it /reinstalling it every day not only takes time and resource - something which isn't unlimited, even for the richest teams - but it also brings risks in terms of mistakes being made during installation / inconsistencies in shifting between chains / cost of quick links and so on.
It's also worth remembering that many teams have sponsorship arrangements that tie them into using certain lubricants. Ineos is sponsored by Muc-Off, for example, which doesn't do waxed-based lubricants.
I appreciate there are potential gains to be had - I didn't say oil was a better choice, and I even wrote BikeRadar's guide to chain waxing: www.bikeradar.com/advice/workshop/how-to-wax-a-chain - but for a pro team it's not as simple/easy as it looks at face value, in my opinion.
Cheers for watching, Simon