How Targaryen's Would & Still Do R*pe Their Smallfolk 😨
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- Опубликовано: 7 сен 2024
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This short uses evidence from A Game of Thrones, A Clash of Kings, A Storm of Swords, A Feast for Crows, A Dance with Dragons and The Winds of Winter.
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So Queen Alysanne banned it. “Indeed it was until the reign of King Jaehaerys…” Alysanne was the old king’s wife, so make it make sense.
She nagged Jaehaerys until he banned it. Ergo, she banned it.
@@SetsunaKai5 I know what happened. The way he worded it is funky is what I was trying to point out.
@@SetsunaKai5 sounds like a good thing to "nag" about.
@@cthulucalamari2448 Ultimately it depends on whats best for the realm.
The abolishment was lauded by the small folk and resented by the high borne.
Could have even been the deciding reason that the great council ruled that women would be passed over in the line of succession to the throne and ultimately caused the dance to take place.
Every time I think about “law of the first night” I remember Roose Boltons story easily in of the darkest moments for me in the show
What’s the story
@@grey8931 essentialy how Ramsey came to be born, really grim i would google it
@@grey8931 Ramsay’s Mom was a Millers Wife. She married a miller. Roose was hunting one day and saw her and her husband, and he wanted her. He killed her husband, hung him and raped her underneath his corpse. Ramsey was created out of this event.
@@grey8931Ramsey's mother married a miller. They had married without asking for lord Bolton's consent/blessing so he raped her (conceiving Ramsey).
why
I remember in Braveheart he married his bride in secret so this exact same thing wouldn't happen.
One of the many historical inaccuracies of that movie. Still a fun flick though.
@@reverendrico5631 oh sh! T
My bad!
@@ajordan1976 no worries, people think the first night was real but in actuality there is in fact only proof it didn’t exist. It was a horror story peasants told about sick and depraved shit nobles did…in that other country and aren’t you glad we don’t live there.
It likely comes from the fact that often times the nobles could do horrid things to the commoners and just get away with it. Which is a thing that still happens in places in the modern era. One of Sadam Hussain’s son’s was infamous for once having his guards abduct a woman on her honeymoon at a resort and take her to his hotel room, she jumped out a window to escape. Even his own men thought he was irredeemable for that, but he was above the law.
@reverendrico5631 To be clear, it isn't that there's evidence of absence, but rather no evidence that prima nocta was codified. The practice may have occurred, or may simply have been a myth spread by peasants about nobles, foreign or domestic, for varying purposes.
@@burntorangehorn well, yes by my statement alone. But let’s be real, there would be a lot more peasant revolts if this was a real thing. No one would talk about that time the lord sent troops becuse the tax collector randomly got eaten by a bear. It would be story after story of the time the local marriage auditor just mysteriously stabbed himself forty seven times in the penis and no one heard him screaming for the six hours it took him to die.
Sometimes the absence of a thing speaks far louder than any proof of a thing ever could.
Well, the Mad King let Tywin know he'd catch a charge with his wife...Alysanne was long out of the picture by then. R*pe in Westeros seemed to be a male power play used on all women. Wedding night or not, Boltens did it for sport, Lannisters used the act as punishment, and Targaryens did it because they were power drunk. Not surprised.
Well I guess Westeros should have been fine with Rheanyra as the ruler then. Since what happened with Cole was certainly rape on Rheanyra's part. It was most definitely a power play since she was the heir to the throne and he was merely a common born knight turned Kingsguard by that very heir to the throne. Had Cole refused her advances, she could have him executed. Coerced consent is not consent. Rape is just a power play. It has nothing to do with gender, only power.
@@brettbrooks5511 the incident you're referring to, only happens in the show and although I'm not a reader - this is a discussion I've had here in the comments before. In the books, to be plain and simple, Rhaenyra is rejected by a much older Cole AND Ser Crispin still used his position and power to destroy her. In a similar way but no physical action took place between them, Cole used the Rhaenyra's night out as a weapon (in the book) and ran to Alicent because he was offended. He tells Alicent that Rhaenyra tainted his honor when she tired him. Although it was him that rejected her...he used the act as a way of advancing himself by using the hateful emotions of Alicent to become her sworn sword.
Knowing that SA is about power, not the action itself, IMO, it's Cole that took advantage of his position and Rhaenyra. How? I'll explain. Cole was the individual that actually held power over Rhaenyra. A teenage girl returning under the influence of grooming from her Uncle and a night of partying should have NEVER been out for one (Cole's responsibility) and secondly, should have never been touched period by Cole because of his position regardless of an intoxicated girl's advances. That's like having a school teacher watching his drunk student express their desires then saying, let's do this. No! There's still vows and oaths in place to prevent that from happening. Regardless of what that student is going to be, that student didn't hold the power of that position, at that time and Cole should have and could have walked away without recourse. He did in the books, the same outcome occurred.
Consent is having the free mind to accept the responsibility of what is going to happen. Only one person had a free mind between Cole and Rhaenyra that night. It wasn't Rhaenyra. Cole's words were damning enough to damage Rhaenyra because females in Westeros, are seen as second class citizens, regardless of their position. A rumor of indiscretion is a weapon just as dangerous for a woman as it is a man. The rumor was that it was Daemon that took Rhaenyra's maidenhead. It was ONLY after being rejected that Cole ran to Alicent to admit that it was him NOT Daemon that did the deed. Why? Because that common born knight knew that he held useful knowledge that he could use to leverage an advancement for himself. No one knew what actually happened that night. Rhaenyra had already denied it was Daemon but she wasn't believed. Instead, Daemon was sent back to his wife and Cole let Daemon go down for his actions. Cole wasn't a victim, he was very much a willing participant and had the most the gain.
@@indiadecoseytillmanit is hinted at happening in the books too
@@deviousalemanni4235 then I stand corrected. It was my understanding that the much older Cole rejected Rhaenyra and after the rejection that's when she ran into Harwin. Mushroom, might have said she was bedded by Daemon but I'm not sure where that came from. I did not read the content and spoke from information gathered by third party. I apologize for the error. As I said, I understood the book account as previously stated. Thank you for the correction.
I still hold my ground regarding the position of authority.
@@brettbrooks5511 Way to twist the events to fit a narrative buddy.
Most women were “sold” or used for house leverage in these days. Few women married who they desired.
That’s so tru they married for more power or to make alliances with other houses
Mostly the upper classes. The peasants really have nothing to make alliances over anyway.
Not "most." Just the wealthy and/or noble.
The men were sold too please don’t make it like the men were okay with theI as well
@@Mcelly58 Err...men were sold into marriage? I've never heard of a dowry for a groom.
I think the reason it still happened at Dragon Stone is because who are they going to tell the king a sibling of whoever is committing the crime and not only that they have dragons
Targaryens are just so special who wouldn't want to be with them. It's not like they are crazy or anything
Exactly it’s not like most of us with Targaryen blood are skumbags or anything like we were part of a conquering empire that took slaves before we arrived in Westeros or have have killed many for stupid reasons 😂 it is good to see you again Bittersteel hope you’re doing great
@AegonTargaryenthesecond3096 Thank you your grace. It is wonderful to see you again. I hope you are doing Fantastic. And you are one of the best Targaryens of course.
@@aegorbittersteel2154 I’m doing great thanks for asking and thank you for the compliment
Shut up you peasants
Shut up you peasants
Also the mad king: congratulations on your marriage tywin, now I shall deman the right of the first night
Lot of people in the comments thankfully being wrong about "this was a thing in Medieval Europe too" There are to my knowledge no historical records of such a law, the "Prima Nocta" First night as they call it in the movie "Braveheart" was seen as fact in the 1700-1800s but has since then been proven to be a myth multiple times by later scholars.
The Turks did that on the Balkans, even old poems speak of this practice
Why would she be shocked? She knew it was happening and it wasn’t just on Dragonstone. It was just more obvious on Dragonstone because of the whole “dragon seed” thing. Some of them were literally born with white hair when their parents have brown hair.
Queen Alysanne was the old King Jaehaerys’s wife, so saying that it wasn’t until King Jaehaerys reign that the practice was finally abolished in Dragon Stone after claiming that Alysanne managed to abolish it everywhere except Dragon Stone is contradictory and stupid. Since any information regarding the practice of the first night never once mentions King Jaehaerys the Second, it sounds to me like this short is just trying to make shit up.
Honestly if the Targaryens thought in the long run. If they kept track of the hundreds of dragons seeds that had been made by that point of time. Raised them up as new houses under them, and with strategic marriages for strong bloodline to others with magic from Essos and Westeros. When they concurred the 7 kingdoms they could have installed the new Valerian family’s under them as the new Wardens of the kingdoms, been able to trust them with dragons (thus repopulating them) and have there built in loyalty due to raising them up and being blood related.
Then really they wouldn’t be having any of these issues and they will keep the blood strong will significantly reducing the damage due to the inbreeding.
But, the Targaryens were a lower house in the strong hold for a reason, and were honestly not built for ruling for the most part. But thats mainly the few that were born to rule instead of the majority that were made to rule. They were successful despite their ancestors.
I'm confused. So is a Lord able to grape the wife or the other small folk women? Or are other lords allowed to grape the wife to be? Am I missing the mark entirely? I watched this 3 times trying to follow what it's talking about.
It’s the Lord’s Right of the First Night. A tradition wherein when small folk get married, a king or lord of the domain has the right to sleep with the bride before she and groom can consummate the marriage. It’s based on a fabled tradition in real life called Prima Nocta. And yes, the implications are just as horrid as they sound…
The right of the firdt night was a thing considered "normal" in history as well. And myth, my favorite story is that of the irish hero cu chulainn. He married Emer and the king didnt want to insult his hero by sleeping with his new wife but his advisor told him he should because it would other wise upset his people. The advisor promised cu chulainn he would stay with the king and Emer throughout the night promising nothing will happend. Its written the 3 shared a bed and while Emer slept peacefully in between the two men neither of the men slept that night out of fear.
It wasn't a thing ever
The English did this to the scots way back when. They wanted to breed then out.
The English did it to the English and it was a thing in all of Middle Ages in Europe
And now the "Asians" are doing it to them.
Myth made popular by the film ’Braveheart’. That film has a lot to answer for…
No! Ius Primae Noctis Is a false myth, search it up
@@Mario.albanese it's actually not, it's only false that the English did it. The french king Ferdinand the second outlawed this practice back in 14 something.
I mean… depends on the husband and the lord tbh. Like Lyanna probably wouldn’t have minded entertaining Raegar if she’d had to marry Robert 😂
Considering the targaryens had the blood of the gods were considered to have the blood of the gods back then, I doubt a lot of those women were entirely against it
Dragonstone... Beautiful and haunting, but *fcking cursed.* Just like most of House Targaryen.
Some ancient cultures saw I as a blessing
To be honest this is one of the most “fantasy” tradition. It’s like a guarantee for a bastard.
Honestly, I guess that depends on if they’d actually chosen that man to marry in the first place…And depends on the Targaryen.
I think I'm many cases the women would choose neither.
This is basically the concept of the opera Figaro
Total targaryen de.....
Apparently they still do it in the North and the Boltons are not alone in practising it.
They had small folk on dragon stone?
Plenty of them. They're mentioned in the books, but obviously not the show. It takes quite a surrounding economy to manage a castle.
If there was not, than the castle wouldn't be managed, the food wouldn't be cooked, the land wouldn't be profitable...
Umm not true.. think about your last statement..holds true if the marriage is based in love..but marriages were just as often politically arranged as not..so then it was more of the last day of summer before neverending school...
These were the marriages of commoners, not nobles.
Dragon seeds
I'm pretty sure this even happened in history somewhere in many places, and it still baffles me to how such shit cld be tolerated as a norm
I thought this was a joke? The law of the first night
It's wild that you don't get copyright violations for these videos. You say "Did you know in the books..." and then you just read literal passages from Fire and Blood. At least put it in your own words man! 😅
Her husband also didn't really like women's rights😂 and was religious in comparison to others
I'm just highly suspicious of this even being true. I have a feeling the dragon seeds are from something else, some other practice.
Probably some of this, as well as a lot of plain old philandering. Corlys Velaryon and Mouse were probably long-term lovers, which is why I'd love for HotD to at least briefly introduce us to Mouse at some point.
@@burntorangehorn Philandering I was guessing too or just paying prostitutes, but only guessing.
I just think this some more Maester bullshit. I don't watch Hotd, but I heard they play the Maesters pretty straight on. and take their interpretation of events, told by mainly 2 other people, as correct, which is dubious at best. so I don't think you're going to see the actual reason in the show.
You don't know women
Who was doing this? 😂 Vicerys and Daemon’s dad? Or uncles?
Was this law ever a real thing?
Yeah the english lords did it to try and breed the scots out
Probably not a codified law, but possibly a condoned practice. Or it could have been a piece of propaganda that peasants spread about either their own or other nobles.
No really, no.
We don’t really know. There’s references to Prima Nocta being a thing throughout history going back as far as the Babylonians, and multiple historians have tried to prove whether or not it existed, but there’s very little evidence. What evidence there is usually has alternate explanations too, so I think it’s mostly considered a myth. Maybe it happened in some places at certain times in history, but it doesn’t seem like there was ever an actual law anywhere that allowed it.
I stopped caring about got after HBO fumbled season 8. Get outta my feed forever plz.
Read the books and wait for the "Winds of Winter" with the rest of us.
How horrific. I feel bad for the husband’s who have to accept their wives being taken first. Then coming back to them with sloppy seconds. So cruel. Can’t imagine some of those lords were probably brutal. Poor women’s first time with a man and it’s r@pe. Disgusting
What the english did to to scottish
Jesus Christ dude just say "supposedly."
L queen
So abolishing rape is L to you? Are you a predator too?
Sounds like a Braveheart story to me
I can never tell if the audio is just a second away from ending or if the video is just a clip of longer video. The shorts always seem to abruptly end 🥲
Peasant propaganda