You 2 should do a follow-up video covering the other IPAs that you mentioned. Some of them I never even heard of! Don't forget to include milkshake IPA in there 😆
I love Brad's summary: These aren't IPAs, but you should call them that anyway. It's so dishonest to internet nerdism, but so honest to where the industry really is.
I love it when you mention British history. Not everybody is as frank about their past and I’m sure you must have ruffled a few feathers but whatever you do, don’t ever change. That’s why I keep watching.
Exactly. What Russia is doing now in Ukraine is what English did in Ireland or Scotland. They tried to eradicate the Gaelic language, genocide (Highland clearance or Irish famine). Stalin would have been proud
@@kw2142 I don’t disagree with anything you said but I would just add that many countries have a less than pristine past. Here in Spain where I live they celebrate a genocide every year.
IPA as a term is perhaps leaning the same way as “martini”. Just because a cocktail is served in a v-shaped glass and called a martini, doesn’t make it a martini.
I - love - a well made black IPA. For me that needs to be really hop-forward like an IPA with a hint of coffee at the end like a porter. I've had a few good ones. Beer merchants sells the "De La Senne - Brusseleir Zwet IPA", recently Stone brought back theirs, "Sublimely Self-Righteous Black IPA", and that one, is sublime. I'm not sure if you've heard of "beerizer", but it might help you in your search next time around :)
One of the best beers I’ve ever had was a “Devil’s Peak - Black South Easter”. Made out of the Devil’s Peak brewery in Cape Town, South Africa. Sadly, it was a limited run 😕
@@CozzyB you have a right to be wrong ;-) I get where you're at. I just expressed my preferred iteration. By porter you mean more a hint of chocolate? Because I think that wouldn't really work with all hops. I'd say the hint of coffee reinforces the bitter hops. Because by hop forward I don't necessarily mean fruity, but more of a west coast resinous dank hop thing.
I have had several Sour IPA's that definitely meet the IPAness requirement, but often they don't really quite get there. I also wish there were more Black IPA's too, as I really enjoy them.
Black IPA is one of my house beers at the home brewery. Push for chocolate over coffee tones. And crank the orange. Really push for that Jaffa cake/chocolate orange type flavor with a nice smooth bitterness. I love it. Also...turn the chiller back on :)
Interesting discussion that I am broadly in agreement with. Re the Black IPA's I have to shout out St Austell's Proper Black which is definitely hop-forward and nicely balanced with toasty malt and hints of chocolate. A dry finish and definitely sessionable.
A few months ago, I tried a Black IPA from my local microbrewery, JAFB in Wooster, Ohio. Didn't think that I would like it at first, but I was pleasantly surprised. Black IPA is a good bridge if you're going from an IPA to a maltier beer.
@@vaughnsigal4560 One of my favorite local breweries, Great Lakes Brewing Company, makes an imperial red IPA around October. Never had it before, but I'll have to give it a try when it's in season
I love this because I’ve been so frustrated with some beers called IPAs that have no hop character whatsoever. Things like fruited milkshake and sour “IPAs” need a new name because they are not IPA.
Non beer drinkers I know totally equate craft beer and IPA to mean the same thing, so it’s been interesting to see this video and your last back to back
YES!! My wife, bless her soul, will often tell her friends: "ohh my husband likes IPA beers" and I wait until we get home to remind her "not all craft beer is an IPA". The term IPA has become very ubiquitous, in that respect.
I recently had a dual of the Iron Double Black IPA (a DIPA BIPA) by Elusive and its been one of the best beers I've had all year. It had a nice bit of hop characters (and even a bit of juiciness). I'd put BIPAs somewhere in a category of their own because there's nothing else really like them.
Most Schwarzbrot is made with at least some rye flour. That's one of the things that makes them darker than wheat breads. So it makes sense that rye beer tastes like Schwarzbrot to you. Great video, thanks for the great overview of the wide and crazy world of IPAs.
Dryness is so undervalued. I'm so glad Jonny said it early on. If it's not dry it's not traditionally an IPA according to the boffs (and me). IPA is so overused as a marketing term but rarely represents the thing you are drinking. West Coast IPA follows this trend. There's a difference between what us Brits consider an IPA vs. the Americans. That doesn't stop the British breweries using US designations though for £$€. For the British audience it was probably to attract traditional drinkers to something a bit different but in the general wheelhouse, which has good intentions, but it dilutes the meaning. IPA has become the catch-all for something that's better than a traditional, and usually low ABV, pale ale for something that doesn't fall into any other category. Re the Black IPA: Cascadian Dark Ale is what I call them. Black IPA is a marketing term that appeared in the last couple of years, there's 'no such thing' but it help people understand what to expect so I guess it will stick around.
I just grabbed a 12 pack of a brewery's IPAs and one of them was a fantastic Black IPA very hoppy, followed by some roasted notes, and actually a pretty clean finish. It was the first brew I tried from the 21st Amendment Brewery ... I've been impressed by them by this 12 pack.
Two of the best "IPAs" I've ever had were a Black one (Stewart Brewing, original Black IPA from like 10 years back), and a Peach infused New England one (Rocky Ridge - Peach Invasion). Good to see more being discussed here, and a few for me to find and try!
As I am drinking a New Belgium Voodoo Ranger Imperial IPA.I also drink Flying Dog The Truth and at times Loose Cannon Tripple IPA. I've been drininking IPAs for decades. As well as hard ciders. Not into lagers anymore. I would consider a porter once in a while.
Black IPAs are my jam. Sadly not many breweries make them. Here in New Brunswick, Canada, with about 50 or so breweries in the province, there is one brewery that makes a black IPA year round (or mostly). It is decent, and when I need that BIPA fix, I have no other choice but to lean towards that. Of the other breweries, there is maybe 3 or 4 that will do a BIPA once as year as a seasonal, usually in the spring. Everyone has their own idea as to what a BIPA is. I have had them where they are mostly a roasty stout, that is slightly hop forward, to ones that are very hop forward and bitter. To me, the sweet spot lies somewhere in the middle. No so bitter that it is just a dark west coast, and not too little bitterness that it is just an above avg hopped stout. Got to have decent bitternes, pine, grapefruit, roasted notes. Basically a Cascadian Dark Ale (again alludes back to the idea that it was renamed a black IPA just to sell). Local brewery one province over had the best BIPA, but sadly haven't made it in years. I would trade in all the NEIPAs and half of the West IPAs for a good all year round BIPA. Here is an idea for a video, which I am sure you have already thought of. What is a Sour Beer? Reason I say, because you have kettle sour and naturally soured, and then you have the ones that pawn off a supposed kettle sour that is so back sweetened with lactose and/or fruit that the beer is no longer sour, barely tart. Sour beer doesn't have to be so sour that is sucks all the saliva out of your mouth (but I love those as well), but not so fruit forward, or lactose sweetened that it is no longer really a sour either.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Hmmm, pretty sure that is something else. V2 The Meaning of Beer Pitch? If you did a video on sours already, then I have probably seen it then.
I've never had a black IPA but I feel like black styles might be the new trend. At least near me every micro brewery is trying to make a black light/black lager. I've enjoyed some of them but it's just fun to drink.
3 Floyds has some of the best IPAs and Pale Ales in America, but it is virtually impossible to get outside of Indiana, Illinois, Michigan and Wisconsin.
I was really interested to understand what the actual original IPA looked like, so that was useful for knowledge as I feel the world of IPA is now so far from it's origins this was really interesting to see where it came from and where it is now. Would be interesting to know if you think the feedback of the taste of the beer once in the country it was sent to, came back and changed the original 1900's IPA that was sent out?
This is an interesting question. We're hoping to do a history of IPA video in the near future, so will add that to the questions we pose and hopefully answer!
If you’re really interested in what IPA originally was, David, then read Mitch Steele’s book, _IPA: Brewing Techniques, Recipes and the Evolution of India Pale Ale_. That will give you a much fuller understanding and appreciation of historical IPA, and one that is in some disagreement with what was presented in this video.
@@markhamstra1083 Wonderful as Mitch's book is, it is a decade old now - with a lot more information discovered since. In my opinion it also does include some misreadings of the research done by Martyn Cornell and Ron Pattinson.
Overall I choose IPAs less often than in the past and am drinking more lagers. When I do reach for an IPA it's almost always a WCIPA, so going back to my roots in a way. Pizza Port Swami's IPA is a current favorite.
I am sure you guys have had a lot more IPA's than me, but I have yet to drink a better hazy/juicy IPA than those from Toppling Goliath Brewing Co. They were a bit infamous for having one of the best stouts of all time (Kentucky Brunch) but they are known as much for their IPA's as their stouts. Not as popular since they are located in Iowa, but worth a try if you have yet to have their beer. Pseudo Sue and King Sue are especially delicious.
Suggestion for a topic.. Lets talk about what makes a double a double and what makes a double imperial vs just an imperial or a triple it gets confusing. P.S. I am on your Untappd, Hazy Scott
Actually 2 out of my TOP 5 IPA's were Brut IPA's. But yeah, they can be a hit or miss. Unfortunately, in most cases they are a miss and do indeed suck. But when the brewery pulls it off.. Oh mama!
Devil's Advocate on New England Triple IPAs. When you're brewing something at that strength, you're stressing the yeast so much that a big majority of your aromatics are coming from the esters. So while it's certainly heavily hopped, can it truly be called a 'hop forward' style, or is it in fact yeast forward? I'd actually be really interested in someone brewing a 10%+ gruit with New England yeast, bittering with something else and seeing how close just the yeast can get you. Would it be similar but fainter? Or would it be missing all kinds of top notes that throw the balance off completely? I imagine someone on a pilot kit must have tried it somewhere, and the fact we never saw it means it stank. That or I just invented a new style and saved craft beer.
I love how Jonny says this beer is from the best brewery in the UK and its a collab, then he doesn't clarify which one of the two breweries is actually the best one! lol
Haha great video guys! The IPA bug has certainly infected the minds of beer marketing people.. Over here in Sweden they call Sierra Nevada Pale Ale a "session" IPA.... enough said
I second this. Especially taste-wise. I know so many people who say: I don't like beer, because it's bitter. So a video of: What even is beer (taste-wise) would be interesting
I would say an IPA must be an hop forward ale, and I would draw the lines something like this: Classics: English, West Coast, New England, Belgian Definitly an IPA: Brut, «Australian/New Zealand», White/Wheat, Farmhouse/Kveik (yeast driven, but not sour), Red and Rye Still an IPA, but on the edge: Milkshake (as long as there is only lactose adden, no fruit), Cold, Mountain, Brown Not IPA anymore, just marketing: Sour, Brett, Black, Fruited, Pastry or heavily adjuncted Also, any of these sub-styles could be non-alcoholic, session, regular, double, triple or quaduple. But that’s just my way of looking at it, and I’m not the correct answer. And as allways, great video lads!
Actually, an historical IPA was not hop-forward, but was aged to allow the hop character and bitterness to mellow and recede. That aging was in wooden casks, meaning that Brett was definitely part of an historical IPAs secondary fermentation while aging and shipping. So, by one of your “must-haves” and one of your “must-not-haves”, no historical IPA was actually an IPA. Seems problematic.
@@markhamstra1083 Brett would indeed have been a large part of historic IPAs, and yes the bitterness recedes. Which is why we at no point said we were talking about what makes historic or English IPAs. Instead we used it for context when defining modern ones as is attempted here. Let's not confuse the matter.
@@markhamstra1083 I’m sure that’s correct, but I wouldn’t call that an IPA still. It’s kinda the same thing as at some point in time, most beers would have been sour, because of poor sanitation and brewing back in the day, and also much of the beer form the northern part og the world would have had a smoky flavor, because the malts were dried on open flames. But u can’t say every beerstyle is sour and/or smoked, just because that’s how the brew turned out in the past. We have to look at it with somewhat «mordern» eyes at least. But interresting point for sure👍🏼
I knew the why the "IPA" but after/during the long journey did it loose some of the extra hoppyness taste, that is bring it back to the normal ale taste?
Quite the opposite! The brett would have really taken hold and the hop bitterness would not have faded much so it would have been very different to fresher beers back home.
Although Westie’s have taken the backseat to NEIPAs over the past few months, I gotta say I’m a sucker for a hazy boi from Beak, Verdant and Pressure Drop!
I experience IPA fatigue often. There is an overabundance of IPAs on the market and a lot of them simply don't meet the basic criteria so there is a lot of disappointment when expectations are not met. Feels like the term "west coast IPA" can also mean a lot of things these days. Red IPAs and English IPAs are generally quite trustworthy and I am a fan of both styles.
Good video. Ipa had definitely become a marketing term. What's the difference between a session ipa and a pale ale/hazy pale ale? Also some fruited ipas in the supermarket are literally just the equivalent of cider and black. So just beer and black or what ever Robinsons has been added.
Not sure about the cider and black comment - very different ingredients used - but the difference between pale and session IPA has definitely blurred. It used to be that session IPA was drier and more hop forward while pales were a balance of hop and malt... very much not the case any more!
I agree with everyone saying that most beers should get different names instead of an IPA, and it is ofcourse marketing. But I think there's also something positive about calling stuff the same. There will be a lot of people who know a Lagunitas IPA or a Punk IPA walking in a taproom and seeing a lot of different stuff on the board called IPA, which maybe will make them try something else, which in my idea is a good thing. If everything was called differently they probably would go with something within their comfort zone. On a other note: you should really try Kinnegar's Black Bucket. It's a Black Rye IPA (if you want to call it that or not) and it's one of my favourite Black IPA's. Also really enjoy a Red IPA, but I found it hard to find new ones to try here in The Netherlands.
1) I now live across the river from HVB and while sensational they can be palette crushers. 100% agree they are not IPA's however they're capable and do a delightful DH'd 4% pale that is utterly chuggable. They do KILLER 'brunch' IPA's that mimic Mimosas, Pancakes, French Toast, etc and they're fantastic. 2) Johnny, you used the term barelywine when describing the 3X but have myself begun using the term Hop Wine. Especially depending on the MF and hop profile. 3) Black IPA's don't get the love I think they should, most especially during cooler months. They're not as exhausting and can carry enough hop character to satisfy that craving. Maine Beer Co. 4) 'Smoothie' IPA's where lactose, vanilla or most recently marshmallows should be considered. They had a pretty big moment over here and still making their way around. Equilibrium crushes 'em.
I feel like this video should have been filmed over here in the Pacific Northwest! Quite a few black IPAs re-emerging and now we have the true brewer's IPA, the cold IPA! An IPA with a crisper grain bill (rice or corn) fermented with a lager yeast at ale temps. It is a truly crushable IPA even though it still sits at 6-7%. Lots of people trying to mimic what the folks at Wayfinder Beer are doing. Let me know when you are in town and I will show you what IPA is;)
I should mention first I am colourblind 🤣 but can distinguish between a “Pale” colour and Black. If the beer isn’t pale in colour then it isn’t an IPA for me. It’s literally in the name India Pale Ale. Sorry ! 😅
I always associate American IPAs with Cascade Hops, otherwise they're more like British IPAs. I've yet to taste a New England IPA, they say they're IPAs but they're all oated pale ales with the haze coming from the "porridge" suspended in the liquid whereas a hazy IPA gets it's haze from lack of filtration and hop haze.
I like Red IPA that are a little bit more malt forward, than hop forward. It could be due to the fact that I like malt more when it comes to certain styles. I have had Red IPA that were hop forward and a little bitter, but I didn't like them as much. What I am gathering from this video is that I might like English-style IPA and that the Red IPA that I tried that was more malt forward should have been considered an English-Style IPA? I've never tried an English-style IPA before or I don't think I have. I have also tried different "Black IPA" and most of them were hoppy, but lacked that bitter character. I'm just going to say that the beers I tried should have really been called Cascadian Dark Ale than Black IPA.
Well... if you want an English IPA like we have in the UK these days try to find Fullers Bengal Lancer which I expect is exported. If you want to taste something like the original 1800s IPAs your best bet, weirdly, is Orval.
I am old enough to remember when the only IPA freely available was Worthington White Shield. West Coast IPA works for me now, everything else is pizza.
When you pull the Pale out of the term IPA (India PALE Ale), I find it fascinating that a Red or Black Ale can even really use the term IPA. Shouldn't they truly be called an IRA (India Red Ale) and IBA (India Black Ale)? I suppose those aren't as marketable though...
Does it even matter what an IPA is these days? As you mentioned right at the start, a modern IPA isn't the same thing as an original IPA so we've already done away with the meaning. Macro's have even changed what an individual IPA beer is. I hate what Greene King have done to what was one of my late dad's favourite beers. But on the subject of Black IPAs, yes I think they are a thing, and you really need to try my local brewery's edition if you can... Void from Blackened Sun brewery in Milton Keynes. Ok I'm biased, but one of the best I've had.
I love Red IPAs, they should be balanced, malt forward with a hoppy kick. Black IPAs just lack that balance for me. What about white IPAs? How are they different from NEIPAs or Hazy IPAs?
Still not sure why or if NEIPA is truely IPA, just been marketed so well and it's way to late to change it. Webrew do a great cask black IPA, but believe it was dropped from the core to became a seasonal. Sour IPA is a strange one. You get ones that are proper IPA that have been been soured at the end and you get stuff like you tasted. It's a minefield
I’m allergic to milk and the milkshake craze has ruined beer for me. It’s a gamble getting a beer in vt. I wish they had to disclose if they put milk in because they couldn’t brew their beer with haze without it.
Do they not have to!? It is an allergen after all. Just a side note, the lactose isn't about getting haze but about body and sweetness. So look out for beers that say bitter, or dry and you should be fine.
Is De Ranke XX Bitter a Belgian IPA that doesn't call itself that? Burning Sky perhaps the best British brewer - De Ranke perhaps the best Belgian brewer? Time for a collab. I think.
...also the designation 'black IPA' is a contradiction in terms! black can't be pale! But then it's as if many brewers have forgotten what IPA actually stands for. Actually not the brewers, it's the marketers (I've worked with many as a graphic designer). They probably didn't know in the first place. It does annoy me, because it's as if there is very little respect for the drinker's ability to differentiate a style. As far as I'm concerned, it's either the original Burton/London model or a West Coast (a nice variant, using American hops but keeping the spirit). In my opinion, most others, including NEIPAS, should really be defined as other styles. It's not that I don't like those styles, but they are NOT IPAs! Another excellent and intelligent video guys.
At this point I think the term IPA has lost all real meaning. It's just become the default style that craft breweries label their beers with to appeal to a wider market, who may be used to drinking something like punk IPA and would recognise the term IPA on the shelf. I mean if sour or black IPAs are a thing how can the term mean anything? A dark pale ale? Seems silly to me.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Yes, “IPA” has become the marketing term for “fresh, hop-forward beer”. That really does a great disservice to historical IPAs, which were intentionally aged, not served fresh, so that they would not be very hop-forward and bitter. I really wish there were another marketing term for “fresh, hop-forward beer”, but it’s probably far too late for that, so we are stuck with “IPAs” that are not IPAs in any historically accurate sense.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Yeh I know but it was the one thing you guy's didn't mention to the viewers, after all the video title is called "What even is IPA..." Lol 😉 Good video btw Cheers.
i personally dislike NEIPAs and i love WCIPAs and the original English Style, but whatever, to each their own. NEIPAs just aren't what i loved about IPAs, the dry bitterness, the pine notes, the florality.. the only real fruit notes i want in an IPA are citrus tbh.
"It's like a yogurt you've found in the back of your fridge".....yeah, no thanks. I'll have a beer instead. I don't get the need for all the additives and sweeteners. Whatever happened to actual beer?
To be fair, I doubt there are any additives in that beer, and it depends on your definitions if lactose is a sweetner (it is a pure milk sugar). Lactose and fruit have been used in beer for centuries (well, one century in the case of lactose). So historically there's no issue. Flavourwise... some issues.
Sour IPA ? Nah I call them hoppy sour because sour traditionally were not that hoppy so to make them stand appart they are basically exclusively dry hopped kettle sour.
So, here I am, watching a video about how IPAs are made, drinking a 8% Lager called "Natty Daddy"... wishing I had an 11%Triple IPA. Actually, The 8% Natty Daddy by Anheuser-Busch Is not that bad...
Come on then! Which of these do you think shouldn't be called IPAs? Do you agree with Jonny about Black IPA?
You 2 should do a follow-up video covering the other IPAs that you mentioned. Some of them I never even heard of! Don't forget to include milkshake IPA in there 😆
@@justina.6769 oh we will! Plus a video on historic ipa too!
@@justina.6769 Same, I also expected to see milkshake IPA here. Totally on board for a follow-up.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Are Black IPA’s even IPA’s. We seriously need Beer purity laws in Ireland and the UK
@@oscarosullivan4513 purity laws worked for the Germans!
I love Brad's summary: These aren't IPAs, but you should call them that anyway. It's so dishonest to internet nerdism, but so honest to where the industry really is.
I wish I didn't agree with you, but I do.
I love it when you mention British history. Not everybody is as frank about their past and I’m sure you must have ruffled a few feathers but whatever you do, don’t ever change. That’s why I keep watching.
Exactly. What Russia is doing now in Ukraine is what English did in Ireland or Scotland. They tried to eradicate the Gaelic language, genocide (Highland clearance or Irish famine). Stalin would have been proud
@@kw2142 I don’t disagree with anything you said but I would just add that many countries have a less than pristine past. Here in Spain where I live they celebrate a genocide every year.
I didn’t learn anything but I thoroughly enjoyed myself. You two are great together, cheers!
Supermarket: Make us a beer
Brewer: Sure, what do you want?
Supermarket: Do whatever the hell you like but make sure to stick IPA on the can.
Saw the notification and immediately started watching! Often discussing this with friends.
IPA as a term is perhaps leaning the same way as “martini”. Just because a cocktail is served in a v-shaped glass and called a martini, doesn’t make it a martini.
Yes, that was first called a cocktail glass and as recently as 1947 David Embury declared a 'martini was gin, dry vermouth you could taste served 'up'
I - love - a well made black IPA. For me that needs to be really hop-forward like an IPA with a hint of coffee at the end like a porter. I've had a few good ones.
Beer merchants sells the "De La Senne - Brusseleir Zwet IPA", recently Stone brought back theirs, "Sublimely Self-Righteous Black IPA", and that one, is sublime.
I'm not sure if you've heard of "beerizer", but it might help you in your search next time around :)
One of the best beers I’ve ever had was a “Devil’s Peak - Black South Easter”. Made out of the Devil’s Peak brewery in Cape Town, South Africa. Sadly, it was a limited run 😕
@@CozzyB you have a right to be wrong ;-)
I get where you're at. I just expressed my preferred iteration. By porter you mean more a hint of chocolate? Because I think that wouldn't really work with all hops. I'd say the hint of coffee reinforces the bitter hops. Because by hop forward I don't necessarily mean fruity, but more of a west coast resinous dank hop thing.
I have had several Sour IPA's that definitely meet the IPAness requirement, but often they don't really quite get there. I also wish there were more Black IPA's too, as I really enjoy them.
Black IPA is one of my house beers at the home brewery. Push for chocolate over coffee tones. And crank the orange. Really push for that Jaffa cake/chocolate orange type flavor with a nice smooth bitterness. I love it.
Also...turn the chiller back on :)
Interesting discussion that I am broadly in agreement with. Re the Black IPA's I have to shout out St Austell's Proper Black which is definitely hop-forward and nicely balanced with toasty malt and hints of chocolate. A dry finish and definitely sessionable.
A few months ago, I tried a Black IPA from my local microbrewery, JAFB in Wooster, Ohio. Didn't think that I would like it at first, but I was pleasantly surprised. Black IPA is a good bridge if you're going from an IPA to a maltier beer.
I’d argue that a well crafted Red IPA can do the same job if not better
@@vaughnsigal4560 One of my favorite local breweries, Great Lakes Brewing Company, makes an imperial red IPA around October. Never had it before, but I'll have to give it a try when it's in season
That’s a fantastic brewery
I love this because I’ve been so frustrated with some beers called IPAs that have no hop character whatsoever. Things like fruited milkshake and sour “IPAs” need a new name because they are not IPA.
Another GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT episode again,sorry catching up after a long awaited holiday. Brilliantly informative as always cheers 👍🍻
Im glad I chugged a yuengling before watching. Makes the popcorn taste better
Hey hey hey. Easy on the Brüt IPA. We have one as a regular at our taproom called Knuckle Duster and it’s selling well in Nashville.
Great topic and discussion. Cheers
Non beer drinkers I know totally equate craft beer and IPA to mean the same thing, so it’s been interesting to see this video and your last back to back
YES!! My wife, bless her soul, will often tell her friends: "ohh my husband likes IPA beers" and I wait until we get home to remind her "not all craft beer is an IPA".
The term IPA has become very ubiquitous, in that respect.
I recently had a dual of the Iron Double Black IPA (a DIPA BIPA) by Elusive and its been one of the best beers I've had all year. It had a nice bit of hop characters (and even a bit of juiciness). I'd put BIPAs somewhere in a category of their own because there's nothing else really like them.
Most Schwarzbrot is made with at least some rye flour. That's one of the things that makes them darker than wheat breads. So it makes sense that rye beer tastes like Schwarzbrot to you. Great video, thanks for the great overview of the wide and crazy world of IPAs.
Boom! Thanks for the knowledge!
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Back at ya!
Best brewery in the uk burning sky. I might agree👍 do have loads of love for them.
Very cool. Great info!!
Dryness is so undervalued. I'm so glad Jonny said it early on. If it's not dry it's not traditionally an IPA according to the boffs (and me). IPA is so overused as a marketing term but rarely represents the thing you are drinking. West Coast IPA follows this trend.
There's a difference between what us Brits consider an IPA vs. the Americans. That doesn't stop the British breweries using US designations though for £$€. For the British audience it was probably to attract traditional drinkers to something a bit different but in the general wheelhouse, which has good intentions, but it dilutes the meaning.
IPA has become the catch-all for something that's better than a traditional, and usually low ABV, pale ale for something that doesn't fall into any other category.
Re the Black IPA: Cascadian Dark Ale is what I call them. Black IPA is a marketing term that appeared in the last couple of years, there's 'no such thing' but it help people understand what to expect so I guess it will stick around.
I just grabbed a 12 pack of a brewery's IPAs and one of them was a fantastic Black IPA very hoppy, followed by some roasted notes, and actually a pretty clean finish. It was the first brew I tried from the 21st Amendment Brewery ... I've been impressed by them by this 12 pack.
Two of the best "IPAs" I've ever had were a Black one (Stewart Brewing, original Black IPA from like 10 years back), and a Peach infused New England one (Rocky Ridge - Peach Invasion). Good to see more being discussed here, and a few for me to find and try!
great video. I personally love Buxton Brewery's Axe edge IPA
As I am drinking a New Belgium Voodoo Ranger Imperial IPA.I also drink Flying Dog The Truth and at times Loose Cannon Tripple IPA. I've been drininking IPAs for decades. As well as hard ciders. Not into lagers anymore. I would consider a porter once in a while.
St Austell Proper Black springs to mind as a good Black IPA I tried whilst down there 🙂
Black IPAs are my jam. Sadly not many breweries make them. Here in New Brunswick, Canada, with about 50 or so breweries in the province, there is one brewery that makes a black IPA year round (or mostly). It is decent, and when I need that BIPA fix, I have no other choice but to lean towards that. Of the other breweries, there is maybe 3 or 4 that will do a BIPA once as year as a seasonal, usually in the spring.
Everyone has their own idea as to what a BIPA is. I have had them where they are mostly a roasty stout, that is slightly hop forward, to ones that are very hop forward and bitter. To me, the sweet spot lies somewhere in the middle. No so bitter that it is just a dark west coast, and not too little bitterness that it is just an above avg hopped stout.
Got to have decent bitternes, pine, grapefruit, roasted notes. Basically a Cascadian Dark Ale (again alludes back to the idea that it was renamed a black IPA just to sell). Local brewery one province over had the best BIPA, but sadly haven't made it in years.
I would trade in all the NEIPAs and half of the West IPAs for a good all year round BIPA.
Here is an idea for a video, which I am sure you have already thought of.
What is a Sour Beer?
Reason I say, because you have kettle sour and naturally soured, and then you have the ones that pawn off a supposed kettle sour that is so back sweetened with lactose and/or fruit that the beer is no longer sour, barely tart. Sour beer doesn't have to be so sour that is sucks all the saliva out of your mouth (but I love those as well), but not so fruit forward, or lactose sweetened that it is no longer really a sour either.
We have a video for that right here: docs.google.com/document/d/1zeIrLlmR1s6Sw6yv3VgYacx6nbuy-owrSgoSr_HMDWU/edit?usp=sharing
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Hmmm, pretty sure that is something else. V2 The Meaning of Beer Pitch?
If you did a video on sours already, then I have probably seen it then.
LoL. At about 9:33, all the beer tastings hit their brains. Cheers, mates! : )
Gotta come to california and make some content on our craft beer!! Please!!
I've never had a black IPA but I feel like black styles might be the new trend. At least near me every micro brewery is trying to make a black light/black lager. I've enjoyed some of them but it's just fun to drink.
if you can get it over there try kinnegars black bucket bipa, iv never liked bipas but this one is unreal!
I actually had a brown NEIPA last night. Was actually good, though I'm not sure it was really different from a brown ale...
3 Floyds has some of the best IPAs and Pale Ales in America, but it is virtually impossible to get outside of Indiana, Illinois, Michigan and Wisconsin.
My favorite IPA was one I made myself while being a home brewer. One hobby I had to give up.
33acres from Canada BC does an amazing hop forward black ipa
I have never seen that one before. But I have tried their other beers and really enjoyed them.
I was really interested to understand what the actual original IPA looked like, so that was useful for knowledge as I feel the world of IPA is now so far from it's origins this was really interesting to see where it came from and where it is now.
Would be interesting to know if you think the feedback of the taste of the beer once in the country it was sent to, came back and changed the original 1900's IPA that was sent out?
This is an interesting question. We're hoping to do a history of IPA video in the near future, so will add that to the questions we pose and hopefully answer!
If you’re really interested in what IPA originally was, David, then read Mitch Steele’s book, _IPA: Brewing Techniques, Recipes and the Evolution of India Pale Ale_. That will give you a much fuller understanding and appreciation of historical IPA, and one that is in some disagreement with what was presented in this video.
@@markhamstra1083 Wonderful as Mitch's book is, it is a decade old now - with a lot more information discovered since. In my opinion it also does include some misreadings of the research done by Martyn Cornell and Ron Pattinson.
Overall I choose IPAs less often than in the past and am drinking more lagers. When I do reach for an IPA it's almost always a WCIPA, so going back to my roots in a way. Pizza Port Swami's IPA is a current favorite.
LOL to the Brut IPA smackdown. I think the brief Brut craze was my first craft beer "WTF?"
I am sure you guys have had a lot more IPA's than me, but I have yet to drink a better hazy/juicy IPA than those from Toppling Goliath Brewing Co. They were a bit infamous for having one of the best stouts of all time (Kentucky Brunch) but they are known as much for their IPA's as their stouts. Not as popular since they are located in Iowa, but worth a try if you have yet to have their beer. Pseudo Sue and King Sue are especially delicious.
Love Brutt - i have a keg i made and its delicious
The best sub-style: The Milkshake IPA!!!
Suggestion for a topic.. Lets talk about what makes a double a double and what makes a double imperial vs just an imperial or a triple it gets confusing. P.S. I am on your Untappd, Hazy Scott
Actually 2 out of my TOP 5 IPA's were Brut IPA's. But yeah, they can be a hit or miss. Unfortunately, in most cases they are a miss and do indeed suck. But when the brewery pulls it off.. Oh mama!
Devil's Advocate on New England Triple IPAs. When you're brewing something at that strength, you're stressing the yeast so much that a big majority of your aromatics are coming from the esters. So while it's certainly heavily hopped, can it truly be called a 'hop forward' style, or is it in fact yeast forward?
I'd actually be really interested in someone brewing a 10%+ gruit with New England yeast, bittering with something else and seeing how close just the yeast can get you. Would it be similar but fainter? Or would it be missing all kinds of top notes that throw the balance off completely?
I imagine someone on a pilot kit must have tried it somewhere, and the fact we never saw it means it stank. That or I just invented a new style and saved craft beer.
Asking all the big question recently!
What is beer? Will be the next video
I love how Jonny says this beer is from the best brewery in the UK and its a collab, then he doesn't clarify which one of the two breweries is actually the best one! lol
Love to leave you all guessing (I meant Burning Sky!)
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Best technical brewery in the UK
Haha great video guys! The IPA bug has certainly infected the minds of beer marketing people.. Over here in Sweden they call Sierra Nevada Pale Ale a "session" IPA.... enough said
Yikes. That's not accurate at all!
Can you make a video about what even is beer? And explain all the craft beers from there??
I second this. Especially taste-wise. I know so many people who say: I don't like beer, because it's bitter. So a video of: What even is beer (taste-wise) would be interesting
IPA: for when you really want to drink unsweetened iced tea, but are forced to drink beer.
Pollys and elusive done a few black ipas lately. Think some of the kernel stouts can be kinda BIPA.
I would say an IPA must be an hop forward ale, and I would draw the lines something like this:
Classics:
English, West Coast, New England, Belgian
Definitly an IPA:
Brut, «Australian/New Zealand», White/Wheat, Farmhouse/Kveik (yeast driven, but not sour), Red and Rye
Still an IPA, but on the edge:
Milkshake (as long as there is only lactose adden, no fruit), Cold, Mountain, Brown
Not IPA anymore, just marketing:
Sour, Brett, Black, Fruited, Pastry or heavily adjuncted
Also, any of these sub-styles could be non-alcoholic, session, regular, double, triple or quaduple.
But that’s just my way of looking at it, and I’m not the correct answer. And as allways, great video lads!
So just the addition of some orange peel means it's not? Man this is tricky.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel exactly, it’s hard haha, I would probably let that one slide tho
Actually, an historical IPA was not hop-forward, but was aged to allow the hop character and bitterness to mellow and recede. That aging was in wooden casks, meaning that Brett was definitely part of an historical IPAs secondary fermentation while aging and shipping. So, by one of your “must-haves” and one of your “must-not-haves”, no historical IPA was actually an IPA. Seems problematic.
@@markhamstra1083 Brett would indeed have been a large part of historic IPAs, and yes the bitterness recedes. Which is why we at no point said we were talking about what makes historic or English IPAs. Instead we used it for context when defining modern ones as is attempted here. Let's not confuse the matter.
@@markhamstra1083 I’m sure that’s correct, but I wouldn’t call that an IPA still. It’s kinda the same thing as at some point in time, most beers would have been sour, because of poor sanitation and brewing back in the day, and also much of the beer form the northern part og the world would have had a smoky flavor, because the malts were dried on open flames. But u can’t say every beerstyle is sour and/or smoked, just because that’s how the brew turned out in the past. We have to look at it with somewhat «mordern» eyes at least. But interresting point for sure👍🏼
I knew the why the "IPA" but after/during the long journey did it loose some of the extra hoppyness taste, that is bring it back to the normal ale taste?
Quite the opposite! The brett would have really taken hold and the hop bitterness would not have faded much so it would have been very different to fresher beers back home.
Although Westie’s have taken the backseat to NEIPAs over the past few months, I gotta say I’m a sucker for a hazy boi from Beak, Verdant and Pressure Drop!
Stone Brewing makes an excellent Black IPA, which is definitely an IPA: Sublimely Self-Righteous Black IPA
A great beer, and indeed very close to an IPA but I am still unsure IPA is the best word for it
A question worth asking 👍
I experience IPA fatigue often. There is an overabundance of IPAs on the market and a lot of them simply don't meet the basic criteria so there is a lot of disappointment when expectations are not met. Feels like the term "west coast IPA" can also mean a lot of things these days. Red IPAs and English IPAs are generally quite trustworthy and I am a fan of both styles.
Yes West Coast IPA is doing a LOT of work right now - essentially meaning "bitter" American IPA. But it's more than that to me.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Could you do a video on Red Ale
Good video. Ipa had definitely become a marketing term. What's the difference between a session ipa and a pale ale/hazy pale ale?
Also some fruited ipas in the supermarket are literally just the equivalent of cider and black. So just beer and black or what ever Robinsons has been added.
Not sure about the cider and black comment - very different ingredients used - but the difference between pale and session IPA has definitely blurred. It used to be that session IPA was drier and more hop forward while pales were a balance of hop and malt... very much not the case any more!
@@TheCraftBeerChannel was more a dig at the the recent candy kittens brewdog beer. Ipa and back is all it was really
Really surprised to not see a shepherd neame IPA in the tasting list, probably one of the most historically accurate IPA’s around
I agree with everyone saying that most beers should get different names instead of an IPA, and it is ofcourse marketing. But I think there's also something positive about calling stuff the same. There will be a lot of people who know a Lagunitas IPA or a Punk IPA walking in a taproom and seeing a lot of different stuff on the board called IPA, which maybe will make them try something else, which in my idea is a good thing. If everything was called differently they probably would go with something within their comfort zone.
On a other note: you should really try Kinnegar's Black Bucket. It's a Black Rye IPA (if you want to call it that or not) and it's one of my favourite Black IPA's. Also really enjoy a Red IPA, but I found it hard to find new ones to try here in The Netherlands.
1) I now live across the river from HVB and while sensational they can be palette crushers. 100% agree they are not IPA's however they're capable and do a delightful DH'd 4% pale that is utterly chuggable. They do KILLER 'brunch' IPA's that mimic Mimosas, Pancakes, French Toast, etc and they're fantastic.
2) Johnny, you used the term barelywine when describing the 3X but have myself begun using the term Hop Wine. Especially depending on the MF and hop profile.
3) Black IPA's don't get the love I think they should, most especially during cooler months. They're not as exhausting and can carry enough hop character to satisfy that craving. Maine Beer Co.
4) 'Smoothie' IPA's where lactose, vanilla or most recently marshmallows should be considered. They had a pretty big moment over here and still making their way around. Equilibrium crushes 'em.
Awesome as usual. I sense you guys had already had a couple beers before you started filming. 😂
This makes me beer thirsty
What even is Baltic Porter?
What’s the best WC IPA you guys have had in the last few months?
I’ll start with Elusive x Villages Great Tree
ANything by Burnt Mill. Their Get The... series is unreal
@@TheCraftBeerChannel thanks guys, I’ll check them out
I'm a big fan of Ron Pattinson's chart of IPA numbers, which was just all question marks.
I feel like this video should have been filmed over here in the Pacific Northwest! Quite a few black IPAs re-emerging and now we have the true brewer's IPA, the cold IPA! An IPA with a crisper grain bill (rice or corn) fermented with a lager yeast at ale temps. It is a truly crushable IPA even though it still sits at 6-7%. Lots of people trying to mimic what the folks at Wayfinder Beer are doing. Let me know when you are in town and I will show you what IPA is;)
pollys - classic unknown, is a good black ipa
IPA became a term for massive hop addition to anything. Technically is a American barley wine just a triple West coast ? 😅
I should mention first I am colourblind 🤣 but can distinguish between a “Pale” colour and Black. If the beer isn’t pale in colour then it isn’t an IPA for me. It’s literally in the name India Pale Ale. Sorry ! 😅
New sub! Liked 🙏🐸✌️👍
I always associate American IPAs with Cascade Hops, otherwise they're more like British IPAs. I've yet to taste a New England IPA, they say they're IPAs but they're all oated pale ales with the haze coming from the "porridge" suspended in the liquid whereas a hazy IPA gets it's haze from lack of filtration and hop haze.
I like Red IPA that are a little bit more malt forward, than hop forward. It could be due to the fact that I like malt more when it comes to certain styles. I have had Red IPA that were hop forward and a little bitter, but I didn't like them as much. What I am gathering from this video is that I might like English-style IPA and that the Red IPA that I tried that was more malt forward should have been considered an English-Style IPA? I've never tried an English-style IPA before or I don't think I have. I have also tried different "Black IPA" and most of them were hoppy, but lacked that bitter character. I'm just going to say that the beers I tried should have really been called Cascadian Dark Ale than Black IPA.
New Yorker craft beer lover here. Can anyone give me some examples of IPAs that are closest to the original English IPA? I’d love to try one.
Well... if you want an English IPA like we have in the UK these days try to find Fullers Bengal Lancer which I expect is exported. If you want to taste something like the original 1800s IPAs your best bet, weirdly, is Orval.
@@TheCraftBeerChannel thanks! I’ll try both. I’m new to your channel. Great content.
I am old enough to remember when the only IPA freely available was Worthington White Shield. West Coast IPA works for me now, everything else is pizza.
When you pull the Pale out of the term IPA (India PALE Ale), I find it fascinating that a Red or Black Ale can even really use the term IPA. Shouldn't they truly be called an IRA (India Red Ale) and IBA (India Black Ale)? I suppose those aren't as marketable though...
Does it even matter what an IPA is these days? As you mentioned right at the start, a modern IPA isn't the same thing as an original IPA so we've already done away with the meaning.
Macro's have even changed what an individual IPA beer is. I hate what Greene King have done to what was one of my late dad's favourite beers.
But on the subject of Black IPAs, yes I think they are a thing, and you really need to try my local brewery's edition if you can... Void from Blackened Sun brewery in Milton Keynes. Ok I'm biased, but one of the best I've had.
I love Red IPAs, they should be balanced, malt forward with a hoppy kick. Black IPAs just lack that balance for me. What about white IPAs? How are they different from NEIPAs or Hazy IPAs?
Rich Mahogany 🤣🤣🤣
Still not sure why or if NEIPA is truely IPA, just been marketed so well and it's way to late to change it.
Webrew do a great cask black IPA, but believe it was dropped from the core to became a seasonal.
Sour IPA is a strange one. You get ones that are proper IPA that have been been soured at the end and you get stuff like you tasted. It's a minefield
I’m allergic to milk and the milkshake craze has ruined beer for me. It’s a gamble getting a beer in vt. I wish they had to disclose if they put milk in because they couldn’t brew their beer with haze without it.
Do they not have to!? It is an allergen after all. Just a side note, the lactose isn't about getting haze but about body and sweetness. So look out for beers that say bitter, or dry and you should be fine.
Is De Ranke XX Bitter a Belgian IPA that doesn't call itself that?
Burning Sky perhaps the best British brewer - De Ranke perhaps the best Belgian brewer? Time for a collab. I think.
Would LOVE to see that collab. XX Bitter could easily be claimed to be an IPA, save for the hop aroma being very much old world.
Houblon Chouffe is a Belgian example of a Belgian IPA.
...also the designation 'black IPA' is a contradiction in terms! black can't be pale! But then it's as if many brewers have forgotten what IPA actually stands for. Actually not the brewers, it's the marketers (I've worked with many as a graphic designer). They probably didn't know in the first place. It does annoy me, because it's as if there is very little respect for the drinker's ability to differentiate a style. As far as I'm concerned, it's either the original Burton/London model or a West Coast (a nice variant, using American hops but keeping the spirit). In my opinion, most others, including NEIPAS, should really be defined as other styles. It's not that I don't like those styles, but they are NOT IPAs! Another excellent and intelligent video guys.
Basically hipster hoppy malt juice..😁
Do you guys drink the beer on room temperature?
Room temperature? If that room is a cellar, perhaps.
Somebody should make a Reverse IPA like a malt foreward ipa
That's a barley wine!
Have you read the CAMRA and SIBA style definitions ?
puttin some beef on there sir
know how that feels btw not having a dig lol
At this point I think the term IPA has lost all real meaning. It's just become the default style that craft breweries label their beers with to appeal to a wider market, who may be used to drinking something like punk IPA and would recognise the term IPA on the shelf. I mean if sour or black IPAs are a thing how can the term mean anything? A dark pale ale? Seems silly to me.
I think I agree. Just calling it a Hoppy version of a style might be more helpful
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Yes, “IPA” has become the marketing term for “fresh, hop-forward beer”. That really does a great disservice to historical IPAs, which were intentionally aged, not served fresh, so that they would not be very hop-forward and bitter. I really wish there were another marketing term for “fresh, hop-forward beer”, but it’s probably far too late for that, so we are stuck with “IPAs” that are not IPAs in any historically accurate sense.
Peach yogurt!!!!!
Bitter beer/IPA?
Sorry I don't understand the comment?
I=? P=Pale A=Ale
India
@@TheCraftBeerChannel Yeh I know but it was the one thing you guy's didn't mention to the viewers, after all the video title is called "What even is IPA..." Lol 😉 Good video btw
Cheers.
i personally dislike NEIPAs and i love WCIPAs and the original English Style, but whatever, to each their own. NEIPAs just aren't what i loved about IPAs, the dry bitterness, the pine notes, the florality.. the only real fruit notes i want in an IPA are citrus tbh.
"It's like a yogurt you've found in the back of your fridge".....yeah, no thanks. I'll have a beer instead. I don't get the need for all the additives and sweeteners. Whatever happened to actual beer?
To be fair, I doubt there are any additives in that beer, and it depends on your definitions if lactose is a sweetner (it is a pure milk sugar). Lactose and fruit have been used in beer for centuries (well, one century in the case of lactose). So historically there's no issue. Flavourwise... some issues.
had a Green Tea IPA. Random.
Sour IPA ? Nah I call them hoppy sour because sour traditionally were not that hoppy so to make them stand appart they are basically exclusively dry hopped kettle sour.
Nobody wants malt charachter? Well you can just call me Nobody then. Cheers!
So, here I am, watching a video about how IPAs are made, drinking a 8% Lager called "Natty Daddy"... wishing I had an 11%Triple IPA. Actually, The 8% Natty Daddy by Anheuser-Busch Is not that bad...