Exploring the CGC Reholdering Scandal
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- Опубликовано: 26 дек 2023
- I have been noticing a great many RUclips videos posted lately in which people are demonstrating that the books inside of a CGC slab do not match the original book with that same CGC Cert ID#. I believe the books were swapped in the slab and then reholdered at CGC
This made me wonder two things
1) Is book swapping being done to books that are NOT reholdered. and if so
2) how can it be detected and avoided
This video is my exploration of some possibilities. I may be completely wrong.
immaculatecomics.com
“State-of-the-art, tamper-proof cases”. What a joke, CGC.
Grow up. NOTHING made by man is foolproof
Lol everything can be counterfeited from money,gold,cars,clothes etc.
@illuminaticomics2253 the punch bowl is tainted.
Absolutely! It seems like CGC itself was the scam. Lol
I trusted CGC to do 2 things: the first was grade my books so my heirs could use the grades as a tool to know what they are worth and secondly, protect the books. At this point, I may as well skip the grading and just buy heavy duty cases and write my grades on them. This is ultimately going to lead to higher submission costs. I hate this happened.
That's pretty much exactly what I was going to do with my full ASM run. I'm going the same as you. Head duty cases. I think they are called lizards skins but ill most likely just fabricate my own
i trust CGC to deliver terrible Q.C and get worse every year. They always do both. LOVE using CBCS
Protip: your heirs won't care. Just look at what is going on with Hummels and stuff. Next generation doesn't care.
My particular boys are very much into comic book collecting and reading. It warms my heart. ❤️
The solution is to start a graded comic authentication service. The Grading Comic Grading Company Company. You could even slab the slab once it's been authenticated. /s
im copyrighting your idea 👏
I propose we go one step further. The company, along with all employees, are slabbed. Books are entered into a mail slot at the front of the building and once graded, the book owner is informed of the grade but the book never again leaves the plastic encased warehouse. It will be like Biodome but for comic books.
I can only imagine how many people are going through their slabs inspecting every one right now, with the same feeling of despair in their gut as I have in mine
Been so disappointed by so many RUclipsrs. You are a definite exception. You have done the community a great service, keep Broadcasting it loud and clear.
I appreciate that! Thank you so much!
Unfortunately, this scam has been going on for years. It's only now that there's a spotlight being put on it because someone was caught.
any slabbed blue label hulk 181 is probably missing the mvs 🤣💀
Nope. Cracked mine out completely and got it regraded with a bump. Lol. Mine’s legit
the fact you can crack it out at all is a bad look live with the grade you get period @@davidcox6601
@@davidcox6601🍪
Wow, I had an idea that it was being done similar to this! Great work as always Rick. Could you possibly share an image of how the corner posts look after the procedure? That way, the community may know what to look for on affected cases.
This is incredible Rick. I've seen several slabs with warped labels on eBay over the last two years. Thoses provoked enough suspicion to avoid them. Thanks to your video, I'm relieved to haved dodged potentially fraudulent sellers.
Thanks for sharing your experience. I am not sure how the dust will settle on this one but I wonder what the "guarantee" part of the CGC moniker means in this case???
there isnt one which makes anything CGC touched suspect which in turn affects the market @@ImmaculateComics
Hey Rick! That was most insightful and informative...as your videos always are. One of the most popular theories about what was done is the person submitted the books to the re-holder program under the "damaged case" and "label details update/correction" reasons while also requesting a custom label; the custom label request provides an additional reason for the re-holder with the benefit of making the encapsulated book look a bit different when it's done. With this method, they wouldn't have to worry about trying to "repair" the case as that would most definitely raise red flags at CGC...at least we hope it would. However...as always, enjoyed the video and look forward to more! 😃
I suspect you are right about the reholdering, but I also think you don’t actually have to have the book reholdered to make the swap nearly undetectable. Thanks for the kind words!
You are likely right that someone could have already figured out the method you've outlined and used that for some book swaps. However, the situation that has spawned the current awareness and discussions is that the books and labels are different while the certification numbers are the same. The newer labels, usually a custom label, are typically being updated with new information such as noting "newsstand" and/or "mark jeweler", with the census information being updated to match, which has to be done by CGC. A new label can only be obtained through a re-grade or a re-holder request. It was the updated label that caught the attention of "The 9.9 Newsstand" and he noticed the books were different but shared the same certification number. But, what you showed was incredibly informative and, quite frankly, fun to watch! Don't try this at home kids! LOL@@ImmaculateComics
Another reason to avoid slabs. No matter what CGC or other companies do to prevent fraud, the frauders always find a work around. The only solution is to not slab. I’m very much against slabbing. I think it turns a comic book into just a commodity to be passed around, never really looked at or enjoyed. Too many people are overly concerned about the color of a label and a number and never really appreciate the actual book. RAW is the best.
RAW is not the best for everything. And the canard that people who have slabs don't appreciate the comics is really tired. That's what reprints or low-grade copies are for. If you don't have slabs everything will desiccate in collector boxes, like so many comics already have. Look at it this way - if you have an excellent condition silver Morgan dollar, are you going to keep it "raw?" Or are you going to encase it and preserve its beauty and value.
That unfortunately explains how you can get a qualified comic into a blue label case, with the added bonus you then have a good raw comic to send to cgc for grading!!. This makes every marvel stamp era comic in a blue label questionable, also could apply to tazoos comics etc etc. If slabs can be invisibility opened and resealed with just a heat gun and the right glue, nothing is safe except low value slabs that are not worth manipulation!!!. Ouch!!!
I believe CGC watches your other videos, let’s hope they watch this one too! Well done Rick, alarming how easy you made this look.
Thanks! I’ve received some comments that lead me to believe they do watch and I only wish them the best. If I can help them In any way I’ll happily do so for free. No one wants this scandal to occur and even though they were not directly defrauded, CGC is still affected greatly. They should have put more effort into slab security and that’s something I’m sure they’ll put more attention on now. I hope they succeed!
@@ImmaculateComics The sharing of your knowledge is appreciated Rick. I’ve watched most of your uploads and I’ve learnt so much. Thank you!
gosh thanks or the kind words!
I'm sure they got their eyeballs all over this video. Great job!!
This is a great video. Will you please attempt the same thing with a new CBCS slab to see if it's possible with those as well?
Its good you showed how easy. It will force change to happen, at this point who can trust a CGC book.
The true value is in the slab itself, not the book. CGC has truly succeeded.
Sarcasm for those who didn't sense it.
lol
Amazing work!! Unfortunate, but so necessary to show this. Thank you!!!
Thank you. It’s very sad and I hope CGC fixes this problem quickly if they haven’t already!
Does the solvent show up under a black light? -DougC
This is so disconcerting. I have seen people say they didn't know how the books received were a higher grade when they could see issues on the book.
I've seen similar things and we all
Just sort of shrugged and called it a gift. In fact I've seen two
ASM 9.0s side by side by side one was so obviously a much lower grade that the seller was unable to sell it because no one wanted it at that price. It makes me wonder now if it was a “slip n slide” book.
I think people needed to see this with their own eyes to finally believe it could be done. Seeing how easy it was, with just a heat gun and slowly prying is alarming for sure. What additional security features would you recommend CGC use to avoid tampering?
Putting the serial number on the inner bag
@@backroom12 Thats a good idea !
Lazer etch the serial number on every individual part: the label, the inner sleeve, and the outer shell.
All they need to do is put RFID tags inside the books. It's cheap and simple. Problem solved.
@@YurrNextthey do that with casino chips and playing cards, cant see why they couldnt easily implement it in a slabbed book
Absolutely, I think more of these books are just being replaced with lower grade books and being sold on ebay and other places, and the higher grade (now raw again) ones being sent back in to CGC/ CBCS or wherever and its a revolving circle if you have multiple lower grades to swap into a high grade case , doing the sending it back for reholdering is definitely a bit riskier even with the number of books that are being washed thru everyday
You should try this with a CBCS case please.
That's. A good idea. Ill see if I have one!
@@ImmaculateComics if you don't I have one I can donate for science!
What a guy!
@consumetheliving I appreciate that! I'll look when I get home later today
If the owner knows or suspects that the case has been tampered with and does not reveal it, then it would most likely fall under fraud (which can be prosecuted in most states) should they send it in to be reholdered or even sold.
And this is just your results of tinkering for awhile. Now imagine you've done it 100+ times with expertise and skill like the perpetrator probably has.
Seems the quickest way to put a stop to this would be for CGC to stop the reholdering service, effective now. And treat every book as a regrade. Then they would need a way to enforce a embedded/laser etched identifier on the inside of the sleeve/label and case. Resuming reholdering for those that meet the new quality criteria.
go one step further and have an accreditation process to certify graders so people dont have to crack slabs at all
It would help. But you could still abused Mechanical errors.
Submit a legimate 9.8 book. As soon as you get it, swap the book out with a book in lesser condition. Send it back as a Mechanical error for cracked case, debris, etc.
Cgc is going to be forced to redesign their cases and scrutinize submissions, MEs, and reholders.
Unfortunately, what this means for everyone is, cgc is going to raise their prices and books will take much longer to come back.
they need to do so to make sure market is stable otherwise every book they touch is going to be questioned and devalued now whether or not people want to pay for those higher prices and wait longer? market will say over time but CGC reputation is shit for the time being this is what happens when companies dont invest into their business and make it better cuz of the greed monster@@eblanco7605
What about collectors who submit their books to CGC for their own collections, and not to sell? Those folks have invested thousands of dollars in having their collections graded. Now they have to resubmit to CGC and HOPE they get the same grade? How is that fair?
@Jdice03 I think the best course of
Action for those people
Is to reslab for free or at a steep
Discount
Also - the older labels DO NOT have that bend you mentioned - instead there is a sticker on top. So, once again, switching labels CAN also be a “thing”. It happened to me with a Spawn 1 that I sold on eBay . Gonna make a video about how it was done. Great video tho
That's what I was wondering. It seems the older cases were targeted for this scam.
Now is there a way to inspect slabs seeing fraud like how you did here….like would the solvent appear under black light etc? Just curious if there’s a way to tell you did what you did
That is such a great idea. I'll look when I am at my shop next!
My guess is that the offenders got a hold of new unused CGC slabs from the supplier.
Solution would be Lasor etching the inside of the slabs with the CGC serial number during grading.
And, not excepting anymore re-holders without that etching.
"not excepting anymore re-holders without that etching." This solution would cause every single book without laser etching on the inner well (every grading book in existence currently) to either be thought of as fraudulent or needing to be regraded entirely. They can't come up with a solution that would alienate every person who has submitted books to them up to this point.
Nice video. I noticed this flaw last year when I was trying to fix newton rings. If you tweak the case the pins can become dislodged, making the bottom come slightly open. I was then able to completely pull the book out and my jaw dropped with no case damage. I immediately emailed CGC about it, with two followups and got no response. I was going to do a video about it but decided not too because I didn't want to give anyone any ideas. Now, I wish I had done the video and blasted it on YT and IG. I feel like an idiot.
It's funny you say that because I discovered something similar in 2021 and was able to reseal the cases as well. I didn't make a video at that time for the same reason you didn't. However since apparently there are so many of us that stumbled across the same thing it's certain that this problem is much mode widespread than just the books that have been reholdered by CGC.
You are a good man and did the right thing at the time. I wouldnt have shown anything now either if it wasn't already evident that the cat was already out of the bag!
You did the right thing. Personally, I think blasting it out on the the internet would open you up to cgc's team of attorney's and lawsuits you don't need,
You are a genius. If in another video I’d like to see the variance in pin sizes post heat/xylene to differentiate from the normal appearance.
Ty Rick-
That was some great work on how to identify tampered cases.
Thanks!
These cases need color change if tampered with features. the cost of grading with such poor actual security creates loss of trust therefor loss of value.
For the tight shots, you should use the macro settings to keep the focus. Or step back and use the zoom so your depth of field stays deeper. The auto focus was being mean to Nolan.
Tha ks those are good tips. Nolan jist got a new DJI OSMO pocket 3 for Christmas and he needs tips like these!
@@ImmaculateComics We all do.
After all the protections in printed currency we still have counterfeit dollars floating about, and art is replete with forgeries so it's no surprise that someone has gamed this to their advantage. It was a clever method you used. But what do we do about it all now and what damage has it done among the higher value book market, I wonder? I don't blame CGC at all for this but I do think they need to make a statement about it very soon. Great video. Thanks for posting it.
If someone just swaps a book and resells it I don't blame CGC for that. However, if someone swaps a book, a HIGH VALUE book no less, and sends it to CGC to be re-holdered and they do it no questions asked, then yes, I do blame CGC for that.
@@300baud I find it stunningly difficult to believe that CGC or CBCS have no review protocols for reholdering books. There's way too much financial liability in that scenario. In fact, part of the reholdering involves, of I'm not mistaken, a re-evaluation of the submission before they'll re-encapsulate. I believe that's the norm for all books, regardless of value. So, yeah, of it was on CGC then there'd be a problem but it's not so there isn't.
@@coolworldpopculture The books being uncovered are lower graded and qualified books ending up in blue label cases with custom labels, so yes, these fraud books were getting re-holdered by CGC.
Great video, Rick! You're my Fav!
This is an important video all CGC collectors should watch
I have cracked those cases and had them stay completely whole and gotten the comic out. I thought about trying to sell the empty case but decided it would cause scammers to scam so I didn’t.
The easiest fix CGC can apply is 2 things. One is to imprint the numbers on the inner book protective cover. Addition to that, place some kind of cgc sticker over the part where the slab comes apart.
Like a tamper foil sticker that they can fake now
I hope CGC addresses this debacle soon, the amount of more expensive books being sent in for grading must be dropping drastically.
And I want to add one more thing… they need to fix this crap for free and not end up making a profit off their massive mistake
@@offkilter9364 the victims in this debacle are any holders of high priced books graded by CGC. It looks like CGC has reviewed their order forms and disclaimers and will play hard ball, they will wait for the law suits and hold up their disclaimers. I really doubt they will take responsibility for their slab being easy to break into, the community is waiting for something to occur that won’t. It will come down to law suits.
This is a simple fix. You just put RFID tags inside the sealed books. It is easy and cost almost nothing.
how would cracking the case be after gluing the case as you did, would you be able to tell how it cracks back open?
There is actually no glue involved. The solvent dissolves the case case plastic and it is then welded together. So for that reason you must actually break the plastic to separate the twonhslves. If it were glue it would separate at the glue point. In this case the weld point is very strong.
Bravo... I think we need more "white hat hacker" to expose the hack. So CGC will have to be forced to address the problem. I have a few CPR candidates I will try to use your experiment as a launching point. Everyone should re-share and tag #CGC 🖖🏾
Wow that would be great if you and others can validate my experiments! Together we can learn and improve. The best disinfectant is daylight and CGC has been keeping everyone in the dark about their methods and practices. This issue may force some much-needed security improvements.
The black hat hacker should be exposed too so that they can receive community ridicule and so it will make it harder for them to do business, I’m sure they will open under a new name but the community should stay vigilant and expose them each time they do reappear.
What suggestions would you make to cgc to fix this? Can this be done with a cbcs slab? Could dictate where I send my next order!!
Always enlightening 👍
It's 100% fraud if the seller is aware and doesn't disclose the misrepresentation. Whether or not that could be proven is another story though. Thanks for sharing this. For me, this is yet another reason why I do not and will not buy graded books.
I suspect many people feel similarly!
Great video sir! Was talking about this at my LCS today and thought of something. Since it requires heat to open, is there something they could add to the plastic that would cause it to change color if it was heated over a certain temperature? Either something to the plastic itself or a clear film?
You can put iodine crystals in the plastic that turn dark if it is heated!
@ImmaculateComics If it would prevent fraud, it would be worth looking into. Whenever they got a case to re-holder that showed heating occurred, they'd know it would require a full re-grade. Thanks!
Where did you get that Spider-Man neon at?
Love it
I’ve completely given up on graded comics. I have sold graded books, but it’s not worth all the trouble. The cost of grading and the cost of postage to mail a heavier item, offsets what you make on the sale. People never want to pay for higher priced comics. Which makes it harder to sell. If your lucky enough to find a buyer, you really don’t make enough to make it worth it.
It almost forced the lowest price of any graded book to be above the cost of grading and shipping. There's a “plastic tax” on every graded book
which is why ive always said grading is a scam youre asking a third party to SUBJECTIVELY rate your book (there is a finite amount of books that will grade high the rest is junk grading its whats going on in pokemon right now and starting to in sports/non sports cards is the grading of junk for repacks do you think the grading card companies are gonna turn down easy money? nope but it sets a artificial market for crap) i have 2 eyes and a brain i dont need someone else to tell me what it looks like @@ImmaculateComics
Super glue and model cement on cockpits of models may cause misting on the inside. It’s recommended to use pvc glue, it dries clear and doesn’t cause misting.
I was wondering if there was pictures of the suspect cases is there any evidence of condensation?
Great explanation! Thank you! Thought I was subscribed but wasn’t! That’s corrected!
Amazing and incredible information. Just subscribed.
Thanks!
CGC has new cases I’d love to see you Try to get into one of those. Your videos are awesome.
Great vid, Rick!
Thanks!
Nice work Rick! Does that glue have a scent that would be a giveaway?
It's actually a solvent that completely evaporates and leaves no residue of itself behind at all. It just dissolves the plastic so it welds itself together.
Isn’t xylene a paint thinner?
I'm a new collector so forgive my admitted ignorance. I'm confused. If a person has a high grade label, didnt they need to have the book in the first place that got that grade? So why swap at all? And what happened to the book that got the high grade?
Thats the scam. Now they can send in the higher graded book that was removed. More than likely get the same grade. And sell both.
CGC is going to have to recall all of it's cases. There is nothing stopping anyone from doing this to any book. I always thought it was strange how there wasn't a hologram or some sort of seal at the bottom that would detect a break.
Particularly in the high value books!
Haven't read through all the comments. But would this method work for cgc's trading card holders too?
I'm not sure but id love to find out if I can get a trading card holder
Started doing intensive research for few mths on collecting graded vintage comics/ trading cards.
There are too much distrust/ loops to jump through as a collector. If this continues, it will kill the hobby and ones holding the bags
CGC needs to make a statement and needs to stop slabbing books until they have a new case that is truly tamper proof. Though I am not sure if this is really a 100% possible thing
@illuminaticomics2253 I imagine something will be added to the inner plastic sleave and probably a tamper proof sticker of some kind
I was always worried about those inner casings not having any markings on them.
These things need to get treated like cars in how they put the vin number everywhere. These grading companies need to do the same and heat stamp or laser etch the serial number on all four sides of the inner plastic casing. Then if that inner casing has any type of tampering to the case or markings its an automatic regrade.
Also, why do they encapsulate high end dollar books the same as 20 dollar books. Anything worth over 1k should have some sort of metal collar around the slab to prevent this kind of stuff and further protect the book.
Then what happens when a book goes up in value and was below the amount initially? You would still have high dollar books in the lower end case. All books need to be in the same case. A secure one that's tamper proof
I've always thought it was strange we had the same labels for $1 million books as $20, just from how we present them.
@@dta151that's bound to happen, but if you sent in a book knowing it's worth 10k why would CGC encapsulate it in the same manner as a $50 dollar book. There should be some extra security.
Can CGC card slabs can be easily opened as well?
I'm saving up for an FF1 and am getting close - but I won't be buying any CGC graded books until the CGC grading scandal is resolved. As you've so excellently illustrated (the comic community owes you big time!) CGC cases can be fairly easily tampered with and the book switched out - and no one knows how long this has been going on. It would be crazy to plunk down serious cash for a blue label slabbed book that may have missing panels, or even missing pages. This is going to lead to having to have high-dollar books re-graded into a newer, I guess more "tamper-proof" slab (once CGC comes up with one) before people should trust and pay a certain $X for a specific grade. Until then no one should be sending high-value books to CGC to be graded into one of these easy to tamper slabs, nor buying high-value CGC slabbed books. I don't know if CBCS has the same problem. A raw book's condition is actually more reliable and ascertainable than a slabbed one's now!
Tha ks for the kind words. I sincerely hope you can get a cheaper FF1 now without having to pay the “CGC tax”. And really wouldn't you prefer to be able to read the book anyway!? I know I would!
So what happens if you return your slabbed books to CGC? What if they crack open your blue label Fantastic Four #12 only to find there's a page missing that was missing when they graded it the first time, and you had no idea. They can just accuse you of switching the book from another case before you resubmitted it to them. I know that's a paranoid thought to come up with, but anything could happen at this point.
thats actually a really good point. I think they are only accepting books on their list now and I suspect strongly they won't be adding any more books to that list. probably ever.
Rick, What about lazer etching a qr code or serial number on the laminating that surround the comic and on the hard case. Make them matching codes that way each comic that is sealed matches the case its sealed in. Like a cars serial # to the registration or engine block. That seems like a simple fix moving forward...🤔 I'm just becoming more and more of a CBCS fan.
Great video, thanks
You're welcome!
Cool video. Thank you for sharing!!
Thanks for watching!
I wonder if cgc could add a chemical to the four posts that turns black when it’s cracked. And for the reholdering….I think the only way to combat that is for every book that comes to cgc to be graded. Regardless of whether it’s just a reholder or not. If you send a book in it’s going to graded. That would solve that problem right there.
Well that can certainly be done. I think it's just a matter of cost. Clearly cgc should address this in some way. But in the past they have not been very transparent about their inner practices .
Excellent video. When I saw you had looked into this I knew you had figured it out. Perhaps a second hologram that has the label number on it that goes on the internal holder the comic is sealed in. This way if the numbers don’t match you immediately know that you have an issue.
Checking my pins tonight!
There could be tons of mega keys that were tampered with this is just horrible
I suspect that if someone were to get comfortable and experienced with this "slip n slide" method, they would naturally gravitate towards the meg keys. Same risk but a much higher reward.
Why do we assume they are resealing the same case? It shouldn't be too hard to source a box of cases, either taken directly from CGC, sourced from the same supplier, or copied to CGC specs by another manufacturer. There's enough money at stack to make box of CGC cases quite valuable with this scam.
New cases can be bought online by anyone.
@DocReasonable then this should be the obvious method, just move the label and lower grade book to a new case rather than attempting to reseal the old case, which could leave a trace of tampering
The scam is more complicated than that. It's about resubmitting qualified green label books for a higher grade... I'm not going to try explaining it here, check out one of the recent videos that goes into. @@grobi614
Does it pass the black light test? Some collectors use black light at Cons to ascertain slab authenticity. Some dealers don’t like this, some are ok with it.
I will check and let you know!
I think im sending allmof my cgc books to cbcs or egs. Yikes. Great video
Also those cracks you can smash that area and just say it was crushed. Great video.
Thanks 👍
Have you attempted a CBCS case?
Heat is your friend when cracking ive found..
Excellent ❤
Thank you! Cheers!
It seems the books have been going through CGC for re-holdering (sometimes under the guise of adding a custom label). This can be fixed by re-grading all re-holders. If the book falls within the 14 day period for ME fixes, the book should still be re-graded, but at no cost. Otherwise, all re-holders come with re-grading fees. This doesn't solve the problem you just modeled, but it addresses the current scandal. Your scenario is more difficult to solve. The inner sleeve might require identifying labels that can't be removed. Maybe some sort of etching. Otherwise, this might be the beginning of the end of the industry.
I was just thinking about that. I had a book I bought on ebay about six years ago that was cracked during shipping and I never sent it in. Now it will cost me even more to get it replaced.
I’ve always thought that the book might not be the one you sent in or the slab claims to be. This is one of the reasons I don’t collect slabs.
many people have had similar suspicions but I always thought it was just an error at CGC. I once sent in two copies of ASM #41 (first Rhino), and they were swapped in the slabs. One was a 7.5, and the other was a 4.0, and they got them reversed. I called CGC, and the customer service agent expected me to just have the higher grade book in the lower grade case regraded and to leave the 4.0 in the 7.5 case. Their familiarity with this situation led me to suspect that this happens sometimes and that it's just accepted that there are books out in the wild in the wrong case and nobody does anything about it. I don't know that for a fact, but that is my suspicion and its just one more thing to be concerned with.
@@ImmaculateComics that’s ridiculous, it’s not a cheap service you expect certain level of professionalism.
Nice detective work.
Thank you kindly
Hoo boy! This will be interesting. Damn right it's fraud.
So now anyone who has 2 copies of the same book can swap out the lesser grade into the higher graded case. They now have the genuine high grade as a raw, and the fake high grade as a CGC. Obviously this can be done with qualified books such as Hulk #181s without the MVS.
The ones that have been found. CGC should go to the FBI and have them arrested.
Without consequences nothing will change
Are you sure this person doesn't work inside CGC?
@skypatrol716 not sure at all
@@ImmaculateComics maybe we get a MCU docudrama movie out of this along with a comic book release key issue and we start all over 😂
It probably at least work a documentary of our own on RUclips once the dust settles. Someone should be downloading any videos available now in case they get deleted later. There's a chance I get a cease and desist order. I got one years ago when I was exposed that a certain brand of gold balls was selling their $20 per dozen balls for $55 per dozen by just putting a different label on them. The balls are no different at all.@@skypatrol716
Re-holdering obfuscates the real problem that ALL Slabs are now suspect. They didn't need to be re-holdered to be swapped out. Imagine an assembly line of slabs being opened with a heat gun and resealed this way and systematically swapping in lower grades into the holders and submitting the raw book for regrading. Every book ever graded is now in question. We all have wasted our money on slabbed books to this point. The label must be sealed inside the inner seal. That is a million slabs that could have been opened and swapped and no one can tell? This is the end of slabs until the holder is TRULY TAMPER PROOF. We have all been deceived that the slabs were tamper proof. I'm an idiot for believing it.
well done. Having spent deep into 6 figures on slabs, I've got some work to do. Luckily, I think, I only buy 9.8 grails
That is a sobering amount of money on slabs!
@@ImmaculateComics based on the list so far, I’m good. I buy a lot on Heritage and comic link. What a hassle… thank you again for the hard work on this
Great job figuring it out. I thought you’d be the guy to do it. Sad times for collectors though.
Thanks, and really it is worrisome. CGC brought a degree of comfort to online trading that the world really needed. Now, I wonder if that comfort is fully merited.
This is why I ONLY buy RAW comics! Always.
well this and the fact that you can actually red a raw book, lol
If this is in your PC.. don’t forget to polish 😂
CGC needs to look at this vid to see that there tamper proof cases are complete fails
CGC finally has a reason to up their grading prices
I don't know what the solution will be but I feel higher prices will be part of it!
people will eventually not use the service since it feels like they are getting gouged by them doing so @@ImmaculateComics
Isn’t xylene a paint thinner?
if it isnt it certainly could be
@@ImmaculateComicsgreat video I just don’t understand how xylene can glue something. I fancy myself a handyman not a good one though lol. Keep the good work!!’
Hi Michel, it's not obvious, but solvents such as Xylene, toluene, etc, are used as welding agents for acrylic and polycarbonate materials . The solvent dissolves a small amount of the plastic material from moth pieces, which merge together at that interface to form one solid piece. Then the solvent evaporates, and it becomes a sturdy joint!@@Mike_oliver1313
@@ImmaculateComics sir, you’ve just taught me something today thank you
Interesting video.
Thanks for the visit
Ugh that’s scary and a real shame. I hate thieves. Hopefully cgc figures out a fast resolution to this problem.
I suspect they’ll do something quickly. But if their existing slabs cannot be universally trusted I’m not sure how they recover from that. It’s a tough situation that CGC didn’t cause directly but through negligence they are still at fault.
@@ImmaculateComics absolutely. I wonder how many people will be cracking big slabs and making sure they’re complete?
@@gregparks1785 I have an AF15 that is missing a coupon from an interior page that they didn’t catch.
What the heck?? Oh no! @@ImmaculateComics
Switching books in slabs have been going on for years, but the ones they are talking about are sharing the same CGC serial numbers. There shouldn't be multiple books with the same numbers.
There aren't, you're misunderstanding the scam. Different books, same cert #'s
CGC must RE GRADE ANY BOOKS REQUESTED FOR FREE!!
Agreed! They'll go broke, but rightly so.
Really that's true but I can't see that happening.
A flat 1 inch razor blade seems more likely as a pry tool.
good idea. I think this is what makes these videos useful. honest people investigating and defeating the bad actors.
The only solution is...wait for it!, Stop sending comics to CGC.
I suspect strongly that this scandal will temper the eagerness of some people to send their books in.
CGC could solve this very easily. Have the serial number engraved in the plastic that encases the actual comic itself. Then anyone can see that the 2 serial numbers match up
People don't realize just how ruinous this is to comic collecting/investing. Watch how the market tanks even further in the coming months.
I hope you are wrong but I suspect you are right!
It appears as though CGC itself WAS the scam. Lol
In their hubris, laziness, and greed, they lowered their standards until the system broke. all they sold was trust protected by 58 cents worth of plastic. It ends up neither is worth much.
@@ImmaculateComics every word. 👏
Also how much do you wanna bet the former CGC owner knew this was going on before he retired.
That's a good question!
How much you wanna bet the former CGC owner _was the scammer?_
I have no encapsulated comic books. They don't seem like comics anymore when they are in slabs, just big trading cards.Yet another industry ruined by fraudsters and con men, very sad.
100% agree with you. What’s the point of a comic you can’t read. I just use top loaders to protect them.
@jayhays8267 I agree with you too. I believe that CGC's intentions were good when they first started grading books although the ultimate goal of any business is to make profit. They did restoration checks and that gave a lot of collectors peace of mind. But now that they have their own in-house pressing and restoration services they have bastardized the grading industry. Before CGC, amateur restoration was looked down upon and professional restoration by people like Susan Ciccone was generally praised for restoring structural integrity and appearance of important vintage comic books. Once CGC started grading books restoration became a huge issue and was looked down on. Then CGC did a 180° turn in their position on restoration because they decided to offer it as an in-house service. They have reclassified what used to be termed "apparent grade" as actual grade. How can a book be pressed or altered in any way and not considered to have had restoration work done just because CGC did it?! I know A LOT of people are okay with this because they are making money from it. I feel like there are so many less collectors who just buy comics for the love of them now. I don't have a lot of vintage comics but what I do have are raw F/VF to VF/NM condition Silver and Bronze Age books. They are structurally sound with very good eye-appeal. I can afford to purchase one once in a while and I can actually hold a vintage book in my hands and read it. If I create a little defect by reading it then so be it. They are still in much nicer shape than the ones I manhandled when I read them as a child and teenager.
Wow just wow that was easy
Really it's just silly how easy it is, once you know how
Wow someone is really trying to discredit the grading companies. Just go back to raw grading system is what it seems like they are trying to do. One theory.
Remember, part of the appeal to slabbing is protecting the book from UV rays and handling accidents.
@@shepherdsknoll CGC cases have absolutely no UV protection.
@@Inktransfercomics you’re right. A quick check shows only plexiglass does not let UV rays in.
There are several special acrylics that block UV light. Many are also anti-reflective. Museums use them
@@ImmaculateComics I wonder why the grading companies don’t use those acrylics, are they a lot more expensive ?