When I saw you two do the class /subclass specific inspiration i knew you both would have great respect for each other. DC20 is what i wanted 6th edition to be. Exactly how you put it in your video.
I always knew there was something special about that guys. When I first saw him I could instantly tell he was friends with DM lair. They had similar vibes. Kinda "nerdy, but I was one of the cool kids" vibe. Really cool to see he had this cooking for so long. Brilliant brilliant brilliant guy.
I'm glad you have the financial stability to not have to do Adspots, but It sucks that you have to go through Patreon. I know they are the most popular, but it sucks that so much of the money that could go to you, the person who earned the subscriber, goes to the platform.
Watching how absolutely excited he was to talk about his system that he clearly put a ton of work into, and how much joy you could see when people were really liking it on this channel, i really wish i could see his face right now with the 400/20k raised right now lol.
I feel like the DC20 headline for me is "sensible". Like, a version of 5e with a lot of common sense changes and choices that support common fantasies. Like, when I first read 10 Candles my mind was blown, I was inspired by the possibilities; when I saw DC20, my first thought was just "why hasn't WOTC done ALL of this?". Definitely looking forward to switching over
@@jaymohunter5149No, I think he said DC stands for something but the definitive name of the game is dc20, and it's too late to change it by this point
The reaction 4 action system sounds very cool in principle, but what do you do when players stop combat to decide who does what and in what sequence? ( that is, if I understood the 4 action correctly ).
There is an initiative system still - not everything can be done as a reaction. Think of it like 5e reactions, but each takes from the 4 action points you'd normally spend on your upcoming turn, and there is a larger set of things to do as a reaction.
I like most of these ideas. The only one I’m not very keen on is not rolling for damage. I know that the bad moments of rolling low damage after a crit stick in people’s minds, but I also just like rolling dice. Maybe the extra advantages would give me a similar feel.
@@PearseNation This was one of the rules I too wasnt keen on because rolling dice is fun and exciting. I can say after playing a session or two that I didnt miss it as much as I though I would as theres still a fair bit of excitement and anticipation from rolling a 18-19 because I know its directly contributing to the amount of damage I will be doing. Its significantly sped up our combats and feels alot more fast pace which I prefer
Totally gives that feeling! I’ve seen people roll 7d20s and 7d8s it’s heady! Rolling with stacking advantage and help dice really gives the dice goblin in me a good rush!
I really like that the higher you roll, the better the result is, that has always felt like an easy solution to me for skill checks. Like, if they beat it by 1, they succeed, but if they beat it by a huge margin, they get a more exceptional success. This is how Brennan often rules nat 20s in Dimension 20, and Pathfinder has the critical success if you beat a DC by 10 or more. I like this version of it!
My least favorite mechanics in D&D 5E is advantage/disadvantage. Which is why I prefer Rob Schwalb's bane/boon system in Shadow of the Demon Lord/Weird Wizard.
Late last year I thought "I'm going to become patron to Treantmonk and Knights of Last Call in 2024!" but then I had to end my apartment lease, and the move has been rough (as well as way more expensive than I ever imagined I could afford.) I want to support all these projects, maaaybe I can delay subscribing a little but to support DC20.
The crucial question for me is “Will a Roll20-compatible version be released in good time? My gaming group already spans three US States and Canada, with interest from players in the Philippines, UK, & Germany. We can’t play around the same table in person.
DC20 is D&D 4.Pathfinder. DC did say PF was an inspiration but seeing how he sort of reverse engineered 4e conventions and how the community is raving about them while 18 years ago the rage against them actually set the PF crew on the course. 4e had its flaws and they were deep, but seeing the kind of 180 got me thinking. A lot of dndtubers would have been very young when 4e launched, and their first experiences with ttrpg might have been Essentials, so maybe the dim echo of 4e that has emerged in DC20 is part of its charm.
I think the ideal low-level play for me would be starting weak/fragile and having a lot of interesting things to do tbh. This way the party still has the option of starting strong (just start at a higher level) but the game can offer the zeroes to heroes fantasy that starting weak provides, but with a better list of system-defined actions than 5e provides.
Will you be running DC20 one shots after the kickstarter ends? I've already backed it, but it would be nice to also try it out before I try to sell my current play group on it. I would even be fine with and almost expect you to only take players who have the pdf (and this probably backed it)
My problem is, I don't trust Dungeon Coach's design principles. It's been a while since I last took a look at his work but back then it was... rough. He's good at pointing out design flaws but his solutions mostly missed their marks imo. That and there were a few cases where his design was suspiciously similar to other 3rd party content I used, with slight changes that usually made things worse. Now a lot of people are promoting his new system and I can't really trust them to be honest about the product because they are financially involved. I'd be willing to give it a chance if someone completely independent were to review the system.
Have you watched any of the one shots of DC20 play like the one treantmonk did? That can give you some observational data. Now if you just don’t connect with the design, that’s understandable. Not every game is for everyone. However, I will say having played a lot of DC20 it plays pretty well and it’s still being refined! PS I’m not being paid in any way!! Just a fan of DC20.
I REALLY want to see you make character builds for DC20. See what you come up with to break the game. Even though there’s only 2 levels currently, there is still a huge variety of character builds due to the multi class and ancestry systems
Hello! I have some doubts with the system, perhaps anyone here can help me? The system was presented as "we're better 5e" but every video focuses on Player Characters. I haven't seen anything about the DM side of things. Is it easier to run? To make challenges or combat encounters? I worry that I would have to keep track of 4 AP for every enemy and be careful when I make them act outside their turn. I'd rather see NPCs using a different action system than players 😅
TBH I don't mind ad spots on D&D Videos if they're short and relevant. Like, don't pitch me some crappy mobile game but if it's D&D or TTRPG related I'm likely to check it out!
DC20 is and will be the top Fantasy TTRPG of 2025 ❤. I highly recommend to any serious TTRPGer or new person that has always wanted to play D&D or a game like it. ❤
Would LOVE to see you make some DC20 builds. I learn by playing more than reading rules, so by watching a build guide I'll understand the system better.
I'm curious if you intend to support DC20 as a content creator post-launch. I'm a big fan of your channel and I'd love to get your perspective on optimized play once it releases.
I convert monsters from 5e to DC20 all the time. It’s pretty easy in my experience. Pocket Dimension did a fun video on converting their 5e characters to DC20 you might check out. That can take more time.
One person could say that and it would be comparatively shallow: they've emotionally soured on 5e and their _gut reaction_ to DC20 reminds them of 5e. But another person could repeat that sentiment, but backed by significant game design insight and informed preferences between TTRPGs. To be clear, I'm not judging your opinion: I don't know what it _is_ (and preference is just preference sometimes). Do you mind expanding on your thoughts?
Check out the sample rules on the Kickstarter. It might have been inspired by 5e, but it's not 5e. There's only four attributes; skills like Influence, Occultism, and Trickery; 5e's tool proficiencies are now Trades that characters work professionally such as sculpting and lockpicking; instead of expertise in a skill or tool you now have levels of Mastery in language, trade, combat, or skill; you gain skill points like in older editions of d20 systems; hp are based on your level plus class or ancestry (similar to Pathfinder 2e); there's more variety of conditions; and classes have Prestige Paths (similar to 4e). Overall, it's a hodgepodge of different d20 systems merged into one. What people are already pointing out that they don't like is that the racial ancestries aren't all benefits, there are defects attached to them. Again, similar to older editions of d20 systems.
It is not a 5e clone but it is a mashup of several different games. It will appear unique and different to people who only play 5e but most of these elements are borrowed from other systems.
It’s definitely not a 5e clone. Started out with 5e as a springboard but even in the beginning was already evolving beyond that base. Check out the sample rules and you’ll see it’s not a clone. Whether it’s for you or not you’ll have to decide, but I’d hate for you to miss out on a great system for a misunderstanding.
Kickstarter Link: www.kickstarter.com/projects/thedungeoncoach/dc20?ref=1t46o8
I love seeing so many videos from other creators supporting DC20. Even if you're getting paid, that's why this community is so amazing!
Here to checkout all the DC20 videos! Thanks Chris!
Every time I hear of DC20 I think of your one shot. That was fun to watch
Kind of seems like a mashup of 4E, 5E, and Pathfinder 2E. Hopefully the good bits of each.
It also has some of its own special sauce!
When I saw you two do the class /subclass specific inspiration i knew you both would have great respect for each other. DC20 is what i wanted 6th edition to be. Exactly how you put it in your video.
Woot! Go Dungeon Coach! And thanks Treantmonk!
hmm, it's funny how I found DC back before he had 10k subs. It's been interesting to see him grow to this point
back before he had an editor, i actually applied, he went with someone else, but gives you an idea lol
I always knew there was something special about that guys. When I first saw him I could instantly tell he was friends with DM lair. They had similar vibes. Kinda "nerdy, but I was one of the cool kids" vibe.
Really cool to see he had this cooking for so long. Brilliant brilliant brilliant guy.
I really am so glad you cover this system.
I only decided to give this system a try thanks to you, and I am SO glad I did!
Im obsessed with it now!
Thanks for spreading the word for a great TTRPG. I want to see this takeover cause once you play DC20 you don't want to go back to DnD.
I find it interesting how both the MCDM crew and DC20 saw the problem with the To Hit and Damage mechanics and went in opposite directions with it
I'm glad you have the financial stability to not have to do Adspots, but It sucks that you have to go through Patreon. I know they are the most popular, but it sucks that so much of the money that could go to you, the person who earned the subscriber, goes to the platform.
I advise subscribestar, floatplane, utreon or other systems. I've left Patreon for the reasons @ciepah2 says.
"i consider him a friend" i hope he considers you one lol
Watching how absolutely excited he was to talk about his system that he clearly put a ton of work into, and how much joy you could see when people were really liking it on this channel, i really wish i could see his face right now with the 400/20k raised right now lol.
Thanks for sharing this out! Your analysis of DC20 really helped pique my interest in the system!
When do you get action points back? End of Round or end of Turn?
Love to see the DC20 content, much love Chris! Deluxe backer and alt cover here I come!
I feel like the DC20 headline for me is "sensible". Like, a version of 5e with a lot of common sense changes and choices that support common fantasies. Like, when I first read 10 Candles my mind was blown, I was inspired by the possibilities; when I saw DC20, my first thought was just "why hasn't WOTC done ALL of this?". Definitely looking forward to switching over
The coach REALLY needs a better name. DC20 was an okay placeholder, but that's not a name.
It was hinted during a live stream that there might be a name change coming in the near future
@@jaymohunter5149No, I think he said DC stands for something but the definitive name of the game is dc20, and it's too late to change it by this point
Honestly not my thing. Still helping out a friend is always a good thing
The reaction 4 action system sounds very cool in principle, but what do you do when players stop combat to decide who does what and in what sequence? ( that is, if I understood the 4 action correctly ).
When we playtested it happened pretty smoothly
There is an initiative system still - not everything can be done as a reaction. Think of it like 5e reactions, but each takes from the 4 action points you'd normally spend on your upcoming turn, and there is a larger set of things to do as a reaction.
It is clear pretty much who goes when.
Ty for introducing me to DC20 all those months ago. Love that you were able to boost Alan's work.
This is certainly the next evolution of TTRPGs. So pumped! The next campaign I start will be DC20, no looking back
I like most of these ideas. The only one I’m not very keen on is not rolling for damage. I know that the bad moments of rolling low damage after a crit stick in people’s minds, but I also just like rolling dice. Maybe the extra advantages would give me a similar feel.
I could see myself bringing something similar over to my 5e game by adding proficiency based on how much over the d20 roll is.
@@PearseNation This was one of the rules I too wasnt keen on because rolling dice is fun and exciting. I can say after playing a session or two that I didnt miss it as much as I though I would as theres still a fair bit of excitement and anticipation from rolling a 18-19 because I know its directly contributing to the amount of damage I will be doing. Its significantly sped up our combats and feels alot more fast pace which I prefer
Totally gives that feeling! I’ve seen people roll 7d20s and 7d8s it’s heady! Rolling with stacking advantage and help dice really gives the dice goblin in me a good rush!
DC20 looks super cool! It is the only game in the latest wave of upcoming TTRPGs that I am truly excited about playing.
Great video! Cant wait to see the final product
I really like that the higher you roll, the better the result is, that has always felt like an easy solution to me for skill checks. Like, if they beat it by 1, they succeed, but if they beat it by a huge margin, they get a more exceptional success. This is how Brennan often rules nat 20s in Dimension 20, and Pathfinder has the critical success if you beat a DC by 10 or more. I like this version of it!
Damn i would have used the link but i backed already
No worries!
My least favorite mechanics in D&D 5E is advantage/disadvantage. Which is why I prefer Rob Schwalb's bane/boon system in Shadow of the Demon Lord/Weird Wizard.
Late last year I thought "I'm going to become patron to Treantmonk and Knights of Last Call in 2024!" but then I had to end my apartment lease, and the move has been rough (as well as way more expensive than I ever imagined I could afford.) I want to support all these projects, maaaybe I can delay subscribing a little but to support DC20.
The crucial question for me is “Will a Roll20-compatible version be released in good time? My gaming group already spans three US States and Canada, with interest from players in the Philippines, UK, & Germany. We can’t play around the same table in person.
DC20 is D&D 4.Pathfinder. DC did say PF was an inspiration but seeing how he sort of reverse engineered 4e conventions and how the community is raving about them while 18 years ago the rage against them actually set the PF crew on the course.
4e had its flaws and they were deep, but seeing the kind of 180 got me thinking. A lot of dndtubers would have been very young when 4e launched, and their first experiences with ttrpg might have been Essentials, so maybe the dim echo of 4e that has emerged in DC20 is part of its charm.
Anyone know if there will be Foundry support?
I don't, but DC does Q&A streams on his channel, you could ask him.
I think the ideal low-level play for me would be starting weak/fragile and having a lot of interesting things to do tbh. This way the party still has the option of starting strong (just start at a higher level) but the game can offer the zeroes to heroes fantasy that starting weak provides, but with a better list of system-defined actions than 5e provides.
Will you be running DC20 one shots after the kickstarter ends? I've already backed it, but it would be nice to also try it out before I try to sell my current play group on it. I would even be fine with and almost expect you to only take players who have the pdf (and this probably backed it)
This is the first I’m hearing of DC20! Thanks, Chris! PS: really like the new logo/watermark.👌🏼
My problem is, I don't trust Dungeon Coach's design principles. It's been a while since I last took a look at his work but back then it was... rough. He's good at pointing out design flaws but his solutions mostly missed their marks imo. That and there were a few cases where his design was suspiciously similar to other 3rd party content I used, with slight changes that usually made things worse.
Now a lot of people are promoting his new system and I can't really trust them to be honest about the product because they are financially involved. I'd be willing to give it a chance if someone completely independent were to review the system.
I believe there will be a free test package coming out at some point so might be a good opportunity to see for yourself
Tastes vary, it won't be everyone's favorite.
Have you watched any of the one shots of DC20 play like the one treantmonk did? That can give you some observational data. Now if you just don’t connect with the design, that’s understandable. Not every game is for everyone. However, I will say having played a lot of DC20 it plays pretty well and it’s still being refined! PS I’m not being paid in any way!! Just a fan of DC20.
@@jaymohunter5149 A friend of mine has invited me to a playtest session on sunday, so I will give it a shot.
Great summary. Hope to see you optimizing in another DC20 playtest during the beta.
I almost expected you to end the video with your usual catchphrase ending, except with "DC20 is for everyone". 😄
Came here from DND Shorts think i'll look about.
I REALLY want to see you make character builds for DC20. See what you come up with to break the game. Even though there’s only 2 levels currently, there is still a huge variety of character builds due to the multi class and ancestry systems
Hello! I have some doubts with the system, perhaps anyone here can help me?
The system was presented as "we're better 5e" but every video focuses on Player Characters. I haven't seen anything about the DM side of things. Is it easier to run? To make challenges or combat encounters?
I worry that I would have to keep track of 4 AP for every enemy and be careful when I make them act outside their turn. I'd rather see NPCs using a different action system than players 😅
Pledged. They just passed $200,000.
LET'S GOOOOO!
@@TreantmonksTemplethat’s awesome!
$350,000 now!
and now $600,000. If everyone used the TM link, drinks are on Chris!
So pumped for this system!
The only thing I've ever backed on Kickstarter.
I already like the idea of playing a character that only does things on other creature's turns.
i love when awesome TTRPG kickstarters get funded on day one of the campaign
I think he lowballed the goal, because it funded in 3 minutes (it was only $20k). It might be to $300k now, 4 hours after launch
You're the best, Chris!
I'm very hopeful for this system.
Already backed. Really happy to see you covering it.
I really hope the kickstarter sees massive succes. Love seeing your support Chris!
Thanks Treantmonk for introducing me to DC20, I’m haven’t been this excited about a TTRPG in a very long time!
Play tested it tonight and my group had a blast!
TBH I don't mind ad spots on D&D Videos if they're short and relevant. Like, don't pitch me some crappy mobile game but if it's D&D or TTRPG related I'm likely to check it out!
Deluxe package with the dice and that limited edition cover is totally worth. So excited to back it.
More power to Alan. Hope he has good luck.
I enjoy the ttrpg community and their support of eachother.
Thanks to let me find Dc20 with your older video
DC20 is and will be the top Fantasy TTRPG of 2025 ❤. I highly recommend to any serious TTRPGer or new person that has always wanted to play D&D or a game like it. ❤
Can't wait to hear "I'm gonna sit back, relax, and have some fun. DC20 is for everyone!"
Would LOVE to see you make some DC20 builds. I learn by playing more than reading rules, so by watching a build guide I'll understand the system better.
Probably not until the official rules are released, unless I'm in a public playtest or something.
Great! I look forward to your DC20 Beta Reviews
Backed it today. I liked what I saw in the alpha.
I'm curious if you intend to support DC20 as a content creator post-launch. I'm a big fan of your channel and I'd love to get your perspective on optimized play once it releases.
I don't really plan ahead that far. I tend to do videos on whatever I'm feeling passionate about
Dc20 is the system you will wany after 5e
I really hope we don't start getting a lot of videos on DC20 because that's not why I'm here.
Don't worry, I still have my 2 videos this week, this was an extra.
I am super excited for DC 20!
Great respect for you!! :D you are a force on the RPG genre! Keep on keeping on!
Lets go DC20
Pledged. It's at $380k!
Gogo DC20 💜 loved your oneshot! Want to see more!
Anything to not support Hasbro
I really, really like a lot of DC20's ideas!
Backed it, thanks for the link!
I pledged using your link.
Thank you!
Neat, ill back it
Backed it.
How easy is it to convert D&D over?
There will apparently be a conversion guide, but not super easy I would think.
I convert monsters from 5e to DC20 all the time. It’s pretty easy in my experience. Pocket Dimension did a fun video on converting their 5e characters to DC20 you might check out. That can take more time.
Looks to much like just another 5e clone for my liking.
One person could say that and it would be comparatively shallow: they've emotionally soured on 5e and their _gut reaction_ to DC20 reminds them of 5e.
But another person could repeat that sentiment, but backed by significant game design insight and informed preferences between TTRPGs.
To be clear, I'm not judging your opinion: I don't know what it _is_ (and preference is just preference sometimes).
Do you mind expanding on your thoughts?
Check out the sample rules on the Kickstarter. It might have been inspired by 5e, but it's not 5e. There's only four attributes; skills like Influence, Occultism, and Trickery; 5e's tool proficiencies are now Trades that characters work professionally such as sculpting and lockpicking; instead of expertise in a skill or tool you now have levels of Mastery in language, trade, combat, or skill; you gain skill points like in older editions of d20 systems; hp are based on your level plus class or ancestry (similar to Pathfinder 2e); there's more variety of conditions; and classes have Prestige Paths (similar to 4e). Overall, it's a hodgepodge of different d20 systems merged into one.
What people are already pointing out that they don't like is that the racial ancestries aren't all benefits, there are defects attached to them. Again, similar to older editions of d20 systems.
It is not a 5e clone but it is a mashup of several different games. It will appear unique and different to people who only play 5e but most of these elements are borrowed from other systems.
It’s definitely not a 5e clone. Started out with 5e as a springboard but even in the beginning was already evolving beyond that base. Check out the sample rules and you’ll see it’s not a clone. Whether it’s for you or not you’ll have to decide, but I’d hate for you to miss out on a great system for a misunderstanding.