Do you think something could happen to China’s Espacio Lejano ground station in Neuquén? And if there would be a significant impact on the Chinese space exploration program? Let me know what you think! 🤔
Even if the Espacio Lejano ground station may no longer be used for CDSN, this issue can be solved by updating one Yuanwang class tracking ship for deep space & sending it to countries like Brazil. And China can also increase the number of Tianlian relay satellites.
You are late to the news btw mileis government already talked back most of the stuff in his campaign like cutting ties with china and switching to the us dollars 4 days ago 😂😂😂
You forgot bosanaro also was anti china and said he would leave brics, but the second he got elected he switched sides. It was just a ploy to trick the CIA to supporting their election
@@NeostormXLMAX That's not really the same. The US putting pressure on Argentina no to allow the use of the ground station won't be too painful on the Argentinians (I bet the Chinese will not react back). Think about Nordstream 2 with Germany....The Germans did not even open their mouth.
@@QuentinKLEau not the same... the US has military bases in Germany and germans depend on the US economically and now with energy FAR more than argentina does. ironically the us rebuffed argentina's request to be dependent upon american rescue just days ago. because of these, argentina depends even more on the chinese lifeline to it -- the currency swap between china and argentina. alienating china could mean cutting off this lifeline completely since argentina borrowing chinese yuan is pending china's approval... lol
I'm from Argentina. I don't think our new president will be able to do anything about it because not only China is our biggest trading partner but also the entire Argentinean economy is surviving thanks to a debt swap with China. The attitude of Milei is sad to be honest, China's debt swap was by far the biggest international monetary help our country received (at least its terms are much more lenient than the IMF's debt terms we also have, and unlike the IMF's debt they aren't trying to force our internal policies). By the way, the contract is until 2067, and Milei can't break it without the approval of the Congress (and he doesn't have a majority there). So I bet the base will outlive Milei's presidency. He's only 6 days in and already devalued our currency by 50%.
@@bbharatillusion4574Basically our previous government (the Peronists) made a lot of economic blunders, that made the bulk of the population reasonably angry and frustrated, and the more centrist party that was supposed to win and replace them (called Cambiemos) started heavily infighting during the months leading up to the elections and went completely divided (they spent more time attacking each other than attacking the Peronists!). Furthermore, they also chose two completely unlikable candidates. That allowed Milei to come second during the first round (with Massa, the Peronist candidate coming fist). Then during the ballotage round it was like choosing between the guy from the party that was already in power and did everything wrong, or choosing the crazy guy who seems insane but at least is new. People were so fed up that they decided to vote for the crazy guy as a punishment vote. It's honestly very frustrating, I'm very sad for my country.
@@olibeau7955 Thank you for your explanation. Democracy can really screw up the normal people sometimes. Luckily this guy don't have the majority in your Congress. I hope he will wise up very soon so that the normal people will at least have a fighting chance for survival. Whatever what the western media prints, for me, there is no precedent of China debt trap or genocide or imperialistic intention. Only trade and diplomacy is important to them. It is also not easy to transition from a third world country to first world. What everyone seems to forget is China just started their belt and road, space program, high speed train and regional politics 10-15 years ago.. of course there will be misstep but the west discounted all these learning curves.. Lastly, I hope Argentina will prosper and get out of the IMF debts.
I'm Chinese. They're saying we got screwed anyway. We lent the yuan to Argentina so that it could pay off its US dollar debt to the mif. The idea was that Argentina would join Brazil as a member of the BRICS in the future, and that providing aid would maintain friendly and stable relations, but things turned out to be quite the opposite.
There is no way that China haven't thought about this scenario from every angles and have contingencies already in place to deal with it promptly to minimise any bad flow on effects.
I agree that this must have definitely been a consideration when the decision of building the station in Neuquén was taken. If Milei ever does make a move though, I don’t see what China could do in the short to medium term…
Yuan Wang 5 is China's sea going vessel used to monitor and control rockets, satellites and test missiles . I bet the new China Antartica base will host a ground station soon.
@@DongfangHour - making a move is easier said than done. With China, Argentina can cope with its economy and inflation better. Argentina will feel it when China stop buying beef. Beside that, China already has signal communication ship sailing all over the world.
Even if the Espacio Lejano ground station may no longer be used for CDSN, this issue can be solved by updating one Yuanwang class tracking ship for deep space & sending it to countries like Brazil. And China can also increase the number of Tianlian relay satellites.
this signifies china's growing needs to protect her interests overseas, and capabilities of influencing foreign politics... these uncertainties do affect china's interests. no sugar coating can mask that! china needs to recalibrate some her long held principles with a growing power and interests outside chinese border...
Non interference means “democracies” like Argentina Ukraine Canada Netherlands are on their own when the deep state attempts to replace their government with puppets
Thank you for Dongfang Hour. I have been following space for years and only met your channel today. Your research is impeccable and your visuals are totally new to me. Great work and I hope your channel grows and grows.
Milei is a U$ marionette, that's true, and can indeed create some problems for Сhina. But like, Сhina can easily build another deep space ground station in a matter of months. So the answer to your question is no, Argentina cannot threaten Сhina's Space Program.
building a deep space station on foreign soil is by no means an easy task. no way in months, not even in a couple of years! there are ways to mitigate the situation but to be honest they are no easy task...
China has been courting numerous nations around the world for building uplink, telemetry, surveillance capacity. They may not have redundancy in place at the moment, but they do see a strategic imperative to have that capacity in the future.
I suspect China will be developing an alternative … or two. 1… a replacement ground station in a friendly country 2… an orbiting station with a huge super light weight antenna made reasonable due to zero mechanical loads (assembled using their orbiting station then slowly accelerated less than 0.01 G, spiraling away from low earth orbit to escape velocity and Lagrange point) 3… high bandwidth laser based communication at Lagrange point. Laser communication to the moon, earth, earth geostationary orbit, and Mars. A large far infrared mirror is ideal to detect a powerful pulse CO2 laser (10 micron wavelength makes a light weight quarter wavelength mirror easily achievable with thin mirror corrected with adjustable mechanical pressure points). China companies dominate electro optics technical conventions so they should have the expertise
No doubt about it. Absolutely 10000% true. It's why Americans love to spread "democracy" everywhere on the planet so they can install puppets like milea or try to like guiado in Venezuela or that wannabe in Thailand (who was educated in the US with Cia influence) or the one in Iran in 1950s or even saddam (who was hired by Cia to assassinate a former Iraqi president)
CIA is behind the scenes in Argentina politics. Who is the biggest trading partner of Argentina? Who is the biggest warmongering country in Argentina? Argentina citizens want trade with China or join the US to purchase more US military weapons.
CIA is behind the scenes in Argentina politics. Who is the biggest trading partner of Argentina? Who is the biggest warmongering country in Argentina? Argentina citizens have to choose side.
Will an anti-US government in Spain threaten US ground station in Spain? The ANSWER IS A BIG NO!! Same with Argentina. All this are commercial, gov, contract, signing, jobs, money, collaboration, access discussed, done benefit both party. Why this even a question raise is unnecessary. Argentina still need to resolve their economic issue and pay their debt.
The answer is NO. If China doesn't want to rely on other countries because of their political whim, they can build a fleet of ships which house the communication systems and its large antennas and have them stationed anywhere in international waters in the Pacific, Atlantic and/or Indian oceans. Make extra ships so those on station duty can be relieved. If China can build aircraft carriers, they can design and build these ships. What I wonder, Argentina is located in the bottom region of the southern hemisphere. Makes more sense to have had this station in Argintina located in Equador, Columbia, or Panama... or another country c;loser to the equator. But what do I know?
They probably already have some space network in place, but they don't have enough throughput in the southern hemisphere, that is how I understand it. They can probably do it with ships but it would be much more expensive to maintain constant presence somewhere in the ocean.
In the 2010s maybe, but if it becomes evident today, that losing a station can set back the Chinese space program for a few years and potentially secure the US in its race back to the moon, you can bet the US will throw every bit of its weight on Chile to refuse the Chinese.
@@byhyew China always assumes the WORST. I'm quite sure that China at least one or two backups plans if Chili backs out of their COVENANT to China. Not to say, it would be EXTREMELY bad to Chili.
@@bbharatillusion4574and trump tore up the Iran nuke deal that was signed by so many other eu countries, not to mention all the tored up agreements with the native Americans !
@@bbharatillusion4574 China paid Argentine money for that station. Under the terms of the contract, Argentine will need to pay China hundreds of BILLIONS of dollar for contract forfeiture. It won't be pretty for Argentina.
Chinese of course can always not make available yuan currency swaps to Argentina for payments on all those outstanding IMF loans, but the way Javier "El Loco" Milei changed his tune regrading China once reality smacked him in the face is pretty much a guarantee that nothing is going to change with the Espacio Lejano Station...🤣😂🤣😂
Supposedly ally Brazil Fernando de noronha Island would been an asset for Chinese space program ( monitoring station etc) but exclusive use were given to US instead.
I support civilian Space programs and the success of Chinese Space program has forced US government to restart lunar missions. Competition is good for Space exploration also ! I don't know if the US and Chinese space ground stations around the world are also used for intelligence and military purposes. The ship based deep space station could be one of the solution.
The Queqiao relay satellite should solve the communication between the back of the moon and the earth, not the deep space communication network. If China does not have the power like the United States to maintain its overseas control, it may have to consider space-based deep space communication satellite constellations (putting huge pot-lid antennas on satellites).
Building communication satellites and not relaying on Earth is actually better. So if they are pushed to do that, it would be better for them in the long term. It doesn't seem like the US is going to back down from their aggressive stance anytime soon.
The Yaogan series launched a No. 41 star on December 15, 2023. What is different from usual is that most of this series satellites use low Earth orbit (LEO) vehicles with a payload of 4 tons (such as Long March 4C, Long March 2D), this time it is Long March 5 - the geostationary orbit (GEO) payload is 5 tons, and the load capacity for LEO will only be larger. This thing is either very heavy (or very BIG) , or its orbit is very high. I doubt it is the Plan B. PS., the GEO payload of the Long March 5B (that is, the Long March 5 without the second stage) is 25 tons, although you will really dislike that its first stage reenters the atmosphere in an almost random manner.
Think a contract is nevertheless still a legal and binding contract. If the president wants to terminate the contract, then just let view the termination clause as all contract should have these clause.
Interesting. Now knowing before that, this country far away from China plays an important role.............. wait and see how everything play out in the coming 10+/- years. thanks for the info
Except for N. Korea whose main focus military, global cooperation on space exploration is a common human advancement. Unfortunately as noted there is potential for military or at least spying overlap. Still Argentina would be able to keep an eye on China. Even Russia cooperated on the intl space station.
Such a fascinating question, as what seems trivial has much complexity. A reliable DSN is essential, particularly for interplanetary exploration. Location is typically in a desert mountain bowl to avoid radio interference, so really limits terrestrial options. A space-based antenna in Earth orbit is not likely, but one at an Lagrange Point could be an option, however would be size limited. Was thinking China might be able to access the Soviet DSN (Russian DSN), but that too presents challenges. Of the four SDN locations (Crimea, Ukraine, Moscow, Russia, Primorsky Krai, Russia, and Uzbekistan which was never completed before the Soviet collapsed), only Moscow and Primorsky Krai might be reliable options. NASA (US) established it's DSN 65 years ago (1958) and is facing limitations as a growing number of deep space satellites reduce available communication windows. LASER communications was recently tested, which might provide a radio alternative to reaching deep space.
The US is unable to give any legal binding garantee that the next administration will support any agreement signed by a previous administration. This needs an amendment to the US Constitution because, with the US legal system, the US government is legally bind only to the US éconstitution. So if Argentina get a bilateral agreement with the US Government that the US will financially support them for any legal penality caused by canceling a contract with China, another US President can come in and unilaterally revoke that agreement.
This is oxymoron type debate of the weak economic country holding power over economic/manufacture strongest country. we're really talking about the western colonial empire...and argentina was always a part of that. look how good it did that country? "fool me once"
And later Milei is the "facist", literally Only 6 days has happened and Literally You want an Coup Meanwhile you didnt say nothing in the worst 4 years in the argentine democratic history
China is no more communist than the USA. That is all political stupidity. I am confident that China has a healthy trade relationship with not only Argentina but with other countries as well and those relationships will make a strong defense against this anti-China propaganda. China has a healthy private space launch sector that is moving forward. China needs to work hard to develop and implement alternative communication systems.
You're allowed to have your own opinions but they are just that, opinions. If one wants statements to be taken seriously, they should be based in fact. Chinese policies are dictated by marxist-leninist (CPC) positions. They are a communist ruled society with a mixed economy where their small capitalist class is not allowed to organize as a political class and are only allowed to exist for the benefit of the whole society. The US is a fascist nation where the forces of Wall St. are very organized as a political class and use their political system (it was never established for the people, that is a myth) to concentrate wealth to the detriment of the whole society. In essence, the PRC is not a creditor nation. The US is. It's GDP is based on unproductive value. (debt, interest on debt. for example interest on credit card debt.) Humanity would benefit immensely if the american people changed their political and economic system to one where the workers, the ones who generate the value, establish a government for the workers, by the workers. Too much innovation is being hoarded away by the american ruling class when it could be used to propel humanity forward instead of being kept for the 0.05% of the american population. There is nothing to lose with China and the US (when finally freed from Wall St) working together.
@@anonnonames8782 Very naive analysis. You obviously don't own land or houses in the USA. If you don't pay one of the myriad of property taxes on your "owned" land or house, the US government confiscates it. Yes, they TAKE it. This does NOT happen in China or Africa or Greece. Now who is the real communist?
A hypothetical scenario only. He doesn’t have the power to do that in his country. He’s party is a super minority and congress won’t approve it. They’re against him big time. Argentinas are already regretting their decision to elect him as president…………
I dont think Argentina loose cannon president will do anything on past actions with China. but moving forward, it may not be so accommoding on dealing with a govt they think is not pro liberal. Milei had even thank Xi Jinping for his congratulatory message
Argentina is only a small fish in the ocean. The usa is a failing and declining country even if Argentina decides to align itself to the us. It's NO THREAT.
To me he also looks like a puppet... nothing good awaits Argentina with a leader like that. And I can see a puppet form a 100 km. Also it seems "communists" are more problem for him than the inflation and other problems his country has. It's like my house is burning but I say "I don't deal with communists".... who cares... even if all communists suddenly vanish, your house will not stop burning, so more work less talk...
@@douginorlando6260 I know, you see how my comment suddenly disappeared. It seems uncle Sam didn't liked it. But then they say we have freedom of speech and what not. I'm not from the US.
Let's be real. China hasn't done itself any favors here. Unlike NASA, ESA, JAXA, and other space agencies, which are all civilian programs, the Chinese space program answers directly to the People's Liberation Army, and they've been fairly opaque about many of their activities. A typical example is they don't provide many updates about what their various science/exploration missions are doing at the moment, and they often make announcements of some particular activity or achievement only after the fact, rather than before, the way most other space agencies do. Because China's space program is run by the military, everything they do is BY DEFINITION a military project. So questions/suspicions about military or dual-use applications are inevitable, and I would say even reasonable. And the issue of sovereignty on the Argentinian tracking station site where Argentina itself has limited "rights" on its own soil? The terms of the agreement make it sound more like a foreign embassy or military base rather than a civilian scientific or research facility. I can't think of any example of a civilian outpost built by a foreign nation where the host nation has such limited authority over the site. But again, this isn't a civilian outpost. It is run by the military and staffed by military personnel. If China wants to change how its space program is perceived by others, they can spin it off as a completely civilian agency, but something tells me they'll never do that, and that fact alone will speak volumes to outside observers.
You are spewing Western propaganda like you are a paid "journalist'. I wonder if " Space Force" of the USA is a civilian group working for peace, just like the US "Defense Dept" bombing, invading and killing over 10 million people around the world for "peace". Please take your twisted lies and shaft it up where it belongs.
Chinas space program is not different from Russias space program. Russia was invited, almost forced to cooperate on the ISS. China is excluded from any cooperation in space. This exclusion is forced by the US only. Just like Russias exclusion from NATO. This recent UAP coverup shows that the elected US politicians are only for TV and that something evil is actually in control. Some entity is completely out of governments control. This entity controls the US and is definitely against peace in our world. 🚀🏴☠️🎸
Do you think something could happen to China’s Espacio Lejano ground station in Neuquén? And if there would be a significant impact on the Chinese space exploration program? Let me know what you think! 🤔
Even if the Espacio Lejano ground station may no longer be used for CDSN, this issue can be solved by updating one Yuanwang class tracking ship for deep space & sending it to countries like Brazil. And China can also increase the number of Tianlian relay satellites.
You are late to the news btw mileis government already talked back most of the stuff in his campaign like cutting ties with china and switching to the us dollars 4 days ago 😂😂😂
You forgot bosanaro also was anti china and said he would leave brics, but the second he got elected he switched sides.
It was just a ploy to trick the CIA to supporting their election
@@NeostormXLMAX That's not really the same. The US putting pressure on Argentina no to allow the use of the ground station won't be too painful on the Argentinians (I bet the Chinese will not react back). Think about Nordstream 2 with Germany....The Germans did not even open their mouth.
@@QuentinKLEau not the same... the US has military bases in Germany and germans depend on the US economically and now with energy FAR more than argentina does. ironically the us rebuffed argentina's request to be dependent upon american rescue just days ago. because of these, argentina depends even more on the chinese lifeline to it -- the currency swap between china and argentina. alienating china could mean cutting off this lifeline completely since argentina borrowing chinese yuan is pending china's approval... lol
I'm from Argentina. I don't think our new president will be able to do anything about it because not only China is our biggest trading partner but also the entire Argentinean economy is surviving thanks to a debt swap with China. The attitude of Milei is sad to be honest, China's debt swap was by far the biggest international monetary help our country received (at least its terms are much more lenient than the IMF's debt terms we also have, and unlike the IMF's debt they aren't trying to force our internal policies). By the way, the contract is until 2067, and Milei can't break it without the approval of the Congress (and he doesn't have a majority there). So I bet the base will outlive Milei's presidency. He's only 6 days in and already devalued our currency by 50%.
Hello, why do Argentinians elect someone so erratic? I am honestly asking because I feel that Argentinians has given up on reason and good governance
@@bbharatillusion4574Basically our previous government (the Peronists) made a lot of economic blunders, that made the bulk of the population reasonably angry and frustrated, and the more centrist party that was supposed to win and replace them (called Cambiemos) started heavily infighting during the months leading up to the elections and went completely divided (they spent more time attacking each other than attacking the Peronists!). Furthermore, they also chose two completely unlikable candidates. That allowed Milei to come second during the first round (with Massa, the Peronist candidate coming fist). Then during the ballotage round it was like choosing between the guy from the party that was already in power and did everything wrong, or choosing the crazy guy who seems insane but at least is new. People were so fed up that they decided to vote for the crazy guy as a punishment vote.
It's honestly very frustrating, I'm very sad for my country.
I wonder how Argentinians could elect such a horrible and warmongering president in the first place!
@@olibeau7955 Thank you for your explanation. Democracy can really screw up the normal people sometimes. Luckily this guy don't have the majority in your Congress.
I hope he will wise up very soon so that the normal people will at least have a fighting chance for survival.
Whatever what the western media prints, for me, there is no precedent of China debt trap or genocide or imperialistic intention. Only trade and diplomacy is important to them.
It is also not easy to transition from a third world country to first world. What everyone seems to forget is China just started their belt and road, space program, high speed train and regional politics 10-15 years ago.. of course there will be misstep but the west discounted all these learning curves..
Lastly, I hope Argentina will prosper and get out of the IMF debts.
I'm Chinese. They're saying we got screwed anyway. We lent the yuan to Argentina so that it could pay off its US dollar debt to the mif. The idea was that Argentina would join Brazil as a member of the BRICS in the future, and that providing aid would maintain friendly and stable relations, but things turned out to be quite the opposite.
There is no way that China haven't thought about this scenario from every angles and have contingencies already in place to deal with it promptly to minimise any bad flow on effects.
I agree that this must have definitely been a consideration when the decision of building the station in Neuquén was taken.
If Milei ever does make a move though, I don’t see what China could do in the short to medium term…
China could not imagine the negative reactions from around the world
Yuan Wang 5 is China's sea going vessel used to monitor and control rockets, satellites and test missiles . I bet the new China Antartica base will host a ground station soon.
@@DongfangHour - making a move is easier said than done. With China, Argentina can cope with its economy and inflation better. Argentina will feel it when China stop buying beef. Beside that, China already has signal communication ship sailing all over the world.
Can they refuse free cash? I don't think so.
For all economic troubles in Argentina, this is a least concern by Argentina people. But…watching out for CIA or others US agents, NED, NGO🤮👹
Milei Is a puppet of CIA.
I appreciate your work. We rarely get to hear, in English, a more moderated speech on China.
🙂+1🙏
Greetings from Argentina! 阿根廷
Even if the Espacio Lejano ground station may no longer be used for CDSN, this issue can be solved by updating one Yuanwang class tracking ship for deep space & sending it to countries like Brazil. And China can also increase the number of Tianlian relay satellites.
this signifies china's growing needs to protect her interests overseas, and capabilities of influencing foreign politics... these uncertainties do affect china's interests. no sugar coating can mask that! china needs to recalibrate some her long held principles with a growing power and interests outside chinese border...
Non interference means “democracies” like Argentina Ukraine Canada Netherlands are on their own when the deep state attempts to replace their government with puppets
Thank you for Dongfang Hour. I have been following space for years and only met your channel today. Your research is impeccable and your visuals are totally new to me. Great work and I hope your channel grows and grows.
Thanks for your kind words, and welcome to the channel! 🙂
Best to not rely of facilities built on foreign soil.
Milei is a U$ marionette, that's true, and can indeed create some problems for Сhina. But like, Сhina can easily build another deep space ground station in a matter of months. So the answer to your question is no, Argentina cannot threaten Сhina's Space Program.
I remember in the 2015 election When La Campora Sayed than Massa was Literally the US Washington's Embassy Encarnated Candidate 😅
building a deep space station on foreign soil is by no means an easy task. no way in months, not even in a couple of years! there are ways to mitigate the situation but to be honest they are no easy task...
If there's any country that can deal with these kinds of problems, it's China. @@catbertevil750
China has been courting numerous nations around the world for building uplink, telemetry, surveillance capacity. They may not have redundancy in place at the moment, but they do see a strategic imperative to have that capacity in the future.
I suspect China will be developing an alternative … or two.
1… a replacement ground station in a friendly country
2… an orbiting station with a huge super light weight antenna made reasonable due to zero mechanical loads (assembled using their orbiting station then slowly accelerated less than 0.01 G, spiraling away from low earth orbit to escape velocity and Lagrange point)
3… high bandwidth laser based communication at Lagrange point. Laser communication to the moon, earth, earth geostationary orbit, and Mars. A large far infrared mirror is ideal to detect a powerful pulse CO2 laser (10 micron wavelength makes a light weight quarter wavelength mirror easily achievable with thin mirror corrected with adjustable mechanical pressure points). China companies dominate electro optics technical conventions so they should have the expertise
As a Chinese. I wish the Argentinians all the best of luck in difficult times!
This election gives me vibes of CIA doing their job.
No doubt about it. Absolutely 10000% true. It's why Americans love to spread "democracy" everywhere on the planet so they can install puppets like milea or try to like guiado in Venezuela or that wannabe in Thailand (who was educated in the US with Cia influence) or the one in Iran in 1950s or even saddam (who was hired by Cia to assassinate a former Iraqi president)
It is.
CIA is behind the scenes in Argentina politics. Who is the biggest trading partner of Argentina? Who is the biggest warmongering country in Argentina? Argentina citizens want trade with China or join the US to purchase more US military weapons.
CIA is behind the scenes in Argentina politics. Who is the biggest trading partner of Argentina? Who is the biggest warmongering country in Argentina? Argentina citizens have to choose side.
Will an anti-US government in Spain threaten US ground station in Spain? The ANSWER IS A BIG NO!! Same with Argentina. All this are commercial, gov, contract, signing, jobs, money, collaboration, access discussed, done benefit both party. Why this even a question raise is unnecessary. Argentina still need to resolve their economic issue and pay their debt.
China can always shift the station to Venezuela or Brazil.
But that'll take a few years to build, potentially causing trouble of the lunar program.
The answer is NO. If China doesn't want to rely on other countries because of their political whim, they can build a fleet of ships which house the communication systems and its large antennas and have them stationed anywhere in international waters in the Pacific, Atlantic and/or Indian oceans. Make extra ships so those on station duty can be relieved. If China can build aircraft carriers, they can design and build these ships.
What I wonder, Argentina is located in the bottom region of the southern hemisphere. Makes more sense to have had this station in Argintina located in Equador, Columbia, or Panama... or another country c;loser to the equator. But what do I know?
They probably already have some space network in place, but they don't have enough throughput in the southern hemisphere, that is how I understand it. They can probably do it with ships but it would be much more expensive to maintain constant presence somewhere in the ocean.
China should just build a floating city
They can simply move it to chili.
Or Brazil or Peru or Venezula or Paraguay or Uraguay or Columbia, etc etc.
In the 2010s maybe, but if it becomes evident today, that losing a station can set back the Chinese space program for a few years and potentially secure the US in its race back to the moon, you can bet the US will throw every bit of its weight on Chile to refuse the Chinese.
@@byhyew China always assumes the WORST. I'm quite sure that China at least one or two backups plans if Chili backs out of their COVENANT to China. Not to say, it would be EXTREMELY bad to Chili.
*Argentina signed an AGREEMENT*
You can't simply tear up an international agreement like that.
Yes, USA did with Kyoto protocol and Paris accord.. it is whether you can survive the tearing up of agreement..😂
I can only imagine you're being sarcastic😂
@@bbharatillusion4574and trump tore up the Iran nuke deal that was signed by so many other eu countries, not to mention all the tored up agreements with the native Americans !
@@bbharatillusion4574 usa has usd,us military and cia
Argentina?
@@bbharatillusion4574 China paid Argentine money for that station. Under the terms of the contract, Argentine will need to pay China hundreds of BILLIONS of dollar for contract forfeiture. It won't be pretty for Argentina.
Chinese of course can always not make available yuan currency swaps to Argentina for payments on all those outstanding IMF loans, but the way Javier "El Loco" Milei changed his tune regrading China once reality smacked him in the face is pretty much a guarantee that nothing is going to change with the Espacio Lejano Station...🤣😂🤣😂
Always appreciated
It's cool ,if China want stations in the Southern hemisphere, they can come to SA ,an actual partner
longitude matters, it needs to be on the other side of the world
Very informative thanks for the update !
Don't cry for me Argentina.
🎵The truth is I never left you. 🎵 😂😂
Thank you for an excellent analysis
Well done.
Supposedly ally Brazil Fernando de noronha Island would been an asset for Chinese space program ( monitoring station etc) but exclusive use were given to US instead.
Could China not just build a larger antenna in another country in south america??
I didn't know about china's deep space network, thanks for the info!
I support civilian Space programs and the success of Chinese Space program has forced US government to restart lunar missions. Competition is good for Space exploration also ! I don't know if the US and Chinese space ground stations around the world are also used for intelligence and military purposes. The ship based deep space station could be one of the solution.
The Argentine Peso has lost 99% of it's value over the past 10 years. That's mind boggling.
Thank you for your informative update🙏👍🙏
I get necktie-chewing vibes from Milei.
Argentina is poor. Has no Money. And the devaluation is 200 percent. Argentina in Chaos.
The Queqiao relay satellite should solve the communication between the back of the moon and the earth, not the deep space communication network.
If China does not have the power like the United States to maintain its overseas control, it may have to consider space-based deep space communication satellite constellations (putting huge pot-lid antennas on satellites).
Building communication satellites and not relaying on Earth is actually better. So if they are pushed to do that, it would be better for them in the long term. It doesn't seem like the US is going to back down from their aggressive stance anytime soon.
More proxy wars coming
The Yaogan series launched a No. 41 star on December 15, 2023. What is different from usual is that most of this series satellites use low Earth orbit (LEO) vehicles with a payload of 4 tons (such as Long March 4C, Long March 2D), this time it is Long March 5 - the geostationary orbit (GEO) payload is 5 tons, and the load capacity for LEO will only be larger. This thing is either very heavy (or very BIG) , or its orbit is very high. I doubt it is the Plan B.
PS., the GEO payload of the Long March 5B (that is, the Long March 5 without the second stage) is 25 tons, although you will really dislike that its first stage reenters the atmosphere in an almost random manner.
China already stopped performing on the two countries' currency swap agreement as a small warning to Argentina.
Who is going to help Argentina win back Falkland Islands if not China?
@monipenny408 so what is China doing in Gaza?
Any news regarding the Chinese IHP-1 and IHP-2 missions? Are they still going to be launched in 2024?
Think a contract is nevertheless still a legal and binding contract. If the president wants to terminate the contract, then just let view the termination clause as all contract should have these clause.
Interesting. Now knowing before that, this country far away from China plays an important role.............. wait and see how everything play out in the coming 10+/- years. thanks for the info
Except for N. Korea whose main focus military, global cooperation on space exploration is a common human advancement. Unfortunately as noted there is potential for military or at least spying overlap. Still Argentina would be able to keep an eye on China. Even Russia cooperated on the intl space station.
LMAO what an incredible overestimation of Argentina's importance 😂😂😂
Yes, I also think Argentina importance is overestimated.
Such a fascinating question, as what seems trivial has much complexity. A reliable DSN is essential, particularly for interplanetary exploration. Location is typically in a desert mountain bowl to avoid radio interference, so really limits terrestrial options. A space-based antenna in Earth orbit is not likely, but one at an Lagrange Point could be an option, however would be size limited.
Was thinking China might be able to access the Soviet DSN (Russian DSN), but that too presents challenges. Of the four SDN locations (Crimea, Ukraine, Moscow, Russia, Primorsky Krai, Russia, and Uzbekistan which was never completed before the Soviet collapsed), only Moscow and Primorsky Krai might be reliable options.
NASA (US) established it's DSN 65 years ago (1958) and is facing limitations as a growing number of deep space satellites reduce available communication windows. LASER communications was recently tested, which might provide a radio alternative to reaching deep space.
The US is unable to give any legal binding garantee that the next administration will support any agreement signed by a previous administration. This needs an amendment to the US Constitution because, with the US legal system, the US government is legally bind only to the US éconstitution.
So if Argentina get a bilateral agreement with the US Government that the US will financially support them for any legal penality caused by canceling a contract with China, another US President can come in and unilaterally revoke that agreement.
can't china build a station in Chile mainland or chile island in the pacific San Juan Baustita?
This is oxymoron type debate of the weak economic country holding power over economic/manufacture strongest country. we're really talking about the western colonial empire...and argentina was always a part of that. look how good it did that country? "fool me once"
dont worry he will be gone in 4 years, maybe less 🚁
And later Milei is the "facist", literally Only 6 days has happened and Literally You want an Coup Meanwhile you didnt say nothing in the worst 4 years in the argentine democratic history
China is no more communist than the USA. That is all political stupidity. I am confident that China has a healthy trade relationship with not only Argentina but with other countries as well and those relationships will make a strong defense against this anti-China propaganda.
China has a healthy private space launch sector that is moving forward. China needs to work hard to develop and implement alternative communication systems.
China has economic relationships internationally but little to no shared values with the major partners it relies on.
China is still a socialist country and there is nothing wrong with that.
You're allowed to have your own opinions but they are just that, opinions. If one wants statements to be taken seriously, they should be based in fact. Chinese policies are dictated by marxist-leninist (CPC) positions. They are a communist ruled society with a mixed economy where their small capitalist class is not allowed to organize as a political class and are only allowed to exist for the benefit of the whole society. The US is a fascist nation where the forces of Wall St. are very organized as a political class and use their political system (it was never established for the people, that is a myth) to concentrate wealth to the detriment of the whole society. In essence, the PRC is not a creditor nation. The US is. It's GDP is based on unproductive value. (debt, interest on debt. for example interest on credit card debt.) Humanity would benefit immensely if the american people changed their political and economic system to one where the workers, the ones who generate the value, establish a government for the workers, by the workers. Too much innovation is being hoarded away by the american ruling class when it could be used to propel humanity forward instead of being kept for the 0.05% of the american population. There is nothing to lose with China and the US (when finally freed from Wall St) working together.
@@anonnonames8782 Very naive analysis. You obviously don't own land or houses in the USA.
If you don't pay one of the myriad of property taxes on your "owned" land or house, the US government confiscates it.
Yes, they TAKE it. This does NOT happen in China or Africa or Greece. Now who is the real communist?
@@anonnonames8782 if China is communist nation, why is it full of private companies? That is not communism; that is capitalism.
This is unfortunate. It will take multiple years if not 10 to build an alternative.
China Biggest Space Journey in 2025
Last time I heard, Milei has made an abrupt U-turn. As at this point in time, he still doesn't know which direction he's facing. 😂
Didn't China buy some islands in the deep south recently?
How
why couldn't china develop ship-based dss systems?
Too much noise. Antenna belongs on a high mountain within a dessert.
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Hmm I’m not sure a ship could support such a large antenna (35m diameter at Espacio Lejano as opposed to 10-20m on the Yuanwang ships I believe)
what about a floating platform, like a repurposed oil rig? @@DongfangHour
Maybe Brazil can host the station since they are a member of BRICS.
But Brazil joined US led Artemis Accord
Same could be said about American bases around the world
China could just go to Bolivia and build a base there. Or Nicaragua. Or Venezuela. Or cuba. All are friendly to China
Yes, rationally, from an economics standpoint, Chile's president won't upset the Chinese. But he does get his evonomics advice from one of his dogs
A hypothetical scenario only. He doesn’t have the power to do that in his country. He’s party is a super minority and congress won’t approve it. They’re against him big time. Argentinas are already regretting their decision to elect him as president…………
Lmao seeing this 9 months in is pretty funny in hindsight
中国在阿根廷最困难的时候帮助了他，我们不需要更多的回报，只是要求按合同要求旅行义务，如果这都做不到，那么什么奇迹都不可能发生。
5:43 It's not "realpolitics" it's "Realpolitik". It's pronounced as RE-AL politik. Ré-àl. Not "real".
You mean like:
RE - ALter
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One word, Cuba!
Cuba's in the Northern hemisphere. Nor is it particularly good for such a station due to seasonal storms and hurricanes.
Brazil is friendly. Just move it there. No biggie.
interesting!
Latino BoJo.
Argentina ! not even us
Ships.
Wine for friends, rifle for wolves. Simple logic in grown up's world =)
Satellite ships
Argentina has no money now.
I dont think Argentina loose cannon president will do anything on past actions with China. but moving forward, it may not be so accommoding on dealing with a govt they think is not pro liberal. Milei had even thank Xi Jinping for his congratulatory message
Military surveillance is exclusive to U.S apparently!!😂😂😂
Argentina is only a small fish in the ocean. The usa is a failing and declining country even if Argentina decides to align itself to the us. It's NO THREAT.
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China would use Antarctica. Simple.
I guess money can solve the issue.
Rather lack of money ....
There was already too much cash involved, else the smok wouldn't have had the idea to make an issue out of it.
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I'm Currious Tho... Will Miley will be Hailed as Hero or Hailed as Clown for next 5years
Don’t expect the new Argentina leader to do what’s best for Argentina. His allegiance is elsewhere.
To me he also looks like a puppet... nothing good awaits Argentina with a leader like that. And I can see a puppet form a 100 km. Also it seems "communists" are more problem for him than the inflation and other problems his country has. It's like my house is burning but I say "I don't deal with communists".... who cares... even if all communists suddenly vanish, your house will not stop burning, so more work less talk...
Did I say allegiance? I should have said ownership
@@Slav4o911it fits the pattern … just like happened in Philippines, Finland, Canada … etc
@@douginorlando6260 I know, you see how my comment suddenly disappeared. It seems uncle Sam didn't liked it. But then they say we have freedom of speech and what not. I'm not from the US.
milei is basically a brunette boris johnson
this
Argentina can't halt China's space programme
Let's be real. China hasn't done itself any favors here. Unlike NASA, ESA, JAXA, and other space agencies, which are all civilian programs, the Chinese space program answers directly to the People's Liberation Army, and they've been fairly opaque about many of their activities. A typical example is they don't provide many updates about what their various science/exploration missions are doing at the moment, and they often make announcements of some particular activity or achievement only after the fact, rather than before, the way most other space agencies do.
Because China's space program is run by the military, everything they do is BY DEFINITION a military project. So questions/suspicions about military or dual-use applications are inevitable, and I would say even reasonable. And the issue of sovereignty on the Argentinian tracking station site where Argentina itself has limited "rights" on its own soil? The terms of the agreement make it sound more like a foreign embassy or military base rather than a civilian scientific or research facility. I can't think of any example of a civilian outpost built by a foreign nation where the host nation has such limited authority over the site. But again, this isn't a civilian outpost. It is run by the military and staffed by military personnel. If China wants to change how its space program is perceived by others, they can spin it off as a completely civilian agency, but something tells me they'll never do that, and that fact alone will speak volumes to outside observers.
You are spewing Western propaganda like you are a paid "journalist'. I wonder if " Space Force" of the USA is a civilian group working for peace, just like the US "Defense Dept" bombing, invading and killing over 10 million people around the world for "peace". Please take your twisted lies and shaft it up where it belongs.
Chinas space program is not different from Russias space program. Russia was invited, almost forced to cooperate on the ISS. China is excluded from any cooperation in space. This exclusion is forced by the US only. Just like Russias exclusion from NATO.
This recent UAP coverup shows that the elected US politicians are only for TV and that something evil is actually in control. Some entity is completely out of governments control. This entity controls the US and is definitely against peace in our world.
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@@andyjo8268 In other words, you have no counter-argument, so you'll just hurl insults. Got it.
What a bullshit coming from this guy
Argentina is a big joke .
Javier Milei is like Trump, alot of bark, no real bite. because the reality is everyone want peace, and there is nothing to be had by making enemies.
Wake up. Thats not peace what the U$ is doing everywhere around the planet. Not even at home.
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The illusion of wanting to be smarter than the rest of the world makes 'em unable to see how stupid it looks.
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LMAO 😂
Impossible, Argentina has agreements with China, that fully intent to honor.