Cali 5.3/427....Ep # 1, Boring for big sleeves
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- Опубликовано: 15 фев 2024
- we start this project by setting up and boring the block for our custom LA Sleeves
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I like how you hone before the sleeves. Thats a detail most shops would ignore
Definitely
@@powellmachineinc3179yes honing, the rounder the better
I like it because a smooth hone would lead to even more sleeve to block contact and better heat transfer as a result.
Great video 👍 and the information you share with us is priceless 😊
Better heat transfer and less likely to see any galling. 100% worth the effort. Electrolytic uniformity is a thing too.
Give the guy with the camera a pay raise damn good filming, usually with other youtubers there are mostly faces not the things the video is supposed to be about..
Giving a 5 star review for effort.. And 👍👍👍👍👍
Ty, will pass it on
You can learn a ton by listening to this guy. The filming was right on the money. Thanks!
Tyvm
Why would you go to anyone but Daniel? Dude is top notch.
This was a long video for you. THAT'S A GOOD THING!
I love all of the detail and the why and how.
Awesome content!!!
Glad you enjoyed it!
I much prefer the long videos and down in the weeds detail
Really impressed by how much Time & attention you Apply to the most Minute but Important details of your shop Machine work. ....Appreciate you taking time to show & Describe engine important Details that don't appear on some other shop videos.....I uncontrollably Cringe when some guys just Press or Sledgehammer room temperature Interference Fit parts together which has to Needlessly Gall up whatever Prefit work they Might have done.....Your Attention to engine Machine work Details is Impressive & Rare in this world of ever increasing Sloppiness regardless of cost...Thx for showing How the job Should be performed Correctly.....
Thank you sir!! We really appreciate that
Great to see a man that putts the thought and effort in to perfect his craft. Also I personally realize the thought and parts choices to get the job done as best he can do with what's available out there today. This is an example of a man that puts just as much thought into a build as far as machine work and parts as he does to get the best possible outcome over all. You don't run across guys that do this type before thought ìn this field of work hardly ever any more. A master at his craft for sure.
Hearing you speak bring back memories of my machining professor from college.
Ty
My next block work I’ll be in contact with you for! Watched about 10 of your video’s, subscribed after watching this one. I knew from previous videos you knew what you were doing but after watching this one I was 150% sold. Being a machinist myself for many years I can see you’re a perfectionist at what you do and have the art of old school ways of doing things along with a good mix of new ways and todays Machinery to get it done with. GREAT WORK!!
👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you!!!, it's humbling to hear!
Here’s where I’m at so far, stock cubes, next build will be a stroker. Hopefully your CNC mill is fixed by then.
ruclips.net/video/HJRD8PqqG5c/видео.htmlsi=ULoRP5Ywv94Z10lk
Thanks for the education, Daniel. I know how much time you're going to spend here. Years ago, when these blocks first came in, my boss wanted me to put the sleeves in the fridge the night before. But i would use the bake clean to warm the block. He thought i was crazy. It worked much better and easier.
Absolutely!
That was one fine episode for myself. I’ve had a 5.3 Aluminum block in my shop for a good while now.
I think I’m going to have to try this out.
Go for it!
Man you have so much knowledge about this. I have never done any machine work so I really appreciate you explaining all that goes in to it. It looks like a very skilled trade and you do an awesome job.
I appreciate that!
Hi Daniel, Thanks for taking the time to make this video, I would watch the whole process no matter how long it took to record! You explain everything and that is something most shops wouldn't take the time to do and probably don't want you to see! In the 70s I was having a rotating assembly balanced and I watched them bore a BBC. The boring machine they used mounted in adjacent Cyl. and they notched the Cyl. by hand with a large cartridge roll! Unusual but alot of Drag Racers used this shop!
Yes, that how it was done, we use to do it the same way 25 year's ago
I love the way you explain over boring and sleeving piston walls, with the necessity of counter oval grounding walls perpendicular to the piston head so a novice can understand it. Great job 💪🏿👍🏿
Glad it was helpful!
Great Video. Way better staying dry sleeved. I had a Darton M.I.D. Sleeved (wet sleeve) 434" LS7 a while back. Only upside was the replaceability of individual sleeves if they got damaged and I was able to salvage a damaged LS7 block. Anything over 800hp required a motor plate and mid-plate. Not ideal.
We can replace these dry sleeves no problem
Love the fact you take the time for the extra steps that most others take shortcuts on.
Check twice cut once as they say. Having spent a few years on refurb assembly line, doing 30-35 engines pr 8h day, I hated the shortcuts we had to take just to make numbers.
"Just has to pass minimum requirements" was a phrase I heard often....This video was closer to meditation for someone with slight perfectionist issues. 😂
Ty sir!
Thank you for another excellent, informative video! I swear the videos just keep getting better.
Glad you like them!
Daniel, you are very patient and precise. It shows. I have really no machining knowledge and you just impress the heck out of me. Very concise explanation and exhibition. Definitely, the channel motorheads need to watch. All the best.
thanks Daniel for the awesome work and videos as always. I cant wait to pick this up and put it together.
💯... sorry for it taking so long
Daniel you really do precision work...and Andrew...really enjoy your knowledge
Ty, we really appreciate that
I have 2 suggestions. #1: Please make playlists of your multi-episode projects such as Facebook 5.3 and LS9 Nightmare. #2: Please use something other than your finger to point with, such as a straight pick or a small phillips screwdriver. Thanks, keep up the good work!
We have a complete Playlist,
Great video...I never knew there was soo much involved in building a engine correctly...
Thanks for watching!
That's very cool! I've never worked in a engine machine shop, but I am a tool maker/die builder. This kind of makes me think of a die I repaired the other day. The bottom shoe was bent, and after I straightedlned it in the press, I realized that the pins had been taken out of square, so I ground it flat in the Blanchard, and I sleeved the show, reset the top to the bottom shoe, and linebored it in the jig bore to fit the pins. It's always nice afterwards when the halves pull off smooth as butter. And I agree, once you get into, and using CNC, it will spoil the hell out of you. Also I see your from SC. I'm from the Columbia area. 👍
Thanks for the video. Thank you for explaining the rigidity issues.
Glad it was helpful!
I know nothing about machine work but your videos encourages me to learn more.
Glad to hear that!
Sir, you are truly an engine master.
Ty, truly humbling!
Good video! Sleeves are something I've always been curious about, and I don't see s lot of people cover the install in depth. I would also love to see how you sleeve iron blocks. With old Mopars, sleeving is becoming a bigger aspect of engine building, unfortunately. We just don't have the aftermarket support when it comes to blocks, and the supply of 360 and especially 340 blocks is noticeably smaller these days.
I'm glad you don't try to trim your videos down to 10 min like some do. When I watch stuff to learn something, I want to see it all. You also do a solid job narrating and explaining all the whys, not just hows. I agree with the others that are saying how Andrew does an excellent job with filming, and I bet he does a lot of other stuff well, too. You should coax him into frame once in a while.
Rock on!
This is why your the only machine shop GNR Automotive trusts there business with! Great video
Thank you very much!!
Excellent, informative video, thanks for doing this.
Absolutely 💯
The only time I see people using the Darton MID sleeves is when the aluminum block is fully open deck and people are turning up the boost. The Honda guys do it because most Honda engines were NA from the factory and the engineers never even thought about using boost. I think it also gets used is someone wants a significantly bigger bore than the block would ever allow. Bonneville Salt Flats racers have been known to go to great lengths just to make the engine a few CCs larger. If it isn't reliable long term, oh well, they can disassemble it and try again next season.
I like turbo power and rally cars. It is why I read about various tricks people went through. Every Subaru WRX and every Mitsubishi Evo X had an aluminum block turbo engine.
When I was a kid, turbo power sounded like magic. When the Nissan 300ZX Twin Turbo went on sale, it sounded like even more magic, so I instantly wanted one. I was 5 years old at the time.
I can say that my early interest in the 300ZXTT made a great deal of influence on what kind of car guy I would be. I suspect I would not have even known or thought about the 300ZXTT if my mom didn't have a 1985 Nissan Maxima, and it didn't make me like the name Nissan. Do you know how cool it was to grow up in the 1980s and have a robot voice chip in a car?
That in mind, my grandma had a Cadillac, and I really loved it. It didn't make me a a Cadillac enthusiast. Even if every rap star and pro athlete had a Escalade, I still didn't want one.
i agree with you 100 percent on the end of video rigidity issues yep and heat transfer
This was sure a “boring” video😂😂😂 great content thanks for sharing
Glad you enjoyed it
Great video ! I see why customers ship across country to have their work done by you . I'd have probably gone the ' corn bread ' route and found a block besides that one though . Maybe one that wasn't nearly that nice to begin with . You have to like seeing something that isn't a salvage job though . Thanks again .
Absolutely
I love how he talks!👍🤠
Ty
Thats wild, I can see the core shift in those opening 2-3 minutes on those stock sleeves.
Absolutely, that's the big issue with tje 6
2s
Xcellent technical content. Thanks for sharing.
Our pleasure!
Thanks for the video!!!
Our pleasure!
Thanks again for Todays. Lesson
Always welcome
Very informative, thank you.
Ty
A very good informative video.
Glad you think so!
If your mechanic sounds like deputy dog they gonna make your car fast af!!!
Lol
Very informative video.
Ty
Awesome informative video
Tyvm
this helped me understand much better
Awesome
I have done a couple hundred of these, most of the issue is over time the side walls crack and leak water, we now use the Lath and put a triple oring in the bottom of sleeve so when it does crack it will not leak, also we now use the Darton sleeve so they can not spin, aluminum pin the Melling style sleeves,
We haven't had any issues, I have a couple that are street duty for 8 year's, but a bottom oring could be a good backup plan for sure.
Your obliviously very smart you have a great shop please consider wearing saftey glasses thank you
Yeah, I should definitely!
Interesting, thanks.
You're welcome
I have thought about using my van norman bar to do that, I hadn't seen anyone do it. I might now. Thanks
💯
Great video
Thanks for the visit
Some time can you show how you are adjusting that cutting tool? I love to understand how this works. Thanks! Really enjoy your work and videos.
Great suggestion!
@@powellmachineinc3179 thanks for considering this, while you're at it, can you show/explain how you centered the boring bar. Thanks again.
MAKE CAMSHAFTS GREAT AGAIN!
Needs to be on a shirt
Funny thing the bigger shops cut so many corners and over charge you I've learned all of them CNC doesn't make a shop better if they don't know how to do the work to start with good video Thanks
Great point!
So every piece going into a build must be checked/rechecked b/c assuming them to be "true" would be a mistake? If I bought a
part I'd probably assume = (ass u me) that the parts were as advertised? It seems that only an older more experienced builder
would consider all the different scenarios as you have here & the other's trying to build would just slap em' together, out the door.
The explanation of the sleeves being round until taken out of the chuck caught me off-guard, but it made perfect sense.
That's my, "WoW Lesson" for today.......trust nothing you haven't measured yourself ! Good video, peace
💯
owner of a '16 silverado with the 6.2 and can't believe you can get 427 cubes from a 5.3 block. Good work and I'm curious what kind of numbers thing thing puts out. excellent video. new sub here.
Same block externally. The 6.0 block has a 4in bore. The 4.8/5.3 blocks have a 3.78 bore size. He's installing sleeves in this so he can go bigger than a 4" bore along with the stroker crank. 5.3 blocks are dirt cheap.
I get stressed out if I have to replace a motor on a CNC. Because there are minor tolerance differences from one to the next sometimes and it's not like you can send the cnc in after to get the extreme accuracy laser calculations done again. I always want my machine to be more accurate than I can measure so that that the only place for error as human error. I have been wanting to put larger motors on my CNC machine but I won't do it because of the small difference there will be without the calculation Manipulating the g code to correct for errors in the fram, motors, guide rails, ball screws, spindle and whatever else I forgot
It's not so bad, we tune it in, there's parameters f9r that.
Bruh you explained that so well. Wonder what the ticket was on this job
Tyvm, around 3500 for all block work and sleeves and studs
eso es un travajo muy profecional saludos
Ty!
Hello Mr Powell,
I am one of your subscribers and I would like to tell you that your video on what makes you as a master machinist is totally true. The elite assholes of this world think it is so easy and they want it done for free. These people have no clue what it takes to do a block prep right. Lawyers real estate agents who really produce nothing seem to think they know better than all of us who actually work. I totally respect everything you do and because I lived it somewhat myself. I spent 25 years in the semiconductor equipment relhmn getting paid jack shit for knowing plasma physics. I have been an ammeter machinist for 30 years and with my perseverance have come thru a lot.
My friends and I are looking at some equipment. I specifically was looking for a hone.
Is your CK10 a 4 stone ? If not how are you doing race hones with it?
I build about twenty engines a year do you provide a spec cam grinding service?
Best regards,
Brant Kinnsch
Weird that you are on youtube saying you build 20 engines a year, yet zero videos.
The hone 8s 2 stones, why would 4 stones make it better? I really on my profilometer and years of data to produce the correct Rvk,Rpk and Ra to make a cylinder last, we really appreciate you taking the time to give us positive feedback!!, I am definitely not a master, but we strive to do the best job we can with the equipment and knowledge we have!
Because I don't video Nor care to do so.@@eriklarson9137
Wow you do it right, not many shops take the extra time to get 100% correct. My question is the cost of you fixing this block has to be close to what brand new block cost?? I know your finished block will be better than new . You have many hrs into resleeve a block. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
A aftermarket aluminum block is around 6k, plus all finish Machine work, this way is half price.
High precision chip guard was 😂
Lol
When I was a fitter & turner I hated the machine shop, to boring for me, some jobs took half a day to machine ( I’m taking one pass )I preferred the fitting shop putting everything together.
Have you ever thought of making a puller for pulling sleeves like they use on the big diesel engines? It might be faster then machining the old one out.
You can't pull a cast in sleeve
Thanks now I know.
I had no idea that they were cast in sleeves. Great info, thanks
Love your work, explaining everything, attention to detail, very clean shop and of course your accent, are you from the south? I’m Aussie 🇦🇺
Absolutely! Born and raised right here in Carolina
Can you give a ballpark figure on how much it would cost to do this. Either all together or a price for sleeves and the price to install ?
Sleeves amd install is roughly 1900.00
@powellmachineinc3179. bore, finish hone, decked ,align honed is on top of that? Or that's about out the door ready to assemble?
This is gonna be one of my favorites, thanks for all you show and do !
@powellmachineinc3179
Try rubbing alcohol as a lubricant when cutting the aluminum.
Will do
Whats the length of the LA sleeve in relation to the stock 5.3l?
Looks like an aluminum block could handle more stroke in terms of piston skirt at BDC but needs clearancing which is interesting...
Appreciate the content...
Wait, so there is an alternative to the Darton sleeves that doesn't require CNC equipment to prepare the block??
And are these a ductile sleeve too?
Enquiring minds NEED to know!
Yes Ductile, and I put in darton sleeves wirh manual equipment no problem
Could you just run some weld passes on old sleeve to shrink it to make removing old sleeves faster
It's cast in with od ribs
evening bro!
Yes sir
It's getting dangerous i am learning something each video, translating the southern accent is coming along, took me awhile work out what a " valve " was.
Kit from down under
Lol
What do you think of using liquid nitrogen to super cool the leaves and setting them in that way?
I have thought of it, but heat is simple, one day I'm gonna try it
I have a 2007 aluminum 5.3, what are the biggest sleeves i can go and do the gen4 5.3 have the strong or weak main webbing?
All gen 4 blocks are OK in the mains, 4.125 ish is max bore
Great video! Very thorough details
I noticed you hand spinning the boring bar on startup.
Just wondering- Is that your normal routine or will it not start without help?
If so, you may need to replace the motor capacitor.
I have a Van Norman 777S and a new capacitor solved the start problem
The governor is bad, I just haven't had time to fix it
Fuking awesome
Ty
How do you know you are at true center of the bore before starting to bore out the old sleeves, and is there a tolerance of being in the true center? Seems like alot of variables there as far as the block being perfectly square to the boring tool and the boring tool being perfectly centered to the bore. I couldn't do that kind of work, I'd be bald 😅. Love the channel and learning the machining side of it all.
The bars centering feature is accurate within .001" , as long as we are within .005" there is no issue, ty for watching
Man doing it that way is gona take forever...Glad am not paying for it.
You can have it Good and Fast, but it won't be Cheap.
You can have it Good and Cheap, but it won't be Fast.
You can have it Cheap and Fast, but it won't be Good
Awesome video keep up the good work. How is LS Nightmare coming along?
Great video. As usual I learned a lot. I'm building a 1000+ HP Chevy inline 6 292. I need to fit my Ryan Falconer V-12 head (same bore spacing) to it with a different bolt pattern than the 292 iron head. I have been told I need a 1/2" deck plate furnace welded to the block and sleeves put in. Does this sound right to you? Do you know where I could get this done? Are you interested? I have a friend that could probably make the plate. Thank you for your time.
Awesome, we are working on roller cams for that application
I have a billet roller cam for an iron head but I need a roller cam for the Falconer head due to the different valve sequence. That's great news. I have a billet crank, direct fire ignition and 5 stage dry sump. No distributor gear needed. I'm running a Weiand 6-71/NOS. Maybe you could help me with the grind. Ryan and his son Erik are also willing to help.@@powellmachineinc3179
Like your attention to the “order of operations “, to avoid the gotchas, from machining shifts.
Personally, too many shops and customers sabotage themselves, for ignoring the interaction of sequence of operations.
Do you think y’all might get a even more accurate hole, if you bored with deck plates, if they fit?
It really doesn't affect it, and with a plate you are farther away from your work which is always a negative, imo
Technically you can use Kerosene as a lubricant when machining aluminum.
Absolutely
You mentioned that with a job removing this much material, you wait until the cylinders are installed before line boring the crank journals. Do you think that baking the block in an oven for a few heat cycles after installing the sleeves would release any other stress in the system, or just not needed?
It definitely would be a good practice
@powellmachineinc3179 i was gonna ask how you feel about vibratory stress relief after this type of work.
was wondering, have you ever tried heat cycling the block after you cut the old sleeve out to let the aluminum relax before you do the bore and hone for the sleeve?
next, how much does it cost to do this kind of thing to a 5.3 block?
Yes, we do
Is that procedure significantly cheaper than the ls next dart block?
Yes, and 100 lbs lighter
How do you align the bore center with the spindle accurately? I didn't catch the setup process that did that tnx
The bar has a centering feature
Brother I wish you weren't 4 and a half hours away. I just dropped my rotating assym to
Can't win them all!
Yea but I like road trips lol
It would be nice if you could bore from the top down vs inside out, just start at 4" or something and then finish out the normal way. Just like turn the bit sideways and go super slow.
Bought a build second hand from someone. Engine combo is pretty much identical to what I wanted. But I want to do a filled block and it’s already been finish honed and ready to assemble. Is there any products you’ve used that won’t distort the finished bores? Hardblok says theirs won’t but would like some real world experience. I know it’s not ideal but trying to see if there’s any options. Thank you!
Supposedly "rokblock" won't distort, but I don't believe it, we always hone afterwards
love your show ! how do i get in touch with u ? i need a small crank done and block do u do small two strokes?
Right now we are booked for the year, but all contract information is on the website
Powellmachineinc.com
How does the block mount to the table?
2" bar through the mains and the lower table raises and clamps the block
Whats the cost out the door? I have a lc9 with a hairline crack in the sleeve i might send down your way one day
Sleeves and install only cost about 1900.00
@@powellmachineinc3179 👍 i will be in touch
Can you make the bores larger on my 010 355 block gen I. Or could i and how large can i go. Seeking the most diameter bore possilbe from a 350 originally 4" bore of course. Even thought of building a block from scratch. Not getting a 400 style block. However how larger can you make a dart or any aftermarket bore larger than normally could while the sleeve is thicker than a bored block. Like say use a dart go to it's advised maximum bore size of 4.185 it's walls are .0033 or whatever. Well could i use a sleeve strictly N/A build and get thicker cylinder walls than that and truer and have it go basically to max bore size that a standard spaced head would fit onto. Like 4.2 or 4.21 or whatever it is.?
Just buy a dart shp, much nicer and save u about a grand
This guy sings,when he talks.
Lol
@@powellmachineinc3179 I can relate, I'm from SC.
America 🇺🇸💪🏼🦅🛠️
Facts
Do you cut the old sleeve out completely or is it like a sleeve in a sleeve deal?
It's all out
Can you do an ls1 to this bore.
Yes
Which part number sleeve are you using from L.A Sleeve?
Hi, are you doing more vidéos about the 5.3/427 ?
Yes, just busy
Cool
I'd like to know if its possible to do à 5.3/454 ?
Was all your cuts 20 thou or just the 1st
First, the rest were .04 till we hit aluminum
Do you use the same process for iron blocks?
Yes
Is that even stronger than the aluminum block with the sleeves installed in Iron block ?
Do you see a problem putting a 4" stroke in a 6.2 with stock sleeves?
Do it all the time
I built one out of L92 block carberated. Made really good power. I've heard a few engine fudd's on the interwebs and locals say pistons pull to far out the bottom.i say malarkey LOL.great videos you put out especially the cam tech
I am a Automotive machinest from south africa i like your videos if u ever need a hand in the shop give me a shout
I always need a hand, but that ride back and forth is going to kill u
@@powellmachineinc3179 yes thats a fact 😅
Maybe I misunderstood but LA Sleeve recommends a much tighter shrink fit, more like 0.001" ~ 0.0015" per inch diameter.
Personally, I would be giving it a minimum of 0.003" under-size on block bore diameter, the alloy expands about six times more than the cast iron so they will be 'loose' at running temperature even though the cast iron is going to be hotter than the alloy.
Would it be quicker to pull sleeves rather than machine them out? (It's more common on diesel engines but if sleeves are not cast in place, heating block and pulling sleeves could save a ton of time)
I also re-grind the carbide bit with a much higher rake angle for cutting aluminium, found brazed carbide better than replaceable tips for that.
With diamond polishing, alloy build up is very limited and some alloys don't 'stick' at all.
In alloy, you can take 0.125" depth of cut (0.250" increase in bore) without any problems, in fact, it makes chips break easier with less chance of build up even on 'sticky' alloys .
A liner held only at the bottom is a terrible idea, I wasn't even aware anyone did it. Beeing shrunk in only at top will be much better in my opinion, at least it's tight where it's hottest.
You can't pull a cast in sleeve, and you just don't need a lot of press we do this all tje time,....if it works like you say I could just warm the block and they would fall out, but they don't
@@powellmachineinc3179Always had to heat block to around 250~300f then slide liner in..
I worked with a guy who decided it was quicker to drop them in and broke the flange off the first one.
I've removed Honda liners with only 0.001" interference, there is always oil up the side of liner.
I've also had liners crack using LA Sleeve recommended 0.0045" interference in alloy block so I won't go over 0.003" even on 4.5" OD liners. All a bit academic now, haven't done that type of work since 2011 and not much of anything since 2016.