Can We Professionally Produce Music In VR Yet?
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- Опубликовано: 5 июн 2024
- I did it so you don't have to. Special appearance from @MrBillsTunes and Lonamakesmusic (on IG, etc).
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timestamps:
0:00 - Intro
2:38 - TribeXR 2/10
3:50 - Paradiddle 5/10
4:49 - Patchworld 6/10
6:00 - Pianovision 3/10
6:49 - Virtuoso 7.5/10
9:32 - Korg Gadget 1/10
10:53 - PC DAWs on VR 2/10
11:54 - Takeaway 
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With Daft Punk gone, we're losing valuable institutional knowledge in Giant Helmet Audio Production. Deadmau5 has been placed in protective confinement.
Dang it. I’m 9 hours late to the joke 😂
This comment wins the the most awesome comment of the year award.
Luckily we still have BTSM and ATLiens
@@Lantertronics well not anymore, what with the differential focus grouping of the video title that RUclips lets creators do.
😂
“Manscaped is making a VPN” lol
I'm surprised no one has made an orchestral conducting app. You could have different difficult levels where an increasing number of sections of the orchestra stop paying attention to you and start rebelling.
Interestingly, that is exactly the sort of thing you CAN make in Patchworld.
Well, Maestro VR is an orchestral conducting app.
This but only if they give you a way to make it look like that Wii Music conducting game.
This actually sounds like a really cool idea, I can imagine a party version mode for pass around multiplayer would be really fun to play in groups.
Beat Saber always felt like Conduct Conduct Revolution to me.
1:04 that sponsoring made me literally laugh out loud. it was so accurately mangling together what you usually hear 😅
Paradiddle does support foot controllers for both kick drum & hi hat (usb or midi). Virtuoso also supports a lot more sounds with the SteamVR app but obvously you lose the standalone option. I just felt that it's worth highlighting both those options exist as they were mentioned as negatives in the vid. Looking up some drum solos on RUclips and music people have created with Virtuoso shows how versatile they both are and that the lack of feedback in Paraddidle can be overcome!
I'm also emetophobic. Thanks for talking about it openly, it's something people often just laugh at. Made watching this video more comfy as people often get motionsickness and do the thang with vr headsets.
“manscaped is making a VPN" 💀💀💀💀
Imagine learning to be a drummer without feeling the sticks and the bounce back
"But first, Manscaped is making a VPN" - I died. So funny.
At first sight I thought this is a picture of doc Emmet Brown 😂
Merry Christmas Mr. Jordan, thank you for another year of audio curiosities!
🎄
Happy New Year man, love you
As a digital artist, VR has been awesome for me. Drawing / sculpting in stereoscopic 3D, with a sense of scale and depth, being able to push and pull in/out as well as up/down/left/right, being able to twist my arm as I sculpt, etc etc. Like you said, it's not yet at the point where it allows real professional work at length, mostly due to the inherent discomfort of a headset. But my god if I don't find myself smiling in wonder every time I use VR to create a 3D drawing or sculpture.
I hope Benn will go to vrc dj parties, modular monday for example
how does one do that?
i think he's talking about VRChat that has some music happenings on it. @@BennJordan
@@BennJordan it's held in vrchat! i don't want to be the one posting links in the comment section but modular monday has an easy to find twitter to lead you further :)
@@BennJordan Same way everyone else learns new things, by watching someone teach it on youtube!
Amazing how much you look like Doc Brown in the thumbnail. Also, as a sort of head-worn monitor, there are AR glasses that do something similar. The NReal air were some that I looked at to use in conjunction with my Steam Deck. Considering that the Deck is more than capable of running a daw and with the dock has the connectivity for an interface, it seems like it would be very useful for someone like myself who is very often bedridden and unable sit at my computer for very long.
I use Vitruoso VR for my music, specifically the drum pads. Works great.
Great overview. Thanks Benn
As someone with chronic motion sickness triggered visually I'd guessed the VR was not for me. I have a shedload of complex audio kit that I barely know how to power up and no time for more assimilation. You clips and concision have shortcut my path away from the tempting graphical adventures I've seen in the advertising.
It’s not production, but there’s a thriving community of musicians in the VR social game VRChat. I have over 7,300 hours in the game and I regularly play live guitar blindfolded by the headset. It’s a great time! There are music festivals, contests, organized and spontaneous open mics, busking, etc. I’d love to introduce you to the scene if you’d be interested!
live guitar? i'm intrigued!
@@xkmerlz I see you play VRChat as well! My name in game is the same as here. Add me, friend!
@@LydianMelody as soon as i return from my holiday! 😄
Great video! ☺
That fully corresponds to my experience with VR music apps. For me, the only “music” related VR app that just doesn’t get boring even after 2 years is Beat Saber. Apart from that, the real winners are VR games like “Moss”, the “I Expect you to Die” series, “Half-Life: Alyx” or “Eye of the Temple”.
Considering the other games you listed, probably my top 3 VR experiences, I think I should give 'Eye of the Temple' a go.
I think Superhypercube is a wonderful hidden gem also
I think the most reasonable prospect for VR being actually useful is VR sculpting/3d modeling. I haven't found any such program that has settled on an actually usable control scheme yet, though, so I'm not exactly holding out hope. Some stuff is out there, but most of it doesn't do traditional poly modeling well, it's all voxel sculpting, which is not very good for high-detail models or game-ready geometry.
@@littlesnowflakepunk855 I agree, you would think that there should already be sophisticated 3D modeling apps for VR. But I haven't been able to find any yet.
@@littlesnowflakepunk855 Have you tried Gravity Sketch? It's a pretty competent subdivision modeler, similar to Blender but in VR.
I thought you were joking when you said your eyebrow was nearly torn off when you were a boxer. That scar is truly BADASS. Merry Christmas Benn!
haha thank you. Most of it has healed up rather nicely
Oh this looks interesting!
You’ve spoken in less then glowing terms about spatialized audio.. I mean mostly Atmos.. but for me, inspired by the sorta electroacoustic tradition.. I’m excited about spatialized audio as a canvas to work on.. and immersive art and design.. and what are the possibilities here… yeah… so I’m excited to see what you do here.
You have a mind that, in part, reminds me of folks I’d hang with in the culture around MIT.. in how you relate to technology.. err.. yeah, so one way or another I’m excited to see what you do
you don't need Atmos for that. 5.1 has been a thing for ages. Beastie boys had a quadraphonic concert in the 90s, Santana, Aerosmith, Black Sabath and a ton of others had quadraphonic singles in the 70s. Atmos is just reinventing the wheel and putting a proprietary seal on top
Tipper did some really cool 5.1 surround work. It was super cool, but it's incredibly hard to do well and usually just serves as a gimmick.
If only a music production app would be as good as VTOLVR is...
Pretty cool. I heard that Dreams PS4/5 has a really great music tool that is a bit more casual but intuitive for composers and lay people. I'm not a hip hop or beat artists so I don't really touch synth pads or understand how to use synthesizers. I'm willing to learn but I usually notate and then import to a DAW 😅 unless I want to just fiddle with the soundbanks
I currently use Korg Gadget on a borrowed iPad, & I have to open it twice to open it once. I’m not surprised that you had to open the VR version several times.
I would recommend Vinyl Reality. It is a pretty accurate representation of DJing with vinyl.
Not sure if intentional, but nice touch using the plack cat world music. When talking about vr it's very fitting.
Thanks for this video! I keep thinking about playing around with some of the VR music apps, but skepticism has kept me from doing it. And it looks like that was warranted. I think one of the most promising areas would be modular, but if it doesn’t try to look as much like hardware modules as in SynthVR. Give me a 3D version of something like the iPad’s BYOD. (There’s probably a better iPad example app that is actually a modular synth, but I haven’t yet gotten past miRack, Model 15, and Drambo in the iPad’s modular synth apps.) Virtual cables emulating physical cables are more annoying than physical cables, and while Drambo’s idea for the connections seems perfect, I’ve most often found it difficult to make the connections I want in practice.
I'd really love to see you go into fun patches using The Analog Thing you've got :D
Thank you so much for the rundown, my friends who have the new quest are not music people and I have been wondering if the experience is any good. I was right to be skeptical it seems. I think there is a lot of potential here for weird controllers and other experimental stuff. Fingers crossed developers stay interested. Maybe something strange like a 3d midinous?
Not that it argues any of your points, but FYI Paradiddle does support external MIDI for foot pedals! (At least, allegedly. I haven't tried it or seen it work yet, but I did notice that option in the menu when I played with it! Also supposed to be able to do MIDI output to an external DAW)
1:22 that picture is pretty dope
Same thing happened to me with Djay, I had paid for it a while back and now it's subscription based. I had to get a subscription just to use my controller with it! The ironic thing is I would've 100% paid 50 bucks for the new version, I haven't given them my money for at least 5 years and definitely owed them for what I've made with it since then, but being forced into a subscription just to use my controller was a dirty move and left an awful taste in my mouth.
Every time a company goes “please :( we need the money :( so we got rid of our one time paid option” it turns me right off. I had a journalling app I used which did something similar, I had a lifetime paid thing but when I moved phones they didn’t want to transfer it. So I just stopped using it.
there are some developers who try to bring in new interfaces (instruments) and workflows for the creative process in VR, which is a good thing. imo, trying to copy a complete production workflow in VR will most probably result in a bad experience. i don't want to turn knobs or sliders in VR. we have unlimited space in VR and we can use our whole body to interact with the VR world. nice to get the perspective of a professional and nice video as always, thanks.
Need to have Benn playing "thrill of the fight" on stream.
Small correction. You won't have to subscribe to Tribe if you already bought it before they switched to subscription. If you email them they give all existing owners a lifetime sub. Just been through this myself. They really should lead with that on their login page.
Thanks for saving us all the trouble. I get dizzy just watching you.
Another Benn Jordan video RUclips didn't notify me about even though I pressed the bell. :|
Ok And there’s a great point you just brought up what another person hears is actually different from what you hear, So if you’re recording a video and they’re recording a video, play those back so you can hear how different the audio sounds with each person… But yes, you use link that way both you and the other person are connected and hearing the same audio through your computer headphones
I read the title and thought you were going to give us some insight on how Daft Punk and Buckethead produce their music.
I was expecting dedmau5 and devo! Or maybe jocks and jarheads making music in uniform... but was blindsided by Facebook apps that haven't even been updated since last time, or barely. For that many billions of dollars investment, you'd expect a DAW and a modular, that both work, and include copy, paste, undo, those kinds of advanced features.
Meta probably could've bought every band that ever wore a helmet, for the amount of money they spent. Sorry, I just had to vent...
You need to do a follow up when the vision pro is released 😉
As an FYI, Steam VR (and most PCVR headsets) Headsets can be used without an account via OpenVR, or by simply installing SteamVR without an account. Additionally, PSVR1 can be used without an online account, and IIRC, the same applies to PSVR2
Laughed so hard when you said "Manscaped"... short wtf moment, followed by loud and intense laughter :D
Great video. With adoption of MR, there will be a feedback loop of user value and development. That will ultimately direct the optimization of the software. Happens on every platform.
Some thing else I noticed that copy of virtuoso he’s using is definitely an Old copy, and it looks like the update hasn’t been applied because there’s been some major changes to the chord instrument..
Has anyone else tried the DAW controller called MoveMusic VR??? I've been using it for a few months and I have mapped 100s of Ableton parameters with it. It has AR passthrough and you can control up to 6 parameters at a time. Lacks basics like copy/paste, undo/redo and no hand tracking yet but I think it is the best AR/VR MIDI DAW Controller I've tried.
Maybe not a DAW, but making music through something like that music making program you got off steam (in a previous video you made) would be kind of dope!
I like the big fat "NOPE" in the thumbnail 😂
Benn, is there a way to collab with someone else remotely? Like a VR meeting but both of you can hear each other PC sound and record things? I would imagine this is be easy to do, a mix of Virtual Desktop, Teamviewer and OBS I guess?
omg feels like we are decades away from decent VR/AR for music making.
When I first got a Quest 2 I thought “what can’t it do?”
Now I know it can do several things, but stay connected to my wifi network isn’t one of them
One Love!
Always forward, never ever backward!!
☀☀☀
💚💛❤
🙏🏿🙏🙏🏼
How is your speech jammer coming along ? Any update vids coming at all on it ? ❤ Merry Christmas 🎅 🎄
VR motion sickness goes away quickly if you’re willing to push the boundaries. Try something like Battleglide, don’t try to make yourself sick, but don’t try to make yourself comfortable. Take the headset off when you feel unwell. 2 weeks of that and you’ll be a VR god lol
When I think of scifi VR, I think of somebody with a headset connected directly to a bunch of keyboards, mixers, and amps, and maybe its a psychic link.
I feel like you have such a great voice for voice over. Like wtf?
Quantum error correction *is* pretty dope
LETS GOO BRETT JORDEN VIDEO
MoveMusic is another Midi VR controller out there. Pretty good IMO
Ah meta the preparation for the matrix pod 😂
I love DJing in Tribe and it's way cheaper than buying a deck
"Jesus wept..." Dean Pelton from Community S6E2 "Lawnmower Maintenance and Postnatal Care", hahaha, great vid, man...
@BennJordan Hey, just an idea I've had in regards to music prod in VR for a while now. Somebody could create a branch of VCV Rack and try to port its interface into a VR environment. VCV is already using OpenGL for all its rendering, it's been a while since I looked at the source but I think they're just using the GLUT library. This undertaking is a pretty low priority for me personally. I'll do it in a couple years if nobody else does.
Hey Benn :) I love your content! However, I'm stumped as to why no one is talking about Movemusic VR DAW Controller for Quest2/3. Have you tried it? Has anyone else tried it? I don't work for them or anything - I'm just curious how this one seems to have slipped through yours and so many peoples nets.
All the best!
It's all still slower and more cumbersome than just using a computer and/or dedicated music hardware, just like most non-game VR content. The inability to "touch" things breaks it for me.
The visual creation apps I’ve tried is like a smile generator. Magical. Simulating existing interfaces with no physical feedback. sigh generator.
Hey, have you tried out Symphony Of Motion yet?
Having had some very intense creative moments in VR, and having tested some of the super low-latency music collaboration tools, I can absolutely see a future where VR or AR/MR has a big role. The feeling of being right next to someone in VR can seem very natural after a few minutes. Even remote music instruction would be very doable with basic pass through and webcams to give the teacher multiple views.
Jeez Benn, you actually earn your money. If I had to wade through that stuff, I’d get tired and frustrated and be rather inclined to be quite mean about the whole gamut. Trying to imagine what aspect VR could exploit, and I would say this: it would be ten times better, at imitating a ‘big’ audio studio, and letting a punter experience that, than maybe trying to enable a VR version of home studio work? In other words, you could envision (envisage) a studio with a bank of sliders, and you really have to go all the way over to get at the last one, and actually, sound sculpting might be a ‘real’ VR thing worth doing? So you can move a virtual mic further from a virtual big amp/combo and so on. Almost, simply using VR as a way to more interestingly interact with actual sound sculpting tasks, than sliding an adjustment for room size, or hardness of the walls? Just spitballing. A great roundup of the technology as it stands. Everyone, have a great New Year. The world’s going to hell in a handcart and probably we can’t stop it - but at least we didn’t cause it, so we still have our self-respect! Good luck in 2024 to all kind souls.
This is what my friends and I do on vrchat
I have a friend who's given DJ gigs in second life for over a decade at this point. None of this is new lmao
manscape should make a vpn though
Are youa. Burner ? Did you go this year ?
Thanks for sharing a peek into the current state of the VR music space. Still doesn't like that avenue is for me. It's hard enough for me to carve out some music making time with my actual physical rack. Hope you are well, you looked extremely exhausted in this video (judging by your eyes). Please get some rest!
Regarding Tribe, the previous owners were supposed to get the lifetime subscriptiom for free (and most of us did). The devs seem to be rather active in resolving such issues, but it seems lile the only place for it is their discord.
That said, I still hate their switch to subscription model, I can no longer direct people interested in DJing to Tribe as a nice way to get their feet wet.
Yeah, I was about to write an email to sort it all out but felt like a subscription to a VR CDJ deck is impressively more obnoxious than NFTs.
1:05 Manscaped VPN LOL
i cant believe that SynthVR is actually missing from this list
This video is out at the same time as Jean-Michel Jarre virtual concert.
Did you try Synthspace? Thought it would have been in the list forsure
Yup. Had some serious bugs 2 years ago and hasn't been updated since.
BTW, content on patch, at least a lot of it is created by dedicated users
I worked in VR for three years. I grew to hate putting the headset on after a month.
I don't think we'll see wide adoption of VR until it's small enough to fit in a pair of glasses or contact lenses. Nobody wants to strap a headset on every day, there's no tactility, and the hand tracking does not (yet) enable the use of fine motor skills.
It's coming, but it's not ready yet. And sadly, once it is fully integrated with our daily lives and actually practically usable for fiddly things like music making, it will become a platform for pushing more ads into our field of view and collecting yet more personal data to sell to third parties. If a big corporation is pushing something hard, you can be sure there's an ulterior motive.
Great video. My flatmate has one of these headsets, its a really cool experience but i see zero reason i to try and make music using this tech. Its mostly visual so why would i use it for audio. It just seems like such a hassle. Mostly the apps just look like shit lol
This video isn't for me but I just popped in with an upvote and a comment for the honest thumbnail :D
Pioneer did this b.s. with rekord box!
HAHAHA ... Manscaped !
Shame about the shortcomings of virtual desktops. First time I saw this I imagined picking up one of these and selling all my monitors... Maybe one day
And also yes, tribe XR. You might as well just go out and buy yourself the equipment… They have really done people a disservice..
Manscape VPN cracked me up.
I gotta know what that instrument is and I can’t wait 20 hours
Clickbaitar
@@BennJordanwhat’s the girl in the thumbnail from? I’m always on the hunt for tv shows and anime about musicians.
As someone that has used Korg Gadget on iPad for hundreds of hours, this Half-assed attempt at a VR app really sucks. We need more updates 😂
is that Duncan Trussell at 05:30?
FROM THE TITLE, I am expecting a collab with Deadmau5
This is what people my age without children do.
wait a minute, you said no more review videos! :P xD
Nice title change
I am typically a fiend for all things VR but I just can't do it with music. Tried so many things, many of the ones mentioned here, but it just doesn't work for me. Physical feedback is just too much of a core musical aspect for me, I can't just air play instruments like this.
Honestly you might have not felt sick in VR recording this but I had to stop the video with the motion sickness the head-bobbing induced in me. I don't think I'm trying VR anything any time soon.
FWIW, it's much better when the view moves with you. Watching other people (like this) in VR is miserable...as the view moving exactly with you in it is critical to not feeling sick. Just like you don't notice all head wiggle/bobbing we do in real life. (If you do try it, as soon as you feel a bit off, stop. Don't push it, and try again later...you do get more used to it. And non-walking games like Beat Saber are great for starting out.)
I'm sure that in years to come, we will eventually get the Star Trek style holodeck. But i cant help but see the current state of VR as nothing more than the very first stepping stone, and nothing else. Like the very first adding machines that led to the computers and smartphones we have now, but are kinda cringe in hindsight. And some people might think that this is now affordable. But i routinely spend large sums on music hardware and software, and so far VR just looks a gigantic waste of time and money to me. But then I'm not a gamer.
1:02 Is the Manscaped VPN also essentially a legal form of underage gambling through a mobile app riddled with microtransactions?
"Manscaped has made a VPN" 🤣🤣🤣