I like keeping a patch antenna on hand in case I lose a quad. I can direction find it. Take off all the omnis and put just the patch on. Turn head toward best video signal. Walk that way.
I take the antenna off entirely it's much more sensitive at that point and super directional. Now if I'm out a mile than a directional antenna could work but, at that point I'd probably be using the gps from the osd because if you're flying more than a half mile or so you should really have a gps on it.
That's the best way. Also, turn down your video transmitter to 25mw when you get closer (if you have smart audio.) This allows you to better differentiate a bad signal from a good one. If you had it on 800mw, then you'll get very clear video no matter which way you turn.
@@michaelbryant3643 easy! Just use an extender! Ive been doing this since July and ive had great results w the Wildfire (until just 3 days ago where i pushed my limits and was shocked that my reception wasnt better!)… ill keep the antennas but swapping out my module for the Rapidfire).
Josh, try the following: use a patch and an Omni on a long coax. The coax should be long enough that the ant sits over your head. Now what I’ve noticed with the rapid fire: even if you go behind the patch, the module still prefers the patch while it is definitely weaker (which I see with the bars). That fact alone shows that this module is not really good in getting the most out of the theoretical dream team (patch and Omni on a long coax). So now I use the 15cm coax Omni and a tiny stubby. The long coax is easily bendable and can stay on as well. Sorry for my long comment, greets, Mario
Years ago I read that diversity is used to reduce the effects of destructive interference where part of the signal reflects of something and therefore arrives a little later at the antenna. Because the paths don't have the same lenght anymore, constructive and destructive interference can occur. So you use two antennas that are spaced out a bit, so that when one experiences destrucive interference, you can switch to the other that hopefully doesn't. My guess is that if you use two omnis, you get reduced interference problems, which in some cases might even be better than a patch.
For the bottom omni, just use the regular stubby (not the right angle one). Still 90 degree to the top one, without the fitment issue. The other reason to use two omnis when racing is because the range/penetration of the patch isn’t needed. And the patch’s high gain can be a detriment when a competitor’s quad flies close to you on the near side of the track. Yes, even if they are on a different but nearby channel, it messes with your video signal. BTW, works great with a standard diversity module too. Not just for Rapidfire.
One of the most basic concepts from getting your ham license is the higher the antenna, the better reception. It makes a lot of sense that putting the antennas closer to your face and goggle is going to result in weaker reception. I find too often that I'm looking down and flying behind me, and my omni isn't tall enough for that. Gotta make that effort to keep my head up. Good info, as always, JB.
3 years later after video i finally understand a little more. great content man. fyi ive been watching jb for 1 year almost and watch his latest stuff.
I have a Foxeer Lollipop Stubby and a Foxeer Patch antenna. Taking into consideration of Your video explaining antennas and placement, I have my patch antenna facing the Omni’s weakest point. I’ve always never felt comfortable flying behind me, but this video help me feel more confident in the choice I made: Fatshark Hdo Rapid Fire Module Foxeer Patch Foxeer Lollipop Stubby. Works as explained in this video; I don’t feel comfortable flying behind myself as I always fly in the same direction I am facing.
Just got a rapid fire and discovered the following: when using the frame combining mode (as opposed to traditional diversity), the signal is fantastic while flying in the area the patch is pointed (obviously), but when flying behind the patch, the signal is much worse than if I was using a non-diversity rx with just an omni. I believe this is because the module is blending in some frames from the patch even when it is breaking up badly. Switching to 2 omnis completely solved this. The difference was amazing.
So this is one of those things that I always wondered about, because it made perfect sense, but it made so much sense that I assumed it would be in the common sense category. Yet so many pilots, if not all, highly recommended omni and patch so I just kind of took them at their word. I'm glad I'm not the only one who questioned it.
JB that was the best damn cliff's notes easy to understand way of explaining this stuff. The flashlight focus analogy of antenna db was spot on. Great video.
I was watching this at night (I was sleepy), so after he dropped the antenna, like a minute later I was like, "Wait, didn't I drop something, I should probably look at what I dropped." And I literally started looking around my bed.
I use Rapidfire and have been refusing to switch to the two omni setup (although I see everyone else at races doing it), precisely because I did a similar side-by-side comparison and didn't like what I saw. Glad to know that it wasn't because I somehow didn't have my trial two omni setup right. My setup: one omni with ~3-inch extension (the one that came with TrueRC X-Air) to clear the goggle and my head, bent slightly backward to compensate my looking down + one directional, aiming ~30-degree up. Works GREAT
Great video Josh. My awesome wife just bought me the ev200d and some patch anntennas for my birthday. Steppin up from some cheap box goggles. Cant wait to improve my reception!!!!!!
I know it's 5 yrs old, but this video is timely. I'm about to switch from omni/patch combo to 2 stubbies, but I'm going to use extensions to get them above the goggles and my big, water-filled head.
@TobiZ2612 I think it's better for what I do (generally fairly short range freestyle). I screwed up and only got 1 extension, so I'm not using that yet, but I have nothing but truerc rchp stubbies on my hdzero goggles and everything is working great (knock wood). I do still HAVE a patch because I like the idea that if I lose a quad, I can use it's more directional nature to help find it, but they are stowed deep in the toolbox. Stubbies for life!
i always run my antennas 45 degrees tilted back so i know that when i lower my head down after like a minute of flying, its still going to be horizontal.
Always need to pick the antennas for your environment too. I know a lot of people stopped using patches at races, lots of people + high gain antennas means that you might pick up other people's video as well because the antenna is so sensitive. Also, with something like rapid fire, certain situations it might be better to have a left omni and a right omni, or even no antenna believe it or not in a really high multi path environment, eg CDRA Nationals inside the football practice area indoors.
@@laurentdinodrone7111 I think it would work either way but I usually run an omni and a patch on each side. I just forget the patches for miniquad stuff tho. With patches I can have acceptable video at over a mile, assuming I point my head in the right direction.
I use an Omni and a patch, and I usually have my head down out of habit from my box goggle days. The way I counteract this is I use a 45 degree sma adapter on my patch so that it points forwards. The adapter came with my True-D so it works out well
Using the stubbies does make it easier to store, especially in a back pack. Long stems antennas will give you better reception because you get away from your radio absorbing melon. But you have to remove or cleverly pack our goggles with long stem roses. So it’s a trade off, what works best for you is totally up to you and how you fly.
Man your cicadas sound SO pleasant compared to the screaming banshee's that we have in AUS Loved the video Josh, glad to he a Patriot of your channel, trying to catch one of your Monday steams but in always working haha Keep it up! Hopefully all is well after the tough times last week Happy Flying!!
I'm new to fpv, I use omni + crosshair on rapidfire. I lost video signal from super clean to 0 in a split second, disarmed and the quad rolled into the water (still working) but I'll definetly buy another omni because patches are too risky when you're not doing longrange.
What do u think of helicals? I made two. 7 turn and 5 turn They work really well for me. I use thick copper wire. I get the best range vs others with a homade 5 turn helical on my rotg01 reciever I dvr off my laptop. I was going to try two helicals on my goggles just facing different directions. I've haven't tried that yet . I always use a helical and triumph
@@DT-gun yeah that's awsome. infact I just built today another more accurate 7 turn. It's unbelievable how great it works. Better then store bought antennas. And let me tell ya I'm no expert. Very simple to build. I turn the thick copper wire on a bolt in a vise then the wire just free stands because it's thick enough. 15mm width of helicals center to center of wire, 12.9mm separation up and down between turns,50mm square or round piece of metal for ground. I use old coax from old antennas. The thicker wire also increases the band width. That's it.
Love my TBS fusion. I flown with 2 omnis since starting fpv almost 3 years ago. I now use a Long range lumenier axii 2 and a lumenier axii 2 stubby, with a long range axii2 on the quad. It's awesome!
I always have a patch on hand, and normally did run a true rc one. But now that the v2 axii2 are out I run one stub right angle and a normal stub. Best ever!
I have a stubby axii on my quad and it is a drastic decrease in reception. With a stubby on a quad the frame and battery itself becomes the interference. switched to a 3 inch longer axii and the reception is now very clear in the same area as nothing blocks the antenna reception. never used a stubby before....will not again lol
Always love your content, and your info helped me build my first quad. Remember how you got here... being real.. this is-1st vid I’ve seen where it’s seems like ur pitching or angling for something down the road. Or maybe, you’ve got your first $ deal to continue.. in which case, I’ve been there and understand. You’re content has always been the best, but want to make sure you stay on path as a business owner.. I can’t wait till the next vid, as always.
I don't know what you think you're picking up on. This is just a video explaining why people are using two omni antennas. There's no pitch or angle here. The video was sparked by the release of the Lumenier stubby, but you can do this with whatever antenna you want.
@@JoshuaBardwell Thanks for your reply. Not sure either.. just seemed a little weird. Maybe bc I am used to seeing you at your desk. My apologies for assuming commercial motives- don't really know what I was thinking. Also, just watched your apology video. -- From the viewers perspective: We don't care about any of that; just love your vids. I didn't know anything about it until I saw your vid about it. And who the hell does this other guy think he is... Don't forget---YOU ARE JOSH F*%&^%^* BARDWELL- You're the man and don't have to put up with some whiney-a** small-fry business owner. Just crush him and forget it. Delete anything you want on your platform. You built it with hard work, (not him) so delete any comment that gets a little lippy, with a tone you don't like. Including mine. All the best
It's funny, I recently tested this myself. Got very linear, snowy noise with two omnis. Totally flyable. But I got this abrupt breakup, felt like it's going away completely any moment with an omni and a patch.
Wearable base station signal tracking switching (hat) with an array of patches and onmis? withRF shield in hat... Just a thought. I know face the direction of quad is a seemingly simple discipline.. So if I learn something ....always do. I will want to improve on and with that. Thanx JB
I've always flown with an omni and a linear for that very reason - that half the ding dongs at races with patch antennae fly with them pointed straight at the ground. I have fewer video problems than most people and I swear the linear is my secret weapon!
I wonder how long until there are goggles that used phased array antennas to electronically "aim" and "focus" the antenna onto the quad automatically...
With wireless microphones true diversity with 2 different types of attenas you always get lots of drop outs since it won’t switch back and forth as often. With 2 matching types you get consistent coverage with no drops. What is different with fpv that lets you run 2 different types without causing issues?
One issue with antennas that metal I proximity will affect it also not just block. (Detuning and absorption I believe). Rule of thumb is 2 wavelengths. That would be 12 which is pretty long but shorter is still going to help vs right on the goggle. Same for the quad in proximity to the carbon/electronics I’m thinking.
Why not use some antenna extensions or longer ones to bring them up above the goggles more? I don't imagine it will be higher than your head, so same issue regardless?
Do some folks fly with one antenna? I didn't hear him say to put a terminator on the empty connector to provide for less loss from the unused branch. This would not apply if there is a separate receiver for each antenna.
Great video. Still relevant over time. Would love to see a updated for digital systems n hope to see new giant quad pathes or double decker lollipop designs are almost awe inspiring. But are they practical 🤔 one must only wounder n buy n try..
Wouldn’t it make more sense to swap the positions of the stubby omnis? The two antennae are meant to compensate for each other’s null. With the horizontal stubby on the bottom, isn’t the vertical stubby on top blocking the horizontal stubby’s coverage above your head (which is also the null of the vertical antenna)? If you swapped positions, the horizontal stubby would have a clear path to catch all of the signal above your head.
I run an ION positioned vertically with a triumph horizontally in front of and below it (coax is bent like a ?) To use the triumph to take care of the ION's big null and crosspolarization all at once
Hey Josh, I have been flying this way for about two years now and it works well for me and I agree with this great advice. You're also right about most people dropping their head while flying and I use a couple Aomway CPs bent back so they are oriented correctly when I have the goggles on, which help avoid flying into the null of the antennas. *One question though, what DVR monitor is that?* It looks perfect for a shirt pocket! I can't help but mention that your Ultimate FPV Shopping List doesn't have any FPV DVR Monitors.
Have you tried one straight stubby and one right angle stubby? I just got my first set of fpv goggles.I accidentally ordered one straight and one right angle. Im going to give it a try today.
I always fly standing sideways and have my patch point out the side because I do have a tendency to look up when I fly, and having out the side no matter if I look up or down its still facing the same.
RE: antennas on stalks - your head is a giant blob of RF-blocking water. Getting the antenna up and away from it as much as possible is only going to be beneficial (or you could just not fly behind yourself).
D Morgan I would say 2 omnis is also useful in a high mulipath environment while a patch antenna is useful for everyday flying where you cauldron face the patch antenna at a difficult place for video or if u want to go farther in one direction
Thank you “know it all”. I have been wondering about this. The stubby would be a lot nicer in the bag. Im switching mine out like this to see how it does.
Hey JB, I use the menace RC periscope, designed to go above your head. I also use an aomway antenna, as I had a fake axi, an Uxi, and I got better range with the aomway. I may try my patch from menace RC when I go back to the spot, see if it does me any better.
I started to use 2 stubby omnis on my realacc achillies, just for the convinience of not having to screw on/off my antennas all the time, as I don't usually fly far from myself the range is acceptable, oven though it's not the best range wise.
Ever tried any of the VAS/IBCrazy antennas? I'm not super impressed with their omni,... I think a pagoda does better, but their crosshair is a different story. Seems to beat others in directional performance, and almost does as good of a job as an omni,....for flights on the horizon. I just ordered their newer crosshair and am going to try mounting it and the older one at 90 degrees to each other horizontally with a slight up-tilt on the older crosshair to cover flights overhead. Doing this on Rapidfire, so will be a challenge mounting them soo close. For my tests, I'm just watching the RSSI bars on the rapidfire,..... I'm sure there's some error there, but I think it gives me a good idea.
Rather than run 2X omnis, it would be better to run 1 omni sticking straight out and a directional aimed straight out as well. THis way the directional does most of the work and the omni covers the rest (except behind you). This is also better because the goggles will not interfere with the antenna radiation pattern as much.
Or going higher up. A telescopic pole like the ones window washers use is cheap and holds cable inside. Your local HAM radio shop has the right cable, And a cheap tripod using your backpack as counterweight will hold the pole without tipping over. And you can keep using just one omni-directional antennae with this.
Putting the antennae at the end of a long cable, and having it be high up. 5-10 meters up from the ground, most things that could lower the RF signal isnt an issue anymore.
Tired of trying to remember to keep my head pointed where I'm flying, think I'm going to give two omnis a shot. Now to figure out how to get two stalked Strix Hoots to stay on RapidFire at an approximately 90 degree angle.
HELP NEEDED: I have a URUAV UR65 and after a small crash, motor 3 no longer spins. all it does is make a quiet buzzing sound. When arming the drone, the motors increase in noise pitch until it disarms and beeps once (long) then a gap and it beeps again (long i think). Im not sure what this corresponds to and cant find anything in the settings telling me of a problem. Is the motor unusable or can it be fixed? Apologies for this being irrelevant but i really need help from more experienced fliers.
@@JoshuaBardwell alright, I feared that might have been the case. Watched all of the vids on remapping resources but mine seemed just broke. Was a friend's which was scaring me Haha. Thanks for the help Josh
I've never understood the use of a patch on FPV Goggles for the reasons you mentioned. With the 90 degree offset omni antennas, you're using the same principal we've used for years with our aircraft receivers to get better diversity. I think the patch would be best served on a ground station when doing long range FPV. Good explanation. See you in the Air!
I just bought a right angle and one straight. I just noticed you have two right angles. Did I get the wrong one? Also does it make sense to use the double axii instead? Or is there not much difference
Ciao, io ho il tbs fusion nei miei fatshark, in modalità fusion devo usare due antenne uguali tra loro o posso anche usare una patch e una omni? Grazie
Thanks for the very good demonstration! As long as the same problem of gain direction if affecting the transmitter antenna, do you think that one day we will see diversity transmitter? Perhaps it requires using 2 different frequencies..
I have the Eachine 200D quadversity goggles. Can I use just 2 antennas on it and expect the same results as dual diversity only goggles? If I use just 2 antenna can they be attached to any of the 4 connectors available?
Kinda why I ended up with 3 Orqa patches and one pagoda omni for my EV200Ds. One patch on a short extension pointed forward, two on 45-degree adapters pointed to the left and right rear, Pagoda pointed up. I did originally have a TFP pointed forward instead of an Orqa patch - the TFP seemed better at long range, but the Orqa ones are lighter. They also look cool. What is this static of which you speak? ;)
The only reason for two "omni" antennas on my achilles module is: Flying with other pilots! It helps to avoid frequency disturbances! The patch tends to "catch" other signals better. Whenever I fly alone, always patch with omni. Been holding my head calm and aware of direction for a long time now, yay what a good habit! xD Oh, and my Omnis are sticking out above my head, just like as many others have it!
I like keeping a patch antenna on hand in case I lose a quad. I can direction find it. Take off all the omnis and put just the patch on. Turn head toward best video signal. Walk that way.
There is only one condition - the battery can not get out of the drone... it often happens to me: /
I take the antenna off entirely it's much more sensitive at that point and super directional. Now if I'm out a mile than a directional antenna could work but, at that point I'd probably be using the gps from the osd because if you're flying more than a half mile or so you should really have a gps on it.
@@_antwonTT6 also you can get GPS for like 10 dollars
@@_antwonTT6 For a RX, it doesn't cause any damage as it isn't transmitting anything.
That's the best way. Also, turn down your video transmitter to 25mw when you get closer (if you have smart audio.) This allows you to better differentiate a bad signal from a good one. If you had it on 800mw, then you'll get very clear video no matter which way you turn.
Reasons I’ve been using two axii stubbies:
1) i don’t have to take them off to put the goggles in my bag.
How do you attach 2?!! I even bought a wrench and the second antena has no room! Am I crazy or what
@@michaelbryant3643 I have the same problem! Did you find a solution?
How to fit the direction of the antenna? Can we turn it 360⁰ until fit the direction toward the sky?
@@michaelbryant3643 easy! Just use an extender! Ive been doing this since July and ive had great results w the Wildfire (until just 3 days ago where i pushed my limits and was shocked that my reception wasnt better!)… ill keep the antennas but swapping out my module for the Rapidfire).
lol i was thinking the same thing. do they fit right on a skyzone sky0x4 pro?
Josh, try the following: use a patch and an Omni on a long coax. The coax should be long enough that the ant sits over your head. Now what I’ve noticed with the rapid fire: even if you go behind the patch, the module still prefers the patch while it is definitely weaker (which I see with the bars).
That fact alone shows that this module is not really good in getting the most out of the theoretical dream team (patch and Omni on a long coax).
So now I use the 15cm coax Omni and a tiny stubby. The long coax is easily bendable and can stay on as well.
Sorry for my long comment, greets, Mario
Years ago I read that diversity is used to reduce the effects of destructive interference where part of the signal reflects of something and therefore arrives a little later at the antenna. Because the paths don't have the same lenght anymore, constructive and destructive interference can occur. So you use two antennas that are spaced out a bit, so that when one experiences destrucive interference, you can switch to the other that hopefully doesn't.
My guess is that if you use two omnis, you get reduced interference problems, which in some cases might even be better than a patch.
I lost it when you were all '...AND THERE HEADS ARE ALL LIKE THIS! *looks straight down*'. I literally bust out laughing. It's so true.
For the bottom omni, just use the regular stubby (not the right angle one). Still 90 degree to the top one, without the fitment issue.
The other reason to use two omnis when racing is because the range/penetration of the patch isn’t needed. And the patch’s high gain can be a detriment when a competitor’s quad flies close to you on the near side of the track. Yes, even if they are on a different but nearby channel, it messes with your video signal.
BTW, works great with a standard diversity module too. Not just for Rapidfire.
TweakRacer this is what I wanted to know. For the bottom antenna just use the regular short stubby and for the top a 90 degree one. Thanks
JB, helping all the Stevie Wonder head movers out in the FPV community.
Theibault 😂
One of the most basic concepts from getting your ham license is the higher the antenna, the better reception. It makes a lot of sense that putting the antennas closer to your face and goggle is going to result in weaker reception. I find too often that I'm looking down and flying behind me, and my omni isn't tall enough for that. Gotta make that effort to keep my head up. Good info, as always, JB.
3 years later after video i finally understand a little more. great content man. fyi ive been watching jb for 1 year almost and watch his latest stuff.
I have a Foxeer Lollipop Stubby and a Foxeer Patch antenna. Taking into consideration of Your video explaining antennas and placement, I have my patch antenna facing the Omni’s weakest point. I’ve always never felt comfortable flying behind me, but this video help me feel more confident in the choice I made:
Fatshark Hdo
Rapid Fire Module
Foxeer Patch
Foxeer Lollipop Stubby.
Works as explained in this video; I don’t feel comfortable flying behind myself as I always fly in the same direction I am facing.
Just got a rapid fire and discovered the following: when using the frame combining mode (as opposed to traditional diversity), the signal is fantastic while flying in the area the patch is pointed (obviously), but when flying behind the patch, the signal is much worse than if I was using a non-diversity rx with just an omni. I believe this is because the module is blending in some frames from the patch even when it is breaking up badly. Switching to 2 omnis completely solved this. The difference was amazing.
So this is one of those things that I always wondered about, because it made perfect sense, but it made so much sense that I assumed it would be in the common sense category. Yet so many pilots, if not all, highly recommended omni and patch so I just kind of took them at their word. I'm glad I'm not the only one who questioned it.
6:30 "oh boy" that reaction you know something is absolutely broken.
JB that was the best damn cliff's notes easy to understand way of explaining this stuff. The flashlight focus analogy of antenna db was spot on. Great video.
I was watching this at night (I was sleepy), so after he dropped the antenna, like a minute later I was like, "Wait, didn't I drop something, I should probably look at what I dropped." And I literally started looking around my bed.
I use Rapidfire and have been refusing to switch to the two omni setup (although I see everyone else at races doing it), precisely because I did a similar side-by-side comparison and didn't like what I saw. Glad to know that it wasn't because I somehow didn't have my trial two omni setup right. My setup: one omni with ~3-inch extension (the one that came with TrueRC X-Air) to clear the goggle and my head, bent slightly backward to compensate my looking down + one directional, aiming ~30-degree up. Works GREAT
Anyone else hear the crack when he cranked down on that antenna? OMG
Then there was no more DVR footage on the video. I bet he broke the Rx. 😂
Oh something broke for sure.. kinda want an update of that Joshua, what broke?
I dout it, if anything it just sounded like the shell over twisted and popped slightly
@@RobbieFPV Haha, he already dropped that too
Thanks Mr.Bardwell... you are very fast with your responses... unlike some of those other guy's... thanks again.
Great video Josh. My awesome wife just bought me the ev200d and some patch anntennas for my birthday. Steppin up from some cheap box goggles. Cant wait to improve my reception!!!!!!
I know it's 5 yrs old, but this video is timely. I'm about to switch from omni/patch combo to 2 stubbies, but I'm going to use extensions to get them above the goggles and my big, water-filled head.
is it good?
@TobiZ2612 I think it's better for what I do (generally fairly short range freestyle). I screwed up and only got 1 extension, so I'm not using that yet, but I have nothing but truerc rchp stubbies on my hdzero goggles and everything is working great (knock wood). I do still HAVE a patch because I like the idea that if I lose a quad, I can use it's more directional nature to help find it, but they are stowed deep in the toolbox. Stubbies for life!
Nice test Josh!
That head full of water attached to the goggles probably does more RF blocking than the goggles ?
well it depends but at least it doesn't have a significant EMF like the electronics in the goggles
i always run my antennas 45 degrees tilted back so i know that when i lower my head down after like a minute of flying, its still going to be horizontal.
Pretty sure they do single axis antenna trackers that fit in the module bay in the goggles.
Always need to pick the antennas for your environment too. I know a lot of people stopped using patches at races, lots of people + high gain antennas means that you might pick up other people's video as well because the antenna is so sensitive. Also, with something like rapid fire, certain situations it might be better to have a left omni and a right omni, or even no antenna believe it or not in a really high multi path environment, eg CDRA Nationals inside the football practice area indoors.
I run two omni antennas and two patches, one super high gain and one medium gain. Loving the EV-200D goggles!
just hate that i have to use RP-SMA to SMA adapters
you put 2 omni at same side or you mix ?
@@laurentdinodrone7111 I think it would work either way but I usually run an omni and a patch on each side. I just forget the patches for miniquad stuff tho. With patches I can have acceptable video at over a mile, assuming I point my head in the right direction.
@@crudboy12 ok thanks
I use an Omni and a patch, and I usually have my head down out of habit from my box goggle days. The way I counteract this is I use a 45 degree sma adapter on my patch so that it points forwards. The adapter came with my True-D so it works out well
Been using 2 omnis for a while now, seems to work great on eachine goggles 2, 1 straight and 1 bent over, aomway rhcp
This video helps a lot. Just got into freestyle quads and picked up HDOs and a rapidfire module. Thank you
Du machst gute Arbeit mit dein Videos 👍🏻
You make a good job!!
Using the stubbies does make it easier to store, especially in a back pack. Long stems antennas will give you better reception because you get away from your radio absorbing melon. But you have to remove or cleverly pack our goggles with long stem roses. So it’s a trade off, what works best for you is totally up to you and how you fly.
Man your cicadas sound SO pleasant compared to the screaming banshee's that we have in AUS
Loved the video Josh, glad to he a Patriot of your channel, trying to catch one of your Monday steams but in always working haha
Keep it up! Hopefully all is well after the tough times last week
Happy Flying!!
I'd like to see you redo this test with 4 omni's on the HDZero
I'm new to fpv, I use omni + crosshair on rapidfire. I lost video signal from super clean to 0 in a split second, disarmed and the quad rolled into the water (still working) but I'll definetly buy another omni because patches are too risky when you're not doing longrange.
Sounds like you lost video not the signal. Maybe.
What do u think of helicals? I made two. 7 turn and 5 turn
They work really well for me. I use thick copper wire. I get the best range vs others with a homade 5 turn helical on my rotg01 reciever I dvr off my laptop. I was going to try two helicals on my goggles just facing different directions. I've haven't tried that yet . I always use a helical and triumph
I've been rocking a 3 turn for 2.5 years now. Great antennas and far overlooked by many.
@@DT-gun yeah that's awsome. infact I just built today another more accurate 7 turn. It's unbelievable how great it works. Better then store bought antennas. And let me tell ya I'm no expert. Very simple to build. I turn the thick copper wire on a bolt in a vise then the wire just free stands because it's thick enough. 15mm width of helicals center to center of wire, 12.9mm separation up and down between turns,50mm square or round piece of metal for ground. I use old coax from old antennas. The thicker wire also increases the band width. That's it.
I run a tripple feed/10 turn helical combo for longer ranges
@@brandonharrsch8318 what's a triple feed?
I just pre-ordered my HDO2 and ordered a patch and an Omni on my TBS fusion. We shall see!!
Love my TBS fusion. I flown with 2 omnis since starting fpv almost 3 years ago. I now use a Long range lumenier axii 2 and a lumenier axii 2 stubby, with a long range axii2 on the quad. It's awesome!
I always have a patch on hand, and normally did run a true rc one. But now that the v2 axii2 are out I run one stub right angle and a normal stub. Best ever!
I have a stubby axii on my quad and it is a drastic decrease in reception. With a stubby on a quad the frame and battery itself becomes the interference. switched to a 3 inch longer axii and the reception is now very clear in the same area as nothing blocks the antenna reception. never used a stubby before....will not again lol
Always love your content, and your info helped me build my first quad. Remember how you got here... being real.. this is-1st vid I’ve seen where it’s seems like ur pitching or angling for something down the road. Or maybe, you’ve got your first $ deal to continue.. in which case, I’ve been there and understand. You’re content has always been the best, but want to make sure you stay on path as a business owner.. I can’t wait till the next vid, as always.
I don't know what you think you're picking up on. This is just a video explaining why people are using two omni antennas. There's no pitch or angle here. The video was sparked by the release of the Lumenier stubby, but you can do this with whatever antenna you want.
@@JoshuaBardwell Thanks for your reply. Not sure either.. just seemed a little weird. Maybe bc I am used to seeing you at your desk. My apologies for assuming commercial motives- don't really know what I was thinking. Also, just watched your apology video. -- From the viewers perspective: We don't care about any of that; just love your vids. I didn't know anything about it until I saw your vid about it. And who the hell does this other guy think he is... Don't forget---YOU ARE JOSH F*%&^%^* BARDWELL- You're the man and don't have to put up with some whiney-a** small-fry business owner. Just crush him and forget it. Delete anything you want on your platform. You built it with hard work, (not him) so delete any comment that gets a little lippy, with a tone you don't like. Including mine. All the best
It's funny, I recently tested this myself. Got very linear, snowy noise with two omnis. Totally flyable. But I got this abrupt breakup, felt like it's going away completely any moment with an omni and a patch.
Thanks JB , been asking about that subject. But no one ever wanted to explain why they were doing it.✌️😎
As always thanks Bardwell!
I run two TBS triumph’s on my rapidfire, works fantastic!👌
Wearable base station signal tracking switching (hat) with an array of patches and onmis?
withRF shield in hat... Just a thought. I know face the direction of quad is a seemingly simple discipline.. So if I learn something ....always do.
I will want to improve on and with that. Thanx JB
I've always flown with an omni and a linear for that very reason - that half the ding dongs at races with patch antennae fly with them pointed straight at the ground. I have fewer video problems than most people and I swear the linear is my secret weapon!
What antennas do you use?
I wonder how long until there are goggles that used phased array antennas to electronically "aim" and "focus" the antenna onto the quad automatically...
I'm a newbee... this information was perfect. Thanks!
With wireless microphones true diversity with 2 different types of attenas you always get lots of drop outs since it won’t switch back and forth as often. With 2 matching types you get consistent coverage with no drops. What is different with fpv that lets you run 2 different types without causing issues?
Well done JB! I just had this question so this is awesome timing! Thank you
One issue with antennas that metal I proximity will affect it also not just block. (Detuning and absorption I believe). Rule of thumb is 2 wavelengths. That would be 12 which is pretty long but shorter is still going to help vs right on the goggle.
Same for the quad in proximity to the carbon/electronics I’m thinking.
Why not use some antenna extensions or longer ones to bring them up above the goggles more? I don't imagine it will be higher than your head, so same issue regardless?
I run a crosshair extreme and a 3 turn helical with my rapidfire... Hands down best antenna combo I have tried.
Do some folks fly with one antenna? I didn't hear him say to put a terminator on the empty connector to provide for less loss from the unused branch. This would not apply if there is a separate receiver for each antenna.
Great video. Still relevant over time. Would love to see a updated for digital systems n hope to see new giant quad pathes or double decker lollipop designs are almost awe inspiring. But are they practical 🤔 one must only wounder n buy n try..
Wouldn’t it make more sense to swap the positions of the stubby omnis? The two antennae are meant to compensate for each other’s null. With the horizontal stubby on the bottom, isn’t the vertical stubby on top blocking the horizontal stubby’s coverage above your head (which is also the null of the vertical antenna)? If you swapped positions, the horizontal stubby would have a clear path to catch all of the signal above your head.
You should check out the FXT HD-DVR for recording. I am very pleased with the output on processed videos. Better than the actual fpv feed.
I run an ION positioned vertically with a triumph horizontally in front of and below it (coax is bent like a ?) To use the triumph to take care of the ION's big null and crosspolarization all at once
Hey Josh, I have been flying this way for about two years now and it works well for me and I agree with this great advice. You're also right about most people dropping their head while flying and I use a couple Aomway CPs bent back so they are oriented correctly when I have the goggles on, which help avoid flying into the null of the antennas. *One question though, what DVR monitor is that?* It looks perfect for a shirt pocket! I can't help but mention that your Ultimate FPV Shopping List doesn't have any FPV DVR Monitors.
Lumenier dx600 dvr
Joshua Bardwell - Thanks JB!
Is it wrong that I have been using both RH & LH omnis with a whip on the quad?
Good stuff, as always, Joshua!
Have you tried one straight stubby and one right angle stubby? I just got my first set of fpv goggles.I accidentally ordered one straight and one right angle. Im going to give it a try today.
I always fly standing sideways and have my patch point out the side because I do have a tendency to look up when I fly, and having out the side no matter if I look up or down its still facing the same.
That quad be like ( Hey Josh u forget me I'm frying here in sun 😡🥵). 😂
Smaller is better for me, and as I don't do long range, 2 omnis offer me a better coverage at proximity flying :)
Dude. I was just wondering about this yesterday. Thanks a ton for the video.
I have a patch and look down a lot, but was smart enough to get a 45 connector so its pointed to where im flying
Great advice as always but what was up with that minute long setup at the beginning? Lol
RE: antennas on stalks - your head is a giant blob of RF-blocking water. Getting the antenna up and away from it as much as possible is only going to be beneficial (or you could just not fly behind yourself).
Thanks for this video Joshua! Very helpful for me! Hugs from Italy and happy fly.
2 omnis is ONLY useful FOR RAPIDFIRE, not traditional diversity IMO patch is much more needed w less sensitive modules.
D Morgan I would say 2 omnis is also useful in a high mulipath environment while a patch antenna is useful for everyday flying where you cauldron face the patch antenna at a difficult place for video or if u want to go farther in one direction
Wow, Bardwell from 3 years ago. Covid was good for the hobby game. I can't lie, that's how I found FPV.
Thank you “know it all”. I have been wondering about this. The stubby would be a lot nicer in the bag. Im switching mine out like this to see how it does.
Hey JB, I use the menace RC periscope, designed to go above your head. I also use an aomway antenna, as I had a fake axi, an Uxi, and I got better range with the aomway. I may try my patch from menace RC when I go back to the spot, see if it does me any better.
I started to use 2 stubby omnis on my realacc achillies, just for the convinience of not having to screw on/off my antennas all the time, as I don't usually fly far from myself the range is acceptable, oven though it's not the best range wise.
Ever tried any of the VAS/IBCrazy antennas? I'm not super impressed with their omni,... I think a pagoda does better, but their crosshair is a different story. Seems to beat others in directional performance, and almost does as good of a job as an omni,....for flights on the horizon. I just ordered their newer crosshair and am going to try mounting it and the older one at 90 degrees to each other horizontally with a slight up-tilt on the older crosshair to cover flights overhead. Doing this on Rapidfire, so will be a challenge mounting them soo close.
For my tests, I'm just watching the RSSI bars on the rapidfire,..... I'm sure there's some error there, but I think it gives me a good idea.
Would adding a bendable SMA extension help to push the omni antennas out of the way for clearer and better reception?
Rather than run 2X omnis, it would be better to run 1 omni sticking straight out and a directional aimed straight out as well. THis way the directional does most of the work and the omni covers the rest (except behind you). This is also better because the goggles will not interfere with the antenna radiation pattern as much.
Why can't be there a spherical patch antenna??
Is there a super wide 170degree patch? Meta-material dish? Would be perfect for anyone not flying behind themselves.
Nice idea, but would have been nice to see it in action with the 2 axii's
I Run Two TrueRC 5.8GHz X²-AIR Antenna's On my Laforge. I Love It Never Looking Back, The Image Is So Crisp For Days. Even When A Few Miles Out.
So I guess an optimal setup would be a ground station with multiple receivers facing all directions
Or going higher up. A telescopic pole like the ones window washers use is cheap and holds cable inside. Your local HAM radio shop has the right cable, And a cheap tripod using your backpack as counterweight will hold the pole without tipping over. And you can keep using just one omni-directional antennae with this.
@@TheEviling can you please explain this !
I mean what are you talking about
Putting the antennae at the end of a long cable, and having it be high up. 5-10 meters up from the ground, most things that could lower the RF signal isnt an issue anymore.
On my RF I fly a MenaceRC Periscope on the top, and a Lumenier AXII normal stubby on the bottom. Found it perfect for racing.
since I use rapidfire I´m always using two omnis...its so much more comfortable for everyday use and it doesnt affect reception in low range freestyle
Tired of trying to remember to keep my head pointed where I'm flying, think I'm going to give two omnis a shot. Now to figure out how to get two stalked Strix Hoots to stay on RapidFire at an approximately 90 degree angle.
Make a V out of them.
How to get two right angle stubies to one reveiver without extender?
When I fly whoops in my house, which is a 3000sf maze, I find an omni and a cross hair seem to work best.
Why not point the dead point of the omni forward instead of up and run the patch to fill the hole?
That would give much worse coverage to the back. But viable.
What if you put an L extender on one and strait extender on the other Omni antenna! Thanks, Josh!
HELP NEEDED: I have a URUAV UR65 and after a small crash, motor 3 no longer spins. all it does is make a quiet buzzing sound. When arming the drone, the motors increase in noise pitch until it disarms and beeps once (long) then a gap and it beeps again (long i think). Im not sure what this corresponds to and cant find anything in the settings telling me of a problem. Is the motor unusable or can it be fixed?
Apologies for this being irrelevant but i really need help from more experienced fliers.
Probably the best approach is to replace the motor.
@@JoshuaBardwell alright, I feared that might have been the case. Watched all of the vids on remapping resources but mine seemed just broke. Was a friend's which was scaring me Haha.
Thanks for the help Josh
I've never understood the use of a patch on FPV Goggles for the reasons you mentioned. With the 90 degree offset omni antennas, you're using the same principal we've used for years with our aircraft receivers to get better diversity. I think the patch would be best served on a ground station when doing long range FPV. Good explanation. See you in the Air!
I just bought a right angle and one straight. I just noticed you have two right angles. Did I get the wrong one?
Also does it make sense to use the double axii instead? Or is there not much difference
Double Axii has narrower coverage pattern. More range in front and back. Less top and bottom.
Deffently picking up a set of these. Thanks jb
Ciao, io ho il tbs fusion nei miei fatshark, in modalità fusion devo usare due antenne uguali tra loro o posso anche usare una patch e una omni? Grazie
Thanks for the very good demonstration! As long as the same problem of gain direction if affecting the transmitter antenna, do you think that one day we will see diversity transmitter? Perhaps it requires using 2 different frequencies..
i went with the same stubbies and it was the best combo for me. also they stay attached ant fit inside the goggle case assembled to goggles
Can I fly with 1 stubby in the meantime? I have dji goggles w adapter for RF and Mobula6. Thanks.
I have the Eachine 200D quadversity goggles. Can I use just 2 antennas on it and expect the same results as dual diversity only goggles? If I use just 2 antenna can they be attached to any of the 4 connectors available?
Kinda why I ended up with 3 Orqa patches and one pagoda omni for my EV200Ds. One patch on a short extension pointed forward, two on 45-degree adapters pointed to the left and right rear, Pagoda pointed up.
I did originally have a TFP pointed forward instead of an Orqa patch - the TFP seemed better at long range, but the Orqa ones are lighter. They also look cool.
What is this static of which you speak?
;)
If your running two Omnis on the TRUE DX would they have to be to left hand?
The only reason for two "omni" antennas on my achilles module is: Flying with other pilots!
It helps to avoid frequency disturbances! The patch tends to "catch" other signals better.
Whenever I fly alone, always patch with omni. Been holding my head calm and aware of direction for a long time now, yay what a good habit! xD
Oh, and my Omnis are sticking out above my head, just like as many others have it!
Why not 2 patch 1 from front to back and the other one side to side