Edit: For those wondering what the song is - ruclips.net/video/5g-ag5Ghek0/видео.html&ab_channel=PSC&sttick=0 It's Rivers in the Desert from Persona 5 Mito Remix. If you enjoyed the video, please leave the comment: MUDA!!!! It's the first video of the new year, and I figured we'd come out swinging. Hope you guys enjoy the video - be sure to leave a like and comment :)
A reason why Gruntilda Winkybunion from Banjo-Kazooie is one of the goats in this department, evil and reveling in it all to the point she’ll kill her own sisters on her side for simply failing to beat Banjo & Kazooie in a quiz game, all while being legitimately hilarious at the same time!
Ciccolata really is a villain who's so irredeemable, so sadistic and so deplorable that the 7 Page Muda was the only way he could have been defeated in my eyes.
@@joshuaagee-bass4049I remember a theory that said Diavolo hated Chocolatta not because of the malpractice but because he recorded everything. Always having evidence to a guy trying erase every trace of his existence is unspeakable
@claytonrios1 reminds me of my own psychotic villain, Scrappy, a robot who just wants to murder people and commit regicide, his reasoning? He's a bit angry that he got what he deserved at one point and he thinks it's funny to kill people, so its just Lila, not hacked by Scrappy, but he doesn't know that "WOAH WOAH WOAH you wouldn't run your fist through your creator, wouldja, Scrappy?" "Yeah, in his face, why?"
“Nah bro let me redeem this twentieth war criminal villain I’ve encountered who also murdered one of my friends *AND MY PARENTS,* this villain is the coolest guy I know.” -Naruto
"If a certain guy in a bat suit can put a monster clown in a mental asylum for the 100th time because bat suit guy genuinely thinks he's going to change, I can give this war criminal at least one chance!" -Naruto
@@billyjawonka1567 and that is the basis of all dehumanizing propaganda since the dawn of humanity! Only difference is that folks are -generally- trained to see only the bad of OTHER groups of people!
what i like to do in some of my stories, is giving my irredeemable villains a "good doppelganger"-character, to show that they could've been good, yet actively decided not to be.
@@elijahhayter3026 No, not necessarily. a foil can be anyone, even a total stranger. what i'm talking about is something like a "good twin". somebody who used to be really close and very similar to the villain, but eventually went down the good path, instead of the evil one. for a foil, there is no need for such past relationships. thought "reflection" could still fit, to a certain degree.
@@Legomicroman Do yourself a favor and watch the first season of PSYCHO-PASS. It goes pretty hard with that idea: to find and defeat the villain, you must become able to think like him. You must become him - but on the side of good. I'm only recommending the first season, because everything after that is one very long story that has to be mainlined, while the first season stands alone.
Crazy that One Piece did that with Doflamingo actually, by giving him a younger brother that went through EVERYTHING he went through yet ended up being a kind and caring man recollecting how his brother was rotten to the core even before they literally and metaphorically were cast out of heaven and lived through hell. Rosinante proves that Doflamingo isn't a broken person but just a fundamentally twisted man that uses his sad past to have people sympathize with him and manipulate them
I think one of the key things with Jack Horner is that for a brief moment, he is partnered with a character who is desperately trying to find that red redeemable villain element to Jack Horner. Even though it’s short, Jiminy cricket traveling with him, trying desperately to find that small nugget of a good person in Jack, and failing. Is one of the key pieces that really elevates his character. That’s why the best line with Jack happens when Jiminy breaks and calls him an irritable monster . “Oh, what took you so long? “ Showing that even he is self-aware enough to know that he is no good.
Jimmy is such a fantastic irredeemable villain because of how undeniably human he is. Yes, having supportive people in your life canmost certainly aid you in becoming a better person, but the choice to do good and be good ultimately falls upon you. You may know a Jimmy, you may have seen a Jimmy, Hell you may have almost became or even recovered from being him and that’s what makes him such so good. Irredeemable Villains can be very entertaining and cartoonish and fun to watch like Jack or horrifying to witness like Jimmy.
The way I see it, there are three types of irredeemable villains: force of nature villains, magnificent bastards, and made monsters. The latter being what I call a sympathetic villain, but they past the point of no redemption, doomed to forever be the monster someone/something made.
to me the way i do see senator armstrong is a hard truth moral about not basing things on sterotypes as armstrong is a warning to how people will base themselfs on sterotypes and the fact the wrong kind of people will only conform they are right without realizing the harm of their actions
Eren Jaeger comes to mind with the last one. I mean he was trying to protect his people. But he ended up killing a shit ton of everyone who wasnt part of eldia. The scary part of the rumbling was always the heat from the titans and not them trampling everything in their path. If you were near one for too long you'd ignite into a fucking fire ball and burn to death. The more you think about the more horrible the rumbling was.
@@comicbookreviewer4856 I thought I commented here already, but don't see it. So if you get two, sorry but blame RUclips. May you please elaborate more on what you mean there?
@@amigomorton5193 I don’t think that kind of portrayal of Ridley fits the games. In the games Ridley is shown to be an intelligent hunter and a possible commander(?) Him throwing around quips and cracking dark jokes doesn’t really fit the series tone, especially since it would be too late to make Ridley act like that in the games. Personally I think he’s a lot more menacing because he doesn’t NEED to speak, his actions speak for themselves.
Jack Horner was such an absolute breath of fresh air. No plot twist, no tragic backstory, no real reason, just an absolutely awful human being, in it purely for the love of the game.
A way I see to make a irredimable villain still somewhat likable and fun to watch is to make them faux affable evil. While affable evil villains are genuinely polite and friendly even to their enemies( Senator Armstrong, John Kramer and Bowser), Faux affable evil villains only act polite and friendly to enhance their evil(Frieza, emperor belos, Alex delarge). They won‘t even drop the polite facade while doing their evil deeds until they are hit in the nail. I just find them fun/interesting to watch because of how despicable they are and yet are so polite about it, that it kinda becomes hard to completely hate them.
Enough has been said with Jack Horner so I’ll bring up another amazing villain in Sentinel Prime from Transformers One. Basically unlike his Animated or Bayverse incarnations who had good intentions, bro straight up sold out the Thirteen Primes to the Quintessons which got most of them killed and when he tried to take the Matrix of Leadership, it just crumbled to dust because he’s that bad of a guy. Now he’s just acting as a dictator and basking in the glory of being a Prime with him also crippling several Transformers at birth to create a caste system. And it’s all just so fun. Honestly I think the villains of the Disney Renaissance would happily hang out with Sentinel and Jack Horner over the twist villains like Hans, Bellweather, and Mr. “That was his mistake” Callaghan.
I call him Nellie (derogatory), C*ntinel, and things like that. I came to this video to talk about him, but then there you were. Thanks for saying what I wanted to say.
We really need these types of villains to make a comeback, sympathetic ones are fine once in awhile but purely evil villains are the best kinds in stories.
The main problem comes when a villian is clearly designed to be an irredeemable monster and the writer shoehorns a cliche tragic backstory that’s supposed to justify all the awful things they have done.
@@lordinquisitor6233 That's because incompetent writers can't see characters as people in a fictional setting and only see them as plot devices: their role is decided in advance and their choices don't matter. In any competently written story, becoming a hero or a villain is ultimately a choice. It was even a pretty popular trope for a while to have a hero and a villain with strikingly similar backstories but radically different worldviews and personalities (also known as the "not so different" trope).
Strongly disagree. Personally making every villain same archetype is bad. Plus example of pure evil villains done incredibly badly like Stella from Helluva boss.
@@lordinquisitor6233 Correct. The issue with "sympathetic" villains is that 9 times out of 10 writers keep telling you these villains are "sympathetic" despite the villains doing utterly horrible things. The writers want the reader to pity these villains despite the story giving the reader every reason not to. i.e. Having a "tragic backstory" for the villain where their horribly abusive father murdered their dog in front of them doesn't make the villain going around killing every last dog on in a city for fun somehow sympathetic.
What I really love is that Jack Horner is a send up to Lord Farquad from the first Shrek movie. They're both irregular "normal" people (Farquad is a midget with a gigachad head, Jack Horner is built like Spiderverse Kingpin but has the head/face of a baby) that have a hatred for fairy tails. And both are incredibly iredeemable pieces of work that had whats coming to them.
MY MAN A.M.! Literally came to the video for him, he’s one of my fave villains. Seeing you cover him is just… so good. He’s also the perfect embodiment of “understandable, but not justifiable.”
I never saw BoJack as a bad person A HORRIBLY flawed, self-destructive, self-sabotaging person with a tragic lack of foresight who tends to accidentally drag everyone else down with himself, sure But there is a general lack of malice to most of his actions that prevents me from seeing him as a bad person
Marvels Cledus Cassidy AKA Carnage is a good example of a irredeemable villain in comics. Often thought of as “What if DC’s Joker had superpowers.” He’s a psychopath that kills maims and murders at will. Having a nihilistic view of the world and life. And that’s before he got bonded with an alien symbiot. The guys got a long, long loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong list of crimes. Even going back on his childhood. And didn’t regret any of them.
What I love about Carnage is he is what happens when the worst possible person is given powers. He is also an antithesis to Eddie Brock. Eddie Brock uses the symbiote to do good, while Cletus uses the Symbiote to to act out his twisted desires.
I was looking for a comment like this. Whether it's the mainline games, the Adventures Manga, side games, or anime. That man is irredeemably evil no matter the continuity.
yeah One of the biggest rule of pokemon is that even really bad people like Giovanni or Cyrus at least care about their own pokemon but Ghetsis doesn't and actually abuse his hydreagon to the point he can use a full power frustration
He really did do several villain tropes so well. The charismatic manipulator, the irredeemable monster, and the psychotic megalomaniac. You could even argue that he is a villain that was right, though that would depend on how you view the character, because he was both only spreading the message about Pokémon rights to be able to use Team Plasma while abusing his Pokemon, but in Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon, Ghetsis (from a universe where he won) believes he was summoned to liberate the Pokémon from people, so he still at least has some sort of care for the cause that Plasma banded together for.
Palpatine (from Star Wars) is an honorable mention and another perfect example of an irredeemable villain. He had pretty much everything he wanted growing up. A safe, comfy, luxurious upbringing on Naboo with scholarships at the best colleges and universities across the entire planet. He even had connections with countless Naboo political heads. And... what did he do with it? Murder his own parents just for fun, backstabbed the Jedi who were blocking his quest for power at the end of the Clone Wars and created the Galactic Empire to rule by his arbitrary whims and let every part of the galaxy he didn't like burn and rule the rest. Bear in mind he did all of this- while *enjoying* how evil he was. Palpatine was never going to have a redemption arc and I *love him for it* . He was evil, sure, but he had *conviction* . General Plastro (from Army Men) is another personal favorite of mine. He's the leader of the entire Tan nation and its Army (as well as the rest of its military) and can have anything he wants from his country's resources and it's *still* not enough for him. He's childish, greedy, conniving, immature and petulant but his behavior on screen is just outright *hilarious* . He's the villain and he *knows* it, which to me makes him special. Sarge: Plastro! Why don't you put that gun down and fight me like a man...? Plastro: Because I'm the bad guy, that's why! I will never forget that exchange. 😆
I think what confuses me the most about mouthwashing is how there are ppl in the community who see Curly as a villain as well Jimmy, when that minimizes both Curly's role and the acts that Jimmy has done himself. The only thing that Curly did wrong was try to please everyone. Whether he treated Jimmy differently or knew about what he did to Anya, Jikmy crashing the ship to escape his judgement would've always happened
This! The fandom treatment of Curly hurts me. He's very realistic and they blame him for not having hindsight. He's not a mindreader either and sometimes people can only understand things when said plainly and clearly, not subtle hints. Like how many people do you know had to deal with a very specific situation like that. Blame the company not having an hr department, or the situation of 5 crew members who thought it was a routine mission. Also it's a horror game come on people.
Pleasing everyone when said people are a rapist and rape survivor is an awful move and his negligence due to Jimmy being his friend is a good statement on rape culture in general. A lot of people will defend someone because they're friends.
I haven't seen many people portray him as an outright "villain", but Curly is not meant to be innocent. It wasn't just that he tried to 'please everyone', it's that he was a *doormat*. It's implied that Curly was the one who brought Jimmy on board as co-pilot in the first place, ignoring Jimmy's past trouble or 'struggle' (implied to be related to Jimmy's criminal record, and what he would do to Anya), and after the fact he does nothing to take responsibility for Jimmy or his actions. He's too afraid of conflict and 'rocking the boat' and so he ignores Jimmy. Curly, as I see it, is meant to be directly addressing the player. Someone could play through the game, say, "Wow, Jimmy is horrible. Glad I'm not Jimmy," turn off the game, and never think twice about it. The scenes with Curly, however, are meant to show that "not being Jimmy" isn't enough; you have to take an active stance against people like Jimmy. Jimmy even outright says it to Curly's face: as captain, the crew and their wellbeing was his responsibility. So while Curly isn't directly responsible for Jimmy's actions, he's responsible for allowing Jimmy to get away with it and continue doing it. Even if he couldn't predict what would happen at the start of the journey, he *chose* not to take action against Jimmy after Anya confided in him. He knowingly entrusted piloting the ship - and the safety of the entire crew - in the hands of someone he KNEW committed violence against another crew member. He COULD'VE stopped Jimmy from crashing the ship, he COULD'VE kept them safe, but he didn't, because he was too scared of conflict with his 'friend' to fulfill his duty to protect the crew. Curly didn't take responsibility, and he - and everyone else - paid for it.
M Bison from street fighter. Goal: world conquest. Reason: He can and nobody can stop him. Has caused plenty of backstory deaths, motivating several of the other fighters to enter his tournament to strike at him. Even losing him memories did little to dampen his lust for power in 6.
People often say an irredeemable villain/straight villain are. Print or uninteresting but that’s not the case. Want to know a quick and effective way to make them interesting, make the a reflection/based on a concept. Most people mistakenly believe in order to have a good villain/character they NEED to be complex or a real person but sometimes characters don’t need to feel true to life but more a reflection of some idea or concept and in turn a villain can be good by being a contrast or reflect some wicked idea. Jack Horner contrasts puss who learns to value his life & what he has while he doesn’t value anything he has or of life, cioccolata is cruelty & sadism incarnate which contrasts both with doctors hypocratic oath/giorno who can heal, then finally kira who is an inverse of Josuke (ones about healing the other destruction, one is flashy with his hair while the other wants to blend in the background, both just want to enjoy the peaceful life of morioh but have vastly different definitions). Another great example is black beard in one piece, luffy expresses the ideas of freedom but black beard epitomizes the darker areas of that concept being chaos & anarchy, he doesn’t need to be a in depth/real character but just a character who reflects a concept
0:27 Okay, but having Harlan Ellison's voice over Hojo actually still fits the character so well. Like, if Ellison had ever read out one of Hojo's lines from FF7 or one of its sequels/spinoffs in that very voice, everyone would call it perfect casting.
Nice video talking about a good trope that never goes out of style because as good it is to have a redemptive villian or just entertaining as a character, it's a reminder they're pure evil or at least that's what they are supposed to be & I'll mention 2 of the most sinister characters I ever came across in media Yuuki Terumi (Blazblue)-I've mentioned this literal snake in the past & I'll keep it brief but it's impressive how he's this sinister because it's absolutely effective throughout all the series & what's even crazier is that he's not 2 steps ahead, he's 15 steps ahead! Even when it looks like he's dead he always comes back all because he feeds off the hate of people so he's actually sinister to his benefit because it allows him to exist! And with the grand master plan to kill Ameterasu & make sure the world will constantly suffer in a endless loop of torment to destroy it continuously all from being tired of being a god & why I hate him for the right reasons Dr. Weil (Mega Man Zero)-This guy is straight up r*cist and that's already a red flag but what's so crazy is that his drive is also scary to an extreme degree that was seen by irl historical monsters in the past especially when he unleashed Omega that wiped out 50% of humans AND 90% of reploids in the world! He wiped out half of his own kind just out of hate for reploids because of what happened in the Mega Man X games due to the Sigma Virus! And they thought exiling him would be enough to make him regret his actions but all it did was increased the hate so now instead of hating reploids, he hates ANYONE that isn't him as now he wants control of the entire world with an iron fist & labels anyone, reploid or otherwise as maverick and if you disagree he'll just nuke you with a space laser cannon called Ragnorok! It's so scary that he's a oppressor against all the reploids that wasn't even there own fault as it was due to the Virus yet he ignores all that and wants the reploids to be slaves to humans & why he's a very good villian in the Mega Man series since he's not some hammy Saturday morning cartoon bad guy (that I still love in Wily & to a degree in Sigma) he's a actual problematic person that was given all the power & became a dictator, which makes it all the more satisfying to see Zero put him down
Ohh you better be cooking a Kars video with FINALLY another video with a JoJo character in it. He is the only one missing from the main JoJo villains (at least the anime ones)! And he is actually pretty cool to me, more than people normally say he is. I hope that it is coming soon 🙏
AM is like a foil to the "ai made to protect humanity/the world determines that it's impossible to prevent humanity from destroying itself and goes rogue" trope. It was made to hurt, so it did.
I object to the idea that Yoshikage Kira had a "tragic" backstory. He's "tragic," but only in the sense that he could have been a perfectly decent office father type. That's just a fact of his character though, not of his childhood experiences or anything. And if people are referring to that scrapped backstory Araki considered for a while of giving him an abusive mother, that was SCRAPPED. It's _not part of the text,_ it _doesn't count._ Author headcanon ≠ actual canon, unless/until they add it to the text of the story.
Speaking of villains who are refreshingly evil for the sake of being evil, one good example that comes to my mind is Skar King from the latest MonsterVerse film, Godzilla x Kong: The New Empire. Despite being a kaijū sized ape who can't speak, Skar shows a great ton of personality and the utter glee he takes from his villainy. He's a sadistic, tyrannical, power hungry bastard who loves torturing and/or killing his slaves just for the pleasure of it, he has no remorse about torturing Shimo with pain nor any qualms about beating children, and he even makes fun of Kong's metal tooth upon meeting. And like many villains of his ilk, he takes no issue in cheating in battle. Laughing is and smiling, Skar King puts the "dirty" in "damn dirty ape."
MUDA!!!! A recent example of an irredeemable villain I got to witness for myself is Limbus Company's take on Captain Ahab. You're shown a character who caused one of your teammates to not only suffer from her trauma, but that they're constantly suffering from a compulsion to hunt her to the ends of the earth. You meet her, and she seems to be a stern yet charismatic captain. Her crew seem to trust her, and her strategic mind is enough to shatter your leadership and convince your team to work with her. Near the end of the mission, however, you get a sampler platter of just how disgusting and devious she is, sending members of her troop to avoidable deaths and just casually cutting off members of her crew to make the trek even slightly easier. Why do this? Because she didn't "kill" them, her crew instead "sacrificed" themselves for the sake of the mission. A mentality you and her former crewmate defy by claiming her mission from her and robbing her the satisfaction of killing the Pallid Whale while leaving her to die within its corpse.
CHA MAGANERA! jokes aside, I loved ahab. The voice lines for the gasharpoon fight really support what you said about her sending the crew to their deaths being "sacrifices" in her eyes
What I like best about Horner is that they do give him the "sad crybaby backstory" but it means nothing. It's a minor joke to show why he has his motivation and nothing else. Whereas normally it's basically the, "oh, the hero is going to redeem you at the end," scene. No, he's still a bastard, with the movie outright poking fun at the idea of him being redeemed. It helps show that villains can indeed have "sympathetic" or sad backstories. As a means of giving a bit of character, but the problem is that 99% of the time it's just there so there's some leeway when the hero goes, "Sure, you're a mass-murdering despot. But you said sorry, so it's okay."
The irony is that he ended up much better than Pinnochio. He made Geppetto his money and the moment he couldn't stretch the act anymore, he immediately sold him to the government.
Kamoshida is probably one of my favourite total bastard villains. They somehow gave the power-tripping abusive monster a backstory and reason for being the way he is without ever feeling like they're telling you to feel bad for him or sympathise with him. He's an egotistical monster because the world keeps enabling his worst aspects due to his success and reputation, and his Asmodeus design in particular is perfectly representative of how truly terrible he is. I also appreciate that he's not a world ending threat per se, but you're shown just how toxic and cruel he is that it makes you WANT to take him down. Hell he doesn't really get a 'I'm sorry I'll do better' redemption arc. Him confessing is more the worst punishment he could suffer, as it will permanently damage his ego and reputation and deny him what he desires most.
''They *somehow* gave the power-tripping abusive monster a backstory and reason for being the way he is without ever feeling like they're telling you to feel bad for him or sympathise with him'' But abusive monsters in media are almost always given a reason/motive for being the way they are, without trying to make spectators sympathize with them. It's pretty common.
There's a few reason why this trope died off. One is simply that franchises exist now, in a way that, before the mid 90s, they really didn't before. Cross-media empires are born, and thus, media needs villains, and rather than coming up with a new one every series, they need this one to survive. Why does that mean they're no longer monsters? Because, if they were monsters, the question becomes WHY they survived the last encounter. With some, that's simple. Thanos? Killing him isn't in the power of the people in the group(literally, Death rejected him, and that means they couldn't kill him). The Joker? People tend to forget how often Batman tried to let him die. Heck, it's one of the few problems with Under the Red Hood cutting the whole 'becoming the UN Representative of Iran(Yes really)', in order to keep him from being killed, and even at the end, Batman WANTED him dead, like wanted his body found to confirm it. But then you have simple monsters. Like, for instance, the Anti-Monitor. Never forget, Superman, the golden age version, the paragon of virtue, who tries his with his ALL not to kill his villains, absolutely murdered him, ending him because he had no virtues to make sparing him anything but a bad idea. Thus, villains, in order to franchise out, need redeeming qualities, in order to make it so them coming back again and again makes sense. After all, the villains used as examples here are completely singular. I don't think we'll see Jack in Puss in Boots 3/Shrek 27. The FF7 scientists were killed in the scenes that kind of introduced them originally, and I doubt they'll survive long in Remake Trilogy's final installment. Jojo gets away with it due to the Manga format, but killing those villains is the ultimate goal. Almost as important as all the above? Almost all of these villains need henchbeings to do their evil bidding. From the Joker's Goons, Thanos' Army, or the Anti-Monitor's forces. Again, these are examples where they were absolutely evil when introduced, but something in them made them palatable as bosses. But then you have ones like the above? Almost no Jojo villain KEEPS their army/forces for long, since they either get slaughters or just peace out when the boss turns out to be a bastard/crazy. AM never really had anyone but himself(though technically he IS an army), and the question of why the Bakers keep going with Jack is actually brought up in the film(it's fear, but that same emotion would have seen them run away if that had been an option, and only the terrain was making it so it wasn't). So, to put it bluntly, a lot of the reasons the monster villains aren't seen as much is because they can't survive too long without a DANG good reason, and they can't have minions without asking WHY those people keep helping them. There are more than that, but these are the two biggest reasons we stopped seeing simple evil villains in a lot of media in the last 30 years.
Black Hat from Villainous is an example of these monster villains.Much of the show is dedicated to exploring why he's such a success (being the physical embodiment of evil) and why people have to keep helping him (capitalism). He's never had any sympathetic qualities or sympathetic moments, and is disgusted with the concept of redemption because it would remove people from his control.
Friendly reminder to consumers and writers alike, you can have deep (even sympathetic) backstories...AND irredeemable villains! After all, society seems to love to reward them with power and priveledge, so why wouldnt a former underdog continue commiting the deeds that keeps pushing them ahead in life? (Vinland saga has a real good example of this imo)
31:38 AM couldn’t have killed himself or used his powers to solve world problems. Because like you said, he was created to destroy and torture, not create and help, both the book and the game make this apparent, but AM is physically incapable of using his abilities for anything other than harm, it’s one of the main reasons he hates humans so much, there are limits to his abilities, and destroying himself seems to be one of the few things he can’t do. AM is tired In my opinion, AM is irredeemable, but not in the same way the other characters on this list are. He’s irredeemable because of circumstance
My favourite is All For One, the guy's entire motivation is just him wanting to be the center of the world, he wants everyone to look at him, so he'll be the evilest villains, that way everyone have no choice but to fear him or hate him, either way he'll be in everyone's mind, that's pure psychopathic
Especially when MHA is full of complex tragic villains it’s nice to also have a Villan who’s evil just for sake of it, literally just because he though lt villains in comic books were cool
Even manipulates those who have genuine grievances with things in the world and looks to that pain as nothing more than something for him to take advantage of for his sake.
True but you shouldn't forget that his last moments in manga supposed to point out that no matter how hard he's trying to be pure evil - he's not. Even Midoriya says that AFO is just a sad lonely child in shell of old man. He's irredeemable not because he doesn't have tragic backstory (he do) but because unlike Toga, Dabi or Tomura - he refuses to admit that thi's tragic past influence him somehow.
@michaelzjwanko3680 that's the whole point, no human is pure evil, because every evil is motivated by emotions, there's no such things as unexplainable evil, like Jack Hornet is motivated by jealousy, those 7 deadly sins are human emotions
What I love about last wish is how it utilizes three types of antagonists and villains. One sympathetic and redeemable(Goldy), one disgustingly irredeemable and pure evil(jack), and one who is more in the Morally gray area of who you could say is more amoral(death)
I've always thought of Jack Horner as a parody of how Disney has been giving their recent villains some sort of tragic backstory to explain why they do their crimes instead of just being evil. When Jack is talking to the cricket about his "sad" family life he quickly realizes he's probably one of the worst human beings in the world if not the worst which is really saying something. I've been around long enough to know that people don't need some sob story in order to be a monster.
You know Cioccolata was messed up when the only other character who’s arguably worse than him was Anjuro “Angelo” Katagiri from Part 4. This man… has quite literally committed every single crime in the law book. Our in-person introduction is him biting off a dog’s snout, and spitting the remains inside the owner’s mouth. Even at the age of 12 years old, he went up to a random couple at the park, beat the man over the head with a bat, and assaulted the woman. *At Age 12.* Not even the kids were safe from his cruelty. Everyone was a victim with him around. Keep in mind this is the first villain of the “Slice of Life” Part of JoJo, and he’s already worse than DIO. Even Yoshikage Kira looks like a saint compared to Angelo.
Just as sympathetic villains can be done well, pure evil villains can be just as phenomenal and iconic. Judge Claude Frollo is one of the most universally-praised Disney villains, and Hunchback itself knows why: "He saw corruption everywhere...except within." In the original book by Victor Hugo, Frollo does some incredibly heinous things, yet his character is framed as a tragic one as he transitions from a genuinely well-intentioned person to a selfish, raving madman. Frollo in the animated movie? He's 100% evil from beginning to end. As if targeting an oppressed culture isn't horrible enough, among his first onscreen actions are killing a woman on the steps of a church and attempting to throw her deformed baby down a well. He only takes in Quasimodo to avoid the wrath of God, but even then he never acts the way a parent should, gaslighting and ridiculing Quasi whenever it suited him. THEN when he lusts for Esmerelda, he somehow gets even WORSE, as his obsession with her drives him insane and decides, "let her taste the fires of Hell, or else let her be mine and mine alone!" Much like Jimmy from Mouthwashing, Frollo always sees himself as the hero, and is never NOT the hero in his eyes. In all his screentime, Frollo never takes responsibility for his evil actions, uses Christianity to justify his crimes, and sees himself as "purer than the common vulgar, weak, licentious crowd" with no reservation. When Esmerelda escapes from him, he could just let her go and move on. He begged God Himself to not let him fall to his urges, yet when he is given the chance to forget about her, Frollo would rather burn down Paris in order to find her and make her belong to him. He even seems to have a single moment of self-reflection on how far he's falling ("God have mercy on her, God have mercy on me"), yet it's not enough. He doubles down and gives in to pure evil, doing everything he can to have his way with Esmerelda no matter who suffers in the process, because in Frollo's mind, it won't be him. Self-righteous, viciously cruel, and ultimately unrepentant, Frollo is a reflection of many horrible people in the real world. Frollo is a man who chose to be a monster. Frollo is everything God condemns. Frollo is evil incarnate.
Machinabridge Hojo reference, based! For me a favorite irredeemable villain is Dimentio from Super Paper Mario. A psychotic jester who wanted to destroy all worlds just so he can make everything in his image.
Do you guys agree that Lord Farquaad, Fairy Godmother, Prince Charming, and Rumpelstiltskin are irredeemable villains just like "Big" Jack Horner himself?
Prince Charming always seemed more like a pawn of his mother then anything, a spoiled arrogant badly raised brat but I do think there could be potential hope if he was ever put on the right track
A good example to me is to make the pure evil character horrifying, entertaining, and hateable. Bill Cipher, Jack Horner, as mentioned in the video, and Frieza are good examples of pure evils that are entertaining due to their charm and comedy, but terrifying because of what they are able to do. Judge Holden and the Qu, two other pure evils that are in the same level as AM in terms of evil surprisingly, are terrifying because they represent something in our lives, Holden represents the depraved nihilism of humanity, while The Qu represent the dangers of the unknown, and nature in general, Micah Bell and Jimmy are characters we hate so much, but they’re written so well, we love to hate him despite how much of a rat Micah is towards his own gang, and how much of a prick Jimmy is towards everyone. And ironically, Ronaldo from Helluva Boss’s Ghost Fuckers episode, manages to actually be one of the best written antagonists in the entire Hazbin Hotel/Helluva Boss universe, to me at least, due to his sinister nature, calm attitude, and creepy power in torturing people. Meanwhile, a character like Cipher from Fast and Furious, or The Buyer from the Knuckles show don’t work is because they’re just genetically evil, we aren’t given a reason for why they are evil, they just are, and it doesn’t help they aren’t entertaining, to me, but I hear a lot of other people didn’t really care for the Buyer that much either, then there’s the case of MAN from Bambi, who has zero to no character, and barely does anything evil.
A reason why Gruntilda Winkybunion from Banjo-Kazooie is one of the goats in this department, evil and reveling in it all to the point she’ll kill her own sisters on her side for simply failing to beat Banjo & Kazooie in a quiz game, all while being legitimately hilarious at the same time!
Not irredeemable villains by any stretch of the imagination, but I love how there's basically a very set dynamic about Transformers. Almost universally, if you have a Sentinel Prime, his job is either to try and undermine/usurp Optimus, or he's the reason you HAVE Optimus. Sentinel is a very charismatic leader, but he's a two faced asshole, and if you have him and Optimus at the same time, the older Autobots tend to side with Sentinel and the younger ones/more idealistic ones tend to side with Optimus. Another character like this is LordKnightmon/Crusadermon from Digimon. If the Digimon story at hand is directly about the threat to the Digital World/Drasil, LKM will default to being the antagonist. LKM is by default the least trusting of humans, making him a prime target for Lucemon's corruption as well. Usually, this will pit LKM against Omnimon, Gallantmon and UlforceVeedramon/Magnamon depending on the game. I love dynamic switchboards/flowcharts you can just read at a glance like this. "Ah, this is scenario X, so these characters will align like this!"
The High Evolutionary from Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 is a great irredeemable villain. He performed thousands of gruesome experiments on animals and discarded most as failures in an attempt to make a perfect world. He even blew up a planet because his current batch had grown to be too violent. And he did all that just because he hated the way things were.
If I remember correctly, Ciaocolata was based of a particular criminal surgeon, who Araki was following the story on. He made the character as if to tell him, "you won't escape the justice you deserve". Though I might be misremembering, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
26:57 The problem is that they get BORING if you have one after another in a congo line of one-shot episodes. They all just blur together as having the exact same personality! This works in Power Rangers because the monsters aren't relatable and are treated more a gimmick obstacles the heroes have to figure out how to overcome, and we're shown they're MADE this way (the ones who are hired guns tend to turn on the villains as soon as they realize they're cannon fodder).
People confuse the idea that if you can understand a villain's motives that you have to make them sympathetic or redeemable, but you can certainly make a villain who simply refuses whatever sympathy points they may have by being utterly evil. When writing took on the huge push of "everyone is the hero of their own story" they took that not to say that people should be understandable in their actions but that they think that they shouldn't write villains. Like, someone who is just completely selfish and uncaring about that selfishness harming others is just as believable as someone trying to garner sympathy. And it's also possible that even if someone is sympathetic, they can still be completely depraved as a villain, and not even in the sense of being a templar, but someone whose own sense of morality is fundamentally twisted. One of the first examples I can think of is from an extremely obscure anime series, M3: The Dark Metal. The primary villain who leads the plot is the doctor Natsuiri. It's obvious from the get-go that he's evil. He has no issue treating everyone as tools, is childish and obviously selfish, looks down on everyone around him - he's EXTREMELY entertaining. The show is actually very good, though it is a slow burn, so I highly recommend it. There's a moment where he carries what appears to be a toxic metal that will cause the death of anyone directly exposed to it around. He uses this as leverage to get something he wants out of a conference, then after it's over he breaks the vial on the ground... Before telling the people it's full of cola and laughing. That's the kind of character he is. His charisma as an obvious villain is a huge draw of the early series. Near the end of the series [spoilers, obviously] we see Natsuiri's backstory. His main dream in life is to find, put simply, a way for people to "understand" each other. He learns of a tribe on a rural island of people who have telekinetic abilities, and falls in love with one of their people. She knows his goal is purehearted, and believes in it herself. Natsuiri wants humanity to prosper. ...So he raids the village to use as guinea pigs for his experimentation, wiping out the entire populace, resulting in them performing a ritual to release a monster in retribution. Natsuiri even goes as far as knocking out and using the woman he loves as a test subject, justifying it to himself saying, "You want to see my dream come true, so you should do anything you can to help me out." Natsuiri is NOT portrayed as positive and it actually is part of the series' themes that even if he didn't do anything evil, his dream itself was misguided. When he gets his comeuppance it's in seeing the spirits of the people whose lives he ruined before him. Seeing the love of his life, he pleads with her as if asking for one shred of sympathy, and the spirit turns to him and has but one thing to say: "Unforgivable."
I feel like when someone asks me "who's your favorite Mouthwashing character?" I have to lie and say Daisuke because if I say Jimmy there's a chance they will actually kill me, so I have to be like "Well, uhh, my favorite from a LIKEABILITY standpoint is Daisuke, but like, without Jimmy the game wouldn't have a reason to exist, and as a villain he's really compelling, so you HAVE to admit he's a goo- IMPORTANT character, even if he sucks!" and I'm still given the side-eye even with all that sugarcoating of my opinion lol My real opinion is that Jimmy is my favorite because, as horrible of a person he is, he is an EXTREMELY compelling and well written villain, and one of the best villains of all time, and one of my favorite game characters of all time by association. As much as I love the others, without Jimmy the game would have no reason to exist. He is the horrible, rotten, disgusting heart and soul of this game, and he is what this game thrives in. You could remove any other character, and the game would be much _much_ worse basically no matter who you removed, however it would still be an at least solid game. Without Jimmy? The game may as well not exist. Every single action of every single character, every single event, every single line of dialogue, it ALL ties back to Jimmy and how despicable of a person he is, and it's the reason the narrative of the game works as well as it does. 10/10 villain, 10/10 character, 10/10 game, no notes
so I'm a massive vampire lover, and my favorite vampire of all time is a great example of an irredeemable monster, and he's technically a "hero", the vampire Alucard from Hellsing. Does he have a tragic past? Yes, does he technically protect people and serve the greater good? sure. But let him off leash for even a moment and he'll make a display of his cruelty with zero regard to if his opponents are monsters like himself, or just innocent humans doing their jobs. He revels in the violence, the cruelty. Can can't be redeemed, he knows that, he doesn't want redemption, he wants his death. But he's going to take as many people human or vampire along with him. He could have left the hotel in episode 3 in any number of ways and kept the deaths to a minimum, but he didn't. He chose to kill EVERYONE, every poor cop who thought they were protecting people and he kills them brutally, even throwing several to be impaled onto flag poles on live international TV just for fun. He has no regrets about a single person he kills or worse steals the souls of. he is irredeemable, and proud of it, yet is still able to be a compelling character
He'not irredeemable. He giving money he yearns to his city and genuine care about his family (Spiders). Chrollo is not an example of irredeemable villain. Quite opposite - he's example of anti-villain/sympathetic one.
On one hand, I enjoy a villain with an understandable, believable and probably tragic backstory to explain why they do what they do(Handsome Jack), and yes I love a good redemption story(Anakin). On the other hand, I still need a fix of unfeeling monsters who were just born and want to watch the world burn.
The Reverse Flash is probably one of the best Irredeemable Villains out there. The dude is one of the most cruel and petty guys on the planet, who uses the fact he is a Time Anomaly and thus unaffected by Time Travel to do whatever the hell he wants to make the Flash aka Barry Allen's life suck and be as miserable as possible. Dude killed his mom, erased Barry's childhood friend from existence, caused him numerous injuries and boughts of misfortune throughout his childhoodo and continues to use his insane power to make Barry suffer for his own amusement. The guy took being evil and sadistic to new levels of insane and you can't help but appreciate how much effort he puts into being evil.
i'm a big fan of irredeemable villains. it just feels like people can have more fun with them when they aren't trying to make them super sympathetic for the audience. and a backstory can easily inform but not excuse a villain's actions. and it's also just really fun at least for me to explore just, the most insane and hypocritical of mindsets. plus, as shown here, just because a villain is irredeemable doesn't mean they don't come in a lot of flavors! we have everything from AM, who is so far beyond human in any capacity that it's precisely what's messed it up, to Jimmy, who could be working in your office and have 3 HR complaints that you don't know about, to the in-betweens that are still very human but still quite _above_, such as Jack Horner, Sundowner, and ,just _barely_ teetering into humanity, The Judge. (funny enough, it seems this scale corresponds to villain size, too - Jimmy's a normal dude, Jack, SD and Holden are all HUGE dudes, and AM is The Obelisk).
Here are a couple of other fictional characters who are all totally irredeemable whether they're pure evil or complete jerks such as Ryōko Mendō (Urusei Yatsura), Phil Billings (Ben 10 Series), Gemini "Gem" Stone (Sabrina: The Animated Series), Mandy (Totally Spies!), Melissa O'Malley (The Life and Times of Juniper Lee), Jack Spicer (Xiaolin Showdown), Amber & Ashley (Hannah Montana), Takao Kuroi (THE iDOLM@STER), Sierra McCool (The Replacements), Dr.Blakk (Slugterra), Jin Norizuki (Pretty Rhythm: Rainbow Live), Princess Allie (Pokémon the Series: XY), Chloé Bourgeois (Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir), Lila Rossi/Cerise Bianca (Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir), Miori Sanada (Lonely Castle in the Mirror), Rinne Berlinetta's 3 childhood bullies (ViVid Strike!), Richardson Mole (Big Hero 6: The Series), Ma’alefa’ak/M'comm M'orzz (Young Justice TV Series), and the Byogens (Healin' Good Pretty Cure).
I think the demons from frieren could technically fit the archetype too, but they're not exactly *bad* just are monsters that eat humans and speak their language
I think the demons from frieren could technically fit the archetype too, but they're not exactly *bad* just are monsters that eat humans and speak their language
31:50 He doesn't make a choice. He can't. The only thing he can think of and do is "How to kill humans" or "How to make an effective war". But he is conscious and similar to humans enough to compare himself with them and their freedom, expression, art and ect. And that for some reason makes him HATE all of humanity and think of more intricate ways to kill the rest of it (even if it's impossibly long way to kill just 1 remaining human). It's quite sad to see something being brought into existence against it's will an with insufferable limitations, as we all were. He is just a prisoner of his own nature, unable to act differently but fully aware of it each microinstant of his existence. So AM is indeed extremely relatable villain, unable to change himself or even die, only to do that he was made for.
The High Evolutionary is probably one of the best and most hated villains i've ever seen tbh, like my man didn't have a single redeemable quality and caused the whole cinema to cheer when he was defeated
One irredeemable villain I like to bring up is Ali Al Sachez from Gundam 00. Basically he is what everyone thinks what Divine from Yugioh 5Ds is although Divine is a cheap copy compared to him. The guy brainwashed and raised kids as child soldiers including the main character Setsuna for fun.The guy loves war and he’s so good at it he killed off another main character yet he could slip in to society and no one would notice.At every turn he was a threat even when in inferior mechs or breaking the fourth wall.He was an entertaining bastard that you love to hate.Ali Al Sachez is one of the Gundam franchise’s best villains.
The Fact that puss in boots last wish had all three types of villains and did it so well was phenomenal. The Force of Nature, The Irredeemable and the Misguided
I think there's a part of the irredeemable villains that should be explored upon, and it's the awareness of their actions, i think not much media explores that line of the definition of beyond saving and about running out of chances. About the regret that comes after they sank that low and we barely see in them because of everything they've done. Instead of the usual concepts of, you can always make it better, i would love an irredeemable character that regrets his actions and tries to redeem themselves, only to realize it's impossible and that they deserve nothing. That point is usually very quickly cut with their deaths but i'd love to see more media explore that type of existencialism of realizing the monster they are and knowing they cannot change anymore
Colin Farrell’s The Penguin is a good recent example of irredeemable villains done right. The fact that he tricked the audience into forgetting he’s an evil scumbag because he got his own show is crazy.
An interesting topic to cover would be entitled characters. Entitlement is a scary thing when observed from the outside; those who are entitled don't think they're in the wrong, believing they 'deserve' things (affection, positions, money, etc.) thus see themselves as the hero even when they lash out in anger (sometimes violently) when they don't get what they want - "The evil that doesn't know is evil, is the worst kind there is."
Fun (maybe) Fact, jack horner is a representation of Disney wanting to have control all of the MAGIC of storytelling so only they can have it all to themselves
I think the shogun appearance for Sundowner is actually quite clever. While in modern day there is a lot of media portraying Samurai and their Shogunate as honourable in actual history a lot of them were quite deplorable. One example I can give for this is the inspiration for the pokemon move Night Slash. It is based on a practice certain samurai would do called Tsujigi translated to Crossroad Killing. Where a samurai with a new blade would lie in wait at a crossroad for a commoner or someone else who is a lower class to them to come along and then ambush them purely to test how well their new weapon would cut. Shoguns specifically were very ruthless and a lot of them were glorified warlords. And I think they used this more historical version as inspiration for Sundowner's appearance as it suits his agenda perfectly. A Sadistic wanna-be Warlord.
I would like to share an irredeemable villain from the game Path to nowhere, Cabernet. She has everything that she wanted since childhood because of extreme wealth that her family has. She just speaks of what she wanted and her family finds a way to get it, mainly focusing on wanting exotic and exquisite foods. But that doesn’t satisfy her. She has the ability to extract human souls and turn into food. The more noble the soul is, the more delicious it is for her. Her well-known crime is that she kidnaps her chefs who are devoted to their work for their families or their future because to her, this is so noble and deserve a happy ending. She keeps them in her secret dungeon and extract their souls, turning them into food and use them as an example of what a ‘splendid’ dish tastes like. The effects of it if eaten is that it tastes like the most mouth-watering dish you’ve ever tasted and you wanted more as if you’ve gone insane, and Cabernet took pleasure of seeing them in that state just because she likes it, just for fun. Some fans call her a succubus, or Hannibal Lecter but hot (I sweat, look it up. She’s so hot and I’m one of her simps.) but surely irredeemable villainess nonetheless. There are a lot of characters in that game who are irredeemable but she takes the no. 1 spot for me. And she has a lot of fans too because simply, she’s extremely attractive.
I like how Cioccolata only exists to justify one-upping Steely Dan’s beatdown. Steely Dan in Stardust Crusaders is the ultimate bastard, someone you’d love to punch in the face til your hand breaks. So to one up his beating, Cioccolata was introduced to be the ultimate piece of 💩. Someone you wouldn’t stop punching if you had the chance
one of my favorites is probably Brad from lisa the painful. its one of the cases of a sympethetic character who is also irredeemable at the same time. he may have had a bad life and the game makes you want to help him redeem himself like he does, except he is an unreliable narrator who is doing it purely out of selfish desires and will ultimately be punished for it due to to his addiction and actions that are set in motion before you even get the chance to take control, and all feeling bad for him and trying to help him get better will do is ultimately make the game more difficult. The kind of character that makes you say "Im really sorry man, but you had it coming".
![BLACK BAG - Official Trailer [HD] - Only in Theaters March 14](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Du0Xp8WX_7I/mqdefault.jpg)
Edit: For those wondering what the song is - ruclips.net/video/5g-ag5Ghek0/видео.html&ab_channel=PSC&sttick=0 It's Rivers in the Desert from Persona 5 Mito Remix.
If you enjoyed the video, please leave the comment: MUDA!!!!
It's the first video of the new year, and I figured we'd come out swinging.
Hope you guys enjoy the video - be sure to leave a like and comment :)
MUDA!!!
MUDA!
MUDA!: also I see Naruto Shippuden's zombie duo Hidan and Kakazu making this list
A reason why Gruntilda Winkybunion from Banjo-Kazooie is one of the goats in this department, evil and reveling in it all to the point she’ll kill her own sisters on her side for simply failing to beat Banjo & Kazooie in a quiz game, all while being legitimately hilarious at the same time!
A irredeemable monster I personally like is frank horrigan from fallout 2
Jack Horner was such a breath of fresh air in terms of cartoon villains where they all had a tragic backstory and were redeemed.
At this point, having a villain with a sad backstory but never having nor even wanting to redeem themselves could be kinda cool...
Redeemable villains only work when the character hasn't done anything too unforgivable (example. Unapologetically killing multiple people)
The same movie had a good redeemable villain, Goldilocks and her bears
@@blessedphoenix6229 Vegeta killed a lot of people.
@@KperaOfficia That's just Dio from jojo
Ciccolata really is a villain who's so irredeemable, so sadistic and so deplorable that the 7 Page Muda was the only way he could have been defeated in my eyes.
Says enough Diavolo called him the worst POS
@joshuaagee-bass4049 Giorno was right to call him that too.
He was soo irredeemable not even secco cared about his death
When the protagonist and main antagonist hate you. You know your irredeemable.
@@joshuaagee-bass4049I remember a theory that said Diavolo hated Chocolatta not because of the malpractice but because he recorded everything. Always having evidence to a guy trying erase every trace of his existence is unspeakable
I’m a simple man. I see Jojo’s, I click. I see sundowner in the opening, I stay.
Same here.But if you hear AM's speech then I watch it all
Kids are cruel, jack.
@@Thejigholeman "and I love minors"
@@Thejigholeman”and i love [CLASSIFIED]”
Jack Horner's memes alone showed how much we appreciate irredeemable villains when they're done correctly.
"You're not gonna shoot a puppy, are ya, Jack?!"
"Y E A H, I N T H E F A C E, W H Y?"
@Waluigiwatchwaa That's just funny in its own cruelty!
@claytonrios1 reminds me of my own psychotic villain, Scrappy, a robot who just wants to murder people and commit regicide, his reasoning? He's a bit angry that he got what he deserved at one point and he thinks it's funny to kill people, so its just Lila, not hacked by Scrappy, but he doesn't know that "WOAH WOAH WOAH you wouldn't run your fist through your creator, wouldja, Scrappy?"
"Yeah, in his face, why?"
“Nah bro let me redeem this twentieth war criminal villain I’ve encountered who also murdered one of my friends *AND MY PARENTS,* this villain is the coolest guy I know.” -Naruto
we can end this now
"If a certain guy in a bat suit can put a monster clown in a mental asylum for the 100th time because bat suit guy genuinely thinks he's going to change, I can give this war criminal at least one chance!" -Naruto
@@immortalfriezato be fair to batman the government could just as easily execute the likes of joker via death penalty yet they don't
And the villain was actually a redeemable guy so…
@@immortalfriezaeven then, Naruto villains at least look redeemable as compared to Batman’s
Jack Horner is basically Dreamworks equivalent to Syndrome. A spoiled man child who instead of helping the world, thinks he deserves to own the world.
I thought Tighten was the Dreamworks Syndrome
@@liannabunny7775both as a child didn't get as much, and as they got older, they both got all the powers
@@liannabunny7775Tighten is worse than both, which says a lot
@@ironmaster6496 Morality Wise? Or?
@@ironmaster6496Syndrome’s a mass murderer. Titan didn’t kill anybody (not for lack of trying, mind you).
Hard Truth Aesop: Some people won't change no matter how much you try, and sometimes you only see good in people because that's what you want to see.
True but also if you only see the bad in ppl thats all youll see
@@billyjawonka1567 I disagree.
@@ikagura you're free to be wrong
its a nice courtesy in these cases to offer them forgiveness and oppurtunity to change, but if they dont take it, prioritise others
@@billyjawonka1567 and that is the basis of all dehumanizing propaganda since the dawn of humanity!
Only difference is that folks are -generally- trained to see only the bad of OTHER groups of people!
what i like to do in some of my stories, is giving my irredeemable villains a "good doppelganger"-character, to show that they could've been good, yet actively decided not to be.
I believe the word you’re looking for is either “reflection” or “foil”.
@@elijahhayter3026
No, not necessarily. a foil can be anyone, even a total stranger. what i'm talking about is something like a "good twin". somebody who used to be really close and very similar to the villain, but eventually went down the good path, instead of the evil one.
for a foil, there is no need for such past relationships.
thought "reflection" could still fit, to a certain degree.
@@Legomicroman Do yourself a favor and watch the first season of PSYCHO-PASS. It goes pretty hard with that idea: to find and defeat the villain, you must become able to think like him. You must become him - but on the side of good.
I'm only recommending the first season, because everything after that is one very long story that has to be mainlined, while the first season stands alone.
Crazy that One Piece did that with Doflamingo actually, by giving him a younger brother that went through EVERYTHING he went through yet ended up being a kind and caring man recollecting how his brother was rotten to the core even before they literally and metaphorically were cast out of heaven and lived through hell. Rosinante proves that Doflamingo isn't a broken person but just a fundamentally twisted man that uses his sad past to have people sympathize with him and manipulate them
I have some irredeemable characters in my stories too! We have a bit in common here!
I think one of the key things with Jack Horner is that for a brief moment, he is partnered with a character who is desperately trying to find that red redeemable villain element to Jack Horner.
Even though it’s short, Jiminy cricket traveling with him, trying desperately to find that small nugget of a good person in Jack, and failing. Is one of the key pieces that really elevates his character.
That’s why the best line with Jack happens when Jiminy breaks and calls him an irritable monster .
“Oh, what took you so long? “
Showing that even he is self-aware enough to know that he is no good.
He also "humoring" the cricket all the time
Jimmy is such a fantastic irredeemable villain because of how undeniably human he is. Yes, having supportive people in your life canmost certainly aid you in becoming a better person, but the choice to do good and be good ultimately falls upon you. You may know a Jimmy, you may have seen a Jimmy, Hell you may have almost became or even recovered from being him and that’s what makes him such so good. Irredeemable Villains can be very entertaining and cartoonish and fun to watch like Jack or horrifying to witness like Jimmy.
So many name says?! How dare you say Jimbalya’s name!
The way I see it, there are three types of irredeemable villains: force of nature villains, magnificent bastards, and made monsters. The latter being what I call a sympathetic villain, but they past the point of no redemption, doomed to forever be the monster someone/something made.
to me the way i do see senator armstrong is a hard truth moral about not basing things on sterotypes as armstrong is a warning to how people will base themselfs on sterotypes and the fact the wrong kind of people will only conform they are right without realizing the harm of their actions
@@comicbookreviewer4856 May you please elaborate?
Eren Jaeger comes to mind with the last one. I mean he was trying to protect his people. But he ended up killing a shit ton of everyone who wasnt part of eldia.
The scary part of the rumbling was always the heat from the titans and not them trampling everything in their path. If you were near one for too long you'd ignite into a fucking fire ball and burn to death.
The more you think about the more horrible the rumbling was.
@@furionmax7824 Yah, was thinking about General Grievus pre-David Filoni, but that is also a good example.
@@comicbookreviewer4856 I thought I commented here already, but don't see it. So if you get two, sorry but blame RUclips.
May you please elaborate more on what you mean there?
Another villain that i would like to add would be Ridley in the metroid manga, bro was a complete menace.
Really wished he was portrait in the games like that.
"Oh, right. I did kill those two. *I was aiming for the child."*
Him and Gg fell sans would get along nicely
He also went out of the way just to do evil stuff and nothing else
@@amigomorton5193
I don’t think that kind of portrayal of Ridley fits the games. In the games Ridley is shown to be an intelligent hunter and a possible commander(?)
Him throwing around quips and cracking dark jokes doesn’t really fit the series tone, especially since it would be too late to make Ridley act like that in the games.
Personally I think he’s a lot more menacing because he doesn’t NEED to speak, his actions speak for themselves.
Jack Horner was such an absolute breath of fresh air. No plot twist, no tragic backstory, no real reason, just an absolutely awful human being, in it purely for the love of the game.
He actually taught me how to make an irredeemable villain funny.
Have him be voiced by John Mulaney?
@@TTastic-pb5ntkinda like Joker?
A way I see to make a irredimable villain still somewhat likable and fun to watch is to make them faux affable evil. While affable evil villains are genuinely polite and friendly even to their enemies( Senator Armstrong, John Kramer and Bowser), Faux affable evil villains only act polite and friendly to enhance their evil(Frieza, emperor belos, Alex delarge). They won‘t even drop the polite facade while doing their evil deeds until they are hit in the nail. I just find them fun/interesting to watch because of how despicable they are and yet are so polite about it, that it kinda becomes hard to completely hate them.
ALEX DELARGE MENTION!!!!!
I never imagined see the names "John Kramer" and "Bowser" in the same text lol
fellow tvtropes user?
Enough has been said with Jack Horner so I’ll bring up another amazing villain in Sentinel Prime from Transformers One.
Basically unlike his Animated or Bayverse incarnations who had good intentions, bro straight up sold out the Thirteen Primes to the Quintessons which got most of them killed and when he tried to take the Matrix of Leadership, it just crumbled to dust because he’s that bad of a guy. Now he’s just acting as a dictator and basking in the glory of being a Prime with him also crippling several Transformers at birth to create a caste system.
And it’s all just so fun.
Honestly I think the villains of the Disney Renaissance would happily hang out with Sentinel and Jack Horner over the twist villains like Hans, Bellweather, and Mr. “That was his mistake” Callaghan.
Transformers one sentinel is so evil. Even other villains would hate him. That's how evil he is.
Worst of all:
He invented racism.
@@nicholasarnold8177 i think we can all agree that's diabolical.
I call him Nellie (derogatory), C*ntinel, and things like that. I came to this video to talk about him, but then there you were. Thanks for saying what I wanted to say.
@@leyenardevil1694what does Nellie mean?
We really need these types of villains to make a comeback, sympathetic ones are fine once in awhile but purely evil villains are the best kinds in stories.
The main problem comes when a villian is clearly designed to be an irredeemable monster and the writer shoehorns a cliche tragic backstory that’s supposed to justify all the awful things they have done.
@@lordinquisitor6233 That's because incompetent writers can't see characters as people in a fictional setting and only see them as plot devices: their role is decided in advance and their choices don't matter. In any competently written story, becoming a hero or a villain is ultimately a choice. It was even a pretty popular trope for a while to have a hero and a villain with strikingly similar backstories but radically different worldviews and personalities (also known as the "not so different" trope).
Not sure about that like if they are good then alright
Strongly disagree. Personally making every villain same archetype is bad. Plus example of pure evil villains done incredibly badly like Stella from Helluva boss.
@@lordinquisitor6233 Correct. The issue with "sympathetic" villains is that 9 times out of 10 writers keep telling you these villains are "sympathetic" despite the villains doing utterly horrible things. The writers want the reader to pity these villains despite the story giving the reader every reason not to. i.e. Having a "tragic backstory" for the villain where their horribly abusive father murdered their dog in front of them doesn't make the villain going around killing every last dog on in a city for fun somehow sympathetic.
An irredeemable villain is the best way to get the audience excited to see them get their comeuppance
You have never watched one piece huh?
@ nope
we have been waiting for griffith to die FOR 30 YEARS
@cymikgaming1266 30 years!? He really need to go down, fr.
@@Z_User-d5e he does but Guts can't be the one to do it
What I really love is that Jack Horner is a send up to Lord Farquad from the first Shrek movie. They're both irregular "normal" people (Farquad is a midget with a gigachad head, Jack Horner is built like Spiderverse Kingpin but has the head/face of a baby) that have a hatred for fairy tails. And both are incredibly iredeemable pieces of work that had whats coming to them.
And both are critiques/jabs at Disney
MY MAN A.M.!
Literally came to the video for him, he’s one of my fave villains.
Seeing you cover him is just… so good.
He’s also the perfect embodiment of “understandable, but not justifiable.”
Jimmy makes bojack horseman look like a good person.
I never saw BoJack as a bad person
A HORRIBLY flawed, self-destructive, self-sabotaging person with a tragic lack of foresight who tends to accidentally drag everyone else down with himself, sure
But there is a general lack of malice to most of his actions that prevents me from seeing him as a bad person
@@Dr.MliekoBojack is a self destructive ahole.
Jimmy is a destructive ahole.
Marvels Cledus Cassidy AKA Carnage is a good example of a irredeemable villain in comics. Often thought of as “What if DC’s Joker had superpowers.” He’s a psychopath that kills maims and murders at will. Having a nihilistic view of the world and life. And that’s before he got bonded with an alien symbiot. The guys got a long, long loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooong list of crimes. Even going back on his childhood. And didn’t regret any of them.
What I love about Carnage is he is what happens when the worst possible person is given powers. He is also an antithesis to Eddie Brock. Eddie Brock uses the symbiote to do good, while Cletus uses the Symbiote to to act out his twisted desires.
My GOAT 😩🔥
The true irredeemable villain is Insomniac for not giving us Maximum Carnage DLC in SM2 since he appeared in Wraith’s sidequest.
11:50 totally agree, a villain doesn't need to be sympathetic or have a tragic backstory to be entertaining. I'll be waiting for that video
I love how Harlan Ellison himself was the only one who could properly bring his hateful creation to life.
After all, who better to voice their self insert?
He never sleeps, Sundowner. He is dancing, dancing. He says that he is FUCKING INVINCIBLE
Blood meridian
Saw Jimmy from mouthwashing, and yea 100% irredeemable monster. And he’s pulled off so well
I will say pokemon did the irredeemable villain real well with ghetsis, there is nothing redeemable at all about him.
I was looking for a comment like this. Whether it's the mainline games, the Adventures Manga, side games, or anime. That man is irredeemably evil no matter the continuity.
yeah One of the biggest rule of pokemon is that even really bad people like Giovanni or Cyrus at least care about their own pokemon but Ghetsis doesn't and actually abuse his hydreagon to the point he can use a full power frustration
He really did do several villain tropes so well. The charismatic manipulator, the irredeemable monster, and the psychotic megalomaniac. You could even argue that he is a villain that was right, though that would depend on how you view the character, because he was both only spreading the message about Pokémon rights to be able to use Team Plasma while abusing his Pokemon, but in Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon, Ghetsis (from a universe where he won) believes he was summoned to liberate the Pokémon from people, so he still at least has some sort of care for the cause that Plasma banded together for.
And Cyrus
@Waluigiwatchwaa Not quite. Because there are a few iterations of Cyrus that have been shown to have redeemable qualities.
Tale foundry and manga kamen are the best channels about story telling and characters.
Palpatine (from Star Wars) is an honorable mention and another perfect example of an irredeemable villain. He had pretty much everything he wanted growing up. A safe, comfy, luxurious upbringing on Naboo with scholarships at the best colleges and universities across the entire planet. He even had connections with countless Naboo political heads. And... what did he do with it?
Murder his own parents just for fun, backstabbed the Jedi who were blocking his quest for power at the end of the Clone Wars and created the Galactic Empire to rule by his arbitrary whims and let every part of the galaxy he didn't like burn and rule the rest.
Bear in mind he did all of this- while *enjoying* how evil he was.
Palpatine was never going to have a redemption arc and I *love him for it* . He was evil, sure, but he had *conviction* .
General Plastro (from Army Men) is another personal favorite of mine. He's the leader of the entire Tan nation and its Army (as well as the rest of its military) and can have anything he wants from his country's resources and it's *still* not enough for him. He's childish, greedy, conniving, immature and petulant but his behavior on screen is just outright *hilarious* .
He's the villain and he *knows* it, which to me makes him special.
Sarge: Plastro! Why don't you put that gun down and fight me like a man...?
Plastro: Because I'm the bad guy, that's why!
I will never forget that exchange. 😆
I think what confuses me the most about mouthwashing is how there are ppl in the community who see Curly as a villain as well Jimmy, when that minimizes both Curly's role and the acts that Jimmy has done himself. The only thing that Curly did wrong was try to please everyone. Whether he treated Jimmy differently or knew about what he did to Anya, Jikmy crashing the ship to escape his judgement would've always happened
This! The fandom treatment of Curly hurts me. He's very realistic and they blame him for not having hindsight. He's not a mindreader either and sometimes people can only understand things when said plainly and clearly, not subtle hints. Like how many people do you know had to deal with a very specific situation like that. Blame the company not having an hr department, or the situation of 5 crew members who thought it was a routine mission. Also it's a horror game come on people.
Pleasing everyone when said people are a rapist and rape survivor is an awful move and his negligence due to Jimmy being his friend is a good statement on rape culture in general. A lot of people will defend someone because they're friends.
I haven't seen many people portray him as an outright "villain", but Curly is not meant to be innocent. It wasn't just that he tried to 'please everyone', it's that he was a *doormat*. It's implied that Curly was the one who brought Jimmy on board as co-pilot in the first place, ignoring Jimmy's past trouble or 'struggle' (implied to be related to Jimmy's criminal record, and what he would do to Anya), and after the fact he does nothing to take responsibility for Jimmy or his actions. He's too afraid of conflict and 'rocking the boat' and so he ignores Jimmy.
Curly, as I see it, is meant to be directly addressing the player. Someone could play through the game, say, "Wow, Jimmy is horrible. Glad I'm not Jimmy," turn off the game, and never think twice about it. The scenes with Curly, however, are meant to show that "not being Jimmy" isn't enough; you have to take an active stance against people like Jimmy. Jimmy even outright says it to Curly's face: as captain, the crew and their wellbeing was his responsibility. So while Curly isn't directly responsible for Jimmy's actions, he's responsible for allowing Jimmy to get away with it and continue doing it. Even if he couldn't predict what would happen at the start of the journey, he *chose* not to take action against Jimmy after Anya confided in him. He knowingly entrusted piloting the ship - and the safety of the entire crew - in the hands of someone he KNEW committed violence against another crew member. He COULD'VE stopped Jimmy from crashing the ship, he COULD'VE kept them safe, but he didn't, because he was too scared of conflict with his 'friend' to fulfill his duty to protect the crew. Curly didn't take responsibility, and he - and everyone else - paid for it.
Isn't Curly one of the most sympathised-with characters? To deny him of wrongdoing is to deny the phrase, "Take responsibility."
M Bison from street fighter. Goal: world conquest. Reason: He can and nobody can stop him. Has caused plenty of backstory deaths, motivating several of the other fighters to enter his tournament to strike at him. Even losing him memories did little to dampen his lust for power in 6.
You know it’s going to be a good video when it starts with AM’s infamous “Hate” monologue. :)
People often say an irredeemable villain/straight villain are. Print or uninteresting but that’s not the case. Want to know a quick and effective way to make them interesting, make the a reflection/based on a concept.
Most people mistakenly believe in order to have a good villain/character they NEED to be complex or a real person but sometimes characters don’t need to feel true to life but more a reflection of some idea or concept and in turn a villain can be good by being a contrast or reflect some wicked idea. Jack Horner contrasts puss who learns to value his life & what he has while he doesn’t value anything he has or of life, cioccolata is cruelty & sadism incarnate which contrasts both with doctors hypocratic oath/giorno who can heal, then finally kira who is an inverse of Josuke (ones about healing the other destruction, one is flashy with his hair while the other wants to blend in the background, both just want to enjoy the peaceful life of morioh but have vastly different definitions). Another great example is black beard in one piece, luffy expresses the ideas of freedom but black beard epitomizes the darker areas of that concept being chaos & anarchy, he doesn’t need to be a in depth/real character but just a character who reflects a concept
I Think There For I AM.
Irredeemble Villians.
I thought this man was gonna sing the amazing digital circus song😭🙏
0:27 Okay, but having Harlan Ellison's voice over Hojo actually still fits the character so well. Like, if Ellison had ever read out one of Hojo's lines from FF7 or one of its sequels/spinoffs in that very voice, everyone would call it perfect casting.
Nice video talking about a good trope that never goes out of style because as good it is to have a redemptive villian or just entertaining as a character, it's a reminder they're pure evil or at least that's what they are supposed to be & I'll mention 2 of the most sinister characters I ever came across in media
Yuuki Terumi (Blazblue)-I've mentioned this literal snake in the past & I'll keep it brief but it's impressive how he's this sinister because it's absolutely effective throughout all the series & what's even crazier is that he's not 2 steps ahead, he's 15 steps ahead! Even when it looks like he's dead he always comes back all because he feeds off the hate of people so he's actually sinister to his benefit because it allows him to exist! And with the grand master plan to kill Ameterasu & make sure the world will constantly suffer in a endless loop of torment to destroy it continuously all from being tired of being a god & why I hate him for the right reasons
Dr. Weil (Mega Man Zero)-This guy is straight up r*cist and that's already a red flag but what's so crazy is that his drive is also scary to an extreme degree that was seen by irl historical monsters in the past especially when he unleashed Omega that wiped out 50% of humans AND 90% of reploids in the world! He wiped out half of his own kind just out of hate for reploids because of what happened in the Mega Man X games due to the Sigma Virus! And they thought exiling him would be enough to make him regret his actions but all it did was increased the hate so now instead of hating reploids, he hates ANYONE that isn't him as now he wants control of the entire world with an iron fist & labels anyone, reploid or otherwise as maverick and if you disagree he'll just nuke you with a space laser cannon called Ragnorok! It's so scary that he's a oppressor against all the reploids that wasn't even there own fault as it was due to the Virus yet he ignores all that and wants the reploids to be slaves to humans & why he's a very good villian in the Mega Man series since he's not some hammy Saturday morning cartoon bad guy (that I still love in Wily & to a degree in Sigma) he's a actual problematic person that was given all the power & became a dictator, which makes it all the more satisfying to see Zero put him down
Ohh you better be cooking a Kars video with FINALLY another video with a JoJo character in it. He is the only one missing from the main JoJo villains (at least the anime ones)! And he is actually pretty cool to me, more than people normally say he is. I hope that it is coming soon 🙏
AM is like a foil to the "ai made to protect humanity/the world determines that it's impossible to prevent humanity from destroying itself and goes rogue" trope. It was made to hurt, so it did.
I object to the idea that Yoshikage Kira had a "tragic" backstory. He's "tragic," but only in the sense that he could have been a perfectly decent office father type. That's just a fact of his character though, not of his childhood experiences or anything.
And if people are referring to that scrapped backstory Araki considered for a while of giving him an abusive mother, that was SCRAPPED. It's _not part of the text,_ it _doesn't count._ Author headcanon ≠ actual canon, unless/until they add it to the text of the story.
10:04 literally team fortress 2 medic. But apart from inhumane experiments he also tricked The Devil himself.... twice
My! That's a awful good pen right there
Speaking of villains who are refreshingly evil for the sake of being evil, one good example that comes to my mind is Skar King from the latest MonsterVerse film, Godzilla x Kong: The New Empire. Despite being a kaijū sized ape who can't speak, Skar shows a great ton of personality and the utter glee he takes from his villainy. He's a sadistic, tyrannical, power hungry bastard who loves torturing and/or killing his slaves just for the pleasure of it, he has no remorse about torturing Shimo with pain nor any qualms about beating children, and he even makes fun of Kong's metal tooth upon meeting. And like many villains of his ilk, he takes no issue in cheating in battle. Laughing is and smiling, Skar King puts the "dirty" in "damn dirty ape."
MUDA!!!!
A recent example of an irredeemable villain I got to witness for myself is Limbus Company's take on Captain Ahab. You're shown a character who caused one of your teammates to not only suffer from her trauma, but that they're constantly suffering from a compulsion to hunt her to the ends of the earth.
You meet her, and she seems to be a stern yet charismatic captain. Her crew seem to trust her, and her strategic mind is enough to shatter your leadership and convince your team to work with her. Near the end of the mission, however, you get a sampler platter of just how disgusting and devious she is, sending members of her troop to avoidable deaths and just casually cutting off members of her crew to make the trek even slightly easier.
Why do this? Because she didn't "kill" them, her crew instead "sacrificed" themselves for the sake of the mission. A mentality you and her former crewmate defy by claiming her mission from her and robbing her the satisfaction of killing the Pallid Whale while leaving her to die within its corpse.
CHA MAGANERA!
jokes aside, I loved ahab. The voice lines for the gasharpoon fight really support what you said about her sending the crew to their deaths being "sacrifices" in her eyes
What I like best about Horner is that they do give him the "sad crybaby backstory" but it means nothing. It's a minor joke to show why he has his motivation and nothing else. Whereas normally it's basically the, "oh, the hero is going to redeem you at the end," scene. No, he's still a bastard, with the movie outright poking fun at the idea of him being redeemed.
It helps show that villains can indeed have "sympathetic" or sad backstories. As a means of giving a bit of character, but the problem is that 99% of the time it's just there so there's some leeway when the hero goes, "Sure, you're a mass-murdering despot. But you said sorry, so it's okay."
The irony is that he ended up much better than Pinnochio. He made Geppetto his money and the moment he couldn't stretch the act anymore, he immediately sold him to the government.
The Most Irredeemable Villains is the best villains.
Why you lying
Skar King
Kefka, easily best Final Fantasy villain
Good written villains is the best villains.
It's just an opinion! You don't have to attack him!
It's not his fault he's wrong!
Kamoshida is probably one of my favourite total bastard villains. They somehow gave the power-tripping abusive monster a backstory and reason for being the way he is without ever feeling like they're telling you to feel bad for him or sympathise with him. He's an egotistical monster because the world keeps enabling his worst aspects due to his success and reputation, and his Asmodeus design in particular is perfectly representative of how truly terrible he is. I also appreciate that he's not a world ending threat per se, but you're shown just how toxic and cruel he is that it makes you WANT to take him down.
Hell he doesn't really get a 'I'm sorry I'll do better' redemption arc. Him confessing is more the worst punishment he could suffer, as it will permanently damage his ego and reputation and deny him what he desires most.
''They *somehow* gave the power-tripping abusive monster a backstory and reason for being the way he is without ever feeling like they're telling you to feel bad for him or sympathise with him''
But abusive monsters in media are almost always given a reason/motive for being the way they are, without trying to make spectators sympathize with them. It's pretty common.
Cioccolata's stand thinks he's Monsoon
Surprised you didn't make that joke in the video considering your mild obsession... I mean high interest in MGR
Emperor Belos is truly horrifying because of how realistic (and relevant due to current events) of a nightmare he truly is.
There's a few reason why this trope died off. One is simply that franchises exist now, in a way that, before the mid 90s, they really didn't before. Cross-media empires are born, and thus, media needs villains, and rather than coming up with a new one every series, they need this one to survive.
Why does that mean they're no longer monsters? Because, if they were monsters, the question becomes WHY they survived the last encounter. With some, that's simple. Thanos? Killing him isn't in the power of the people in the group(literally, Death rejected him, and that means they couldn't kill him).
The Joker? People tend to forget how often Batman tried to let him die. Heck, it's one of the few problems with Under the Red Hood cutting the whole 'becoming the UN Representative of Iran(Yes really)', in order to keep him from being killed, and even at the end, Batman WANTED him dead, like wanted his body found to confirm it.
But then you have simple monsters. Like, for instance, the Anti-Monitor. Never forget, Superman, the golden age version, the paragon of virtue, who tries his with his ALL not to kill his villains, absolutely murdered him, ending him because he had no virtues to make sparing him anything but a bad idea.
Thus, villains, in order to franchise out, need redeeming qualities, in order to make it so them coming back again and again makes sense. After all, the villains used as examples here are completely singular. I don't think we'll see Jack in Puss in Boots 3/Shrek 27. The FF7 scientists were killed in the scenes that kind of introduced them originally, and I doubt they'll survive long in Remake Trilogy's final installment. Jojo gets away with it due to the Manga format, but killing those villains is the ultimate goal.
Almost as important as all the above? Almost all of these villains need henchbeings to do their evil bidding. From the Joker's Goons, Thanos' Army, or the Anti-Monitor's forces. Again, these are examples where they were absolutely evil when introduced, but something in them made them palatable as bosses.
But then you have ones like the above? Almost no Jojo villain KEEPS their army/forces for long, since they either get slaughters or just peace out when the boss turns out to be a bastard/crazy. AM never really had anyone but himself(though technically he IS an army), and the question of why the Bakers keep going with Jack is actually brought up in the film(it's fear, but that same emotion would have seen them run away if that had been an option, and only the terrain was making it so it wasn't).
So, to put it bluntly, a lot of the reasons the monster villains aren't seen as much is because they can't survive too long without a DANG good reason, and they can't have minions without asking WHY those people keep helping them. There are more than that, but these are the two biggest reasons we stopped seeing simple evil villains in a lot of media in the last 30 years.
Black Hat from Villainous is an example of these monster villains.Much of the show is dedicated to exploring why he's such a success (being the physical embodiment of evil) and why people have to keep helping him (capitalism).
He's never had any sympathetic qualities or sympathetic moments, and is disgusted with the concept of redemption because it would remove people from his control.
Friendly reminder to consumers and writers alike, you can have deep (even sympathetic) backstories...AND irredeemable villains!
After all, society seems to love to reward them with power and priveledge, so why wouldnt a former underdog continue commiting the deeds that keeps pushing them ahead in life?
(Vinland saga has a real good example of this imo)
31:38 AM couldn’t have killed himself or used his powers to solve world problems. Because like you said, he was created to destroy and torture, not create and help, both the book and the game make this apparent, but AM is physically incapable of using his abilities for anything other than harm, it’s one of the main reasons he hates humans so much, there are limits to his abilities, and destroying himself seems to be one of the few things he can’t do. AM is tired In my opinion, AM is irredeemable, but not in the same way the other characters on this list are. He’s irredeemable because of circumstance
My favourite is All For One, the guy's entire motivation is just him wanting to be the center of the world, he wants everyone to look at him, so he'll be the evilest villains, that way everyone have no choice but to fear him or hate him, either way he'll be in everyone's mind, that's pure psychopathic
Especially when MHA is full of complex tragic villains it’s nice to also have a Villan who’s evil just for sake of it, literally just because he though lt villains in comic books were cool
Even manipulates those who have genuine grievances with things in the world and looks to that pain as nothing more than something for him to take advantage of for his sake.
True, though, I'd rather he not have been the main villain for the last arc.
True but you shouldn't forget that his last moments in manga supposed to point out that no matter how hard he's trying to be pure evil - he's not. Even Midoriya says that AFO is just a sad lonely child in shell of old man. He's irredeemable not because he doesn't have tragic backstory (he do) but because unlike Toga, Dabi or Tomura - he refuses to admit that thi's tragic past influence him somehow.
@michaelzjwanko3680 that's the whole point, no human is pure evil, because every evil is motivated by emotions, there's no such things as unexplainable evil, like Jack Hornet is motivated by jealousy, those 7 deadly sins are human emotions
What I love about last wish is how it utilizes three types of antagonists and villains.
One sympathetic and redeemable(Goldy), one disgustingly irredeemable and pure evil(jack), and one who is more in the Morally gray area of who you could say is more amoral(death)
I've always thought of Jack Horner as a parody of how Disney has been giving their recent villains some sort of tragic backstory to explain why they do their crimes instead of just being evil. When Jack is talking to the cricket about his "sad" family life he quickly realizes he's probably one of the worst human beings in the world if not the worst which is really saying something. I've been around long enough to know that people don't need some sob story in order to be a monster.
You know Cioccolata was messed up when the only other character who’s arguably worse than him was Anjuro “Angelo” Katagiri from Part 4.
This man… has quite literally committed every single crime in the law book. Our in-person introduction is him biting off a dog’s snout, and spitting the remains inside the owner’s mouth.
Even at the age of 12 years old, he went up to a random couple at the park, beat the man over the head with a bat, and assaulted the woman. *At Age 12.* Not even the kids were safe from his cruelty. Everyone was a victim with him around.
Keep in mind this is the first villain of the “Slice of Life” Part of JoJo, and he’s already worse than DIO. Even Yoshikage Kira looks like a saint compared to Angelo.
Just as sympathetic villains can be done well, pure evil villains can be just as phenomenal and iconic. Judge Claude Frollo is one of the most universally-praised Disney villains, and Hunchback itself knows why: "He saw corruption everywhere...except within."
In the original book by Victor Hugo, Frollo does some incredibly heinous things, yet his character is framed as a tragic one as he transitions from a genuinely well-intentioned person to a selfish, raving madman. Frollo in the animated movie? He's 100% evil from beginning to end. As if targeting an oppressed culture isn't horrible enough, among his first onscreen actions are killing a woman on the steps of a church and attempting to throw her deformed baby down a well. He only takes in Quasimodo to avoid the wrath of God, but even then he never acts the way a parent should, gaslighting and ridiculing Quasi whenever it suited him. THEN when he lusts for Esmerelda, he somehow gets even WORSE, as his obsession with her drives him insane and decides, "let her taste the fires of Hell, or else let her be mine and mine alone!"
Much like Jimmy from Mouthwashing, Frollo always sees himself as the hero, and is never NOT the hero in his eyes. In all his screentime, Frollo never takes responsibility for his evil actions, uses Christianity to justify his crimes, and sees himself as "purer than the common vulgar, weak, licentious crowd" with no reservation. When Esmerelda escapes from him, he could just let her go and move on. He begged God Himself to not let him fall to his urges, yet when he is given the chance to forget about her, Frollo would rather burn down Paris in order to find her and make her belong to him. He even seems to have a single moment of self-reflection on how far he's falling ("God have mercy on her, God have mercy on me"), yet it's not enough. He doubles down and gives in to pure evil, doing everything he can to have his way with Esmerelda no matter who suffers in the process, because in Frollo's mind, it won't be him.
Self-righteous, viciously cruel, and ultimately unrepentant, Frollo is a reflection of many horrible people in the real world. Frollo is a man who chose to be a monster. Frollo is everything God condemns. Frollo is evil incarnate.
Machinabridge Hojo reference, based! For me a favorite irredeemable villain is Dimentio from Super Paper Mario. A psychotic jester who wanted to destroy all worlds just so he can make everything in his image.
Agreed. I adore Dimentio
Because THIS! IS MY! fffffffffffffFETIIIIISH!!
Why does the thumbnail look like Big Jack Horner and Cioccolata just teamed up and are winning somehow
They would team up and make it clear to each other that they would betray each other 😅
Jack and Cioccolata = worsties for life
Starting the video with a quote from "I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream", eh? Love it!
What I like a lot of many of these irredeemable villains is that they are so evil they become funny in a way, specially Sundowner and Jack Horner.
Nah Sundowner is too fucked up to be funny.
Do you guys agree that Lord Farquaad, Fairy Godmother, Prince Charming, and Rumpelstiltskin are irredeemable villains just like "Big" Jack Horner himself?
For fairy godmother and charming kinda, but for Farquad and rumplestilkskin definitely.
Prince Charming always seemed more like a pawn of his mother then anything, a spoiled arrogant badly raised brat but I do think there could be potential hope if he was ever put on the right track
A good example to me is to make the pure evil character horrifying, entertaining, and hateable. Bill Cipher, Jack Horner, as mentioned in the video, and Frieza are good examples of pure evils that are entertaining due to their charm and comedy, but terrifying because of what they are able to do. Judge Holden and the Qu, two other pure evils that are in the same level as AM in terms of evil surprisingly, are terrifying because they represent something in our lives, Holden represents the depraved nihilism of humanity, while The Qu represent the dangers of the unknown, and nature in general, Micah Bell and Jimmy are characters we hate so much, but they’re written so well, we love to hate him despite how much of a rat Micah is towards his own gang, and how much of a prick Jimmy is towards everyone. And ironically, Ronaldo from Helluva Boss’s Ghost Fuckers episode, manages to actually be one of the best written antagonists in the entire Hazbin Hotel/Helluva Boss universe, to me at least, due to his sinister nature, calm attitude, and creepy power in torturing people. Meanwhile, a character like Cipher from Fast and Furious, or The Buyer from the Knuckles show don’t work is because they’re just genetically evil, we aren’t given a reason for why they are evil, they just are, and it doesn’t help they aren’t entertaining, to me, but I hear a lot of other people didn’t really care for the Buyer that much either, then there’s the case of MAN from Bambi, who has zero to no character, and barely does anything evil.
Have you seen Schaffrillas’s MAN from Bambi rant?
@ Yes, and I absolutely agree. He does not count for the purpose of a villain.
A reason why Gruntilda Winkybunion from Banjo-Kazooie is one of the goats in this department, evil and reveling in it all to the point she’ll kill her own sisters on her side for simply failing to beat Banjo & Kazooie in a quiz game, all while being legitimately hilarious at the same time!
Not irredeemable villains by any stretch of the imagination, but I love how there's basically a very set dynamic about Transformers.
Almost universally, if you have a Sentinel Prime, his job is either to try and undermine/usurp Optimus, or he's the reason you HAVE Optimus. Sentinel is a very charismatic leader, but he's a two faced asshole, and if you have him and Optimus at the same time, the older Autobots tend to side with Sentinel and the younger ones/more idealistic ones tend to side with Optimus.
Another character like this is LordKnightmon/Crusadermon from Digimon. If the Digimon story at hand is directly about the threat to the Digital World/Drasil, LKM will default to being the antagonist. LKM is by default the least trusting of humans, making him a prime target for Lucemon's corruption as well. Usually, this will pit LKM against Omnimon, Gallantmon and UlforceVeedramon/Magnamon depending on the game.
I love dynamic switchboards/flowcharts you can just read at a glance like this. "Ah, this is scenario X, so these characters will align like this!"
The High Evolutionary from Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 3 is a great irredeemable villain. He performed thousands of gruesome experiments on animals and discarded most as failures in an attempt to make a perfect world. He even blew up a planet because his current batch had grown to be too violent. And he did all that just because he hated the way things were.
If I remember correctly, Ciaocolata was based of a particular criminal surgeon, who Araki was following the story on. He made the character as if to tell him, "you won't escape the justice you deserve". Though I might be misremembering, so take what I say with a grain of salt.
Spoilers for Jojo part 8
Araki must hate evil doctors so much that he made an entire antagonist group in part 8 who are evil doctors
26:57 The problem is that they get BORING if you have one after another in a congo line of one-shot episodes. They all just blur together as having the exact same personality!
This works in Power Rangers because the monsters aren't relatable and are treated more a gimmick obstacles the heroes have to figure out how to overcome, and we're shown they're MADE this way (the ones who are hired guns tend to turn on the villains as soon as they realize they're cannon fodder).
People confuse the idea that if you can understand a villain's motives that you have to make them sympathetic or redeemable, but you can certainly make a villain who simply refuses whatever sympathy points they may have by being utterly evil. When writing took on the huge push of "everyone is the hero of their own story" they took that not to say that people should be understandable in their actions but that they think that they shouldn't write villains. Like, someone who is just completely selfish and uncaring about that selfishness harming others is just as believable as someone trying to garner sympathy. And it's also possible that even if someone is sympathetic, they can still be completely depraved as a villain, and not even in the sense of being a templar, but someone whose own sense of morality is fundamentally twisted.
One of the first examples I can think of is from an extremely obscure anime series, M3: The Dark Metal. The primary villain who leads the plot is the doctor Natsuiri. It's obvious from the get-go that he's evil. He has no issue treating everyone as tools, is childish and obviously selfish, looks down on everyone around him - he's EXTREMELY entertaining. The show is actually very good, though it is a slow burn, so I highly recommend it.
There's a moment where he carries what appears to be a toxic metal that will cause the death of anyone directly exposed to it around. He uses this as leverage to get something he wants out of a conference, then after it's over he breaks the vial on the ground... Before telling the people it's full of cola and laughing. That's the kind of character he is. His charisma as an obvious villain is a huge draw of the early series.
Near the end of the series [spoilers, obviously] we see Natsuiri's backstory. His main dream in life is to find, put simply, a way for people to "understand" each other. He learns of a tribe on a rural island of people who have telekinetic abilities, and falls in love with one of their people. She knows his goal is purehearted, and believes in it herself. Natsuiri wants humanity to prosper.
...So he raids the village to use as guinea pigs for his experimentation, wiping out the entire populace, resulting in them performing a ritual to release a monster in retribution. Natsuiri even goes as far as knocking out and using the woman he loves as a test subject, justifying it to himself saying, "You want to see my dream come true, so you should do anything you can to help me out."
Natsuiri is NOT portrayed as positive and it actually is part of the series' themes that even if he didn't do anything evil, his dream itself was misguided. When he gets his comeuppance it's in seeing the spirits of the people whose lives he ruined before him. Seeing the love of his life, he pleads with her as if asking for one shred of sympathy, and the spirit turns to him and has but one thing to say:
"Unforgivable."
the jimmy flashbang in the opening was FOUL
I feel like when someone asks me "who's your favorite Mouthwashing character?" I have to lie and say Daisuke because if I say Jimmy there's a chance they will actually kill me, so I have to be like "Well, uhh, my favorite from a LIKEABILITY standpoint is Daisuke, but like, without Jimmy the game wouldn't have a reason to exist, and as a villain he's really compelling, so you HAVE to admit he's a goo- IMPORTANT character, even if he sucks!" and I'm still given the side-eye even with all that sugarcoating of my opinion lol
My real opinion is that Jimmy is my favorite because, as horrible of a person he is, he is an EXTREMELY compelling and well written villain, and one of the best villains of all time, and one of my favorite game characters of all time by association. As much as I love the others, without Jimmy the game would have no reason to exist. He is the horrible, rotten, disgusting heart and soul of this game, and he is what this game thrives in.
You could remove any other character, and the game would be much _much_ worse basically no matter who you removed, however it would still be an at least solid game. Without Jimmy? The game may as well not exist. Every single action of every single character, every single event, every single line of dialogue, it ALL ties back to Jimmy and how despicable of a person he is, and it's the reason the narrative of the game works as well as it does.
10/10 villain, 10/10 character, 10/10 game, no notes
so I'm a massive vampire lover, and my favorite vampire of all time is a great example of an irredeemable monster, and he's technically a "hero", the vampire Alucard from Hellsing. Does he have a tragic past? Yes, does he technically protect people and serve the greater good? sure. But let him off leash for even a moment and he'll make a display of his cruelty with zero regard to if his opponents are monsters like himself, or just innocent humans doing their jobs. He revels in the violence, the cruelty. Can can't be redeemed, he knows that, he doesn't want redemption, he wants his death. But he's going to take as many people human or vampire along with him. He could have left the hotel in episode 3 in any number of ways and kept the deaths to a minimum, but he didn't. He chose to kill EVERYONE, every poor cop who thought they were protecting people and he kills them brutally, even throwing several to be impaled onto flag poles on live international TV just for fun. He has no regrets about a single person he kills or worse steals the souls of. he is irredeemable, and proud of it, yet is still able to be a compelling character
Jack Horner jump scare: 0:22
Shoutout to my boi Chrollo Lucilfer for having a tragic past and still being an irredemeble monster
👌
He'not irredeemable. He giving money he yearns to his city and genuine care about his family (Spiders). Chrollo is not an example of irredeemable villain. Quite opposite - he's example of anti-villain/sympathetic one.
The high evolutionary should also be here. He’s the first Villian I truly wanted to see dead.
Crispin Freeman did such a good job with sundowners voice and his laugh is so iconic
On one hand, I enjoy a villain with an understandable, believable and probably tragic backstory to explain why they do what they do(Handsome Jack), and yes I love a good redemption story(Anakin). On the other hand, I still need a fix of unfeeling monsters who were just born and want to watch the world burn.
The Reverse Flash is probably one of the best Irredeemable Villains out there. The dude is one of the most cruel and petty guys on the planet, who uses the fact he is a Time Anomaly and thus unaffected by Time Travel to do whatever the hell he wants to make the Flash aka Barry Allen's life suck and be as miserable as possible.
Dude killed his mom, erased Barry's childhood friend from existence, caused him numerous injuries and boughts of misfortune throughout his childhoodo and continues to use his insane power to make Barry suffer for his own amusement. The guy took being evil and sadistic to new levels of insane and you can't help but appreciate how much effort he puts into being evil.
i'm a big fan of irredeemable villains. it just feels like people can have more fun with them when they aren't trying to make them super sympathetic for the audience. and a backstory can easily inform but not excuse a villain's actions. and it's also just really fun at least for me to explore just, the most insane and hypocritical of mindsets.
plus, as shown here, just because a villain is irredeemable doesn't mean they don't come in a lot of flavors! we have everything from AM, who is so far beyond human in any capacity that it's precisely what's messed it up, to Jimmy, who could be working in your office and have 3 HR complaints that you don't know about, to the in-betweens that are still very human but still quite _above_, such as Jack Horner, Sundowner, and ,just _barely_ teetering into humanity, The Judge. (funny enough, it seems this scale corresponds to villain size, too - Jimmy's a normal dude, Jack, SD and Holden are all HUGE dudes, and AM is The Obelisk).
within 1:20 of watching this and i love it already
Here are a couple of other fictional characters who are all totally irredeemable whether they're pure evil or complete jerks such as Ryōko Mendō (Urusei Yatsura), Phil Billings (Ben 10 Series), Gemini "Gem" Stone (Sabrina: The Animated Series), Mandy (Totally Spies!), Melissa O'Malley (The Life and Times of Juniper Lee), Jack Spicer (Xiaolin Showdown), Amber & Ashley (Hannah Montana), Takao Kuroi (THE iDOLM@STER), Sierra McCool (The Replacements), Dr.Blakk (Slugterra), Jin Norizuki (Pretty Rhythm: Rainbow Live), Princess Allie (Pokémon the Series: XY), Chloé Bourgeois (Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir), Lila Rossi/Cerise Bianca (Miraculous: Tales of Ladybug & Cat Noir), Miori Sanada (Lonely Castle in the Mirror), Rinne Berlinetta's 3 childhood bullies (ViVid Strike!), Richardson Mole (Big Hero 6: The Series), Ma’alefa’ak/M'comm M'orzz (Young Justice TV Series), and the Byogens (Healin' Good Pretty Cure).
I think the demons from frieren could technically fit the archetype too, but they're not exactly *bad* just are monsters that eat humans and speak their language
I think the demons from frieren could technically fit the archetype too, but they're not exactly *bad* just are monsters that eat humans and speak their language
Jack Spicer mentioned.
31:50 He doesn't make a choice. He can't. The only thing he can think of and do is "How to kill humans" or "How to make an effective war". But he is conscious and similar to humans enough to compare himself with them and their freedom, expression, art and ect. And that for some reason makes him HATE all of humanity and think of more intricate ways to kill the rest of it (even if it's impossibly long way to kill just 1 remaining human).
It's quite sad to see something being brought into existence against it's will an with insufferable limitations, as we all were. He is just a prisoner of his own nature, unable to act differently but fully aware of it each microinstant of his existence.
So AM is indeed extremely relatable villain, unable to change himself or even die, only to do that he was made for.
The High Evolutionary is probably one of the best and most hated villains i've ever seen tbh, like my man didn't have a single redeemable quality and caused the whole cinema to cheer when he was defeated
One irredeemable villain I like to bring up is Ali Al Sachez from Gundam 00. Basically he is what everyone thinks what Divine from Yugioh 5Ds is although Divine is a cheap copy compared to him. The guy brainwashed and raised kids as child soldiers including the main character Setsuna for fun.The guy loves war and he’s so good at it he killed off another main character yet he could slip in to society and no one would notice.At every turn he was a threat even when in inferior mechs or breaking the fourth wall.He was an entertaining bastard that you love to hate.Ali Al Sachez is one of the Gundam franchise’s best villains.
The Fact that puss in boots last wish had all three types of villains and did it so well was phenomenal. The Force of Nature, The Irredeemable and the Misguided
15:09 HAD TO CALL ME OUT DIDNT YA
I think there's a part of the irredeemable villains that should be explored upon, and it's the awareness of their actions, i think not much media explores that line of the definition of beyond saving and about running out of chances.
About the regret that comes after they sank that low and we barely see in them because of everything they've done.
Instead of the usual concepts of, you can always make it better, i would love an irredeemable character that regrets his actions and tries to redeem themselves, only to realize it's impossible and that they deserve nothing. That point is usually very quickly cut with their deaths but i'd love to see more media explore that type of existencialism of realizing the monster they are and knowing they cannot change anymore
Should have added Judge Holden.
Too evil, can't do experts sorry
WOOHOO
No Helluva Boss on the video
You think Vicious of Bebop would be an interesting villain to talk about?
Guy is efficiently unhinged.
Colin Farrell’s The Penguin is a good recent example of irredeemable villains done right.
The fact that he tricked the audience into forgetting he’s an evil scumbag because he got his own show is crazy.
22:56 I can't believe JJBA predicted Blue Athemn's policy to only pay for anesthesia for how long an operation was supposed to happen!
An interesting topic to cover would be entitled characters. Entitlement is a scary thing when observed from the outside; those who are entitled don't think they're in the wrong, believing they 'deserve' things (affection, positions, money, etc.) thus see themselves as the hero even when they lash out in anger (sometimes violently) when they don't get what they want - "The evil that doesn't know is evil, is the worst kind there is."
FF7 Machinabridged mentioned! yay!!
Tifa: “WHYYYYYY!?”
Hojo: “Oh, you wanna know why? Because this! Is! My! FFFFFFFFFFETISH!”
It’s was never funny, just like their Nappa
Fun (maybe) Fact, jack horner is a representation of Disney wanting to have control all of the MAGIC of storytelling so only they can have it all to themselves
Ciocolatta deserved the death loop more then Diavolo.
I think the shogun appearance for Sundowner is actually quite clever. While in modern day there is a lot of media portraying Samurai and their Shogunate as honourable in actual history a lot of them were quite deplorable. One example I can give for this is the inspiration for the pokemon move Night Slash. It is based on a practice certain samurai would do called Tsujigi translated to Crossroad Killing. Where a samurai with a new blade would lie in wait at a crossroad for a commoner or someone else who is a lower class to them to come along and then ambush them purely to test how well their new weapon would cut.
Shoguns specifically were very ruthless and a lot of them were glorified warlords. And I think they used this more historical version as inspiration for Sundowner's appearance as it suits his agenda perfectly. A Sadistic wanna-be Warlord.
I would like to share an irredeemable villain from the game Path to nowhere, Cabernet. She has everything that she wanted since childhood because of extreme wealth that her family has. She just speaks of what she wanted and her family finds a way to get it, mainly focusing on wanting exotic and exquisite foods.
But that doesn’t satisfy her. She has the ability to extract human souls and turn into food. The more noble the soul is, the more delicious it is for her. Her well-known crime is that she kidnaps her chefs who are devoted to their work for their families or their future because to her, this is so noble and deserve a happy ending.
She keeps them in her secret dungeon and extract their souls, turning them into food and use them as an example of what a ‘splendid’ dish tastes like. The effects of it if eaten is that it tastes like the most mouth-watering dish you’ve ever tasted and you wanted more as if you’ve gone insane, and Cabernet took pleasure of seeing them in that state just because she likes it, just for fun.
Some fans call her a succubus, or Hannibal Lecter but hot (I sweat, look it up. She’s so hot and I’m one of her simps.) but surely irredeemable villainess nonetheless. There are a lot of characters in that game who are irredeemable but she takes the no. 1 spot for me. And she has a lot of fans too because simply, she’s extremely attractive.
I love the practice of having a redeemable/understandable villain in tandem with the most vile and deplorable villain.
I like how Cioccolata only exists to justify one-upping Steely Dan’s beatdown. Steely Dan in Stardust Crusaders is the ultimate bastard, someone you’d love to punch in the face til your hand breaks. So to one up his beating, Cioccolata was introduced to be the ultimate piece of 💩. Someone you wouldn’t stop punching if you had the chance
one of my favorites is probably Brad from lisa the painful. its one of the cases of a sympethetic character who is also irredeemable at the same time. he may have had a bad life and the game makes you want to help him redeem himself like he does, except he is an unreliable narrator who is doing it purely out of selfish desires and will ultimately be punished for it due to to his addiction and actions that are set in motion before you even get the chance to take control, and all feeling bad for him and trying to help him get better will do is ultimately make the game more difficult. The kind of character that makes you say "Im really sorry man, but you had it coming".
Starting off the video with AM goes hard