MkLeo & Mew2King Smash Ultimate Guide | Lucina & Marth
HTML-код
- Опубликовано: 7 фев 2025
- MkLeo and Mew2king have history with Lucina and Marth. Mew2King was the best Marth in Melee. What do they think of these characters in Ultimate? Which one is better? What random clips and polls will we throw in? Watch to find out....
WHAT? You haven't entered the @tzrApp & Echo Fox giveaway for a chance to win an Audeze headset, a Master Series seat from OPSEAT, a bulk supply of Celsius, Echo Fox merch, and a chance to join Mew2 and Leo on stream?!?! What are you waiting for: giveaway.teeze...
Check out our other Smash Guide episodes: • MkLeo & Mew2King Smash...
Follow our Smash Gods:
/ mkleosb
/ mvg_mew2king
Produced by Brett Shumway
Co-Produced by Jason Zimmerman, and Leonardo Lopez Perez
Edited by Matt Beeby
Titles/Graphics by Matt Beeby
Game Capture by Charlie Siers
Director of Photography and Sound Mixing by Brandon Scullion
Echo Fox is one of the world’s preeminent esports organizations, recruiting, developing and celebrating some of the world’s best professional esports athletes.
➡ SUBSCRIBE ➡ bit.ly/RUclipsFOX
➡ MERCH ➡ store-echofox....
FOLLOW:
echofox.gg
/ echofoxgg
/ echofoxlol
/ echofoxgg
/ echofoxgg
/ discord
/ tzrapp
SPONSORS:
Audeze (DISCOUNT CODE): gaming.audeze....
Celsius: www.celsius.co...
HyperX: hyperx.gg/echofox
OPSEAT (DISCOUNT CODE): opseat.com/?ut...
#FOXWIN #echofox #SmashUltimate
I hope I'll get to see M2K's Melee Marth again someday.
He's gonna be competing at the big house soon
Nice.
12:05 I love this part... and the editing so amazing too. The zoom into M2K low key foxtrotting, Leo being shocked after finding out the foxtrot trick, then the sliding backdrop of Leo super tryhard foxtrotting with the awakening music. I love it so much
That was a quality moment.
Marth with japanese voice is top tier.
I know what you mean, but Yuri Lowenthal isn't even the right person for the english voice and he has revoiced lines in japanese for the first time since melee.
My game mode is in Japanese solely because I win more when he speaks Japanese.
@@johnjay9767 Facts.
that was his biggest nerf
Marth mains rise
There are ways to vary dancing blade so they don’t fall out for Lucina, and 4U optimizations! It’s in Izaw’s video and the marcina disc
As a Marth main i found this really helpful, thank you
welcome ;)
In the most perfect theoretical scenarios, Marth is better in almost every category. Combo potential, damage potential and kill potential..
In reality, Lucina has more consistency in almost every scenario.
Yeah it's kinda sad, and I wish he had his old costume.
I can see it now a smash anime and they will be like "IT CANT BE !!! HE'S ENTERED THE MARTH ZONE"
Quick note that they didn't mention. Lucina's dancing blade 3 won't send them too far for the finisher if you do the down variant.
Opposite of the Roy one?
@@JonahDeroy I dont use roy, not much I can tell you there. But on some characters doing up on dancing blade 3 then doing neutral 4 makes you go under them. For luci (and marth based on position) dancing blade 3 is best down unless you're going for an up finisher.
The 5th dimension "marth zone" edit had me rolling
These are the best character analysis videos I’ve seen. You two are very easy to listen to and funny.
I want to see Lucas
heared that mkleo has a different opinion on him than most top players :)
LETS GO I’ve been stanning marth since day one and now MkLeo see’s his potential as well
I'm just glad they finally upped the stock count to 99, idk why it took them so long to do this
I like Lucina better cuz I’m bad at the game and she’s a really simple character that just works.
Fundamentals are important. Better off playing Lucina first
RikuPlayz not to be rude or anything but this person may understand the game extremely well while not being a good player who knows
I liked this one, made me want to play Marth more than before.
Wish for some comments from mk and m2k about the change to Lucina/patch changes.
Does it affect her much? like even a 1 hit difference can prevent some kill confirms.
YESSS
So happy about this AND Hero direct same day!!!!
"mew2king was the best marth in melee."
:(
He was and that's true , to an extent he still is, he has not playing in a while , playing after a break give you a fresh mentality which i believe he would benefit from.. King's back??
PPMD was better
Never Ken is always the best marth player
Christian Murphy nah zain is gain and gain is insane
@@stevendaily3695 All of the above! only one way to find out, Melee Marth only Smash tournament.
I want to see a specialised vid from Leo going into detail about the info on Marths sour into sweet spot kill confirms, specifically as well how to get the side b tipper kill as consistently as possible
I’m a Lucina main and this was extremely helpful for giving me attack combo and more info on ways to use Lucina. This Definitely a helpful video
My two favorite smash players in one video taking about my two favorite characters? I'm fangirling hard right now
Even if you have perfect spacing you have to read your oponents DI to tipper
DI does not really matter when they are stupid and just fall into your fsmash
Holy fuck, Leo’s tipper spacing is amazing... I have much yet to learn
I just don't like Lucina (I like Ike), so I play Marth, but you're actually saying that Marth might be better... at least one day...
(I still miss japanese Marth....)
You can change the language and if you don't mind me asking, why don't you like her?
@@imkrakenup7366 No real particular reason. Just as how I like or dislike characters, Lucina just so happens to be one I really dislike (kinda how I also don't like Sonic, no real reason, just hate their guts).
Her voice is kinda annoying and I haven't played FE Awakening so I don't have any attachment.
I want to feel attached to the character I play in some way.
And also she joined in Smash4, where so many FE characters joined and her being the least original compared to the rest and just bland compared to Marth (who has tipper mechanics that give some more depth, as a pro AND as a con)
So basically I just don't want to play her, tough I respect If someone likes her or just wants a good swordie character and not get cucked by inconsistent tippers.
(But whenever I fight Lucina as Marth, I'm really motivated to win)
Drayv she waifu though
@@2FadeMusic no she's flatter than game & Watch
@@atbtrendy9932 fuck u meaaaaaan
The problem is that Marth optimization is very difficult and the lacking consistency in comparison to Lucina makes him worse imo despite the fact that Leo has been saying he’s better.
The "lack of consistency" only means the player piloting Marth needs higher game sense at all times compared to piloting Lucina.
@@Casual_Shots facts and a lot of people just don't understand that for some reason
Zenex As the best player in the world, Leo doesn’t know what it is like for a person with a normal skill level to play Marth
s tier editing
Leo's English is too good now
FINALLY
LUCINA 😍
and marth... of course
wow talking about dissing a veteran for a boring character
I would like to see Chrom and the Hero when he comes out.
Lucina sucks
ATBT RENDY Bro she’s like top 10
@@Lightning-gg5iu probably he sucks at smash...
Playing Lucina might be more consistent for some people, but I think playing Marth which is more interesting, I am not talking about his strength, but the play style of Marth's tippers is just incredible (At least I want Marth and Lucina stay in the same tier, it feels painful to see in Ultimate Marth has been overwhelmed by Lucina in the tier list in every updates.......).
Its weird for an echo to be an entire tier more capable than her counterpart.
Lucina- Top Tier
Marth- High Tier
Leo: and Lucina is from?
M2k: uh… fire emblem
Leo: fire emblem what?
M2k: uh… the big one
my ranked characters going down:
6. Joker
5. Marth
4. Chrom
3. Roy (Fire Emblem) cuz of bowser roy
2. Lucina
1. Mario
Pienso que marth es mejor aunque requiere de un espaciado perfecto o bueno.
I never see anyone directional input the side B you could do crazy combos off of it
A landing sour FAIR to F Smash starting at 20% can bring you to a solid 43% dealt, besides the throw thing.
Tell me why this channel geeks while still being super informative
I really want to see Leo's Marth if he wins the Roy MU like he said. I thought it was universally accepted that Roy has a much easier time landing his sweetspots, and Ultimate's engine fosters aggressive approaches much better.
Marth can use his range to his advantage while Roy can't. Roy is also heavier and falls faster so Marth can combo and juggle Roy. Marth also edgeguards better and recovers better. This is my opinion of the matchup
@@sonriku7331 That would be obvious on paper, but I've seen too many Marth matches in Ultimate where the opponent lives well past 150%, sometimes 200%. He already seems to be having trouble landing tippers in Ultimate's engine because of the speed of the game, and Roy is one of the faster characters on top of that (and because of the combination of those two things, Roy players rarely have to worry about getting in sweetspot range when going on the offensive since they don't have to worry about spacing).
So not only is Roy more consistent with sweetspots, he's still designed to have more damage and KO power than Marth. The difference in their recoveries overall isn't potent enough to make up the difference anyway, especially when their ability to edgeguard the other is roughly equal. Yes, Marth has a more lenient time comboing Roy than vice versa, but Roy tends to win neutral against him much more often, and his own combo game isn't nonexistent.
@@OneGamer2EnvyThemAll ok it was my intention to give out what's good on paper. When you give this kind of info it is more important to tell what's good in theory rather than based on experiences. Also while Roy can combo Marth, Marth's floatiness can allow him to escape some of Roy's combos in combination of DI of course
I want to see Marth be proven to be there better one but it’s just not happening
This was annoying, MKLeo keeps interrupting M2K.... talking over him, kinda distracting. Other than that, very good video! Thank you for the combos, very nice
Well m2k has already stated that he doesn’t like marth in this game and doesn’t think he’s good, while leo plays marth and knows his potential. We’re probably better off hearing what leo has to say about him since he actually put time to learn him.
thanks for the video, you guys are the best ! I really love see marth matches when you use him, I think he is better than lucina for a little . I have a question, are you sure that marth is the same range than lucina, I think he have more range and he is taller and have a litte more big sword than hers :-o
Overall Marth is more risk/reward than Lucina, and Lucina 's attacks split the difference between Marth's tipper and sour spot. I think player skill will matter more than which one is more consistent though. If player A performs better than player B, it doesn't matter if its Lucina or Marth. They're so similar that skill becomes more of a factor than which one is higher on the tier list.
I find funny how hard MkLeo tries to advocate on why Marth may be the better choice but throughout the years of Ultimate is blatantly clear how Lucina is the better character and how he was went on winning tournaments thanks to Lucina since she is pretty much the more consistent Marth.
You forgot to add in the bio that Leo was the best Marth in smash 4
Haha, so did Leo.
Lucina is the character I wish I could main lol. I play pretty small brain so a character like Bowser is best for me, Lucina is kind of big brain and too advanced for me still
You got this! just keep at it haha
I personally prefer Lucina because I find her to be more consistent.
Imagine hitting from the tip of your sword but your opponents don't die at 30%
Thanks for the tips cause im a lucina main
*shield breaker*
Bad Recoverys are my favorite characters
Lil mak
Thank You Yayson and Leo
#ClassicEchoFox
6:31
Esto se puede considerar un YTP?
XD
Corrin guide when? No? Alright, I'll see myself out.
Unpopular opinion: corrin is secretly high mid-high tier
One of our editors is DYING to do a Corrin guide, so you may get your wish...
I would love to see wolf :)
GentleKef well he’s so easy to play u don’t need one lol
tomorrow :)
@@EchoFox Something you should add aswell is your opinion if the character is solo viable or needs to be dual mained, and if dual mained what could be a good secondary to cover poor matchups
Mr.Psych Lucina is easy too but here we are.
Main marth second Lucina
Marth is as good or better than Lucina. Dancing blade is crazy. 3 down is useful if the opponent is close to the tipper range on the first hit. If you tipper the first hit, it’s extremely difficult to tipper the final hit. Otherwise it’s almost always possible.
Lmao that intro was way too soon considering what happened to Rick Fox
15:20 “something”
Basically, I can beat the 9 cpu okay but having trouble with the 10 that’s where it starts to get at this level I think? I’m sure it’s still not quite the same but it’s interesting. Competitive smash is new to me! I love my new switch and ultimate, so I’ve been having a lot of fun training and oddly straining straining and pushing myself, lol. I’m surprised that I’m up there a bit skill wise, I never did this intentionally.
True Survivor Don’t practice against CPU’s bc they can lead you to develop bad habits. Training in battle arenas against actually people r better. Plus CPUs don’t always DI and tech and have frame perfect reactions. You need to practice against human opponents to improve
TheTyphlosionExplosion Level 9s tech way better than normal people lol
@@driggs6445 playing online can make you better against humans but definitely not make you better at the game overall since online is trash
Hero King Ofcourse not but it’s better than grinding against a computer that won’t give u any human practice. Tbh the best way to get better is to go to smash discord servers or play someone locally at tourneys in friendlies. However not everyone has that access
@@driggs6445 That is true
Wasn’t ken the best Marth?
No. He revolutionized the way marth was played, but he isn’t too dog anymore.
Ok
@@sullydeets m2k isnt top dog marth anymore either.... Zain is
Melee Marth is the most fun version of Marth by far, wish they brought back his physics
Brawl marth
Idk I don't wanna get force choked across the entire stage lmfao
Something
Marth definitely top 10. I main Marth and I secondary Sonic. Never really needed to switch to Lucina, but I’m fine with other people playing her.
LOL I’m surprised no one else replied to your comment, considering you said this a year ago, I would’ve strongly disagreed with you. Even with Marths buffs it did help him a lot, he still needs more buffs but I definitely think he is a high tier character
@@kava3957 this was a while ago, and I have different opinions now. I’ll tell you later because I’m busy now.
@@kava3957 but I do want to say that the buffs really didn’t affect him. It just made it easier for people to get into him.
@@kava3957 ok, I’m back. I now solo main Marth, and have been solo maining him for a while now. I don’t think that he isn’t top 10 anymore, but I do think that he is around the top 15-20 range. Not top tier, but still an extremely good character. I know that I mentioned before that the buffs really didn’t help him that much, and I’ll explain why. The buffs made him be able to tipper Bair, Fair, and Uair, as well as Dsmash’s tipper being more powerful. The Fair buff is the least noticeable, and the Dsmash buff really only helps with tech chasing. Dtilt at 60(tipper) or 120(sour) -> Dsmash is good and it just gebe you more reward for putting someone in a tech chase. Bair and Uair is the most notable. Uair is now **VERY** hard to sour when trying to go for a sour Uair kill confirm, but it helps more when juggling (so there are positives and negatives about the buff, even though Uair had a big tipper pre-patch). Bair is more consistent for raw RARs and tippering OoS(however sometimes I would prefer sour sometimes because it sets into a tech chase that I can kill from). Again, the buffs were more to help players who wanted to get into Marth. While the buffs were appreciated, they weren’t really needed. Now after the buffs, we are good, and Marth does not need to have any more. If you have any other questions, I’d love to answer them!
Can we get Greninja? :]
I predict Mkleo will be number 1 on the PGR but will suck online. Also, an Arms will be included in smash.
You couldve had M2K narrate the whole thing by himself tbh
Also: yes, Marth's hitboxes are identical to Lucina for every move, just with an added tipper.
Side note: he holds his sword at a 45° angle now for god knows what reason making his reach INTENTIONALLY shorter than previously and his fsmash has a massive chunk where it just doesnt have a hitbox (the chunk is comparable in size to Marth's actual tipper width, i have no idea how that STILL hasnt been fixed)
marths got better colors therefore he's superior
yummy yummy beans content ooooooo
hype
Hey senpai
I’ve been playing this game since I was really young and it used to be one of my favourite games, but I never practiced really consecutively and I think I’m almost as good as them. I stopped playing video games very regularly but I bought a switch recently and got into ultimate so I’m trying to finally master the game. I feel like I’m like 28% away from their skill level..? I chose to main as Cloud, even though the game might be uneven after a point. I couldn’t regularly practice but in the meantime I am. I just love Cloud, but I wonder if he can beat a high level fox or Marth?
@ lmao right that's no where near I'm smash terms. Nigga ur funny but it's true
Is there anyway I cant watch your gameplay? I'd really appreciate a link. Upload your games or go to a tournament because there are undiscovered people who are savage at smash but they aren't into esports
@valy0f that's true but honestly if someone was 72% as good as MKLeo they would probably be closer to top 25 PGR
These are great lol
Marth has a better recovery, fun fact
Marth because of M2k and Ken haha
I just hope Marth becomes top tier again,
Tiers don’t matter it’s the skill of the player
Marth is such an all-or-nothing character in this game. What's it matter if 1 in 15 fsmashes/DBs kills at 60 center stage when the other 14 don't kill until like 110 at the ledge.
Lucy can just throw out bairs and yolo fsmashes, Roy and Chrom have actual kill confirms with jab bair or nair fsmash, Marth just sort of swings and prays his timing and spacing were absolutely perfect and when it's not then his opponent lives to 160 then he gets uptilt shoryuken'd and dies at 75 and loses. That's Marth
Marth doesn't pray he reacts to his weak hits and follows up.
Isn’t that more an issue of better execution to get early kills?
@@edwinvargas7969 It is exactly that.
All the Lucina slander lmao this didn’t age well. Your Lucina was a beast tho Leo
Anyone else think the change to Dancing Blade looks terrible? It’s just boring swipes now instead of cool flashy moves
Just you.
I've been saying since day one that marth was the same as Lucina
Well they're echoes.... So yeah?
@@YangyChaddyDad most people put marth at mid high tier and Lucina mid top tier
Jacob Online 69 tf is ya profile pic weirdo
Lol m2k acting like his Marth is good in ultimate
Good, but undiscovered because people quit early on.
It is... There was like a 2 week period he actually went there. 😓
Marth may be better in some 20XX world.
Marth is a god
Marth mains b crying
Mkleo where are.... Oh wait...
Lesgo
The best Marth is Zelda
"Now we gonna rank the attributts"
I think lucina is probably better, but i played a lot of marth so i personally get better results with marth.
shulk
Lucina is only for people who don't have the skill to play Marth
I just really like Awakening so that's why I play her. No other reason tbh.
@@Meracog then ur forgiven
Female Marth vs female marth 2 lol
I love how everyone agrees mkleo is gonna win Evo
He better win Evo or imma cry. Unless tweek takes it then I won't be that upset
@@jamesgreenwood1703 yes! The rivalry is back on!
James Greenwood Nairos Ganon wins EVO
@@2FadeMusic but the thing is that Nairo never so Leo's joker coming
@@jamesgreenwood1703 i'm just joking man, of course a ganon can't win evo
これ見てる日本人いるの？
TFW you prefer playing as Marth just because you think Fire Emblem Awakening is overrated asf.
idk thought it was pretty good. why do u have robin as pfp then
@@deedumeday518 Well... TBF Awakening isn't a bad game or even a bad FE game. I do have it as my most played 3DS game and there are aspects about it that I like. It's more overrated in a similar sense that Zelda Ocarina of Time is overrated where a large portion of the FE fandom consider it one of if not the best FE game ever just cuz it sold well enough to make Fire Emblem as relevant as it is now (and TBF without it selling well, we wouldn't have had Fates Conquest and Three Houses which are 2 FE games that I do enjoy quite a bit) or just because a lot of people started with Awakening.
That being said, in my opinion, the game itself is so average by Fire Emblem standards with a rather generic JRPG story and not all that interesting characters imo with a few exceptions. There are worse Fire Emblem games such as Gaiden/ Echoes, Fates Revelations and Binding Blade but there are much better FE games as well such as Mystery of the Emblem, Genealogy of the Holy War, Path of Radiance, Radiant Dawn, Conquest and Three Houses.
As for my pfp, good question. honestly I just thought of random words for my username that sounded badass that would hint that I'm a Zelda and Fire Emblem fan and just made my pfp match my user name by having it being Robin with a Triforce tattooed on his hand.
@@hylianfelldragon1308 hahaha ok awesome.
*This was recorded before joker came out and before leo decided marth was absolute dogshit in this game.
Don't be fooled, marth can't actually get shit done that lucina can't, her fsmash that actually functions will always make her the better character.
4.0 didn't buff marth either.
Nice meme Nintendo.
2 months later: mkleo still thinks Marth is better than Lucina. And he plays him as a secondary. Therefore, your bullshit sucks and you can go fuck yourself. 🖕
G R E N I N J A?
I'm not even 5 minutes and there's so much misinformation being thrown around and all topped off by saying Lucina is an up close brawler and Marth always wants tippers. Just go watch izaw's video if you want a good video about these two characters lmao
First off these aren't supposed to be the IzaW videos. They are mainly about intro to character vids. Second, MkLeo won a major with Lucina so his words are basically set in stone and probably should be listened to regardless
@@jamesgreenwood1703 Mkleo also tried to say Marth had more range than Luci like 2 minutes into the video. If you wanna say literally incorrect information is set in stone then sure.
Milo bruh why u acting like ur better than the literal best player in the world
@@2FadeMusic because I'm tired of all these players that clearly have more skill and experience with the game and series say incorrect shit about these characters??
@@Milo-same hm let's see.... I don't see Milo on the PGR nor any tournament rankings. I mean if you're really saying that and critizing top players then it means you're a top player yourself but it turns out you're just another shitty degenerate the smash community as a whole has.
I think they are both really boring characters
Well fuck you too. :p
Something