These Problems With Solo Shuffle Are Causing Players To Quit PvP In Dragonflight
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- Опубликовано: 24 авг 2024
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Venruki is the only top player that seems to care that people are quitting WoW. All top PvE raiders and M+ players ignore the issues PvE faces entirely. PvE like PvP now faces the lowest numbers of all time during Dragonflight. Thanks for standing up for the majority of the playerbase Venruki. We appreciate it!!
Because the game is just bad. Everybody playing Classic ERA instead.
The top 1% are out of touch with the game. Only think what's best for the them and not the casual player. Unfortunately blizzard placates the 1%ers constantly
nobody cares for the noobs, same shit in every game. just trash talk the worse players and on top of that they get no rewards for trying their best and manage to pick up a round or 2 and still get nothing lol
@@dmasiodnmiod lol classic era is garbage tho
@@dmasiodnmiod Which top players are hard grinding Classic besides Xar? Who's said it multiple times, Classic to him is boring. If hardcore wasn't a mode, he wouldn't be playing 🤣
Venruki you missed a detail. When you are randomly thrown to a 1900 fight with a class that you dont know how to play, remember there is a healer there that will have to lose because of that. I found that as a healer really annoying. This happens a lot at 1500 where most of the people starts. I believe everyone should start at 0.
I recently came back to the game, leveled up got the honor gear for my Disc Priest, and jumped into Solo Shuffle to start getting conquest and trying to learn. The first lobby I get into is 2800, understand that I am NOT a 2800 player, I'm probably not even a 2000 player, so everyone in that game got punished because I was placed where I had no business playing. Still, DPS managed to carry my weight enough that my next lobby was 2600, where more DPS carried me even further, but we had a leaver so it sort of came out in the wash. The next few lobbies, I got run over, it dawned on people in full gear that I was in honor gear, and I lost every round for my team due to inexperience and gear disadvantage. Getting run down and beaten by better players is not something that bogs me down easily, but what gets me every time is being the dead weight that wrecks other players' experience, and in my single stressful night of solo shuffle, numerous players were punished by the placement system putting me in lobbies I simply did not belong in, and I haven't been back since. To the credit of everyone involved, not a single person roasted me in chat, no one blamed me, but they 100% got punished by my presence there. Winners gained nothing, losers lost a lot more than they should have, and my MMR is still above 2k.
Sounds about right
Was pretty much my experience, returned to the game after 10+ years within few weeks I got level cap, gear and around 2k in shuffle then every single ladder I was queued with gladiators which was just not fun.
The mistake Blizzard made was thinking that healers are competing against solely each other.. they are not.
A healer is not competing against the enemy healer, they are competing against the whole team.. the sum of the skill, knowledge and dps/hps throughput of not only the enemy team, but your own team, determines how long you as the healer will keep your team alive.
So what you have is a system of combined Healer Power and Dps Power and the ratio at which your team power is above the enemy team power is what determines the amount of time that a team can survive.
It's not about which healer has the most healer power.. it's about which team has a higher ratio.. and it's important to understand that a bad dps impacts that ratio just as much as a good healer does, and dps make up two thirds of every team.. thus two thirds of the teams power ratio.
So having healers in their own mmr bracket is just bad plain and simple.. you're being punished for the mistakes of the dps and then punished again by Blizzard coding the game to think that those dps mistakes were infact your mistakes as the healer.
As a current glad on multiple healers, these are the exact reasons I rarely queue solo shuffle.
I really miss Cata/Mop/WoD honor and conquest. You could relax and still progress if you wanted.
Yup. MoP was where it was at.
3-3 as a healer should gain you rating. 3-3 isn't bad as a healer imo
I agree, you get one shitter dps and the healer is screwed
I’m a shitter dps
I hated healer mmr. I stopped after hitting past 2400
Definitely. As a healer I’ve noticed most lobbies one of the dps is probably going 0-6 unless I can scrounge out a win with them and get 4 wins for me
I was at 1850 mmr as my holy priest, was getting into 2100-2200 bracket games due to lack of healers. One game I actually went 6-0 and only gained 72 rating lol
I felt that and im so glad blizzcon level players are sharing the same issues as nubs like me. Im not great at arena and i jumped on shuffle quickly, i also heal. But getting flamed when you aren’t on the same awareness level as a teammate, or the terrible hurt from losing 35 rating for a 3-3, slowly made me not even want to push. I get why they changed the cq amount, but man, more people played it then. Now not as many do. I hope they take notes from players of sterge and your skill level.
wish there was a 2v2 DPS only solo shuffle. some people just dont like playing with healers and enjoy the faster games.
Yea it would be fun.. problem is stealth classes have suchbs massive advantage
and then we would cry about rogues ruining the ladder :P
One of the most annoying things I run into is someone will be afk the first couple rounds (of course when they are on your team) and then they will come back after that which already guarantees you won’t go above 3-3. I don’t know how there’s no detection system to kick them sooner so it doesn’t negatively impact anyone else.
There has never had enough healers, even in vanilla all the way to DF. Solo shuffle will always have a bad queue until they just make healing in WoW fun for most players
The main player base is middle aged bald dudes wearing shorts and sandals, they don’t wanna heal on a priest, they want to smack people on their warrior, it’s that simple. For healers to appeal to them they need to do damage, but when healers do too much damage or other utility it's broken in PvP. Solve that design issue and you'll fix it, until then, well, here we are.
I feel like everyone is hyperfocusing on rating and missing this completely, i've always had insta queues as a healer and dps players always had long ones way before ss existed, that's why there was always 20 different groups in lfg looking for a healer and i was able to choose whichever i liked and instantly get invited. The problem with healing is that it is not appealing for most people, the amount of people who enjoy making health bars go up and nothing else is minimal, that's why all the modern games evolved to have not only healers but also off-healers or off-supports. Look at overwatch, you have mercy for people who like traditional healing, you have moira for those who want to kill people and then you have everything in the middle so you can choose the healer that better suits your playstyle. Same with league of legends, and supports like zyra, senna, lux, etc. Wow went on the right direction in season 1 with prevoker and disc priest, which literally made a ton of dps start healing but for some reason they decided to nerf both into the ground.
Healers in wow should modernize, leave prevoker and disc as the damage dealing healers, Hpriest and Rdru as high output healers and rsham, hpal and mw as something in the middle or maybe more multi-tool focused healers. Otherwise, if every healer is supposed to stand in narnia and do nothing all game, the healer population will never grow even if they fix rating.
The SS rewards need to be more appealing to draw people in (only R1 gets permanent rewards, and that toy isn't something anyone cares about. Moreover, the additional conquest and honor aren't practical for healers).
Blizzard's attempts to boost player engagement are pretty disheartening. They do it by reducing the rewards for winning and lowering the penalty thresholds, which means players have to play more games to make up for the shortage of players (it's often in vain if it's not 5-1 or 6-0).
We rarely see new players, or rather, newcomers, have been scared off by this situation.
The situation will continue unless players unite to boycott SS or protest against Blizzard's design like this.
I find it still fun how people think rating and mmr somehow matters. It literally will not change anything... give them rating, all it's gonna do is that people quit at 2.4k instead of 1.8k....
You need to motivate people to KEEP playing, not set irrelevant goals that don't mean anything.
If queue times are not fixed the game is doomed. Unless you are an only WoW player there are simply just other PvP games where you can get one or two even more full sessions during the duration of one queue for solo shuffle.
Like WOTLK :D
I sit in Solo shuffle queue for 40 minutes but if I hop on another game I’m loaded into the game within 15 seconds
@@thehardcorecasual9444 Nobody cares about that boomer shit.
Queue times are def bad, but i also would lose over 40 mins to find a partner that i actually could arena with, nowadays sometimes i cna in fact get to play less time than before.
I am not arguing in favor of the old system. I am arguing that everyone's time is finite, and if you want to pursue PvP, your best bet is to not play WoW because you can get way more gameplay out of another game (and most PvP games are free, to boot)@@rickroll9705
So ridiculous how a big company like that seems to put so few thoughts in a system that should motivate ppl to stay and play.
it's like a coverment ... they just there for the MONEY!
The community makes sure you stay away and play something else ^^ i joined Solo shuffle as a newbie healer ( 16 years of wow pvp exp with feral and i stopped pvp in DF ) ... after 2 rounds i got so much cursed at and name called etc Whilee they never line of sighted etc that i instantly left , deleted the healing character and never looked back. ill stick to tanking pve from now on. the community clearly is showing they dont want healers
It’s not just solo shuffle. People don’t want to play healers across the board in Pvp. They gain honor and conquest slowly and they are subjected to a lot toxicity from dps who expect them to carry the team to a win. It’s not worth it.
I wish yall would quit pvp in retail to get the message across. its not going to get fixed when everyone is still no lifeing the hell out of pvp still. I'm glad you're putting out these videos bro. hopefully something Is done soon
As a healer going 3-3 should increase rating every time. Youre only matched against 1 other player.
Are you saying that if a random noob healer that is several hundred rating below you and manages to 3-3s you, you should not lose rating?? It means you played under what you are currently rated are and should have by all means done better than 3-3 against that healer.
then don't make me queue into a healerr that is "several hundred rating below me" ? - how hard is that lmao@@dobromir90
The No conquest unless winning 3 games is mind boggling to me. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. Fix that and the "losing mmr despite winning 3+ games" and you're guaranteed to get more healers playing.
Even if it's just 15% more it'd drastically cut queue times.
Cool, then people queue just to semi afk and lose as fast as possible to get free gear, the lwoer brackets gonna be soo fun.
@@rickroll9705 because 75 minute queues and punishing healers has worked out wonderfully so far.
? Even late night worst you getting in 30ish to 40ish mins queue at lower brackets at "high"(2000+) brackets and even as DPS depending on your class and spec its 10 mins or so, playing fotm has disavantages and being fotm in lower brackets where the ratio for dps;healer is far greater is just you memeing yourself into chaos, 3 to 4 shuffles and this issues is sovled provided you dont lose all of them lol.
It could take legit 2 horus to make a 3s group in shadowlands to play 6 games. SS has whitout a doubt vastly improved the pvp experience.
@@rickroll9705that’s why it should be per win within a lobby.
@@rickroll9705 "It could take legit 2 horus to make a 3s group in shadowlands to play 6 games. SS has whitout a doubt vastly improved the pvp experience."
This is the classic WoW Player mentality if I've ever seen it. Since the new system isn't as bad as something else was in the past, you will defend the current thing.
You are allowed to expect better.
Was trying to gear up a character, managed to win 5 solo shuffle rounds in a row, and then on the sixth one a DPS tilted and left the game. Got 0 conquest and had waited 40mins for the queue. It is unbelievably demotivating.
I quit right before 10.1, simply because of solo queues, rating gains as a healer, the never ending ups and downs of fotm OP rerollers (think Ret) and the final straw was the mandatory embellishments. I just wanna log on and pvp, I don’t want to grind out a quest line to pvp competitively.
i think there should be qualifying rounds like play 5 or 10 rounds and based on how you do it will assign you a rating at which you start at. Also they should design the rating system to take gear score into account. This would help drastically with fresh or new characters just getting started. Also i think it would be cool if they added an unranked solo shuffle that would reward like half the amount of honor and conquest. That would be a great way to get started and practice learning characters in solo shuffle environment.
Gear based match making is always super good. I know there's alot of private servers that will put you into gear brackets with pre determined ilvl range and it's very helpful and makes it way more enjoyable. You're not getting completely rolled by premades like in classic that have full relentless/wrathful gear and your team is just now getting their gear from season 1
add
2's shuffle (2v2)
4's shuffle (4v4)
5's shuffle (5v5)
give a mount (not the glad one but similar ) for +100 wins at 2400/2500 for all shuffles brackets.
maybe give a mount for healers spec only at +100 wins at 2400/2500 (not the glad one but similar)
if they give another type of mount for "glad" in shuffles, u have still a different rewards from Glad but still Hard to get and glad mount doesnt get "deflated" by that.
Why SS is 3v3 and has healers I'll never understand. Shoulda been 2v2 dps only. Later on down the line add the SS 3's queue, or do it as a special event.
so healers can't do the shuffle? no
I played Unholy DK last season and this is how I felt most of the season. There were several times last season where I would win 4-6 out of 6 rounds and only gain like 12 points per match, or 30 in some cases but then I might lose 4 rounds the next match and lose 70+ points causing me to be running at a deficit. It was extremely upsetting. I hit 1600 points 7 separate times and 1700 once. Couple that with how you're bound to lose some matches due to bad team-comp or trolls/feeders/griefers and it just really starts to feel unpleasant but I just figured "that's the name of the game, Baby."
Then it was the last week of the season. My last chance to really push. I got to 1725 rating, just 75 more points and 5 hours from the end of the season (unbeknownst to me) my internet drops out in the middle of a match costing me 150 points. I figured 'Okay but I got there before and I have 10 hours before servers go down for update so I've got that long to get it back.' I did not. By time my internet came back I had 1 hour to gain 225 points and I knew I was going to lose at least a few matches.
MMR is very free below 2100. While you can get hung up on blaming lobbies at your rating, I’d look to improve before you include yourself in this problem.
@@mbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbthis is always the least helpful statement always uttered by folks with positive or negative intention.
Nobody loses a match without considering what they could have done to contribute to that loss.
It is the #1 in algebra, a given.
The issue at lower elo is not even knowing half the time the nature of the issue. It's not always mechanical, execution based, or even match up knowledge --- it sometimes and many times are you simply are not being matched with folks at your skill level, and lack of people player distorts this ratio greatly.
Empathy can go along way here.
To the OP tho, I feel you. I DC'd after a 0-6 prior match and tanked almost 200 points.
I ended up getting them back after sticking with it 50 more matches, but I could have been at 1800 by then.
Just keep at it, the upside is unlike before, at least we can que!
@@mbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmb Sure it is, unless you are a casual. If u win 4/6 rounds you get 20ish rating, but if you dare to have a bad lobby and go 2/6 you go down 70 points easily. But hey, instead of making a system that actually works for both casual and R1 players just say "git gud no0b" and expect participation to go up.
@@Isekai_no_Yume im not reading all that, but "Nobody loses a match without considering what they could have done to contribute to that loss." is so blatantly untrue. stop. just stop.
@@mbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmbmb "I'm not reading, what I don't already agree with"***
Fixed the first part of your response for you 😁
As a healer (Disc Priest) in solo-shuffle... it feels like most wins are somewhere between 6-12 points.... and once I lost all 6 rounds because of a rogue who had a problem with his mouse when he was on my team (deadly when he was on the other team) and lost 72 points.
I'm not an AWC pro but generally speaking I don't just lose all 6 games. I had been grinding for more than 5 hours because of a goal to hit 2k+ and in one single solo-shuffle I lost more points than I gained that whole night's grind. Just after that, I had a match where I won 2 and lost 4 and lost 46 points... which I didn't understand, because if I won/lost 3/3 it would be zero point reward. How is one game's loss worth 46 points?
I was now so much further from the goal than before I began the grind of 5+ hours. The queue may be a lot shorter for a healer but losing 72 points because of a rogue who was a free kill or having a bad game where you only win 2 of the 6 and getting 46 point punishment was very sad times and I stopped doin solo-shuffle entirely.
considering the disc priest rework was a troll rework by blizz and that 35% of all SS healers are disc priests expect queues to increase drastically
Problem is it’s so hard to gear as a healer literally just get killed every time someone targets you, I miss the old days of wow when it was just bloodthirsty and vicious gear no upgrades, you can actually still fight people and skill mattered now it’s all gear dependent
As a healer. I tilt and give up on SS. If you get ONE bad dps. You are now destined for a 3-3 at BEST. Or 0-6 at worst. This now means we lose 70 cr and get 0. As a dps the games seem easier to carry when playing as/with a fotm class. (I play as a Hpriest which gets shadowed by Hpala, Rdr and even MW in most games).
This is so true. I get lobbied with people that speak no english, approach every fight like they have target dummy tunnel vision, and have the skill to LOS healers but stand in aoe. SS MMR for healers is broke, it sucks so much to heal low cr
Blizzard should literally just hire someone who’s sole job is to walk around the office and look at what ppl are working on and just ask “Is this fun?”
The conquest issue is actually a big reason why I log off quickly some days. Its hard to come back to the game to play shuffle just to sit around and then get no conquest for the little wins that I do get. Glad its being mentioned.
? You not losing due 13 ilvl difference against people that are almost all of the time not full conq and stuck at 1500
same i tried gearing my warrior for a week and i got my weapon and a ring thats it and i did like 300 rounds, and in lower cr almost every other lobby is just a leave so ontop of playing 36 rounds with no conquest every other game has a leaver after waiting for 30-45 minutes its terrible
@@rickroll9705 you're clearly a troll but not all of us have all day to practice one game so it takes a bit to get going coming back to the game, so every round win matters. If i go 2 and 4 and it takes an hour of my time and i get nothing it makes it hard to want to play more. its pretty easy to understand that.
@@Tiptoess Agreed! There needs to be rewards for round wins because each round is essentially a 3s win. Getting nothing for half the time you're playing the game (regardless if you are a great player or not) is the worst feeling
@@courtvisions2 trolling about what? game is about builder, spenders and big CDS. The hardcore super hard thing is literally positioning yourself lol. Wanna get full honor gear? takes about 3 hours, maybe less, the top pvp gear is 13% better than what you get in those 3 hours grind, not meaningless but you can go above 1800 rating and do bgs just whitout them, hell I got duelist whit like 15 Solo shuffles and didnt have the conq weapon.
There is somethign EVEN MORE EASY to understand, sometimes the issue isnt in the screen my dude but between the chair and the screen, if you cant improve just move on. If you managed to not get anything be a conq item or a full honor set in 2 to 4 hours in the current system im sorry but the only solution would just hand them free at this point lol.
I wish they would do 2s solo shuffle. All roles are equal...meaning it doesn't matter if you are healer or dps. As long as they don't put 2 healers together.
Solo Shuffle is salvageable and definitely the future of PvP. But we need a relatively large and impactful PvP patch to get it done.
-change SS to DPS/Tank/Healer.
-remove all healing debuffs from most, or all DPS specs and relocate them to Tank PvP talents.
DPS player is DPS>Utility>Offheals if applicable.
Tank is HealingDebuffs>Utility=Damage.
Healer is Heals>Utility>Damage.
I just came back to the game and quit in 2 weeks. I was really excited about solo queue but, as a game designer, I am baffled by what level of incompetence blizzard has displayed in designing these systems.
Whoever designed solo shuffle as it is now has little to no competence in game design.
Absolute degenerate design. Oh, by the way, I also got a warning for being "toxic" but my teammates who AFK-ed and griefed on purpose got no punishment.
Bliz also need to do something about the toxic environment/people in pvp and mythic
I had a queue pop at 8 minutes. Someone declines..."you have been returned to the FRONT of the queue". It did not pop again until FOURTY NINE MINUTES IN QUEUE.
I ❤ shuffle in season 1, but quit in season 2 bc conquest was way too low per game. I don't have forever to play and couldn't fill the bar quick enough to get a vault reward.
I don't remember it this way in season1. Meanwhile, I can get a m+ vault in 1 15 min dungeon.
So i decided to queue solo shuffle on my alt healer the other day. Note that it is a fresh toon with no previous season mmr. I get into a lobby where i am at 1850 mmr and the enemy healer is 1700mmr (none of us had any cr) Thinking it is a good chance to boost my mmr on the first shuffle games so that i can have better quality games at higher mmr, i tried my best to heal underperforming dps and managed to go 2-1 until the warrior in our lobby decided to leave the game. This resulted in me dropping 150 mmr even though i won 2 and lost one just because the game decided to match me with a lower mmr healer.
You might think “”oh its your alt, or, this is just 1800 you will get higher quickly”” but in my experience healing 1700-2000 lobbies is way harder sometimes than even higher mmr games. I decided to not queue again and thats another healer gone from solo shuffle this season.
Maybe Blizzard knows all this but wants to remove solo shuffle next expansion? And by not fixing healers in solo shuffle, the wait time on matches is too high, so Blizzard can say in the next expansion that the system was not a success and remove it?
giving rating per win should be a given in my opinion, 3-3 for anyone especially healers feels really bad with 0 rating, 2ndly MMR rating changes dont really matter
I as a casual just dont feel like spending multiple hours reading my spells and other classes spells to understand everything thats going on. It used to be simpler some classes had something, but now every single class seems to have stuns, insane healing, absorbs etc..
the same is going towards healers in pve, ALL affixes are healer oriented. DF S1 was a PAIN to heal, still gotten my m20s in s1 but i quit healing after that
The point of this system should be: getting rewarded for progression and successfully playing harder content. If you go 3-3 as a healer and get rating for that and thus move up to a higher rated lobby and then go 3-3 again, sure you could argue you tied the other healer, but you did so in a harder lobby. That is progress and less demoralizing and will make healers want to queue at least slightly more. Speaking for myself here.
One of the big problems with current WoW PvP is there’s just too much going on. There’s too many passives and abilities and flashy animations. You can’t even tell what’s going on without 20 Addons telling you what’s happening. Even then it’s still hard. It makes for some pretty terrible gameplay. I just don’t like it anymore unfortunately. In classic wow I can actually tell what’s happening on my screen.
That’s at least the biggest issue for me.
Same i hate whats going up and that huge burst dmg from 100-0 in 1 global feels Not Great
completely agree. i have to use that voice addon that calls out cds used. cause most of the time, there is too much going on, i can;t tell what happens. not to mention that every class has over bloated rotation. no to mention that some CDs literally have no animation. like ice bound fortitude on DKs, like it has no animation, how am i supposed to know they popped it. look at ret Wings for example, it's clear. another invisible one is feral druid berserk. those little blood droplets on floor..... like for real, i have to be able to see it?
I really hate it when the other healer is clearing more experienced than I am and has much lower rating and I just stand no chance and my rating is going to tank for losing the rounds, it feels like you might as well just give up after the first couple rounds as you know you're f'd either way. One of the many reasons gave up on solo queue after trying arena for the first time. Almost need to have an account wide rating system or something or they'll never convince new people to try out the content.
Honestly I quit play Dragonflight as a main healer in solo shuffle....just pain, no gain
I actually prefer healing but it’s so much harder to push rating as a healer than on dps. Just seeing no healers in the top 100 on the solo que ladder is insane. I feel hardstuck 2100 on all my healers because 90% of the time I go 3-3 because its three 2300 dps players and then one guy doing placement matches who has low rating and goes 0-6. I log my boomy and get 2400 over a weekend. Hopefully it’s fixed in 10.2?
Increasing healer CR would be such an incentive to play.
another example from me. i took 6 toons to 1800. im a 1800 player, a bit better than casual. 2 were healers, disc priest and holy paladin. i tried doing 7th, a resto druid. i generally love druids. been maining one in warlords and end of cata. believe it or not, i could not even get over 1500 rating as resto druid. like yo, i cast heals, i know how to cycle my cds, i did cc (not my strongest playstyle). i tried for 2 weeks to break 1500, to no avail. i switch to feral druid i go 1700 the same day. just so you, high end players know (sitting there up top for so long, probably forgot) majority of people marinate in 1400-1600 bracket. getting to 1600, takes no skill, you just have to play enough games and know your rotation. no matter how bad you are, 1600 is attainable. so here i go feral druid 1700, and i hate ferals because over years their rotation became too bloated, you need to take ton of extra abilities instead of passive nodes in order to do well, plus whole hit and run without hard reset like rogues have. and than resto druid, who i love and always loved, just sitting there at 1450, unable to do anything. 3/6 gives me no rating, or like 1 or 2, making no difference because 1-2 lobbies down the road, i will lose 40 rating for going 2-6.
I think they need to show respect for all forms of rated PVP rather than just 3s. SS is 3s so it should give mount and title as well
Agreed. 2s, 3s, solo shuffle, and even solo shuffle RBGs and regular RBGs should all give Glad mount at 2400 and 100 wins.
People leaving is the reason why I stopped healing. If somebody leaves, then you don't get the conquest points. In other words, your time is wasted. Especially if they leave in the last round.
Im done healing just getting banned from raging at people, why they let this mode go live without any voice chat is beyond me. Add ontop of it the MMR issue fuck it I quit.
I don't see why the matchmaker doesn't just put two no healer teams together
I had to check when this video was released because the issue with healers in solo shuffle was evident from the moment it was released before dragonflight. Since then this was obvious. The fundamentals behind having 1 healer on one side and another healer in the other side is broken and cannot be mitigated. 4 dps vs 2 healers will always make it easier for the dps to climb faster. Less room for healers to do a mistake compared to 1 out of 4 dps
All problems stem from the fact that no one "developing" the game actually plays it. They're trying to develop from spreadsheets. So not only do they hire devs that don't play the game(and maybe never have), they're not going off of feedback... they're using data. I haven't played in months and 2 nights ago I chose to logon just to see if my supposed burnout is clear. 20 minutes and nope. It drains the soul.
Bro i mean this comment is complete respect.
I use to watch you, but I stopped because the retail version of WoW was dying and all the other streamers I watched stopped playing, even Bajheera is just kind of in and out. I haven't got any recommendations for you until today, and noticed you are still playing.
That said: I didn't know that there was a large enough player base for retail that even mattered so much as for any content creator to make a video about it? The entire time you're in iron forge and the place is a ghost town, and you just stand there and queue for stuff, eventfully getting a group with players who may as well be NPCs because the activities are so unrewarding and boring at this point, while simultaneously explaining why players are quitting. The game just sucks, man. The demographic Blizzard shot for isn't fruitful in terms of quality.
I love healing, but the toxicity of people discourages me from learning PVP. How is one supposed to learn it when everyone is toxic and demotivates me to learn PVP. I don't want to ruin anyone's game, but people who do this make me feel that way.
100% right, if someone leaves you get no conquest rewards no matter how well you’ve done to that point. I was 5-0 in a lobby as a resto sham yesterday, the disc priest in the lobby left and I got 150 honor, no conquest, & no mmr boost. Something definitely needs to change!
Holy smokes the dude hit the nail on the head. I Didn’t get into pvp until maybe 5 weeks ago and it has been 0 fun waiting and playing 3-4 hours just to get nothing. Not even 20 gold or something small like that. Conq needs to be earned every round if its takes 1 hour to actually finish a shuffle. Be it 5 conq or 150 conq I don’t care. Just not nothing
Tried the 2 hours a day thing... After you get your gear, you'll spend your 2 hours sitting in Goldshire and play 2-3 games. Then maybe make the games award more points or something. That pace is not what I would consider "playing a video game"
These things better be addressed before the next season or it’s donzo
Same exact same issues an entire year down the line, ty for the update. The lack of enthusiasm from Blizzard towards pvp across the board is why I won't be coming back to Blizzard's WoW
ive been saying since its inception that solo shuffle is a really bad bracket.
whenever someone tries to join a 3s group with "2600xp solo shuffle* i auto decline.
i accepted someone once, and checked them, their highest 3s rating was 1200, and 2s was 900cr. 2600 solo doesnt mean anything.
I quit wow entirely because of q times in solo shuffle. I loved that they did solo shuffle because as a dad I have limited time to play. However with the q times, I quit and went to another game that when I q it takes 2 minutes max to put me in a game.
I made some similar suggestions on forums in S1 when it was obvious how demoralizing this system would be. Elite PvPers came out and said I and those who agreed simply didn't understand the system. Most of the forums are littered with low life comments suggesting complainers 'get gud' or do some ez pve. It's not surprising that many just threw their hands in the air and don't give af anymore. The result is a bunch of elitists circle jerking in the lobbies with no fresh blood.
Catering to these types of players in PvP or PvE is detrimental to the community. I'm a better M+ player and so I don't take the abuse in that content but I see these types of players in all content. There are a million different views on what's right and what's wrong with WoW, but the awful player interaction in anything but a steamroll of content is probably the most obvious 'wrong' thing that should be fixed.
you are exactly right. blizz caters to top 5% players base cause they play their game for living and have channels to attract viewership. and mere casuals, are just trash. blizzard should work hard to completely get rid of elitism and segregating players with rating, elite mounts and etc. everything should be grindable, if you have time and if you dont, cause you work 60 hours a week and have a wife and kids, well there is a booster for you on sale. that's all
Input from a previous glad from wrath, mop, and cata.
I came back to dragonflight from the good i heard when it dropped. I have several dps toons over 2200 in shuffle even after years of not playing. But the 45 min ques are a waste of time so decided to make a healer.
Instant ques are cool, but its not fun. Between dps factoring your entire game, lining you, not using defensives, not reseting, spliting dam for no reason, etc i gave up at 1900. When you heal your ass off having to deal with dps constantly ruining the games and doing your best just to be told its all the healers fault every single shuffle while your watching these dps throw i cant even describe the feeling. Also constantly being qued against lower rated healers to then go 5-1 and get +11 rating if even that is a joke. It takes the game from enjoyable to a straight frustrating grind thats not fun. I havent played wow in 2 weeks now, really dont think ill be back. I wanna sit down and play, not spend 50 mins waiting for a que or being forced to heal and have a bad time.
I´ld take it even further, If U go 3-3 NOONE should loose mmr, healers or dps. U can only beat what is infront of U and a tie is just that, a tie...status quo
As a resto druid there is nothing you can really do to make me play shuffle again besides make all healing matchups be mirrored. People just do all the things you aren't supposed to do with a resto druid healer, so the games aren't fair without giving a lecture in the chat before every round. You can't just zugzug chase the warrior around and expect a resto druid to keep you up. We are made to CC the melee off of people.
this is completely, insane, i dont even play PVP - but someone at blizzard needs to outlive their kids for these atrocities - how are these basic ass concerns not fixed? like we aren't even talking about incompetence anymore, this is just comically evil, sadistic even
this game has so many gameplay issues, almost doubling every single patch and they wonder why people are quitting
I tried solo shuffle out as someone who hasn't done much rated pvp since cataclysm/mop era and my first two matches went well. I went 6-0 and then 5-1 so im thinking were not as rusty as maybe i thought but I did notice my MMR skyrocketed to 2k even though my cr was like 800 or something. I then spent the next 6 matches going at best 2 wins and more often 0 wins with players telling me I need to kill myself/uninstall the game after each round while my mmr hardly moved downward. Wow PVP is what got me into this game years ago watching streamers such as yourself play but the systems and community has driven me right back into being a full time mythic+ player after only 2 days of queing a few games at what should have been a beginner level experience. I'm not a god at this game by any means and I understand that pvp is a different challenge than pve encounters have to offer but I cant help but think if my experience was this poor what the hell is this game mode like to actual new players that are still learning core concepts to the game.
I do like that it’s easier to get ranked higher in solo queue. 2’s is too hard to find chill people who know how to lose and keep pushing.
Solo queue is silly in a lot of ways. Mainly how you basically pick on the squishiest player for all 6 rounds unless they quit early.
The main issue is queue times. 15 minutes+ for a game makes it less fun.
I'm saddly one of the healers that quit that mode. I accepted the 50/50 win rate, but the rating climb is insane. Every game is 3/3, 3/3, 3/3. Why put myself in that instance when I can get as much gear from 2s, 3s, RBGs or just standard BGs. Now I'll admit Im not a 2400 player. Only time I ever hit that was with prot paladin in one of the preseasons where it didn't count and prot was able to be a dedicated healer in 2s, but I am definitely at least capable of 2000-2100 if given the time.
In the current reward system of WoW PvP, the sad truth is the only thing that would get me to dip my toe back into solo shuffle is if I could essentially get the Glad Mount guaranteed for 3/3 and some 2/4 matches. I was hoping the introduction to solo shuffle would be that answer of easier way to get Glad Mount for some of us Solo Healers to get better access to Glad Mount considering how hard it is to carry random DPS as a healer. I love queing for 2s and RBGs with randoms, and don't mind risking a little rating. But in that instance I am risking 1 match worth of rating, not 6 matches worth of time that could be predestined by the fact that there is a mage that doesn't know what button his iceblock or blink is bound to when a ret paladin with wings and a DK with full summons up comes barreling at him.
This is such a circular problem. 6 round format, 4 dps and 2 healers means there’s more chances for bad dps player to tank both healers. Mix in damage feeling insane with super high RSS dampening, and healing doesn’t feel good.
Then, healers quit healing. Queue times go up. How to fix? Expand the mmr ranges for healers. Now you have 1500 healers playing with 2100+ dps, or worse a healer mmr mismatch where the higher one is basically punished. More healers stop queueing.
Problem repeats and worsens. Queue times won’t be fixed until Blizz makes healing feel better in RSS (dampening is so oppressive to some specs), you get conquest per win, and prevent healers from losing mmr and cr on a 3-3.
P.S. that one forum poster is such a degenerate. The wow forums were always toxic, but they are officially 4-5 people circle jerking and trolling.
Solo shuffle is the only form of rated pvp I enjoy. When you play as a healer you are competing against 1 other persons when you play as DPS you are competing against 3 other dps
I think we can all agree that people keep quitting DF in general, not just pvp.
I actually disagree with the starting rating thing, I find if I start at 1900 rating I find it easier to get my 1900 but if I start lower than 1500 people have no clue and I am not good enough to carry my team so my builds get stuck in limbo. Obviously this might be different for others but for me I feel I can hold in those lobbies because atleast there is some brain cells there
I made this forum back when RSS first came out. I saw this issue with healers immediately
This is why I love vanilla wow. There's no arena's, no CR to deal with, no having to deal with The Meta. Just the world and progressing your character with gear and having fun in the open world with PVP and PVE, a beautiful MMO in its entirety, especially after the big change to the PVP ranking system and I recommend anyone that wants to have a chill experience with World of Warcraft to join classic era and to leave retail behind because the truth is retail has met its end. They've committed to much damage. Its not WoW anymore.
instead of giving people a 1550/1750/2400 achievement they should give people percentage based achievements. like top 50% of arena players top 70% and top 90% and top 1% that way people can see their progression and not have it be based of a predetermined number of rating
Actually to add to what Venruki said at minute 8:00 they should give you honor and conquest acordingly after winning a match within the lobby also win the rating acordingly properly shown in the table. The should happen whe you lose you get some honor and lose rating after every match in the lobby.
Its Mindlowing to me that People still play Retail even tho you can Play WOTLK CLASSIC Phase 4 Arena and go into the dopest Raid scan get Legendarys and the coolest Heroic Trinkets and tons of other Things if you start to play Wotlk and take it serious it becomes realy addicting and you will not miss Retail even once ...
Classes are fun to play but the game is just shit now. So little participation in the game. i quit like 2 months ago from playing and i played mainly pvp. i try my best with my friends and play alot of games, we get 2k i 2v2 and we play against the same 3 teams over and over because nobody else ques, and guess what.... all those 3 teams were all 2700+ EXP from many other seasons, like multiglads and there i am, my first time ever playing at 2k rating. smashing my face against that unbreakable brick wall. Tried the 3v3 bracket, same thing there. try really hard... Go up to 2k rating and same shit again.
We ended up quitting because for us its pointless, we are not going to get any better or get better macros, or better scripts or better anything in order to compete with these people so whats the point. Rewards are unachieavable even when us casual really bunker down and play 4-5 hours a night and really talking strats and trying our best trading cooldowns and optimizing dps and everything.
And solo shuffle i tried couple times but i dont have the time to sit in 30 minute ques all night because i want to log in and play immedietly, and when nobodys on and i tried playing as a healer it was more frustration than fun so. Lose to dampening every game, or someone jumps off to a corner far away and gets stuck there and dead. Or you finally have a sick game and someone deciding to piss off and leave before last round and nobody gets fuck all but negative rating and mmr.
The developers of this game these days have no clue what they are doing, its quite evident that they dont because this community provides ALL feedback they would ever need in the entire world to fix the game, and STILL its just ignored for whatever reason, or "cant be done until next expansion" or "next patch" or whatever because they are so incompetent and cant write a piece of code faster than 4 weeks minimum.
I have loved this game for seriously half my life, but really its been damn hard to love it the last 3 expansions.
I made an MM Hunter last week and went into my first shuffle yesterday, it was a 2300 lobby with two 2300+ healers and two 2300+ dps, and then me and some other kid at 0 cr lol 😂
a 40 minute queue to have it disappear just as I try to click into the game is what killed it for me. NO motivation to play at all after not being able to get a single game 2 days in a row. Hopefully the new solo queue BG will be better.
People really bitching about something that was never even in the game for most of WoWs time online. I'm just happy that I even CAN Q up by myself at any time now.
I can confirm that you get no conquest if somebody leaves the match. Just went 4-0 and all I got was 600 honor. Lame.
Thank you for this video.
To my mind, Blizzard need to do something similar to what Riot did with the support role in League of Legends, which like healing in WoW was relatively unpopular. Riot started putting out support champions that could genuinely
influence the outcome of games, for example through lots of CC or significant damage capabilities of their own, and the role got quite a bit more popular as a result.
WoW has the holy trinity, so there’s not much scope for increasing healer damage and that’s fine. The way in which WoW should help healers to influence the outcome of games is by giving them more CC.
I expect that not every DPS player would be happy, and lots of balancing would be required, but I also expect that most would forget about it if and when their shuffle queues went from 20 minutes to 10.
they did that with holy paladin rework. it was all nice and dandy, than they started nerfing it to the ground, where holy paladins barely do any damage anymore and their manage regen is the worse of all healers. this is not to mention that in order to be good, you had to roll with heavily bloated rotation. which 70% of player base can't handle, but in hands of top 5% player base ended up being super OP, so the nerfs came in.
Im an old player but focused mostly on PvE for the 20 years, every time I have tried to get into pvp I feel behind and too slow.
Now if I try do Solo as healer, I get insulted, too.
It's just not fun.
As someone who has mainhealed/raid healed and healed for many 22k + pushes in 2v2 and 3v3...dragonflight has strangled all desire to heal out of me
Mythics, people don't do the mechanics just right, and blame you.
In arenas, you pump, you LoS, you CC on the spot, pivot to help seal the deal.
And lose MMR.
Makes you want to just reroll or respec.
I have and never felt better.
0:16 a Kul Tiran dressed in whatever those clothes are running through Ironforge makes me irrationally upset :/
I think you’re forgetting it’s blizzard math we’re talking about.
I really dont understand why blizz did not make solo shuffle into 4 dps players lobby where ppl would just do 3 duels and get points based on the results. Anyone with brain could see this problem coming. And it is not just the queue time - the arenas are literally reduced into "which healer is better player" so you basically get 6 inderect duels of those two healers instead of 6 3v3 arena matches. The only one who did not see this coming was Blizz.
As the queues go, no matter what you do, you will not make ppl to play healers instead of dps (and you have number of classes who literally do not have healer spec so those players dont even have that one option) because ppl simply enjoy playing dps and not enjoy playing healer and this is still a video game, not a job to expect players to do what they do not enjoy. You would think that Blizz will get that after literal decades of observing this fact in multiple of their games.
Well good to see solo shuffle is still fked up before I renewed the sub just to see myself and get disapointed before canceling it again :).
i dont know i wanna play pvp so bad but i cant learn it because everyone is leaving if i do one mistake and thats why i cant grind conq gear or sth thats so sad
They should make leavers pay in conquest points balance, honor rank/level, and increase the debuff as well as put a comsetic debuff to shame them. I am a new healer and every game where I am on my way to getting more then 3 wins in SS theres a leaver. Its terrible.
I like healing. I just don’t like healing 4 other monkeys that couldn’t get 1800 in rated arena but blizzard thought they would be nice to place them in “2200+ solo shuffle” I’d rather sign up to a group titled “1550 lf 1600 push” and I’d expect more than the garbage I see I shuffle
For the AFK point I believe that no those under 3 wins should get no loss, those over 3 wins get a slight rating increase. The leaver should be banned from all PvP/PvE instances for one in game day (must be online and wait it out). After a day another leave would be a week, then a month, then indefinite. Maybe too harsh.
The issue is that you can play dragonflight from lvl 1 to 70 and not make a single friend or have a single social interaction. Imagine if someone complained about not having a single person to do an arena with in wrath. People would laugh at them. i made more friends in vanilla from lvl 1-20 than i have in modern wow in 5 years
The system VERY closely resembles the FIDE (Chess) rating system. Especially in 5 game tournaments. Once you reach International master status, you win very little rating per win for playing people lower rated than you. It's a grandmaster grind they're putting you through in a video game LMAO. Unironically, GM is 2500.
If someone leaves let's say on the 5th or 6th round you get no conquest points. I opened a ticket to complain to blizz and they ignored the ticket, just sending me a faq response.
I want RSS to be reworked. How many times its just me and my wife online and we want to do arena but dont want to play against hunter/healer or warrior/healer in 2s. I would rather see it be similar to skirms quing into the 3s bracket with its own rating separate from 3s. This could be a good way of finding new team mates as well.