Lawrence Krauss vs Hamza Tzortzis | Islam vs Atheism Debate
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- Опубликовано: 28 мар 2013
- 00:00:24 Introduction | Timothy Yusuf Chambers
00:06:30 Opening Remarks | Hamza Tzortzis
00:32:02 Opening Remarks | Lawrence Krauss
00:59:33 Rebuttal | Hamza Tzortzis
01:14:28 Rebuttal | Lawrence Krauss
01:22:43 Summary Discussion
01:42:07 Question & Answer Session
02:06:00 Closing Remarks | Lawrence Krauss
02:07:50 Closing Remarks | Hamza Tzortzis
Are you a non-Muslim and interested in Islam? Please visit onereason.org
This debate sees Professor Lawrence M. Krauss, renowned cosmologist and Hamza Andreas Tzortzis, author, lecturer and intellectual activist explore this very interesting and thought-provoking topic. www.thebigdebates.com/debates/...
PLEASE NOTE:
You are about to see unedited footage of an intellectual debate where philosophical and theoretical positions will be discussed. Any of the views expressed by the speakers do not necessarily represent the views of iERA or The Big Debates project.
For more information about the logical and rational foundations of Islam visit www.OneReason.org
Lawrence Krauss vs Hamza Tzortzis Debate
Islam vs Atheism Debate
Muslim vs Atheist Debate
God vs Science Debate
![Does God Exist? William Lane Craig vs. Christopher Hitchens - Full Debate [HD]](/img/1.gif)
Watch the video in the Arabic language
ruclips.net/video/SCOF0KraLiY/видео.html
why?
Hey educated idiot why don't you show your loyalty with Darwin? Don't be ugliest thing of universe and accept my challenge, with which face you are teaching the fake knowledge even your heart don't believe that.
Pope rabi atheists and all other fuel of hell type humans are now prisoners of their own hearts by me for many years same as you are prisoner of your own heart now, so take it easy and for freedom come in the Ring, Facebook people are witness that I captured all pseudo humans with help of Allah for many years. whole world and Allah (God) is watching your loyalty with your beliefs.
👉🚥🚦Show your confidence in your religion, science or reason. I suggest you with respect that you follow the Holy Quran, if you don't agree with me? then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now.
By the all holy books and medical science dead mankind is non communicable and if you call dead personalities or prophets along with Allah (God) and seek help from dead mankind then you will Never go to the heaven, if you don't agree with me then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now?
(Don't relate pseudo Muslims with Holy Quran.)
@@blueinfinite5940 why not?
@@deuces_biatch1706 it's a silly thing that Arabic speaking muslims feel that a deeper truth is revealed in Arabic - and since most of the world does not speak Arabic, then it is a sad commentary that Allah chooses to leave out so many people from truly understanding him. I thought he was supposed to be akbar.
جزاكم الله خيرا على الترجمة
I'm an atheist, but I have to admire Hamza's style here. And I find Krauss's attitude kind of hard to watch.
@@oscarbarrera6081 please study Islam my brother, u will find the truth
My friend I would suggest learning about Islam , It teaches us to respect one another unlike the proffesor
@@oscarbarrera6081 My friend I am pretty sure u know maybe even a little a bit of Islam , if you dont and wont then that is your choice but I can tell you Islam is a religion of peace and it means to submit yourself to the one and truly God (Allah) and to follow the teachings of his beloved prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him) and also Islam teaches you about cleanliness and we Muslims after passing urine or stool ,we wipe with tissue first , then with water because it is very important and pure but I'm 100% sure non Muslims do not . I am not here to preach but why do u think the media and everywhere in this world is just targeting Muslims. Its because they know it's TRUE my brother so it's for you to decide, I personally chose to become Muslim because they dont eat pork /pig because it eats it's own poo , surely that's disgusting. Like I said I've done my part preaching , it's your choice
@@oscarbarrera6081
The Qur'an is God's Words:
In the name of Allah(God), The Most Gracious, The Most Merciful.
All besides those believers who have pure faith, irrespective of which religious background they claim to have come from, merely a single sign would suffice them to believe in the existence of One God, whether it be a sign concerning a scientific phenomenon or any other sign. Where as, on the other hand, there are people who would never believe even if a thousand signs are presented to them, such people would never accept faith and as such they are the Rejectors; there may be a third sect/group/category of people who may be convinced if proper efforts are made, either by means of science and technology, or by reasoning and with logic or by any other technique.
As today is the age of science and technology, the best approach we have is the use of scientifically proven and established facts, excluding hypotheses and theories (which lack solid evidence) in order to convince an atheist or an agnostic or any other individual who may not believe that the Qur'an is the revelation of God, as no human being could ever mention such scientific facts in the Qur'an, 14 centuries back which the humanity has unveiled/discovered very recently,with the help of rapidly growing technology and the advances made by the modern scientific world.
Majority of the people who disagree with the fact that the Qur'an has been sent down by God, revealed to the last and final messenger and servant of God, i.e. prophet Mohammad (pbuh), when asked about the reason they disbelieve, what they come up with is that they falsely claim that the Qur'an must have been written by prophet Mohammad himself as they do not have any better explanation for not believing in the Qur'an or Allah.
With the help of mathematics, we can refute their baseless claim (that Muhammad is the author of the Qur'an, they even fail to realise that he was an Ummi,i.e. he was unlettered/illiterate!).
Nevertheless,even for the sake of an argument, let us be kind enough to give them a benefit of doubt, and say that may be, prophet Muhammad wrote the Qur'an (though we never agree!).
Now we shall refute their false claim with the help of what we know in mathematics as 'The Probability Theory'.
Probability is basically concerned with the likelihood or the chance of something happening/taking place or not happening for which we make certain guesses/flukes or predictions at random and calculate the chance of our choice or guess coming true as a number or percentage.
Probability has a range of 0-1. Having a probability of 0 implies the impossibility of the occurence of the event we are dealing with, on the other hand, probability of 1 means that the event is sure to occur, thus affirming a 100% possibility of the occurrence of the event we are dealing with. Any number in between would indicate that the event may either occur or not.
For example,if you toss or flip a coin(fair), there are(a total of), two possibilities, it may either land up with a head or tail, whatever choice you make the mathematical chance/probability of your guess being rightat random is 1 out of 2,i.e. 1/2 or 50%.
Further, if you have a die (having 6 faces) and you roll it, the chance of your guess-number coming on the top is 1/6 as there are a total of 6 distinct choices to make.
Similarly,if you roll the die 2 times in succession/consecutively or roll two dice simultaneously (both yield the same result, these are termed as 'independent events' meaning that the two (or more) events have no influence/impact on one another; they yield independent results) what you'll see is, the probability of both your choices being right at the same time is merely
(1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/36 which is < 3%.
Now,if you roll the die 3 times successively,the chance of you making the right choice all three times,just at random is
(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/216 which is < 0.5%.
Let us now consider the compound event of tossing the coin 2 times and rolling the die 4 times,the probability of you making the correct choices all 6 times is therefore
(1/2)×(1/2)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)=(1/2)^2 × (1/6)^4 =(1/4)×(1/1296)=1/5184 which is ~ 0.02%.
Let me generalize the method for you.
If you repeat an experiment for n different times and all of which must deal with independent events as in our case here, fortunately; and you have a probability of, say 'p' for each of the individual events and of course 0 < p < 1.
Now you want to calculate the probability of you making the correct choice all 'n' times i.e. each time you making the right choice without a single mistake..
It is p^n,i.e. 'p' raised to the power of 'n'.
For those who are good at maths, they can readily see that this number, p^n quickly reaches 0 when |p| < 1 and n is let increase!!
Praise be to Allah SWT,all the Qur'anic verses that talk about scientific phenomena can be modelled as ' the independent events' in this very analysis of ours.
And the holy Qur'an contains more than 1,000 (out of more than 6,000 verses in total) verses which speak about science. And more than 800 of which have already been supported by established scientific facts.
1.
For example, the Qur'an says that the light of the moon is not its own light but rather, it is the reflected light of the sun (the moon reflects the light from the sun onto the earth), for this one people (at the time of the revelation of the Qur'an,i.e. at the time of the prophet) could have made two choices (if they were asked, hypothetically) i.e. the light of the moon could be the light of its own or it could be the borrowed light of the sun.
2.
Similarly, the Qur'an talks about the spherical shape (more accurately, the geo-spherical shape, as the earth is slightly flattened at the poles and slightly bulging out at the equatorial region,i.e. the 'circle of maximum diameter').
People could have thought of various shapes for the earth such as flat, triangular,rectangular etc. So, lfor this particular one, the number of choices would be more than 2.
3.
The Qur'an states that the Sun also rotates (about its own axis)...people couldn't even have thought of this, at the time of the prophet as this one is a very very recent discovery, we came to know about this hardly a few decades earlier. So even for this particular one, there would be 2 choices to make, the Sun may either rotate or not! (For the sake of argument only!)
4.
The Qur'an talks, in a nutshell, about the birth of our universe which the scientists today call the Big Bang, it may be right or wrong. ..So for this too, we would have 2 choices.
5.
The Qur'an talks about the interstellar matter, called 'plasma' by the scientists. Again, could be right or wrong. ..So 2 choices for this too.
6.
The Qur'an states that our universe has been expanding. Again, could be right or wrong. .So for this too, we have 2 choices.
And so on..
The Qur'an talks about scientific phenomena,over and over again, for more than 1,000 times.
Each verse which talk about a scientific phenomenon, can be attributed a number of choices we can think of, as above. These choices vary, from 2 (which is the least/minimum number of choices) to larger numbers, for instance,in the case of the earth, we could think of more than a dozen of possible shapes!
Let's restrict ourselves to 2 (as the number of choices), clearly seeing that even the least number of choices would give us the desired result and if we consider more number of choices, we get to the result even more quickly.
As a challenge to the people, I'll prove my logic even with the least number of choices as the Qur'an, with no doubts, is the book of God.
Proceeding with 2 choices as the flukes/guesses for each of the verses which speak about science, what we find is, the probability or the mathematical chance of one making the correct choice all 800 times, i.e. making the right choice for each of the verses each and every single time is...
Using, probability = p^n with p = 1/2 and n = 800...
Probability(P) = (1/2)^800 = 1/(2)^800
The number 2^800, i.e. 2 raised to the power of 800 is a very huge number though it may not appear so, so huge that the number
1/(2)^800 is literally negligible and is considered 0 (zero/nill) in practical mathematics.
The number of choices that could be thought of,for the scientific verses of the Qur'an is not merely 2 as we have used above!!
We could've used more than 2 choices in which case we'd have arrived at the answer of 0 even more quickly.
So, even in the most probable case (using the least number of choices, i.e.2), the probability of the scientific verses being written in the noble Qur'an by (any) a human being is 0.
The Qur'an, thus, can never be the work of a human. It must have come from a divine source. The only being Who could mention such facts in the Qur'an must be the Creator Himself Who possesses All The Knowledge.
Peace
@Gunther Vincent
FAMOUS LAST WORDS, FROM ATHEISTS, BEFORE THEY
DIED
(Re-post)
1. Caesar Borgia:
"While I lived, I provided for everything but death;
now I must die, and am unprepared to die." 2. Thomas Hobbs[political philosopher]
I say again, if I had the whole world at my disposal, I
would give it to live one day. I am about to take a leap
into the dark."
3. Thomas Payne [/b]the leading atheistic writer in
American colonies: "Stay with me, for God's sake; I cannot bear to be left
alone , O Lord, help me! O God, what have I done to
suffer so much? What will become of me hereafter?
"I would give worlds if I had them, that The Age of
Reason had never been published. 0 Lord, help me!
Christ, help me! …No, don't leave; stay with me! Send even a child to stay with me; for I am on the edge of
Hell here alone.
If ever the Devil had an agent, I have been that one."
4. Sir Thomas SCOTT [Chancellor of England ]"
Until this moment I thought there was neither a God
nor a hell. Now I know and feel that there are both, and I am doomed to perdition by the just judgment of
the Almighty."
5. Voltaire famous anti-christian atheist:
"I am abandoned by God and man; I will give you half
of what I am worth if you will give me six months'
life." (He said this to Dr. Fochin, who told him it could not be done.) "Then I shall die and go to hell!" (His
nurse said: "For all the money in Europe I wouldn’t
want to see another unbeliever die! All night long he
cried for forgiveness.
6. Robert Ingersoll:
"O God, if there be a God, save my soul, if I have a soul!" (Some say it was this way:
"Oh God, if there be a God, save my soul if I have a
soul, from hell, if there be a hell!
7. David Hume, atheist philosopher famous for his
philosophy of empiricism and skepticism of religion
He cried loud on his death bed "I am in flames!" It is said his "desperation was a horrible scene".
8. Napoleon Bonaparte, the French emperor, and who,
like Adolf Hitler, brought death to millions to satisfy his
greedy, power-mad, selfish ambitions for world
conquest:
"I die before my time, and my body will be given back to the earth. Such is the fate of him who has been
called the great Napoleon. What an abyss between
my deep misery and the eternal kingdom of Christ!”
9. Sir Francis Newport[The head of an English Atheist
club to those gathered around his deathbed: ]
"You need not tell me there is no God for I know there is one, and that I am in his presence! You need not tell
me there is no hell. I feel myself already slipping.
Wretches, cease your idle talk about there being hope
for me! I know I am lost forever! Oh, that fire! Oh, the
insufferable pangs of hell! …Oh, that I could lie for a
thousand years upon the fire that is never quenched, to purchase the favor of God and be united to Him
again. But it is a fruitless wish. Millions and millions of
years will bring me no nearer the end of my torments
than one poor hour. Oh, eternity, eternity forever and
forever!, Oh, the insufferable pangs of Hell!”
10. Charles IX [/b]was the French king who urged on by his mother, gave the order for the massacre of the
French Huguenots, in which 15,000 souls were
slaughtered in Paris alone and 100,000 in other
sections of France, for no other reason than that they
loved Christ. The guilty king suffered miserably for
years after that event. He finally died, bathed in blood bursting from his veins.
To his physicians he said in his last hours:
"Asleep or awake, I see the mangled forms of the
Huguenots passing before me. They drop with blood.
They point at their open wounds. Oh! That I had
spared at least the little infants at the bosom! What blood! I know not where I am. How will all this end?
What shall I do? I am lost forever! I know it. Oh, I have
done wrong."
11. David Strauss, leading representative of German
rationalism, after spending a lifetime erasing belief in
God from the minds of others said: "My philosophy leaves me utterly forlorn! I feel like
one caught in the merciless jaws of an automatic
machine, not knowing at what time one of its great
hammers may crush me!"
12. In a Newsweek interview with Svetlana Stalin, the
daughter of Josef Stalin, she told of her father's death: "My father died a difficult and terrible death. . God
grants an easy death only to the just. . At what
seemed the very last moment he suddenly opened his
eyes and cast a glance over everyone in the room. It
was a terrible glance, insane or perhaps angry. . His
left hand was raised, as though he were pointing to something above and bringing down a curse on us all.
The gesture was full of menace. . The next moment he
was dead."
13. Anton LeVey [/b][author of the Satanic Bible and
high priest of the religion dedicated to the worship of
Satan]. Some of his famous quotes are “There is a beast in
man that needs to be exercised, not exorcised”. His
dying words were "Oh my, oh my, what have I done,
there is something very wrong…there is something
very wrong…
Beloved,compare this lasts words from atheists,with this last words,from this saint of God, Augustus
Montague Toplady (1710-1778).This servant of God,,
will ever be famous as the author of one of the most
evangelical hymns of the eighteenth century, "Rock of
Ages," which was first published in 1776.
During the final illness, Toplady was greatly supported by the consolations of the gospel.Near his last,
awaking from a sleep, he said:"Oh, what delights!
Who can fathom the joy of the third heaven? The sky is
clear, there is no cloud; come Lord Jesus, come
quickly!"
He died saying:"No mortal man can live after the glories which God has manifested to my soul."
Only fools never learn from history,and it's amazing
that even in our days, with all these facts on our
fingertips, someone with a mind can devote his life to
a delusion, and want everyone to know that there is
no God, no-wonder the bible says ,"Only fools say in their hearts, "There is no God."[Psalm 14:1].
God bless you.
An old strategy: “if you can’t convince them, confuse them”.
Wait I'm confused 😂😂
Exactly Krauss went on a random arrogant tangent filled with fallacies of all kinds since he knew he couldn't challenge Hamza and Islam's claims/evidence.
Fatima Waseem what evidence are you talking about? 😂
Zem GoldLine The evidence of the miraculous,linguistic,inimitable nature of the Quran. And the only possibilities of the Prophet Muhammad, either liar/deluded or speaking the truth. And we can deduce from his life,history,events,psychological profile,prophecies,success against all impossible odds and teachings/positive impact that he was indeed a truthful Prophet of God. And also caused the Islamic Golden age that caused the the renaissance and enlightenment period giving rise to all these advancements/technology/knowledge . And creation of Oxford university too.
@@Fatima_33 The tricks they generally pull is "what if", "might be" "could be" should be"... Man! We have got families to feed in this age of Capitalism and you are talking about the could-bes and the should-bes.
I would rather take a word of wisdom even if the challenged its divinity than a confused set of statements that never give a certain answer and are a lifelong quest finding the found.
We have got bigger and better things to do in the world.
"Let's allow that time exists outside of the universe. Given the laws of nature, then the universe can and will spontaneously come into existence!"
That line has to be the most unscientific statement ever uttered by a practising scientist!
Yes and no. The idea of time existing 'outside of the universe' and being an idea that we might 'allow' is effectively a statement of faith, ironically, which doesn't exactly help his argument. What's more useful is the idea that the laws of our universe also imply the existence of non-laws - they have to, or the laws won't work. For example, 'light travels at 186,000 miles per second' must also also mean that 'light does not travel at 185,999 miles per second' i.e. such laws are really about what can't happen, not what can happen. In a situation that's 'pre-universe' (a slightly misleading idea since time won't exist in such a situation, but let's work with it for now) there are no laws saying what can't happen, so the spontaneous creation of a universe is perfectly allowable - and quite possibly inevitable.
@@zaxzaxx4561 exactly 💯
You see, he based his whole argument off an unproven premise , namely..." ... let's pretend that time exists outside of the universe..." And then continues to argue with passion from then on. So ridiculous, don't you think so?
@@ismailhamza5219 Like I said, it sounds like a statement of faith. I would define all statements of faith as unproven premises. He presumably has a problem conceiving of a situation in which time doesn't exist, which is a significant - but not insuperable - mental obstacle.
@@zaxzaxx4561every belief including atheism is faith
@@endlessnutella8612 Not so. Faith means the acceptance of a statement with no evidence to support it. Atheism entails a willingness to take genuine, incontrovertible evidence into account that may contradict it. Faith does not.
Krauss interrupts all the time! I am an atheist but is not polite and he doesn’t let Hamza end his argument. I was interested in listening to his explanations but Krauss doesn’t let him finish anything.
He’s simply not allowing Hamza to do what almost every single advocate of religion does, which is pontificate about a bunch of baseless concepts before pinning the opponent with an impossible question, made so by the fact that you can’t answer nonsense with sense and make sense, you can only erase it which is not the point of the debate. It’s a cheap advantage you have when your entire argument is based off of made up things that are so subjective you can alter them whenever needed to suit you. As expected, Hamza starts strong with a rehearsed sermon which he spared no punches inserting condescending puns and pointedly religious deceitfully innocuous phrases, yet falters when countered with a similar biting “tough love” presentation.
Hamza fizzles out because he has nothing to pull from but stories, so when he can’t gain momentum by playing the “friendly innocent”, he’s got nothing else to rebuttal with.
It is typical of an atheists. If I have a student I'd rather him not to raise hands during the lecture & save it up for later bc most probably his query is gonna get solved after listening to the lecture.But atheists would not let you complete your explaination for they know it's gonna start making sense.
@@Brandon-ml2zw lol how arrogant of you , regardless of arguments krauss should be able to act with respect and guess what he didn't. hamza complete dismantle everything krauss had to say if anything krauss is clearly not well verse in philosophy
@@hamzaaouad6885 Why do you think Hamza's argument for the existence of this god should be convincing?
Nobody is fooled by all of these comments by Muslims that all follow the same formula and begin with "I'm an atheist but [Muslim apologist] was correct about everything".
Highlights
00:00:24 : Introduction - Timothy Yusuf Chambers
00:06:30 : Opening Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis
00:32:02 : Opening Remarks - Lawrence Krauss
00:59:33 : Rebuttal - Hamza Tzortzis
01:14:28 : Rebuttal - Lawrence Krauss
01:22:43 : Summary Discussion
01:42:07 : Question & Answer Session
02:06:00 : Closing Remarks - Lawrence Krauss
02:07:50 : Closing Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis
Narrated Anas bin Malik:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Make things easy for the people, and do not make it difficult for them, and make them calm (with glad tidings) and do not repulse (them )"
Let’s add here 1:24:40 it’s very funny wAllahi and here 56:47 😂😂 LGBQ in here is so funny too
Jazakallahu khair
Thank you so much for this! :)
Samirah Samir what does he mean by lots of fish here today LOL 😂
@@ifuknewwhatiknew4893 it's the red hearing strategy thing that he discussed it's a way to manipulate and change words and stuff and he even said an example when he said it's like throwing a dead fish to a dog or sth like that idk remember the quote exactly but all i learned from the atheist dude is he came here to twist words from mr.hamza and the quran and just talk about nonsense for an hour(not to mention the whole incest thing which is so stupid and got him trapped in a box)
The comments here are very interesting, seeing how different people with different backgrounds can experience (see, hear) the exact same thing and yet interpret the same data completely differently according to their personal interests.
Kaplaars k Hamza commented on a physics book without knowing physics.
He did not even know the relationship between Pi and the circumference of a circle.
I do not think there is any grey area in this debate. Krauss insults Islam so
Islamists will defend Hamza and criticise Krauss. Predictable and it still not
make Hamza in anyway right. Anyone who says otherwise is either stupid or lying.
pinball1970 It is interesting to see how many people fail to see that the "logical" deduction method used by Hamza is in no way a reliable tool to come to a conclusion. Krauss tried to show him with examples how easy it is to come to faulty conclusions using the method of deduction.
It is odd to me to see that as soon as people have no grasp on the explanations given by a scientist it is more logical that their specific God did it.
Kaplaars k
Hamza is all words I have seen him on other debates and likes the sound of his own voice. He rarely says anything of substance. He likes words like epistemological then pats himself on the back happy in the fact that people on the whole do not know what it means.
pinball1970 The problem is that most people don't understand what he is saying. He uses meaningless sentences filled with intelligent sounding words. However since he is "defending" a religion the followers of this religion think he is actually making logical and intelligent statements even though they have no clue what he just said.
In my opinion someone who resorts to these kinds of phrases and wording is afraid that it will become clear to everyone that his claims are based on nothing.
Dr. Krauss tried to explain his position, and showed the errors of Hamza's "reasoning",by using examples while trying to steer away from jargon. I wonder which one of the two is more knowledgeable?
Kaplaars k
yes I would put my money on Krauss! We need more like him. Sam Harris is another good speaker.
Most of the audience was biased towards Hamza. Must have been pretty frustrating for Krauss.
As an atheist and a physics major Hamza was humble and admirable while Krauss acted like a 5yo
He was humble? Never saw someone humbly say so much nonsense and make so much claims arrogantly without bringing any proof.
@@surgigi1582 you don't really know what humble means do you?lol
@@surgigi1582bro what 😭 you really don't understand what this word means, do you?
krauss was fantastic
@@cunctator3401 You don't understand Sarcasm, do you? what smart dudes you Muslims are.
Clicks on Video. Press Pause. Scroll down to comments. Grabs popcorn.
Same here
Yeah ...
I did that and got bored - then went back to the video.
Lol :) I did exactly that.
gets out bingo card
Hahaha you must be mind reader
until watching this video I thought I know English 😪😪😪😅😓😹😄😓😓
hamzah is dictionary itself
@@daudwani8429 Nullius in verba
Ahhahahaahah
True dude..
Just a language, Doesn't matter, Focus on the content
"0+0+0 can never be 3" checkmate athiests
@@larganmansheriff265
2+2= 5 this is your point ?
So what does it equal?
@@EndOfAnAg3 rather than asking in a yutube comment section..go learn some 3rd grade maths
Zero implies nothing. Science has substantiated, incontrovertible evidence. Religion has faith in the supernatural - zero. Don't play faith chess with a knowledgeable informed, realistic, rational, critical thinker.
Heaven avoider, why did your god save Adolf 42 times? Is he a national socialist?
I’m not Moslem per say, but some islamic scholars do have a very interesting intellectual presence about themselves that I’ve always admired.
Its smug self assurance every Muslim/ middle eastern person I've met thinks that everyone around them is a filthy dog and that only they have the right to paradise
As an ex-muslim I can tell you Islam is one of the worst religioun on the world dont trust it
Hamza sure doesn’t. He’s a sophist and really uses rhetorical arguments. So did Krauss tho, almost every time he started a new point. But Krauss was genuinely involved in the discussion here and there, especially with the comebacks.
Intellectual presence? All they offer are non sensual excuses for reasoning & fairytales from the Koran..
That's the thing with the word intellectuality everyone can perceive it differently. To me being intellectual is being objective wich Muslim scholars try to be but can't because they follow a man made religion.
Trying to prove the absolute existence of God in a laboratory using mathematics and science is a fool's errand. This is crystal clear after watching this video, and Prof. Krauss did say that himself more than once throughout the debate.
Personally, I'm a believer in God, not because I'm able to prove his existence with pure mathematics or quantum physics, but simply by looking at my life and the lives or those around me.
If there's no God then this life is pointless, and no matter how much money you make, or how much knowledge you gain, it wouldn't make any difference because one day you're gonna die and you wont take any of that with you. So to me, there must be some other purpose for our existence, a purpose I couldn't find elsewhere but in faith and the belief in God.
Some other things that make me think there must be a purpose for our lives is the fact that we "humans" are the only sapient species living on the only life-sustaining planet in this whole enormous universe. Kinda makes me wonder why? is it really just a coincidence?
Even with no god or life after death, what you do in life does matter. You don't have to keep something forever to be able to enjoy that thing while you have it.
Also, do you seriously think that you'll take your money with you after you die? What are you gonna use it for? Are you really that selfish?
***** if u leave in Islam it's consider apostasy and there is death threat or u can get killed for leaving Islam. Muslims wants there religion to spread in Western countries but they don't recognize or approved atheist, agnostic or secularist or other religion in Islamic countries what a double standard. In Egypt a guy name Karim Ashraf Mohamed al-Banna left Islam recently now he is jail for three years for leaving Islam. In Sudan a women name Meriam Yehya Ibrahim Ishag was sentence to death for apostasy for leaving Islam and in Saudi Arabia a guy name raif badawi for blogging in his websites now he is jail for 10 years and getting 1000 lashes. In Islam there is no religious freedom for none Muslims sorry folks
***** they dont lol
InsaneGadget Entertainment Ah, so Sharia was made up by the western media, right?
To claim what you claimed, you are either an ignorant fool, or a liar of the most loathsome variety.
True is truth even if it is uncomfortable and unsettling no matter how much you dislike it.
What's amazing about Islam is that its followers are confronting atheism properly... Islamic argument is very strong!
Thump's up Hamzah... very respectful man
Are you muslim brother
@@bigsmoke382190 percent he is if you look at the end of this name there is ALI which is a name used by Muslims
islamic argument is nonexistent
@Noah Adams I'm 0% mad, and who said anything about bible or christianity
Self praise is no praise...
Facts vs feelings - facts win every time.
You mean religion? Yes
@@szuvibes9474religion is feelings lol
Still waiting for Krauss to let Hamza finish a single point
Was he interruping Hamza's opener? If not then you just said that Hamza didn't make a coherent point in his opener. I agree.
@@joerdim How nobel of him to not interrupt someone in their opening speech 💀
He was constantly interrupting him that’s just straight up disrespectful
@@acecream1411 That's just how a debate works with an uninterrupted opener. We should appreciate Krauss jumping in when Hamza came up with some other unfounded trash.
Seems like you agree that Hamza didn't make a coherent point in his opener.
@@joerdim yeah I know I was being sarcastic genius
And no that’s not how a debate works that just shows that you are scared and insecure to net even letting your opponent finish a point 🤣
@@acecream1411 Well, if you say that Hamza couldn't make a single point and Krauss didn't interrupt his opener then Hamza failed hard in his opener. Glad you agree genius.
In an open discussion section this is no problem. And in case of Krauss he couldn't stand that Hamza kept making clueless unfounded claims and we should appreciate that he jumped in to immediately correct him.
I used to believe that there is no God, no Creator, etc. I was convinced of this because of all the injustice I had seen and experienced, how could a Creator create something so huge and powerful and let it run wild. I saw religion as emotional blind faith, but even then from my very basic and prejudiced knowledge of Islaam, I saw some morality in it, some guidance, which I had spent 15 years looking for elsewhere, no one, not even Muslims themselves (from my limited experience) had tried to tell me the truth, I saw everyone just chasing material wealth and comfort sometimes under the guise of religion.
I was too hurt and unhealthy to be a part of the might is right system, God knows I tried, so I set out on my journey of creating God. An Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) that'd watch over the entire planet and establish justice. That was a huge undertaking, I had to gain knowledge from a vast array of fields.
This led me to a lot of new challenges, modeling something on human Intelligence with justice and benevolence as its driver started to open my eyes to the reality we're trapped inside. Asking questions like when do we intervene in a situation that according to our predictions is about to lead to violence? what about triggers and stimuli that lead to violence... do we work to reduce them or would that be going to far?
and there were the question of rights, I believed strongly that everyone had the right to privacy, but wasn't this for their own good, and the greater good.
this and many many other reflections led me very slowly and steadily to submitting my will to the Unseen Creator over a period of several years of sharp learning curves and intuitive realizations. Replicating speech, sight, hearing, decision making, learning, rationality, self-analysis, ... was more than enough to help me realize that this huge intelligently designed universe was not without an extremely Powerful Designer.
I was never emotional, that was actually one of the things people would criticize me about. I was seen as a detached & silent rebel. After Islaam, alhumdulillah, I went through a metamorphosis in manners, body language and knowledge. A world of knowledge opened up to me and I'm still learning.
That's an incredible story, thanks for sharing.
Masha'Allah, you sought the truth and you found it, I'm very happy for you, may Allah reward you heavily for your efforts, ameen.
@@chrischow9085 but universe also contains matter which exists after creation. such creation is unachievable by we ppl
@@affanali9966 read edgar andrew's (a physicist) book "who created God"
@@chrischow9085 God doesnt really mean a creature or something like that.
The way the universe works, the way everything sets into place, it only makes sense if a creator existed. But creator is a wide term the creator can just be something in a higher dimension, something that guides the progress of the universe.
Now what religion is an idea about the nature of that creator, maybe a God in haven, maybe odin in asgard, etc.
But there is something thats guiding the progress of the universe from its genesis and whatever that is, its God.
Now we can keep arguing about its nature all day and we will never reach anywhere.
Tbh as a physics and maths student all i wish for is to someday prove God with maths XD.
Let’s take a moment of appreciation to hamza when he shakes hands with Krauss in the end of the video 👏🏻
Why though?
Herald Orome why didn’t he have a choice ?
@Herald Orome why doesnt he have a choice?
@@bleach--__--2493 Herald said this to Abdullah maybe.
Herald Orome now who’s the idiot for not knowing what he’s saying or knows how to answer . So try hard Heraldo ! Try hard to answer? Why he have no choice?
This debate is the reason bcz of which i started again praying.
What convinced you that Islam is true? Can you say it in your own words?
@@joerdim first of all it addresses the identity question very well, it is purpose oriented religion, it desciplines your life, it gives you a very warmth community but puts individual responsibility to only one God, it comes with rich history of Sufism and philosophy. I find it much useful than following political ideologies.
@@islamic_epistemology This has nothing to do with the question what convinced you that Islam is true. You answered why you think Islam is useful to you.
Also, religion is not necessary to discipline one's life or get a warm community. And why would anybody need individual responsibility to one god? Rich history you can also find pretty much everywhere. And why is a rich history important? Philosophical thoughts you can also dig into without following a religion.
@@joerdim I find islamic metaphysics much relatable to me than Western platonism. The modernity of west driven by materialism has exhausted me. I find islam to be the only pure monothestic religion which stands firm on philosophical ground.
@@islamic_epistemology Cool story. Would you answer my question now?
What an amazing debate. Really made me rethink a lot of things. Over the years I have been trying my best to remove my prejudices and stand on the other end: to understand the people whose views oppose. May I unlearn arrogance which I am susceptible to sometimes. May I be so tolerant that I could reason with clarity. For we are here for a short time and there is so much to learn.
I hope everyone aspires to be like you in this regard
Hope you find the right message of Islam and Allah give you strength to accept Islam.
You are not what you think you are.
@@WealthyandNerdy keep on mocking
with this mindse5, in sha2a llah you will understand why and how islam is the truth.
Cheering should really not be allowed during the debates
This is how assholes prove their statements
They really turn it into sports
they remind me of a group of chimpanzees excited when they encounter a lion. I saw them on National Geography channel last week
Well it’s allowed take the message idiot
Yeah totally agreed
I saw this whole debate, Mr. L Krauss was less debater and more lecturer, I think he couldn't convince to even give his initial statement. I really very much impressed from Mr. Hamza God bless him for his penitents
gods blessings are nice
but the truth is more important
like with this Covid, god is not going to save us, we need scientists now and THEIR truth
that is reality
and Hamza ignoring reality is being extremely impolite and disrespectful
debates are not fights about lies, they should be about facts
Due to covid mecca closed allu lullu failed. Case is closed for stone licker islamic pagans
"Patience".
jamal Durani they came here for two diff reasons. Hamza came to win over the audience with rhetorical power and Krauss wanted an honest discussion.
@@MrKaugaban i may be low rank but not then muhmmad ( messenger of saitan).
True discussion is when both come with open hearts and minds to share and find what is truth, not to defend their opinions.
It is a complete waste of time when neither wants to learn!
Then its not called a debate its called discussion bro
according to Hamza believing in the german god "Thor" is childish but beleiving in the muslim god "Allah" is not. Racism at its finest.
@@electricearth1101well Thor is the god of thunder allah is the god of everything. It’s more rational to conclude there is one god for everything then multiple in my perspective idk about you though
Очень узкое мышление
@@endlessnutella8612 80% of the world thinks you are a liar, scammer and evil person for saying that allah is the god of everything.
00:28 Debate on Islam and Atheism: Which is More Reasonable?
10:18 The universe had a beginning and was created by something uncreated.
26:24 The Qur'an is considered a miracle due to its literary form beyond the scope of the Arabic language.
33:25 Islam is not a special religion and atheism is not a belief system.
47:26 Causation and the beginning of time are complex topics in physics.
55:17 Discussion on punishment for questioning God's existence and homosexuality in Islam
1:08:59 Discussion on morality and ethics from an Islamic perspective
1:16:33 Criticism of religious beliefs and the importance of science
1:31:56 Discussion on spirit, existence, and restrictions in religion
1:39:29 The universe began 14.72 billion years ago and the best explanation is that it came out of nowhere.
00:05 The debate discusses the use of empirical and deductive arguments in science.
2:02:41 Discussion on gender equality and respecting personal choices
00:28 Atheism, since it's lack of belief in ridiculous claims.
10:18 Not even a creation independent from gods has been demonstrated.
26:24 The quran is just a book with many flaws. Nothing special about that.
33:25 True.
47:26 Yes. And a god outside of time seems ridiculous. He would exist for zero seconds. That's one way to describe things that don't exist.
55:17 Infinite punishments for finite "crimes" which shouldn't be considered as crimes is extremely unjust. Fantasy Allah claims that Homosexuality is a bad thing. Turns out it is not.
1:08:59 Objective morality like Islam usually promotes it doesn't exist, it's always subjective. A muslim following some supposed god's orders isn't acting morally anyways. It's simply obedience to the rules of some dictator.
1:16:33 Even non-violent religions are bad since they teach people to believe in nonsense based on nothing. This can lead to conspiracy theories because of bad standards of evidence.
1:31:56 Whatever terms like "spirit" even mean. And there are lots of unnecessary restrictions in religion.
1:39:29 If it even "came" in the first place.
00:05 What matters is good evidence to support the premises of an argument. Muslims don't have that.
2:02:41 Gender equality doesn't exist in Islam. Another reason to never look at it again. Lots of ex-muslims would risk their lives if they would openly express their apostasy. Grave consequences in their families are the norm. Allah threatening people with his ridiculous hell is one of the worst forms of compulsion in religion. Still muslims claim that there is no compulsion.
@@joerdim please understand its all about bias. Much of the time there is no clear winner between muslims and athiests unless one of them talks over the other person. Also, many incredible things happen in peoples lives that cannot be explained without god. I dont really need to list any examples. I should also mention you should see the other side of things. You probably watch athiests bringing down religions. Watch the other side where educated muslims go and refute these claims quite well. Islam is more special than other religions in my opinion, because the prophet pbuh was illiterate and even if he had co authors its hard to be shakespeare in arabia where most people were illiterate and no one was a great writer. These are my claims and beliefs if you want to believe in athiesm then go ahead.
@@endlessnutella8612 No, it's not all about bias. It's about presenting good evidence to support your claims. Muslims apologists are horrendously bad, even worse than Christian apologists.
That's absolute nonsense. Tell me about one of these "incredible things" that cannot be explained without a god. Oh, you really do need to list an example. Lol. And how is a god even a candidate explanation as we have zero evidence for gods?
Dude, you cannot even prove that Muhammad was illiterate. And you cannot even prove that Muhammad came up with the quran. This is how bad this is.
And your claims get even worse when especially muslim apologists in contrast to you like to paint a picture that in arabia back then there was like the biggest center of poetry on earth.
Also wrong, atheism is not a belief. This is so bad...
krauss calls Tzortzis rude for mentioning the U.S. but it isn't rude to point your finger at a man's face and call him ignorant during a debate??
yo tzortzis is killin it rn bro
@Ахрор Кабулов chill he said 3.14 lmaoo
@Ахрор Кабулов Oh yeah you really showed me, thanks so much! I'll listen to your words exactly.
@Shinobi gamer Lol Shinobi leave him be. Allah SWT knows best, and knows those whose heart's are sealed. We can only know Allah better, and please him in this dunya. All will be made clear in the akhira.
@Axopop is a troll.. Writing the same baseless question in every comment
Six ways to earn good deeds even after death:
1. Give a copy of Qur’an to someone. Each time one reads from it, you gain.
2. Donate a wheelchair to a hospital. Each time a sick or injured person uses it, you gain.
3. Participate in the building a Masjid. Every time a person uses it to worship Allah (SWT), you gain.
4. Build a well or place a water cooler in a public place. Every time somebody drinks from it, you gain.
5. Plant a tree. whenever a person or animal sits in its shade or eats from it, you gain
6. And the easiest of all, share this message with other people.
May Allah (SWT) bless you all and grant you Jannah, inshallah
Gunther Vincent Yes. You can do all of these things when you’re alive of course. But when you die, you can not take anything with you. Therefore all you have to show for yourself is your deeds. Try to do things that have a long and positive impact on the world continuously even after you’re in the grave and awaiting judgement. Your good deeds will continue to stack even after you’re gone inshallah.
Gunther Vincent Oh sorry brother. I didn’t come here to debate. Just a friendly advice to Muslims or anyone who finds interest in the topic. May Allah grant you Hidayah and inshallah you will be led down the right path.
Ameen, Jamian In Sha Allah.
Can I get points by just jerking off XXXVIDEOS and smoking pot?
Michael Bachman... The words that comes in my mind are ... Sucker, Dumbass, Retard, Goofy, Bozo, Brainless and finally GREENPEACE...
"Induction isn't based on observation" - Kraussian logic. Where did this man get his PhD from. He needs to demand a refund.
He really is a pylon, isn't he.
For sure he has failed himself. 💯
Maybe you are to dumb to understand his statement, induction doesn't rely on observation it's self sufficient. Maybe before you spout nonsense actually think before you type.
Strange indeed.where did he say that?
Where tf he even said that?
Lawrence is truly brave risking his life to stand up for what he believes.
That's what I was thinking of!
How
@@ummabdullah7601 He risked his life standing for truth and speaking against Islam. If it was against any other religion in the world, it wouldn't be a big deal, but against Islam ... you know what I am saying... some muslim fanatic might attack him in the name of Allah (Peace be upon him).
He's a coward he didn't follow the prophet Muhammad pbuh!
Yea brave and doesn't know that incest is bad and defended jeffery epstein at one point, bravo complimenting a degenerate like that 😂
the guy in the middle was having the time of his life
Brother Yusuf Chambers
Yeah his happiness makes me happy 😂
the physics of star 'trak' ? he doesn't even know what he's talking about.
This kind of issue is wrong on the begining, its Impossible have discussion between One religion with atheism, with seems two stuborn Doors talking
Both are arrogants because they protect themselves from no really true arguments, they wont Change their believes or learn anything with this debate
I like how Hamza calms himself by smiling.
It's a sign of embarrassment
@Jimmi K right on 😂👍
@ilma iskander insulting what? Religion? What about me getting insulted by the nonsense you call religion? What about my feelings? Why is always only religion people get offended and insulted? So just suck it up!
Space Roamer u need to read the quran n learn the islamic history first with an openmind, put aside your denial n ego first. If u can’t, it means your ears, eyes, heart n mind have been closed/blocked. No matter how much people try to explain to u, it won’t work, just like what Hamza explained in this video, he did very well.
@@maiii7733 let him question about trinity that doesnt exist if he is that smart xD
Wow!! This was so entertaining!!
Its not fair 😂
Hamza did not answered the question of space, which he did not know, . He just keeps arguments about space . He did not answer the remaining necessary arguments fairly. Why did the prophet not receive revelation when there was someone else? Why should God hide himself? Then why would he send a prophet and want to attribute the existence of God?
When someone starts insulting the other, it usually means they lost already, "infinitely" lol.
@@chrischow9085 When your good friends with Jeffery Epstein who was arrested for pedophilia, you have already lost.
@@chrischow9085 poor arguement
@@chrischow9085 prove it
@@chrischow9085 you're lying or you've been lied to if you really believe that lmao. For centuries and centuries, his worst of enemies didn't even conjure up these lies, doesn't that say a lot chris😂, go ahead and do your research or believe these lies, you know what they say " ignorance is bliss"
@@chrischow9085 when you hesitate regarding Incest .. you are toasted
6:30 start of the debate
Praise to you
Ty
You're the real mvp.
HI lets begin.
@@TheyCallHimTheTops
All praise to the creator
As a previous atheist I used to Admire Lawerence , Sagan, and Hawkins. After reverting March 2023 I realized all those books I used to read wasn’t science because they were purely speculative they would tell you science then right after they show you the HOW they remind you their interpretation is their view on God. No connection between the two but if u say it right afterwards after people are blown with the work of the creator peoples brain will auto pair the two things together.
Carl Sagan isn't atheist he's agnostic
This debate is a treasure to be preserved forever.
True, Krauss did his best to get some basic education across. And I also recommend watching the short video of Hamza and some other apologist trying to confront atheists at some convention about "quran science" (lol). Man, I think I have never seen someone switching the topic as quickly as good old Hamza did when he heard that his interlocutor was an actual embryologist who knows his stuff.
according to Hamza believing in the german god "Thor" is childish but beleiving in the muslim god "Allah" is not. Racism at its finest.
@@electricearth1101 there are many proofs that destroyed and continue to destroy atheism, but most won't even debate about it. do you really think you have been born in 2000s and not in year 57381 where human are so much advance and there is no religion.... by coincidence? you didn't born as ant or bird but as human who can write in keyboard and make thoughts in his mind just to say there is no creator who I'm thankful for all blessing I have.
in 100 years it won't be necessary anymore, there is no need for any gods
@@abdalaalenzi3748Humans are not perfect because we were created by magic. It took us billions of years to evolve. We are simply the result of billions of years of evolution, so it's only natural that we would be intelligent and capable. It's called a natural process. You are just a species on a small planet orbiting a star among 100 billion stars in a galaxy among 2 trillion galaxies. What makes you think your tiny brain can comprehend the complexity of the universe? But it doesn't make sense, right? Well, guess what? THE UNIVERSE IS UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO MAKE SENSE TO YOU OR ANYONE.
No one is going to say he looks like Mahone from Prison Break
Ya Allah;;; Ya Muhammad ;;; Ya imam Ali;;; Ya Imam Mahdi (as)
He even sound so..🤣🤣
@Sabir When you say name of prophet Muhammad (SAWW) you praise Him and His family (ahlul bayt) prophet said Ali is also my ahlul bayt.
Ahlul Bayt >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sahabi
Eventhough, Both are righteous but ahlul bayt is something else espiecally first caliph and imam Imam Ali (as)
Hahahahahaha Agent Mahone
I swear to Allah I thought the same. I’m like damn, they got the greatest investigator in the world against Islam lol jk
The level of rude from Krauss is a man who’s unhinged and knows he’s lost the argument before it started.
His rudeness is the perfect example of why the faithful deem atheism as sinful. Atheism is NOT the disbelief of there being a God. Atheism is a state of DENIAL and RIDICULE, not of true disbelief.
@@serviogaming5169 please dont spread lies it's a sin dont forget
@@serviogaming5169 and yeah atheism is disbelief in god, we criticize the idea of god because it discourages people for trying to learn and because it has no evidence supporting it, and tbh Islam says alot of evil stuff and scientific illiterate stuff that's why anti theists think it's bad (anti theists are NOT all atheists)
@Ismail Ibrahim Wow. Goddamm, you muslims are REALLY smart! I love when someone can use words like that
If you listen to tsorzis opening statements he was actually quite rude but he was very subtle, it was passive aggressive with a smile. Add to that Krauss was pissed off even before this debate started because the men and women where seperated in the audience and he refused to take part unless it was changed. Krauss ruffled his feathers so you could see tsorzis true colours. Tsorzis even had to remind himself to calm down when his mask dropped.
Its funny how 10 years ago when i watched this i was on hamza's side and now 10 years later im in lawrence's.
💪 Because you have a strong character.
@@joerdim i think im just concerned about knowing the truth. It does require overcoming your own biases.
@@yusufansari790 true
@@yusufansari790 so after 10 years of research you came to conclusion that universe came from Nothing?
Don't make me laugh boy
@@justsendmelocation313 how about i dont know.
As an Agnostic here, i can say that i enjoyed the debate. Little thrashtalk and smiles made debate better absolutely, im entertained.
Read the Quran brother
@@darwishtrade4526 I was a muslim until I read the Qur'an bro.
@@jiukam how
Hamza is also ex-aethist , it was undoubtedly easy for him to handle.
Mashallah
Ramadan Mubarak 🙏❣️
Alsamohsin Alsamohsin really? i thought he is an arab muslim. MasyaaAllah
He's greek
@@nurhidayahharidzulzain1077 he's Greek. He said as much in the debate
@@nurhidayahharidzulzain1077 hes greek, look at his last name
Hamza got rocked.
this was in 2013??? lmao watching in 2020 during this pandemic
Me too bro, me too lol
Jesus is the only way to the father
@@emidiorrr5755 Islam is the only way to god...
@@fcbkingmessi4664 Islam is the most stupid pagan cult, totally man-made. You are brainwashed idiot.
@@George-iv1hi well we need arguments you can't say that and you don't even have knowledge
This is the debates we need.
You got what you wanted a debate so how come you don't want to obey god and follow the prophet Muhammad pbuh
@@sammymohamed8541cuz Ur prophet molested a 9 y.o
I might be wrong, but I think it is considered courteous to argue a debate in a common language. I don't know how good Lawrence's grasp of Arabic is, but does it add anything to the strength of his argument?
Yes but when he was talking in arabic he was quoting the quran, he then translated.
@Someone-ll6zu LK wouldn't necessarily know that.
He is meant to be debating him. LK is not going be persuaded by what is written in a holy book anyway, so why mention it. As his supporters in the crowd understand it and his opponents don't, it is more than bad manners, IMO.
@@psychologicalprojectionist he does translate
@@psychologicalprojectionist Quran is read and memorized in Arabic. All over the world. No one memorizes Quran in English or Japanese. If he mentions a verse (in Arabic) and then he translates it, I don't think it has much difference. Almost all Muslim preachers mentions Quranic verse in Arabic and then translates it.
@mubaraksenju7521 if Lawrence knew this was what he was doing, then fine. But he could just say that bit in his head.
The debate is in English and the validity of the religion is the debate, so the contents of the book don't matter. As with Christians, you have to look for evidence outside the evidence that was planted by adherents to the faith.
Quran 52.35-36 “Or were they created by nothing, or were they the creators [of themselves]? Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.”
Actually , Krauss is "place a term here" enough to believe that something could come out of nothing...
@@nadimahmed8485 I'm criticizing him.
@v k speak in human.
@Gunther Vincent
1- Islam doesn't tell you to kill all nonbeliever's. That's BS.
2- you can't as an atheist say that it's wrong. Because you don't have a moral compass.
+
Why don't you take this killing as a way to survival ? I mean killing those who oppose me means that there is more resources for me.
Jason Voorhees lol soz misread
Who's here 2020
Every year. I love watching Krauss hand religion it’s own ass.
Telsonater I feel sorry for you...If only you knew ...
me..
@@user-sx3pc7yt3k يا ليت قومي يعلمون
July 2020
One was respectful and explained his points very clearly, the other was just there to throw insults.
Just because you are polite, doesn't mean you are correct.
Thank you
C'mon. Hamza was provocative. The bit where he takes and misinterprets a sentence from Krauss' book is a good demonstration. Krauss was clear in what he meant in the book, but Hazma insisted it proved his point, even though he was clearly understanding it wrong.
Both were respectfull you are just biased towards your religion.
Unimportant, the arguments put forward are the point of debate
"Little knowledge of science makes man an atheist, but in-depth study of science makes him a believer in God"
Francis Bacon
Lord Verulam
the opposite is the case: in-depth knowledge of science typically leads to atheism. indoctrination, brainwashing, ramming religious beliefs down childrens throats, threats of death for not believing, and religious bias makes him believe in god
Francis Bacon was a militant atheist but his atheism was not a simple dismissal of religion and religious belief. He exploited the symbols of Christianity, especially the Crucifixion and the Pope, in order to show its untenability in the modern age.
this shows that you are quote mining out of desperation
He really should have said "Little knowledge of the scriptures makes a man a believer, but in-depth study of the scriptures makes him an atheist".
@@Dexuz most atheists have barely done an in-depth study of the scriptures wdym...
to all human beings:
when you want to win
you don't learn.
Very interesting what you said but can you explain it a lttle better what you mean?
Yusuf Altug if you start arguing not for the validity of your viewpoint but rather just to push your viewpoint you become bias and people will call you out on that. When you become bias you will ignore opposite reason to push your reason and people will call out that flaw.
@@easy5989 the moment you come to know that were wrong just admit it. when you become this kind of person no one can overpower you because you never get disappointed. its actually being true to yourself
@@bestoddlysatisfyingshorts8729 Entire quote sounds great, the last sentence is uplifting🙏🏿
@@tyronevaldez-kruger5313 thank you sir
Brother Hamza you're still young, amazing, knowledgeable and handsome person may Allah protect you from evil eye
what about the djinns? does he need protection against them too?
@@chrischow9085 you mean extremely educated unlike your stupid self
There is no evil eye
@@sbsjdahxxbbsbsbdjsjs8368 is he the one who is believing in a god that has not been proven and there is absolutely no proof that God exists. Is he the one that is uneducated or is it you who is wrongly educated. People like you have been brainwashed by everyone in your community to force you to believe that God exists. And islamic religion is by no means a peaceful religion. In nearly half the islamic countries, you are executed for being an atheist.
Leena Khaneja my guy the main most strict country which is Saudi Arabia which in fact is where Islam originated allows atheists and any other religion to be accepted equally into they society. The Quran even mentions that disbelievers in Islam should not have any conflict with believers since all we are trying to do is to invite to Islam we will not have any conflict with the disbelievers and should be minding our own business unless if we are here to promote, defend ourselves or invite someone to Islam it says in Surat al kaferoon, in fact there are more unmuslim countries that are putting unhuman laws and punishments into their law, such as North Korea. The fact that you immediately assume that we are uneducated because we have a belief is just wrong and stupid tbh.
"What is a soul?"
"You'll find out when you die"
*Crowd goes wild*
smh
Ikr
I don’t get it
@@Hi-cu2vxsoul actually mean conscious mind not brain according to Islam the separation of that mind from your brain is death ☠️ that is scary though like near death experiences and brain doesn't produce consciousness rather they work together mean dualism
Hamza God bless you you are the real face of Islam
face of no reason and logic ..am glad to be an ex muslim
@@earth.planet8860aaah, so you can fallow your perverse desires, nothing to be proud of, may Allah give you wisdom
Hamza taught me how to calm with such a rude personality.. truly gentleman he is!
but he is most disrespectful and arrogant
not gentle at all
in the real world, people who use lies are rude, and speaking facts and truth is respectful, not the other way around
islam is the opposite of reality, and Hamza is most annoying and disrespectful, defending his beliefs as if they are facts
Bro do you meet hamza?
@H H haha?
Hamza is not a scientist but a child rapist worshiper
that's why
see?
@H H no, I do not HAVE to lie, I told you and explained that
so why do you have to lie about me?
why do YOU need lies? do you also worship that child raping pig?
@H H No |I am not
do you lie because you worship a child rapist?
The most amazing part of the debate was that Krauss managed to drink out of an empty glass multiple times
thats what Atheism is giving him
@@nazhir4156 what religion give you?
@@YTwatcher926 a purpose
He was demonstrating water comes from nothing 🤣
Because he quenches his thrist from nothing. That is called atheism
Awesome good job both of you❤
Naa! You get hell!
2:05:24 Krauss drinking water from Empty glass
"Something from nothing". 😂
LMAFOOOOO
underrated comment 😂😂😂
@@fbbinoire201 ikr 2 likes
😂true 👍🏻
Lolll
As a born Christian (currently agnostic - but I lean Abrahamic meaning I view all scriptures that claim Abrahamic origins as potentially true and from God) who often watches these sort of debates - I think its quite obvious that Krauss danced around responding to the argument made by Hamza (one can only assume because he had no valid counter to offer up outside of his opinion based off of his personal worldview and knowledge). Krauss was intentionally rude and disrespectful while claiming his intent was not to offend people only to disagree with their ideas. If that were true he would have chosen his words - which vI know he is well capable of doing - more wisely. Its not what he is saying but how he is saying it at times that is the problem. Then he takes offense when Hamza says things regarding America in a certain way - what a double standard! He got up tot he podium and 1. made almost no response to the argument that Hamza offered up 2. He then began to take sensationalized perspectives regarding beliefs of Muslims to try and back Hamza into a corner - which felt was an attempt to say "see! this is Gods creation - why would God create something this way just to call it a sin?". The problem with that is that All 3 Abrahamic scriptures have very reasonable answers to that question - does Krauss think he is the first to raise this? His ignorance of the religion coming into this debate was absolutely insulting and just showed his outrageous arrogance regarding his own worldview and knowledge. I would choose to be a part of Hamza's community over someone like Krauss any day of the week. To call himself an educator is laughable.....he doesn't want to influence discussion and critical thinking - what he actually does is first deflect by using criticism that is practically irrelevant to the topic at hand and then when all else fails completely avoid the theme of the discussion altogether - highjacking it to take it in his own direction in order to control the narrative.
You should look into islam sister as its the most preserved abrahamic religion and makes sense with only one true all knowing God with no partners unlike for e.g christianity with the whole idea of the trinity.
Perhaps it's his arrogance that's keeping him from accepting the truth. Happens to a lot of people.
Very well said! Hamza seemed more educated than Krauss. A professor shouldn't be acting this way, especially when invited to speak.
I would also humbly suggest you the RUclips channel, The Deen Show, which has interviews with former Christians and Jews (& sometimes atheists). I personally loved it and hope the same for you.
Finally someone said it, very eloquently and elegantly put
I don't usually read long comments but this one is beautifully written, wonderful comment God bless you 👏🏿👏🏿
10 years and this debate still had its effect on the moral realm of religion .. God bless Hamza
too bad 10 years later you Still don't know what morals are ...
religions Do Not Have morals , they can't , religions have DECREES or dictations from a dictator ,
when your morals '' come from another subject '' , they can't be objective , or you don't understand what That word means either , objective
it means without opinion or coming from a mind , including gods
so no the bible , torah , quran ... = no morals , just decrees
you can Only Have morals , objective morals , when you're an atheist ,
who grounds his / her morality in ... get this ... the evidence OF morality , which are the patterns we see change over time ,
we give those patterns a name , the patterns ... ARE objective , no mind involved , we call THAT ... whoop-de-doo ... OBJECTIVE MORALITY ...
now , we could explain this to a 4 year old and he / she would understand this in a heartbeat ,
apparently not a lot of people are smarter THEN a 4 year old ...
and not a lot of people know they have NO morality to speak of , like you and your family , parents grand parents , children , nobody
just the atheists who understand what the word ACTAULLY MEANS , say it with me ... Objective Morality , decrees bad , objective morality good ...
billions of people across the world have no cue what 90% of the words mean we invented , don't worry about it , LEARN about it
hamza made no sense....according to islam that profile photo you put is haram..total absurdity and dictatorship
@@earth.planet8860😂 78k comments say otherwise
@@earth.planet8860 what do you mean hamza made no sense", that is a really strong claim to make, did you even watch the whole thing?
@@mohamadhamid3360 tell me what his argument was ? using big words that made no sense
why is the microphone volume level of Mr. Lawrence Krauss so low that you can't hear his point? While Hamza and the mediator has their microphone volume on full blast?
It must be a conspiracy. You should contact the FBI there might be AlQaeda inside your headphones.
Mr Krauss, last warning, get off you alt account😂
Lmao😂
After 1 hour and 9 minutes Mr. Krauss said "i am only asking because i want to learn." So saying "everything you said is crap or nonsense" is called "asking" ?
lol very true
That's what they do all the time, "i dont know" "i wanna know" type of sentences
Since when atheist got morality? They are denial..that what Hamza is showing the world.
@@luqman2626 Hamza is definitley a better at debates but it doesnt mean he is correct. I would love to see him debate another atheist that can have better composure
"I never learned about Islam because it's nonsense" then suddenly "I'm asking because I want to learn"
Lol
I guess I'm going back to school to repeat learning English.
@@goatfied-7362 The fact u spelled common as comment is concerning and I think you should learn yourself before criticizing others.
@@goatfied-7362 You spelled sense wrong too, please just stop, you're just insulting yourself.
@@goatfied-7362 Correcting someone means you have no knowledge?
@@xVoid42 you have to go down to IQ level 0 to argue the dude @GoatfiedNY
@@lly_09 Lol, I'm not arguing, just telling him not to say mean stuff to other people when he can't do what he's trying to correct them for. (this makes like little to no sense but u get what I mean)
Is this on a podcast? I can’t seem to find it anywhere :(
Can't have an infinite universe, but can have an infinite being.? Special pleading.
instead of defending his standpoint, the hatred in his heart made him come after Islam
@@chrischow9085 u have alot to learn about body language .. try reading both speakers and u'll see
@Jack Michaelson guess you're the one who's not
@H H @jack michaelson you are the biggest idiot
@Jack Michaelson just like the speaker talks about things that dont relate to the debate
@Jack Michaelson lmao bro you're handing out 'f-cking idiot!"s like oprah
When Professor Krauss started talking, sounded like he was so upset that he just rambled on "nonsense". I was hoping to understand Atheism, but he was too busy calling Islam nonsense.
Understand atheism? There isn’t much to understand we just don’t believe in god
Bc it is nonsense.
@@yes-wx2je Exactly, its derived from christianity which everyone knows, so god knows why people still subscribe to it in this day and age.
Guys relax. Please
chris chow hay yes boy 👦 boy your covered
Ayyy that’s intro went hard AF!!! Had me like🕺
2:06:20 Mr Krauss’s response to the women saying she was offended could be used against him here. He said to the women that she knew coming in that the event is not segregated and should not have a problem with sitting with men. Now, he says he thinks the debate format is stupid and treated the whole “debate” like a back and forth and kept interrupting, even when it was not his time to speak.. so the same could be said for him - he knew he was coming to participate in a DEBATE and should have respected that
Kudos to Hamza for doing a great job in conducting this debate 👏🏼
I noticed that too. Krauss's entire performance here was lacklustre and full of double standards.
His key arguments were moral and whether it's "sensible" to believe in God/Islam, yet he can't morally argue against incest. When Hamza uses technical and reasonable terminology his response is to ask Hamza to "stop using words". It should be embarrassing enough that he doesn't appear to have a good grasping of what's inductive and deductive and how it relates to the discussion - or he's just being intentionally obtuse.
In fact, what even was his argument? When backed into a corner as his position is being demolished he starts to posit a vague standpoint.
Krauss, as typical of most 'new atheists', literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma then walk away smugly. Almost like a Christian proselytiser. I don't think these new atheists realise how much they are unironically presenting themselves as behaving in the same manner as the 'ignorant religious zealots' that they proclaim to be against.
There's an underlying sense that Krauss literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma (with a very cursory understanding of Islam) then walk away smugly. It's clear he wasn't prepared because his arrogance made him think he didn't need to be.
@@stuntxl5783 Hamzah's key argument was that there can be an infinity and if there can be then something can come from nothing. Hamzah ignored his entire scientific argument by claiming it wasn't scientific it was a deductive argument, a deductive argument can and usually is a scientific one and thus since his first premise of the argument was proven incorrect it was an invalid deductive argument.
Ashadu An laillaha Ilawllah wa ashadu ana Muhammadan Rasulullah ☝🏻❤️
Did someone say Ra Ghal Zul?
Cuz I reply.... Lazarus well!
☝️
Masha Allah,,,Allah bless us brother
allah makan babi!!!
he looks like alexander mahone from prison break
Totally 😂🤓
@Perkin Warbeck omg same 😂
😂😂😂 I was also wondering who he is resembling with??
So true
Marwan Bouchakour you right lool
all discussions should have one single motive, simple to just be in a better place after the discussion than before.
ears just listening to to understand not to give 10 reasons why you are right because then your ears listens to give 10 reasons why you are right.
only thing to take to the future is to learn something
Must say truly one of the greatest debates I've seen. Well organized and amazing guests. Hamza was just amazing how polite and respectful he was as a true muslim. Good argument by Pr krauss aswell although he should be more respectful but still fan of his work aswell. 👏👏
He's okay with inc3st but not with women covering their body lol
how can u be respectful with a blind hypoctate in front of u??? He worship a p3d0 who claims the sun run after the moon. STOP THIS BS
@@UsamahMohdSabri The problem is u not the Prof, he clearly explained the specific case and scientifically speaking he is right. If 2 adult and educated brothers loves each other in a way that lead to sex, they are not hurting someone else and they both want the thing, so they would be just 2 adults enjoing sex. As prof said: I'd recomend that? No. But scientifically speaking, as a species who have sex often just for fun/enjoy, there is nothing wrong with inc3st if u don't reproduce. Otherwise would be genetically dangerous, so the fact to aviod births between family have sense as safe sex between family if all partecipant agree. Strange? Oh yes, I'd never do but I repeat, 2 adults are free if they didn't hurt someone else. The Prof had the balls to treat the argument with an honest free mind. A woman covering her body because her religion imposed to her, that is non-sense, from the same god who allowed p3d0 about mohammad, he ashamengly married a poor 6 yo child. U care about Prof giving thouts about inc3st BUT u r ok with your prophet *busing an innocent. I can continue with quran contradictions and disgusting things but I'll stop here, usually musl1 are incapable of critical thinking.
@@nathanspark4876 you talk a lot without knowledge. Don't give me the yeah... as long as it not harmful... I'm okay. Shut up. Read this:
While anyone who has sex can get an STD, sexually active gay, bisexual and other men who have sex with men (MSM) are at greater risk. In addition to having higher rates of syphilis, more than half of all new HIV infections occur among MSM. For reference: CDC gov
So it's harmful. Your argument crumble and you will show inconsistency.
And please show me the contradiction in Quran and i will left islam. You think i have no desire to have casual sex with stranger? If you have the contradiction in the Quran, i would. So please go ahead.
@@nathanspark4876 As for your accusation that Muhammad is a p3do. He married Aisha RA when she's ready, her father knows she's ready, she's also accept the proposal. Islamicaly it's wrong to marry or force someone to marry anyone. She's physically and mentally ready, she love her husband pbuh, there's plenty story of she jealous of her husband pbuh other wives. Indicating how much she loved him. And the whole world is doing it (marrying young). People have shorter life expectancy back then. And if Prophet Muhammad PBUH a ped0. Why would he consummate 3years after their marriage?
So again, your argument crumble. Islam is flawless,showing it is indeed from God
A New Muslim Alhamdulillah from Atheism... The Reason was Atheism has No Set of Rules to Live Live peacefully with mental satisfaction... Alhamdulillah Allah selected Me
❤️🙏🏻
LOLL brainwashed
You're not an atheist. Never was. Don't lie.
@@globalcoupledances we all obey those things
then u never were an atheist but a moron
My English is gooder after watching this.
"gooder"
I understood 100% what massage you want to relay so good keep going.
Let your "gooder" be "better"
Mine is goodest now😂😂😂
I think he's just kidding dumbass bashers.
Hamza in 2023 is an absolute beast....2013 was awesome but he has improved drastically.
according to Hamza believing in the german god "Thor" is childish but beleiving in the muslim god "Allah" is not. Racism at its finest.
@@electricearth1101are you retarded?
@@electricearth1101LOL 😆 learn the difference you are a grown up women plz don't talk like a kid....
I didn't expect Krauss would be so encouraged like this!
He is speaking very freely in a debate full of Muslims and people support Muslim believes
💀💀💀💀💀
Just because you haven't discovered a thing doesn't mean that a thing doesn't exist. Humans are not supreme.
It doesn’t mean it does exist either lol
I can’t prove the Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn’t exist, does that mean it actually exists?
Ramen, brother.
@@kaiza6467 you prove my point with your statement, "I can't prove." Just because YOU can't prove something or experience something doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. You cannot began to comprehend the grand design of this universe and the creature that are in it.
Remember, science "discover" new things all the time. Doesn't mean that those things just appear or exist upon human discovery.
panda berries you’re missing my point.
It isn’t scientific at all to just assume things exist just because you can’t prove they don’t exist.
Because it’s impossible to prove a negative.
@@kaiza6467 Hamza already explained that he's not talking science. He was talking deduction and logic, abstract views of the universe that everyone can concur to without proof. 1+1=2 full stop
Ryuga Law if panda was just making a random, non-religious statement that “you can’t know everything in the universe” then sure, I think that’s true.
But if you were to use the fact that we don’t know everything as a reason to imply there IS a “grand designer”, then that logic is flawed.
Because you could come up with an infinite number of possible creator beings, like my Flying Spaghetti Monster example, presuppose it designed everything and the argument would be the same.
“You can’t know everything, therefor you can’t prove the creator being from MY religion designed the entire universe.”
That’s not how logic works.
The time to believe something is when there is sufficient reason to.
Subhanallah I remembered a verse of Surah Al-mulk verse 9 and 10 when he said "we use commonsense"
Ie:. قَالُوا بَلَىٰ قَدْ جَاءَنَا نَذِيرٌ فَكَذَّبْنَا وَقُلْنَا مَا نَزَّلَ اللَّهُ مِنْ شَيْءٍ إِنْ أَنْتُمْ إِلَّا فِي ضَلَالٍ كَبِيرٍ
They will say: \Yes indeed; a warner did come to us, but we belied him and said: 'Allah never sent down anything (of revelation), you are only in great error.'\" (Al-Mulk 67:9)"
وَقَالُوا لَوْ كُنَّا نَسْمَعُ أَوْ نَعْقِلُ مَا كُنَّا فِي أَصْحَابِ السَّعِيرِ
And they will say: \Had we but listened or used our intelligence, we would not have been among the dwellers of the blazing Fire!\" (Al-Mulk 67:10)"
May Allah guide us All Ameen
Oh lord, These verses came before more than 1400 years ago, and Allah knew that there would be a bunch of people who would deny the existence of God *and* Islam
Ameen ya RAB
Ikr
Ameen
Regret is not before event but after.deep verses.may Allah keeps us from ignorance
Nothing is something, Nothing is a Thing, 0 is 1 and 1 is 0, by this logic nothing will remain, no logic, no Internet, No universe
I like this form of debate. But I feel they should have come to some form of conclusion. I'd love to see one of these where they debate until they agree.
Inshallah Krauss becomes Muslim.. he would be at so much peace
IA
InshaAllah
Let him know about jinnat
Amira Kaced Ameen.
Amen
That moment of " Actually let me calm down" by hamza was so smooth and funny , i' ve never seen someone calm himself like that ever . That actually shows self control at such a high level . And apologized for it at the end even .
@@chrischow9085 I see you like to troll about. How bored are you. If you think religion is so much bs why are you so pained and burtthurt trolling all over the comment section for a week. It's almost like you are obssesed and you are angry that there is an inevitable and you must face it. You hate that there are people bold enough to accept this inevitable. I suggest you stay away from this videos if you can't handle them like a man lol 😅😁
Loved it too. He’s so grounded.
@@chrischow9085 i don t appreciate nor respect arrogant people . I appreciate it if you found someone else to fill your ego with . Have a nice day .
@@chrischow9085 you came to me . Get some help
@@chrischow9085 It's always funny to see these atheists responding to all muslim comments with some dumb points. There are the most fanatic people. But just virtually, in fact you'll never see them taking part in an oral debate
A debat for ages 🎉
The opening statement for Islam was basically “I have not studied and therefore have no fundamental understanding of science, but in my simplified example based off of what little I did grasp, it doesn’t make sense and therefore is illogical.”
It’s astounding yet saddening to me that people seem to gravitate toward this argument because it was presented “warm and fuzzy” while the professor simply chose not to mince any words. In fact, if you actually listen, you might consider the multiple religious greetings/comments directed toward him and the audience to be disrespectful given the context of their debate. I wouldn’t show up to a “All sports are great” party wearing a Football jersey to imply that we all know the “truth.” As usual, the religious argument is filled with almost everything but the one thing that matters: quantifiable, measurable, documented evidence of its existence. We’re just upset because an instructor didn’t make us feel good inside.
As Mr Krauss came into the debate so confidently I expected something of a good fight. Hamza sat him down without needing to compromise on his modesty and humbleness. Embarrassing
@Jimmi K Krauss was the twat. Hamza was the reasonable one.
@Jimmi K Watch the debate again pal.
@Jimmi K dude, stop being delusional. Hamza clearly won. Krauss was being an idiot.
Completely agree with Jimmi K - Hamza was just awful in this. He can barely present a point without having to change the subject.
@Jimmi K I disagree - there are plenty of islamic scholars who, while I don't agree with their ideas, are much more honest interlocutors than Hamza. It was shocking to watch him commit all kinds of rhetorical errors, and then turn around and accuse Dr. Krauss of the very things he was doing.
I’m an atheist, but Krauss’ atitudes during this debate was terrible. Even though I agree that someone’s attitude towards a subject has no bearing over the truth of a claim, Hamza did a greater job at interacting with the audience and presenting his perspective in more polite manner. I hope Krauss can learn from this experience and improve his debating skills, cause this was just hard to watch, he came off as the angry and arrogant atheist, something most of us atheists have been trying to get away from.
I dont think it was terrible (i am a staunch muslim) i think prof krauss's frustration was genuine. The debate format wasnt optimized enough in my opinion. I am a muslim who believes in islam but i accept that it takes a certain convincing to do so, and to a HIGHLY reputed professor like dr. krauss? I think the format should be in a very different manner. However I do wish such a debate should be there.
Firstly i think proof of islam can be debated in MANY ways. For example, scientifically, mathematically, logically, literally, ontologically, historically etc. We need to keep it focused.
Secondly, after keeping it focused to one discipline and one discipline alone (since i believe that since Allah is true, i believe that Allah's evidence always overpowers other evidences) we need to get professors in that area. And not just any professors, top professors in the world.
Thirdly, you have to figure out which aspect of religion you are arguing. Islam will not speak of christianity and vice versa. If it is religion vs athiesm we need to figure out which religion.
Fourthly, we need to document every statement according to laws of the subject. For instance, if i say something like i believe in islam due to the historical facts and if i give a 3 minute lecture on the proof of it, my statement should be there to present on some screen. One line statement. Otherwise word picking will occur and no matter how good a professor is, he is human and emotions will come and it is our job as people of science to come to a conclusion while negating human emotion as much as we can.
Fifthly, There should be no timelimit. This is not a debate of today and can not really be concluded like that.
Sixthly, every statement that is presented must be backed by some sort of evidence (suggesting REALLY high levels of scholars). If someone negates athiestic views based on ontological argument there must be atleast a google search on the worldly accepted definition and AXIOMS of ontological argument and there should be a THIRD party discussion that agrees it.
Seventhly, this can not be done in one video or something because it will take DAYS and stuff but i think it is required. Athiests believe that religion is the cause of violence and i believe intolerance is the cause of violence and i think since violence is a HUGE problem of today's world, we must come together as different religions to figure out a solution. You cant coexist like that if there are extremists everywhere. To make things better we need such dialogues.
Lastly i think there should be many teams having different roles including a third party that VALIDATES the facts these guys give.
@@MrCuteguylol I agree that his frustration was genuine, but my problem is not with his sincerity towards how he feels, it’s with how he handled himself becoming very emotional during the debate. That’s not a good sign in any intellectual debate, as the truth about reality has no bearing to your feelings and should be presented with good arguments and evidences rather than Ad Hominem and Straw-manning (which both debaters actually did to each other, but Krauss was very rude while Hamza was doing it more for the laughs).
When it comes to convincing, it’s not as complicated as many people make it be. What a lot of these debates do is talk about philosophical arguments for a God, which to some theists, not all, can be misconstrued as evidence, while for most atheists, philosophy, while being a very useful epistemological tool, to be proven or show with a highly probability of being a reality must follow some method to be verified in its validity. The thing is, the best method most skeptics trust is the scientific method, rather than the methods many theists have claimed to use to reach their conclusions, since to us, are methods that can be used to reach other conclusions, demonstrating that it’s not a good method.
For example, here are some methods I’ve seen used by some Christians to prove that their God is the real one: “faith, revelation, holy text, philosophy, personal experience, historical events”. All of these examples can also be used to reach any other religion or any other belief system, ones that may very well contradict each other. Now, to discern who is right and who is wrong, the scientific method is the best tool for the job, one that is based purely on deducing the facts of reality by verifiable experiments by postulating predictions on what we might find in the scenario the hypothesis is correct, and if the findings is constant with the predictions made, it can become a theory, the highest awarded rank to an explanation for a phenomenon in science.
I believe that if any theist wants to convince a skeptic (not just an atheist, many atheists aren’t skeptics, but most are) is presenting the type of scientific evidence I said. Philosophy, Math, History, while being useful tools, aren’t good enough for knowing and understanding a a concept like “God”. There are many branches of philosophy that contradict each other, there are concepts in Math that are impossible, like irrational numbers and history, while correct at many times, is a hard method to determine what was true in the past, certainly getting it wrong in many stances because of how hard it is to very some events.
I agree with most of what you said in how debates should be organized and conducted to maximize efficiency in the debate. I’ll even go as far as to say that committing argumentation fallacies should always be noted and understood between debaters, as many don’t always address them, especially for the audience to understand why that argument show fallacious reasoning behind it.
There is no point in having debates where the debaters will be: dishonest, rude, dodge arguments/question, misrepresent the other, assert claims without providing evidence, etc. Any platform and debaters that can minimize these, in my view, independently on their views, will be a lot more productive.
Exactlyyyy!!!! totally agreed with you. However, no matter how impossible this may seem, its equally necessary. Because coexistence will occur and people will fight against each other unless there is some sort of representation.
I am sorry but the Muslim speaker has been just as condescending but he was more playing to his crowd. It is easy to argue out of a religious perspective because you can always retrude yourself in a moral high-ground. Science isn't moral but factual, so moral argument are totally sensless to have. Also his constant Arabic input in between are just terribly distracting and derailing for any non-muslim listener.
@@bodo887 Both were condescending in how I see it, but Hamza played it off a lot better. I don’t think neither of them ended up being good debaters. However, since I’m an atheist and I see that this position is the best position to be in, I expect that the debater defending this doesn’t do it with ad Hominems and overall bad explanations and reasoning like Krauss did. My expectations for the atheists are much higher precisely because i believe they are in the more reasonable perspective, it’s the reason I enjoy Matt Dillahunty’s debates a lot, as he not only understand religions very well in general, he knows about argumentation fallacies, which every debater should have at least a basic understanding of, which Krauss and Hamza lacked.
Not saying I would have done better then Krauss, but there were multiple moments I would have presented something completely different than what he decided to present to counter arguments. Look at how off guard he was with the “incest” morality, he should be more prepared to defend his opinion, even if it is taboo. He used an argumentation that it is ok, but the chances of having children with mental disabilities is high. Even though his statement about it is true, this is bad reasoning at its core, since he implies that a relationship necessarily needs to end in reproduction, which isn’t the case, as we can obviously see with homosexual/assexual couples. It’s also bad because it would imply that couples with genetical mental disabilities shouldn’t reproduce, which is a complicated subject, since you’re talking about taking away someone’s basic right, like having a child, because of a disorder.
I agree with him that two consenting adults that happen to be close family should have the freedom to decide what they want. It’s none of my business if this is what they want for their life, that’s probably what he thinks as well. The reason for this is because my moral judgement parts on the notion that your freedom cannot come in conflict with the collective freedom. Two adults in love that want to be together doesn’t harm anyone, so it should be a right, even if it’s looked upon as wrong or unnatural by our culture and upbringing.
He should have been more prepared for this debate and more prepared to deal with his own emotions. In many people’s minds that don’t know many atheists, he’s up there representing who an atheist is. Hamza used Krauss’ anger to his own advantage and made atheists look like they are angry and unreasonable, which causes the atheist community more harm than good.
“For fools admire and love those things they see hidden in verses turned all upside down, and take for truth what sweetly strokes the ears and comes with sound of phrases fine imbued.” ― Lucretius, The Nature of Things
The only woman who spoke made herself look stupid !
Talking about “ a black man sitting next to her made her uncomfortable “
But she went to a public event that wasn’t’ carded as a segregated event !
She sounded really racist and bigoted for even mentioning his “ race “ …
She said
“ will he come sit next to me and my friends in a restaurant ? »
She’s obviously racist ! And not q true Muslim ! Or human !
She’s the type to ride the city public bus , pay for 1 seat , then complain that « a black man sat next to me and I did not want him to «
She needs to check her attitude ! This is not a restaurant !
She would go to a restaurant, sit at a table for 10 , with 3 friends and be angry when strangers join them at the table !
moral of the story : do not talk about science to a scientist, if you wanna save your vanity.
*The more I wanted to understand comparative religion and beliefs the more I felt that intelligence and truthfulness are only required to revert in islam from any other beliefs*
@Jimmi K you can talk with me via messenger or whatsapp if you think I am wrong.❤️😊
@Jimmi K you can debate me about Islam...❤️
Let's have a discussion.
Let's See who's right.
I am confident about my religion.😏
Because I was in lot of atheist groups in fb.😊
I faced their questions
and researched them.😶
Now in a right track.🙏
You can have some discussions with me.😊
I can challenge you.❤️
@Gunther Vincent not revert but researched in deferent beliefs.❤️
Chains of religion.. No ones chained to religion.. God himself gave us free will.. Anyone is free to be a idiot.. But they wouldn't enjoy jannah with us.. People just want reason to not have judgement for the evil way of life they live.. They would love that
@@armanhossain3781 That you are wrong there's no question about it! You are so brainwashed that I don't if you can get help.
It’s amazing how Hamza sat Krauss down in the second round. krauss thought he could bag the debate but damn Hamza is intelligent and logical..
I’ve been watching a lot of debates on atheism vs islam - and it appears that atheist speakers always don’t do self study on the opponent belief and would just make ignorant statements and waited for opponents to educate them.
chris chow you know krauss messed up that’s why you defend him 😊
@@chrischow9085 you don't know how to argue, sit back down.
@@chrischow9085 did you watch the debate backwards or something?
Guys relax.
@@chrischow9085 Okay, tell us where he messed up. Go on.
What is the name of song at the beginning...?? Can someone tell me please..
In 2024 still 99% population on Earth believe in 9 million year old book. 😂
Not as many and not as old, but it's still freakin embarrassing. Imagine aliens land on earth tomorrow and you have to admit that so many members of your species are that gullible.
Nobody:
Krauss: I am nothing
😂🤣😂
Navman I never see it more disgusting mane krauss He’s so disgusting
😂😂😂😆
Lmao
😂😂😂😂
I watched this in 2014, i couldn't understand due to weak english now comeback in 2021 still can't understand lol
You will surely understand after you die🤣
Stop playing pubg then😂 improve your English bro
@@jamesrichard5192 How will i understand when i die?
@@akkad-bakkad working on it.
Your English is good
Atheism is too often defined incorrectly as a belief system,atheism is just common sense…
You lack logic
@@8achim936 You lack arguments.
@@joerdim ok tell me what common sense is.
@@8achim936 Rational discernment or judgment. It's irrational to believe in things without good evidence hence atheism is common sense.
@@joerdim and there is my point. God's existence is proved with logic, atheists think logic is not "good evidence". Which loops back to me original reply. You lack logic 😁
I was a muslim but after reading islam with understanding i think such hateful words would never from God. I decided to left it so suffocating to live in islam ? There is no hate, separation, judging, killing, in God's nature so why in Quran and in islam. Here in my vicinity Islamic scholars teach us very disgusting lessons in the name of God. So i started reading islam by myself and i ended up that it is totally man made. I don't want to follow someone else ideology which makes a God cruel entity who punishes his own creation Just for being happy or being themselves and hate others who are non Muslim.
I'm a muslim if you wanna have a friendly debate or have an argument about this topic I think I can change your mind so just pls mention me if u accept (if I don't respond within a day tag me again yt doesn't send notifications alot of the time)
True. Islam teaches lots of terrible things. But even any actual god could also very well be a terrible and vile character, just like the proposed islamic god. Luckily, there is no good reason to think that any god even exists. So who cares, right?
@@joerdim you rlly should care you atheists are so dependent on randomness for us to exist and randomness is not logical "Islamic god" doesn't teach horrible things you are just brainwashed into believing that yes the quran mentions killing but its all for a reason not bc the "Islamic god" wants to see killing or likes it idk who put these ideas in ur head
@@pro-vk2pd Tf you waffling about? Define atheism.
Also, "reasons" doesn't mean good reasons and he supposedly tortures people in some hell. Can you still hear yourself talking?
you know what i've learned ???"knowledge without explanation is worthless
"Truth has come, and falsehood has departed. Indeed is falsehood, [by nature], ever bound to depart."
Rayan He already did and said the truth doesn’t change as the science change every time and also he give u example of the earth and sun 🤷🏽♀️ Also religions especially Quran discovered 80% before 1400 years ago what science did right now and it’s just clear that they copped from Quran 🤷🏽♀️
Gunther Vincent I dare you to proof it All what you said in the Quran do it plz
and don’t be brainwashed go and read Quran well instead reading this in the propaganda islamicphobia websites
@Gunther Vincent I want to point out that It was stated in the Qur'an that the earth was spherical tho.
Falsehood will depart, that is the reason why Islam will depart
@@manne8575 Islam is the fastest growing religion right now...lol
Folks commenting here, please watch the entire debate. This guy was humbled by Hamza
@Wasay i would love going back in time and changeing the bible/quaran so they would praise a unicorn😂
Islam is the best religion in the world ❤☪️
Why? Muslims cannot even make their case that their god actually exists.
Have a bacon sandwich and a glass of Merlot and you’ll soon see why it’s not.
@@martynjohnstone6022 dude thought he did something
@@szuvibes9474he is actually funny, unlike these Islamic bots 😊
@@AliZalghout-ys3xk Like you..? Definitely a bot 😊😊