Hey educated idiot why don't you show your loyalty with Darwin? Don't be ugliest thing of universe and accept my challenge, with which face you are teaching the fake knowledge even your heart don't believe that. Pope rabi atheists and all other fuel of hell type humans are now prisoners of their own hearts by me for many years same as you are prisoner of your own heart now, so take it easy and for freedom come in the Ring, Facebook people are witness that I captured all pseudo humans with help of Allah for many years. whole world and Allah (God) is watching your loyalty with your beliefs. 👉🚥🚦Show your confidence in your religion, science or reason. I suggest you with respect that you follow the Holy Quran, if you don't agree with me? then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now. By the all holy books and medical science dead mankind is non communicable and if you call dead personalities or prophets along with Allah (God) and seek help from dead mankind then you will Never go to the heaven, if you don't agree with me then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now? (Don't relate pseudo Muslims with Holy Quran.)
@@deuces_biatch1706 it's a silly thing that Arabic speaking muslims feel that a deeper truth is revealed in Arabic - and since most of the world does not speak Arabic, then it is a sad commentary that Allah chooses to leave out so many people from truly understanding him. I thought he was supposed to be akbar.
@@oscarbarrera6081 My friend I am pretty sure u know maybe even a little a bit of Islam , if you dont and wont then that is your choice but I can tell you Islam is a religion of peace and it means to submit yourself to the one and truly God (Allah) and to follow the teachings of his beloved prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him) and also Islam teaches you about cleanliness and we Muslims after passing urine or stool ,we wipe with tissue first , then with water because it is very important and pure but I'm 100% sure non Muslims do not . I am not here to preach but why do u think the media and everywhere in this world is just targeting Muslims. Its because they know it's TRUE my brother so it's for you to decide, I personally chose to become Muslim because they dont eat pork /pig because it eats it's own poo , surely that's disgusting. Like I said I've done my part preaching , it's your choice
@@oscarbarrera6081 The Qur'an is God's Words: In the name of Allah(God), The Most Gracious, The Most Merciful. All besides those believers who have pure faith, irrespective of which religious background they claim to have come from, merely a single sign would suffice them to believe in the existence of One God, whether it be a sign concerning a scientific phenomenon or any other sign. Where as, on the other hand, there are people who would never believe even if a thousand signs are presented to them, such people would never accept faith and as such they are the Rejectors; there may be a third sect/group/category of people who may be convinced if proper efforts are made, either by means of science and technology, or by reasoning and with logic or by any other technique. As today is the age of science and technology, the best approach we have is the use of scientifically proven and established facts, excluding hypotheses and theories (which lack solid evidence) in order to convince an atheist or an agnostic or any other individual who may not believe that the Qur'an is the revelation of God, as no human being could ever mention such scientific facts in the Qur'an, 14 centuries back which the humanity has unveiled/discovered very recently,with the help of rapidly growing technology and the advances made by the modern scientific world. Majority of the people who disagree with the fact that the Qur'an has been sent down by God, revealed to the last and final messenger and servant of God, i.e. prophet Mohammad (pbuh), when asked about the reason they disbelieve, what they come up with is that they falsely claim that the Qur'an must have been written by prophet Mohammad himself as they do not have any better explanation for not believing in the Qur'an or Allah. With the help of mathematics, we can refute their baseless claim (that Muhammad is the author of the Qur'an, they even fail to realise that he was an Ummi,i.e. he was unlettered/illiterate!). Nevertheless,even for the sake of an argument, let us be kind enough to give them a benefit of doubt, and say that may be, prophet Muhammad wrote the Qur'an (though we never agree!). Now we shall refute their false claim with the help of what we know in mathematics as 'The Probability Theory'. Probability is basically concerned with the likelihood or the chance of something happening/taking place or not happening for which we make certain guesses/flukes or predictions at random and calculate the chance of our choice or guess coming true as a number or percentage. Probability has a range of 0-1. Having a probability of 0 implies the impossibility of the occurence of the event we are dealing with, on the other hand, probability of 1 means that the event is sure to occur, thus affirming a 100% possibility of the occurrence of the event we are dealing with. Any number in between would indicate that the event may either occur or not. For example,if you toss or flip a coin(fair), there are(a total of), two possibilities, it may either land up with a head or tail, whatever choice you make the mathematical chance/probability of your guess being rightat random is 1 out of 2,i.e. 1/2 or 50%. Further, if you have a die (having 6 faces) and you roll it, the chance of your guess-number coming on the top is 1/6 as there are a total of 6 distinct choices to make. Similarly,if you roll the die 2 times in succession/consecutively or roll two dice simultaneously (both yield the same result, these are termed as 'independent events' meaning that the two (or more) events have no influence/impact on one another; they yield independent results) what you'll see is, the probability of both your choices being right at the same time is merely (1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/36 which is < 3%. Now,if you roll the die 3 times successively,the chance of you making the right choice all three times,just at random is (1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/216 which is < 0.5%. Let us now consider the compound event of tossing the coin 2 times and rolling the die 4 times,the probability of you making the correct choices all 6 times is therefore (1/2)×(1/2)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)=(1/2)^2 × (1/6)^4 =(1/4)×(1/1296)=1/5184 which is ~ 0.02%. Let me generalize the method for you. If you repeat an experiment for n different times and all of which must deal with independent events as in our case here, fortunately; and you have a probability of, say 'p' for each of the individual events and of course 0 < p < 1. Now you want to calculate the probability of you making the correct choice all 'n' times i.e. each time you making the right choice without a single mistake.. It is p^n,i.e. 'p' raised to the power of 'n'. For those who are good at maths, they can readily see that this number, p^n quickly reaches 0 when |p| < 1 and n is let increase!! Praise be to Allah SWT,all the Qur'anic verses that talk about scientific phenomena can be modelled as ' the independent events' in this very analysis of ours. And the holy Qur'an contains more than 1,000 (out of more than 6,000 verses in total) verses which speak about science. And more than 800 of which have already been supported by established scientific facts. 1. For example, the Qur'an says that the light of the moon is not its own light but rather, it is the reflected light of the sun (the moon reflects the light from the sun onto the earth), for this one people (at the time of the revelation of the Qur'an,i.e. at the time of the prophet) could have made two choices (if they were asked, hypothetically) i.e. the light of the moon could be the light of its own or it could be the borrowed light of the sun. 2. Similarly, the Qur'an talks about the spherical shape (more accurately, the geo-spherical shape, as the earth is slightly flattened at the poles and slightly bulging out at the equatorial region,i.e. the 'circle of maximum diameter'). People could have thought of various shapes for the earth such as flat, triangular,rectangular etc. So, lfor this particular one, the number of choices would be more than 2. 3. The Qur'an states that the Sun also rotates (about its own axis)...people couldn't even have thought of this, at the time of the prophet as this one is a very very recent discovery, we came to know about this hardly a few decades earlier. So even for this particular one, there would be 2 choices to make, the Sun may either rotate or not! (For the sake of argument only!) 4. The Qur'an talks, in a nutshell, about the birth of our universe which the scientists today call the Big Bang, it may be right or wrong. ..So for this too, we would have 2 choices. 5. The Qur'an talks about the interstellar matter, called 'plasma' by the scientists. Again, could be right or wrong. ..So 2 choices for this too. 6. The Qur'an states that our universe has been expanding. Again, could be right or wrong. .So for this too, we have 2 choices. And so on.. The Qur'an talks about scientific phenomena,over and over again, for more than 1,000 times. Each verse which talk about a scientific phenomenon, can be attributed a number of choices we can think of, as above. These choices vary, from 2 (which is the least/minimum number of choices) to larger numbers, for instance,in the case of the earth, we could think of more than a dozen of possible shapes! Let's restrict ourselves to 2 (as the number of choices), clearly seeing that even the least number of choices would give us the desired result and if we consider more number of choices, we get to the result even more quickly. As a challenge to the people, I'll prove my logic even with the least number of choices as the Qur'an, with no doubts, is the book of God. Proceeding with 2 choices as the flukes/guesses for each of the verses which speak about science, what we find is, the probability or the mathematical chance of one making the correct choice all 800 times, i.e. making the right choice for each of the verses each and every single time is... Using, probability = p^n with p = 1/2 and n = 800... Probability(P) = (1/2)^800 = 1/(2)^800 The number 2^800, i.e. 2 raised to the power of 800 is a very huge number though it may not appear so, so huge that the number 1/(2)^800 is literally negligible and is considered 0 (zero/nill) in practical mathematics. The number of choices that could be thought of,for the scientific verses of the Qur'an is not merely 2 as we have used above!! We could've used more than 2 choices in which case we'd have arrived at the answer of 0 even more quickly. So, even in the most probable case (using the least number of choices, i.e.2), the probability of the scientific verses being written in the noble Qur'an by (any) a human being is 0. The Qur'an, thus, can never be the work of a human. It must have come from a divine source. The only being Who could mention such facts in the Qur'an must be the Creator Himself Who possesses All The Knowledge. Peace
@Gunther Vincent FAMOUS LAST WORDS, FROM ATHEISTS, BEFORE THEY DIED (Re-post) 1. Caesar Borgia: "While I lived, I provided for everything but death; now I must die, and am unprepared to die." 2. Thomas Hobbs[political philosopher] I say again, if I had the whole world at my disposal, I would give it to live one day. I am about to take a leap into the dark." 3. Thomas Payne [/b]the leading atheistic writer in American colonies: "Stay with me, for God's sake; I cannot bear to be left alone , O Lord, help me! O God, what have I done to suffer so much? What will become of me hereafter? "I would give worlds if I had them, that The Age of Reason had never been published. 0 Lord, help me! Christ, help me! …No, don't leave; stay with me! Send even a child to stay with me; for I am on the edge of Hell here alone. If ever the Devil had an agent, I have been that one." 4. Sir Thomas SCOTT [Chancellor of England ]" Until this moment I thought there was neither a God nor a hell. Now I know and feel that there are both, and I am doomed to perdition by the just judgment of the Almighty." 5. Voltaire famous anti-christian atheist: "I am abandoned by God and man; I will give you half of what I am worth if you will give me six months' life." (He said this to Dr. Fochin, who told him it could not be done.) "Then I shall die and go to hell!" (His nurse said: "For all the money in Europe I wouldn’t want to see another unbeliever die! All night long he cried for forgiveness. 6. Robert Ingersoll: "O God, if there be a God, save my soul, if I have a soul!" (Some say it was this way: "Oh God, if there be a God, save my soul if I have a soul, from hell, if there be a hell! 7. David Hume, atheist philosopher famous for his philosophy of empiricism and skepticism of religion He cried loud on his death bed "I am in flames!" It is said his "desperation was a horrible scene". 8. Napoleon Bonaparte, the French emperor, and who, like Adolf Hitler, brought death to millions to satisfy his greedy, power-mad, selfish ambitions for world conquest: "I die before my time, and my body will be given back to the earth. Such is the fate of him who has been called the great Napoleon. What an abyss between my deep misery and the eternal kingdom of Christ!” 9. Sir Francis Newport[The head of an English Atheist club to those gathered around his deathbed: ] "You need not tell me there is no God for I know there is one, and that I am in his presence! You need not tell me there is no hell. I feel myself already slipping. Wretches, cease your idle talk about there being hope for me! I know I am lost forever! Oh, that fire! Oh, the insufferable pangs of hell! …Oh, that I could lie for a thousand years upon the fire that is never quenched, to purchase the favor of God and be united to Him again. But it is a fruitless wish. Millions and millions of years will bring me no nearer the end of my torments than one poor hour. Oh, eternity, eternity forever and forever!, Oh, the insufferable pangs of Hell!” 10. Charles IX [/b]was the French king who urged on by his mother, gave the order for the massacre of the French Huguenots, in which 15,000 souls were slaughtered in Paris alone and 100,000 in other sections of France, for no other reason than that they loved Christ. The guilty king suffered miserably for years after that event. He finally died, bathed in blood bursting from his veins. To his physicians he said in his last hours: "Asleep or awake, I see the mangled forms of the Huguenots passing before me. They drop with blood. They point at their open wounds. Oh! That I had spared at least the little infants at the bosom! What blood! I know not where I am. How will all this end? What shall I do? I am lost forever! I know it. Oh, I have done wrong." 11. David Strauss, leading representative of German rationalism, after spending a lifetime erasing belief in God from the minds of others said: "My philosophy leaves me utterly forlorn! I feel like one caught in the merciless jaws of an automatic machine, not knowing at what time one of its great hammers may crush me!" 12. In a Newsweek interview with Svetlana Stalin, the daughter of Josef Stalin, she told of her father's death: "My father died a difficult and terrible death. . God grants an easy death only to the just. . At what seemed the very last moment he suddenly opened his eyes and cast a glance over everyone in the room. It was a terrible glance, insane or perhaps angry. . His left hand was raised, as though he were pointing to something above and bringing down a curse on us all. The gesture was full of menace. . The next moment he was dead." 13. Anton LeVey [/b][author of the Satanic Bible and high priest of the religion dedicated to the worship of Satan]. Some of his famous quotes are “There is a beast in man that needs to be exercised, not exorcised”. His dying words were "Oh my, oh my, what have I done, there is something very wrong…there is something very wrong… Beloved,compare this lasts words from atheists,with this last words,from this saint of God, Augustus Montague Toplady (1710-1778).This servant of God,, will ever be famous as the author of one of the most evangelical hymns of the eighteenth century, "Rock of Ages," which was first published in 1776. During the final illness, Toplady was greatly supported by the consolations of the gospel.Near his last, awaking from a sleep, he said:"Oh, what delights! Who can fathom the joy of the third heaven? The sky is clear, there is no cloud; come Lord Jesus, come quickly!" He died saying:"No mortal man can live after the glories which God has manifested to my soul." Only fools never learn from history,and it's amazing that even in our days, with all these facts on our fingertips, someone with a mind can devote his life to a delusion, and want everyone to know that there is no God, no-wonder the bible says ,"Only fools say in their hearts, "There is no God."[Psalm 14:1]. God bless you.
Highlights 00:00:24 : Introduction - Timothy Yusuf Chambers 00:06:30 : Opening Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis 00:32:02 : Opening Remarks - Lawrence Krauss 00:59:33 : Rebuttal - Hamza Tzortzis 01:14:28 : Rebuttal - Lawrence Krauss 01:22:43 : Summary Discussion 01:42:07 : Question & Answer Session 02:06:00 : Closing Remarks - Lawrence Krauss 02:07:50 : Closing Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis Narrated Anas bin Malik: The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Make things easy for the people, and do not make it difficult for them, and make them calm (with glad tidings) and do not repulse (them )"
@@ifuknewwhatiknew4893 it's the red hearing strategy thing that he discussed it's a way to manipulate and change words and stuff and he even said an example when he said it's like throwing a dead fish to a dog or sth like that idk remember the quote exactly but all i learned from the atheist dude is he came here to twist words from mr.hamza and the quran and just talk about nonsense for an hour(not to mention the whole incest thing which is so stupid and got him trapped in a box)
The comments here are very interesting, seeing how different people with different backgrounds can experience (see, hear) the exact same thing and yet interpret the same data completely differently according to their personal interests.
Kaplaars k Hamza commented on a physics book without knowing physics. He did not even know the relationship between Pi and the circumference of a circle. I do not think there is any grey area in this debate. Krauss insults Islam so Islamists will defend Hamza and criticise Krauss. Predictable and it still not make Hamza in anyway right. Anyone who says otherwise is either stupid or lying.
pinball1970 It is interesting to see how many people fail to see that the "logical" deduction method used by Hamza is in no way a reliable tool to come to a conclusion. Krauss tried to show him with examples how easy it is to come to faulty conclusions using the method of deduction. It is odd to me to see that as soon as people have no grasp on the explanations given by a scientist it is more logical that their specific God did it.
Kaplaars k Hamza is all words I have seen him on other debates and likes the sound of his own voice. He rarely says anything of substance. He likes words like epistemological then pats himself on the back happy in the fact that people on the whole do not know what it means.
pinball1970 The problem is that most people don't understand what he is saying. He uses meaningless sentences filled with intelligent sounding words. However since he is "defending" a religion the followers of this religion think he is actually making logical and intelligent statements even though they have no clue what he just said. In my opinion someone who resorts to these kinds of phrases and wording is afraid that it will become clear to everyone that his claims are based on nothing. Dr. Krauss tried to explain his position, and showed the errors of Hamza's "reasoning",by using examples while trying to steer away from jargon. I wonder which one of the two is more knowledgeable?
00:28 Debate on Islam and Atheism: Which is More Reasonable? 10:18 The universe had a beginning and was created by something uncreated. 26:24 The Qur'an is considered a miracle due to its literary form beyond the scope of the Arabic language. 33:25 Islam is not a special religion and atheism is not a belief system. 47:26 Causation and the beginning of time are complex topics in physics. 55:17 Discussion on punishment for questioning God's existence and homosexuality in Islam 1:08:59 Discussion on morality and ethics from an Islamic perspective 1:16:33 Criticism of religious beliefs and the importance of science 1:31:56 Discussion on spirit, existence, and restrictions in religion 1:39:29 The universe began 14.72 billion years ago and the best explanation is that it came out of nowhere. 00:05 The debate discusses the use of empirical and deductive arguments in science. 2:02:41 Discussion on gender equality and respecting personal choices
00:28 Atheism, since it's lack of belief in ridiculous god claims. 10:18 Not even a creation independent from gods has been demonstrated. 26:24 The quran is just a book with many flaws. Nothing special about that. 33:25 True. 47:26 Yes. And a god outside of time seems ridiculous. He would exist for zero seconds. That's one way to describe things that don't exist. 55:17 Infinite punishments for finite "crimes" which shouldn't be considered as crimes is extremely unjust. Fantasy Allah claims that Homosexuality is a bad thing. Turns out it is not. 1:08:59 Objective morality like Islam usually promotes it doesn't exist, it's always subjective. A muslim following some supposed god's orders isn't acting morally anyways. It's simply obedience to the rules of some dictator. 1:16:33 Even non-violent religions are bad since they teach people to believe in nonsense based on nothing. This can lead to conspiracy theories because of bad standards of evidence. 1:31:56 Whatever terms like "spirit" even mean. And there are lots of unnecessary restrictions in religion. 1:39:29 If it even "came" in the first place. 00:05 What matters is good evidence to support the premises of an argument. Muslims don't have that. 2:02:41 Gender equality doesn't exist in Islam. Another reason to never look at it again. Lots of ex-muslims would risk their lives if they would openly express their apostasy. Grave consequences in their families are the norm. Allah threatening people with his ridiculous hell is one of the worst forms of compulsion in religion. Still muslims claim that there is no compulsion.
@@joerdim please understand its all about bias. Much of the time there is no clear winner between muslims and athiests unless one of them talks over the other person. Also, many incredible things happen in peoples lives that cannot be explained without god. I dont really need to list any examples. I should also mention you should see the other side of things. You probably watch athiests bringing down religions. Watch the other side where educated muslims go and refute these claims quite well. Islam is more special than other religions in my opinion, because the prophet pbuh was illiterate and even if he had co authors its hard to be shakespeare in arabia where most people were illiterate and no one was a great writer. These are my claims and beliefs if you want to believe in athiesm then go ahead.
@@endlessnutella8612 No, it's not all about bias. It's about presenting good evidence to support your claims. Muslims apologists are horrendously bad, even worse than Christian apologists. That's absolute nonsense. Tell me about one of these "incredible things" that cannot be explained without a god. Oh, you really do need to list an example. Lol. And how is a god even a candidate explanation as we have zero evidence for gods? Dude, you cannot even prove that Muhammad was illiterate. And you cannot even prove that Muhammad came up with the quran. This is how bad this is. And your claims get even worse when especially muslim apologists in contrast to you like to paint a picture that in arabia back then there was like the biggest center of poetry on earth. Also wrong, atheism is not a belief. This is so bad...
@@endlessnutella8612 1) No, muslims just don't have good arguments. This is why no one should be convinced that islam is true. 2) Some god isn't an explanation for anything until there is evidence for gods. You better give an example. 3) No, I watch muslim, christian and atheist content. Muslim apologists are even worse than christian apologists. And that's saying much. 4) Islam isn't special at all. The scripture is dull and disgusting. Prove that he actually was illiterate. Good luck. And why does it matter if he had scribes? Especially in arabia poetry was a relatively big thing, they pretty much didn't produce anything else. 6) Wrong again. Atheism is not a belief. It's lack of belief.
I used to believe that there is no God, no Creator, etc. I was convinced of this because of all the injustice I had seen and experienced, how could a Creator create something so huge and powerful and let it run wild. I saw religion as emotional blind faith, but even then from my very basic and prejudiced knowledge of Islaam, I saw some morality in it, some guidance, which I had spent 15 years looking for elsewhere, no one, not even Muslims themselves (from my limited experience) had tried to tell me the truth, I saw everyone just chasing material wealth and comfort sometimes under the guise of religion. I was too hurt and unhealthy to be a part of the might is right system, God knows I tried, so I set out on my journey of creating God. An Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) that'd watch over the entire planet and establish justice. That was a huge undertaking, I had to gain knowledge from a vast array of fields. This led me to a lot of new challenges, modeling something on human Intelligence with justice and benevolence as its driver started to open my eyes to the reality we're trapped inside. Asking questions like when do we intervene in a situation that according to our predictions is about to lead to violence? what about triggers and stimuli that lead to violence... do we work to reduce them or would that be going to far? and there were the question of rights, I believed strongly that everyone had the right to privacy, but wasn't this for their own good, and the greater good. this and many many other reflections led me very slowly and steadily to submitting my will to the Unseen Creator over a period of several years of sharp learning curves and intuitive realizations. Replicating speech, sight, hearing, decision making, learning, rationality, self-analysis, ... was more than enough to help me realize that this huge intelligently designed universe was not without an extremely Powerful Designer. I was never emotional, that was actually one of the things people would criticize me about. I was seen as a detached & silent rebel. After Islaam, alhumdulillah, I went through a metamorphosis in manners, body language and knowledge. A world of knowledge opened up to me and I'm still learning.
@@chrischow9085 God doesnt really mean a creature or something like that. The way the universe works, the way everything sets into place, it only makes sense if a creator existed. But creator is a wide term the creator can just be something in a higher dimension, something that guides the progress of the universe. Now what religion is an idea about the nature of that creator, maybe a God in haven, maybe odin in asgard, etc. But there is something thats guiding the progress of the universe from its genesis and whatever that is, its God. Now we can keep arguing about its nature all day and we will never reach anywhere. Tbh as a physics and maths student all i wish for is to someday prove God with maths XD.
Exactly Krauss went on a random arrogant tangent filled with fallacies of all kinds since he knew he couldn't challenge Hamza and Islam's claims/evidence.
Zem GoldLine The evidence of the miraculous,linguistic,inimitable nature of the Quran. And the only possibilities of the Prophet Muhammad, either liar/deluded or speaking the truth. And we can deduce from his life,history,events,psychological profile,prophecies,success against all impossible odds and teachings/positive impact that he was indeed a truthful Prophet of God. And also caused the Islamic Golden age that caused the the renaissance and enlightenment period giving rise to all these advancements/technology/knowledge . And creation of Oxford university too.
@@Fatima_33 The tricks they generally pull is "what if", "might be" "could be" should be"... Man! We have got families to feed in this age of Capitalism and you are talking about the could-bes and the should-bes. I would rather take a word of wisdom even if the challenged its divinity than a confused set of statements that never give a certain answer and are a lifelong quest finding the found. We have got bigger and better things to do in the world.
Me. And still embarrassed by the cheering muslim majority audience which had no idea what's going on, just like the vast majority of the muslims in the comment section.
@Shinobi gamer Lol Shinobi leave him be. Allah SWT knows best, and knows those whose heart's are sealed. We can only know Allah better, and please him in this dunya. All will be made clear in the akhira.
As a born Christian (currently agnostic - but I lean Abrahamic meaning I view all scriptures that claim Abrahamic origins as potentially true and from God) who often watches these sort of debates - I think its quite obvious that Krauss danced around responding to the argument made by Hamza (one can only assume because he had no valid counter to offer up outside of his opinion based off of his personal worldview and knowledge). Krauss was intentionally rude and disrespectful while claiming his intent was not to offend people only to disagree with their ideas. If that were true he would have chosen his words - which vI know he is well capable of doing - more wisely. Its not what he is saying but how he is saying it at times that is the problem. Then he takes offense when Hamza says things regarding America in a certain way - what a double standard! He got up tot he podium and 1. made almost no response to the argument that Hamza offered up 2. He then began to take sensationalized perspectives regarding beliefs of Muslims to try and back Hamza into a corner - which felt was an attempt to say "see! this is Gods creation - why would God create something this way just to call it a sin?". The problem with that is that All 3 Abrahamic scriptures have very reasonable answers to that question - does Krauss think he is the first to raise this? His ignorance of the religion coming into this debate was absolutely insulting and just showed his outrageous arrogance regarding his own worldview and knowledge. I would choose to be a part of Hamza's community over someone like Krauss any day of the week. To call himself an educator is laughable.....he doesn't want to influence discussion and critical thinking - what he actually does is first deflect by using criticism that is practically irrelevant to the topic at hand and then when all else fails completely avoid the theme of the discussion altogether - highjacking it to take it in his own direction in order to control the narrative.
You should look into islam sister as its the most preserved abrahamic religion and makes sense with only one true all knowing God with no partners unlike for e.g christianity with the whole idea of the trinity.
Very well said! Hamza seemed more educated than Krauss. A professor shouldn't be acting this way, especially when invited to speak. I would also humbly suggest you the RUclips channel, The Deen Show, which has interviews with former Christians and Jews (& sometimes atheists). I personally loved it and hope the same for you.
Six ways to earn good deeds even after death: 1. Give a copy of Qur’an to someone. Each time one reads from it, you gain. 2. Donate a wheelchair to a hospital. Each time a sick or injured person uses it, you gain. 3. Participate in the building a Masjid. Every time a person uses it to worship Allah (SWT), you gain. 4. Build a well or place a water cooler in a public place. Every time somebody drinks from it, you gain. 5. Plant a tree. whenever a person or animal sits in its shade or eats from it, you gain 6. And the easiest of all, share this message with other people. May Allah (SWT) bless you all and grant you Jannah, inshallah
Gunther Vincent Yes. You can do all of these things when you’re alive of course. But when you die, you can not take anything with you. Therefore all you have to show for yourself is your deeds. Try to do things that have a long and positive impact on the world continuously even after you’re in the grave and awaiting judgement. Your good deeds will continue to stack even after you’re gone inshallah.
Gunther Vincent Oh sorry brother. I didn’t come here to debate. Just a friendly advice to Muslims or anyone who finds interest in the topic. May Allah grant you Hidayah and inshallah you will be led down the right path.
Quran 52.35-36 “Or were they created by nothing, or were they the creators [of themselves]? Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.”
@Gunther Vincent 1- Islam doesn't tell you to kill all nonbeliever's. That's BS. 2- you can't as an atheist say that it's wrong. Because you don't have a moral compass. + Why don't you take this killing as a way to survival ? I mean killing those who oppose me means that there is more resources for me.
After 1 hour and 9 minutes Mr. Krauss said "i am only asking because i want to learn." So saying "everything you said is crap or nonsense" is called "asking" ?
@@luqman2626 Hamza is definitley a better at debates but it doesnt mean he is correct. I would love to see him debate another atheist that can have better composure
I saw this whole debate, Mr. L Krauss was less debater and more lecturer, I think he couldn't convince to even give his initial statement. I really very much impressed from Mr. Hamza God bless him for his penitents
gods blessings are nice but the truth is more important like with this Covid, god is not going to save us, we need scientists now and THEIR truth that is reality and Hamza ignoring reality is being extremely impolite and disrespectful debates are not fights about lies, they should be about facts
@@joerdim first of all it addresses the identity question very well, it is purpose oriented religion, it desciplines your life, it gives you a very warmth community but puts individual responsibility to only one God, it comes with rich history of Sufism and philosophy. I find it much useful than following political ideologies.
@@Islamicepistemology This has nothing to do with the question what convinced you that Islam is true. You answered why you think Islam is useful to you. Also, religion is not necessary to discipline one's life or get a warm community. And why would anybody need individual responsibility to one god? Rich history you can also find pretty much everywhere. And why is a rich history important? Philosophical thoughts you can also dig into without following a religion.
@@joerdim I find islamic metaphysics much relatable to me than Western platonism. The modernity of west driven by materialism has exhausted me. I find islam to be the only pure monothestic religion which stands firm on philosophical ground.
@Sabir When you say name of prophet Muhammad (SAWW) you praise Him and His family (ahlul bayt) prophet said Ali is also my ahlul bayt. Ahlul Bayt >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sahabi Eventhough, Both are righteous but ahlul bayt is something else espiecally first caliph and imam Imam Ali (as)
His rudeness is the perfect example of why the faithful deem atheism as sinful. Atheism is NOT the disbelief of there being a God. Atheism is a state of DENIAL and RIDICULE, not of true disbelief.
@@serviogaming5169 and yeah atheism is disbelief in god, we criticize the idea of god because it discourages people for trying to learn and because it has no evidence supporting it, and tbh Islam says alot of evil stuff and scientific illiterate stuff that's why anti theists think it's bad (anti theists are NOT all atheists)
If you listen to tsorzis opening statements he was actually quite rude but he was very subtle, it was passive aggressive with a smile. Add to that Krauss was pissed off even before this debate started because the men and women where seperated in the audience and he refused to take part unless it was changed. Krauss ruffled his feathers so you could see tsorzis true colours. Tsorzis even had to remind himself to calm down when his mask dropped.
Krauss interrupts all the time! I am an atheist but is not polite and he doesn’t let Hamza end his argument. I was interested in listening to his explanations but Krauss doesn’t let him finish anything.
He’s simply not allowing Hamza to do what almost every single advocate of religion does, which is pontificate about a bunch of baseless concepts before pinning the opponent with an impossible question, made so by the fact that you can’t answer nonsense with sense and make sense, you can only erase it which is not the point of the debate. It’s a cheap advantage you have when your entire argument is based off of made up things that are so subjective you can alter them whenever needed to suit you. As expected, Hamza starts strong with a rehearsed sermon which he spared no punches inserting condescending puns and pointedly religious deceitfully innocuous phrases, yet falters when countered with a similar biting “tough love” presentation. Hamza fizzles out because he has nothing to pull from but stories, so when he can’t gain momentum by playing the “friendly innocent”, he’s got nothing else to rebuttal with.
It is typical of an atheists. If I have a student I'd rather him not to raise hands during the lecture & save it up for later bc most probably his query is gonna get solved after listening to the lecture.But atheists would not let you complete your explaination for they know it's gonna start making sense.
@@Brandon-ml2zw lol how arrogant of you , regardless of arguments krauss should be able to act with respect and guess what he didn't. hamza complete dismantle everything krauss had to say if anything krauss is clearly not well verse in philosophy
Nobody is fooled by all of these comments by Muslims that all follow the same formula and begin with "I'm an atheist but [Muslim apologist] was correct about everything".
the patience of hamza left me speeachless, i would have lost it. but he kept so calm and still talked with so much respect. lord please give me a husband like him i pray for someone so respectful, patience understanding brilliant. his wife should be so proud of him. bless this man
What an amazing debate. Really made me rethink a lot of things. Over the years I have been trying my best to remove my prejudices and stand on the other end: to understand the people whose views oppose. May I unlearn arrogance which I am susceptible to sometimes. May I be so tolerant that I could reason with clarity. For we are here for a short time and there is so much to learn.
I’m an atheist, but Krauss’ atitudes during this debate was terrible. Even though I agree that someone’s attitude towards a subject has no bearing over the truth of a claim, Hamza did a greater job at interacting with the audience and presenting his perspective in more polite manner. I hope Krauss can learn from this experience and improve his debating skills, cause this was just hard to watch, he came off as the angry and arrogant atheist, something most of us atheists have been trying to get away from.
I dont think it was terrible (i am a staunch muslim) i think prof krauss's frustration was genuine. The debate format wasnt optimized enough in my opinion. I am a muslim who believes in islam but i accept that it takes a certain convincing to do so, and to a HIGHLY reputed professor like dr. krauss? I think the format should be in a very different manner. However I do wish such a debate should be there. Firstly i think proof of islam can be debated in MANY ways. For example, scientifically, mathematically, logically, literally, ontologically, historically etc. We need to keep it focused. Secondly, after keeping it focused to one discipline and one discipline alone (since i believe that since Allah is true, i believe that Allah's evidence always overpowers other evidences) we need to get professors in that area. And not just any professors, top professors in the world. Thirdly, you have to figure out which aspect of religion you are arguing. Islam will not speak of christianity and vice versa. If it is religion vs athiesm we need to figure out which religion. Fourthly, we need to document every statement according to laws of the subject. For instance, if i say something like i believe in islam due to the historical facts and if i give a 3 minute lecture on the proof of it, my statement should be there to present on some screen. One line statement. Otherwise word picking will occur and no matter how good a professor is, he is human and emotions will come and it is our job as people of science to come to a conclusion while negating human emotion as much as we can. Fifthly, There should be no timelimit. This is not a debate of today and can not really be concluded like that. Sixthly, every statement that is presented must be backed by some sort of evidence (suggesting REALLY high levels of scholars). If someone negates athiestic views based on ontological argument there must be atleast a google search on the worldly accepted definition and AXIOMS of ontological argument and there should be a THIRD party discussion that agrees it. Seventhly, this can not be done in one video or something because it will take DAYS and stuff but i think it is required. Athiests believe that religion is the cause of violence and i believe intolerance is the cause of violence and i think since violence is a HUGE problem of today's world, we must come together as different religions to figure out a solution. You cant coexist like that if there are extremists everywhere. To make things better we need such dialogues. Lastly i think there should be many teams having different roles including a third party that VALIDATES the facts these guys give.
@@MrCuteguylol I agree that his frustration was genuine, but my problem is not with his sincerity towards how he feels, it’s with how he handled himself becoming very emotional during the debate. That’s not a good sign in any intellectual debate, as the truth about reality has no bearing to your feelings and should be presented with good arguments and evidences rather than Ad Hominem and Straw-manning (which both debaters actually did to each other, but Krauss was very rude while Hamza was doing it more for the laughs). When it comes to convincing, it’s not as complicated as many people make it be. What a lot of these debates do is talk about philosophical arguments for a God, which to some theists, not all, can be misconstrued as evidence, while for most atheists, philosophy, while being a very useful epistemological tool, to be proven or show with a highly probability of being a reality must follow some method to be verified in its validity. The thing is, the best method most skeptics trust is the scientific method, rather than the methods many theists have claimed to use to reach their conclusions, since to us, are methods that can be used to reach other conclusions, demonstrating that it’s not a good method. For example, here are some methods I’ve seen used by some Christians to prove that their God is the real one: “faith, revelation, holy text, philosophy, personal experience, historical events”. All of these examples can also be used to reach any other religion or any other belief system, ones that may very well contradict each other. Now, to discern who is right and who is wrong, the scientific method is the best tool for the job, one that is based purely on deducing the facts of reality by verifiable experiments by postulating predictions on what we might find in the scenario the hypothesis is correct, and if the findings is constant with the predictions made, it can become a theory, the highest awarded rank to an explanation for a phenomenon in science. I believe that if any theist wants to convince a skeptic (not just an atheist, many atheists aren’t skeptics, but most are) is presenting the type of scientific evidence I said. Philosophy, Math, History, while being useful tools, aren’t good enough for knowing and understanding a a concept like “God”. There are many branches of philosophy that contradict each other, there are concepts in Math that are impossible, like irrational numbers and history, while correct at many times, is a hard method to determine what was true in the past, certainly getting it wrong in many stances because of how hard it is to very some events. I agree with most of what you said in how debates should be organized and conducted to maximize efficiency in the debate. I’ll even go as far as to say that committing argumentation fallacies should always be noted and understood between debaters, as many don’t always address them, especially for the audience to understand why that argument show fallacious reasoning behind it. There is no point in having debates where the debaters will be: dishonest, rude, dodge arguments/question, misrepresent the other, assert claims without providing evidence, etc. Any platform and debaters that can minimize these, in my view, independently on their views, will be a lot more productive.
Exactlyyyy!!!! totally agreed with you. However, no matter how impossible this may seem, its equally necessary. Because coexistence will occur and people will fight against each other unless there is some sort of representation.
I am sorry but the Muslim speaker has been just as condescending but he was more playing to his crowd. It is easy to argue out of a religious perspective because you can always retrude yourself in a moral high-ground. Science isn't moral but factual, so moral argument are totally sensless to have. Also his constant Arabic input in between are just terribly distracting and derailing for any non-muslim listener.
@@bodo887 Both were condescending in how I see it, but Hamza played it off a lot better. I don’t think neither of them ended up being good debaters. However, since I’m an atheist and I see that this position is the best position to be in, I expect that the debater defending this doesn’t do it with ad Hominems and overall bad explanations and reasoning like Krauss did. My expectations for the atheists are much higher precisely because i believe they are in the more reasonable perspective, it’s the reason I enjoy Matt Dillahunty’s debates a lot, as he not only understand religions very well in general, he knows about argumentation fallacies, which every debater should have at least a basic understanding of, which Krauss and Hamza lacked. Not saying I would have done better then Krauss, but there were multiple moments I would have presented something completely different than what he decided to present to counter arguments. Look at how off guard he was with the “incest” morality, he should be more prepared to defend his opinion, even if it is taboo. He used an argumentation that it is ok, but the chances of having children with mental disabilities is high. Even though his statement about it is true, this is bad reasoning at its core, since he implies that a relationship necessarily needs to end in reproduction, which isn’t the case, as we can obviously see with homosexual/assexual couples. It’s also bad because it would imply that couples with genetical mental disabilities shouldn’t reproduce, which is a complicated subject, since you’re talking about taking away someone’s basic right, like having a child, because of a disorder. I agree with him that two consenting adults that happen to be close family should have the freedom to decide what they want. It’s none of my business if this is what they want for their life, that’s probably what he thinks as well. The reason for this is because my moral judgement parts on the notion that your freedom cannot come in conflict with the collective freedom. Two adults in love that want to be together doesn’t harm anyone, so it should be a right, even if it’s looked upon as wrong or unnatural by our culture and upbringing. He should have been more prepared for this debate and more prepared to deal with his own emotions. In many people’s minds that don’t know many atheists, he’s up there representing who an atheist is. Hamza used Krauss’ anger to his own advantage and made atheists look like they are angry and unreasonable, which causes the atheist community more harm than good.
As Mr Krauss came into the debate so confidently I expected something of a good fight. Hamza sat him down without needing to compromise on his modesty and humbleness. Embarrassing
@Jimmi K I disagree - there are plenty of islamic scholars who, while I don't agree with their ideas, are much more honest interlocutors than Hamza. It was shocking to watch him commit all kinds of rhetorical errors, and then turn around and accuse Dr. Krauss of the very things he was doing.
Back when i was an atheist i used to think pple like kraus were geniuses. Dawkins, hitchens. But alhamdillah when i re-found my faith in the truth i see how arrogant, ideological, irrational and dogmatic these people are. I came to realize my admiration for these people was based purely on them “owning” people of faith which fed an insecurity i had which made me feel good about thinking i was intellectually superior to 7 biilion people. Hamdillah for choosing me to come back to Islam. SubhanAllah may he guide whom he wills.
Well, you are obviously not intellectually superior to 7 billion people. Such much is clear. What's your definition of faith and why do you now think thst Allah actually exists?
@@joerdim Thats why I said "THINKING I was intelectually superior". So i may not be intectually superior to 7 billion people, but to you, who cant even read well, I am. Faith is having complete conviction in something. I wouldnt call it "belief" it is knowing that the Quran is from Allah and no one else. And the reason for that is because it is prophetic in history, science, and future events, all of which at the time could not have been known by anything less than the creator. Why do you think he doesnt?
@@Stonnin No, dude, I was making an additional statement. You thought you were, I know you weren't. What do you mean by full conviction? 100% certainty or simply that you are convinced? Knowledge is a subset to belief, so when you know then you automatically also believe. Show me a so-called prophecy with a pinpoint time designation and a message that cannot be interpreted in another way in the quran and what it has to do with a god. Go! I never said he doesn't. Are you trying to dishonestly strawman me?
People do this all the time. It's just human nature, jumping from one dogma to another. We have to live with a belief system. I've read just as many comments of people saying the same people Dawkins, Hitchens pulled them out of their dogmatic religions.
Yusuf Altug if you start arguing not for the validity of your viewpoint but rather just to push your viewpoint you become bias and people will call you out on that. When you become bias you will ignore opposite reason to push your reason and people will call out that flaw.
@@easy5989 the moment you come to know that were wrong just admit it. when you become this kind of person no one can overpower you because you never get disappointed. its actually being true to yourself
@@MKermy umm did you see the video? I think you should do your research first and don't believe what anyone tells you about a specific belief without researching it.
@@bo5235 ah yes I'm not doing my research I was a muslim for most of my life until i left the horrible religion took months of research before I actually left
@@MKermy "horrible" yeah ok Well I'm going to assume the best and say that Maybe you have had contradictions between traditions and culture and the actual religion and it's rulings,maybe you didn't reaserch in a right way or you didn't ask scholars because i heard about a lot of people who act as if they've left islam and they were not even Muslims in the first place. And if we were talking in real life I would've asked you how many rakaas is in fajr or asr but because we are talking on the internet you could easily search it. I hope you're happy and comfortable with your life and i hope god forgives you and shows you the right path.
@@lly_09 Lol, I'm not arguing, just telling him not to say mean stuff to other people when he can't do what he's trying to correct them for. (this makes like little to no sense but u get what I mean)
Its smug self assurance every Muslim/ middle eastern person I've met thinks that everyone around them is a filthy dog and that only they have the right to paradise
Hamza sure doesn’t. He’s a sophist and really uses rhetorical arguments. So did Krauss tho, almost every time he started a new point. But Krauss was genuinely involved in the discussion here and there, especially with the comebacks.
That's the thing with the word intellectuality everyone can perceive it differently. To me being intellectual is being objective wich Muslim scholars try to be but can't because they follow a man made religion.
@@chrischow9085 you're lying or you've been lied to if you really believe that lmao. For centuries and centuries, his worst of enemies didn't even conjure up these lies, doesn't that say a lot chris😂, go ahead and do your research or believe these lies, you know what they say " ignorance is bliss"
It’s amazing how Hamza sat Krauss down in the second round. krauss thought he could bag the debate but damn Hamza is intelligent and logical.. I’ve been watching a lot of debates on atheism vs islam - and it appears that atheist speakers always don’t do self study on the opponent belief and would just make ignorant statements and waited for opponents to educate them.
A New Muslim Alhamdulillah from Atheism... The Reason was Atheism has No Set of Rules to Live Live peacefully with mental satisfaction... Alhamdulillah Allah selected Me
It’s easy to criticise Kraus for his attitude but it’s very hard to have a proper debate in a room full of people less intelligent. You’ll never win the argument and always be seen as the fool. Put Humza in a room of physicists and see how frustrated he get.
@@sbsjdahxxbbsbsbdjsjs8368 is he the one who is believing in a god that has not been proven and there is absolutely no proof that God exists. Is he the one that is uneducated or is it you who is wrongly educated. People like you have been brainwashed by everyone in your community to force you to believe that God exists. And islamic religion is by no means a peaceful religion. In nearly half the islamic countries, you are executed for being an atheist.
Leena Khaneja my guy the main most strict country which is Saudi Arabia which in fact is where Islam originated allows atheists and any other religion to be accepted equally into they society. The Quran even mentions that disbelievers in Islam should not have any conflict with believers since all we are trying to do is to invite to Islam we will not have any conflict with the disbelievers and should be minding our own business unless if we are here to promote, defend ourselves or invite someone to Islam it says in Surat al kaferoon, in fact there are more unmuslim countries that are putting unhuman laws and punishments into their law, such as North Korea. The fact that you immediately assume that we are uneducated because we have a belief is just wrong and stupid tbh.
but he is most disrespectful and arrogant not gentle at all in the real world, people who use lies are rude, and speaking facts and truth is respectful, not the other way around islam is the opposite of reality, and Hamza is most annoying and disrespectful, defending his beliefs as if they are facts
@H H no, I do not HAVE to lie, I told you and explained that so why do you have to lie about me? why do YOU need lies? do you also worship that child raping pig?
As a previous atheist I used to Admire Lawerence , Sagan, and Hawkins. After reverting March 2023 I realized all those books I used to read wasn’t science because they were purely speculative they would tell you science then right after they show you the HOW they remind you their interpretation is their view on God. No connection between the two but if u say it right afterwards after people are blown with the work of the creator peoples brain will auto pair the two things together.
@@MaturingMinds Wtf is this gibberish? Is there any coherent point in this? Btw, "reverting" is a nonsense term which outs you as someone who doesn't know what he is talking about.
@@kaiza6467 you prove my point with your statement, "I can't prove." Just because YOU can't prove something or experience something doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. You cannot began to comprehend the grand design of this universe and the creature that are in it. Remember, science "discover" new things all the time. Doesn't mean that those things just appear or exist upon human discovery.
panda berries you’re missing my point. It isn’t scientific at all to just assume things exist just because you can’t prove they don’t exist. Because it’s impossible to prove a negative.
@@kaiza6467 Hamza already explained that he's not talking science. He was talking deduction and logic, abstract views of the universe that everyone can concur to without proof. 1+1=2 full stop
Ryuga Law if panda was just making a random, non-religious statement that “you can’t know everything in the universe” then sure, I think that’s true. But if you were to use the fact that we don’t know everything as a reason to imply there IS a “grand designer”, then that logic is flawed. Because you could come up with an infinite number of possible creator beings, like my Flying Spaghetti Monster example, presuppose it designed everything and the argument would be the same. “You can’t know everything, therefor you can’t prove the creator being from MY religion designed the entire universe.” That’s not how logic works. The time to believe something is when there is sufficient reason to.
As soon as the professor started talking made this really hard to watch. Having a difference of opinion is fine, it happens but his attitude was quite frankly pathetic and expected better.
It’s Kraus...that’s his personality. He’s a professor first, so he doesn’t try to make friends, just tries to stick to the facts and gets angry quickly when someone is avoiding obvious facts. He won’t win any personally contests..
"Let's allow that time exists outside of the universe. Given the laws of nature, then the universe can and will spontaneously come into existence!" That line has to be the most unscientific statement ever uttered by a practising scientist!
Yes and no. The idea of time existing 'outside of the universe' and being an idea that we might 'allow' is effectively a statement of faith, ironically, which doesn't exactly help his argument. What's more useful is the idea that the laws of our universe also imply the existence of non-laws - they have to, or the laws won't work. For example, 'light travels at 186,000 miles per second' must also also mean that 'light does not travel at 185,999 miles per second' i.e. such laws are really about what can't happen, not what can happen. In a situation that's 'pre-universe' (a slightly misleading idea since time won't exist in such a situation, but let's work with it for now) there are no laws saying what can't happen, so the spontaneous creation of a universe is perfectly allowable - and quite possibly inevitable.
@@zaxzaxx4561 exactly 💯 You see, he based his whole argument off an unproven premise , namely..." ... let's pretend that time exists outside of the universe..." And then continues to argue with passion from then on. So ridiculous, don't you think so?
@@ismailhamza5219 Like I said, it sounds like a statement of faith. I would define all statements of faith as unproven premises. He presumably has a problem conceiving of a situation in which time doesn't exist, which is a significant - but not insuperable - mental obstacle.
@@endlessnutella8612 Not so. Faith means the acceptance of a statement with no evidence to support it. Atheism entails a willingness to take genuine, incontrovertible evidence into account that may contradict it. Faith does not.
@Denzo Dridz when people get frustrated they get emotional. Nothing wrong with his arguments, it was the delivery that was the problem and in a debate like this for most watching, they pay more attention to how something is said rather than what was said.
@Denzo Dridz there is no point and it hurts the argument he's trying to make. People stop listening to the words you're trying to say once you become emotional and condescending.
@Denzo Dridz i didn't think it was a very good debate. I felt the basis of tzortzis argument was flawed but more articulate while I agree with Krause's point of view, he could've presented his ideas more diplomatically.
He is not Greek anymore. The Greek community doesn't accept muslims at all. By converting to Islam, he is now on the other side of the fence. Real Greeks are with the West. He made a choice, now he is out.
claiming your god knows best is the most arrogant claim ever I think it's YOUR arrogance that created your hatred do you think this alla Hamza believes in is a god?
@@anaarkadievna ...compared to anyone.... Gods can comfort people, gods can inspire people and gods can create religious feelings but there never was a god who gave us any knowledge we didn't have already. Science is about knowledge, gods are about beliefs, and religious people who can not understand or accept that are most arrogant without any reason. Not one god knows how to create an youtube account, so claiming that "god is a creator" of "god knows" is ignorance and arrogance. Krauss understands that well.
@@anaarkadievna If I punch you in the face, will you feel pain? Yes... Will you like that? No... Is it best for me to punch everyone around in the face? No because everyone will eventually hate me for creating pain to everyone and I would be rejected by other and I would understand that doing that is bad... Eventually, the people will invent a word to define a bad dehavior... this word will evolve and eventually will be: immoral. No need any religious crap to understand that... just a fucking brain, a little of judgment and rationality. You have none of them...
When Professor Krauss started talking, sounded like he was so upset that he just rambled on "nonsense". I was hoping to understand Atheism, but he was too busy calling Islam nonsense.
This verse explains the reason for the existence of atheists. Allah said I will turn away from My signs those who are arrogant upon the earth without right; and if they should see every sign, they will not believe in it. And if they see the way of consciousness, they will not adopt it as a way; but if they see the way of error, they will adopt it as a way. That is because they have denied Our signs and they were heedless of them. Surah Al-Araf Full Ayah 146
This is unfair. I agree, most people who are atheists just wanna folkow their desires but there are some who genuinely wanna understand and learn, not to mention they study philosophy, theology and even religion to want to know God but arent convinced (with certainty) in the end. Isnt it unfair for Allah to deny his signs to a man who is actively looking and i also have to admit that the only way Allah's signs can be accepted is if you ignore your reasoning and have blind faith (which has its own merits and demerits)
@@joerdimThe Qur’an dealt with hundreds of scientific topics, which contradicted the prevailing science at the time. Now there is not a single scientific error, and there are still many
*The more I wanted to understand comparative religion and beliefs the more I felt that intelligence and truthfulness are only required to revert in islam from any other beliefs*
@Jimmi K you can debate me about Islam...❤️ Let's have a discussion. Let's See who's right. I am confident about my religion.😏 Because I was in lot of atheist groups in fb.😊 I faced their questions and researched them.😶 Now in a right track.🙏 You can have some discussions with me.😊 I can challenge you.❤️
Chains of religion.. No ones chained to religion.. God himself gave us free will.. Anyone is free to be a idiot.. But they wouldn't enjoy jannah with us.. People just want reason to not have judgement for the evil way of life they live.. They would love that
Herald Orome now who’s the idiot for not knowing what he’s saying or knows how to answer . So try hard Heraldo ! Try hard to answer? Why he have no choice?
"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it? If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?" -Sam Harris
@@jiukam Read the Quran in Arabic , not translation. Do your research about the background of each verse, and use authentic explanations by scholars to understand them (do NOT listen to random RUclips videos or comments)
@@mr.o8539 Of course he was, but he run the risk of turning them off. Remember; these are people that alreadt believe they are morally superior. That an atheist can't be a good person. But he can only be who he is I suppose. Dawkins is also hopeless in this regard, same with Harris and Hitchens (R.I.P.). I like them all alot, but I think someone like Tyson would've done alot better job at convincing muslims that are sitting on the fence between faith and reason.
@@viperracing2889 not everyone has the same temperament. Krauss doesn't mind offending people if he is saying what is correct. This was a debate, but Krauss refused to debate because he wanted to address all the fallacies made by Hamza, trust me bro as an atheist who lives in secret in a Muslim majority country, these people deserve no sympathy, we are talking about people who not only thing atheists can't be good people, but that death is the only way to deal with atheists. If Hamza and the moderator had their way, they'd kill Krauss for his blasphemy.
Everything you mentioned is just a lie I am a Muslim and I had three classmates who were atheists who left Islam And I live in Morocco I was discussing with them, but I did not insult or harm them in any way, and my treatment with them was normal and all the people treated them normally. It is amazing how a person can say such a thing about his father, his mother, his brothers, his family and his people What is this malice and hatred in your heart for Muslims and you do not want them to hate you? Do you think that the West is a good society more than Islamic societies?
This debate was fantastic. The only downside, in my humble opinion, was the very poor host of this program who was putting his own entrenchment, by his acts and his gestures and his words, into the discussion between these two persons, while during any debates, regardless of the topic, the host should be neutral.
Actually he was very fairly neutral, i didn't notice anything that's unneutral with him. And i was focusing on the person who talks, the ideas, the arguments, and not the host who will change nothing in fact. So it's only your respected personal perception.
Trying to prove the absolute existence of God in a laboratory using mathematics and science is a fool's errand. This is crystal clear after watching this video, and Prof. Krauss did say that himself more than once throughout the debate. Personally, I'm a believer in God, not because I'm able to prove his existence with pure mathematics or quantum physics, but simply by looking at my life and the lives or those around me. If there's no God then this life is pointless, and no matter how much money you make, or how much knowledge you gain, it wouldn't make any difference because one day you're gonna die and you wont take any of that with you. So to me, there must be some other purpose for our existence, a purpose I couldn't find elsewhere but in faith and the belief in God. Some other things that make me think there must be a purpose for our lives is the fact that we "humans" are the only sapient species living on the only life-sustaining planet in this whole enormous universe. Kinda makes me wonder why? is it really just a coincidence?
Even with no god or life after death, what you do in life does matter. You don't have to keep something forever to be able to enjoy that thing while you have it. Also, do you seriously think that you'll take your money with you after you die? What are you gonna use it for? Are you really that selfish?
***** if u leave in Islam it's consider apostasy and there is death threat or u can get killed for leaving Islam. Muslims wants there religion to spread in Western countries but they don't recognize or approved atheist, agnostic or secularist or other religion in Islamic countries what a double standard. In Egypt a guy name Karim Ashraf Mohamed al-Banna left Islam recently now he is jail for three years for leaving Islam. In Sudan a women name Meriam Yehya Ibrahim Ishag was sentence to death for apostasy for leaving Islam and in Saudi Arabia a guy name raif badawi for blogging in his websites now he is jail for 10 years and getting 1000 lashes. In Islam there is no religious freedom for none Muslims sorry folks
InsaneGadget Entertainment Ah, so Sharia was made up by the western media, right? To claim what you claimed, you are either an ignorant fool, or a liar of the most loathsome variety.
True, Krauss did his best to get some basic education across. And I also recommend watching the short video of Hamza and some other apologist trying to confront atheists at some convention about "quran science" (lol). Man, I think I have never seen someone switching the topic as quickly as good old Hamza did when he heard that his interlocutor was an actual embryologist who knows his stuff.
@@electricearth1101 there are many proofs that destroyed and continue to destroy atheism, but most won't even debate about it. do you really think you have been born in 2000s and not in year 57381 where human are so much advance and there is no religion.... by coincidence? you didn't born as ant or bird but as human who can write in keyboard and make thoughts in his mind just to say there is no creator who I'm thankful for all blessing I have.
@@abdalaalenzi3748Humans are not perfect because we were created by magic. It took us billions of years to evolve. We are simply the result of billions of years of evolution, so it's only natural that we would be intelligent and capable. It's called a natural process. You are just a species on a small planet orbiting a star among 100 billion stars in a galaxy among 2 trillion galaxies. What makes you think your tiny brain can comprehend the complexity of the universe? But it doesn't make sense, right? Well, guess what? THE UNIVERSE IS UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO MAKE SENSE TO YOU OR ANYONE.
He won the debate, also philosophy is big part in this kind of conversations. Its not scince vs religion, because islam support scince. Its about exist ing of dude
Lawrence looks a psycho, I wonder who will call him an intellectual lol, so much frustrated hehe. Once I see atheists like him I say these r people who need a religion the most
That moment of " Actually let me calm down" by hamza was so smooth and funny , i' ve never seen someone calm himself like that ever . That actually shows self control at such a high level . And apologized for it at the end even .
@@chrischow9085 I see you like to troll about. How bored are you. If you think religion is so much bs why are you so pained and burtthurt trolling all over the comment section for a week. It's almost like you are obssesed and you are angry that there is an inevitable and you must face it. You hate that there are people bold enough to accept this inevitable. I suggest you stay away from this videos if you can't handle them like a man lol 😅😁
@@chrischow9085 It's always funny to see these atheists responding to all muslim comments with some dumb points. There are the most fanatic people. But just virtually, in fact you'll never see them taking part in an oral debate
I think that If there is a true religion in this word it would be Islam. It's more logical than atheism and other religions, and It has many undeniable scientific and logical evedence in It's book the Qran.... Much respect To brother hamza he give me more evedence how powerful Islamic argument is. I am in my way To learn more and more about Islam and prophet Mohammed...🇧🇪
@Dwan Sangma I got another answer for the first question: God might be meaning with the "Spread", the planet that hit the earth and was the cause of the ejection of the moon (I know this is a theory we still don't know exactly how the moon formed), and what happened there is that the earth's surface turned into liquid magma, therefore the earth didn't have any geographical terrain, and that makes the choice of choosing the word "Spread" very rational. 🛑This my own explanation, I am not a scientist, I am just a science and astronomy lover. I hope this was useful to you. c:
@Dwan Sangma Look I want to tell you something very important, Most of all that we know about the space the universe...are just theories, and what are you doing now is that you are making the theories and hypotheses looks like the truth, When you are talking with science it doesn't mean you are saying the reality or what happened exactly you are just talking logically, therefore the best way to know if God was there or not is to see the Scientifiques miracles that people in the 7th century had no way to know, and I see that many Atheists don't believe in jinn and call then paranormal...You know I am Moroccan who lives in Morocco, And you don't see what we see here in some areas in Morocco the black magic is used so much, and trust me this stuff destroyed many peoples life, it was used even in a bank robbery they made the worker lose his mind he gave them everything with no need of power, then he kept walking along the street, they can make you sterile make your life torture, black magic is a big illegal business, and there are those people that don't get affected easily they are those who pray the fair, and there is this only and best way to cure this is the "ruqia" which is a bit like the Exorcism, where they take special parts of the Quran to use them in healing. What I want to tell is that stop making science the true reality we are just giving theories.
I am an Atheist ⚛️ I do not believe in the existence of God. There is no evidence to support the belief in any gods or supernatural entities. I rely on science, reason, logic, and empirical evidence to form my worldview and have not found compelling evidence or arguments to support the existence of God. The universe is governed by natural laws and forces, rather than moral, spiritual, or supernatural ones. As an atheist, I reject religious dogma, supernaturalism, and superstition as the basis of morality and decision-making. I emphasize the social and empirical nature of inquiry and prioritize scientific solutions to intellectual problems. There is an intrinsic intellectual conflict between faith and science, and that it inevitably leads to hostility. I am engaged in a continually evolving search for truth, primarily through science and philosophy.
I am an atheist, though I admit Krauss was quite rude to Tzortzis in this. It is fine to disagree, but don't treat him like an idiot when giving an explanation.
When someone attacks your credibility and your book by misquoting you, and an entire audience starts clapping and making noises because you got 'roasted', I'm sure you'd be extremely level-headed. After being open to the fact that you might be wrong (Krauss said: "if I did (write the phrase in the book) then I was wrong"), even though it turned out that he didn't, and what does he get for actually letting go of his ego infront of cameras and an audience? Booing and mooing. Or when your asked about your opinion about incest, and just before you're done answering everyone starts booing and mooing, you'd also be calm. Stop putting a burden on him that you don't put on Hamza. Everyone in the comments is complementing Hamza for smiling when it's a tactic to disguise being 'roasted' by after Krauss proved he was misquoting him. Love seeing how the standard for the atheist is always high. Sam Harris could just say one fallacy or one wrong fact and he would be eaten alive, while Deepak can go ahead and not say anything coherent and still have followers and get invited to debates.
@@zorba9660 No, idiots should be treated with the same kindness you show to everyone else. Just be decent, it doesn't matter to whom you are speaking. Except perhaps for people who cause harm to others.
@@sarahbutler363 I'm from Arab as well .. Most of the arab people are Muslims, there is a bit of us following other faiths, Christians, Jewish, atheists .. Etc.. But the majority are Muslims .. Alhamdulillah.
i liked this debate, two very intelligent individuals. but to be fair, krauss sometimes contradict his own theories, and he does it more than he thinks.
@@upplsuckimcool16 like how he used math to justify presence of infinity in actuality and then at 1:45:00 said 90% of sound mathematical model of reality are nonsense in physics.
@@StoicPhilosophyyyy That is NOT what he said AT ALL..... LMFAOOOOOOOOO HAHAHA. I hope you have the excuse that English is not your primary language. Watch it again and listen closer.
My point is just because it's possibel mathematically, doesn't mean it has to be present physically. He later said sound mathematical models can be nonsense in physics (reality). This doesn't hold against the argument of hamza (about universe having a beginning) nor does the pie example which is completely off topic. Although personally i am inconclusive about whether infinity can or cannot exist physically. Plus you shouldn't give random laughs and pseudosuperior phrases.
@@acecream1411 That's just how a debate works with an uninterrupted opener. We should appreciate Krauss jumping in when Hamza came up with some other unfounded trash. Seems like you agree that Hamza didn't make a coherent point in his opener.
@@joerdim yeah I know I was being sarcastic genius And no that’s not how a debate works that just shows that you are scared and insecure to net even letting your opponent finish a point 🤣
@@acecream1411 Well, if you say that Hamza couldn't make a single point and Krauss didn't interrupt his opener then Hamza failed hard in his opener. Glad you agree genius. In an open discussion section this is no problem. And in case of Krauss he couldn't stand that Hamza kept making clueless unfounded claims and we should appreciate that he jumped in to immediately correct him.
A lot of things going on in the comment section. People trying to explain themselves. People trying to start english classes. (Which I totally want to be apart of)
to be better in english, watch alot of western videos with them just speaking. vlogs , audio books, bbc radio etc. i used to suffer listening from the start because you would miss alot of words as it seems they speak very fast, but after several months you get better, and even you begin to speak english alot faster when speaking to people around you. audio books is the best since you just download it, and listen at anytime. bbc radio is good since its just radio you can listen anytime if you have a phone with radio or a radio app.
@@drmosaddegh a great privilege indeed, and we take it for granted... Even though I am fluent in English as I was raised in Canada, I still feel that my vocabulary isn't as great as it should be. I guess I am missing eloquence in my speech...
And if you know this, know that if there is a lot of luminosity, you can see it in the tongue of the Arabs by Ibn Manzur, or in any other lexicon of linguistic dictionaries, and it was mentioned in the noble verse in the sense of vision, which is the most appropriate phrase, and it cannot be replaced by a phrase that plays its role. It is more appropriate than it, and the interpreters have interpreted the noble verse so that there is no room for doubt or bewilderment. Ibn Katheer said: He found it set in the eye of Hama, meaning he saw the sun in his sight set in the surrounding sea, and this is the case for everyone who ends up on his coast and sees it as if it is set in it and it does not leave. The fourth astronomy that is fixed in it does not leave it ... Sheikh Al-Shanqeeti said in the lights of the statement: ..... And the fact that whoever is on the shore of the western ocean sees the sun in the eyes of his eye falling into the sea is a known matter ..
Yes, because in the Qur’an it was written and found and in the Arabic language it came in a sense that seemed in the sense that the sun seemed to (Dhul-Qarnayn) here the Qur'an speaks from his perspective but when the Qur'an speaks of facts it is clearly and not from the perspective of a person like the Scientific miracles in the Quran about fetuses.
@@chrischow9085 You reminds me of those Muslims who also try to prove Quran as a Scientific book, this context is not even about where the Sun goes, this is a context of the Horizon, and the Ocean, by Dhul Qarnain, and old King, who almost had conquered the Earth. great that you found a hadith out of 80.000 Thousands hadiths :-) The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "The sun and the moon do not eclipse because of the death of someone from the people but they are two signs amongst the signs of Allah. When you see them stand up and pray." Sahih Bukhari even though he could have conviced them because his son Ibrahim died the same day, and NASA confirmed the eclipse also
so he excuses incest as long as they are in love and use contraception, but has a problem with women who cover themselves and prefer to only show their beauty to their family and husband?
Its the source of the belief that he probably finds unreasonable and unjustified and the consequences she may face if she refuses is what I find awful. There is actual harm being done to women who refuse to wear it. What harm is done with two consenting people having sex without risk of pregnancy?
@@teresamcmud2605 You cannot speak reason to people that base their world view on bronze age philosophy. I thought your comment was spot on and would have left something very similar if you hadn't beat me to it.
@@teresamcmud2605 1. The first statements goes both ways, there are women harmed who also wish to wear it or do wear it. Either by their enviroment or even their families. But Krauss or many atheists dont adress it this way, they just genuinely dont like the fact women cover and hide their beauty. 2. A brother and a sister consenting to sex even if its protected sex still doesnt change the fact its just insanely wrong to do so. To say it does no harm means you didnt think through it properly, what about their surroundings? It would cause lots of emotional harm especially to their parents or community, and it would likely cause harm to themselves later in life, either physical or emotional due to their environment or just psychologically.
@@aq4356 But some women are harmed by their families or Islamic regimes specifically for the reason of not covering themselves. The fact that other women are also sometimes harmed does nothing to alleviate the first fact. Certainly, we can oppose multiple rationales for harming women.
2:06:20 Mr Krauss’s response to the women saying she was offended could be used against him here. He said to the women that she knew coming in that the event is not segregated and should not have a problem with sitting with men. Now, he says he thinks the debate format is stupid and treated the whole “debate” like a back and forth and kept interrupting, even when it was not his time to speak.. so the same could be said for him - he knew he was coming to participate in a DEBATE and should have respected that Kudos to Hamza for doing a great job in conducting this debate 👏🏼
I noticed that too. Krauss's entire performance here was lacklustre and full of double standards. His key arguments were moral and whether it's "sensible" to believe in God/Islam, yet he can't morally argue against incest. When Hamza uses technical and reasonable terminology his response is to ask Hamza to "stop using words". It should be embarrassing enough that he doesn't appear to have a good grasping of what's inductive and deductive and how it relates to the discussion - or he's just being intentionally obtuse. In fact, what even was his argument? When backed into a corner as his position is being demolished he starts to posit a vague standpoint. Krauss, as typical of most 'new atheists', literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma then walk away smugly. Almost like a Christian proselytiser. I don't think these new atheists realise how much they are unironically presenting themselves as behaving in the same manner as the 'ignorant religious zealots' that they proclaim to be against. There's an underlying sense that Krauss literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma (with a very cursory understanding of Islam) then walk away smugly. It's clear he wasn't prepared because his arrogance made him think he didn't need to be.
@@stuntxl5783 Hamzah's key argument was that there can be an infinity and if there can be then something can come from nothing. Hamzah ignored his entire scientific argument by claiming it wasn't scientific it was a deductive argument, a deductive argument can and usually is a scientific one and thus since his first premise of the argument was proven incorrect it was an invalid deductive argument.
Anthony Flew is considered one of the most prominent atheists, so he retracted his atheism and ،told us that the universe has a deity with modern scientific evidence, not with thought or dreams and feeling, but after science and modern discoveries about the existence of a Creator. He fell into another problem that the Creator wanted according to his mood He wanted the Creator to be neither speaking nor hearing, and creating creation in vain But it is logical that this Creator sends a messenger to teach us who he is. And we have to verify the authenticity of the Messenger and what this Messenger calls to? It transports sperm from the liquid state to the eyes, heart, blood, arteries, and bones. Unconscious nature creates a conscious human being. Then this nature teaches about the importance of the heart and lung, then puts the rib cage, then oxygen, then water, there is sexual desire, and there are the genitals to complete the male and female sexual process. , What coincidence are you talking about, a coincidence that creates the male and the female. All of these are called verses and there are things that complement each other, there is a lung and there is air and there are teeth and stomach and in food and other things and we say that it has no creator!!! The only question God will ask you is focus on it ((He said: Did you deny My verses and did not encompass them in knowledge, or what did you do?)) I mean, God Almighty tells you what I told you is a lie and you cannot realize it or understand it And what in the world have you been doing? Do you know what your answer is? ((The decree will befall them for what they did wrong, and they will not be able to speak. If you find yourself in the world without a choice in a great reality we live in, and you go without a choice and a question is the most important If your destiny is fire, has God wronged you???ًً Muhammad, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him, is a prophet from the Creator, and before him many prophets did not lie or deceive, and he is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator who created everything. First of all, you should know that the religion of all prophets is the worship of one Creator who created everything. Islam today is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator and not idols, illusions, conjecture or a number of gods. But how do we know that the speech is from God and not from Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace? . These are some of the things that comfort your heart and believe that this is a prophet and many of the prophets before him The Almighty said: (Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been (as) smoke) The smoke confirms that the origin of this universe is inflamed. It is not a lake of water, as was the perception of all philosophies and religions that are based on illusion. This is one of the postulates of modern science today that the sky is condensation of smoke. This fact converted the French scientist Maurice to Islam and wrote a book entitled the Holy Qur’an on the scale of modern science How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before? The Almighty says: ((And the heaven We constructed)) The sky is a building, not a vacuum as it was thought, and this was awarded the Nobel Prize in Physics in 2017 that proved it How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before? The Almighty’s saying: ((And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander. )). That is, the sky expands with time. This fact, even in the time of Einstein, was not imagined by anyone and it was proven. And Einstein admitted it and admitted that it was the biggest scientific mistake he made in his life if he believed that the sky was fixed. The Qur’an before Einstein says that the sky expands fact Almighty’s saying: :((And We have made the night and day two signs, and We erased the sign of the night and made the sign of the day visible that you may seek bounty from your Lord and may know the number of years and the account [of time]. And everything We have set out in detail. )) The verse of the night is the moon and the verse of the day is the sun. The Qur'an tells that the sun and the moon were fiery masses. That is, the moon was a fiery mass and was erased, and the verse of the day remained visible to the eyes. Was the moon a fiery mass and extinguished? This is one of the biggest scientific issues discovered about the moon. The moon was already a fiery mass, and NASA issued on its official website a conceptual clip entitled The Evolution of the Moon in the video. In fact, the moon was a fiery mass like the sun, and this is what the Qur’an told about and the truth of modern science. How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before? Almighty’s saying And you see the mountains thinking that they are rigid, while you will cross as the passage of clouds. [It is] the work of God who has perfected everything. In fact, he knows what you're doing.)) And the verse clearly spoke of a strange phenomenon, which is that the viewer of the mountains appears to him still, that is, they are still, but in fact they are not like that, rather they are in a state of constant movement. And the infidels of Quraish had previously accused our master Muhammad, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him, of madness, and it is likely that their joy was overwhelming when this verse was revealed. They also found in it, according to their claim, evidence of this madness, and they told the people: How can you believe this man who says that these fixed mountains move like clouds moving in the sky! And today it is proven that the earth rotates, and with it the mountains, how did Muhammad know that and why is he telling you instead of the matter that makes people consider him crazy? The matter was not from him, but from God. Almighty’s saying Those whom Allah (in His plan) willeth to guide,- He openeth their breast to Islam; those whom He willeth to leave straying,- He maketh their breast close and constricted, as if they had to climb up to the skies: thus doth Allah (heap) the penalty on those who refuse to believe)). After man was able to reach the sky by flying by modern means of transportation, he knew that the higher up in the air, the less oxygen and atmospheric pressure, which causes severe tightness in the chests and the process of breathing. : How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before? It was not from him, but from God Almighty’s saying Or (the Unbelievers' state) is like the depths of darkness in a vast deep ocean, overwhelmed with billow topped by billow, topped by (dark) clouds: depths of darkness, one above another: if a man stretches out his hands, he can hardly see it! for any to whom Allah giveth not light, there is no light! Modern sciences have revealed that in the bottom of the deep seas with abundant water - the deep sea - there is great darkness, to the extent that living creatures live in this darkness without visual tools, but live using their other senses such as hearing. These dark darknesses are not found in the sea water that surrounds the Arabian Peninsula, but rather they have been discovered in the oceans far from it This verse shows another aspect of the Qur’anic miracle, which is that the sea wave that all people only knew was one wave in the seas The verse says there is another wave in the depths of the sea, and divers discovered at the beginning of the twentieth century a fact that was hidden in the depths of the sea, that fact that shows another wave that throws divers into it as it is thrown at swimmers, and this wave was discovered by Scandinavian divers. I will tell you what the Prophet said. The Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, said: One day the Bedouins who live in the desert will build tall towers, and this is my duty. Go and see where the tallest buildings are and who owns them. God Almighty: ((We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth. But is it not sufficient concerning your Lord that He is, over all things, a Witness?) And God informed the Qur’an of this by saying: “Did you think that we created you without a purpose and that you would never return to us?” All these and other matters that I have not mentioned indicate that this is a prophet from God..More important than that, as I told you, is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator, who created everything and before him many prophets. Say, if you wish, there is no god but God, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of God speak from the heart
I came here expecting highly intellectual debate but, I’m really disappointed with the professor’s behavior. Lack of respect, full of himself, and extremely arrogant.
chris chow Not the case, if you watch the whole “debate”, it was the professor who demanded men and women intermingle. The evidence is when the young woman stood up and let the professor have it. She didn’t wanted to sit next to a man and she said that achieved the opposite of what he wanted to achieve when he pushed for “not to segregate the sexes”.
chris chow It was the professor who took her choice as she complained to him. If her choice and her religion say so who are you to say? Your bias and preconceived notion is evident and wack to be frank.
chris chow Islam gave women the right to choose, live, own property, and of course the right to live way before any European and Asian cultures. Islam advanced women’s right before 1,440 years ago. At least do fact checking and educate yourself the subject matter. Approximately, 6th century girls were sadly buried alive and Islam outlawed that savage practice.
@@chrischow9085 Alright so the thing you are saying is absolutely wrong. Islam is the religion that came and said women have right to marry to vote, to get her share and Whether a woman is a wife, mother, sister, or daughter, she receives a certain share of her deceased relative’s property. This share depends on her degree of relationship to the deceased and the number of heirs. While many societies around the world denied women inheritance, Islam assured women this right, illustrating the universal justice of Islam’s divine law. Islam introduced voting rights, marrying rights at a time when they were buried alive in arabia and were known as transferable objects and in europe women rights took more 500 years to come. Islam further confirms that both men and women are equal in the sight of God. In the Quran, God declares, “…Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you…” (49:13) At another place in the Quran, God clearly states that all humans are equal: “To whoever, male or female, does good deeds and has faith, We shall give a good life and reward them according to the best of their actions.” (16:97) God devotes an entire chapter of the Quran, the holy book of Islam, to women. In addition, God directly addresses women repeatedly throughout the Quran. Islam proclaims that all human beings, men and women, are born in a pure state. The goal of every Muslim is to preserve this purity by shunning evil tendencies and beautifying their inner being with virtuous traits P.S. In Islam it's said that when you give birth to a girl, a door of paradise is open for you. If you are the parents of 2 or 3 girls it means the 2nd and 3rd gate of jannah is open for you. ( and yes for this there are conditions like just not giving birth to them but also educating them, providing them, giving them a good life). But can't you see how lucky you are said to be if you have a girl child in islam. So you don't tell people that islam doesn't advocate for women rights.
was krauss trying to prove that God doesnt exist or was he trying to prove that God is evil? i felt like he was arguing for the latter. and religious people tend to get emotional when their faith is challenged but this debate shows the absolute opposite. all krauss was doing was attacking Islam instead of rationally deducing flaws in the things said in Quran. weird and disappointing.
@@adilahmad6377 Oh yes it is intellectual behaviour! My physics professor had a PhD from MIT. The guy next to me in class was autistic. My friend would always point out the mistakes the Prof. made in front of the class. The Prof. would have conniption fits and storm out of the classroom. Sometimes I would have to button up my friends shirt and tie his shoes when doing homework.
Religious debaters are always such bad faith. As soon as you say anything they interpret as an attempt to discredit what they say they cry victim and pretend you are only trying to insult them. Its pathetic
Yeah, but without the language calculus is impossible to do modern science... Religion eg. Is firbwhen u feel unspititual in time and spritlritusl will make u back spiritual again. Other use other than that usually result in laziness... hence yhise people don't really want to work or progress
@Scorer Scored sir....you need to study Islam in depth to connect thoes dots...no i am not being a passive aggressive muslim and pushing you towards my religion...i am just saying that an hour's debate can not give you an in depth view of islam and what it really is...If you are really curious about the dots then maybe you can study the religion to find out...
@@garycooper607 sir everyone in their life gets a chance by ALLAH Almighty to know about their creator to be on the right path...just like how you watched this video...Allah gives many chances to humans,some are just lucky enougu to understand this and some are unfortunate enough to don't...ALLAH says that i love a human more than the love of 70 mothers,so no matter if you are an atheist or muslim..He still loves you and will give you numerous chances to go back to him...its in your own hands if you take thoes chances or not...
Zero implies nothing. Science has substantiated, incontrovertible evidence. Religion has faith in the supernatural - zero. Don't play faith chess with a knowledgeable informed, realistic, rational, critical thinker.
I'm an atheist and I must say I don't like how Krauss went about this. Some arguments were very logical, strong and well put. Others were all over the place, in fact most were since he wanted to counter everything in random orders. But him stealing Hamza's time over and over and say "You can take this off my time whatever" with a shrug when there would be room for a more 1 on 1 argument later on. Unprofessional and disrespectful.
Agreed. Krauss is far too biased and militant and arrogant. At one point he even encourages people to interchange science and atheism as identical, which is insane. Science is unconcerned if there is or is not a creator and atheism does not believe in one. Krauss lacks integrity and was thoroughly embarassed by Hamza.
@@cdb5001 i would also lose my temper if a person told me that if i used my brain i would deduce that infinity does not exist lmao. If the only thing you take from Krauss is don't rely on your common sense but study the world and do the maths, you already took more than Hamza's all points combined.
@@wulfiii1490 your statement shows a clear bias and unwillingness to accept truth regardless of your bias. I am not Muslim, not religious, but it is plain to see that Krauss was thoroughly out-maneuvered by Hamza because: 1. He doesn't have a grasp of deductive vs inductive reasoning 2. He has no clue how philosophy works 3. His scientific assertions are baseless and contingent upon changing the meaning of "nothing" 4. He is rude and disrespectful to any and all viewpoints that differ from his The only PhD Krauss truly deserves is one in arrogance. If you are going to use your brain, as you say, please understand that scientific zealotry is no better than religious zealotry, and brow-beating people when you yourself have no answers, only makes one look foolish, which is what Larry Krauss did to himself here.
@@cdb5001 ofc no zealotry is good, whether it is religion or science, for that i surely am gonna use my brain although i nowhere claimed to do that. On the opposite i said when talking about physics common sense goes out the window while math and experimenting does the trick. We would never find theory of relativity with common sense, so why do we believe that we can understand the beginning of the universe with common sense? Krauss was arrogant, because a man who had no clue about such basic concept like infinity tried to explain to him how his theory of universe from nothing is wrong. For you to say the only thing he deserves a Phd from is arrogance only shows that maybe you deserve a title from arrogance too.
@@wulfiii1490 lol, fair enough, though I didn't try to project any arrogance. I love physics and the sciences, but Krauss is too steeped in his atheistic zealotry to be taken seriously. Hamza very clearly states that on the scientific side, he conceded to Krauss' expertise, but that philosophically, Krauss' arguments make no sense. And it is an apt example to use math and state that 0+0 always equals zero. It's an interesting and relevant counter argument to any math that Krauss may try to use mathematics as a foundation for his theory, considering that the math does not support his assumptions. I am glad at least that we agree on zealotry being bad in any topic, and would clarify that my disappointment is that Krauss gets any airtime when he is clearly very biased, when there are other phycisists with more compelling postulates and more open minds, who do not get any exposure. I found it very disrespectful that Krauss knows so little about Islam and yet was happy to make general sweeping assumptions about the religion and people. And while I personally do not find Islam compelling, were I debating someone on it, I would at least be humble enough to study the topic before entering a debate, which is what Hamza did on the opposite side of the table. He read Krauss' book and critiqued it very well. Cheers.
I'm so glad I watched this debate. It opened my eyes, even enlightened me. Thanks to this debate, I understood how incompatible Islam is with our civilization. Everything we owe to Islam, e.g. the preservation of Greek thought, the transfer of Indian mathematical thought to Europe and many others, no longer exists in this culture. There are only some myths left, an inferiority complex combined with extroverted assurance to oneself and others how great Islam is. And it's all because of myths from the Bronze and Iron Ages. Pity.
@ilma iskander insulting what? Religion? What about me getting insulted by the nonsense you call religion? What about my feelings? Why is always only religion people get offended and insulted? So just suck it up!
Space Roamer u need to read the quran n learn the islamic history first with an openmind, put aside your denial n ego first. If u can’t, it means your ears, eyes, heart n mind have been closed/blocked. No matter how much people try to explain to u, it won’t work, just like what Hamza explained in this video, he did very well.
Sometimes I've noticed people that are smart usually the socially awkward types and Krauss definitely fits in that category of socially awkward well look at who he was debating after all a handsome greek man.
Because everythings against him The crowd especially is kind of stupid cheer for blunder it's like you are teaching classical physics to Quantum mechanicts thinking that it's right
54:25 unlike that woman who killed her children, prophets did not harm anybody because of revelation, for example in Qur'an most cursed people are Pharoah of Moses's time and Abu Lahab, and Allah did not order Mohammed of Moses to kill them, instead Allah ordered Moses to talk with a lower voice and be kind to even that bloodthirsty Pharoah, and ordered the same to Mohammed PBuH for his every encounter.
too bad 10 years later you Still don't know what morals are ... religions Do Not Have morals , they can't , religions have DECREES or dictations from a dictator , when your morals '' come from another subject '' , they can't be objective , or you don't understand what That word means either , objective it means without opinion or coming from a mind , including gods so no the bible , torah , quran ... = no morals , just decrees you can Only Have morals , objective morals , when you're an atheist , who grounds his / her morality in ... get this ... the evidence OF morality , which are the patterns we see change over time , we give those patterns a name , the patterns ... ARE objective , no mind involved , we call THAT ... whoop-de-doo ... OBJECTIVE MORALITY ... now , we could explain this to a 4 year old and he / she would understand this in a heartbeat , apparently not a lot of people are smarter THEN a 4 year old ... and not a lot of people know they have NO morality to speak of , like you and your family , parents grand parents , children , nobody just the atheists who understand what the word ACTAULLY MEANS , say it with me ... Objective Morality , decrees bad , objective morality good ... billions of people across the world have no cue what 90% of the words mean we invented , don't worry about it , LEARN about it
if ahmed deedat was alive this man would've probably been talking about how merciful allah is for guiding him into islam , I'm nothing meaning anything about hamza tzortzis he's such a brilliant speaker and intelligent i just discovered him for 4 days probably and he's got an impressive eloquence mashaallah may god bless him and protect him say amine ya rab
@@mimivisha136 you're absolutely right as allah said in surah al kahf verse 16 , what I mean is that ahmed deedat was a very strong way in which allah guided many people trough .
@@mimivisha136 zakir naik is too , even if it's ALLAH who guide , making daawa is our job too as muslims , and ofc making sure it's made in the softest ways there could be , I invite you to watch khutbah of ustadh Nouman Ali KHAN about making daawah , I'm sure you'll enjoy it .He's such a good speaker he's got a very high level of knowledge masha allah .
Rayan He already did and said the truth doesn’t change as the science change every time and also he give u example of the earth and sun 🤷🏽♀️ Also religions especially Quran discovered 80% before 1400 years ago what science did right now and it’s just clear that they copped from Quran 🤷🏽♀️
Gunther Vincent I dare you to proof it All what you said in the Quran do it plz and don’t be brainwashed go and read Quran well instead reading this in the propaganda islamicphobia websites
I think it's kinda pathetic to see Hamza flailing around with unproven concepts which he doesn't even understand and Krauss lecturing him again and again.
Krauss presented throughout the whole debate that we shouldn't presume anything before proving it or doing research on it. Yet, without doing ANY research on Islam, he is not even willing to listen to Hamza for one moment before completely discounting it.
@Scott Holder You're contradicting yourself. First u say him listening to Muslims is his research. Then you admit that Krauss doesn't even agree to listen to Hamza or other Muslims properly out of arrogance. What kind of half baked research is that?
@Scott Holder He has that attitude with every Muslim! Not listening to anyone's point and being so arrogant about it is not the way to have a discourse!
Scott Holder then why he came to the debate if he is not willing to listen? The real answer is because he is too prideful and that's actually the case with all disbelievers, they're just too prideful to admit TO THEY SELF AT LEAST that they are wrong.
chicken flavoured pineapples ... well why shouldn’t you engage in it? Because it’s wrong. It’s not allowed in any Abrahamic religion - the difference between those believing in Abrahamic religions is that they have a moral compass to abide by, whereas others simply dont
@@ismail_2967 no the reason we shouldnt engage with it is because its is harmful for the body and because morality is subjective ironically the story of adam and eve is a story of incest, how do you think there son's and daughter's reproduced ?
@@ismail_2967 this is a common misconception almost all atheists have a moral guide, this is a big debate in the atheist community we do not know if morality is objective (because of evolution) or if morality is subjective
@@ismail_2967 as @M'Kermy pointed out, morality being inherently subjective it is not immoral yet it is not something which you should do as it has been linked to a higher rate of birth defects.
![SOMETHING FROM NOTHING ? [OFFICIAL] Richard Dawkins & Lawrence Krauss [HD] 02-04-12](/img/1.gif)
Watch the video in the Arabic language
ruclips.net/video/SCOF0KraLiY/видео.html
why?
Hey educated idiot why don't you show your loyalty with Darwin? Don't be ugliest thing of universe and accept my challenge, with which face you are teaching the fake knowledge even your heart don't believe that.
Pope rabi atheists and all other fuel of hell type humans are now prisoners of their own hearts by me for many years same as you are prisoner of your own heart now, so take it easy and for freedom come in the Ring, Facebook people are witness that I captured all pseudo humans with help of Allah for many years. whole world and Allah (God) is watching your loyalty with your beliefs.
👉🚥🚦Show your confidence in your religion, science or reason. I suggest you with respect that you follow the Holy Quran, if you don't agree with me? then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now.
By the all holy books and medical science dead mankind is non communicable and if you call dead personalities or prophets along with Allah (God) and seek help from dead mankind then you will Never go to the heaven, if you don't agree with me then after death liar will take other's and his whole nation's sins, do you agree? Be brave now?
(Don't relate pseudo Muslims with Holy Quran.)
@@blueinfinite5940 why not?
@@deuces_biatch1706 it's a silly thing that Arabic speaking muslims feel that a deeper truth is revealed in Arabic - and since most of the world does not speak Arabic, then it is a sad commentary that Allah chooses to leave out so many people from truly understanding him. I thought he was supposed to be akbar.
جزاكم الله خيرا على الترجمة
I'm an atheist, but I have to admire Hamza's style here. And I find Krauss's attitude kind of hard to watch.
@@oscarbarrera6081 please study Islam my brother, u will find the truth
My friend I would suggest learning about Islam , It teaches us to respect one another unlike the proffesor
@@oscarbarrera6081 My friend I am pretty sure u know maybe even a little a bit of Islam , if you dont and wont then that is your choice but I can tell you Islam is a religion of peace and it means to submit yourself to the one and truly God (Allah) and to follow the teachings of his beloved prophet Muhammad ( peace be upon him) and also Islam teaches you about cleanliness and we Muslims after passing urine or stool ,we wipe with tissue first , then with water because it is very important and pure but I'm 100% sure non Muslims do not . I am not here to preach but why do u think the media and everywhere in this world is just targeting Muslims. Its because they know it's TRUE my brother so it's for you to decide, I personally chose to become Muslim because they dont eat pork /pig because it eats it's own poo , surely that's disgusting. Like I said I've done my part preaching , it's your choice
@@oscarbarrera6081
The Qur'an is God's Words:
In the name of Allah(God), The Most Gracious, The Most Merciful.
All besides those believers who have pure faith, irrespective of which religious background they claim to have come from, merely a single sign would suffice them to believe in the existence of One God, whether it be a sign concerning a scientific phenomenon or any other sign. Where as, on the other hand, there are people who would never believe even if a thousand signs are presented to them, such people would never accept faith and as such they are the Rejectors; there may be a third sect/group/category of people who may be convinced if proper efforts are made, either by means of science and technology, or by reasoning and with logic or by any other technique.
As today is the age of science and technology, the best approach we have is the use of scientifically proven and established facts, excluding hypotheses and theories (which lack solid evidence) in order to convince an atheist or an agnostic or any other individual who may not believe that the Qur'an is the revelation of God, as no human being could ever mention such scientific facts in the Qur'an, 14 centuries back which the humanity has unveiled/discovered very recently,with the help of rapidly growing technology and the advances made by the modern scientific world.
Majority of the people who disagree with the fact that the Qur'an has been sent down by God, revealed to the last and final messenger and servant of God, i.e. prophet Mohammad (pbuh), when asked about the reason they disbelieve, what they come up with is that they falsely claim that the Qur'an must have been written by prophet Mohammad himself as they do not have any better explanation for not believing in the Qur'an or Allah.
With the help of mathematics, we can refute their baseless claim (that Muhammad is the author of the Qur'an, they even fail to realise that he was an Ummi,i.e. he was unlettered/illiterate!).
Nevertheless,even for the sake of an argument, let us be kind enough to give them a benefit of doubt, and say that may be, prophet Muhammad wrote the Qur'an (though we never agree!).
Now we shall refute their false claim with the help of what we know in mathematics as 'The Probability Theory'.
Probability is basically concerned with the likelihood or the chance of something happening/taking place or not happening for which we make certain guesses/flukes or predictions at random and calculate the chance of our choice or guess coming true as a number or percentage.
Probability has a range of 0-1. Having a probability of 0 implies the impossibility of the occurence of the event we are dealing with, on the other hand, probability of 1 means that the event is sure to occur, thus affirming a 100% possibility of the occurrence of the event we are dealing with. Any number in between would indicate that the event may either occur or not.
For example,if you toss or flip a coin(fair), there are(a total of), two possibilities, it may either land up with a head or tail, whatever choice you make the mathematical chance/probability of your guess being rightat random is 1 out of 2,i.e. 1/2 or 50%.
Further, if you have a die (having 6 faces) and you roll it, the chance of your guess-number coming on the top is 1/6 as there are a total of 6 distinct choices to make.
Similarly,if you roll the die 2 times in succession/consecutively or roll two dice simultaneously (both yield the same result, these are termed as 'independent events' meaning that the two (or more) events have no influence/impact on one another; they yield independent results) what you'll see is, the probability of both your choices being right at the same time is merely
(1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/36 which is < 3%.
Now,if you roll the die 3 times successively,the chance of you making the right choice all three times,just at random is
(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6) i.e. 1/216 which is < 0.5%.
Let us now consider the compound event of tossing the coin 2 times and rolling the die 4 times,the probability of you making the correct choices all 6 times is therefore
(1/2)×(1/2)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)×(1/6)=(1/2)^2 × (1/6)^4 =(1/4)×(1/1296)=1/5184 which is ~ 0.02%.
Let me generalize the method for you.
If you repeat an experiment for n different times and all of which must deal with independent events as in our case here, fortunately; and you have a probability of, say 'p' for each of the individual events and of course 0 < p < 1.
Now you want to calculate the probability of you making the correct choice all 'n' times i.e. each time you making the right choice without a single mistake..
It is p^n,i.e. 'p' raised to the power of 'n'.
For those who are good at maths, they can readily see that this number, p^n quickly reaches 0 when |p| < 1 and n is let increase!!
Praise be to Allah SWT,all the Qur'anic verses that talk about scientific phenomena can be modelled as ' the independent events' in this very analysis of ours.
And the holy Qur'an contains more than 1,000 (out of more than 6,000 verses in total) verses which speak about science. And more than 800 of which have already been supported by established scientific facts.
1.
For example, the Qur'an says that the light of the moon is not its own light but rather, it is the reflected light of the sun (the moon reflects the light from the sun onto the earth), for this one people (at the time of the revelation of the Qur'an,i.e. at the time of the prophet) could have made two choices (if they were asked, hypothetically) i.e. the light of the moon could be the light of its own or it could be the borrowed light of the sun.
2.
Similarly, the Qur'an talks about the spherical shape (more accurately, the geo-spherical shape, as the earth is slightly flattened at the poles and slightly bulging out at the equatorial region,i.e. the 'circle of maximum diameter').
People could have thought of various shapes for the earth such as flat, triangular,rectangular etc. So, lfor this particular one, the number of choices would be more than 2.
3.
The Qur'an states that the Sun also rotates (about its own axis)...people couldn't even have thought of this, at the time of the prophet as this one is a very very recent discovery, we came to know about this hardly a few decades earlier. So even for this particular one, there would be 2 choices to make, the Sun may either rotate or not! (For the sake of argument only!)
4.
The Qur'an talks, in a nutshell, about the birth of our universe which the scientists today call the Big Bang, it may be right or wrong. ..So for this too, we would have 2 choices.
5.
The Qur'an talks about the interstellar matter, called 'plasma' by the scientists. Again, could be right or wrong. ..So 2 choices for this too.
6.
The Qur'an states that our universe has been expanding. Again, could be right or wrong. .So for this too, we have 2 choices.
And so on..
The Qur'an talks about scientific phenomena,over and over again, for more than 1,000 times.
Each verse which talk about a scientific phenomenon, can be attributed a number of choices we can think of, as above. These choices vary, from 2 (which is the least/minimum number of choices) to larger numbers, for instance,in the case of the earth, we could think of more than a dozen of possible shapes!
Let's restrict ourselves to 2 (as the number of choices), clearly seeing that even the least number of choices would give us the desired result and if we consider more number of choices, we get to the result even more quickly.
As a challenge to the people, I'll prove my logic even with the least number of choices as the Qur'an, with no doubts, is the book of God.
Proceeding with 2 choices as the flukes/guesses for each of the verses which speak about science, what we find is, the probability or the mathematical chance of one making the correct choice all 800 times, i.e. making the right choice for each of the verses each and every single time is...
Using, probability = p^n with p = 1/2 and n = 800...
Probability(P) = (1/2)^800 = 1/(2)^800
The number 2^800, i.e. 2 raised to the power of 800 is a very huge number though it may not appear so, so huge that the number
1/(2)^800 is literally negligible and is considered 0 (zero/nill) in practical mathematics.
The number of choices that could be thought of,for the scientific verses of the Qur'an is not merely 2 as we have used above!!
We could've used more than 2 choices in which case we'd have arrived at the answer of 0 even more quickly.
So, even in the most probable case (using the least number of choices, i.e.2), the probability of the scientific verses being written in the noble Qur'an by (any) a human being is 0.
The Qur'an, thus, can never be the work of a human. It must have come from a divine source. The only being Who could mention such facts in the Qur'an must be the Creator Himself Who possesses All The Knowledge.
Peace
@Gunther Vincent
FAMOUS LAST WORDS, FROM ATHEISTS, BEFORE THEY
DIED
(Re-post)
1. Caesar Borgia:
"While I lived, I provided for everything but death;
now I must die, and am unprepared to die." 2. Thomas Hobbs[political philosopher]
I say again, if I had the whole world at my disposal, I
would give it to live one day. I am about to take a leap
into the dark."
3. Thomas Payne [/b]the leading atheistic writer in
American colonies: "Stay with me, for God's sake; I cannot bear to be left
alone , O Lord, help me! O God, what have I done to
suffer so much? What will become of me hereafter?
"I would give worlds if I had them, that The Age of
Reason had never been published. 0 Lord, help me!
Christ, help me! …No, don't leave; stay with me! Send even a child to stay with me; for I am on the edge of
Hell here alone.
If ever the Devil had an agent, I have been that one."
4. Sir Thomas SCOTT [Chancellor of England ]"
Until this moment I thought there was neither a God
nor a hell. Now I know and feel that there are both, and I am doomed to perdition by the just judgment of
the Almighty."
5. Voltaire famous anti-christian atheist:
"I am abandoned by God and man; I will give you half
of what I am worth if you will give me six months'
life." (He said this to Dr. Fochin, who told him it could not be done.) "Then I shall die and go to hell!" (His
nurse said: "For all the money in Europe I wouldn’t
want to see another unbeliever die! All night long he
cried for forgiveness.
6. Robert Ingersoll:
"O God, if there be a God, save my soul, if I have a soul!" (Some say it was this way:
"Oh God, if there be a God, save my soul if I have a
soul, from hell, if there be a hell!
7. David Hume, atheist philosopher famous for his
philosophy of empiricism and skepticism of religion
He cried loud on his death bed "I am in flames!" It is said his "desperation was a horrible scene".
8. Napoleon Bonaparte, the French emperor, and who,
like Adolf Hitler, brought death to millions to satisfy his
greedy, power-mad, selfish ambitions for world
conquest:
"I die before my time, and my body will be given back to the earth. Such is the fate of him who has been
called the great Napoleon. What an abyss between
my deep misery and the eternal kingdom of Christ!”
9. Sir Francis Newport[The head of an English Atheist
club to those gathered around his deathbed: ]
"You need not tell me there is no God for I know there is one, and that I am in his presence! You need not tell
me there is no hell. I feel myself already slipping.
Wretches, cease your idle talk about there being hope
for me! I know I am lost forever! Oh, that fire! Oh, the
insufferable pangs of hell! …Oh, that I could lie for a
thousand years upon the fire that is never quenched, to purchase the favor of God and be united to Him
again. But it is a fruitless wish. Millions and millions of
years will bring me no nearer the end of my torments
than one poor hour. Oh, eternity, eternity forever and
forever!, Oh, the insufferable pangs of Hell!”
10. Charles IX [/b]was the French king who urged on by his mother, gave the order for the massacre of the
French Huguenots, in which 15,000 souls were
slaughtered in Paris alone and 100,000 in other
sections of France, for no other reason than that they
loved Christ. The guilty king suffered miserably for
years after that event. He finally died, bathed in blood bursting from his veins.
To his physicians he said in his last hours:
"Asleep or awake, I see the mangled forms of the
Huguenots passing before me. They drop with blood.
They point at their open wounds. Oh! That I had
spared at least the little infants at the bosom! What blood! I know not where I am. How will all this end?
What shall I do? I am lost forever! I know it. Oh, I have
done wrong."
11. David Strauss, leading representative of German
rationalism, after spending a lifetime erasing belief in
God from the minds of others said: "My philosophy leaves me utterly forlorn! I feel like
one caught in the merciless jaws of an automatic
machine, not knowing at what time one of its great
hammers may crush me!"
12. In a Newsweek interview with Svetlana Stalin, the
daughter of Josef Stalin, she told of her father's death: "My father died a difficult and terrible death. . God
grants an easy death only to the just. . At what
seemed the very last moment he suddenly opened his
eyes and cast a glance over everyone in the room. It
was a terrible glance, insane or perhaps angry. . His
left hand was raised, as though he were pointing to something above and bringing down a curse on us all.
The gesture was full of menace. . The next moment he
was dead."
13. Anton LeVey [/b][author of the Satanic Bible and
high priest of the religion dedicated to the worship of
Satan]. Some of his famous quotes are “There is a beast in
man that needs to be exercised, not exorcised”. His
dying words were "Oh my, oh my, what have I done,
there is something very wrong…there is something
very wrong…
Beloved,compare this lasts words from atheists,with this last words,from this saint of God, Augustus
Montague Toplady (1710-1778).This servant of God,,
will ever be famous as the author of one of the most
evangelical hymns of the eighteenth century, "Rock of
Ages," which was first published in 1776.
During the final illness, Toplady was greatly supported by the consolations of the gospel.Near his last,
awaking from a sleep, he said:"Oh, what delights!
Who can fathom the joy of the third heaven? The sky is
clear, there is no cloud; come Lord Jesus, come
quickly!"
He died saying:"No mortal man can live after the glories which God has manifested to my soul."
Only fools never learn from history,and it's amazing
that even in our days, with all these facts on our
fingertips, someone with a mind can devote his life to
a delusion, and want everyone to know that there is
no God, no-wonder the bible says ,"Only fools say in their hearts, "There is no God."[Psalm 14:1].
God bless you.
Highlights
00:00:24 : Introduction - Timothy Yusuf Chambers
00:06:30 : Opening Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis
00:32:02 : Opening Remarks - Lawrence Krauss
00:59:33 : Rebuttal - Hamza Tzortzis
01:14:28 : Rebuttal - Lawrence Krauss
01:22:43 : Summary Discussion
01:42:07 : Question & Answer Session
02:06:00 : Closing Remarks - Lawrence Krauss
02:07:50 : Closing Remarks - Hamza Tzortzis
Narrated Anas bin Malik:
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "Make things easy for the people, and do not make it difficult for them, and make them calm (with glad tidings) and do not repulse (them )"
Let’s add here 1:24:40 it’s very funny wAllahi and here 56:47 😂😂 LGBQ in here is so funny too
Jazakallahu khair
Thank you so much for this! :)
Samirah Samir what does he mean by lots of fish here today LOL 😂
@@ifuknewwhatiknew4893 it's the red hearing strategy thing that he discussed it's a way to manipulate and change words and stuff and he even said an example when he said it's like throwing a dead fish to a dog or sth like that idk remember the quote exactly but all i learned from the atheist dude is he came here to twist words from mr.hamza and the quran and just talk about nonsense for an hour(not to mention the whole incest thing which is so stupid and got him trapped in a box)
The comments here are very interesting, seeing how different people with different backgrounds can experience (see, hear) the exact same thing and yet interpret the same data completely differently according to their personal interests.
Kaplaars k Hamza commented on a physics book without knowing physics.
He did not even know the relationship between Pi and the circumference of a circle.
I do not think there is any grey area in this debate. Krauss insults Islam so
Islamists will defend Hamza and criticise Krauss. Predictable and it still not
make Hamza in anyway right. Anyone who says otherwise is either stupid or lying.
pinball1970 It is interesting to see how many people fail to see that the "logical" deduction method used by Hamza is in no way a reliable tool to come to a conclusion. Krauss tried to show him with examples how easy it is to come to faulty conclusions using the method of deduction.
It is odd to me to see that as soon as people have no grasp on the explanations given by a scientist it is more logical that their specific God did it.
Kaplaars k
Hamza is all words I have seen him on other debates and likes the sound of his own voice. He rarely says anything of substance. He likes words like epistemological then pats himself on the back happy in the fact that people on the whole do not know what it means.
pinball1970 The problem is that most people don't understand what he is saying. He uses meaningless sentences filled with intelligent sounding words. However since he is "defending" a religion the followers of this religion think he is actually making logical and intelligent statements even though they have no clue what he just said.
In my opinion someone who resorts to these kinds of phrases and wording is afraid that it will become clear to everyone that his claims are based on nothing.
Dr. Krauss tried to explain his position, and showed the errors of Hamza's "reasoning",by using examples while trying to steer away from jargon. I wonder which one of the two is more knowledgeable?
Kaplaars k
yes I would put my money on Krauss! We need more like him. Sam Harris is another good speaker.
00:28 Debate on Islam and Atheism: Which is More Reasonable?
10:18 The universe had a beginning and was created by something uncreated.
26:24 The Qur'an is considered a miracle due to its literary form beyond the scope of the Arabic language.
33:25 Islam is not a special religion and atheism is not a belief system.
47:26 Causation and the beginning of time are complex topics in physics.
55:17 Discussion on punishment for questioning God's existence and homosexuality in Islam
1:08:59 Discussion on morality and ethics from an Islamic perspective
1:16:33 Criticism of religious beliefs and the importance of science
1:31:56 Discussion on spirit, existence, and restrictions in religion
1:39:29 The universe began 14.72 billion years ago and the best explanation is that it came out of nowhere.
00:05 The debate discusses the use of empirical and deductive arguments in science.
2:02:41 Discussion on gender equality and respecting personal choices
00:28 Atheism, since it's lack of belief in ridiculous god claims.
10:18 Not even a creation independent from gods has been demonstrated.
26:24 The quran is just a book with many flaws. Nothing special about that.
33:25 True.
47:26 Yes. And a god outside of time seems ridiculous. He would exist for zero seconds. That's one way to describe things that don't exist.
55:17 Infinite punishments for finite "crimes" which shouldn't be considered as crimes is extremely unjust. Fantasy Allah claims that Homosexuality is a bad thing. Turns out it is not.
1:08:59 Objective morality like Islam usually promotes it doesn't exist, it's always subjective. A muslim following some supposed god's orders isn't acting morally anyways. It's simply obedience to the rules of some dictator.
1:16:33 Even non-violent religions are bad since they teach people to believe in nonsense based on nothing. This can lead to conspiracy theories because of bad standards of evidence.
1:31:56 Whatever terms like "spirit" even mean. And there are lots of unnecessary restrictions in religion.
1:39:29 If it even "came" in the first place.
00:05 What matters is good evidence to support the premises of an argument. Muslims don't have that.
2:02:41 Gender equality doesn't exist in Islam. Another reason to never look at it again. Lots of ex-muslims would risk their lives if they would openly express their apostasy. Grave consequences in their families are the norm. Allah threatening people with his ridiculous hell is one of the worst forms of compulsion in religion. Still muslims claim that there is no compulsion.
@@joerdim please understand its all about bias. Much of the time there is no clear winner between muslims and athiests unless one of them talks over the other person. Also, many incredible things happen in peoples lives that cannot be explained without god. I dont really need to list any examples. I should also mention you should see the other side of things. You probably watch athiests bringing down religions. Watch the other side where educated muslims go and refute these claims quite well. Islam is more special than other religions in my opinion, because the prophet pbuh was illiterate and even if he had co authors its hard to be shakespeare in arabia where most people were illiterate and no one was a great writer. These are my claims and beliefs if you want to believe in athiesm then go ahead.
@@endlessnutella8612 No, it's not all about bias. It's about presenting good evidence to support your claims. Muslims apologists are horrendously bad, even worse than Christian apologists.
That's absolute nonsense. Tell me about one of these "incredible things" that cannot be explained without a god. Oh, you really do need to list an example. Lol. And how is a god even a candidate explanation as we have zero evidence for gods?
Dude, you cannot even prove that Muhammad was illiterate. And you cannot even prove that Muhammad came up with the quran. This is how bad this is.
And your claims get even worse when especially muslim apologists in contrast to you like to paint a picture that in arabia back then there was like the biggest center of poetry on earth.
Also wrong, atheism is not a belief. This is so bad...
@@endlessnutella8612 1) No, muslims just don't have good arguments. This is why no one should be convinced that islam is true.
2) Some god isn't an explanation for anything until there is evidence for gods. You better give an example.
3) No, I watch muslim, christian and atheist content. Muslim apologists are even worse than christian apologists. And that's saying much.
4) Islam isn't special at all. The scripture is dull and disgusting. Prove that he actually was illiterate. Good luck. And why does it matter if he had scribes? Especially in arabia poetry was a relatively big thing, they pretty much didn't produce anything else.
6) Wrong again. Atheism is not a belief. It's lack of belief.
I used to believe that there is no God, no Creator, etc. I was convinced of this because of all the injustice I had seen and experienced, how could a Creator create something so huge and powerful and let it run wild. I saw religion as emotional blind faith, but even then from my very basic and prejudiced knowledge of Islaam, I saw some morality in it, some guidance, which I had spent 15 years looking for elsewhere, no one, not even Muslims themselves (from my limited experience) had tried to tell me the truth, I saw everyone just chasing material wealth and comfort sometimes under the guise of religion.
I was too hurt and unhealthy to be a part of the might is right system, God knows I tried, so I set out on my journey of creating God. An Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) that'd watch over the entire planet and establish justice. That was a huge undertaking, I had to gain knowledge from a vast array of fields.
This led me to a lot of new challenges, modeling something on human Intelligence with justice and benevolence as its driver started to open my eyes to the reality we're trapped inside. Asking questions like when do we intervene in a situation that according to our predictions is about to lead to violence? what about triggers and stimuli that lead to violence... do we work to reduce them or would that be going to far?
and there were the question of rights, I believed strongly that everyone had the right to privacy, but wasn't this for their own good, and the greater good.
this and many many other reflections led me very slowly and steadily to submitting my will to the Unseen Creator over a period of several years of sharp learning curves and intuitive realizations. Replicating speech, sight, hearing, decision making, learning, rationality, self-analysis, ... was more than enough to help me realize that this huge intelligently designed universe was not without an extremely Powerful Designer.
I was never emotional, that was actually one of the things people would criticize me about. I was seen as a detached & silent rebel. After Islaam, alhumdulillah, I went through a metamorphosis in manners, body language and knowledge. A world of knowledge opened up to me and I'm still learning.
That's an incredible story, thanks for sharing.
Masha'Allah, you sought the truth and you found it, I'm very happy for you, may Allah reward you heavily for your efforts, ameen.
@@chrischow9085 but universe also contains matter which exists after creation. such creation is unachievable by we ppl
@@affanali9966 read edgar andrew's (a physicist) book "who created God"
@@chrischow9085 God doesnt really mean a creature or something like that.
The way the universe works, the way everything sets into place, it only makes sense if a creator existed. But creator is a wide term the creator can just be something in a higher dimension, something that guides the progress of the universe.
Now what religion is an idea about the nature of that creator, maybe a God in haven, maybe odin in asgard, etc.
But there is something thats guiding the progress of the universe from its genesis and whatever that is, its God.
Now we can keep arguing about its nature all day and we will never reach anywhere.
Tbh as a physics and maths student all i wish for is to someday prove God with maths XD.
An old strategy: “if you can’t convince them, confuse them”.
Wait I'm confused 😂😂
Exactly Krauss went on a random arrogant tangent filled with fallacies of all kinds since he knew he couldn't challenge Hamza and Islam's claims/evidence.
Fatima Waseem what evidence are you talking about? 😂
Zem GoldLine The evidence of the miraculous,linguistic,inimitable nature of the Quran. And the only possibilities of the Prophet Muhammad, either liar/deluded or speaking the truth. And we can deduce from his life,history,events,psychological profile,prophecies,success against all impossible odds and teachings/positive impact that he was indeed a truthful Prophet of God. And also caused the Islamic Golden age that caused the the renaissance and enlightenment period giving rise to all these advancements/technology/knowledge . And creation of Oxford university too.
@@Fatima_33 The tricks they generally pull is "what if", "might be" "could be" should be"... Man! We have got families to feed in this age of Capitalism and you are talking about the could-bes and the should-bes.
I would rather take a word of wisdom even if the challenged its divinity than a confused set of statements that never give a certain answer and are a lifelong quest finding the found.
We have got bigger and better things to do in the world.
Cheering should really not be allowed during the debates
This is how assholes prove their statements
They really turn it into sports
they remind me of a group of chimpanzees excited when they encounter a lion. I saw them on National Geography channel last week
Well it’s allowed take the message idiot
Yeah totally agreed
Who is watching in 2025?
11 years later and still gold
First time watching
Lawrence krauss is watching under anonymous account still trying to sway the comments section in his favor
Me. And still embarrassed by the cheering muslim majority audience which had no idea what's going on, just like the vast majority of the muslims in the comment section.
@@joerdim Cope Harder
krauss calls Tzortzis rude for mentioning the U.S. but it isn't rude to point your finger at a man's face and call him ignorant during a debate??
yo tzortzis is killin it rn bro
@Ахрор Кабулов chill he said 3.14 lmaoo
@Ахрор Кабулов Oh yeah you really showed me, thanks so much! I'll listen to your words exactly.
@Shinobi gamer Lol Shinobi leave him be. Allah SWT knows best, and knows those whose heart's are sealed. We can only know Allah better, and please him in this dunya. All will be made clear in the akhira.
@Axopop is a troll.. Writing the same baseless question in every comment
As a born Christian (currently agnostic - but I lean Abrahamic meaning I view all scriptures that claim Abrahamic origins as potentially true and from God) who often watches these sort of debates - I think its quite obvious that Krauss danced around responding to the argument made by Hamza (one can only assume because he had no valid counter to offer up outside of his opinion based off of his personal worldview and knowledge). Krauss was intentionally rude and disrespectful while claiming his intent was not to offend people only to disagree with their ideas. If that were true he would have chosen his words - which vI know he is well capable of doing - more wisely. Its not what he is saying but how he is saying it at times that is the problem. Then he takes offense when Hamza says things regarding America in a certain way - what a double standard! He got up tot he podium and 1. made almost no response to the argument that Hamza offered up 2. He then began to take sensationalized perspectives regarding beliefs of Muslims to try and back Hamza into a corner - which felt was an attempt to say "see! this is Gods creation - why would God create something this way just to call it a sin?". The problem with that is that All 3 Abrahamic scriptures have very reasonable answers to that question - does Krauss think he is the first to raise this? His ignorance of the religion coming into this debate was absolutely insulting and just showed his outrageous arrogance regarding his own worldview and knowledge. I would choose to be a part of Hamza's community over someone like Krauss any day of the week. To call himself an educator is laughable.....he doesn't want to influence discussion and critical thinking - what he actually does is first deflect by using criticism that is practically irrelevant to the topic at hand and then when all else fails completely avoid the theme of the discussion altogether - highjacking it to take it in his own direction in order to control the narrative.
You should look into islam sister as its the most preserved abrahamic religion and makes sense with only one true all knowing God with no partners unlike for e.g christianity with the whole idea of the trinity.
Perhaps it's his arrogance that's keeping him from accepting the truth. Happens to a lot of people.
Very well said! Hamza seemed more educated than Krauss. A professor shouldn't be acting this way, especially when invited to speak.
I would also humbly suggest you the RUclips channel, The Deen Show, which has interviews with former Christians and Jews (& sometimes atheists). I personally loved it and hope the same for you.
Finally someone said it, very eloquently and elegantly put
I don't usually read long comments but this one is beautifully written, wonderful comment God bless you 👏🏿👏🏿
Six ways to earn good deeds even after death:
1. Give a copy of Qur’an to someone. Each time one reads from it, you gain.
2. Donate a wheelchair to a hospital. Each time a sick or injured person uses it, you gain.
3. Participate in the building a Masjid. Every time a person uses it to worship Allah (SWT), you gain.
4. Build a well or place a water cooler in a public place. Every time somebody drinks from it, you gain.
5. Plant a tree. whenever a person or animal sits in its shade or eats from it, you gain
6. And the easiest of all, share this message with other people.
May Allah (SWT) bless you all and grant you Jannah, inshallah
Gunther Vincent Yes. You can do all of these things when you’re alive of course. But when you die, you can not take anything with you. Therefore all you have to show for yourself is your deeds. Try to do things that have a long and positive impact on the world continuously even after you’re in the grave and awaiting judgement. Your good deeds will continue to stack even after you’re gone inshallah.
Gunther Vincent Oh sorry brother. I didn’t come here to debate. Just a friendly advice to Muslims or anyone who finds interest in the topic. May Allah grant you Hidayah and inshallah you will be led down the right path.
Ameen, Jamian In Sha Allah.
Can I get points by just jerking off XXXVIDEOS and smoking pot?
Michael Bachman... The words that comes in my mind are ... Sucker, Dumbass, Retard, Goofy, Bozo, Brainless and finally GREENPEACE...
00:00:24 Introduction | Timothy Yusuf Chambers
00:06:30 Opening Remarks | Hamza Tzortzis
00:32:02 Opening Remarks | Lawrence Krauss
00:59:33 Rebuttal | Hamza Tzortzis
01:14:28 Rebuttal | Lawrence Krauss
01:22:43 Summary Discussion
01:42:07 Question & Answer Session
02:06:00 Closing Remarks | Lawrence Krauss
02:07:50 Closing Remarks | Hamza Tzortzis
What's the point?
the guy in the middle was having the time of his life
Brother Yusuf Chambers
Yeah his happiness makes me happy 😂
the physics of star 'trak' ? he doesn't even know what he's talking about.
This kind of issue is wrong on the begining, its Impossible have discussion between One religion with atheism, with seems two stuborn Doors talking
Both are arrogants because they protect themselves from no really true arguments, they wont Change their believes or learn anything with this debate
Clicks on Video. Press Pause. Scroll down to comments. Grabs popcorn.
Same here
Yeah ...
I did that and got bored - then went back to the video.
Lol :) I did exactly that.
gets out bingo card
Hahaha you must be mind reader
Quran 52.35-36 “Or were they created by nothing, or were they the creators [of themselves]? Or did they create the heavens and the earth? Rather, they are not certain.”
Actually , Krauss is "place a term here" enough to believe that something could come out of nothing...
@@nadimahmed8485 I'm criticizing him.
@v k speak in human.
@Gunther Vincent
1- Islam doesn't tell you to kill all nonbeliever's. That's BS.
2- you can't as an atheist say that it's wrong. Because you don't have a moral compass.
+
Why don't you take this killing as a way to survival ? I mean killing those who oppose me means that there is more resources for me.
Jason Voorhees lol soz misread
As an atheist and a physics major Hamza was humble and admirable while Krauss acted like a 5yo
He was humble? Never saw someone humbly say so much nonsense and make so much claims arrogantly without bringing any proof.
@@surgigi1582 you don't really know what humble means do you?lol
@@surgigi1582bro what 😭 you really don't understand what this word means, do you?
krauss was fantastic
@@cunctator3401 You don't understand Sarcasm, do you? what smart dudes you Muslims are.
After 1 hour and 9 minutes Mr. Krauss said "i am only asking because i want to learn." So saying "everything you said is crap or nonsense" is called "asking" ?
lol very true
That's what they do all the time, "i dont know" "i wanna know" type of sentences
Since when atheist got morality? They are denial..that what Hamza is showing the world.
@@luqman2626 Hamza is definitley a better at debates but it doesnt mean he is correct. I would love to see him debate another atheist that can have better composure
"I never learned about Islam because it's nonsense" then suddenly "I'm asking because I want to learn"
Lol
I saw this whole debate, Mr. L Krauss was less debater and more lecturer, I think he couldn't convince to even give his initial statement. I really very much impressed from Mr. Hamza God bless him for his penitents
gods blessings are nice
but the truth is more important
like with this Covid, god is not going to save us, we need scientists now and THEIR truth
that is reality
and Hamza ignoring reality is being extremely impolite and disrespectful
debates are not fights about lies, they should be about facts
Due to covid mecca closed allu lullu failed. Case is closed for stone licker islamic pagans
"Patience".
jamal Durani they came here for two diff reasons. Hamza came to win over the audience with rhetorical power and Krauss wanted an honest discussion.
@@MrKaugaban i may be low rank but not then muhmmad ( messenger of saitan).
6:30 start of the debate
Praise to you
Ty
You're the real mvp.
HI lets begin.
@@TheyCallHimTheTops
All praise to the creator
This debate is the reason bcz of which i started again praying.
What convinced you that Islam is true? Can you say it in your own words?
@@joerdim first of all it addresses the identity question very well, it is purpose oriented religion, it desciplines your life, it gives you a very warmth community but puts individual responsibility to only one God, it comes with rich history of Sufism and philosophy. I find it much useful than following political ideologies.
@@Islamicepistemology This has nothing to do with the question what convinced you that Islam is true. You answered why you think Islam is useful to you.
Also, religion is not necessary to discipline one's life or get a warm community. And why would anybody need individual responsibility to one god? Rich history you can also find pretty much everywhere. And why is a rich history important? Philosophical thoughts you can also dig into without following a religion.
@@joerdim I find islamic metaphysics much relatable to me than Western platonism. The modernity of west driven by materialism has exhausted me. I find islam to be the only pure monothestic religion which stands firm on philosophical ground.
@@Islamicepistemology Cool story. Would you answer my question now?
No one is going to say he looks like Mahone from Prison Break
Ya Allah;;; Ya Muhammad ;;; Ya imam Ali;;; Ya Imam Mahdi (as)
He even sound so..🤣🤣
@Sabir When you say name of prophet Muhammad (SAWW) you praise Him and His family (ahlul bayt) prophet said Ali is also my ahlul bayt.
Ahlul Bayt >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sahabi
Eventhough, Both are righteous but ahlul bayt is something else espiecally first caliph and imam Imam Ali (as)
Hahahahahaha Agent Mahone
I swear to Allah I thought the same. I’m like damn, they got the greatest investigator in the world against Islam lol jk
The level of rude from Krauss is a man who’s unhinged and knows he’s lost the argument before it started.
His rudeness is the perfect example of why the faithful deem atheism as sinful. Atheism is NOT the disbelief of there being a God. Atheism is a state of DENIAL and RIDICULE, not of true disbelief.
@@serviogaming5169 please dont spread lies it's a sin dont forget
@@serviogaming5169 and yeah atheism is disbelief in god, we criticize the idea of god because it discourages people for trying to learn and because it has no evidence supporting it, and tbh Islam says alot of evil stuff and scientific illiterate stuff that's why anti theists think it's bad (anti theists are NOT all atheists)
@Ismail Ibrahim Wow. Goddamm, you muslims are REALLY smart! I love when someone can use words like that
If you listen to tsorzis opening statements he was actually quite rude but he was very subtle, it was passive aggressive with a smile. Add to that Krauss was pissed off even before this debate started because the men and women where seperated in the audience and he refused to take part unless it was changed. Krauss ruffled his feathers so you could see tsorzis true colours. Tsorzis even had to remind himself to calm down when his mask dropped.
The most amazing part of the debate was that Krauss managed to drink out of an empty glass multiple times
thats what Atheism is giving him
@@nazhir4156 what religion give you?
@@YTwatcher926 a purpose
He was demonstrating water comes from nothing 🤣
Because he quenches his thrist from nothing. That is called atheism
Krauss interrupts all the time! I am an atheist but is not polite and he doesn’t let Hamza end his argument. I was interested in listening to his explanations but Krauss doesn’t let him finish anything.
He’s simply not allowing Hamza to do what almost every single advocate of religion does, which is pontificate about a bunch of baseless concepts before pinning the opponent with an impossible question, made so by the fact that you can’t answer nonsense with sense and make sense, you can only erase it which is not the point of the debate. It’s a cheap advantage you have when your entire argument is based off of made up things that are so subjective you can alter them whenever needed to suit you. As expected, Hamza starts strong with a rehearsed sermon which he spared no punches inserting condescending puns and pointedly religious deceitfully innocuous phrases, yet falters when countered with a similar biting “tough love” presentation.
Hamza fizzles out because he has nothing to pull from but stories, so when he can’t gain momentum by playing the “friendly innocent”, he’s got nothing else to rebuttal with.
It is typical of an atheists. If I have a student I'd rather him not to raise hands during the lecture & save it up for later bc most probably his query is gonna get solved after listening to the lecture.But atheists would not let you complete your explaination for they know it's gonna start making sense.
@@Brandon-ml2zw lol how arrogant of you , regardless of arguments krauss should be able to act with respect and guess what he didn't. hamza complete dismantle everything krauss had to say if anything krauss is clearly not well verse in philosophy
@@ignvongola123 Why do you think Hamza's argument for the existence of this god should be convincing?
Nobody is fooled by all of these comments by Muslims that all follow the same formula and begin with "I'm an atheist but [Muslim apologist] was correct about everything".
the patience of hamza left me speeachless, i would have lost it. but he kept so calm and still talked with so much respect. lord please give me a husband like him i pray for someone so respectful, patience understanding brilliant. his wife should be so proud of him. bless this man
The husband you pray for you will reject..those men you speak of would never believe in Islam
Ameen, I pray Allah SWT bless you with a husband like him, say Ameen 😄
From where r u sis??
@@NoName-zp7bg from where r u bro? 😂😂😂
amin
Hamza is also ex-aethist , it was undoubtedly easy for him to handle.
Mashallah
Ramadan Mubarak 🙏❣️
Alsamohsin Alsamohsin really? i thought he is an arab muslim. MasyaaAllah
He's greek
@@nurhidayahharidzulzain1077 he's Greek. He said as much in the debate
@@nurhidayahharidzulzain1077 hes greek, look at his last name
Hamza got rocked.
2:05:24 Krauss drinking water from Empty glass
"Something from nothing". 😂
LMAFOOOOO
underrated comment 😂😂😂
@@fbbinoire201 ikr 2 likes
😂true 👍🏻
Lolll
What an amazing debate. Really made me rethink a lot of things. Over the years I have been trying my best to remove my prejudices and stand on the other end: to understand the people whose views oppose. May I unlearn arrogance which I am susceptible to sometimes. May I be so tolerant that I could reason with clarity. For we are here for a short time and there is so much to learn.
I hope everyone aspires to be like you in this regard
Hope you find the right message of Islam and Allah give you strength to accept Islam.
You are not what you think you are.
@@WealthyandNerdy keep on mocking
with this mindse5, in sha2a llah you will understand why and how islam is the truth.
instead of defending his standpoint, the hatred in his heart made him come after Islam
@@chrischow9085 u have alot to learn about body language .. try reading both speakers and u'll see
@Jack Michaelson guess you're the one who's not
@H H @jack michaelson you are the biggest idiot
@Jack Michaelson just like the speaker talks about things that dont relate to the debate
@Jack Michaelson lmao bro you're handing out 'f-cking idiot!"s like oprah
I’m an atheist, but Krauss’ atitudes during this debate was terrible. Even though I agree that someone’s attitude towards a subject has no bearing over the truth of a claim, Hamza did a greater job at interacting with the audience and presenting his perspective in more polite manner. I hope Krauss can learn from this experience and improve his debating skills, cause this was just hard to watch, he came off as the angry and arrogant atheist, something most of us atheists have been trying to get away from.
I dont think it was terrible (i am a staunch muslim) i think prof krauss's frustration was genuine. The debate format wasnt optimized enough in my opinion. I am a muslim who believes in islam but i accept that it takes a certain convincing to do so, and to a HIGHLY reputed professor like dr. krauss? I think the format should be in a very different manner. However I do wish such a debate should be there.
Firstly i think proof of islam can be debated in MANY ways. For example, scientifically, mathematically, logically, literally, ontologically, historically etc. We need to keep it focused.
Secondly, after keeping it focused to one discipline and one discipline alone (since i believe that since Allah is true, i believe that Allah's evidence always overpowers other evidences) we need to get professors in that area. And not just any professors, top professors in the world.
Thirdly, you have to figure out which aspect of religion you are arguing. Islam will not speak of christianity and vice versa. If it is religion vs athiesm we need to figure out which religion.
Fourthly, we need to document every statement according to laws of the subject. For instance, if i say something like i believe in islam due to the historical facts and if i give a 3 minute lecture on the proof of it, my statement should be there to present on some screen. One line statement. Otherwise word picking will occur and no matter how good a professor is, he is human and emotions will come and it is our job as people of science to come to a conclusion while negating human emotion as much as we can.
Fifthly, There should be no timelimit. This is not a debate of today and can not really be concluded like that.
Sixthly, every statement that is presented must be backed by some sort of evidence (suggesting REALLY high levels of scholars). If someone negates athiestic views based on ontological argument there must be atleast a google search on the worldly accepted definition and AXIOMS of ontological argument and there should be a THIRD party discussion that agrees it.
Seventhly, this can not be done in one video or something because it will take DAYS and stuff but i think it is required. Athiests believe that religion is the cause of violence and i believe intolerance is the cause of violence and i think since violence is a HUGE problem of today's world, we must come together as different religions to figure out a solution. You cant coexist like that if there are extremists everywhere. To make things better we need such dialogues.
Lastly i think there should be many teams having different roles including a third party that VALIDATES the facts these guys give.
@@MrCuteguylol I agree that his frustration was genuine, but my problem is not with his sincerity towards how he feels, it’s with how he handled himself becoming very emotional during the debate. That’s not a good sign in any intellectual debate, as the truth about reality has no bearing to your feelings and should be presented with good arguments and evidences rather than Ad Hominem and Straw-manning (which both debaters actually did to each other, but Krauss was very rude while Hamza was doing it more for the laughs).
When it comes to convincing, it’s not as complicated as many people make it be. What a lot of these debates do is talk about philosophical arguments for a God, which to some theists, not all, can be misconstrued as evidence, while for most atheists, philosophy, while being a very useful epistemological tool, to be proven or show with a highly probability of being a reality must follow some method to be verified in its validity. The thing is, the best method most skeptics trust is the scientific method, rather than the methods many theists have claimed to use to reach their conclusions, since to us, are methods that can be used to reach other conclusions, demonstrating that it’s not a good method.
For example, here are some methods I’ve seen used by some Christians to prove that their God is the real one: “faith, revelation, holy text, philosophy, personal experience, historical events”. All of these examples can also be used to reach any other religion or any other belief system, ones that may very well contradict each other. Now, to discern who is right and who is wrong, the scientific method is the best tool for the job, one that is based purely on deducing the facts of reality by verifiable experiments by postulating predictions on what we might find in the scenario the hypothesis is correct, and if the findings is constant with the predictions made, it can become a theory, the highest awarded rank to an explanation for a phenomenon in science.
I believe that if any theist wants to convince a skeptic (not just an atheist, many atheists aren’t skeptics, but most are) is presenting the type of scientific evidence I said. Philosophy, Math, History, while being useful tools, aren’t good enough for knowing and understanding a a concept like “God”. There are many branches of philosophy that contradict each other, there are concepts in Math that are impossible, like irrational numbers and history, while correct at many times, is a hard method to determine what was true in the past, certainly getting it wrong in many stances because of how hard it is to very some events.
I agree with most of what you said in how debates should be organized and conducted to maximize efficiency in the debate. I’ll even go as far as to say that committing argumentation fallacies should always be noted and understood between debaters, as many don’t always address them, especially for the audience to understand why that argument show fallacious reasoning behind it.
There is no point in having debates where the debaters will be: dishonest, rude, dodge arguments/question, misrepresent the other, assert claims without providing evidence, etc. Any platform and debaters that can minimize these, in my view, independently on their views, will be a lot more productive.
Exactlyyyy!!!! totally agreed with you. However, no matter how impossible this may seem, its equally necessary. Because coexistence will occur and people will fight against each other unless there is some sort of representation.
I am sorry but the Muslim speaker has been just as condescending but he was more playing to his crowd. It is easy to argue out of a religious perspective because you can always retrude yourself in a moral high-ground. Science isn't moral but factual, so moral argument are totally sensless to have. Also his constant Arabic input in between are just terribly distracting and derailing for any non-muslim listener.
@@bodo887 Both were condescending in how I see it, but Hamza played it off a lot better. I don’t think neither of them ended up being good debaters. However, since I’m an atheist and I see that this position is the best position to be in, I expect that the debater defending this doesn’t do it with ad Hominems and overall bad explanations and reasoning like Krauss did. My expectations for the atheists are much higher precisely because i believe they are in the more reasonable perspective, it’s the reason I enjoy Matt Dillahunty’s debates a lot, as he not only understand religions very well in general, he knows about argumentation fallacies, which every debater should have at least a basic understanding of, which Krauss and Hamza lacked.
Not saying I would have done better then Krauss, but there were multiple moments I would have presented something completely different than what he decided to present to counter arguments. Look at how off guard he was with the “incest” morality, he should be more prepared to defend his opinion, even if it is taboo. He used an argumentation that it is ok, but the chances of having children with mental disabilities is high. Even though his statement about it is true, this is bad reasoning at its core, since he implies that a relationship necessarily needs to end in reproduction, which isn’t the case, as we can obviously see with homosexual/assexual couples. It’s also bad because it would imply that couples with genetical mental disabilities shouldn’t reproduce, which is a complicated subject, since you’re talking about taking away someone’s basic right, like having a child, because of a disorder.
I agree with him that two consenting adults that happen to be close family should have the freedom to decide what they want. It’s none of my business if this is what they want for their life, that’s probably what he thinks as well. The reason for this is because my moral judgement parts on the notion that your freedom cannot come in conflict with the collective freedom. Two adults in love that want to be together doesn’t harm anyone, so it should be a right, even if it’s looked upon as wrong or unnatural by our culture and upbringing.
He should have been more prepared for this debate and more prepared to deal with his own emotions. In many people’s minds that don’t know many atheists, he’s up there representing who an atheist is. Hamza used Krauss’ anger to his own advantage and made atheists look like they are angry and unreasonable, which causes the atheist community more harm than good.
As Mr Krauss came into the debate so confidently I expected something of a good fight. Hamza sat him down without needing to compromise on his modesty and humbleness. Embarrassing
@Jimmi K Krauss was the twat. Hamza was the reasonable one.
@Jimmi K Watch the debate again pal.
@Jimmi K dude, stop being delusional. Hamza clearly won. Krauss was being an idiot.
Completely agree with Jimmi K - Hamza was just awful in this. He can barely present a point without having to change the subject.
@Jimmi K I disagree - there are plenty of islamic scholars who, while I don't agree with their ideas, are much more honest interlocutors than Hamza. It was shocking to watch him commit all kinds of rhetorical errors, and then turn around and accuse Dr. Krauss of the very things he was doing.
Back when i was an atheist i used to think pple like kraus were geniuses. Dawkins, hitchens. But alhamdillah when i re-found my faith in the truth i see how arrogant, ideological, irrational and dogmatic these people are. I came to realize my admiration for these people was based purely on them “owning” people of faith which fed an insecurity i had which made me feel good about thinking i was intellectually superior to 7 biilion people. Hamdillah for choosing me to come back to Islam. SubhanAllah may he guide whom he wills.
Well, you are obviously not intellectually superior to 7 billion people. Such much is clear.
What's your definition of faith and why do you now think thst Allah actually exists?
@@joerdim Thats why I said "THINKING I was intelectually superior". So i may not be intectually superior to 7 billion people, but to you, who cant even read well, I am.
Faith is having complete conviction in something. I wouldnt call it "belief" it is knowing that the Quran is from Allah and no one else. And the reason for that is because it is prophetic in history, science, and future events, all of which at the time could not have been known by anything less than the creator.
Why do you think he doesnt?
@@Stonnin No, dude, I was making an additional statement. You thought you were, I know you weren't.
What do you mean by full conviction? 100% certainty or simply that you are convinced? Knowledge is a subset to belief, so when you know then you automatically also believe.
Show me a so-called prophecy with a pinpoint time designation and a message that cannot be interpreted in another way in the quran and what it has to do with a god. Go!
I never said he doesn't. Are you trying to dishonestly strawman me?
People do this all the time. It's just human nature, jumping from one dogma to another. We have to live with a belief system. I've read just as many comments of people saying the same people Dawkins, Hitchens pulled them out of their dogmatic religions.
Well you got theism right. Now find out the truth about Christ.
to all human beings:
when you want to win
you don't learn.
Very interesting what you said but can you explain it a lttle better what you mean?
Yusuf Altug if you start arguing not for the validity of your viewpoint but rather just to push your viewpoint you become bias and people will call you out on that. When you become bias you will ignore opposite reason to push your reason and people will call out that flaw.
@@easy5989 the moment you come to know that were wrong just admit it. when you become this kind of person no one can overpower you because you never get disappointed. its actually being true to yourself
@@bestoddlysatisfyingshorts8729 Entire quote sounds great, the last sentence is uplifting🙏🏿
@@tyronevaldez-kruger5313 thank you sir
Krauss is extremely rude and arrogant, having different beliefs doesn't mean to be rude and disrespect others.
because the belief is bad the believers are mostly ok
@@MKermy umm did you see the video? I think you should do your research first and don't believe what anyone tells you about a specific belief without researching it.
@@bo5235 ah yes I'm not doing my research I was a muslim for most of my life until i left the horrible religion took months of research before I actually left
@@MKermy "horrible" yeah ok
Well I'm going to assume the best and say that Maybe you have had contradictions between traditions and culture and the actual religion and it's rulings,maybe you didn't reaserch in a right way or you didn't ask scholars because i heard about a lot of people who act as if they've left islam and they were not even Muslims in the first place.
And if we were talking in real life I would've asked you how many rakaas is in fajr or asr but because we are talking on the internet you could easily search it.
I hope you're happy and comfortable with your life and i hope god forgives you and shows you the right path.
@@bo5235 and just as a cherry on top, 2 4 4 3 4 that's the order:) I literally prayed everyday I started fasting at 7 I was a devoted to it
I guess I'm going back to school to repeat learning English.
@@goatfied-7362 The fact u spelled common as comment is concerning and I think you should learn yourself before criticizing others.
@@goatfied-7362 You spelled sense wrong too, please just stop, you're just insulting yourself.
@@goatfied-7362 Correcting someone means you have no knowledge?
@@xVoid42 you have to go down to IQ level 0 to argue the dude @GoatfiedNY
@@lly_09 Lol, I'm not arguing, just telling him not to say mean stuff to other people when he can't do what he's trying to correct them for. (this makes like little to no sense but u get what I mean)
I’m not Moslem per say, but some islamic scholars do have a very interesting intellectual presence about themselves that I’ve always admired.
Its smug self assurance every Muslim/ middle eastern person I've met thinks that everyone around them is a filthy dog and that only they have the right to paradise
As an ex-muslim I can tell you Islam is one of the worst religioun on the world dont trust it
Hamza sure doesn’t. He’s a sophist and really uses rhetorical arguments. So did Krauss tho, almost every time he started a new point. But Krauss was genuinely involved in the discussion here and there, especially with the comebacks.
Intellectual presence? All they offer are non sensual excuses for reasoning & fairytales from the Koran..
That's the thing with the word intellectuality everyone can perceive it differently. To me being intellectual is being objective wich Muslim scholars try to be but can't because they follow a man made religion.
When someone starts insulting the other, it usually means they lost already, "infinitely" lol.
@@chrischow9085 When your good friends with Jeffery Epstein who was arrested for pedophilia, you have already lost.
@@chrischow9085 poor arguement
@@chrischow9085 prove it
@@chrischow9085 you're lying or you've been lied to if you really believe that lmao. For centuries and centuries, his worst of enemies didn't even conjure up these lies, doesn't that say a lot chris😂, go ahead and do your research or believe these lies, you know what they say " ignorance is bliss"
@@chrischow9085 when you hesitate regarding Incest .. you are toasted
It’s amazing how Hamza sat Krauss down in the second round. krauss thought he could bag the debate but damn Hamza is intelligent and logical..
I’ve been watching a lot of debates on atheism vs islam - and it appears that atheist speakers always don’t do self study on the opponent belief and would just make ignorant statements and waited for opponents to educate them.
chris chow you know krauss messed up that’s why you defend him 😊
@@chrischow9085 you don't know how to argue, sit back down.
@@chrischow9085 did you watch the debate backwards or something?
Guys relax.
@@chrischow9085 Okay, tell us where he messed up. Go on.
A New Muslim Alhamdulillah from Atheism... The Reason was Atheism has No Set of Rules to Live Live peacefully with mental satisfaction... Alhamdulillah Allah selected Me
❤️🙏🏻
LOLL brainwashed
You're not an atheist. Never was. Don't lie.
@@globalcoupledances we all obey those things
then u never were an atheist but a moron
It’s easy to criticise Kraus for his attitude but it’s very hard to have a proper debate in a room full of people less intelligent. You’ll never win the argument and always be seen as the fool. Put Humza in a room of physicists and see how frustrated he get.
Finally someone said it!
He doesn't even understand deductive reasoning which is the premise of the existence of mathematics. For a scientists, he seems more like a fraud lol.
@@autisticman4396ridiculous cope
I agree, muslims will always say the same stuff, many of them didnt read anything besides Quaran and they are stubborn, so yes, I understand Krauss.
THIS
Brother Hamza you're still young, amazing, knowledgeable and handsome person may Allah protect you from evil eye
what about the djinns? does he need protection against them too?
@@chrischow9085 you mean extremely educated unlike your stupid self
There is no evil eye
@@sbsjdahxxbbsbsbdjsjs8368 is he the one who is believing in a god that has not been proven and there is absolutely no proof that God exists. Is he the one that is uneducated or is it you who is wrongly educated. People like you have been brainwashed by everyone in your community to force you to believe that God exists. And islamic religion is by no means a peaceful religion. In nearly half the islamic countries, you are executed for being an atheist.
Leena Khaneja my guy the main most strict country which is Saudi Arabia which in fact is where Islam originated allows atheists and any other religion to be accepted equally into they society. The Quran even mentions that disbelievers in Islam should not have any conflict with believers since all we are trying to do is to invite to Islam we will not have any conflict with the disbelievers and should be minding our own business unless if we are here to promote, defend ourselves or invite someone to Islam it says in Surat al kaferoon, in fact there are more unmuslim countries that are putting unhuman laws and punishments into their law, such as North Korea. The fact that you immediately assume that we are uneducated because we have a belief is just wrong and stupid tbh.
Hamza taught me how to calm with such a rude personality.. truly gentleman he is!
but he is most disrespectful and arrogant
not gentle at all
in the real world, people who use lies are rude, and speaking facts and truth is respectful, not the other way around
islam is the opposite of reality, and Hamza is most annoying and disrespectful, defending his beliefs as if they are facts
Bro do you meet hamza?
@H H haha?
Hamza is not a scientist but a child rapist worshiper
that's why
see?
@H H no, I do not HAVE to lie, I told you and explained that
so why do you have to lie about me?
why do YOU need lies? do you also worship that child raping pig?
@H H No |I am not
do you lie because you worship a child rapist?
this was in 2013??? lmao watching in 2020 during this pandemic
Me too bro, me too lol
Jesus is the only way to the father
@@emidiorrr5755 Islam is the only way to god...
@@fcbkingmessi4664 Islam is the most stupid pagan cult, totally man-made. You are brainwashed idiot.
@@George-iv1hi well we need arguments you can't say that and you don't even have knowledge
As a previous atheist I used to Admire Lawerence , Sagan, and Hawkins. After reverting March 2023 I realized all those books I used to read wasn’t science because they were purely speculative they would tell you science then right after they show you the HOW they remind you their interpretation is their view on God. No connection between the two but if u say it right afterwards after people are blown with the work of the creator peoples brain will auto pair the two things together.
Carl Sagan isn't atheist he's agnostic
@@Coolmaster-kj4sr Which most probably means that he is an atheist since most theists would call themselves gnostic theists.
@@MaturingMinds Wtf is this gibberish? Is there any coherent point in this? Btw, "reverting" is a nonsense term which outs you as someone who doesn't know what he is talking about.
@@Coolmaster-kj4srboth are on same track. They don't know wtf is god
Just because you haven't discovered a thing doesn't mean that a thing doesn't exist. Humans are not supreme.
It doesn’t mean it does exist either lol
I can’t prove the Flying Spaghetti Monster doesn’t exist, does that mean it actually exists?
Ramen, brother.
@@kaiza6467 you prove my point with your statement, "I can't prove." Just because YOU can't prove something or experience something doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. You cannot began to comprehend the grand design of this universe and the creature that are in it.
Remember, science "discover" new things all the time. Doesn't mean that those things just appear or exist upon human discovery.
panda berries you’re missing my point.
It isn’t scientific at all to just assume things exist just because you can’t prove they don’t exist.
Because it’s impossible to prove a negative.
@@kaiza6467 Hamza already explained that he's not talking science. He was talking deduction and logic, abstract views of the universe that everyone can concur to without proof. 1+1=2 full stop
Ryuga Law if panda was just making a random, non-religious statement that “you can’t know everything in the universe” then sure, I think that’s true.
But if you were to use the fact that we don’t know everything as a reason to imply there IS a “grand designer”, then that logic is flawed.
Because you could come up with an infinite number of possible creator beings, like my Flying Spaghetti Monster example, presuppose it designed everything and the argument would be the same.
“You can’t know everything, therefor you can’t prove the creator being from MY religion designed the entire universe.”
That’s not how logic works.
The time to believe something is when there is sufficient reason to.
until watching this video I thought I know English 😪😪😪😅😓😹😄😓😓
hamzah is dictionary itself
@@daudwani8429 Nullius in verba
Ahhahahaahah
True dude..
Just a language, Doesn't matter, Focus on the content
As soon as the professor started talking made this really hard to watch. Having a difference of opinion is fine, it happens but his attitude was quite frankly pathetic and expected better.
Your opinion was preformed, then. “As soon as he started talking..”, you say? Open your mind
@@heathermimiwahlquist5587 and how about you open your eyes. I clearly said I expected better. I held high hope's. But he delivered the opposite.
It’s Kraus...that’s his personality. He’s a professor first, so he doesn’t try to make friends, just tries to stick to the facts and gets angry quickly when someone is avoiding obvious facts. He won’t win any personally contests..
He was alleged with sexual molestation what more can we expect.
Really man he so rude
"Let's allow that time exists outside of the universe. Given the laws of nature, then the universe can and will spontaneously come into existence!"
That line has to be the most unscientific statement ever uttered by a practising scientist!
Yes and no. The idea of time existing 'outside of the universe' and being an idea that we might 'allow' is effectively a statement of faith, ironically, which doesn't exactly help his argument. What's more useful is the idea that the laws of our universe also imply the existence of non-laws - they have to, or the laws won't work. For example, 'light travels at 186,000 miles per second' must also also mean that 'light does not travel at 185,999 miles per second' i.e. such laws are really about what can't happen, not what can happen. In a situation that's 'pre-universe' (a slightly misleading idea since time won't exist in such a situation, but let's work with it for now) there are no laws saying what can't happen, so the spontaneous creation of a universe is perfectly allowable - and quite possibly inevitable.
@@zaxzaxx4561 exactly 💯
You see, he based his whole argument off an unproven premise , namely..." ... let's pretend that time exists outside of the universe..." And then continues to argue with passion from then on. So ridiculous, don't you think so?
@@ismailhamza5219 Like I said, it sounds like a statement of faith. I would define all statements of faith as unproven premises. He presumably has a problem conceiving of a situation in which time doesn't exist, which is a significant - but not insuperable - mental obstacle.
@@zaxzaxx4561every belief including atheism is faith
@@endlessnutella8612 Not so. Faith means the acceptance of a statement with no evidence to support it. Atheism entails a willingness to take genuine, incontrovertible evidence into account that may contradict it. Faith does not.
41:30 Athiest: (can't pronounce Andreas) "I'm trying to learn Turkish".
Greek Muslim: Looks up stunned.
Why is he so rude?
I don't get it.
@Denzo Dridz when people get frustrated they get emotional. Nothing wrong with his arguments, it was the delivery that was the problem and in a debate like this for most watching, they pay more attention to how something is said rather than what was said.
@Denzo Dridz there is no point and it hurts the argument he's trying to make. People stop listening to the words you're trying to say once you become emotional and condescending.
@Denzo Dridz i didn't think it was a very good debate. I felt the basis of tzortzis argument was flawed but more articulate while I agree with Krause's point of view, he could've presented his ideas more diplomatically.
He is not Greek anymore. The Greek community doesn't accept muslims at all. By converting to Islam, he is now on the other side of the fence. Real Greeks are with the West. He made a choice, now he is out.
I am Christian, but Lawrence Krauss is such an unlikable person... I like Hamza Tzortzis way better... Krauss is soooo arrogant...
claiming your god knows best is the most arrogant claim ever
I think it's YOUR arrogance that created your hatred
do you think this alla Hamza believes in is a god?
@@worfoz" claiming your god knows best "
best ... comparing to who?
@@anaarkadievna ...compared to anyone....
Gods can comfort people, gods can inspire people and gods can create religious feelings but there never was a god who gave us any knowledge we didn't have already.
Science is about knowledge, gods are about beliefs, and religious people who can not understand or accept that are most arrogant without any reason.
Not one god knows how to create an youtube account, so claiming that "god is a creator" of "god knows" is ignorance and arrogance. Krauss understands that well.
@@worfoz "Science is about knowledge"
yeah... sure!
but how science proves morals are a real?
@@anaarkadievna If I punch you in the face, will you feel pain? Yes... Will you like that? No... Is it best for me to punch everyone around in the face? No because everyone will eventually hate me for creating pain to everyone and I would be rejected by other and I would understand that doing that is bad... Eventually, the people will invent a word to define a bad dehavior... this word will evolve and eventually will be: immoral.
No need any religious crap to understand that... just a fucking brain, a little of judgment and rationality.
You have none of them...
When Professor Krauss started talking, sounded like he was so upset that he just rambled on "nonsense". I was hoping to understand Atheism, but he was too busy calling Islam nonsense.
Understand atheism? There isn’t much to understand we just don’t believe in god
Bc it is nonsense.
@@yes-wx2je Exactly, its derived from christianity which everyone knows, so god knows why people still subscribe to it in this day and age.
Guys relax. Please
chris chow hay yes boy 👦 boy your covered
This verse explains the reason for the existence of atheists.
Allah said I will turn away from My signs those who are arrogant upon the earth without right; and if they should see every sign, they will not believe in it. And if they see the way of consciousness, they will not adopt it as a way; but if they see the way of error, they will adopt it as a way. That is because they have denied Our signs and they were heedless of them.
Surah Al-Araf Full Ayah 146
Lol
This is unfair. I agree, most people who are atheists just wanna folkow their desires but there are some who genuinely wanna understand and learn, not to mention they study philosophy, theology and even religion to want to know God but arent convinced (with certainty) in the end.
Isnt it unfair for Allah to deny his signs to a man who is actively looking and i also have to admit that the only way Allah's signs can be accepted is if you ignore your reasoning and have blind faith (which has its own merits and demerits)
Another silly verse. What "signs" is it even referring to? And what the hell is "the way of consciousness" even supposed to mean? Gibberish.
@@joerdimThe Qur’an dealt with hundreds of scientific topics, which contradicted the prevailing science at the time. Now there is not a single scientific error, and there are still many
@@Mohamed-nu7nd And? Is there any point coming? How is this even an answer to what I said?
*The more I wanted to understand comparative religion and beliefs the more I felt that intelligence and truthfulness are only required to revert in islam from any other beliefs*
@Jimmi K you can talk with me via messenger or whatsapp if you think I am wrong.❤️😊
@Jimmi K you can debate me about Islam...❤️
Let's have a discussion.
Let's See who's right.
I am confident about my religion.😏
Because I was in lot of atheist groups in fb.😊
I faced their questions
and researched them.😶
Now in a right track.🙏
You can have some discussions with me.😊
I can challenge you.❤️
@Gunther Vincent not revert but researched in deferent beliefs.❤️
Chains of religion.. No ones chained to religion.. God himself gave us free will.. Anyone is free to be a idiot.. But they wouldn't enjoy jannah with us.. People just want reason to not have judgement for the evil way of life they live.. They would love that
@@armanhossain3781 That you are wrong there's no question about it! You are so brainwashed that I don't if you can get help.
Let’s take a moment of appreciation to hamza when he shakes hands with Krauss in the end of the video 👏🏻
Why though?
Herald Orome why didn’t he have a choice ?
@Herald Orome why doesnt he have a choice?
@@bleach--__--2493 Herald said this to Abdullah maybe.
Herald Orome now who’s the idiot for not knowing what he’s saying or knows how to answer . So try hard Heraldo ! Try hard to answer? Why he have no choice?
"If someone doesn't value evidence, what evidence are you going to provide to prove that they should value it?
If someone doesn't value logic, what logical argument could you provide to show the importance of logic?"
-Sam Harris
Ohoh it amazes me when someone like Harris talking about logic
Exactly. By believing in god you are taking logic and evidence and throwing them out the window
@@kurtiliusroyce so what next you want me to be nihilist or something like that no thanks keep it to yourself
@@aliabd5625 I'm not sure where i said that
@@aliabd5625 what is so bad about nihilism ?
As an Agnostic here, i can say that i enjoyed the debate. Little thrashtalk and smiles made debate better absolutely, im entertained.
Read the Quran brother
@@darwishtrade4526 I was a muslim until I read the Qur'an bro.
@@jiukam how
@@jiukamwhy? What confused you, what startled you? Let’s talk about it
@@jiukam Read the Quran in Arabic , not translation. Do your research about the background of each verse, and use authentic explanations by scholars to understand them (do NOT listen to random RUclips videos or comments)
this is actually more interesting and fun to watch than any movie or TV series ever.
Ikr!
It’s a phase man. You’ll get through it.
Lunavyz what
Thats why television shows are free and RUclips costs you data 😂
Then bro you will love debates on Hamza's den .
I watched this in 2014, i couldn't understand due to weak english now comeback in 2021 still can't understand lol
You will surely understand after you die🤣
Stop playing pubg then😂 improve your English bro
@@jamesrichard5192 How will i understand when i die?
@@akkad-bakkad working on it.
Your English is good
Krauss said so much but at the same time nothing at all
Same with the other guy
@@EricMalette not even true, he gave many
@@MuhammadFurqanAdil No, he didn't. He spouted nonsense. Over and over again.
@@EricMalette Atheist nigga 😂
@@EricMalette Yes, another ignorant human who can't understand deductive reasoning
This is the debates we need.
You got what you wanted a debate so how come you don't want to obey god and follow the prophet Muhammad pbuh
@@sammymohamed8541cuz Ur prophet molested a 9 y.o
@@sammymohamed8541 Why not tinkerbell or the Easter bunny?
I'm an atheist, but I have to say; I think Krauss was too hostile. When you're hostile you push people away and they won't listen to your message.
He wasn't trying to convince the Muslims there, he was speaking to the millions who would be watching it online later.
@@mr.o8539 Of course he was, but he run the risk of turning them off. Remember; these are people that alreadt believe they are morally superior. That an atheist can't be a good person. But he can only be who he is I suppose. Dawkins is also hopeless in this regard, same with Harris and Hitchens (R.I.P.). I like them all alot, but I think someone like Tyson would've done alot better job at convincing muslims that are sitting on the fence between faith and reason.
@@viperracing2889 not everyone has the same temperament. Krauss doesn't mind offending people if he is saying what is correct. This was a debate, but Krauss refused to debate because he wanted to address all the fallacies made by Hamza, trust me bro as an atheist who lives in secret in a Muslim majority country, these people deserve no sympathy, we are talking about people who not only thing atheists can't be good people, but that death is the only way to deal with atheists. If Hamza and the moderator had their way, they'd kill Krauss for his blasphemy.
@@mr.o8539 I can't argue with that.
Everything you mentioned is just a lie
I am a Muslim and I had three classmates who were atheists who left Islam
And I live in Morocco
I was discussing with them, but I did not insult or harm them in any way, and my treatment with them was normal and all the people treated them normally.
It is amazing how a person can say such a thing about his father, his mother, his brothers, his family and his people
What is this malice and hatred in your heart for Muslims and you do not want them to hate you?
Do you think that the West is a good society more than Islamic societies?
This debate was fantastic. The only downside, in my humble opinion, was the very poor host of this program who was putting his own entrenchment, by his acts and his gestures and his words, into the discussion between these two persons, while during any debates, regardless of the topic, the host should be neutral.
I agree with you. Being completely and totally neutral is a skill I wish more people learned how to do, even if their convictions are elsewhere.
@@jn1346 Thanks a lot for your reply dear JN, I am absolutely agree with you, it is absolutely important specially for such programs..!
Actually he was very fairly neutral, i didn't notice anything that's unneutral with him.
And i was focusing on the person who talks, the ideas, the arguments, and not the host who will change nothing in fact.
So it's only your respected personal perception.
@@theyassine6420 Oh right, so their opinions are wrong, and your is right? gtfoh.
The host was nodding his head to the Muslims arguments and grinning.
Trying to prove the absolute existence of God in a laboratory using mathematics and science is a fool's errand. This is crystal clear after watching this video, and Prof. Krauss did say that himself more than once throughout the debate.
Personally, I'm a believer in God, not because I'm able to prove his existence with pure mathematics or quantum physics, but simply by looking at my life and the lives or those around me.
If there's no God then this life is pointless, and no matter how much money you make, or how much knowledge you gain, it wouldn't make any difference because one day you're gonna die and you wont take any of that with you. So to me, there must be some other purpose for our existence, a purpose I couldn't find elsewhere but in faith and the belief in God.
Some other things that make me think there must be a purpose for our lives is the fact that we "humans" are the only sapient species living on the only life-sustaining planet in this whole enormous universe. Kinda makes me wonder why? is it really just a coincidence?
Even with no god or life after death, what you do in life does matter. You don't have to keep something forever to be able to enjoy that thing while you have it.
Also, do you seriously think that you'll take your money with you after you die? What are you gonna use it for? Are you really that selfish?
***** if u leave in Islam it's consider apostasy and there is death threat or u can get killed for leaving Islam. Muslims wants there religion to spread in Western countries but they don't recognize or approved atheist, agnostic or secularist or other religion in Islamic countries what a double standard. In Egypt a guy name Karim Ashraf Mohamed al-Banna left Islam recently now he is jail for three years for leaving Islam. In Sudan a women name Meriam Yehya Ibrahim Ishag was sentence to death for apostasy for leaving Islam and in Saudi Arabia a guy name raif badawi for blogging in his websites now he is jail for 10 years and getting 1000 lashes. In Islam there is no religious freedom for none Muslims sorry folks
***** they dont lol
InsaneGadget Entertainment Ah, so Sharia was made up by the western media, right?
To claim what you claimed, you are either an ignorant fool, or a liar of the most loathsome variety.
You can prove nothing you ignorant liar.
This debate is a treasure to be preserved forever.
True, Krauss did his best to get some basic education across. And I also recommend watching the short video of Hamza and some other apologist trying to confront atheists at some convention about "quran science" (lol). Man, I think I have never seen someone switching the topic as quickly as good old Hamza did when he heard that his interlocutor was an actual embryologist who knows his stuff.
according to Hamza believing in the german god "Thor" is childish but beleiving in the muslim god "Allah" is not. Racism at its finest.
@@electricearth1101 there are many proofs that destroyed and continue to destroy atheism, but most won't even debate about it. do you really think you have been born in 2000s and not in year 57381 where human are so much advance and there is no religion.... by coincidence? you didn't born as ant or bird but as human who can write in keyboard and make thoughts in his mind just to say there is no creator who I'm thankful for all blessing I have.
in 100 years it won't be necessary anymore, there is no need for any gods
@@abdalaalenzi3748Humans are not perfect because we were created by magic. It took us billions of years to evolve. We are simply the result of billions of years of evolution, so it's only natural that we would be intelligent and capable. It's called a natural process. You are just a species on a small planet orbiting a star among 100 billion stars in a galaxy among 2 trillion galaxies. What makes you think your tiny brain can comprehend the complexity of the universe? But it doesn't make sense, right? Well, guess what? THE UNIVERSE IS UNDER NO OBLIGATION TO MAKE SENSE TO YOU OR ANYONE.
Did hamza swallow a philosophical dictionary
He won the debate, also philosophy is big part in this kind of conversations. Its not scince vs religion, because islam support scince. Its about exist ing of dude
Hamza tore Krauss to pieces
🤷🤷😂😂😂😂
@@TheDzudas how ?
Lawrence looks a psycho, I wonder who will call him an intellectual lol, so much frustrated hehe. Once I see atheists like him I say these r people who need a religion the most
Gus Fring
what philosophy? none of the abrahamic religions were built around any metaphysics. Bunch of un proven historical claims and fantasy stories
That moment of " Actually let me calm down" by hamza was so smooth and funny , i' ve never seen someone calm himself like that ever . That actually shows self control at such a high level . And apologized for it at the end even .
@@chrischow9085 I see you like to troll about. How bored are you. If you think religion is so much bs why are you so pained and burtthurt trolling all over the comment section for a week. It's almost like you are obssesed and you are angry that there is an inevitable and you must face it. You hate that there are people bold enough to accept this inevitable. I suggest you stay away from this videos if you can't handle them like a man lol 😅😁
Loved it too. He’s so grounded.
@@chrischow9085 i don t appreciate nor respect arrogant people . I appreciate it if you found someone else to fill your ego with . Have a nice day .
@@chrischow9085 you came to me . Get some help
@@chrischow9085 It's always funny to see these atheists responding to all muslim comments with some dumb points. There are the most fanatic people. But just virtually, in fact you'll never see them taking part in an oral debate
I think that If there is a true religion in this word it would be Islam. It's more logical than atheism and other religions, and It has many undeniable scientific and logical evedence in It's book the Qran.... Much respect To brother hamza he give me more evedence how powerful Islamic argument is. I am in my way To learn more and more about Islam and prophet Mohammed...🇧🇪
Hey bro , I'm muslim , and i will be my pleasure to give u a hand
@Dwan Sangma I got another answer for the first question:
God might be meaning with the "Spread", the planet that hit the earth and was the cause of the ejection of the moon (I know this is a theory we still don't know exactly how the moon formed), and what happened there is that the earth's surface turned into liquid magma, therefore the earth didn't have any geographical terrain, and that makes the choice of choosing the word "Spread" very rational.
🛑This my own explanation, I am not a scientist, I am just a science and astronomy lover.
I hope this was useful to you. c:
@Dwan Sangma Who told you that he was on earth?
@Dwan Sangma Look I want to tell you something very important, Most of all that we know about the space the universe...are just theories, and what are you doing now is that you are making the theories and hypotheses looks like the truth, When you are talking with science it doesn't mean you are saying the reality or what happened exactly you are just talking logically, therefore the best way to know if God was there or not is to see the Scientifiques miracles that people in the 7th century had no way to know, and I see that many Atheists don't believe in jinn and call then paranormal...You know I am Moroccan who lives in Morocco, And you don't see what we see here in some areas in Morocco the black magic is used so much, and trust me this stuff destroyed many peoples life, it was used even in a bank robbery they made the worker lose his mind he gave them everything with no need of power, then he kept walking along the street, they can make you sterile make your life torture, black magic is a big illegal business, and there are those people that don't get affected easily they are those who pray the fair, and there is this only and best way to cure this is the "ruqia" which is a bit like the Exorcism, where they take special parts of the Quran to use them in healing.
What I want to tell is that stop making science the true reality we are just giving theories.
@Dwan Sangma I read that Controversial therapy can cure homosexuality.
I am an Atheist ⚛️
I do not believe in the existence of God. There is no evidence to support the belief in any gods or supernatural entities. I rely on science, reason, logic, and empirical evidence to form my worldview and have not found compelling evidence or arguments to support the existence of God. The universe is governed by natural laws and forces, rather than moral, spiritual, or supernatural ones. As an atheist, I reject religious dogma, supernaturalism, and superstition as the basis of morality and decision-making. I emphasize the social and empirical nature of inquiry and prioritize scientific solutions to intellectual problems. There is an intrinsic intellectual conflict between faith and science, and that it inevitably leads to hostility. I am engaged in a continually evolving search for truth, primarily through science and philosophy.
come to islam
Great idea 💡
But you ever study any religious books from your own..
Where did you come from?
I am an atheist, though I admit Krauss was quite rude to Tzortzis in this. It is fine to disagree, but don't treat him like an idiot when giving an explanation.
I completely agree, bearing in mind that not everyone has the patience required. He could have been kinder.
When someone attacks your credibility and your book by misquoting you, and an entire audience starts clapping and making noises because you got 'roasted', I'm sure you'd be extremely level-headed. After being open to the fact that you might be wrong (Krauss said: "if I did (write the phrase in the book) then I was wrong"), even though it turned out that he didn't, and what does he get for actually letting go of his ego infront of cameras and an audience? Booing and mooing.
Or when your asked about your opinion about incest, and just before you're done answering everyone starts booing and mooing, you'd also be calm.
Stop putting a burden on him that you don't put on Hamza. Everyone in the comments is complementing Hamza for smiling when it's a tactic to disguise being 'roasted' by after Krauss proved he was misquoting him.
Love seeing how the standard for the atheist is always high. Sam Harris could just say one fallacy or one wrong fact and he would be eaten alive, while Deepak can go ahead and not say anything coherent and still have followers and get invited to debates.
Idiots should be treated as idiots because there are billions of them .
@@zorba9660 No, idiots should be treated with the same kindness you show to everyone else. Just be decent, it doesn't matter to whom you are speaking.
Except perhaps for people who cause harm to others.
@@xerozoo They have their own dogmas and superstitions. Because it’s not just about them their stupidity might cost us lot more than that.
Atheists: "well.... I believe that you're wrong!!"
Theists: "Its a start, at least you believe something."
Beliefs are certainly part of human thinking, in all people. Think about it.
Yusuf Estes except some people choose to believe things for good reasons, and others believe things they want to believe on nothing but faith.
@@kaiza6467
Yes, nothing but faith .. just as a non-Muslims
my brother in law is a arab, he says arabs are backwards, and need to grow up,, lots of them dont believe in religion
@@sarahbutler363
I'm from Arab as well .. Most of the arab people are Muslims, there is a bit of us following other faiths, Christians, Jewish, atheists .. Etc..
But the majority are Muslims .. Alhamdulillah.
i liked this debate, two very intelligent individuals. but to be fair, krauss sometimes contradict his own theories, and he does it more than he thinks.
would be nice if you pointed any of these contradictions out at all.
@@upplsuckimcool16 like how he used math to justify presence of infinity in actuality and then at 1:45:00 said 90% of sound mathematical model of reality are nonsense in physics.
@@StoicPhilosophyyyy That is NOT what he said AT ALL..... LMFAOOOOOOOOO HAHAHA. I hope you have the excuse that English is not your primary language. Watch it again and listen closer.
@@upplsuckimcool16 so what did he say.
My point is just because it's possibel mathematically, doesn't mean it has to be present physically. He later said sound mathematical models can be nonsense in physics (reality).
This doesn't hold against the argument of hamza (about universe having a beginning) nor does the pie example which is completely off topic.
Although personally i am inconclusive about whether infinity can or cannot exist physically.
Plus you shouldn't give random laughs and pseudosuperior phrases.
Still waiting for Krauss to let Hamza finish a single point
Was he interruping Hamza's opener? If not then you just said that Hamza didn't make a coherent point in his opener. I agree.
@@joerdim How nobel of him to not interrupt someone in their opening speech 💀
He was constantly interrupting him that’s just straight up disrespectful
@@acecream1411 That's just how a debate works with an uninterrupted opener. We should appreciate Krauss jumping in when Hamza came up with some other unfounded trash.
Seems like you agree that Hamza didn't make a coherent point in his opener.
@@joerdim yeah I know I was being sarcastic genius
And no that’s not how a debate works that just shows that you are scared and insecure to net even letting your opponent finish a point 🤣
@@acecream1411 Well, if you say that Hamza couldn't make a single point and Krauss didn't interrupt his opener then Hamza failed hard in his opener. Glad you agree genius.
In an open discussion section this is no problem. And in case of Krauss he couldn't stand that Hamza kept making clueless unfounded claims and we should appreciate that he jumped in to immediately correct him.
A lot of things going on in the comment section.
People trying to explain themselves.
People trying to start english classes. (Which I totally want to be apart of)
to be better in english, watch alot of western videos with them just speaking. vlogs , audio books, bbc radio etc. i used to suffer listening from the start because you would miss alot of words as it seems they speak very fast, but after several months you get better, and even you begin to speak english alot faster when speaking to people around you.
audio books is the best since you just download it, and listen at anytime.
bbc radio is good since its just radio you can listen anytime if you have a phone with radio or a radio app.
thank God my family brought me to an english speaking country at a young age. english fluency is a privilege.
@@drmosaddegh a great privilege indeed, and we take it for granted...
Even though I am fluent in English as I was raised in Canada, I still feel that my vocabulary isn't as great as it should be. I guess I am missing eloquence in my speech...
This is simple:
Religion is for the purpose of life and science is for serving the purpose.
Why so serious!?
@@chrischow9085 that is back to ur intellect to decide ,,,
but if you the shortcut path Is ISLAM,,,no other religion beside based on strong arguments
And if you know this, know that if there is a lot of luminosity, you can see it in the tongue of the Arabs by Ibn Manzur, or in any other lexicon of linguistic dictionaries, and it was mentioned in the noble verse in the sense of vision, which is the most appropriate phrase, and it cannot be replaced by a phrase that plays its role. It is more appropriate than it, and the interpreters have interpreted the noble verse so that there is no room for doubt or bewilderment. Ibn Katheer said: He found it set in the eye of Hama, meaning he saw the sun in his sight set in the surrounding sea, and this is the case for everyone who ends up on his coast and sees it as if it is set in it and it does not leave. The fourth astronomy that is fixed in it does not leave it ...
Sheikh Al-Shanqeeti said in the lights of the statement: ..... And the fact that whoever is on the shore of the western ocean sees the sun in the eyes of his eye falling into the sea is a known matter ..
in english thats its wrong but its an arabic expression
Yes, because in the Qur’an it was written and found and in the Arabic language it came in a sense that seemed in the sense that the sun seemed to (Dhul-Qarnayn) here the Qur'an speaks from his perspective but when the Qur'an speaks of facts it is clearly and not from the perspective of a person like the Scientific miracles in the Quran about fetuses.
@@chrischow9085 You reminds me of those Muslims who also try to prove Quran as a Scientific book, this context is not even about where the Sun goes, this is a context of the Horizon, and the Ocean, by Dhul Qarnain, and old King, who almost had conquered the Earth. great that you found a hadith out of 80.000 Thousands hadiths :-)
The Prophet (ﷺ) said, "The sun and the moon do not eclipse because of the death of someone from the people but they are two signs amongst the signs of Allah. When you see them stand up and pray." Sahih Bukhari even though he could have conviced them because his son Ibrahim died the same day, and NASA confirmed the eclipse also
so he excuses incest as long as they are in love and use contraception, but has a problem with women who cover themselves and prefer to only show their beauty to their family and husband?
Its the source of the belief that he probably finds unreasonable and unjustified and the consequences she may face if she refuses is what I find awful. There is actual harm being done to women who refuse to wear it. What harm is done with two consenting people having sex without risk of pregnancy?
@@teresamcmud2605
You cannot speak reason to people that base their world view on bronze age philosophy. I thought your comment was spot on and would have left something very similar if you hadn't beat me to it.
@@teresamcmud2605 1. The first statements goes both ways, there are women harmed who also wish to wear it or do wear it. Either by their enviroment or even their families. But Krauss or many atheists dont adress it this way, they just genuinely dont like the fact women cover and hide their beauty.
2. A brother and a sister consenting to sex even if its protected sex still doesnt change the fact its just insanely wrong to do so. To say it does no harm means you didnt think through it properly, what about their surroundings? It would cause lots of emotional harm especially to their parents or community, and it would likely cause harm to themselves later in life, either physical or emotional due to their environment or just psychologically.
@@aq4356 It doesn't cause physical harm to anyone. Muslim fundamentalists beat women who dont comply to this ridiculous notion of modesty.
@@aq4356 But some women are harmed by their families or Islamic regimes specifically for the reason of not covering themselves. The fact that other women are also sometimes harmed does nothing to alleviate the first fact.
Certainly, we can oppose multiple rationales for harming women.
2:06:20 Mr Krauss’s response to the women saying she was offended could be used against him here. He said to the women that she knew coming in that the event is not segregated and should not have a problem with sitting with men. Now, he says he thinks the debate format is stupid and treated the whole “debate” like a back and forth and kept interrupting, even when it was not his time to speak.. so the same could be said for him - he knew he was coming to participate in a DEBATE and should have respected that
Kudos to Hamza for doing a great job in conducting this debate 👏🏼
I noticed that too. Krauss's entire performance here was lacklustre and full of double standards.
His key arguments were moral and whether it's "sensible" to believe in God/Islam, yet he can't morally argue against incest. When Hamza uses technical and reasonable terminology his response is to ask Hamza to "stop using words". It should be embarrassing enough that he doesn't appear to have a good grasping of what's inductive and deductive and how it relates to the discussion - or he's just being intentionally obtuse.
In fact, what even was his argument? When backed into a corner as his position is being demolished he starts to posit a vague standpoint.
Krauss, as typical of most 'new atheists', literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma then walk away smugly. Almost like a Christian proselytiser. I don't think these new atheists realise how much they are unironically presenting themselves as behaving in the same manner as the 'ignorant religious zealots' that they proclaim to be against.
There's an underlying sense that Krauss literally seemed to have thought that he could just walk in, point at religious dogma (with a very cursory understanding of Islam) then walk away smugly. It's clear he wasn't prepared because his arrogance made him think he didn't need to be.
@@stuntxl5783 Hamzah's key argument was that there can be an infinity and if there can be then something can come from nothing. Hamzah ignored his entire scientific argument by claiming it wasn't scientific it was a deductive argument, a deductive argument can and usually is a scientific one and thus since his first premise of the argument was proven incorrect it was an invalid deductive argument.
I'm amazed Prof. Krauss didn't know that mathematics is deductive. If mathematics is not deductive, it simply wouldn't have any use!
Anthony Flew is considered one of the most prominent atheists, so he retracted his atheism and ،told us that the universe has a deity with modern scientific evidence, not with thought or dreams and feeling, but after science and modern discoveries about the existence of a Creator. He fell into another problem that the Creator wanted according to his mood
He wanted the Creator to be neither speaking nor hearing, and creating creation in vain
But it is logical that this Creator sends a messenger to teach us who he is. And we have to verify the authenticity of the Messenger and what this Messenger calls to?
It transports sperm from the liquid state to the eyes, heart, blood, arteries, and bones. Unconscious nature creates a conscious human being. Then this nature teaches about the importance of the heart and lung, then puts the rib cage, then oxygen, then water, there is sexual desire, and there are the genitals to complete the male and female sexual process. , What coincidence are you talking about, a coincidence that creates the male and the female. All of these are called verses and there are things that complement each other, there is a lung and there is air and there are teeth and stomach and in food and other things and we say that it has no creator!!!
The only question God will ask you is
focus on it
((He said: Did you deny My verses and did not encompass them in knowledge, or what did you do?))
I mean, God Almighty tells you what I told you is a lie and you cannot realize it or understand it
And what in the world have you been doing?
Do you know what your answer is?
((The decree will befall them for what they did wrong, and they will not be able to speak.
If you find yourself in the world without a choice in a great reality we live in, and you go without a choice and a question is the most important
If your destiny is fire, has God wronged you???ًً
Muhammad, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him, is a prophet from the Creator, and before him many prophets did not lie or deceive, and he is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator who created everything.
First of all, you should know that the religion of all prophets is the worship of one Creator who created everything. Islam today is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator and not idols, illusions, conjecture or a number of gods. But how do we know that the speech is from God and not from Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace? . These are some of the things that comfort your heart and believe that this is a prophet and many of the prophets before him
The Almighty said: (Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been (as) smoke)
The smoke confirms that the origin of this universe is inflamed. It is not a lake of water, as was the perception of all philosophies and religions that are based on illusion. This is one of the postulates of modern science today that the sky is condensation of smoke. This fact converted the French scientist Maurice to Islam and wrote a book entitled the Holy Qur’an on the scale of modern science
How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before?
The Almighty says: ((And the heaven We constructed))
The sky is a building, not a vacuum as it was thought, and this was awarded the Nobel Prize in Physics in 2017 that proved it
How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before?
The Almighty’s saying: ((And the heaven We constructed with strength, and indeed, We are [its] expander.
)).
That is, the sky expands with time. This fact, even in the time of Einstein, was not imagined by anyone and it was proven. And Einstein admitted it and admitted that it was the biggest scientific mistake he made in his life if he believed that the sky was fixed. The Qur’an before Einstein says that the sky expands
fact
Almighty’s saying: :((And We have made the night and day two signs, and We erased the sign of the night and made the sign of the day visible that you may seek bounty from your Lord and may know the number of years and the account [of time]. And everything We have set out in detail.
))
The verse of the night is the moon and the verse of the day is the sun. The Qur'an tells that the sun and the moon were fiery masses. That is, the moon was a fiery mass and was erased, and the verse of the day remained visible to the eyes. Was the moon a fiery mass and extinguished? This is one of the biggest scientific issues discovered about the moon. The moon was already a fiery mass, and NASA issued on its official website a conceptual clip entitled The Evolution of the Moon in the video. In fact, the moon was a fiery mass like the sun, and this is what the Qur’an told about and the truth of modern science.
How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before?
Almighty’s saying
And you see the mountains thinking that they are rigid, while you will cross as the passage of clouds. [It is] the work of God who has perfected everything. In fact, he knows what you're doing.))
And the verse clearly spoke of a strange phenomenon, which is that the viewer of the mountains appears to him still, that is, they are still, but in fact they are not like that, rather they are in a state of constant movement. And the infidels of Quraish had previously accused our master Muhammad, may God’s prayers and peace be upon him, of madness, and it is likely that their joy was overwhelming when this verse was revealed.
They also found in it, according to their claim, evidence of this madness, and they told the people: How can you believe this man who says that these fixed mountains move like clouds moving in the sky!
And today it is proven that the earth rotates, and with it the mountains, how did Muhammad know that and why is he telling you instead of the matter that makes people consider him crazy? The matter was not from him, but from God.
Almighty’s saying
Those whom Allah (in His plan) willeth to guide,- He openeth their breast to Islam; those whom He willeth to leave straying,- He maketh their breast close and constricted, as if they had to climb up to the skies: thus doth Allah (heap) the penalty on those who refuse to believe)).
After man was able to reach the sky by flying by modern means of transportation, he knew that the higher up in the air, the less oxygen and atmospheric pressure, which causes severe tightness in the chests and the process of breathing. :
How did Muhammad, may God bless him and grant him peace, know this fact before? It was not from him, but from God
Almighty’s saying
Or (the Unbelievers' state) is like the depths of darkness in a vast deep ocean, overwhelmed with billow topped by billow, topped by (dark) clouds: depths of darkness, one above another: if a man stretches out his hands, he can hardly see it! for any to whom Allah giveth not light, there is no light!
Modern sciences have revealed that in the bottom of the deep seas with abundant water - the deep sea - there is great darkness, to the extent that living creatures live in this darkness without visual tools, but live using their other senses such as hearing.
These dark darknesses are not found in the sea water that surrounds the Arabian Peninsula, but rather they have been discovered in the oceans far from it
This verse shows another aspect of the Qur’anic miracle, which is that the sea wave that all people only knew was one wave in the seas
The verse says there is another wave in the depths of the sea, and divers discovered at the beginning of the twentieth century a fact that was hidden in the depths of the sea, that fact that shows another wave that throws divers into it as it is thrown at swimmers, and this wave was discovered by Scandinavian divers.
I will tell you what the Prophet said. The Prophet, may God bless him and grant him peace, said: One day the Bedouins who live in the desert will build tall towers, and this is my duty. Go and see where the
tallest buildings are and who owns them.
God Almighty: ((We will show them Our signs in the horizons and within themselves until it becomes clear to them that it is the truth. But is it not sufficient concerning your Lord that He is, over all things, a Witness?)
And God informed the Qur’an of this by saying: “Did you think that we created you without a purpose and that you would never return to us?”
All these and other matters that I have not mentioned indicate that this is a prophet from God..More important than that, as I told you, is the only religion that commands you to worship one Creator, who created everything and before him many prophets.
Say, if you wish, there is no god but God, and that Muhammad is the Messenger of God
speak from the heart
@Zeid Bitar I'm amazed at your idiocy.
@@greyngreyer5 how about u have a legit counter argument instead of just a petty insult
@@ZBspicey I've been doing that a bit too much. Trying muslim tactics now. I have to say, it's going pretty well
@@greyngreyer5 it's clear u don't know what ur talking about lol
I came here expecting highly intellectual debate but, I’m really disappointed with the professor’s behavior. Lack of respect, full of himself, and extremely arrogant.
He was being honest.
chris chow
Not the case, if you watch the whole “debate”, it was the professor who demanded men and women intermingle. The evidence is when the young woman stood up and let the professor have it. She didn’t wanted to sit next to a man and she said that achieved the opposite of what he wanted to achieve when he pushed for “not to segregate the sexes”.
chris chow
It was the professor who took her choice as she complained to him. If her choice and her religion say so who are you to say? Your bias and preconceived notion is evident and wack to be frank.
chris chow
Islam gave women the right to choose, live, own property, and of course the right to live way before any European and Asian cultures. Islam advanced women’s right before 1,440 years ago. At least do fact checking and educate yourself the subject matter. Approximately, 6th century girls were sadly buried alive and Islam outlawed that savage practice.
@@chrischow9085 Alright so the thing you are saying is absolutely wrong. Islam is the religion that came and said women have right to marry to vote, to get her share and Whether a woman is a wife, mother, sister, or daughter, she receives a certain share of her deceased relative’s property. This share depends on her degree of relationship to the deceased and the number of heirs. While many societies around the world denied women inheritance, Islam assured women this right, illustrating the universal justice of Islam’s divine law. Islam introduced voting rights, marrying rights at a time when they were buried alive in arabia and were known as transferable objects and in europe women rights took more 500 years to come.
Islam further confirms that both men and women are equal in the sight of God. In the Quran, God declares, “…Indeed, the most noble of you in the sight of Allah is the most righteous of you…” (49:13) At another place in the Quran, God clearly states that all humans are equal: “To whoever, male or female, does good deeds and has faith, We shall give a good life and reward them according to the best of their actions.” (16:97)
God devotes an entire chapter of the Quran, the holy book of Islam, to women. In addition, God directly addresses women repeatedly throughout the Quran. Islam proclaims that all human beings, men and women, are born in a pure state. The goal of every Muslim is to preserve this purity by shunning evil tendencies and beautifying their inner being with virtuous traits
P.S. In Islam it's said that when you give birth to a girl, a door of paradise is open for you. If you are the parents of 2 or 3 girls it means the 2nd and 3rd gate of jannah is open for you. ( and yes for this there are conditions like just not giving birth to them but also educating them, providing them, giving them a good life).
But can't you see how lucky you are said to be if you have a girl child in islam.
So you don't tell people that islam doesn't advocate for women rights.
was krauss trying to prove that God doesnt exist or was he trying to prove that God is evil? i felt like he was arguing for the latter. and religious people tend to get emotional when their faith is challenged but this debate shows the absolute opposite. all krauss was doing was attacking Islam instead of rationally deducing flaws in the things said in Quran. weird and disappointing.
I agree with you
He gets very emotional and very impatient that is not an intellectual behaviour
This was not what I was expecting
look if an abrahamic god exists he is evil but an abrahamic god probably doesnt exist
M'Kermy and why are u bitter?
@@MKermy if I was an evil god I would give you and your parents stage 4 cancer right now just to show you how evil I am 😈
@@adilahmad6377 Oh yes it is intellectual behaviour! My physics professor had a PhD from MIT. The guy next to me in class was autistic. My friend would always point out the mistakes the Prof. made in front of the class. The Prof. would have conniption fits and storm out of the classroom. Sometimes I would have to button up my friends shirt and tie his shoes when doing homework.
Religious debaters are always such bad faith. As soon as you say anything they interpret as an attempt to discredit what they say they cry victim and pretend you are only trying to insult them. Its pathetic
Yeah, but without the language calculus is impossible to do modern science...
Religion eg. Is firbwhen u feel unspititual in time and spritlritusl will make u back spiritual again.
Other use other than that usually result in laziness... hence yhise people don't really want to work or progress
@@eddyr1041 i feel like i had a stroke trying to read that
"AND ALSO...let me calm down first" *smiles* i love this guy already 😂
1:01:14 (free replay button)
he controlling your ass just by a smile bunch of sheep .
@@775.- lmao, ok
@@775.- bro just shut up replying why you jealous
Amr Tahditi rather than insulting atheists he calms himself down, complimenting him on that is not being a sheep, your wrong and ignorant
He is a convert to Islam not born to Islam
he looks like alexander mahone from prison break
Totally 😂🤓
@Perkin Warbeck omg same 😂
😂😂😂 I was also wondering who he is resembling with??
So true
Marwan Bouchakour you right lool
Alhamdulillah for everything, Alhamdulillah Allah give me Islam as my Religion.
Then what about others,why did not Allah gave them Islam?
@Scorer Scored I'm a complete atheist like dawkins from 15 years.
@Scorer Scored sir....you need to study Islam in depth to connect thoes dots...no i am not being a passive aggressive muslim and pushing you towards my religion...i am just saying that an hour's debate can not give you an in depth view of islam and what it really is...If you are really curious about the dots then maybe you can study the religion to find out...
@@garycooper607 sir everyone in their life gets a chance by ALLAH Almighty to know about their creator to be on the right path...just like how you watched this video...Allah gives many chances to humans,some are just lucky enougu to understand this and some are unfortunate enough to don't...ALLAH says that i love a human more than the love of 70 mothers,so no matter if you are an atheist or muslim..He still loves you and will give you numerous chances to go back to him...its in your own hands if you take thoes chances or not...
@@gn8900 ok that means Allah is giving me a chance through this video....every religious person says his religion is right.
"0+0+0 can never be 3" checkmate athiests
@@larganmansheriff265
2+2= 5 this is your point ?
So what does it equal?
@@EndOfAnAg3 rather than asking in a yutube comment section..go learn some 3rd grade maths
Zero implies nothing. Science has substantiated, incontrovertible evidence. Religion has faith in the supernatural - zero. Don't play faith chess with a knowledgeable informed, realistic, rational, critical thinker.
Heaven avoider, why did your god save Adolf 42 times? Is he a national socialist?
you know what i've learned ???"knowledge without explanation is worthless
I'm an atheist and I must say I don't like how Krauss went about this. Some arguments were very logical, strong and well put. Others were all over the place, in fact most were since he wanted to counter everything in random orders. But him stealing Hamza's time over and over and say "You can take this off my time whatever" with a shrug when there would be room for a more 1 on 1 argument later on. Unprofessional and disrespectful.
Agreed. Krauss is far too biased and militant and arrogant. At one point he even encourages people to interchange science and atheism as identical, which is insane.
Science is unconcerned if there is or is not a creator and atheism does not believe in one. Krauss lacks integrity and was thoroughly embarassed by Hamza.
@@cdb5001 i would also lose my temper if a person told me that if i used my brain i would deduce that infinity does not exist lmao. If the only thing you take from Krauss is don't rely on your common sense but study the world and do the maths, you already took more than Hamza's all points combined.
@@wulfiii1490 your statement shows a clear bias and unwillingness to accept truth regardless of your bias. I am not Muslim, not religious, but it is plain to see that Krauss was thoroughly out-maneuvered by Hamza because:
1. He doesn't have a grasp of deductive vs inductive reasoning
2. He has no clue how philosophy works
3. His scientific assertions are baseless and contingent upon changing the meaning of "nothing"
4. He is rude and disrespectful to any and all viewpoints that differ from his
The only PhD Krauss truly deserves is one in arrogance. If you are going to use your brain, as you say, please understand that scientific zealotry is no better than religious zealotry, and brow-beating people when you yourself have no answers, only makes one look foolish, which is what Larry Krauss did to himself here.
@@cdb5001 ofc no zealotry is good, whether it is religion or science, for that i surely am gonna use my brain although i nowhere claimed to do that. On the opposite i said when talking about physics common sense goes out the window while math and experimenting does the trick. We would never find theory of relativity with common sense, so why do we believe that we can understand the beginning of the universe with common sense? Krauss was arrogant, because a man who had no clue about such basic concept like infinity tried to explain to him how his theory of universe from nothing is wrong. For you to say the only thing he deserves a Phd from is arrogance only shows that maybe you deserve a title from arrogance too.
@@wulfiii1490 lol, fair enough, though I didn't try to project any arrogance. I love physics and the sciences, but Krauss is too steeped in his atheistic zealotry to be taken seriously.
Hamza very clearly states that on the scientific side, he conceded to Krauss' expertise, but that philosophically, Krauss' arguments make no sense.
And it is an apt example to use math and state that 0+0 always equals zero. It's an interesting and relevant counter argument to any math that Krauss may try to use mathematics as a foundation for his theory, considering that the math does not support his assumptions.
I am glad at least that we agree on zealotry being bad in any topic, and would clarify that my disappointment is that Krauss gets any airtime when he is clearly very biased, when there are other phycisists with more compelling postulates and more open minds, who do not get any exposure.
I found it very disrespectful that Krauss knows so little about Islam and yet was happy to make general sweeping assumptions about the religion and people.
And while I personally do not find Islam compelling, were I debating someone on it, I would at least be humble enough to study the topic before entering a debate, which is what Hamza did on the opposite side of the table. He read Krauss' book and critiqued it very well. Cheers.
Who's here 2020
Every year. I love watching Krauss hand religion it’s own ass.
Telsonater I feel sorry for you...If only you knew ...
me..
@@G11-z7e يا ليت قومي يعلمون
July 2020
I'm so glad I watched this debate. It opened my eyes, even enlightened me. Thanks to this debate, I understood how incompatible Islam is with our civilization. Everything we owe to Islam, e.g. the preservation of Greek thought, the transfer of Indian mathematical thought to Europe and many others, no longer exists in this culture. There are only some myths left, an inferiority complex combined with extroverted assurance to oneself and others how great Islam is. And it's all because of myths from the Bronze and Iron Ages. Pity.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
I like how Hamza calms himself by smiling.
It's a sign of embarrassment
@Jimmi K right on 😂👍
@ilma iskander insulting what? Religion? What about me getting insulted by the nonsense you call religion? What about my feelings? Why is always only religion people get offended and insulted? So just suck it up!
Space Roamer u need to read the quran n learn the islamic history first with an openmind, put aside your denial n ego first. If u can’t, it means your ears, eyes, heart n mind have been closed/blocked. No matter how much people try to explain to u, it won’t work, just like what Hamza explained in this video, he did very well.
@@maiii7733 let him question about trinity that doesnt exist if he is that smart xD
I understand why Mr. Krauss is so frustrated, but his demeanor is doing him a huge disfavor during this debate.
Sometimes I've noticed people that are smart usually the socially awkward types and Krauss definitely fits in that category of socially awkward well look at who he was debating after all a handsome greek man.
Because everythings against him
The crowd especially is kind of stupid cheer for blunder it's like you are teaching classical physics to Quantum mechanicts thinking that it's right
@@kiransebastianshaji7042Привет тупой гусь)
@@kiransebastianshaji7042 Та ты многого не понимаешь
@@kiransebastianshaji7042 Ду ю спик Раша? Нет, не говорю -__-
54:25 unlike that woman who killed her children, prophets did not harm anybody because of revelation, for example in Qur'an most cursed people are Pharoah of Moses's time and Abu Lahab, and Allah did not order Mohammed of Moses to kill them, instead Allah ordered Moses to talk with a lower voice and be kind to even that bloodthirsty Pharoah, and ordered the same to Mohammed PBuH for his every encounter.
snore.
Mohammad killed
@@globalcoupledances why are the followers of christ killing people in Iraq and Yemen and Afghanistan and China???
@@CollectThaBucks If your fault because you led by that same example.
Portia Morray What did he killed ?
10 years and this debate still had its effect on the moral realm of religion .. God bless Hamza
too bad 10 years later you Still don't know what morals are ...
religions Do Not Have morals , they can't , religions have DECREES or dictations from a dictator ,
when your morals '' come from another subject '' , they can't be objective , or you don't understand what That word means either , objective
it means without opinion or coming from a mind , including gods
so no the bible , torah , quran ... = no morals , just decrees
you can Only Have morals , objective morals , when you're an atheist ,
who grounds his / her morality in ... get this ... the evidence OF morality , which are the patterns we see change over time ,
we give those patterns a name , the patterns ... ARE objective , no mind involved , we call THAT ... whoop-de-doo ... OBJECTIVE MORALITY ...
now , we could explain this to a 4 year old and he / she would understand this in a heartbeat ,
apparently not a lot of people are smarter THEN a 4 year old ...
and not a lot of people know they have NO morality to speak of , like you and your family , parents grand parents , children , nobody
just the atheists who understand what the word ACTAULLY MEANS , say it with me ... Objective Morality , decrees bad , objective morality good ...
billions of people across the world have no cue what 90% of the words mean we invented , don't worry about it , LEARN about it
hamza made no sense....according to islam that profile photo you put is haram..total absurdity and dictatorship
@@earth.planet8860😂 78k comments say otherwise
@@earth.planet8860 what do you mean hamza made no sense", that is a really strong claim to make, did you even watch the whole thing?
@@mohamadhamid3360 tell me what his argument was ? using big words that made no sense
if ahmed deedat was alive this man would've probably been talking about how merciful allah is for guiding him into islam , I'm nothing meaning anything about hamza tzortzis he's such a brilliant speaker and intelligent i just discovered him for 4 days probably and he's got an impressive eloquence mashaallah may god bless him and protect him say amine ya rab
@بلقين ابن زيري asalam alayka my brother much love from algeria may god protect you
Guidance comes only from Allah not people !!!
@@mimivisha136 you're absolutely right as allah said in surah al kahf verse 16 , what I mean is that ahmed deedat was a very strong way in which allah guided many people trough .
@@muhammadtn2931 yes in deed he was .
@@mimivisha136 zakir naik is too , even if it's ALLAH who guide , making daawa is our job too as muslims , and ofc making sure it's made in the softest ways there could be , I invite you to watch khutbah of ustadh Nouman Ali KHAN about making daawah , I'm sure you'll enjoy it .He's such a good speaker he's got a very high level of knowledge masha allah .
"Truth has come, and falsehood has departed. Indeed is falsehood, [by nature], ever bound to depart."
Rayan He already did and said the truth doesn’t change as the science change every time and also he give u example of the earth and sun 🤷🏽♀️ Also religions especially Quran discovered 80% before 1400 years ago what science did right now and it’s just clear that they copped from Quran 🤷🏽♀️
Gunther Vincent I dare you to proof it All what you said in the Quran do it plz
and don’t be brainwashed go and read Quran well instead reading this in the propaganda islamicphobia websites
@Gunther Vincent I want to point out that It was stated in the Qur'an that the earth was spherical tho.
Falsehood will depart, that is the reason why Islam will depart
@@manne8575 Islam is the fastest growing religion right now...lol
"I didn't choose to be born Greek but looking like a Pakistani" - best quote ever 🤣
Timestamp please.
@@UmarFarooq-jn7dt 1:32:59
and when he insulted his beard, he replied "Well, I'm growing my hair just like yours. 😂😂😂
Ya Allah;;; Ya Muhammad ;;; Ya imam Ali;;; Ya Imam Mahdi (as)
Where does he say that what time
This is one of the best debates ive seen. God damn this was awesome lmao
I think it's kinda pathetic to see Hamza flailing around with unproven concepts which he doesn't even understand and Krauss lecturing him again and again.
Krauss presented throughout the whole debate that we shouldn't presume anything before proving it or doing research on it. Yet, without doing ANY research on Islam, he is not even willing to listen to Hamza for one moment before completely discounting it.
@Scott Holder You're contradicting yourself. First u say him listening to Muslims is his research. Then you admit that Krauss doesn't even agree to listen to Hamza or other Muslims properly out of arrogance. What kind of half baked research is that?
@Scott Holder He has that attitude with every Muslim! Not listening to anyone's point and being so arrogant about it is not the way to have a discourse!
@@justdoit8075 Deffo won't get a answer like that lool.
Scott Holder then why he came to the debate if he is not willing to listen? The real answer is because he is too prideful and that's actually the case with all disbelievers, they're just too prideful to admit TO THEY SELF AT LEAST that they are wrong.
Scott Holder Fear of what?????
Ashadu An laillaha Ilawllah wa ashadu ana Muhammadan Rasulullah ☝🏻❤️
Did someone say Ra Ghal Zul?
Cuz I reply.... Lazarus well!
☝️
Masha Allah,,,Allah bless us brother
allah makan babi!!!
When I heard the atheist dude say there’s basically nothing wrong with incest, the guy lost the argument straight away for me 😂
He was speaking in the sense of morality. Its not inherently morally wrong but its not something that you should engage in.
chicken flavoured pineapples ... well why shouldn’t you engage in it? Because it’s wrong. It’s not allowed in any Abrahamic religion - the difference between those believing in Abrahamic religions is that they have a moral compass to abide by, whereas others simply dont
@@ismail_2967 no the reason we shouldnt engage with it is because its is harmful for the body and because morality is subjective
ironically the story of adam and eve is a story of incest, how do you think there son's and daughter's reproduced ?
@@ismail_2967 this is a common misconception almost all atheists have a moral guide, this is a big debate in the atheist community we do not know if morality is objective (because of evolution) or if morality is subjective
@@ismail_2967 as @M'Kermy pointed out, morality being inherently subjective it is not immoral yet it is not something which you should do as it has been linked to a higher rate of birth defects.