Thanks Ryan. We do our best to bring value with every video we publish, but that's not an easy thing to do. We appreciate your comment. Nice to hear you growing from our efforts.
My one criticism is that I wish you'd go deeper into the character traits that you say they need. For example, obsessed, what does that mean? Are they obsessed with their goals, are they obsessed with a person, are they ocd? I don't really get what you mean by obsessed in this context. Or loved by others, are we talking in the Disney sense where the main character is inexplicably loved by others or is having a close knit group of friends or family who love them enough.
Blondie on Tucos reaction to being left in the desert: " Such ingratitude for all the times Ive saved your life". Cant say he doesnt gave a sense of humour
No of course not. If anything give the character cowardice as a character flaw. If your character is a hero and you want to follow Edson's advice, just make sure your hero has at least 5 of the 9 traits mentioned, that arent courage.
What about films like Taxi Driver and The Wolf of Wall Street? The main characters in those films are not remotely sympathetic to me. That may explain why I personally don't like them, but plenty of people do. Do others find those characters sympathetic?
I was thinking less sympathetic, and more empathetic. We can follow the emotional arc of the character, and understand some "truth" about them, or at least identify with their subjective experience. I have a similar reaction with most of Scorsese's protagonist, and even characters like Walter White and Jesse Pinkman.
Maybe you're lacking in observation? Travis lives in a world of shit, just like our own real streets. Prostitution, adultery, drugs etc they cripple our projected imagination of a loving world... Travis can see through the rose tinted glass. He can see the politicians lying for votes, for example and of course, naturally, being a taxi driver, leads him to encounter all sides of the coin- race, gender, class etc. Perhaps Travis is mentally ill, but some of his thoughts are grounded in ideological love even if he uses radical ways to express (saving the young girl). Trying to be a good and fair person in a world that isn't either...I can sympathise with his wellbeing and empathise with his situation.
Sympathy is one method, the other two are humanity and talent. You can make your character care for something outside themselves. And or you can make them very talented at something, I.e., Robin Hood’s ability to shoot an arrow.
@@alexanderford3831 Yes, perhaps we could say that empathy is necessary, and sympathy is more optional so long as we are still interested in what the character does. Walter White is an interesting example I think because there were times when he did come across as sympathetic (his illness, wanting to protect his family, fighting against bad guys), and other times definitely not (when he watches Jesse's girlfriend choke without intervening, the self-serving rationalizations for his greed, etc.).
@@filmcourage Yep :^) Downside is that many beta readers can't see those qualities in him. Unfortunately, it's a race thing; my protagonist is Black, but many of my betas aren't. The readers who seemed to understand the character are Black or are used to being around us. So, even though my novel isn't about the _"Black Experience"_ , per se, I have to market it specifically to Black readers, limiting my audience. :^/ I wonder: How many screenwriters face similar issues, and how many movies get short shrift because of a lack of diversity in reviewers?
@@yapdog Don't get discouraged by that! Remember Black Panther was the greatest Marvel solo movie ever, what makes it one of the greatest super heroes movie ever! (I mean it both storywise and "box-officewise") Keep writing it and you'll nail it!
@@yapdog Are you sure that's a 'race thing' and not related to culture? There's plenty of black characters in movies and shows that are widely accepted, understood and appreciated by general audiences, at least within the context of those shows. If it were related to culture then I think that would be more understandable, as there could be a lot of people unfamiliar with the culture represented in your story that the character has come from
He only really gave one, I agree with you. I'll be hopping into the lecture later, he probably says the rest in there. 200 mil is peanuts compared to what hollywood was spending just before corona.
are u kidding? house of sand of and fog is an amazing movie! and it didnt have a hero, thats why it bombed or are u telling me you can sympathize with every single main character?
sapin He is educating in general. You are accusing a wrong issue that is like “80% Of the citizen of USA is blah blah, but I am not so the statistics is wrong.”
@@Doskharaas in general we are going to get more star wars garbage and superhero bullshit instead of you know... good movies but yes of course how naive of me
@@firstlast-oo1he Yep. Your character doesn't need to be morally good. It can be as bad as dark hero. But It MUST connect with the audience first and foremost. Though I find there's a line a main character shouldn't cross, even if audience empathizes with the main character. If your main character becomes TOO amoral for whatever reason, audience will have hard time justifying their action.
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Here is the full lecture, "14 Movie Characters Writers Should Know" - ruclips.net/video/d85qzE6V38E/видео.html
Thank you Mr. Edson, I love your classes, may god bless you for spreading this invaluable treasure... respect 🙏🙏🙏
Prof. Edson is somehow super sympathetic.
Wished I had such a good course back in the day.
Dont mind me, just learning how to become a super hero.
Great video, very helpful! I'm so glad I found your channel, every time I click a video I learn something new. Thanks!
Thanks Ryan. We do our best to bring value with every video we publish, but that's not an easy thing to do. We appreciate your comment. Nice to hear you growing from our efforts.
Very interesting and informative. TYVM, Professor Edson.
It's priceless. Thank You, Film Courage and Eric Edson!
This is a great video. The "pop quiz" solve at the end is a great reminder what type of characters not to write (in screenplays, novels, whatever).
Wow . Great lesson sir.
My one criticism is that I wish you'd go deeper into the character traits that you say they need. For example, obsessed, what does that mean? Are they obsessed with their goals, are they obsessed with a person, are they ocd? I don't really get what you mean by obsessed in this context. Or loved by others, are we talking in the Disney sense where the main character is inexplicably loved by others or is having a close knit group of friends or family who love them enough.
Where's the video talking about the nine traits?
Truly helpful advice.
Blondie on Tucos reaction to being left in the desert: " Such ingratitude for all the times Ive saved your life". Cant say he doesnt gave a sense of humour
Does my character have to start with courage if that's what I want them to gain over the course of the story??
No of course not. If anything give the character cowardice as a character flaw. If your character is a hero and you want to follow Edson's advice, just make sure your hero has at least 5 of the 9 traits mentioned, that arent courage.
Okay...!
What about films like Taxi Driver and The Wolf of Wall Street? The main characters in those films are not remotely sympathetic to me. That may explain why I personally don't like them, but plenty of people do. Do others find those characters sympathetic?
I was thinking less sympathetic, and more empathetic. We can follow the emotional arc of the character, and understand some "truth" about them, or at least identify with their subjective experience.
I have a similar reaction with most of Scorsese's protagonist, and even characters like Walter White and Jesse Pinkman.
Maybe you're lacking in observation? Travis lives in a world of shit, just like our own real streets. Prostitution, adultery, drugs etc they cripple our projected imagination of a loving world... Travis can see through the rose tinted glass. He can see the politicians lying for votes, for example and of course, naturally, being a taxi driver, leads him to encounter all sides of the coin- race, gender, class etc. Perhaps Travis is mentally ill, but some of his thoughts are grounded in ideological love even if he uses radical ways to express (saving the young girl). Trying to be a good and fair person in a world that isn't either...I can sympathise with his wellbeing and empathise with his situation.
Sympathy is one method, the other two are humanity and talent. You can make your character care for something outside themselves. And or you can make them very talented at something, I.e., Robin Hood’s ability to shoot an arrow.
@@alexanderford3831 Yes, perhaps we could say that empathy is necessary, and sympathy is more optional so long as we are still interested in what the character does. Walter White is an interesting example I think because there were times when he did come across as sympathetic (his illness, wanting to protect his family, fighting against bad guys), and other times definitely not (when he watches Jesse's girlfriend choke without intervening, the self-serving rationalizations for his greed, etc.).
He is saying sympathy or empathy are required. Not just sympathy.
Damn, the MC of my novel has all 9! Coolness :^D
Nice!
@@filmcourage Yep :^) Downside is that many beta readers can't see those qualities in him. Unfortunately, it's a race thing; my protagonist is Black, but many of my betas aren't. The readers who seemed to understand the character are Black or are used to being around us. So, even though my novel isn't about the _"Black Experience"_ , per se, I have to market it specifically to Black readers, limiting my audience. :^/ I wonder: How many screenwriters face similar issues, and how many movies get short shrift because of a lack of diversity in reviewers?
@@yapdog
Don't get discouraged by that! Remember Black Panther was the greatest Marvel solo movie ever, what makes it one of the greatest super heroes movie ever!
(I mean it both storywise and "box-officewise")
Keep writing it and you'll nail it!
@@brunayamaguchi9664 Thank you *very* much for the encouragement :^D
@@yapdog Are you sure that's a 'race thing' and not related to culture? There's plenty of black characters in movies and shows that are widely accepted, understood and appreciated by general audiences, at least within the context of those shows. If it were related to culture then I think that would be more understandable, as there could be a lot of people unfamiliar with the culture represented in your story that the character has come from
I remmber a w.b sweeny film. No sense of exape of hope .no humour. Totally realistic on the plus side. Most likey to end up as greek tragady. Unusual.
Why
Maybe watch the video. LOL
Well, Green Hornet has 2 heroes in it, and Battleship has at least 3, but the main protagonists are unsympathetic.
$200 mil is chump change 😆
So, uh, what are the five qualities?
And 200 mill is still an incredible amount to spend on a film.
Did you watch the video?
He only really gave one, I agree with you. I'll be hopping into the lecture later, he probably says the rest in there.
200 mil is peanuts compared to what hollywood was spending just before corona.
His opinion is kinda generic, maybe supposed to be.
are u kidding? house of sand of and fog is an amazing movie! and it didnt have a hero, thats why it bombed or are u telling me you can sympathize with every single main character?
sapin He is educating in general. You are accusing a wrong issue that is like “80% Of the citizen of USA is blah blah, but I am not so the statistics is wrong.”
@@Doskharaas in general we are going to get more star wars garbage and superhero bullshit instead of you know... good movies but yes of course how naive of me
If the audience can't empathize with a character, they will not care about that character. Just like real life.
@@firstlast-oo1he Yep. Your character doesn't need to be morally good. It can be as bad as dark hero. But It MUST connect with the audience first and foremost.
Though I find there's a line a main character shouldn't cross, even if audience empathizes with the main character. If your main character becomes TOO amoral for whatever reason, audience will have hard time justifying their action.