Best DI for Amp Modelers... or should you just use an adapter?
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- Опубликовано: 26 ноя 2024
- You want the best tone from your amp modeler or IR loader, so what should you use to get the signal to the sound board? Let's discuss the difference between using a DI, an adapter cable, or a line isolator.
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Special thanks to Charlie at Pinstripe Pedals for lending me the DISO+ and Bret Teegarden at Teegarden Audio for lending me the Magic DI.
Great job. Something that might be helpful for any future videos like this would be a "null test". I'm not a pro at this, but from what I understand, it's where you record the original signal (maybe using the loop pedal as an audio interface to your DAW), then record the same audio going through the DI/Line isolator, invert the polarity of that clip (don't quote me on that part) and basically what you're left with is the sound that was lost by going through the DI/Line isolator. It's the best way I've seen to represent what is being lost in the process of using them. I've only seen it done in one video, but it was incredibly helpful to hear, instead of the normal back to back sounds where you often can't actually detect anything being lost, even if it is happening.
Another A/B that really surprised me was the Diso+/RadialProDI. The Radial required about 30-40 percent more volume from the HX Stomp to match the level from the Stomp into DISO. There was also high end content that just went completely missing in the process
Ray Romano does super thorough gear reviews; kudos!
_takes a bow_
Very interesting timing with this video! I just reworked my board this past Sunday to exclude the DI. Most of the decision was just so I don’t have to tote the DI around. It did introduce a fair amount of noise with my Telecaster pickups, however the HX Stomp has a noise gate function and I was able to put on on each of the presets I was using. End result was a very strong, clean signal. I was happy with it!
I expected the passive DI to be the one that changes the tone the most and that is what I heard. Did I convince myself of that? Maybe need to set up a double blind experiment.
Hi. I'm not sure if I missed this in your video, but as I understand it there are reasons why mic level coming to the desk can be preferred ... and my memory tells me I got these from Sound on Sound ... so not a dodgy source.
One is that older desks didn't have pad buttons so clipping on input was a real possibility. I have never experienced this with a FoH desk, to be fair, but I know some domestic products from Mackie that have assumed XLR = mic level.
Second is to minimise crosstalk - run a mic level and a line level cable for long enough and because the mic signal at the desk end will be have much more gain, it'll have a little of the line level signal that leaked over the long, adjacent, cable run. Again, to be fair, I think this is a fringe case, but if we're evaluating them, let's evaluate them :).
On the flip side, I'm a keys player and the signals out of one of my keys (Yamaha MoXF) are notoriously low and when going through a DI, the mic signal via DI is quite low too ... but this has only been a problem once in 10 years or so - that was an older Behringer 16ch desk.
Oh and I see someone has already addressed that a TRS to XLR is probably balanced so noise is not an issue, per se.
Thanks for your vids - I find them very informative.
The Horizon Straightline had a relatively huge impact on the "tone" including what sounded light top and bottom cuts. The Diso+ and the Magic DI were much closer to line level console input, but the Magic DI was closest to my ear.
I use a Kemper in "mono dry and stereo out" signal configuration (wet/dry/wet) and our PA is a L-R-L setup.. Because I only have two channels for my rig I use a small Mackie board to sum the dry and effects signals to a stereo signal straight to board. I'm not certain how that is affecting my tone, but this video has me thinking about doing some experimentation.
If the stomp box output is line level, low impedance & balanced on a TRS, there should be no electrical issue with using a TRS to XLR adaptor and bringing it into a line level input on the console. (as James says at :10) Provided the input impedance is >10x the output impedance, it should transfer just fine.
I can't see why there would be any more noise on TRS to XLR because it's still a balanced line. You would want the cable to be a proper balanced cable ie twisted pairs so that any induced noise appears on both hot and cold.
There are 2 potential issues: 1. if there is a ground loop, but that would usually be a pin 1 problem where the pin 1 ground is wired to the chassis ground (do manufacturers still do that? It's been known issue for at least 20 years!). 2. Perhaps the bigger risk is that the XLR from the console gets phantom power on it. Most devices that are not microphones or DIs (ie expecting/using phantom power) hate it when they get phantom power up their output. That would be my main reason for using an isolation transformer.
The only time I've ever had a huge difference in tone from a DI box is when the instrument has a high impedance passive pickup. Then the 10x ratio of the decent DI made a huge difference - the difference in tone between a Behringer DI100 and Countryman DT-85 was very obvious. The latter is also better shielded from electrical noise on stage - if one can't get away from the lighting cables.
Hi! What about a Y/split XLR cable? Two female connecting to the mulit effects and single male at the end going to the PA/console? Thanks!
okay... I've never thought that I could hear the difference between DI's and I have to doublecheck / blindtest it. But I was surprised how clear the difference was.
Nice Video and awesome informations. Thank you again...
Okay... My thoughts seeing and hearing this video the first time:
TRS XLR (Direct) was the most open sound (which I liked the most)
PassivDI less HighEnd (like a 2-4dB HighShelfCut). sounded a bit to muddy for me
DISO+ Best solution for DI (but also a 1-2dB HighShelfCut)
AktiveDI some Crazy 4kHz boost
I recorded it and took it into Logic Pro X, switched the other tracks in Phase (TRS to XLR Track was my "MainTrack" because I thought it sounds most open / "natural"). I was right... (as far as this check is correct because of RUclips, recorded through my Interface, PreAmp sound blablabla).
what’s ur global out settings in stomp when using the DISO+ in the vid ?
James! I use a Walrus Canvas and love it…would get a Pinstripe if I ever decided to replace it. But the important thing… the piece of paper or lint on your shirt is killing my OCD 😂.
Haven't even watched yet....still, commenting for the algorithm.
I could only feel a thin layer of butter on the Horizon. I didn't notice any other changes...
best thing you can do is watch the whole video then watch another video after
What do you mean by saying "a little bit more noise?"
Great information brother! And Go Chiefs!
Thank you brother
Thanks for vidéo
What if you are using a modeler (helix floor) that has xlr outputs? Use those or di boxes? The level always is too hot using the xlr out and we use a pad at the board to compensate.
Most line inputs on boards are balanced TRS, just use an adapter or adapter cable.
You can set the global output volume to knock the XLR levels down. Just beware of ground loops if using in stereo, there is only a single ground lift.
The DI has no ultra high sounds
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🥰👌👌👌👌👌nice sir
lotsa talk less rock
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