I'm glad I found you! This is one of the few videos that explains in detail *WHY* we take these various calibration frames. The "how" part is well done too. Thanks Michael!
Thanks for the video. I should have come here first - I just spent 15 minutes trawling through the internet and through other videos trying to find how to do flats and you're the first one that mentioned that the f number needs to be the same as your light frames. No one else seemed to mention that detail.
I want to complement your presentation style! I'm a former pilot and flight simulator instructor. We had to learn numerous techniques, and then practice, to be sure we communicated precisely what was needed, hopefully with very few mistakes in our presentation. I'd say you did extremely well! I just acquired an MSM tracker a few weeks ago. Weather, schedule, etc. have prevented me from getting out so far. But I'm taking the time to learn what I can, and to acquire some additional pieces of equipment that I've seen recommended on the MSM page and other youtube videos. (like a right angle viewer for polar scope, how to calibrate the laser, what to order for an extra battery for the tracker on long, cold nights, etc.) I had listened to two other videos on the subject of calibration frames that still left me with a feeling that I just wasn't quite getting it. I got it now!!
That's very nice of you to say, Scott! A right angle viewer for the polar scope would be a nice accessory to look at. I'm glad my video helped you out a bit and please let me know if you have any other questions regarding this or any of my other astrophotography tutorials.
No one in any tutorials I have found on YT describe what these items are, mean, or how to achieve. Not even on post processing software websites do they explain. they all just assume you know what you are doing. So for the complete beginner, like me, your video was AWESOME! thanks so much from a new subscriber.
You are awesome in your description. I finally understood what exactly I need to do. A big big thank you. If you ever come to Greece you have a treat from me. And thanks again.
I am impressed by the simplicity and clarity to explain each process, I could understand everything perfectly, despite not speaking English, thank you very much for taking time to teach us, greetings from Chile
I'm glad you enjoy them. Astrophotography is a wonderful part of this hobby and hopefully I can do a small part in helping to get people into it. Take care and clear skies!
Had no clue about why these were important, nor about how to undertake them. Not only do I know now, but I also received useful information on what to expect and how much of each is needed. Very useful video. Thank you.
This video will help dearly when it comes to me adding flat and bias frames into my imaging as have only managed light and dark frames up to now. Awesome content dude. 📸
As someone just starting out this is fantastic, I do have a question though. I use a Sony a7iii, and it does not have an Av mode on the dial. What should I do to take my flat frames? I'm not entirely sure what Av mode is or does. Do I just keep everything the same just do the t-shirt and light?
Good question. I'm honestly not sure. See if sony calls it a different name for their settings! That is a nice camera by the way. A mirrorless Sony or Canon will be my next purchase once my current camera stops working.
I like the trick of putting the camera into aperture priority and letting it do the work for you. Nice video, it was to the point with no rambling and very helpful.
I appreciate you saying that! I've found the more direct things are regarding astrophotography the better. Especially for those who are just getting into the hobby! Clear skies!
@@LateNightAstronomy Yes, it's very overwhelming at first. There are a lot of new terms, concepts and disciplines to learn. I'm VERY picky when it comes to RUclips subscriptions but I subscribed to yours because it's a solid channel. Keep up the good work, I appreciate it.
Hey, just wanted to say I finally got enough of the basic ingredients together to get started with some basic imaging! Now the weather has to give me a break lol
The clouds always come around right when we get everything in line for some observing or imaging! Best of luck to you and keep me updated on how things go.
You should have mentioned that longer exposures at the proper ISO setting also results in higher signal to noise especially when using a DSLR on a telescope at a pre determined focal ratio. Also, guiding is necessary for longer exposures. You're only going to get so much detail out of thirty second exposures, even if you stack multiple short exposures. There's just not a high enough signal to noise ratio, even with calibration frames to cancel out unwanted noise. It's all about aperture. I recommend small Newtonians or Ritchey Cretien designed reflectors. Aperture is king and you can capture a lot more photons,(signal), with a six inch reflector than you ever can with a 60 millimeter camera lens. You could spend 4,000 dollars on multi element 60 millimeter camera lens and still not get the performance that you could get out of a six inch reflector. And they're probably close to the same weight.
Aperture is king for visual observing but I've been very surprised and pleased at the capabilities of the 135mm lens shooting at f/2 for long exposure astrophotography! I've found using a DSLR and Lens to be a wonderful and fairly budget friendly entry into this hobby. Also, shooting 30 second to 1 minute exposures at f/2 under my bortle 5 skies is the max I can do before light pollution engulfs the entire image. If I were under darker skies or needed exposure times beyond a minute a guide scope would definitely help. Thanks for your suggestions and clear skies!
Thanks. Fine made, good spoken! Some questions: Would it not be easier to take the Dark frames immediately after the Lights? Just put the lens cap on and press again the remote control. After that the Flats and at the end the Bias frames? Less changings necessary. And to the Flats: My mobile is smaller than the front of my lense. Is that a problem? And I would take the pictures also with the remote control, think it is more easy than to make it by pressing the button in the camera.
Great questions. I like taking the flats and bias first because they take more effort to do. Once those are done I can setup the remote to shoot the darks and then head inside to relax and get ready for bed while the darks shoot away. Then when the darks are done, all I have to do is pack up and call it a night. If you are shooting on a lens like the 135 it shouldn't matter if you are using the bright white screen of a large phone. If you are shooting with a telescope it probably wouldn't uniformly cover the fabric enough.
What an excellent educational video for us noobs, thank you!! Of course you have to decide where to draw the line from a details perspective and I believe you made an excellent choice. I am a little bit puzzled though since my Canon EOS D70 has Bulb mode on the program selector button and I run it with an ASIAIR Plus.
@@LateNightAstronomy Yes I bought one, but I can control it perfectly via ASIAIR Plus in "Bulb" mode. The main issue I have is that the scope has clear pictures when used for visual, but as soon as I fit the field flattener and camera, sharpness flies right out the window... bummer... So now I plan to use my D70 with a 70-200 lens (like in your video (withou ASIAIR Plus and EAF focuser etc). So can you suggest a good way to fasten it to my Sky-Watcher EQ6R Pro, will a simple dovetail Vixen with som stability mod be ok?
@@MarvelousLXVII We all started in the exact same position you are in. I was equally overwhelmed and excited the first time I went out to image the night sky!
@@LateNightAstronomy I have Celestron 80ED that I have never looked-through. I've had it for probably 15 years. Never had a mount for it or a tripod that could hold it. I hooked it to the HEQ5 and of course looked at the moon and it blew me away how good the optics are. I was worried that this telescope would not be a good fit for astrophotography until I hooked my Canon up to it and snapped a few pictures. They turned out perfectly. I can't wait to try this rig on a DSO this weekend. Thanks for the encouraging words.
Why this video doesn't have 500k views? It's the best explanation of Light/Dark/Bias/Flat frames on RUclips. Helped me a lot to understand the difference and settings needed for each frame type. Thanks!
This video enlights me. I am a newbie and this infos are very useful. Now I am at the point struggling with the histogram: don't know how to have the peak on the right position. Every settings i tried i have it at the far left of the histogram. Maybe my Nikon D40x are not capable of doing astrophotography?
@@LateNightAstronomy I tried with a Nikkor AF-S 18-200 f/3.4-5.6 lens at around 100m with f/5.6 that gives me the best result, even if very far to be optimal. Now I'm going to change lens (70mm at f4.5).. let's see. Time of exposure (according to the MFN rule) should be around 6secs (I don't have a tracker).
@@corradofrasca118 That's some nice equipment. I would encourage you have and if you are still loving astrophotography in a few months maybe look to get a samyang/rokinon 150mm f/2 lens. Do you own a tracking mount?
@@LateNightAstronomy Unfortunately I don't have a tracking mount, yet. Maybe when i will understand more of this world i will invest more money ;) Thanks for your suggestion on the samyang lens. I will keep it in mind. Thanks a Lot !
@@corradofrasca118 I shot on a normal tripod for about 6 months does short exposure shots and star trails. One thing I've learned is to take your time and plan before you spend. It's easy to sink a lot of money into this hobby too quickly.
Fantastic tutorial, thank you very much! As a newbie I would like to ask if it would be better logistically to take the different shots in the following sequence? 1, lightframes 2, Dark frames 3, Bias frames 4, Flat frames This way you don't need to adjust the camera after the light frames just put on the cap and take the Bias frames. Then you adjust the shutter to the fastest and take the darks. Finally change to Av mode and do the "T-shirt trick shots" for the flats. Thanks, Roberto
You can go a number of ways with this. Do what works best for you but I've found doing the darks last is the best for me because I can go inside and get ready for bed or even go to sleep while it is still shooting darks if I know the weather is 100% clear for the night. Now, darks need to be roughly the same temperature so you probably can't let it run all night, but if it's shooting for an hour or so getting darks while I'm counting sheep, that's a win win in my book :)
@@LateNightAstronomy Ahh, it make sense now! Unfortunately I need to drive at least 1/2 hour from my home to get a decent place without too much light pollution - So leaving the camera out to take darks alone is not an option here, but I'll keep it in mind for the times when I travel and will be able to let the camera do it's job while I sleep. :) Thanks again!
Sorry for what is a total beginner question. With this exact camera (Rebel SL2) How are the different calibration frames distinguished (seperated) from each other on the same memory card? The lights, flats seem self explanatory but no so with bias and dark. Perhaps labeled "in camera" before taking them. I'm over thinking this...as usual :)
Great question! Right after I take the pictures I go inside and the first thing I do is organize them on the computer. I open the RAW files using a program that came with my Canon Camera called Digital Photo Professional, that allows me to see the RAW files and also easily look at the file info to determine which ones were my light, dark, flat and bias frames.
Hi . Great video. But I thought and read in a lot of places that flats and biases are to be taken at the lowest iso possible. I’m still struggling to get rid of that samyang vigneting…
Thanks so much. From what I have read in a book I got on astrophotography you want the flats and bias to be the same iso. That has gotten rid of most of the vignetting on my Samyang 135.
Might be a stupid question, but if you forget how many Bias and Dark photos you took, how do you know the difference when putting them into deep sky stacker (I assume they are both just black images)?. Is there a way of saving them in a different folder on the camera so you know which were Bias and which were Dark? Great tutorial by the way, very clear and concise.
Great question and thanks for your compliment! I use a program called Digital Photo Professional 4 to preview the files on my PC before putting them into DeepSkyStacker. This allows me to make sure everything came out well and organize them into the proper folders. Check out a video I just uploaded on DeepSkyStacker to go a bit more into the process you are asking about.
I was thinking of simple idea, just writing down the timestamp that you started with the lights and before you start with the darks als write down the starting time etc. Then in the end you can see by the creation time of the files, which belongs to what.
You could just take them in a different order. Light, Dark, Flat, Bias - so when viewing them on the computer you’ll see image as, light, dark, light and dark, then just place them in their own folders.
@@LateNightAstronomy can you create a video with beginners issues in astrophotography final images ,for example dust shadows and veinieting , very noisy image,and other issues???????
Thanks so much and good question. You reach diminising returns eventually. Part of it depends on the length of your light frames but I've found around 75 to be the sweet spot for my equipment. Anything more and I have a hard time noticing a difference in how they clean things up.
Interesting video. I've done a bit over a half dozen deep sky shoots so far and they turned out pretty good. I had an interesting problem on my last shoot, M31. When I stacked, using Siril, I got a lot of negative pixel rejections. I tried stacking using only bias and flats, same result. I then tried stacking with only the darks, same result. Finally I stacked without calibration frames and got as good of an image as I hoped for with my equipment. I checked the meta data on the frames to make sure I hadn't reversed my dark and bias, I hadn't. Finally, in similar conditions, re-shot the calibration frames and again got the negative pixel rejects. Does anyone have any idea of what went wrong? (FWIW, I am using Siril instead of DeepSkyStacker because it failed to stack the last time I tried to use it.)
@@LateNightAstronomy it is a real puzzler. I started using a program, DeepSkyStacker or something like that. Not sure of the name. It worked good for a few but I had one that would get to the last stage in the image creating process and just seem to freeze. After a 3rd attempt I gave up and tried Siril and got a good image. Either way it doesn't have the image editing capabilities of Siril. At least I couldn't figure out how to use them if it did have them and did all my edting in GIMP. I now have to do very little in GIMP.
Thanks! Just became a follower 🤩 I am really looking forward to try take som astro images this year, Wan to try a little bit of different objects from milky way to orion nebula and the Andromeda galaxy. I´m not sure I will succeed but I hope I can at least get something 😄👍
Glad I found this video. But I have a question on the white tee shirt, iPhone technique. How do you turn on the white screen on your iPhone. When I search for this, all I find is how to turn off the "white screen kiss of death" but nothing on how to enable it. What's the trick??? Thanks!
Bill, I just saw this but will answer here so others can see my response. I downloaded a white background from google that I keep in my phone's photo library, temporarily turn off the display auto lock and turned up the brightness to 100 percent.
Great Tutorial!! Thanks, I have Just, started to learn How To use Deep Sky Stacker. In My Work Flow I usually Take a Light Frames And Flats, I ignore Darks, Super Useful For Me!!🌌🔭
Thanks for the positive feedback! I'll have the video out walking through deep sky stacker in about a week. Let me know if you have any questions along the way!
I found a website that suggested the best iso to get the best dynamic range for my camera, the canon sl2. For most objects I shoot at iso 400. For very faint deep sky objects I will sometimes shoot at iso 800.
I would like to get into this hobby. I’m not into photography or how to use any kind of photo software. Just your typical taking pictures here and there throughout my everyday living. Im glad I stumbled into your video. I’ve seen others using lights and shirts on their lens and would wonder what the heck they were doing. I still haven’t purchased a telescope or a mount, just have a Nikon D90 and cheap tripod. Living in light polluted suburb is what I’m dealing with. Anyway, I am going to like and subscribe, purchase the recommended book and hope I will succeed. I am retired and need a third hobby. Thanks for this much needed video.
I appreciate your support of this channel. I started out with a DSLR and Tripod about 5 years ago doing star trails and testing the waters before I put more money into it. Check out my astrophotography playlist for more info on products to get you started!
I believe the bias frames are separate because they are the sensor noise from the fastest shutter speed available. Where the dark frames are the sensor heat/noise from the exposure length you took that evening. Most books I've read on astrophotography have encouraged people to take bias and dark frames if possible!
@@LateNightAstronomy Actually I just started doing Astro Photography and so I Read All the Important Stuff then after I will go on to the shoot Mode and easily learn the way you present the all the stuff...Can I get your Insta Handle?
@@HimachoPhotography I do not cover up the viewfinder but a friend in my local club does. It's never impacted my calibration frames but you could experiment with it's impact on your images.
Yes, but make sure the temperature is the same for the darks and the orientation is the same for the flats. I normally shoot them at the end of my night imaging.
Did I miss something when you talked about flat frames? You changed the camera setting from M to A-(aperture priority) with no follow up why?, also no mention of where the histogram setting /position should aim for when taking Flat Frames. Could you expand on that in more detail please. Is the flat frame exposure the same as used for the light frames? Thank you in anticipation and for your presentation.
Good question. Switching to Aperture priority mode will automatically have the camera move the histogram to the middle for each of the flat images. This is the simplest way to get even flats at the same exposure to stack later on!
Hii sir pls reply for taking calibration frames does star tracker need to be on or should off and take frames for example you say that exposure length for dark frames should be same as light so does startracker need to be on when taking dark frames iam confuse and sorry for bad English
Hey, if I follow the same process as this but using a Samsung galaxy 11, do you think it would give similar results ?. Not for deep sky objects but for stars like the pleides
It's always worth a shot. My suggestion is to always begin astrophotography with what you already have and for most people that is a smart phone with a pretty impressive camera.
Glad it was helpful! I appreciate your comment and please let me know if you have any questions along the way. I just started to heavily dive into this about 3 years ago. It's a great hobby!
Hi do you recommend using mechanical shutter or electronic shutter? The limitation on Sony which I use, is electronic is from 30 sec to 1/8000 while mechanical is from Bulb to 1/4000
I have never shot with a electronic shutter but if you can only get "Bulb" with mechanical that I think you will have to shoot with that if you are using a tracking system and want exposures longer than 30 second which will often be the case! Which Sony do you own?
@@LateNightAstronomy Sony A7c. as far as I know, many Sony FF models and all Sony APS-C models have the same limitations on mechanical and electronic shutters.
How do I set exposure times and how many I want there to be without the little handheld remote you have there? I just bought a canon rebel t6 and I’m trying to figure it out
That is the easiest and most affordable way to do it. There are non supported firmware upgrades for some cameras to set all of that internally but I've never messed around with that. The shutter remote I bought cost about 30 dollars on amazon.com
This is a good question. Having not used a mirrorless camera my best educated guess is yes due to similar effects going on with the sensor of a DSLR and Mirrorless camera regardless of their mechanical differences. Are you out imaging anything right now or just getting into astrophotography?
For workflow... you take this in the field, but how do you know which is which when you get back to your computer?? I am thinking of maybe creating a photoshop image with large text saying "Flat Frame," "Bias Frame," and "Dark Frame." Load those in my "astro" album on the iPhone, then take a photo of the appropriate image just before starting to take that type of frame. That way, when I am back in the office, I will have a marker to tell me which form of black I am looking at, etc. Does that sound like a reasonable approach?
Good question. I use a program that canon offered for free with my camera pruchase called Digtal Photo Professional. It allows me to dump all of the raw files into a folder on windows after my imaging session and see the raw files. I first oranize the light and flat frames because they are the most obvious and then I put into folders the bias and dark frames based off of the information on each file showing how long or short the exposure was.
If I'm using the same camera settings for a different picture, can I use all of the same dark, flat, and bias frames for that one? If not then why not?
In most cases no. The dark frames are capturing the temperature of your sensor and most nights temps outside and in your camera will vary. Flat frames have to be done every night because of the orientation of the lens and dust particles. Bias frames might be the most likely to be reused but I still take 50 to 75 every night because they are so quick to do.
@@LateNightAstronomy imaging. If I set my focal length and put on the mask and than 10x digital zoom I see the star but not the spike’s. Or maybe my star isn’t bright enough?
Hi! This is a GREAT video, thank you so much! Your explanation is very clear. I photographed the comet C/2022 E3 ZTF using this method and it worked really well. I'm satisfied with the results. I have a question: are dark frames to be taken using the same zoom? In other words: during the same stargazing night, can I take darks only once, and use them for the stacking process of different objects at different zooms? (Taking the temperature as constant)
Great information and extremely clearly described. Although I’m using a dedicated Astro camera and not a DSLR, it looks like everything still applies. The only thing different will be the flat frames as my iPhone isn’t going to be large enough for illuminating the tee shirt on an 8” telescope!! I can probably build something to do it. Thanks for the great video.
I have been struggling with these calibration frames so I really appreciate the insight. Specifically, I find that my camera will not take the dark frames because it decided there is not enough light to capture an image. There must be some setting I am missing. Same thing when I was trying to capture bias frames. I am also struggling with the ASIair. It writes jpg and fit files. Do I load both into Deep Sky Stacker? Or just the Fit frames? It really is a steep learning curve, but the challenge also makes it exciting. Appreciate your help here.
Will there be a different process if instead of a regular lens but a telescope SCT 8in at f/10? Because I have been trying and failing. Great video now at least I know what to do.
Michael, your video was so helpful. Im a beginner and I have a problem shooting flats. I took a series of light frames. The info says that they were shoot RAW, ISO 8000, f/4, 16.0mm, 15s on a Canon EOS R6. When I try to take flat frames using these settings and a t-shirt the camera wont fire. It worked taking the Bias and Dark files. Help please.
Good question. When you shoot flats you want to change the camera to AV mode. Keep your iso and f-stop the same but your exposure time will now be done automatically by the camera to give a proper flat white shot.
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That's probably the only video showing calibration frames using a lens. Super useful. Thanks!
I'm glad you found it helpful. This setup and process has worked well for me over the past couple years!
I second this. Its also only the second time ive heard to swtich to AV. Which i assume is just A on my Sony? What is Av mode?
Finally, someone explained to me what it is and what the purpose of these photos is
I appreciate that! Let me know if you ever have any questions.
I'm glad I found you! This is one of the few videos that explains in detail *WHY* we take these various calibration frames. The "how" part is well done too. Thanks Michael!
You’re welcome! Let me know if you have anymore questions along the way!
The best video out there. No BS, only BS (bias stacking).
Haha! I like that!
Thanks for the video. I should have come here first - I just spent 15 minutes trawling through the internet and through other videos trying to find how to do flats and you're the first one that mentioned that the f number needs to be the same as your light frames. No one else seemed to mention that detail.
I'm really glad you found it helpful!
No one mentions anything in detail. Haha, It's so "muscle memory" for most of them. They forget the tiny bits that add up to everything! 🙂
I want to complement your presentation style! I'm a former pilot and flight simulator instructor. We had to learn numerous techniques, and then practice, to be sure we communicated precisely what was needed, hopefully with very few mistakes in our presentation. I'd say you did extremely well!
I just acquired an MSM tracker a few weeks ago. Weather, schedule, etc. have prevented me from getting out so far. But I'm taking the time to learn what I can, and to acquire some additional pieces of equipment that I've seen recommended on the MSM page and other youtube videos. (like a right angle viewer for polar scope, how to calibrate the laser, what to order for an extra battery for the tracker on long, cold nights, etc.)
I had listened to two other videos on the subject of calibration frames that still left me with a feeling that I just wasn't quite getting it. I got it now!!
That's very nice of you to say, Scott! A right angle viewer for the polar scope would be a nice accessory to look at. I'm glad my video helped you out a bit and please let me know if you have any other questions regarding this or any of my other astrophotography tutorials.
No one in any tutorials I have found on YT describe what these items are, mean, or how to achieve. Not even on post processing software websites do they explain. they all just assume you know what you are doing. So for the complete beginner, like me, your video was AWESOME! thanks so much from a new subscriber.
I appreciate you saying that and for your support of my channel! I hope your journey into astrophotography is rewarding!
You are awesome in your description. I finally understood what exactly I need to do. A big big thank you. If you ever come to Greece you have a treat from me. And thanks again.
I apprecaite that and thanks for watching!
Charles’s book is a masterpiece. I recommend that to anyone. Thanks for the mention.
I couldn't agree with you more!
Wauw,
You are so well spoken not to fast not to slow... just perfect, explained everything i needed to know and more!
Thanks so much! Stop back by if you ever have any questions!
The definitive guide! Thank you very much for all your effort!
Of course!
I am impressed by the simplicity and clarity to explain each process, I could understand everything perfectly, despite not speaking English, thank you very much for taking time to teach us, greetings from Chile
That is very nice of you to say! Thanks so much and let me know if you have any questions.
Very clear to understand and concise. Many thanks. It is an excellent video!
Glad it was helpful!
Thank god! Finally someone who explains it in a clearly way!
That is kind of you to say! Thanks and let me know if you have any questions.
This is EXACTLY the video I've been searching for on this topic. Thank you so much for taking the time to explain this to us beginners!
I'm glad you found it helpful.
wow man🔥🔥🔥🔥 u upload the best astrophotography tutorials.🔥🔥🔥
I'm glad you enjoy them. Astrophotography is a wonderful part of this hobby and hopefully I can do a small part in helping to get people into it. Take care and clear skies!
Had no clue about why these were important, nor about how to undertake them. Not only do I know now, but I also received useful information on what to expect and how much of each is needed. Very useful video. Thank you.
Thanks very much! Stop back by if you ever have any questions!
your videos are my favorites, cause they tell me the important stuff in a fraction of the time compared to others, thank you.
That's so nice to hear! I'm glad you find them helpful and please let me know if you ever have any questions!
Congrats Sir! The best 10 minute in the topic. This should be compulsary content to view for anyone who wants to start in this area. Well done!
I really appreciate that! Clear skies and let me know if you ever have any questions!
This video will help dearly when it comes to me adding flat and bias frames into my imaging as have only managed light and dark frames up to now.
Awesome content dude. 📸
Clear skies to you and keep my updated on how everything goes with your imaging!
perfect video, simple, straight to the point, thanks!
I really appreciate that!
Excellent, as always. Appreciate the straightforward and detailed explanation.
Thanks for taking the time to let me know that! I appreciate your support!
As someone just starting out this is fantastic, I do have a question though. I use a Sony a7iii, and it does not have an Av mode on the dial. What should I do to take my flat frames? I'm not entirely sure what Av mode is or does. Do I just keep everything the same just do the t-shirt and light?
Good question. I'm honestly not sure. See if sony calls it a different name for their settings! That is a nice camera by the way. A mirrorless Sony or Canon will be my next purchase once my current camera stops working.
Nicely done, exactly the topic I was trying to figure out as a newbie.
Glad to hear that. Let me know if you have any questions along the way!
Thank you for helping me!
I couldn't understand these frames and now i understand them😊 thank you great video❤
You're welcome
Really very useful, many thanks, peace and love from Scotland
I appreciate that and best wishes to my friends in Scotland!
I like the trick of putting the camera into aperture priority and letting it do the work for you. Nice video, it was to the point with no rambling and very helpful.
I appreciate you saying that! I've found the more direct things are regarding astrophotography the better. Especially for those who are just getting into the hobby! Clear skies!
@@LateNightAstronomy Yes, it's very overwhelming at first. There are a lot of new terms, concepts and disciplines to learn. I'm VERY picky when it comes to RUclips subscriptions but I subscribed to yours because it's a solid channel. Keep up the good work, I appreciate it.
excellent presentation. You are easy to listen to with your tempo
Thank you!
Excellent tutorial! Merci beaucoup! Well done!!
You are quite welcome! Take care!
Wonderful video! Thanks!!
That's very kind of you! I'm glad you enjoyed it!
Hey, just wanted to say I finally got enough of the basic ingredients together to get started with some basic imaging! Now the weather has to give me a break lol
The clouds always come around right when we get everything in line for some observing or imaging! Best of luck to you and keep me updated on how things go.
@@LateNightAstronomy I will do that
i will sharing on linked in..im inspire..job well done
I appreciate that and clear skies!
A very good Video. THANKS !
You're very welcome! Let me know if you ever have any questions!
You should have mentioned that longer exposures at the proper ISO setting also results in higher signal to noise especially when using a DSLR on a telescope at a pre determined focal ratio. Also, guiding is necessary for longer exposures. You're only going to get so much detail out of thirty second exposures, even if you stack multiple short exposures. There's just not a high enough signal to noise ratio, even with calibration frames to cancel out unwanted noise. It's all about aperture. I recommend small Newtonians or Ritchey Cretien designed reflectors. Aperture is king and you can capture a lot more photons,(signal), with a six inch reflector than you ever can with a 60 millimeter camera lens. You could spend 4,000 dollars on multi element 60 millimeter camera lens and still not get the performance that you could get out of a six inch reflector. And they're probably close to the same weight.
Aperture is king for visual observing but I've been very surprised and pleased at the capabilities of the 135mm lens shooting at f/2 for long exposure astrophotography! I've found using a DSLR and Lens to be a wonderful and fairly budget friendly entry into this hobby. Also, shooting 30 second to 1 minute exposures at f/2 under my bortle 5 skies is the max I can do before light pollution engulfs the entire image. If I were under darker skies or needed exposure times beyond a minute a guide scope would definitely help. Thanks for your suggestions and clear skies!
This was so helpful! Thank you
I appreciate you letting me know that! Are you getting into astrophotography or been out to image anything lately?
Thanks. Fine made, good spoken! Some questions: Would it not be easier to take the Dark frames immediately after the Lights? Just put the lens cap on and press again the remote control. After that the Flats and at the end the Bias frames? Less changings necessary. And to the Flats: My mobile is smaller than the front of my lense. Is that a problem? And I would take the pictures also with the remote control, think it is more easy than to make it by pressing the button in the camera.
Great questions. I like taking the flats and bias first because they take more effort to do. Once those are done I can setup the remote to shoot the darks and then head inside to relax and get ready for bed while the darks shoot away. Then when the darks are done, all I have to do is pack up and call it a night. If you are shooting on a lens like the 135 it shouldn't matter if you are using the bright white screen of a large phone. If you are shooting with a telescope it probably wouldn't uniformly cover the fabric enough.
What an excellent educational video for us noobs, thank you!!
Of course you have to decide where to draw the line from a details perspective and I believe you made an excellent choice. I am a little bit puzzled though since my Canon EOS D70 has Bulb mode on the program selector button and I run it with an ASIAIR Plus.
Thank you! Do you have a remote shutter release controller to adjust the length of exposure you want to take?
@@LateNightAstronomy Yes I bought one, but I can control it perfectly via ASIAIR Plus in "Bulb" mode.
The main issue I have is that the scope has clear pictures when used for visual, but as soon as I fit the field flattener and camera, sharpness flies right out the window... bummer...
So now I plan to use my D70 with a 70-200 lens (like in your video (withou ASIAIR Plus and EAF focuser etc). So can you suggest a good way to fasten it to my Sky-Watcher EQ6R Pro, will a simple dovetail Vixen with som stability mod be ok?
Great video. I just ordered my life long dream of astrophotography equipment after saving for years and can't wait to get started.
Congratulations on your purchase! Please let me know of any questions you have along the way and how things are going for you.
@@LateNightAstronomy Thank you it just came in. I might give it a whirl tonight and embarrass myself with my lack of skills lol.
@@MarvelousLXVII We all started in the exact same position you are in. I was equally overwhelmed and excited the first time I went out to image the night sky!
@@LateNightAstronomy I have Celestron 80ED that I have never looked-through. I've had it for probably 15 years. Never had a mount for it or a tripod that could hold it. I hooked it to the HEQ5 and of course looked at the moon and it blew me away how good the optics are. I was worried that this telescope would not be a good fit for astrophotography until I hooked my Canon up to it and snapped a few pictures. They turned out perfectly. I can't wait to try this rig on a DSO this weekend. Thanks for the encouraging words.
You've earned a lifelong sub
Thank you so much!
Very clear explanation! Thanks!
Glad it was helpful!
Thank you so much!!! I just took my first images for astrophotography and I was so confused when the program asked me for all this strange terms lol.
I'm so glad this video helped you out!
Why this video doesn't have 500k views? It's the best explanation of Light/Dark/Bias/Flat frames on RUclips. Helped me a lot to understand the difference and settings needed for each frame type. Thanks!
I really appreciate that! And thankfully your view made it get a bit closer to 500,000 :) Take care and clear skies!
amazing...............................
Thank you so much 😀
The best explanation ever 👍👍👍
I really appreciate you saying that! Have you been out to image anything lately?
Thanks so much. Clear and to the point.
I'm glad you enjoyed it. Are you getting into astrophotography or currently out imaging some things?
This video enlights me. I am a newbie and this infos are very useful. Now I am at the point struggling with the histogram: don't know how to have the peak on the right position. Every settings i tried i have it at the far left of the histogram. Maybe my Nikon D40x are not capable of doing astrophotography?
What lens are you using and what f stop are you shooting at?
@@LateNightAstronomy I tried with a Nikkor AF-S 18-200 f/3.4-5.6 lens at around 100m with f/5.6 that gives me the best result, even if very far to be optimal. Now I'm going to change lens (70mm at f4.5).. let's see. Time of exposure (according to the MFN rule) should be around 6secs (I don't have a tracker).
@@corradofrasca118 That's some nice equipment. I would encourage you have and if you are still loving astrophotography in a few months maybe look to get a samyang/rokinon 150mm f/2 lens. Do you own a tracking mount?
@@LateNightAstronomy Unfortunately I don't have a tracking mount, yet. Maybe when i will understand more of this world i will invest more money ;) Thanks for your suggestion on the samyang lens. I will keep it in mind. Thanks a Lot !
@@corradofrasca118 I shot on a normal tripod for about 6 months does short exposure shots and star trails. One thing I've learned is to take your time and plan before you spend. It's easy to sink a lot of money into this hobby too quickly.
Fantastic tutorial, thank you very much!
As a newbie I would like to ask if it would be better logistically to take the different shots in the following sequence?
1, lightframes
2, Dark frames
3, Bias frames
4, Flat frames
This way you don't need to adjust the camera after the light frames just put on the cap and take the Bias frames.
Then you adjust the shutter to the fastest and take the darks.
Finally change to Av mode and do the "T-shirt trick shots" for the flats.
Thanks,
Roberto
You can go a number of ways with this. Do what works best for you but I've found doing the darks last is the best for me because I can go inside and get ready for bed or even go to sleep while it is still shooting darks if I know the weather is 100% clear for the night. Now, darks need to be roughly the same temperature so you probably can't let it run all night, but if it's shooting for an hour or so getting darks while I'm counting sheep, that's a win win in my book :)
@@LateNightAstronomy Ahh, it make sense now! Unfortunately I need to drive at least 1/2 hour from my home to get a decent place without too much light pollution - So leaving the camera out to take darks alone is not an option here, but I'll keep it in mind for the times when I travel and will be able to let the camera do it's job while I sleep. :)
Thanks again!
@@RobertoPhoto Best of luck to you and stop back by to let me know how your imaging is going!
I only thought we took light & dark frames, this has educated me quite a bit.
I'm glad you found it helpful! Let me know if you have any questions in the future!
Great video. It was very informative and helpful
Thanks for letting me know. If you have any questions, please stop back by.
Sorry for what is a total beginner question. With this exact camera (Rebel SL2) How are the different calibration frames distinguished (seperated) from each other on the same memory card? The lights, flats seem self explanatory but no so with bias and dark. Perhaps labeled "in camera" before taking them. I'm over thinking this...as usual :)
Great question! Right after I take the pictures I go inside and the first thing I do is organize them on the computer. I open the RAW files using a program that came with my Canon Camera called Digital Photo Professional, that allows me to see the RAW files and also easily look at the file info to determine which ones were my light, dark, flat and bias frames.
@@LateNightAstronomy Excellent. Thank you!
Great Info..
Thanks very much!
Brilliant, clear and simple, definitely understand it now :)
That's exactly what I love to hear! Clear skies!
Can you recommend any particular suppliers of the incredibly sophisticated and expensive scientific instrument?
Which instrument are you referring to?
@@LateNightAstronomy 6:05 The t-shirt 😂
@@TParis23 Hahaha! Target!!!!!
I learn so much from you as a begener
very helpful video .
Glad to hear that! Let me know any questions you have along the way.
@@LateNightAstronomy
I’m sure I’ll have questions soon I will begin.
just subbed! very useful video! thanks!
Thanks for the sub!
Hi . Great video. But I thought and read in a lot of places that flats and biases are to be taken at the lowest iso possible.
I’m still struggling to get rid of that samyang vigneting…
Thanks so much. From what I have read in a book I got on astrophotography you want the flats and bias to be the same iso. That has gotten rid of most of the vignetting on my Samyang 135.
Thanks! Very clear information.
You're Welcome!
Might be a stupid question, but if you forget how many Bias and Dark photos you took, how do you know the difference when putting them into deep sky stacker (I assume they are both just black images)?. Is there a way of saving them in a different folder on the camera so you know which were Bias and which were Dark? Great tutorial by the way, very clear and concise.
Great question and thanks for your compliment! I use a program called Digital Photo Professional 4 to preview the files on my PC before putting them into DeepSkyStacker. This allows me to make sure everything came out well and organize them into the proper folders. Check out a video I just uploaded on DeepSkyStacker to go a bit more into the process you are asking about.
I was thinking of simple idea, just writing down the timestamp that you started with the lights and before you start with the darks als write down the starting time etc. Then in the end you can see by the creation time of the files, which belongs to what.
You could just take them in a different order. Light, Dark, Flat, Bias - so when viewing them on the computer you’ll see image as, light, dark, light and dark, then just place them in their own folders.
Very useful video congratulations i have aderstent al steps for taking calibration frames
Glad you found it helpful! Clear skies!
@@LateNightAstronomy thanks
@@LateNightAstronomy Please can you create a video with lagoon nebula
@@LateNightAstronomy Can you create a video of lagoon nebula and all nebula in this area in the center of the galaxy that you captured???????
@@LateNightAstronomy can you create a video with beginners issues in astrophotography final images ,for example dust shadows and veinieting , very noisy image,and other issues???????
Good job....enjoyed it
Thank you! This was one took a while to put together and I'm excited to get it posted!
Very helpful... grateful...thank you so much
Glad you enjoyed it. Clear skies!
How do you know how many Flat, Bias,and Dark frames to take? This video and others of yours was Super Helpful! I do have other questions... lol
Thanks so much and good question. You reach diminising returns eventually. Part of it depends on the length of your light frames but I've found around 75 to be the sweet spot for my equipment. Anything more and I have a hard time noticing a difference in how they clean things up.
Interesting video. I've done a bit over a half dozen deep sky shoots so far and they turned out pretty good. I had an interesting problem on my last shoot, M31. When I stacked, using Siril, I got a lot of negative pixel rejections. I tried stacking using only bias and flats, same result. I then tried stacking with only the darks, same result. Finally I stacked without calibration frames and got as good of an image as I hoped for with my equipment.
I checked the meta data on the frames to make sure I hadn't reversed my dark and bias, I hadn't. Finally, in similar conditions, re-shot the calibration frames and again got the negative pixel rejects.
Does anyone have any idea of what went wrong?
(FWIW, I am using Siril instead of DeepSkyStacker because it failed to stack the last time I tried to use it.)
Having never used Siril, I'm not sure what might be going on. But either way I'm glad you ended up with a great final image.
@@LateNightAstronomy it is a real puzzler. I started using a program, DeepSkyStacker or something like that. Not sure of the name. It worked good for a few but I had one that would get to the last stage in the image creating process and just seem to freeze. After a 3rd attempt I gave up and tried Siril and got a good image.
Either way it doesn't have the image editing capabilities of Siril. At least I couldn't figure out how to use them if it did have them and did all my edting in GIMP. I now have to do very little in GIMP.
Thanks! Just became a follower 🤩
I am really looking forward to try take som astro images this year, Wan to try a little bit of different objects from milky way to orion nebula and the Andromeda galaxy. I´m not sure I will succeed but I hope I can at least get something 😄👍
Best of luck to you and stop back by to let me know how things are going for you!
@@LateNightAstronomy I will let you know, just dont expect to much or too soon 😅👍
Glad I found this video. But I have a question on the white tee shirt, iPhone technique. How do you turn on the white screen on your iPhone. When I search for this, all I find is how to turn off the "white screen kiss of death" but nothing on how to enable it. What's the trick??? Thanks!
Bill, I just saw this but will answer here so others can see my response. I downloaded a white background from google that I keep in my phone's photo library, temporarily turn off the display auto lock and turned up the brightness to 100 percent.
Great Tutorial!! Thanks, I have Just, started to learn How To use Deep Sky Stacker. In My Work Flow I usually Take a Light Frames And Flats, I ignore Darks, Super Useful For Me!!🌌🔭
Thanks for the positive feedback! I'll have the video out walking through deep sky stacker in about a week. Let me know if you have any questions along the way!
Great videos and thank you for sharing your knowledge. How do you determine what ISO to use?
I found a website that suggested the best iso to get the best dynamic range for my camera, the canon sl2. For most objects I shoot at iso 400. For very faint deep sky objects I will sometimes shoot at iso 800.
I would like to get into this hobby. I’m not into photography or how to use any kind of photo software. Just your typical taking pictures here and there throughout my everyday living. Im glad I stumbled into your video. I’ve seen others using lights and shirts on their lens and would wonder what the heck they were doing.
I still haven’t purchased a telescope or a mount, just have a Nikon D90 and cheap tripod. Living in light polluted suburb is what I’m dealing with. Anyway, I am going to like and subscribe, purchase the recommended book and hope I will succeed. I am retired and need a third hobby. Thanks for this much needed video.
I appreciate your support of this channel. I started out with a DSLR and Tripod about 5 years ago doing star trails and testing the waters before I put more money into it. Check out my astrophotography playlist for more info on products to get you started!
What are the bias frames for? The bias is of course already included in the dark frames, so when you subtract the dark, the bias is also subtracted.
I believe the bias frames are separate because they are the sensor noise from the fastest shutter speed available. Where the dark frames are the sensor heat/noise from the exposure length you took that evening. Most books I've read on astrophotography have encouraged people to take bias and dark frames if possible!
Very Helpful! Thanks
Glad it was helpful! Do you do any imaging?
@@LateNightAstronomy Actually I just started doing Astro Photography and so I Read All the Important Stuff then after I will go on to the shoot Mode and easily learn the way you present the all the stuff...Can I get your Insta Handle?
Also want to know one more thing that in Flat,Bias and Dark we will also Cover up viewfinder?
@@HimachoPhotography I do not cover up the viewfinder but a friend in my local club does. It's never impacted my calibration frames but you could experiment with it's impact on your images.
Ok Thanks Mate :)
Thanks for the information. Since the flat, bias and dark frames are taken with a shirt or the lens cap on, can you shoot these later?
Yes, but make sure the temperature is the same for the darks and the orientation is the same for the flats. I normally shoot them at the end of my night imaging.
Thanks. Great tutorial
Glad it was helpful!
And what botanav mask does the roki 135mm take?
Should be the same one I bought for my samyang. I've got a video on it in my astrophotography playlist.
Did I miss something when you talked about flat frames? You changed the camera setting from M to A-(aperture priority) with no follow up why?, also no mention of where the histogram setting /position should aim for when taking Flat Frames. Could you expand on that in more detail please. Is the flat frame exposure the same as used for the light frames? Thank you in anticipation and for your presentation.
Good question. Switching to Aperture priority mode will automatically have the camera move the histogram to the middle for each of the flat images. This is the simplest way to get even flats at the same exposure to stack later on!
Hii sir pls reply for taking calibration frames does star tracker need to be on or should off and take frames for example you say that exposure length for dark frames should be same as light so does startracker need to be on when taking dark frames iam confuse and sorry for bad English
You only need the star tracker on when taking your light frames of the object. I turn it off for my flat, bias and dark frames to save battery!
Hey, if I follow the same process as this but using a Samsung galaxy 11, do you think it would give similar results ?. Not for deep sky objects but for stars like the pleides
It's always worth a shot. My suggestion is to always begin astrophotography with what you already have and for most people that is a smart phone with a pretty impressive camera.
Loved the T-shirt part
Haha! Thank You!
Wow man you grow my interest in astronomy
That's why I do what I do here! Thanks for taking the time to let me know that and clear skies!
Great video for explaining the difference and how to take the different frames. Appreciated!
You're welcome. Clear skies and keep me updated on how your astrophotography goes.
thanks man! well edited and detailed. especially liked the slides with written info so i can save them for later
I appreciate your comment and am glad that helped to show you the process.
I’m just about to embark on Astro photography - this video and your explanation process is just perfect. Thanks so much for posting!
Glad it was helpful! I appreciate your comment and please let me know if you have any questions along the way. I just started to heavily dive into this about 3 years ago. It's a great hobby!
Hi do you recommend using mechanical shutter or electronic shutter? The limitation on Sony which I use, is electronic is from 30 sec to 1/8000 while mechanical is from Bulb to 1/4000
I have never shot with a electronic shutter but if you can only get "Bulb" with mechanical that I think you will have to shoot with that if you are using a tracking system and want exposures longer than 30 second which will often be the case! Which Sony do you own?
@@LateNightAstronomy Sony A7c. as far as I know, many Sony FF models and all Sony APS-C models have the same limitations on mechanical and electronic shutters.
@@moshesalama That's a nice camera! Keep me updated on how it goes for you.
That was really well explained and helpful, thank you!
I appreciate that! let me know if you ever have any questions about AstroPhotography!
How do I set exposure times and how many I want there to be without the little handheld remote you have there? I just bought a canon rebel t6 and I’m trying to figure it out
That is the easiest and most affordable way to do it. There are non supported firmware upgrades for some cameras to set all of that internally but I've never messed around with that. The shutter remote I bought cost about 30 dollars on amazon.com
Can I ask if the calibration frames are just as important for Mirrorless cameras? Not sure if it makes any difference? Excellent video!!!
This is a good question. Having not used a mirrorless camera my best educated guess is yes due to similar effects going on with the sensor of a DSLR and Mirrorless camera regardless of their mechanical differences. Are you out imaging anything right now or just getting into astrophotography?
Hello, fine video! What a wire trigger do you use for your camera?
It is a remote timer shutter release that I bought off of amazon.com. I believe it is from Neewer and cost about 30 dollars.
@@LateNightAstronomy okay, thank you for you answer!
What type of white light do you use for an 9.25 or larger telescope?
I've heard of people using the t-shirt technique but with an iPad instead of an iPhone for larger telescopes.
Hey quick question, for flat frames do you keep the same exposure time as light frames?
No, flat frames will be set on AV mode which will pick the best exposure length with the white fabric covering the lens.
Thanks so much.
For workflow... you take this in the field, but how do you know which is which when you get back to your computer??
I am thinking of maybe creating a photoshop image with large text saying "Flat Frame," "Bias Frame," and "Dark Frame." Load those in my "astro" album on the iPhone, then take a photo of the appropriate image just before starting to take that type of frame. That way, when I am back in the office, I will have a marker to tell me which form of black I am looking at, etc.
Does that sound like a reasonable approach?
Good question. I use a program that canon offered for free with my camera pruchase called Digtal Photo Professional. It allows me to dump all of the raw files into a folder on windows after my imaging session and see the raw files. I first oranize the light and flat frames because they are the most obvious and then I put into folders the bias and dark frames based off of the information on each file showing how long or short the exposure was.
If I'm using the same camera settings for a different picture, can I use all of the same dark, flat, and bias frames for that one? If not then why not?
In most cases no. The dark frames are capturing the temperature of your sensor and most nights temps outside and in your camera will vary. Flat frames have to be done every night because of the orientation of the lens and dust particles. Bias frames might be the most likely to be reused but I still take 50 to 75 every night because they are so quick to do.
I have trouble focusing with bathinov mask. Do you need a specific one for each focal length?
No, I don't think so. Are you using it for visual focusing or imaging focusing?
@@LateNightAstronomy imaging. If I set my focal length and put on the mask and than 10x digital zoom I see the star but not the spike’s. Or maybe my star isn’t bright enough?
@@MrGeert1972 My guess is the star isn't bright enough.
@@LateNightAstronomy thx next clear night I try to find a brighter star and give it another try 👍
Hi! This is a GREAT video, thank you so much! Your explanation is very clear. I photographed the comet C/2022 E3 ZTF using this method and it worked really well. I'm satisfied with the results.
I have a question: are dark frames to be taken using the same zoom? In other words: during the same stargazing night, can I take darks only once, and use them for the stacking process of different objects at different zooms? (Taking the temperature as constant)
Thanks so much. Dark Frames will work as long as the ISO, Exposure length and outdoor temperature are the same for the night you are shooting.
Thank you!
Such a Detailed Explaination Thanks a lot. 1 Silly Query for Bias and Dark Frames f (Aperture) should be kept same as Light Frames?
Good question. Yes, keep your F-stop the same throughout the process.
@@LateNightAstronomy Thanks a lot. 👍🏻
about bahtinov mask are there specially mask for each focal lenght? or just a mask for what ever lense?
Just make sure you buy a mask that fits over the end of your camera lens or telescope. Other than matching the diameter you should be good.
Great information and extremely clearly described. Although I’m using a dedicated Astro camera and not a DSLR, it looks like everything still applies. The only thing different will be the flat frames as my iPhone isn’t going to be large enough for illuminating the tee shirt on an 8” telescope!! I can probably build something to do it. Thanks for the great video.
Glad you enjoyed it. I've heard of people using an "iPad" to illuminate larger optics. Hope astro imaging keeps going well for you!
I have been struggling with these calibration frames so I really appreciate the insight. Specifically, I find that my camera will not take the dark frames because it decided there is not enough light to capture an image. There must be some setting I am missing. Same thing when I was trying to capture bias frames. I am also struggling with the ASIair. It writes jpg and fit files. Do I load both into Deep Sky Stacker? Or just the Fit frames? It really is a steep learning curve, but the challenge also makes it exciting. Appreciate your help here.
Are you shooting in Manual Mode for the dark and bias frames?
@@LateNightAstronomy That was probably the problem. Tried again last night and it all worked just fine. Thank you very much.
Will there be a different process if instead of a regular lens but a telescope SCT 8in at f/10? Because I have been trying and failing. Great video now at least I know what to do.
The process should be similar if your mount is equitorial, polar aligned and tracking.
Michael, your video was so helpful. Im a beginner and I have a problem shooting flats. I took a series of light frames. The info says that they were shoot RAW, ISO 8000, f/4, 16.0mm, 15s on a Canon EOS R6. When I try to take flat frames using these settings and a t-shirt the camera wont fire. It worked taking the Bias and Dark files. Help please.
Good question. When you shoot flats you want to change the camera to AV mode. Keep your iso and f-stop the same but your exposure time will now be done automatically by the camera to give a proper flat white shot.
I'm new to this video and you explained it very well. T
Thank you very much.
@@LateNightAstronomy
You are welcome
Very helpful thanks
You're welcome!