Massive car parks everywhere, 10-12 lanes of traffic = not visual clutter. A couple of wires for a trolleybus or a tram line = unacceptable visual clutter. What a hellhole.
All depends what one is used to. All kinds of romantic photos of a steam train going though a lovely green valley. The steam train doesn’t belong there, as it is the least…natural…thing…imaginable. But still, people look at it and say “Ohhh! How nice!”
The visual clutter line about overhead wires is a hoot. Even in less visually cluttered cities, San Francisco, Seattle, and Vancouver are consistently considered scenic and beautiful, yet all three have extensive trolleybus networks (not one but a pair of overhead wires for each route). Yet you just don't hear tourism writers complaining about the wires over the streets.
It's a "prized viewshed"! I joked, but I do get it just a TINY bit for views across the Strip to the Bellagio water show. That's about it, though. Otherwise, just dress the catenary poles up as fake palm trees like you would a cell tower, and you're all good!
Just visited Amsterdam, tram lines everywhere. But I like how they look because they're not smog. But it all blends in and you don't notice it anymore.
Yeah, overhead wires are the sort of thing people imagine to be super obstructive and ugly, but anyone's that ever lived or spend a bunch of time in a city with trams will surely know that you absolutely just do not notice them ... ... thank god cars and their infrastructure nowadays are completely invisible, would hate for them to obstruct my view too. Though, granted, bit frustrating to regularly get mowed down by camo-SUVs when crossing roads, but that's just the price to pay for unobstructed views, I guess.
The argument about visual clutter/pollution is called "concern trolling"; completely no basis to it, but if thats what sunk the proposal, it seems to have worked.
@@timmydeee learned a new phrase. Thank you. I wonder if that would apply to the people who think solar panels and wind turbines are ugly but think we need more drilling platforms and hydraulic fracturing sites
I read online that the idea of elevated transit in the Strip was rejected due to it being an "eyesore". An eyesore, in Las Vegas. It would ruin the view to the pirate ships, the New York and Paris replicas, the fake roman imperial palace. Why not make it sleek, neon and Cyberpunk-esque. There is enough visual saturation as is, might as well make it easier to move around.
Or what they could also do is have the Casinos all pitch in to make it and make them decide what it looks like. The idea that companies shouldn't create transit makes no sense as the best transit is created by every company pitching in.
But that's just it -- it would ruin the view of all the gaudy attractions that draw the crowds that line the pockets of the hotels and casinos and fill the municipal coffers.
And despite the monorail being really bad, I'd still support trying to salvage it by adding extensions to downtown and the airport, taxi and uber drivers be damned!
Yeah, it's already there. The back of the casino location is less than ideal, but if it went to the freaking airport it would still work, and extending it to that would cost a fraction of starting from scratch.
honestly just the airport extension alone would make the whole thing useable, a transit journey and a walk is preferable to waiting for a more direct but slower and more expensive uber
Giving in to the taxi companies by not extending the monorail to the airport or downtown was by far the biggest mistake. Taxis are very expensive in Las Vegas and they cheat you on top of that by taking longer routes than necessary.
The Las Vegas monorail truly is the trifecta of useless for its purpose, wildly expensive and then ALSO manages not to make any money. Totally onboard with your idea for an elevated or underground route through the centre.
The LV Monorail is an amazing system. I've used it a few times. It is fast, frequent, and reliable. The stations are clean and the trains are comfortable. It is a model for what mass transit can and should look like... it is however a system that was built in exactly the wrong location. It is appropriate that it is now owned by the convention center, because about the only useful use of that route is to go from select resorts to and from the convention center. If they had built the monorail on the Strip instead of a quarter of a mile off of it, it would probably be one of the busiest transit systems in the country.
@@paveladamek3502 if you are going between two adjacent hotels, yeah, it is only about .5 miles. What is considered The Strip though is a 3.5 mile stretch in a city that often reaches 120 degrees in the summer. If walking for over an hour in triple degree weather is your idea of fun, you do you, most people though will choose to use an air conditioned monorail or bus.
The reason it's not on the strip is that the casino hotel owners don't want it obstructing the views of the people that stay there. That's not to say they're right or wrong, but that's the reason.
The Luxor monorail is so good it really saves walking time from mandalay to Excalibur. Also it’s amazing when it’s too hot like when it’s 100+ degrees. Also avoiding and crowded smoke smelling casino floors adds to it
When I was in LV in 2019 for a concert, my friend and I stayed at a seedy hotel close to Fremont St. The nice security man there recommended that we get on the bus to get to the Cosmo. It was our saving grace, honestly. But having a light rail or something similar on that route instead would be game-changing.
Yup, the Deuce carries a lot of riders, but it's super-susceptible to bunching (which I wanted to talk about in this video but had to cut), so it's not nearly as reliable as it should be! I feel like you could run a train every five minutes or so, but ridership projections aren't my wheelhouse!
@@CityNerd It sounds to me like a "priority lane" for buses could be a great idea - and I've seen it successfull in Asia and Europe. Obviously the next step is then to replace it with trams...
The only time I took the monorail there was when I was in Vegas for CES. For CES, the monorail was super packed, so it does seem to do pretty well for big conventions.
It was actually pretty busy for NFL Draft too. (The LINQ and Flamingo stops dropped you right into the fan zone , i.e., surface parking lots the rest of the year.) It does do well for certain uses, but it has still badly missed ridership projections -- they expected it to be a lot more attractive for a lot more trip types.
Clearly a sign it's stuck in "tourist train" land and not a real every day people mover... Like it could/should be... Also not a great sign when MSG Sphere opens but not with its monorail station which will be added.... later? 17,000 people on a "train" line with no direct access... That's going to work out swell!
@@stickynorth yeah, I guess that's the distinction. It's not good public transit, but it seems to do well for moving tourists on that side of the strip (at least for big events). So I think it can be both useful, and bad public transit. I think all the suggestions for improvements are 100% valid and I hope to see them, but I do think with better signage more people could end up using the monorail.
@@TheSpiffyNeoStar I honestly think it is serviceable as is, and with signage could become pretty decent. When I found out that it exists, the first thing I did was to try to look up if it went to the airport or downtown. Its main problem is that it doesn't serve those two important destinations. If it did it could be actually pretty useful for tourists. If they added a few more stops between the strip and downtown it could even become somewhat useful for the locals.
I don't get why people still think building a monorail for transit is a good idea. Do they not remember what had happened to Springfield, Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook? And those things are awfully loud
Well the Sao Paulo monorail and the monorails in Chongqing and Tokyo are pretty amazing, as well as Wuppertal to an extent. But apart those they're generally pretty bad.
@@eannamcnamara9338 Monorails have very occasional niche uses, particularly in super high density or hilly terrain where the entire line is elevetated... Maybe not in sprawling flat desert though.
The monorail can be criticized for many things, but being "awfully loud" is not one of them. I tried to get a photo of a train from street level during my last visit to Las Vegas. The trains were so quiet that I couldn't rely on hearing them in time to aim my camera. I had a similar experience in trying to get a photo of the monorail trains passing through the restaurant at the Contemporary Resort in Walt Disney World. The guideway was perhaps ten meters from our table, but the trains were so quiet that I had trouble hearing them in time to aim my camera.
The moral of the story is transit needs great stations to thrive. I would love to see transit engineers measure down to the second how long it takes to walk from the train, through the station and to their destination. They could then draw radiuses around the train stop (eg 30 seconds, 60 seconds, 90 seconds, etc). If they did this, we would we see much better and more walkable stations.
Where you say great, I think I would say convient, since its all about location and access. You don't need big expensive cathedrals, a platform can be enough.
@@neolithictransitrevolution427 I agree. eg There are NYC stations that are completely ugly but quite functional. Often it's just a 30 second walk from the station to the surface. Compare this to the huge Chinese metro stations...they look fantastic, but many require long walk times...sometimes up to 8-10 minutes!
@@AaronSmith-sx4ez That's one of the problems with the 2nd Avenue subway extension in NYC, they built these huge "cathedral" stations (as @Neolithic Transit Revolution put it) which take two long escalators to get to platform level and are completely unnecessary. For this and other reasons, instead of fast cut-and-cover construction (how most of the subway was built in the first place) they had to use much more expensive deep tunnel boring.
I think this is one area where the Boring Co Loop has a significant advantage. Every hotel and casino on the Vegas strip is getting its own Loop station above-ground right at its front door - 51 stations all in the space of about 8 miles. Walking time to each station is pretty much negligible and then you only have to wait 15 seconds at most for an EV compared to 3, 5, 10 or 30 MINUTES for a train or bus.
The Monorail only moved 13,000 people per day (pre-pandemic) which is much less than the Loop moved during the SEMA convention last year (27,000 people per day). And that is despite the monorail having more than double the number of stations over 4x the distance. Why so down on the Loop?
I didn't even know Vegas had a monorail until you mentioned it in a previous video. The ineptitude of building grade separated rapid transit on the strip is kinda fascinating.
Well, it's hardly ineptitude, but rather outright opposition from the powers that be. I mean the casino owners. The last thing they want is for more public involvement in their affairs. There's very good reasons why they set up shop on unincorporated land outside of the city of Las Vegas. And none of them include the desire for more government involvement. These guys just don't believe in public transit so it simply won't exist on their turf for as long as they are in charge.
I am a fan of the monorail and always ride it when I am in Las Vegas, but I concede you are right that the stations are too awkwardly located for it to fill the transit need. I vaguely recall that at one time there was a proposal to build a light rail line along Frank Sinatra Boulevard on the opposite side of the strip from the monorail, which would have resulted in stations that were equally awkward to reach. My understanding is that part of the strip was temporarily closed to auto traffic during the NFL draft, and this proved fairly popular. Perhaps this will ultimately lead to reducing the number of motor vehicle lanes on the strip and running a light rail line along the median. Alternatively, perhaps Mr. Musk will come to his senses and design trains that can run through his tunnels in lieu of cars.
If you happen to be staying in one of the hotels the monorail stops at...it's OK. It's still $5!! They have to stop treating the Strip like it's some sort of sacrosanct, perfectly planned transportation utopia that can't be improved upon. Just put a high quality, grade separated line right down the middle. It's a slam dunk.
Agreed on almost all counts. Except, I don't think that our South African diamond mine boi is capable of what you want him to do. He's broken in sorts of ways that make this kind of thinking impossible for him. He's friends with Peter Thiel after all.
I went to Vegas recently with two young kids, the trek to the monorail (and back to the strip), the cost and a separate cost for the bus service (surprisingly slow) ended up proving that ultimately the similarly cost effective and hassle free approach was to just catch lyft/uber. Such a shame because I honestly would have preferred public transportation for my entire trip but it's just not a good use of time and money especially with kids in tow...
@Lucy Bikes NYC number of bike lane miles per capita, with bonuses given for them being protected lanes or dedicated bike paths would probably be a relatively simple but effective metric
@Lucy Bikes NYC It's so, so difficult to get useful data on bike infrastructure. Usually, a bike lane that runs right nest to 45mph traffic shows up the same as a protected bike lane in the data. I wouldn't know where to start! (Trust me, I'd have been using the data at my job for the last xx years if it existed!)
The Monorail is a white elephant for all the reasons you mention, but it should be noted that you *can* get to it from street level at Sahara and MGM stations- Sahara has a stairway and a pair of escalators (that have been out of service for *years*), and MGM has an elevator to the street. They're not easy to find, but they're there. There are also subsidized $1 fares for locals, which makes it a little more useful for employees. I carry a couple $1 tickets in my wallet just on the off chance I ever need to get between Tropicana or Flamingo and Sahara in a hurry.
What?????? I coulda rode the monorail for a buck????? Curses!! Still figuring out the locals discounts. I did kind of suspect you could access from Sahara or Tropicana -- I should've researched it a bit more before I said otherwise in the video. Thanks for setting me straight!
I can just about remember when I was a kid, thinking that the Las Vegas strip was a pedestrian promenade. This was before I knew almost anything about the US but based on the way people spoke about it that was what came to mind, something like the main street of an amusement park but with bigger buildings. I was definitely pretty shocked I had been wrong all that time and seeing just how many lanes there are. To this day I have a hard time wrapping my head around the strip, it seems like a pretty uncomfortable place even if you come by car.
Interesting... as a Vegas local, here is some context about these monorails and trams that were never meant to be a replacement for mass transit. They were built to take guests from one resort to another owned by the same casino operator. Here is some local history.... Around 1986 Circus Circus opened a new tower across the street from their main hotel casino. A tram was built for the guests convenience by connecting the two. In 1989 Golden Nugget built the Mirage. With the success of this themed resort in 1993 they had the Treasure Island built next door. The tram was built to connect the two and to funnel guests from one casino to their other casino without having them walk in 110 F / 43 C summers. In 1990 Circus Circus built Excalibur and in 1993 with these profits opened the Luxor next door, and the tram was built between them. With the profits from Luxor in 1999 Mandalay Bay was opened along with the tram stop connecting all three. In 1996 Mirage resorts and Circus Circus got together and built Monte Carlo Resort then in 1998 Mirage Resorts opened the Bellagio along with the tram connecting these two. In 2000, MGM Resorts bought out Mirage Resorts. Then, in 2005, MGM/Mirage Resorts bought out Mandalay Resorts. Now known as MGM Resorts International, in 2009 they opened City Center. Located between Bellagio and Monte Carlo, the tram line was rebuilt to include a station that connects all three. The monorail, to begin with, was only built in 1995 to connect MGM and Bally's as a proof of concept. It was as exciting as Seattle's monorail with the bonus of inconvenient station locations. I believe the best location for mass transit in Las Vegas would be underground. The problem is we have a few issues here. We are located on caliche clay which is hard and expensive to dig through as well. (Now if there was only someone who wanted to prototype and test their future Mars tunnel boring equipment and is also in need of a multi billion dollar tax write-off for the next 30 years until it shows a profit.)
Fascinating info -- I don't see any way Clark County does the right thing here, though, and provides good public transit and saves millions on street infrastructure.
Thank you for doing this to show how divided this town is. I have lived here for 11yrs and they (Casinos) all want to do their own thing which as you know has turned out disastrous for this city and probably will not get any better in the future!
Hello Nerd of Towns, how about a video on the layout of rapid transit routes? Linear (Seattle), hub-and-spoke (Boston) and whatever NYC is? Flaws of not having circumferential routes? Food for thought.
I love your Vegas content! I take the bus to work here, and have always been frustrated by the local routes. But your videos allow me to appreciate what we do have while still being critical of the shortcomings
I rode the monorail just after it first opened in 2004. To get to the Paris/Bally's stop, you had to walk through the Paris casino to the indoor shopping street, along the street until you entered the Bally's casino, turn right, walk through the casino until you found some escalators (the first monorail signs are here), took the escalators down one level, walk to the sports book, turn left, walk to the end of the hall, turn right, walk to the unsigned door at the end of the hall next to the swimming pool, and you found the monorail. It took me 20 minutes of walking to get there.
Seems to me that private groups running transit generally seems to have every disadvantage folks point to for public agencies and none of the advantages. Because of high capital costs they tend towards monopolistic/colluding behavior meaning no innovation from competition, but they're also focused on profit seeking (even for non-profits) and can't rely on tax revenue. Which incidentally I've been thinking about transit vs cars and tell me if I'm off base here, but it seems to me likely that transit has low marginal cost per passenger (maybe higher for buses than rail) and most costs are fixed based on infrastructure and how often the transit runs. But then cars also still have high fixed costs for the infrastructure and the vehicle (though most cars will be substantially cheaper than a bus or train car), but also higher marginal costs per trip taken. And yet we charge transit riders per trip as if rationing the number of trips is necessary, but we don't charge cars per trip on most roads outside of toll roads (common in some areas, extremely rare in my area) and gas taxes that between better fuel mileage and EVs are increasingly disconnected from marginal costs per trip. Setting aside the admittedly not inconsiderable question of how cars could be charged for the marginal costs of their trips in our current road environment, this seems exactly backwards to me. We should have most if not all transit funded outside of fees per trip (such as with taxes and ads) since per rider costs make little difference to overall operational costs and do more to ensure per trip car costs are correctly priced.
ads are meh, I would suggest leasing out space as a better funding system. Both large scale, like owning the developments around a station, or small scale, like renting out the ends of a platform to Kiosk owners or cash opperated public washrooms. But transit should definitely be priced to compete with cars, and the fairs should follow that marginal cost; decreasing in mid day and on weekends for example when vehicles run closer to empty.
Topic suggestion: Best comeback. London Overground showed how underused railroad lines could be rebranded, upgraded and turned around and there must be reopened, revitalized or rebuilt in-place transit that has also been resurrected right?
Buses on the strip running in mixed traffic eh? If only someone would shine a light on how such stroads could be or have been changed into high quality BRT.
Please not BRT though. I get that it has its uses in some places at some times. But in the US having gasoline powered busses running on rubber tires with expensive operators at the wheel is ludicrous. If you're building a system from scratch and you're not located in a low-wage state like Alabama, there are zero reasons to prefer a BRT over a tram. Proper BRT that isn't just a painted lane costs about as much as light rail but delivers a fraction of the benefits. (See Van Ness BRT in San Francisco). It's just not a good idea when you have to pay drivers American wages in a high-wage area. And a high-wage city is the only place BRT tends to make sense in the US for a variety of reasons. It's a solution for a set of problems we don't tend to have in the places where we need and can afford to have high-capacity transit.
@@TohaBgood2 I guess my main reply to this would be "Don't build proper BRT". But I think just about every major road should have a bus service with seperated ROW, off board fare payment, level boarding, high frequency, and signal priority, which I think fits the definition of BRT pretty well. I think gas powered buses make a lot of sense for the US, unlike Europe North America is energy sufficient, even without fracking. Getting people out of cars and onto buses has nearly as large an environmental impact regardless of the energy source, particularly if it allows denser development. Of course, not having gas vehicles is preferable, and adding overhead wires and pantographs on buses is certainly possible on BRT routes, and that allows for much smaller batteries to be used when taking the bus off route. As for runner tires I get they aren't as efficient as steel on steel but I think this point is vastly overstate. Again the point is getting people out of cars, after that it's marginal differences. The point about drivers and the higher lifetime cost is certainly valid. Lifetime BRT costs can absolutely be higher then LRT, particularly as Capacity on a certain route starts to increase and 40 drivers are needed to move as many people an hour as 6 (or even none) might with LRT. I think BRT routes should be converted to LRT overtime for sure as ridership increases. But I would say that is the role BRT plays (or ought to), it can quickly be implement by providing partial ROW to existing buses, and slowly evolve by having more vehicles, then large vehicles, then electrifying, and eventually being replaced by LRT, and at the same time those buses can be moved to a new route to repeat the cycle over 20-30 years. North America needs tranist now and I don't think being a purist about the absolutely most effecient choice is helpful when municipalities are far more familiar with the operation and installation of a more easily available and better fit for existing infrastructure choice.
Sydney Australia constructed a monorail in 1988 to link the CBD with a new harbourside development at Darling Harbour. It was an unloved piece of infrastructure, mainly used by tourists. The elevated track was unsightly passing through the narrow streets of the city (one commentator said "It's like fitting spoilers on a Model T Ford") and the vehicles weren't particularly quick or comfortable. The monorail closed in 2013 and was dismantled. All that remains is a couple of the stations no-one knows what to do with. The monorail was a complete failure as a means of moving large numbers of passengers. Darling Harbour was always within easy walking distance of the CBD and is also now served by a light rail.
Didn't help that it was a one way loop, expensive, not integrated with other transit and as said more for the tourist. In fact a lot of similar features to the LV monorail. Hopefully the new owners of the LV Monorail can make it more useful.
Great Video! My family went to Vegas during spring break. When we spent a day on the strip, we just walked. Monorail was far away and the wait for the bus was too long. It's crazy that they don't have a train that runs on the strip.
@@j.f.e.productions4098 my friends and I visited last month with the same experience. Easier to take an Uber between resorts on the Strip than public transit
Yes, grade separated rail line from the airport to downtown. Probably the most logical rail alignment in the US. Make it automated and designed for 24/7 service to meet the full potential.
@@jfwfreo You just wait for Uber and Lyft to have their way with them and then build the rail line. But I think that extending the monorail to the airport and to downtown would be a better use of everyone's time at this point. The Strip literally exists where it is in order to give the casinos control over their affairs. If they were amenable to public involvement, they would have built within the city limits of Las Vegas rather than starting from scratch outside of the city. The monorail has a tiny chance of being sufficiently insignificant that it slides under their radar. As long as you can defeat the taxi companies, you can in fact extend the monorail and make it somewhat serviceable in the medium term.
10/10 good stuff. I wanted to hear a little more about the walkability of the strip, but the focus on transit was great! Thanks!! You're a great urban planning channel, please keep it up!
I kindof liked the monorail. It came in real handy getting to the hotels on the strip from the Westgate and back several times a day with the unlimited pass, and the views of the Venetian were pretty nice.
Spot on with most of your points on the monorail. I haven't been there is a few years, but I vaguely remember hearing that the stations were paid for by the casinos that wanted them, so that is why they are where they are. Add that to the fact that since it came after the resorts, being behind them actually meant being behind large buildings, and pool areas, and thus not that pedestrian friendly. Given that start and the multiple bankruptcies, I can see an extension being more transit oriented. I think the biggest things they could do would be to figure out some way to transfer with the busy bus lines.
Another super interesting video. I've been to Vegas, and I just took a taxi everywhere. It never crossed my mind to even try to find public transportation there because it wasn't obvious. I would love a video where you talked about the process, or just your experience in the process of getting new public transportation approved. Maybe even bike lanes? Also, a primer on effective ways that someone interested in transit could help push their local officials to support better transit policies.
I was there the same weekend! Coming from NYC, I found walking the strip very frustrating with all the pedestrian bridges and casino mazes. On day two I ended up using the tram from Mandalay Bay and also jumped on The Deuce for a quick run to Walgreens and found it to be really nice.
I did not hear you mention that "locals" (with a Nevada drivers license or other state issued ID) can buy single ride tickets for a dollar. The limit is two rides per day, or twenty rides in a ten day period. I used the monorail twice during a visit to Sin City (April 2022) as I was attending a convention. I used the MGM Grand stop to the LVCC. Though pricey at $5 for a one way ride, my use of the monorail did not merit buying all-day or multi-day tickets. Still much cheaper than a cab or Uber. With regards to the RTC bus line, you can buy a $5 all day pass which allows you to use the "neighborhood" bus lines, but a premium pass to use the Deuce ($8, allows use of all bus lines in the RTC system). The #108 bus serves the Convention Center, the Airport and the Bonneville bus center downtown. My biggest gripe is that the kiosk ticket machines do not sell single ride tickets. The ticket machine at the Convention Center was broken when I wanted to buy a ticket in late April. The driver was good enough to let me ride to Bonneville where I bought the $5 pass.
It's wild to see this video now. Just a week ago I submitted my capstone research paper for college on the Walkability of Las Vegas, and I talked about a lot of similar points. Unfortunate how I had most of it finished before hearing about the public opinion post-NFL draft as I would have loved to include it, although a lot of similar points were made. I know there is a RTC project currently to redesign Boulder Highway in Las Vegas and it actually seems like a step in the right direction with a lot of applicable information for redesigning the Strip. It even mentions light rail as well, although I feel it is more likely we will see dedicated bus lanes instead (Still a win!). Additionally, when looking at bus ridership in Las Vegas it is important to consider how many people are locals and how many are visiting. A 2017 Visitor profile study found between 10-15% of people using the buses are visitors. I could gush about so many other little details, but I lack any qualification to provide new insight besides doing a few months of research on data and being a local. Anyway, great video and keep up the great content.
Thanks! Check out my video on the Strip's pedestrian bridges (from a coupe months ago) if you haven't already. I've skimmed the Boulder Highway Plan -- interesting stuff! Best of luck on all your studies.
@@CityNerd Thank you! I might have actually found the plan through your channel in all honesty. This past week has felt like a blur. Finals week, and possibly my final finals week before graduation (if all goes well).
I love the dry sarcasm and the incisive analytical questioning. Music to my ears. Sydney did the same with its Monorail downtown and there is mixed results as to its effectiveness. Albeit you can walk the same distance or should. It is an eyesore as it travels down major streets, such as Market street.
Throwing in a request to talk about how urban fabric impacts ability to provide high quality transit. Just wondering if it’s possible to turn sprawl into decent transit. Or vice versa if having good fabric is enough.
I have visited both LV (Strip) and Macao in the past 10 years, there's no comparison from an urbanism standpoint. Cotai being a pale humid imitation of the LV Strip notwithstanding, there actually was a bus shuttle service between the Ferry terminal, the major casinos, and the old city on the Macao Peninsula. This was before the viaduct-based Light Rail opened. And obviously the Peninsula is a dense environment, in fact the most densely populated top-level dependency (say, Cayman Islands, and not Ontario) in the world!
Fantastic video, can't believe I haven't seen it until now While the current version of the Las Vegas Monorail gives much to be desired and an elevated rail over Las Vegas blvd is by far the greatest solution to transit needs, it is being shown that Major influences to deciding forces (Clark County Commissioners) to not be something that is desired And thus the most elegant solution is to just purely extend the monorail to the Airport, to the historic downtown, and to currently under served casinos on the Las Vegas Strip While it is not the most efficient solution, it could be a more beneficial compromise vs what the Loop would offer and what is currently in effect
11:32 Yes and the plural of leaf is leaves, but it’s the Toronto Maple Leafs. 🍁(Fine by me I’m from Montreal…) Thanks for an excellent illustration of absurd, unfortunate private planning. In Las Vegas, the Ferengi are in charge. 🖖🏼 (Ferengi is another word that doesn’t take an S for its plural.)
After I think my 2nd trip to LV we always got a rental car to get around to the off strip places out to Red Rock and Sam's Town on the other side, down to South Point and the M and to downtown. We just go around everywhere.
When I came to Vegas for the first time I was shocked to see the monorail and also shocked to hear it was useless. I wanted to ride it but never got the chance. A raised tram would be extremely useful in Vegas because the traffic is terrible, especially during major events with road closures like the NFL Draft which was going on when I went. Getting from the airport to the Flamingo took forever. (I think we were in town the same time as you lol)
We visited Las Vegas in 2004. The new monorail had to be shut down before we arrived. A wheel had fallen off and rolled down the street. Luckily, no one was hurt.
The Mandalay Bay tram (I've attended several conventions at MB) is super convenient but obviously limited in scope. The Tesla tunnels seem absurd in concept. Expensive and low volume. But on occasions I have mentioned this, I immediately get ambushed by people saying it is the most brilliant, efficient, and cost effective solutions imaginable and I am just being dense (Paid trolls? I don't know) I suppose it is Las Vegas, so normal rules sometimes don't apply.
@@odinhonour2170 Musk fanboys are the right's answer to Kpop stans. They're just one small stroke away from spamming fan-cams of Elon everywhere on Twitter
They are 12 yo Elon fanboys. No real life experience, live in mothers basement and simply have no analytical skills to see the frauds that man has pulled because they are overwhelmed with his ‘personality’
Since we frequently visit Vegas with friends, we find the monorail very useful in a certain sense. Usually we have comped rooms at MGM Grand but friends/ family who use Caesar's can be at flamingo, or Harrah's, you get it. It's almost like staying at the same resort with the connection. We use the deuce for actually getting around strip and/or to downtown
I'm in Vegas a lot for conferences (at least pre-COVID) 7-8x a year. Mostly at Mandalay, LVCC, Sands CC, and MGM. Staying at a "Conference Hotel" can be expensive and/or might not be at a property I want to stay at or have "Loyalty Status" with. The biggest conferences usually have dedicated private bus shuttles which are fine but not always ideal or fast. The best thing sometimes for me to get around without messing with the busses/bus schedule or paying for taxi/Uber, is the Monorail. Buy a multi-day pass and you are good for on/off as much as you need, when you need. $5 is high for "public transit" but it's way cheaper than an Uber ride from the LVCC to the MGM at rush hour.
I think an interesting topic for a future video could be the jitney buses that are common in northeastern NJ/outer boroughs of NYC. They're essentially barebones, privately owned buses that are typically extremely frequent and I haven't seen them prominently in any other city in the US.
I'm sure it's no accident. The share of trips going by taxi/ridehail is absolutely shocking, especially considering how close a lot of the likely destinations are to the airport.
@@CityNerd That was my impression too, except most airport to public transit connections I'm used to just have some extra fee instead of making it hard to find. But like you said in the video, making things difficult to navigate is typical for Vegas.
las Vegas should build a themed system, themed naturally. A branch to resemble the French Metro of the Beau Epoch era, another to resemble a canal with palm tree supports and trains dressed to resemble a solar barque.
Hello CityNerd love your videos and appreciate the work you put into them. How about making a video about the best and worst value urban transit infrastructure projects.
Doing a trip to the UK soon; visiting a bunch of non-London big cities (Portsmouth, Brighton, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester, Bristol, etc). Given your love of Premier League stadia, a video about those transit systems would be cool.
8:16 Switzerland does! Well almost. Most transit tickets are $4 or more. Even slow, stuck in traffic buses and infrequent charge that much. It's even worse if you need to go through more than 2 fare zones
I've ridden the LV monorail twice, once from the MGM Grand to the Venetian and we walked back. And then to get from Top Golf back to our hotel we rode a few stops. Like you, it was tough to find it and a pain to walk through the casinos.
Las Vegas has quite a few uninspired pedestrian bridges. I am on a trip to Los Angeles and just explored the Taylor Yard Pedestrian Bridge spanning the LA River and connecting 2 LA communities. It would be great to see a list of great pedestrian bridges in North America.
Obviously some sort of grade-separated train along Las Vegas Boulevard is the actual answer--and doesn't even seem that technically difficult given how absurdly wide the road is. But I'm kind of in love with really leaning into the inherently gimmicky nature of The Strip and running a gondola above LVB. Can you even imagine how popular that would be for the views alone?
I really think it's a slam dunk. You could keep the profile of the structure light, but the trains themselves could be garish LED-fests. It would be incredible, and certainly no one could say transit is invisible (the way the monorail is!).
You could actually just run a long Disney Skyliner type system with intermediate stops up and down the strip. It would be a relatively low cost, and relatively high volume solution.
They recently did a feasibility study on having a cable car/gondola lift run along a major road in, uh, Munich. The conclusion was that it wouldn't work because the capacities would be too low and the cost way too high, along with having a very difficult time to get the stations in place above the road - and somehow making them accessible from the ground. They did mention the tourist potential specifically though. I suspect it'd be similar issues in Las Vegas. Unless you mean gondolas in the sense of digging a canal along the road and inviting some Venetian gondoliers .... I mean, that'd be an even more Las Vegas solution. Especially given the whole city-in-the-desert thing.
@@Sp4mMe I meant overhead gondolas. I'd have to look at capacity, but if you look at any ski resort with gondolas, the gondola capacity is about 2000 people an hour, with essentially zero headway and zero dwell time.
@@andrewdiamond2697 Maybe. But how many of those systems are build to for anything but point-to-point transportation? This would be very much a more complex use, with multiple stations in between (and it's those stations that are the expensive bit). Munich thought building their system would cost 400 million € for 11km and 9 stations. Meanwhile setting up an express bus system for the same line has an expected cost of 20 million € and the expected passenger capacity is just slightly lower (23000 vs 20000). So, yeah. It's just too much. Obv Las Vegas wouldn't be precisely the same but I can't imagine it'd make any more sense there than a tram or comparable. Cable cars are great for difficult terrain - otherwise, naw.
I have been to Vegas lots of times and the traffic is horrible at night and on special events. They should stop being stupid and build a heavy rail subway system that makes real easy for people to come and go. You got everything you need. Cheers
Great video! LOTS of thoughts: 1) The LVM was entirely financed by seven casino megaresorts that it serves. No significant public money was involved. 2) Given the power of the megaresorts, it is not merely surprising but absolutely shocking that they allowed the private transportation companies (taxi, shuttle, and car rental) to block the airport connection that would probably have prevented the bankruptcies. 3) The LVM grand opening in July 2004 was the most extravagant event I have ever attended in my life. World-class chefs and buffet service at EVERY station, weird bands doing weird things while playing weird music, a simulated helicopter assault using actual helicopters (I am NOT kidding), enough fireworks to light up the entire Atlantic coast, and ALL the pretty people between the Mississippi and Pacific gathered to gape in awe at the sheer spectacle of it all. To this day, I'm not quite sure what any of that had to do with the world's first privately owned, fully automated, screened-platform fixed guideway elevated transit line and I'm sure that it didn't help the LVM's bottom line but nobody - and I mean NOBODY - puts on a show like Vegas, baby! I took hundreds of photos, six or seven of which are actually quite good. 4) Nobody in their right mind buys a one-trip ticket for $5. You buy a 24-hour pass for $13 and use the hell out of it. That's what I did way back in the days when dinosaurs roamed the land while staying at the LVH. After checking in on the night I arrived, I took the monorail to the MGM to see a show, then elsewhere to grab a late dinner, then back to the LVH to sleep. The next morning, I took it to hit a breakfast buffet, then to another resort to game for a while, then back to the LVH to load up my car and check out. In that scenario, it was totally worth the $13. Smooth, quiet, fast, and frequent. 5) You missed the old Circus-Circus tram that used to connect the front of the resort to the back of the resort. Completely useless, but kind of cute - like most Hollywood stars. 6) How to fix Las Vegas public transit: 6A) NO more Teslas in sewer pipes. This is the dumbest thing in the history of transportation and clearly exists only as a gimmick to sell cars. Convert the existing pipes into pedestrian tunnels. You'll make better time walking! 6B) Do NOT abandon the monorail. Make it part of the bigger picture. Extend it east along Tropicana, then south to the center of the terminal complex at McCarran, as should have been done during initial construction. Also extend it north to the Strat, along Main for a few blocks, and then west along Wyoming to the railroad tracks (more about that, below). 6C) Convert Las Vegas Boulevard (LVB) into a pedestrian-friendly transit mall with LRT from the WTFLV sign at the south, through downtown, to the circle thing north of Owens Ave. Future LRT extensions could branch out of the circle thing. 6D) West of LVB is a multi-track rail line that runs more or less north/south (and ultimately connects to Los Angeles and Salt Lake City). There is room to overlay regional LRT passenger service using offline platforms so as to not interfere with freight movements or future restoration of intercity passenger service. LRT service could eventually be extended to Henderson along existing rail ROW. 6E) The two LRT lines suggested above could either be formed into a continuous loop OR transfer stations could be built near Sunset and Owens. I favor the loop. 6F) The monorail should add a transfer station where it crosses the LVB transit mall and where Wyoming crosses the railroad mainline. It should eventually be extended from the McCarran terminal complex south to another transfer station at the future Henderson branch. 6G) Re-route all the crosstown buses through several rail stations and rationalize the entire bus system. Conclusion: There you have it! We've just enhanced the utility of existing assets without tearing down anything (except, perhaps, some of the pedestrian bridges above LVB) while taming the nightmare that is The Strip. We've also enabled the conversion of some of LV's urban wastelands into valuable TODs, connected the airport to several other modes, and given residents and visitors viable transportation options. Voila. You're welcome.
Amazing comment as usual. 1. Yeah I think I mentioned it was all privately owned -- I probably should've emphasized it more, because it's truly amazing. 2. I don't fully understand the symbiotic relationship between hotels and taxis, but it isn't specific to Vegas. Weird stuff. 3. I love this. 4. I dunno, I love to walk, so there are very few times I'm going to feel motivated to walk to the back of a particular casino on the east side of the Strip. Using the hell out of a monorail pass is gonna get in the way of my step count! 5. I've stayed at the Circus Circus in Reno and that one has a monorail that...still is in operation? I will not speak that resort's name in my videos, but it was one of the 20 biggest hotels I flagged in that one graphic. 6. My instinct to just let the Monorail be a white elephant. I could be wrong. Gotta get a transit line down the the Brightline West Station, though, by the time that opens -- around Warm Springs? You could branch the Strip rail line so some trips go to the airport maybe. Not sure.
I'm curious why you think the Loop is a bad idea Colorme? With the Loop moving 27,000 people per day thru 3 stations over 0.8 miles during SEMA in November, that is double the ridership of the Las Vegas Monorial which handled 13,510 people per day over 4 miles and 7 stations. And the monorail figures were pre-pandemic, so they're even lower now. In comparison, the Vegas Bus service has a daily ridership of 178,390 but that is across 51 routes and 3,900+ stops and a fleet of 708 buses. So compare that to the Boring Co’s Loop which only has 1 route, 3 stops and 70 cars and yet has demonstrated it can carry at least 27,000 passengers per day. So that very large bus network only carries 6.6x the number of passengers of the small 3-station Loop despite having 51x the number of routes, 1,300x the number of stops and 10x the number of vehicles each of which has 10x the seating capacity as each Loop EV.
I find it really interesting because like you said, there really is this demand for a better way of getting around the strip. Even with the absolutely god-awful options currently available they still get a fair amount of use. It's kind of strange that the casinos/companies don't seem to fully recognize it. They understand it enough that they have all these small trams and poor solutions, without ever evolving that idea further to its natural conclusion. 2 major companies own the majority of the strip, they have their own services of all types, yet they just can't come together on perfecting the traffic and transportation of their area despite how popular it would be.
As a Las Vegas, NV metro area resident, I just want to point out that if you live in Nevada and show proof of this such as a Nevada driver's license, the ride costs $1.00 but with a limit of two rides per day or 20 rides in 10 days if purchasing the 20 ride ticket. However, the monorail is much more geared to people attending conventions and tourists visiting the strip as locals tend to avoid the Strip. I ride it at times but much more for fun than as a transit option. But the climate-controlled and air-conditioned monorail is especially helpful in the summer when temperatures are frequently well above 100 degrees outside.
The Las Vegas Monorail was never more than a gimmick. One more thing to try to make Vegas an “Adult Disney World.” “Yeah, we’ve got a monorail, too!” The one good thing about it is that a stop for the former Las Vegas Hilton. It really does need to get extended to the airport and to downtown. That might make it worth trying to find the terminals in casinos it services. It won’t happen simply because cruising the Strip is a thing, but what would work best is a public rail running down the middle; again reaching from airport to downtown. Close the strip off to all automobile and truck traffic (There are already sufficient roads behind the casinos on both sides to service the area that way) and make it pedestrian-only or small electric vehicles, preferably in fixed routes. Add some more pedestrian bridges across the northern side of the Strip for getting across more easily. Then allow regular road traffic back on at Sahara or a bit further north.
I used to have to go to Las Vegas for trade shows quite often. I tried to ride the monorail once from the hotel and after 20 minutes trying to find it, I gave up. I could've just walked instead. As for those taxi tunnels, I can only imagine that they will be built the same way the monorail is with access to the tunnels buried in the casinos and access to only select casinos with no direct street access. It's interesting that the Deuce Bus has a southern terminal at the McCarren Car Rental Facility (lots of bus riders there I'm sure) just 1/2 mile from the ramp into the tunnel under the airport to the terminals. The airport has only one 15 min frequent bus line; the 109, and it doesn't go to the Strip. It goes downtown and it does go south through that tunnel to connect to The Deuce. Why not offer a one-seat ride from the airport on The Deuce since it's almost at the airport? That right there shows you that the regional transportation authority isn't really about efficient transit for the residents and visitors of Las Vegas when it comes to The Strip. The Strip has one bus line. None of the transverse lines travels along the strip. All of the employees taking the bus have to transfer to The Deuce (unless they work at those select corners). A one-seat rides in Vegas? Not if they can help it.
Yeah, RTC has limited planning authority when elected officials can just decide they want a Tesla tunnel instead, or allow the taxi/ridehail interests to dissuade them from offering monorail or high quality bus from the airport to the Strip. I'm no expert on Vegas politics, but it all smells just a bit.
Actually most of the 51 hotels and casinos are building above-ground Loop stations right at their front door like the two above-ground convention centre Loop stations with only a few apparently putting their Loop stations in their underground parking garages. There will also be Loop stations at the University and several Loop stations at Allegiant Stadium and eventually the airport. As such, with Loop stations at virtually every hotel, casino and attraction in Vegas, this 29 mile Vegas Loop looks like it will be very targeted at moving significant volumes of the general public.
@@CityNerd I think Las Vegas has just done some simple calculations and found that a 10,000 people per hour tram/light rail would cost $3 billion, a 50,000 people per hour subway would cost $8 billion versus the 29 mile 51 station 57,000 people per hour Vegas Loop costing them zero dollars. The only politics at play here would be that around making sure that billions of dollars of public money isn't spent uneccessarily.
@@Codraroll why do you think that Erlend? The current 3-station, convention center Loop is already easily handling 27,000 people per 8-hour day during large conventions so I’m not sure why you would think that 57,000 people per hour over 51 stations and 29 miles of tunnels would be unachievable?
Hey, idea, can you talk about the coolest Comprehensive Plans. Maybe an episode for smaller cities vs. an episode for large cities as their cool documents that get passed every 10+ years with lofty ideas, about urban planning and general neighborhood design!
Could you do a video on the Midwest/Rust Belt. I hear that some of our transit is overbuilt and older because people left for the sunbelt post war. I also heard people are coming back because of climate change (lake mead drying up as an example). Any thoughts or say a list of best cities for that growth or most rebounded. I am from Cleveland personally so do see some of this personally (Tremont going from a place to avoid to having some of the highest home costs and a bill that hurt development failing).
Las Vegas has much better public transit than a lot of cities its size, believe it or not! They should be doubling down on it, not giving permits to this other crap
Hi Eyebot, have you tried the Loop as a local? I'd be interested to know what you don't like about it? And by the way that single short clip from CES that bloggers repeat over and over ad nauseam showed only a brief slow down for less than 40 seconds in the Loop tunnel due to a temporary closure of the South building’s doors. The EVs didn’t even stop, they just briefly slowed. This ignores the fact that the rest of the time the Teslas are smoothly entering and exiting each station every 3 seconds compared to switching to a mulit-billion dollar subway where you have to wait for far longer - 3, 5, 10 or 60 minutes for the next train and have to stop and wait at every station on a line instead.
Just found your channel. Love it, live in Vegas and take the bus... It's not great but way better than Denver because it's 24 hours and I live near UNLV off Flamingo so more buses come every 20 mins. I can't believe RTC hasn't brought back the SDX but maybe it's lack of drivers.
SDX just suffered with being unable to enforce fare usage. Among the locals it was quick to be called "the free bus" and with Las Vegas not having any actual Transit Police further enforcement of fare would be nonviable as opposed to increasing resources to the Deuce
Ah, thanks for spotting it! The On Board plan specifies "mixed traffic" in its language...these things tend to be a hybrid, though, like dedicated lanes but with crossing/conflicting traffic, so not grade separated. I would love to go to Lyon at some point. Like, just to eat food.
@@CityNerd Indeed, Lyon trams aren't grade separated (except in a few key places). But to my knowledge they are never in mixed traffic and have signal priotity, so they tend to be really efficient. And yes, the food is excellent there!
A few years back I stayed at the MGM Grand for AWS re:Invent. Most of the talks were at the Sands Expo Center (at the Venetian/Palazzo). I bought a monorail pass and went through the exact same experience of walking the MGM until I had passed the station entrance. And that's not even the worst station! There was one station - Harrah's maybe - that was accessed directly from a road with no sidewalks, in the back alley used for driving to the parking garages. Terrible! And yet it was still better than even the dedicated buses just for the conference since they all got stuck in that awful traffic.
I hear ya. I don't know if I've used the Harrah's/LINQ station ever. LINQ built out a cool promenade that goes back to the ferris wheel -- I honestly don't know if the promenade accesses the monorail, though.
@@CityNerd The promenade was nice. That was one of the few areas that felt like a normal, comfortable place and not some wacky adult theme park. It's possible that the main entrance to the monorail was from that promenade and there was a secondary entrance that I was using to get to the Venetian. I just remember it feeling like I was breaking some kind of law to walking in that area. You know, without sidewalks or slot machines around. I also want to thank you for all your videos. I've watched every one of them at least once. I really appreciate your insights, your professional experience, and your dry humor. And it means so much to me that you actually bothered to read and respond to my comment. Keep up the great work! I'll be pledging my support on Patreon as well.
I’d nominate The Trolley in the Delmar Loop in St. Louis as a similar example of what not to in transit. It was pushed by the guy who developed the Loop and doesn’t connect to any nearby local transit so it failed miserably. It’s also rails on car lanes on a car heavy street, so it didn’t go well.
In my last visit (Nov 2022), I used the bus, tram (conveniently was staying at Luxor), and monorail. The bus system, especially outside the strip, wasn't great. At one stop the bus didn't show up at all for a scheduled stop I made sure I was early for.
I have to admit that there's a part of me which really wants to see the Tesla Tunnels built out so that they can be a case study for how not to build urban transit. I'm also well aware that this is a really bad idea though because the Elon Fanboy Apologists will just move the goalposts and claim it's the best thing ever despite it being a dystopian nightmare. I mean, it's Vegas, so it's already a dystopian nightmare, but it would suck if other cities catch Elon fever and try replicating it (I'm looking at you Ft. Lauderdale).
Asking the question I always ask: How does one successfully build a below ground tunnel in Florida? Reminder, Disney World's Magic Kingdom is technically on the second floor.
@@HarryLovesRuth Central Subway in SF is having this very problem at the Moscone Center station and it looks like it's going to be delayed _again_. I'm hoping it will open in my lifetime. Construction started uh.. 9 years ago?
I think you might be pleasantly surprised Patrick. As I posted in a comment further up, the current LVCC Loop is actually carrying far more passengers per vehicle/route/stop than the entire Las Vegas bus service The Vegas Bus service has a daily ridership of 178,390 across 51 routes and 3,900+ stops and a fleet of 708 buses. Now, compare this to the Boring Co’s Loop which only has 1 route, 3 stops and 70 cars and yet carried 27,000 passengers per day during SEMA in November. So that very large bus network only carries 6.6x the number of passengers of the small 3-station Loop despite having 51x the number of routes, 1,300x the number of stops and 10x the number of vehicles each of which has 10x the seating capacity as each Loop EV. Perhaps the Loop isn’t that bad a solution after all? Particularly since the now under-construction 51 station, 29 mile Vegas Loop will have stations at the front doors of pretty much every hotel and casino on the Las Vegas Strip solving the complaint of visibility far more effectively than a train service that could never hope to have that extremely high number and frequency of stations in such a short distance.
Whether or not you like the Loop, moving cars underground is really a win for everyone. And while I'm very pro transit and think we should be hugely pushing people onto it, even countries like Singapore amd the Netherlands have cars. So I'm very pro the loop just to push forward low cost car tunneling.
Fast forward 2 years the monorail just posted it's first ever profit. The Monorail at MGM is VERY easy to find, you literally took a wrong turn. Enter front doors where cabs pick up, take a right and head down the escalator at the Underground
At 12:00. I LOVE the reset that the COVID pandemic has caused in NYC. I'm loving the fact that outdoor dining has now become more ingrained and far more common in far more neighborhoods within NYC. All these restaurants taking up road space also displaces car parking spots that were once there, which means that this new norm forcefully pushes down the number of people who will want to own and drive cars in the city. So it's a win-win for everyone except the awful people who still want to drive cars within this crowded metropolis.
Your thoughts are right on. It should go right down the strip. I love the Monorail but it's so well hidden as all of Vegas Transit. Horrible system and system map, bus included.
I used the monorail on the strip for DEFCON in 2015, it worked great for me, especially in combination with a lot of underage drinking. The fare wasn't memorably high when I paid for the whole trip worth of day passes on arrival, and got me between Bally's (where DEFCON was held) and my hotel, which was the last stop. It was very empty though so idunno. I was living in Toronto at the time, and it felt a lot more useful than the TTC lol. The wayfinding isn't a huge deal because the monorail stops are at the back of every building, and visible any time you go outside. A separate tram on the centerline of the strip, maybe even primarily made of monotrack, would probably work pretty well.
European trams usually don't run in mixed traffic though. I really hope that if they shut down the strip or if they cut down on lanes they should create high capacity BRT or preferably a tram.
You should rename this video "Vegas: Transit Fiasco". lol. Seriously Vegas just seems like the U.S's place to try out all the weird Gadgetbahn options possible and not care about the outcome. That would be a worthy plan if other cities actually learned from Vegas's mistakes and NEVER COPIED THEM EVER.
Yeah, it's like there's this effort to provide exaggeratedly different travel options for tourists (valuable people) and locals/labor (disposable people).
Oh, and as an added benefit to centralizing employee parking= Every casino that has a dedicated lot (Which is all of them) would find themselves with a whole lot of extra land to do something with- it's probably the concepts biggest selling point. "Oh, now I have 5 more acre's? what can I do with that?" Just look what Ballys did with all that dead space in front of them- a cool pedestrian promenade that draws businesses to lease the space, draws tourists to visit it, and makes your property stand out and be more memorable to visitors.
The strip should have bus lanes. Also I don’t understand why the public transportation isn’t better. Been multiple times and the trams look out of place everytime
A simple solution would be to restore the SDX service and extend it to serve the airport. Even without dedicated bus lane, (bus lanes would be much better but might be hard to get approved), that would make a fair alternative to Uber or Taxi.
Turns out I've been to Vegas 3 times since '95 and I had no idea that monorail even existed, hidden on the back side of those hotels. The solution is so simple since the strip is so massively wide. Separate 2 narrow lanes with curbs and paint, just wide enough for a bus down the center of the strip ideally. Add stations at cross streets and people can use the existing crosswalks to gain access and board the bus/tram during red lights. Give the bus lane an advance green with just enough seconds to clear the intersection for left turning drivers. No tunnels, no elevated tracks, no stairwells, escalators and elevators.
Maybe the monorail would have higher ridership if it wasn't so damn hard to find where the stations even are. I just got back from Vegas and wanted to take the monorail to go to the Stratosphere, managed to find the station behind the Paris only to find that it was walled off on multiple sides from street level. I ended up just using the deuce for the length of the trip.
Technically not true. There is Street access for Paris/Bally.......but it's on Audrie Street and is not clearly marked. I only found out when I saw people using the doors and spotted the ticket office inside.
Yes i absolutely HATE that monorail. And I did exactly you did trying to find the mgm monorail station. It’s stupid that it didn’t go down the center of Las Vegas blvd. Not only it’s hard to find you do a ton of walking just to get to a station
Hey, we were in Vegas at the same time! Lol. Was there because of a family emergency. The last couple of nights we stayed in Harrah's. We left Friday, so the first day of the draft. Ok, so I used to drive for RTC. They have two bus yards and two different contractors running the buses. (There's three if you count the paratransit service) I drove for MV Transportation so I didn't get to drive the Strip buses. RTC claims it doesn't have the money to run light rail or even street cars. I honestly think it's a combination of the taxi companies and the casinos not wanting it. I'm with you on the visual clutter of the OCS. It wouldn't block a damn thing. Plus I think having a light rail or Streetcar system, more people would ride it. They could've replaced the old SDX line with a Streetcar. But the line would turn East at Tropicana to Paradise and then South again to the airport. There's open property near the airport a people mover could be built to meet the light rail or Streetcar line. The empty lot on Trop just east of the MGM would be the lot for the rail vehicles. The monorail in Vegas is a big joke, as you proved. One thing you left out, it closes at midnight. The one thing you did miss, because it was Draft Weekend, it runs empty when nothing is going on. I rode it during the week when I lived there. I freaking ghost town. I took the same trip you took. I was by myself except for one family that rode between intermediate stops. That's why it went bankrupt two times.
Massive car parks everywhere, 10-12 lanes of traffic = not visual clutter. A couple of wires for a trolleybus or a tram line = unacceptable visual clutter. What a hellhole.
People got used to the cars, it's considered a completely normal part of the scenery.
I reckon the 'visual clutter' is just a cheap disingenuous argument to rile people against the idea.
@@JeffBilkins it is. Literally every American city has power and telephone wires hanging above it's streets
All depends what one is used to. All kinds of romantic photos of a steam train going though a lovely green valley. The steam train doesn’t belong there, as it is the least…natural…thing…imaginable. But still, people look at it and say “Ohhh! How nice!”
america! fcuk yeah... i disappointed...
The visual clutter line about overhead wires is a hoot. Even in less visually cluttered cities, San Francisco, Seattle, and Vancouver are consistently considered scenic and beautiful, yet all three have extensive trolleybus networks (not one but a pair of overhead wires for each route). Yet you just don't hear tourism writers complaining about the wires over the streets.
It's a "prized viewshed"! I joked, but I do get it just a TINY bit for views across the Strip to the Bellagio water show. That's about it, though. Otherwise, just dress the catenary poles up as fake palm trees like you would a cell tower, and you're all good!
Just visited Amsterdam, tram lines everywhere. But I like how they look because they're not smog. But it all blends in and you don't notice it anymore.
Yeah, overhead wires are the sort of thing people imagine to be super obstructive and ugly, but anyone's that ever lived or spend a bunch of time in a city with trams will surely know that you absolutely just do not notice them ...
... thank god cars and their infrastructure nowadays are completely invisible, would hate for them to obstruct my view too. Though, granted, bit frustrating to regularly get mowed down by camo-SUVs when crossing roads, but that's just the price to pay for unobstructed views, I guess.
The argument about visual clutter/pollution is called "concern trolling"; completely no basis to it, but if thats what sunk the proposal, it seems to have worked.
@@timmydeee learned a new phrase. Thank you. I wonder if that would apply to the people who think solar panels and wind turbines are ugly but think we need more drilling platforms and hydraulic fracturing sites
I read online that the idea of elevated transit in the Strip was rejected due to it being an "eyesore". An eyesore, in Las Vegas. It would ruin the view to the pirate ships, the New York and Paris replicas, the fake roman imperial palace.
Why not make it sleek, neon and Cyberpunk-esque. There is enough visual saturation as is, might as well make it easier to move around.
Disney already did the rob thing lol
Or what they could also do is have the Casinos all pitch in to make it and make them decide what it looks like. The idea that companies shouldn't create transit makes no sense as the best transit is created by every company pitching in.
But that's just it -- it would ruin the view of all the gaudy attractions that draw the crowds that line the pockets of the hotels and casinos and fill the municipal coffers.
@@bob_._. That's why every country should pitch into the project and have it be lead by someone who wants to keep the esthetics in place.
I think they should close the strip to vehicular traffic, make it a pedestrian mall, and run a public transit tram down the middle.
And despite the monorail being really bad, I'd still support trying to salvage it by adding extensions to downtown and the airport, taxi and uber drivers be damned!
Yeah, it's already there. The back of the casino location is less than ideal, but if it went to the freaking airport it would still work, and extending it to that would cost a fraction of starting from scratch.
It still wouldn’t serve 70% of the strip so still kinda pointless and no way that thing have the capacity to actually run full length
honestly just the airport extension alone would make the whole thing useable, a transit journey and a walk is preferable to waiting for a more direct but slower and more expensive uber
you'd think they'd just orient part of the casinos to surround the monorail rather than hide it away
Giving in to the taxi companies by not extending the monorail to the airport or downtown was by far the biggest mistake. Taxis are very expensive in Las Vegas and they cheat you on top of that by taking longer routes than necessary.
The Las Vegas monorail truly is the trifecta of useless for its purpose, wildly expensive and then ALSO manages not to make any money. Totally onboard with your idea for an elevated or underground route through the centre.
Collab soon?
It should just be extended
Didn't expect to see you here.
Im in vegas, and its disappointing to have a monorail thats not in any sense useful
I mean the correct answer is the obvious one, isn't it? It's like they went out of their way to do the most ineffectual possible thing
The LV Monorail is an amazing system. I've used it a few times. It is fast, frequent, and reliable. The stations are clean and the trains are comfortable. It is a model for what mass transit can and should look like... it is however a system that was built in exactly the wrong location. It is appropriate that it is now owned by the convention center, because about the only useful use of that route is to go from select resorts to and from the convention center. If they had built the monorail on the Strip instead of a quarter of a mile off of it, it would probably be one of the busiest transit systems in the country.
Does the adjective "comfortable" really apply for a .5 mile ride between FUCKING HOTELS? Do Americans even walk anymore?
@@paveladamek3502 if you are going between two adjacent hotels, yeah, it is only about .5 miles. What is considered The Strip though is a 3.5 mile stretch in a city that often reaches 120 degrees in the summer. If walking for over an hour in triple degree weather is your idea of fun, you do you, most people though will choose to use an air conditioned monorail or bus.
The reason it's not on the strip is that the casino hotel owners don't want it obstructing the views of the people that stay there. That's not to say they're right or wrong, but that's the reason.
"Hotel California school of interior design." Perfect!
The Luxor monorail is so good it really saves walking time from mandalay to Excalibur. Also it’s amazing when it’s too hot like when it’s 100+ degrees. Also avoiding and crowded smoke smelling casino floors adds to it
When I was in LV in 2019 for a concert, my friend and I stayed at a seedy hotel close to Fremont St. The nice security man there recommended that we get on the bus to get to the Cosmo. It was our saving grace, honestly. But having a light rail or something similar on that route instead would be game-changing.
Yup, the Deuce carries a lot of riders, but it's super-susceptible to bunching (which I wanted to talk about in this video but had to cut), so it's not nearly as reliable as it should be! I feel like you could run a train every five minutes or so, but ridership projections aren't my wheelhouse!
@@CityNerd It sounds to me like a "priority lane" for buses could be a great idea - and I've seen it successfull in Asia and Europe. Obviously the next step is then to replace it with trams...
Always a pleasure having you teardown my city, sir.
It's all done with love
The only time I took the monorail there was when I was in Vegas for CES. For CES, the monorail was super packed, so it does seem to do pretty well for big conventions.
It was actually pretty busy for NFL Draft too. (The LINQ and Flamingo stops dropped you right into the fan zone , i.e., surface parking lots the rest of the year.) It does do well for certain uses, but it has still badly missed ridership projections -- they expected it to be a lot more attractive for a lot more trip types.
Clearly a sign it's stuck in "tourist train" land and not a real every day people mover... Like it could/should be... Also not a great sign when MSG Sphere opens but not with its monorail station which will be added.... later? 17,000 people on a "train" line with no direct access... That's going to work out swell!
@@stickynorth yeah, I guess that's the distinction. It's not good public transit, but it seems to do well for moving tourists on that side of the strip (at least for big events). So I think it can be both useful, and bad public transit. I think all the suggestions for improvements are 100% valid and I hope to see them, but I do think with better signage more people could end up using the monorail.
@@TheSpiffyNeoStar I honestly think it is serviceable as is, and with signage could become pretty decent. When I found out that it exists, the first thing I did was to try to look up if it went to the airport or downtown. Its main problem is that it doesn't serve those two important destinations. If it did it could be actually pretty useful for tourists.
If they added a few more stops between the strip and downtown it could even become somewhat useful for the locals.
I don't get why people still think building a monorail for transit is a good idea. Do they not remember what had happened to Springfield, Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook? And those things are awfully loud
Cause it looks cool and the only time they willingly used transit was at Disney World
Well the Sao Paulo monorail and the monorails in Chongqing and Tokyo are pretty amazing, as well as Wuppertal to an extent. But apart those they're generally pretty bad.
@@eannamcnamara9338 Monorails have very occasional niche uses, particularly in super high density or hilly terrain where the entire line is elevetated... Maybe not in sprawling flat desert though.
The monorail can be criticized for many things, but being "awfully loud" is not one of them. I tried to get a photo of a train from street level during my last visit to Las Vegas. The trains were so quiet that I couldn't rely on hearing them in time to aim my camera. I had a similar experience in trying to get a photo of the monorail trains passing through the restaurant at the Contemporary Resort in Walt Disney World. The guideway was perhaps ten meters from our table, but the trains were so quiet that I had trouble hearing them in time to aim my camera.
Nah, they glide as softly as a cloud... But isn't there a chance the track could bend?
The moral of the story is transit needs great stations to thrive. I would love to see transit engineers measure down to the second how long it takes to walk from the train, through the station and to their destination. They could then draw radiuses around the train stop (eg 30 seconds, 60 seconds, 90 seconds, etc). If they did this, we would we see much better and more walkable stations.
Where you say great, I think I would say convient, since its all about location and access. You don't need big expensive cathedrals, a platform can be enough.
@@neolithictransitrevolution427 I agree. eg There are NYC stations that are completely ugly but quite functional. Often it's just a 30 second walk from the station to the surface. Compare this to the huge Chinese metro stations...they look fantastic, but many require long walk times...sometimes up to 8-10 minutes!
@@AaronSmith-sx4ez That's one of the problems with the 2nd Avenue subway extension in NYC, they built these huge "cathedral" stations (as @Neolithic Transit Revolution put it) which take two long escalators to get to platform level and are completely unnecessary. For this and other reasons, instead of fast cut-and-cover construction (how most of the subway was built in the first place) they had to use much more expensive deep tunnel boring.
I simplified it in the video, but it's really about network distance -- not radius -- and this is where the walking-through-the-casinos REALLY fails!
I think this is one area where the Boring Co Loop has a significant advantage. Every hotel and casino on the Vegas strip is getting its own Loop station above-ground right at its front door - 51 stations all in the space of about 8 miles.
Walking time to each station is pretty much negligible and then you only have to wait 15 seconds at most for an EV compared to 3, 5, 10 or 30 MINUTES for a train or bus.
The Loop make the Monorail look like a good idea.
"But it's free because memelord is paying for it"
The Monorail only moved 13,000 people per day (pre-pandemic) which is much less than the Loop moved during the SEMA convention last year (27,000 people per day).
And that is despite the monorail having more than double the number of stations over 4x the distance.
Why so down on the Loop?
@@CityNerd An Elon fanboy is spamming this comment thread with boilerplate. Wonder how much he's getting paid?
I didn't even know Vegas had a monorail until you mentioned it in a previous video. The ineptitude of building grade separated rapid transit on the strip is kinda fascinating.
Well, it's hardly ineptitude, but rather outright opposition from the powers that be. I mean the casino owners. The last thing they want is for more public involvement in their affairs. There's very good reasons why they set up shop on unincorporated land outside of the city of Las Vegas. And none of them include the desire for more government involvement.
These guys just don't believe in public transit so it simply won't exist on their turf for as long as they are in charge.
I am a fan of the monorail and always ride it when I am in Las Vegas, but I concede you are right that the stations are too awkwardly located for it to fill the transit need. I vaguely recall that at one time there was a proposal to build a light rail line along Frank Sinatra Boulevard on the opposite side of the strip from the monorail, which would have resulted in stations that were equally awkward to reach. My understanding is that part of the strip was temporarily closed to auto traffic during the NFL draft, and this proved fairly popular. Perhaps this will ultimately lead to reducing the number of motor vehicle lanes on the strip and running a light rail line along the median. Alternatively, perhaps Mr. Musk will come to his senses and design trains that can run through his tunnels in lieu of cars.
Elon Musk hates public transit
If you happen to be staying in one of the hotels the monorail stops at...it's OK. It's still $5!! They have to stop treating the Strip like it's some sort of sacrosanct, perfectly planned transportation utopia that can't be improved upon. Just put a high quality, grade separated line right down the middle. It's a slam dunk.
Agreed on almost all counts. Except, I don't think that our South African diamond mine boi is capable of what you want him to do. He's broken in sorts of ways that make this kind of thinking impossible for him. He's friends with Peter Thiel after all.
I went to Vegas recently with two young kids, the trek to the monorail (and back to the strip), the cost and a separate cost for the bus service (surprisingly slow) ended up proving that ultimately the similarly cost effective and hassle free approach was to just catch lyft/uber. Such a shame because I honestly would have preferred public transportation for my entire trip but it's just not a good use of time and money especially with kids in tow...
May I ask what you were doing in Vegas with young kids?
I am once again requesting a video on the top ten cycling cities in North America
Cycling infrastructure is so random in the U.S. even in the same city. I can't believe our country is so far behind the rest of the world
@Lucy Bikes NYC number of bike lane miles per capita, with bonuses given for them being protected lanes or dedicated bike paths would probably be a relatively simple but effective metric
@@JordanPeace You'll probably run into a whole bunch of pleasure trails for recreational use though.
@Lucy Bikes NYC It's so, so difficult to get useful data on bike infrastructure. Usually, a bike lane that runs right nest to 45mph traffic shows up the same as a protected bike lane in the data. I wouldn't know where to start! (Trust me, I'd have been using the data at my job for the last xx years if it existed!)
@@r.d.9399 it’s because bicycles lost the chicken or the egg equation in the USA because our cities are not dense enough.
The Monorail is a white elephant for all the reasons you mention, but it should be noted that you *can* get to it from street level at Sahara and MGM stations- Sahara has a stairway and a pair of escalators (that have been out of service for *years*), and MGM has an elevator to the street. They're not easy to find, but they're there. There are also subsidized $1 fares for locals, which makes it a little more useful for employees. I carry a couple $1 tickets in my wallet just on the off chance I ever need to get between Tropicana or Flamingo and Sahara in a hurry.
Sorry, update, as of this morning the escalators to street level at Sahara station are working again!
What?????? I coulda rode the monorail for a buck????? Curses!! Still figuring out the locals discounts. I did kind of suspect you could access from Sahara or Tropicana -- I should've researched it a bit more before I said otherwise in the video. Thanks for setting me straight!
I can just about remember when I was a kid, thinking that the Las Vegas strip was a pedestrian promenade. This was before I knew almost anything about the US but based on the way people spoke about it that was what came to mind, something like the main street of an amusement park but with bigger buildings. I was definitely pretty shocked I had been wrong all that time and seeing just how many lanes there are. To this day I have a hard time wrapping my head around the strip, it seems like a pretty uncomfortable place even if you come by car.
its truly amazing how you make these topics so interesting and engaging. no joke!
Glad you think so!
Interesting... as a Vegas local, here is some context about these monorails and trams that were never meant to be a replacement for mass transit. They were built to take guests from one resort to another owned by the same casino operator.
Here is some local history.... Around 1986 Circus Circus opened a new tower across the street from their main hotel casino. A tram was built for the guests convenience by connecting the two.
In 1989 Golden Nugget built the Mirage. With the success of this themed resort in 1993 they had the Treasure Island built next door. The tram was built to connect the two and to funnel guests from one casino to their other casino without having them walk in 110 F / 43 C summers.
In 1990 Circus Circus built Excalibur and in 1993 with these profits opened the Luxor next door, and the tram was built between them. With the profits from Luxor in 1999 Mandalay Bay was opened along with the tram stop connecting all three.
In 1996 Mirage resorts and Circus Circus got together and built Monte Carlo Resort then in 1998 Mirage Resorts opened the Bellagio along with the tram connecting these two.
In 2000, MGM Resorts bought out Mirage Resorts. Then, in 2005, MGM/Mirage Resorts bought out Mandalay Resorts. Now known as MGM Resorts International, in 2009 they opened City Center. Located between Bellagio and Monte Carlo, the tram line was rebuilt to include a station that connects all three.
The monorail, to begin with, was only built in 1995 to connect MGM and Bally's as a proof of concept. It was as exciting as Seattle's monorail with the bonus of inconvenient station locations.
I believe the best location for mass transit in Las Vegas would be underground. The problem is we have a few issues here. We are located on caliche clay which is hard and expensive to dig through as well. (Now if there was only someone who wanted to prototype and test their future Mars tunnel boring equipment and is also in need of a multi billion dollar tax write-off for the next 30 years until it shows a profit.)
Fascinating info -- I don't see any way Clark County does the right thing here, though, and provides good public transit and saves millions on street infrastructure.
Thank you for doing this to show how divided this town is. I have lived here for 11yrs and they (Casinos) all want to do their own thing which as you know has turned out disastrous for this city and probably will not get any better in the future!
Thank you for your feedback. Your qualitative research is appreciated. Keep doing what you do. Cheers.
Hello Nerd of Towns, how about a video on the layout of rapid transit routes? Linear (Seattle), hub-and-spoke (Boston) and whatever NYC is? Flaws of not having circumferential routes? Food for thought.
NYC is a combination of the two. Mainly hub and spoke.
I love your Vegas content! I take the bus to work here, and have always been frustrated by the local routes. But your videos allow me to appreciate what we do have while still being critical of the shortcomings
I rode the monorail just after it first opened in 2004. To get to the Paris/Bally's stop, you had to walk through the Paris casino to the indoor shopping street, along the street until you entered the Bally's casino, turn right, walk through the casino until you found some escalators (the first monorail signs are here), took the escalators down one level, walk to the sports book, turn left, walk to the end of the hall, turn right, walk to the unsigned door at the end of the hall next to the swimming pool, and you found the monorail. It took me 20 minutes of walking to get there.
Seems to me that private groups running transit generally seems to have every disadvantage folks point to for public agencies and none of the advantages. Because of high capital costs they tend towards monopolistic/colluding behavior meaning no innovation from competition, but they're also focused on profit seeking (even for non-profits) and can't rely on tax revenue.
Which incidentally I've been thinking about transit vs cars and tell me if I'm off base here, but it seems to me likely that transit has low marginal cost per passenger (maybe higher for buses than rail) and most costs are fixed based on infrastructure and how often the transit runs. But then cars also still have high fixed costs for the infrastructure and the vehicle (though most cars will be substantially cheaper than a bus or train car), but also higher marginal costs per trip taken. And yet we charge transit riders per trip as if rationing the number of trips is necessary, but we don't charge cars per trip on most roads outside of toll roads (common in some areas, extremely rare in my area) and gas taxes that between better fuel mileage and EVs are increasingly disconnected from marginal costs per trip. Setting aside the admittedly not inconsiderable question of how cars could be charged for the marginal costs of their trips in our current road environment, this seems exactly backwards to me. We should have most if not all transit funded outside of fees per trip (such as with taxes and ads) since per rider costs make little difference to overall operational costs and do more to ensure per trip car costs are correctly priced.
Good points, and it gets at some of what I'm going to talk about when I get to my Vegas Loop video.
ads are meh, I would suggest leasing out space as a better funding system. Both large scale, like owning the developments around a station, or small scale, like renting out the ends of a platform to Kiosk owners or cash opperated public washrooms. But transit should definitely be priced to compete with cars, and the fairs should follow that marginal cost; decreasing in mid day and on weekends for example when vehicles run closer to empty.
Topic suggestion: Best comeback. London Overground showed how underused railroad lines could be rebranded, upgraded and turned around and there must be reopened, revitalized or rebuilt in-place transit that has also been resurrected right?
Buses on the strip running in mixed traffic eh? If only someone would shine a light on how such stroads could be or have been changed into high quality BRT.
Send a Vegas delegation to Mexico City -- Insurgentes Sur will blow their minds.
Please not BRT though. I get that it has its uses in some places at some times. But in the US having gasoline powered busses running on rubber tires with expensive operators at the wheel is ludicrous. If you're building a system from scratch and you're not located in a low-wage state like Alabama, there are zero reasons to prefer a BRT over a tram.
Proper BRT that isn't just a painted lane costs about as much as light rail but delivers a fraction of the benefits. (See Van Ness BRT in San Francisco). It's just not a good idea when you have to pay drivers American wages in a high-wage area. And a high-wage city is the only place BRT tends to make sense in the US for a variety of reasons. It's a solution for a set of problems we don't tend to have in the places where we need and can afford to have high-capacity transit.
@@TohaBgood2 I guess my main reply to this would be "Don't build proper BRT". But I think just about every major road should have a bus service with seperated ROW, off board fare payment, level boarding, high frequency, and signal priority, which I think fits the definition of BRT pretty well.
I think gas powered buses make a lot of sense for the US, unlike Europe
North America is energy sufficient, even without fracking. Getting people out of cars and onto buses has nearly as large an environmental impact regardless of the energy source, particularly if it allows denser development. Of course, not having gas vehicles is preferable, and adding overhead wires and pantographs on buses is certainly possible on BRT routes, and that allows for much smaller batteries to be used when taking the bus off route. As for runner tires I get they aren't as efficient as steel on steel but I think this point is vastly overstate. Again the point is getting people out of cars, after that it's marginal differences.
The point about drivers and the higher lifetime cost is certainly valid. Lifetime BRT costs can absolutely be higher then LRT, particularly as Capacity on a certain route starts to increase and 40 drivers are needed to move as many people an hour as 6 (or even none) might with LRT. I think BRT routes should be converted to LRT overtime for sure as ridership increases. But I would say that is the role BRT plays (or ought to), it can quickly be implement by providing partial ROW to existing buses, and slowly evolve by having more vehicles, then large vehicles, then electrifying, and eventually being replaced by LRT, and at the same time those buses can be moved to a new route to repeat the cycle over 20-30 years. North America needs tranist now and I don't think being a purist about the absolutely most effecient choice is helpful when municipalities are far more familiar with the operation and installation of a more easily available and better fit for existing infrastructure choice.
Funny enough, part of The Deuce and SDX routes were BRT in the Arts District of Vegas.
Love some more talk on the fundamentals of good transit!
Edit: Also love that this was focusing on one city! Plug for Spokane again…
Sydney Australia constructed a monorail in 1988 to link the CBD with a new harbourside development at Darling Harbour. It was an unloved piece of infrastructure, mainly used by tourists. The elevated track was unsightly passing through the narrow streets of the city (one commentator said "It's like fitting spoilers on a Model T Ford") and the vehicles weren't particularly quick or comfortable.
The monorail closed in 2013 and was dismantled. All that remains is a couple of the stations no-one knows what to do with. The monorail was a complete failure as a means of moving large numbers of passengers. Darling Harbour was always within easy walking distance of the CBD and is also now served by a light rail.
Yeah, I remeber visiting Sydney in early 2000s, riding that thing once just to check it out, and thinking how useless it is.
Didn't help that it was a one way loop, expensive, not integrated with other transit and as said more for the tourist.
In fact a lot of similar features to the LV monorail.
Hopefully the new owners of the LV Monorail can make it more useful.
Great Video! My family went to Vegas during spring break. When we spent a day on the strip, we just walked. Monorail was far away and the wait for the bus was too long. It's crazy that they don't have a train that runs on the strip.
Yeah, the transit options just don't jump out at you. They could do something incredible there.
@@CityNerd Yeah. We got lost in a casino at one point trying to find the strip. No sign saying, "LAS VEGAS BLVD THIS WAY"
@@j.f.e.productions4098 my friends and I visited last month with the same experience. Easier to take an Uber between resorts on the Strip than public transit
Yes, grade separated rail line from the airport to downtown. Probably the most logical rail alignment in the US. Make it automated and designed for 24/7 service to meet the full potential.
How do you overcome the huge lobbying power of the taxi drivers?
@@jfwfreo You just wait for Uber and Lyft to have their way with them and then build the rail line.
But I think that extending the monorail to the airport and to downtown would be a better use of everyone's time at this point. The Strip literally exists where it is in order to give the casinos control over their affairs. If they were amenable to public involvement, they would have built within the city limits of Las Vegas rather than starting from scratch outside of the city.
The monorail has a tiny chance of being sufficiently insignificant that it slides under their radar. As long as you can defeat the taxi companies, you can in fact extend the monorail and make it somewhat serviceable in the medium term.
10/10 good stuff. I wanted to hear a little more about the walkability of the strip, but the focus on transit was great! Thanks!! You're a great urban planning channel, please keep it up!
I kindof liked the monorail. It came in real handy getting to the hotels on the strip from the Westgate and back several times a day with the unlimited pass, and the views of the Venetian were pretty nice.
POINTING OUT: Casinos don't want you to leave so it is NOT in their interests to make the monorail so visible.
Spot on with most of your points on the monorail. I haven't been there is a few years, but I vaguely remember hearing that the stations were paid for by the casinos that wanted them, so that is why they are where they are. Add that to the fact that since it came after the resorts, being behind them actually meant being behind large buildings, and pool areas, and thus not that pedestrian friendly. Given that start and the multiple bankruptcies, I can see an extension being more transit oriented. I think the biggest things they could do would be to figure out some way to transfer with the busy bus lines.
Another super interesting video. I've been to Vegas, and I just took a taxi everywhere. It never crossed my mind to even try to find public transportation there because it wasn't obvious. I would love a video where you talked about the process, or just your experience in the process of getting new public transportation approved. Maybe even bike lanes? Also, a primer on effective ways that someone interested in transit could help push their local officials to support better transit policies.
I was there the same weekend! Coming from NYC, I found walking the strip very frustrating with all the pedestrian bridges and casino mazes.
On day two I ended up using the tram from Mandalay Bay and also jumped on The Deuce for a quick run to Walgreens and found it to be really nice.
I did not hear you mention that "locals" (with a Nevada drivers license or other state issued ID) can buy single ride tickets for a dollar. The limit is two rides per day, or twenty rides in a ten day period.
I used the monorail twice during a visit to Sin City (April 2022) as I was attending a convention. I used the MGM Grand stop to the LVCC. Though pricey at $5 for a one way ride, my use of the monorail did not merit buying all-day or multi-day tickets. Still much cheaper than a cab or Uber.
With regards to the RTC bus line, you can buy a $5 all day pass which allows you to use the "neighborhood" bus lines, but a premium pass to use the Deuce ($8, allows use of all bus lines in the RTC system). The #108 bus serves the Convention Center, the Airport and the Bonneville bus center downtown. My biggest gripe is that the kiosk ticket machines do not sell single ride tickets. The ticket machine at the Convention Center was broken when I wanted to buy a ticket in late April. The driver was good enough to let me ride to Bonneville where I bought the $5 pass.
It's wild to see this video now. Just a week ago I submitted my capstone research paper for college on the Walkability of Las Vegas, and I talked about a lot of similar points. Unfortunate how I had most of it finished before hearing about the public opinion post-NFL draft as I would have loved to include it, although a lot of similar points were made. I know there is a RTC project currently to redesign Boulder Highway in Las Vegas and it actually seems like a step in the right direction with a lot of applicable information for redesigning the Strip. It even mentions light rail as well, although I feel it is more likely we will see dedicated bus lanes instead (Still a win!). Additionally, when looking at bus ridership in Las Vegas it is important to consider how many people are locals and how many are visiting. A 2017 Visitor profile study found between 10-15% of people using the buses are visitors. I could gush about so many other little details, but I lack any qualification to provide new insight besides doing a few months of research on data and being a local. Anyway, great video and keep up the great content.
Thanks! Check out my video on the Strip's pedestrian bridges (from a coupe months ago) if you haven't already. I've skimmed the Boulder Highway Plan -- interesting stuff! Best of luck on all your studies.
@@CityNerd Thank you! I might have actually found the plan through your channel in all honesty. This past week has felt like a blur. Finals week, and possibly my final finals week before graduation (if all goes well).
I love the dry sarcasm and the incisive analytical questioning. Music to my ears. Sydney did the same with its Monorail downtown and there is mixed results as to its effectiveness. Albeit you can walk the same distance or should. It is an eyesore as it travels down major streets, such as Market street.
Throwing in a request to talk about how urban fabric impacts ability to provide high quality transit. Just wondering if it’s possible to turn sprawl into decent transit. Or vice versa if having good fabric is enough.
City Beautiful just did a good video on this.
Thanks, that was pretty interesting.
8:15 As someone who once lived in London, I really felt that.
I love the tube, but man it's pricey!
I have visited both LV (Strip) and Macao in the past 10 years, there's no comparison from an urbanism standpoint. Cotai being a pale humid imitation of the LV Strip notwithstanding, there actually was a bus shuttle service between the Ferry terminal, the major casinos, and the old city on the Macao Peninsula. This was before the viaduct-based Light Rail opened. And obviously the Peninsula is a dense environment, in fact the most densely populated top-level dependency (say, Cayman Islands, and not Ontario) in the world!
Fantastic video, can't believe I haven't seen it until now
While the current version of the Las Vegas Monorail gives much to be desired and an elevated rail over Las Vegas blvd is by far the greatest solution to transit needs, it is being shown that Major influences to deciding forces (Clark County Commissioners) to not be something that is desired
And thus the most elegant solution is to just purely extend the monorail to the Airport, to the historic downtown, and to currently under served casinos on the Las Vegas Strip
While it is not the most efficient solution, it could be a more beneficial compromise vs what the Loop would offer and what is currently in effect
11:32 Yes and the plural of leaf is leaves, but it’s the Toronto Maple Leafs. 🍁(Fine by me I’m from Montreal…)
Thanks for an excellent illustration of absurd, unfortunate private planning. In Las Vegas, the Ferengi are in charge. 🖖🏼 (Ferengi is another word that doesn’t take an S for its plural.)
Romulans? Vulcans?
Romulanes eunt domum.
Come to Quark’s! Quark’s is Fun! ruclips.net/video/Kg8o__6bEEY/видео.html
Thanks!
You bet!
After I think my 2nd trip to LV we always got a rental car to get around to the off strip places out to Red Rock and Sam's Town on the other side, down to South Point and the M and to downtown. We just go around everywhere.
Watching this video got me thinking, that the JTA's Skyway in Jacksonville, FL might be a good topic for a video.
I was there the same weekend for CrimeCon, the Draft was a nightmare!
When I came to Vegas for the first time I was shocked to see the monorail and also shocked to hear it was useless. I wanted to ride it but never got the chance. A raised tram would be extremely useful in Vegas because the traffic is terrible, especially during major events with road closures like the NFL Draft which was going on when I went. Getting from the airport to the Flamingo took forever.
(I think we were in town the same time as you lol)
We visited Las Vegas in 2004. The new monorail had to be shut down before we arrived. A wheel had fallen off and rolled down the street. Luckily, no one was hurt.
But the passengers were cross and told sir toppam hat what a bad railway this was.
The Mandalay Bay tram (I've attended several conventions at MB) is super convenient but obviously limited in scope. The Tesla tunnels seem absurd in concept. Expensive and low volume. But on occasions I have mentioned this, I immediately get ambushed by people saying it is the most brilliant, efficient, and cost effective solutions imaginable and I am just being dense (Paid trolls? I don't know) I suppose it is Las Vegas, so normal rules sometimes don't apply.
Just musk fanboys. They live for it.
@@odinhonour2170 Musk fanboys are the right's answer to Kpop stans. They're just one small stroke away from spamming fan-cams of Elon everywhere on Twitter
They are 12 yo Elon
fanboys. No real life experience, live in mothers basement and simply have no analytical skills to see the frauds that man has pulled because they are overwhelmed with his ‘personality’
I'm really amazed the Musk fanboys haven't shown up here already.
I'm actually going to do a video that focuses on the Vegas Loop, but it's just not ready for prime time yet.
Since we frequently visit Vegas with friends, we find the monorail very useful in a certain sense. Usually we have comped rooms at MGM Grand but friends/ family who use Caesar's can be at flamingo, or Harrah's, you get it. It's almost like staying at the same resort with the connection. We use the deuce for actually getting around strip and/or to downtown
I'm in Vegas a lot for conferences (at least pre-COVID) 7-8x a year. Mostly at Mandalay, LVCC, Sands CC, and MGM. Staying at a "Conference Hotel" can be expensive and/or might not be at a property I want to stay at or have "Loyalty Status" with. The biggest conferences usually have dedicated private bus shuttles which are fine but not always ideal or fast. The best thing sometimes for me to get around without messing with the busses/bus schedule or paying for taxi/Uber, is the Monorail. Buy a multi-day pass and you are good for on/off as much as you need, when you need. $5 is high for "public transit" but it's way cheaper than an Uber ride from the LVCC to the MGM at rush hour.
Love the reviews of weird rail systems.
Wow the 2005 Fixed Guideway Plan was honestly the right approach. And it would have cost 1/10 of what it would cost to build now.
I feel like RTC spends a lot of time getting yanked around by special/private interests. It's unfortunate, but man this is a weird town.
I think an interesting topic for a future video could be the jitney buses that are common in northeastern NJ/outer boroughs of NYC. They're essentially barebones, privately owned buses that are typically extremely frequent and I haven't seen them prominently in any other city in the US.
I took RTC from the airport to downtown last time I was in Vegas. It was shockingly difficult to find the bus stop in the airport.
I'm sure it's no accident. The share of trips going by taxi/ridehail is absolutely shocking, especially considering how close a lot of the likely destinations are to the airport.
@@CityNerd That was my impression too, except most airport to public transit connections I'm used to just have some extra fee instead of making it hard to find. But like you said in the video, making things difficult to navigate is typical for Vegas.
las Vegas should build a themed system, themed naturally. A branch to resemble the French Metro of the Beau Epoch era, another to resemble a canal with palm tree supports and trains dressed to resemble a solar barque.
Hello CityNerd love your videos and appreciate the work you put into them. How about making a video about the best and worst value urban transit infrastructure projects.
Doing a trip to the UK soon; visiting a bunch of non-London big cities (Portsmouth, Brighton, Leeds, Liverpool, Manchester, Bristol, etc).
Given your love of Premier League stadia, a video about those transit systems would be cool.
8:16 Switzerland does! Well almost. Most transit tickets are $4 or more. Even slow, stuck in traffic buses and infrequent charge that much. It's even worse if you need to go through more than 2 fare zones
Take a look at incones in Switzerland and it makes sense.
I've ridden the LV monorail twice, once from the MGM Grand to the Venetian and we walked back. And then to get from Top Golf back to our hotel we rode a few stops. Like you, it was tough to find it and a pain to walk through the casinos.
Las Vegas has quite a few uninspired pedestrian bridges. I am on a trip to Los Angeles and just explored the Taylor Yard Pedestrian Bridge spanning the LA River and connecting 2 LA communities. It would be great to see a list of great pedestrian bridges in North America.
Obviously some sort of grade-separated train along Las Vegas Boulevard is the actual answer--and doesn't even seem that technically difficult given how absurdly wide the road is. But I'm kind of in love with really leaning into the inherently gimmicky nature of The Strip and running a gondola above LVB. Can you even imagine how popular that would be for the views alone?
I really think it's a slam dunk. You could keep the profile of the structure light, but the trains themselves could be garish LED-fests. It would be incredible, and certainly no one could say transit is invisible (the way the monorail is!).
You could actually just run a long Disney Skyliner type system with intermediate stops up and down the strip. It would be a relatively low cost, and relatively high volume solution.
They recently did a feasibility study on having a cable car/gondola lift run along a major road in, uh, Munich. The conclusion was that it wouldn't work because the capacities would be too low and the cost way too high, along with having a very difficult time to get the stations in place above the road - and somehow making them accessible from the ground. They did mention the tourist potential specifically though.
I suspect it'd be similar issues in Las Vegas. Unless you mean gondolas in the sense of digging a canal along the road and inviting some Venetian gondoliers .... I mean, that'd be an even more Las Vegas solution. Especially given the whole city-in-the-desert thing.
@@Sp4mMe I meant overhead gondolas. I'd have to look at capacity, but if you look at any ski resort with gondolas, the gondola capacity is about 2000 people an hour, with essentially zero headway and zero dwell time.
@@andrewdiamond2697 Maybe. But how many of those systems are build to for anything but point-to-point transportation? This would be very much a more complex use, with multiple stations in between (and it's those stations that are the expensive bit).
Munich thought building their system would cost 400 million € for 11km and 9 stations. Meanwhile setting up an express bus system for the same line has an expected cost of 20 million € and the expected passenger capacity is just slightly lower (23000 vs 20000). So, yeah. It's just too much.
Obv Las Vegas wouldn't be precisely the same but I can't imagine it'd make any more sense there than a tram or comparable. Cable cars are great for difficult terrain - otherwise, naw.
I have been to Vegas lots of times and the traffic is horrible at night and on special events. They should stop being stupid and build a heavy rail subway system that makes real easy for people to come and go. You got everything you need.
Cheers
Great video! LOTS of thoughts:
1) The LVM was entirely financed by seven casino megaresorts that it serves. No significant public money was involved.
2) Given the power of the megaresorts, it is not merely surprising but absolutely shocking that they allowed the private transportation companies (taxi, shuttle, and car rental) to block the airport connection that would probably have prevented the bankruptcies.
3) The LVM grand opening in July 2004 was the most extravagant event I have ever attended in my life. World-class chefs and buffet service at EVERY station, weird bands doing weird things while playing weird music, a simulated helicopter assault using actual helicopters (I am NOT kidding), enough fireworks to light up the entire Atlantic coast, and ALL the pretty people between the Mississippi and Pacific gathered to gape in awe at the sheer spectacle of it all. To this day, I'm not quite sure what any of that had to do with the world's first privately owned, fully automated, screened-platform fixed guideway elevated transit line and I'm sure that it didn't help the LVM's bottom line but nobody - and I mean NOBODY - puts on a show like Vegas, baby! I took hundreds of photos, six or seven of which are actually quite good.
4) Nobody in their right mind buys a one-trip ticket for $5. You buy a 24-hour pass for $13 and use the hell out of it. That's what I did way back in the days when dinosaurs roamed the land while staying at the LVH. After checking in on the night I arrived, I took the monorail to the MGM to see a show, then elsewhere to grab a late dinner, then back to the LVH to sleep. The next morning, I took it to hit a breakfast buffet, then to another resort to game for a while, then back to the LVH to load up my car and check out. In that scenario, it was totally worth the $13. Smooth, quiet, fast, and frequent.
5) You missed the old Circus-Circus tram that used to connect the front of the resort to the back of the resort. Completely useless, but kind of cute - like most Hollywood stars.
6) How to fix Las Vegas public transit:
6A) NO more Teslas in sewer pipes. This is the dumbest thing in the history of transportation and clearly exists only as a gimmick to sell cars. Convert the existing pipes into pedestrian tunnels. You'll make better time walking!
6B) Do NOT abandon the monorail. Make it part of the bigger picture. Extend it east along Tropicana, then south to the center of the terminal complex at McCarran, as should have been done during initial construction. Also extend it north to the Strat, along Main for a few blocks, and then west along Wyoming to the railroad tracks (more about that, below).
6C) Convert Las Vegas Boulevard (LVB) into a pedestrian-friendly transit mall with LRT from the WTFLV sign at the south, through downtown, to the circle thing north of Owens Ave. Future LRT extensions could branch out of the circle thing.
6D) West of LVB is a multi-track rail line that runs more or less north/south (and ultimately connects to Los Angeles and Salt Lake City). There is room to overlay regional LRT passenger service using offline platforms so as to not interfere with freight movements or future restoration of intercity passenger service. LRT service could eventually be extended to Henderson along existing rail ROW.
6E) The two LRT lines suggested above could either be formed into a continuous loop OR transfer stations could be built near Sunset and Owens. I favor the loop.
6F) The monorail should add a transfer station where it crosses the LVB transit mall and where Wyoming crosses the railroad mainline. It should eventually be extended from the McCarran terminal complex south to another transfer station at the future Henderson branch.
6G) Re-route all the crosstown buses through several rail stations and rationalize the entire bus system.
Conclusion: There you have it! We've just enhanced the utility of existing assets without tearing down anything (except, perhaps, some of the pedestrian bridges above LVB) while taming the nightmare that is The Strip. We've also enabled the conversion of some of LV's urban wastelands into valuable TODs, connected the airport to several other modes, and given residents and visitors viable transportation options. Voila. You're welcome.
Amazing comment as usual.
1. Yeah I think I mentioned it was all privately owned -- I probably should've emphasized it more, because it's truly amazing.
2. I don't fully understand the symbiotic relationship between hotels and taxis, but it isn't specific to Vegas. Weird stuff.
3. I love this.
4. I dunno, I love to walk, so there are very few times I'm going to feel motivated to walk to the back of a particular casino on the east side of the Strip. Using the hell out of a monorail pass is gonna get in the way of my step count!
5. I've stayed at the Circus Circus in Reno and that one has a monorail that...still is in operation? I will not speak that resort's name in my videos, but it was one of the 20 biggest hotels I flagged in that one graphic.
6. My instinct to just let the Monorail be a white elephant. I could be wrong. Gotta get a transit line down the the Brightline West Station, though, by the time that opens -- around Warm Springs? You could branch the Strip rail line so some trips go to the airport maybe. Not sure.
I'm curious why you think the Loop is a bad idea Colorme? With the Loop moving 27,000 people per day thru 3 stations over 0.8 miles during SEMA in November, that is double the ridership of the Las Vegas Monorial which handled 13,510 people per day over 4 miles and 7 stations. And the monorail figures were pre-pandemic, so they're even lower now.
In comparison, the Vegas Bus service has a daily ridership of 178,390 but that is across 51 routes and 3,900+ stops and a fleet of 708 buses.
So compare that to the Boring Co’s Loop which only has 1 route, 3 stops and 70 cars and yet has demonstrated it can carry at least 27,000 passengers per day.
So that very large bus network only carries 6.6x the number of passengers of the small 3-station Loop despite having 51x the number of routes, 1,300x the number of stops and 10x the number of vehicles each of which has 10x the seating capacity as each Loop EV.
Who the hell wants to walk in tunnels? Just turn the sewer pipes into subway lines.
@@jwt1035 Why do you call the Loop tunnels "sewer tunnels" JWT? At 12.5 feet diameter, they are larger than the 11' 8" of London Underground tunnels.
@@jwt1035 They're too small. Even the Teslas frequently bump the sides.
I find it really interesting because like you said, there really is this demand for a better way of getting around the strip. Even with the absolutely god-awful options currently available they still get a fair amount of use. It's kind of strange that the casinos/companies don't seem to fully recognize it. They understand it enough that they have all these small trams and poor solutions, without ever evolving that idea further to its natural conclusion. 2 major companies own the majority of the strip, they have their own services of all types, yet they just can't come together on perfecting the traffic and transportation of their area despite how popular it would be.
As a Las Vegas, NV metro area resident, I just want to point out that if you live in Nevada and show proof of this such as a Nevada driver's license, the ride costs $1.00 but with a limit of two rides per day or 20 rides in 10 days if purchasing the 20 ride ticket. However, the monorail is much more geared to people attending conventions and tourists visiting the strip as locals tend to avoid the Strip. I ride it at times but much more for fun than as a transit option. But the climate-controlled and air-conditioned monorail is especially helpful in the summer when temperatures are frequently well above 100 degrees outside.
The Las Vegas Monorail was never more than a gimmick. One more thing to try to make Vegas an “Adult Disney World.”
“Yeah, we’ve got a monorail, too!”
The one good thing about it is that a stop for the former Las Vegas Hilton. It really does need to get extended to the airport and to downtown. That might make it worth trying to find the terminals in casinos it services.
It won’t happen simply because cruising the Strip is a thing, but what would work best is a public rail running down the middle; again reaching from airport to downtown. Close the strip off to all automobile and truck traffic (There are already sufficient roads behind the casinos on both sides to service the area that way) and make it pedestrian-only or small electric vehicles, preferably in fixed routes. Add some more pedestrian bridges across the northern side of the Strip for getting across more easily. Then allow regular road traffic back on at Sahara or a bit further north.
I used to have to go to Las Vegas for trade shows quite often. I tried to ride the monorail once from the hotel and after 20 minutes trying to find it, I gave up. I could've just walked instead.
As for those taxi tunnels, I can only imagine that they will be built the same way the monorail is with access to the tunnels buried in the casinos and access to only select casinos with no direct street access.
It's interesting that the Deuce Bus has a southern terminal at the McCarren Car Rental Facility (lots of bus riders there I'm sure) just 1/2 mile from the ramp into the tunnel under the airport to the terminals. The airport has only one 15 min frequent bus line; the 109, and it doesn't go to the Strip. It goes downtown and it does go south through that tunnel to connect to The Deuce. Why not offer a one-seat ride from the airport on The Deuce since it's almost at the airport?
That right there shows you that the regional transportation authority isn't really about efficient transit for the residents and visitors of Las Vegas when it comes to The Strip. The Strip has one bus line. None of the transverse lines travels along the strip. All of the employees taking the bus have to transfer to The Deuce (unless they work at those select corners). A one-seat rides in Vegas? Not if they can help it.
Yeah, RTC has limited planning authority when elected officials can just decide they want a Tesla tunnel instead, or allow the taxi/ridehail interests to dissuade them from offering monorail or high quality bus from the airport to the Strip. I'm no expert on Vegas politics, but it all smells just a bit.
Actually most of the 51 hotels and casinos are building above-ground Loop stations right at their front door like the two above-ground convention centre Loop stations with only a few apparently putting their Loop stations in their underground parking garages. There will also be Loop stations at the University and several Loop stations at Allegiant Stadium and eventually the airport.
As such, with Loop stations at virtually every hotel, casino and attraction in Vegas, this 29 mile Vegas Loop looks like it will be very targeted at moving significant volumes of the general public.
@@CityNerd I think Las Vegas has just done some simple calculations and found that a 10,000 people per hour tram/light rail would cost $3 billion, a 50,000 people per hour subway would cost $8 billion versus the 29 mile 51 station 57,000 people per hour Vegas Loop costing them zero dollars.
The only politics at play here would be that around making sure that billions of dollars of public money isn't spent uneccessarily.
@@andrewfranklin4429 Laughably optimistic numbers there, pal.
@@Codraroll why do you think that Erlend? The current 3-station, convention center Loop is already easily handling 27,000 people per 8-hour day during large conventions so I’m not sure why you would think that 57,000 people per hour over 51 stations and 29 miles of tunnels would be unachievable?
Hey, idea, can you talk about the coolest Comprehensive Plans. Maybe an episode for smaller cities vs. an episode for large cities as their cool documents that get passed every 10+ years with lofty ideas, about urban planning and general neighborhood design!
Could you do a video on the Midwest/Rust Belt. I hear that some of our transit is overbuilt and older because people left for the sunbelt post war. I also heard people are coming back because of climate change (lake mead drying up as an example). Any thoughts or say a list of best cities for that growth or most rebounded. I am from Cleveland personally so do see some of this personally (Tremont going from a place to avoid to having some of the highest home costs and a bill that hurt development failing).
I love your voice, If i could listen to your voice for 6 hours a day I would
As a Las Vegas local, I used to think public transit couldn’t get any worse here… then suddenly we approved the Tesla tunnels.
Las Vegas has much better public transit than a lot of cities its size, believe it or not! They should be doubling down on it, not giving permits to this other crap
@@CityNerd did you see the video on Twitter of the tunnels already backed with traffic? I wanted cry!
Hi Eyebot, have you tried the Loop as a local? I'd be interested to know what you don't like about it?
And by the way that single short clip from CES that bloggers repeat over and over ad nauseam showed only a brief slow down for less than 40 seconds in the Loop tunnel due to a temporary closure of the South building’s doors. The EVs didn’t even stop, they just briefly slowed.
This ignores the fact that the rest of the time the Teslas are smoothly entering and exiting each station every 3 seconds compared to switching to a mulit-billion dollar subway where you have to wait for far longer - 3, 5, 10 or 60 minutes for the next train and have to stop and wait at every station on a line instead.
The Monorail needs to go to the Las Vegas Airport !!
Just found your channel. Love it, live in Vegas and take the bus... It's not great but way better than Denver because it's 24 hours and I live near UNLV off Flamingo so more buses come every 20 mins. I can't believe RTC hasn't brought back the SDX but maybe it's lack of drivers.
SDX just suffered with being unable to enforce fare usage. Among the locals it was quick to be called "the free bus" and with Las Vegas not having any actual Transit Police further enforcement of fare would be nonviable as opposed to increasing resources to the Deuce
The "Euro-tram" concept is interesting. The picture the MPO chose is from Lyon (France), where virtually the entire network is on dedicated lanes...
Ah, thanks for spotting it! The On Board plan specifies "mixed traffic" in its language...these things tend to be a hybrid, though, like dedicated lanes but with crossing/conflicting traffic, so not grade separated. I would love to go to Lyon at some point. Like, just to eat food.
@@CityNerd Indeed, Lyon trams aren't grade separated (except in a few key places).
But to my knowledge they are never in mixed traffic and have signal priotity, so they tend to be really efficient.
And yes, the food is excellent there!
A few years back I stayed at the MGM Grand for AWS re:Invent. Most of the talks were at the Sands Expo Center (at the Venetian/Palazzo). I bought a monorail pass and went through the exact same experience of walking the MGM until I had passed the station entrance. And that's not even the worst station! There was one station - Harrah's maybe - that was accessed directly from a road with no sidewalks, in the back alley used for driving to the parking garages. Terrible! And yet it was still better than even the dedicated buses just for the conference since they all got stuck in that awful traffic.
I hear ya. I don't know if I've used the Harrah's/LINQ station ever. LINQ built out a cool promenade that goes back to the ferris wheel -- I honestly don't know if the promenade accesses the monorail, though.
@@CityNerd The promenade was nice. That was one of the few areas that felt like a normal, comfortable place and not some wacky adult theme park.
It's possible that the main entrance to the monorail was from that promenade and there was a secondary entrance that I was using to get to the Venetian. I just remember it feeling like I was breaking some kind of law to walking in that area. You know, without sidewalks or slot machines around.
I also want to thank you for all your videos. I've watched every one of them at least once. I really appreciate your insights, your professional experience, and your dry humor. And it means so much to me that you actually bothered to read and respond to my comment. Keep up the great work! I'll be pledging my support on Patreon as well.
I’d nominate The Trolley in the Delmar Loop in St. Louis as a similar example of what not to in transit. It was pushed by the guy who developed the Loop and doesn’t connect to any nearby local transit so it failed miserably. It’s also rails on car lanes on a car heavy street, so it didn’t go well.
a LondonSkyline style ropeway system of elevated gondolas would fit this sort of system really well I think....
In my last visit (Nov 2022), I used the bus, tram (conveniently was staying at Luxor), and monorail. The bus system, especially outside the strip, wasn't great. At one stop the bus didn't show up at all for a scheduled stop I made sure I was early for.
I have to admit that there's a part of me which really wants to see the Tesla Tunnels built out so that they can be a case study for how not to build urban transit. I'm also well aware that this is a really bad idea though because the Elon Fanboy Apologists will just move the goalposts and claim it's the best thing ever despite it being a dystopian nightmare. I mean, it's Vegas, so it's already a dystopian nightmare, but it would suck if other cities catch Elon fever and try replicating it (I'm looking at you Ft. Lauderdale).
Asking the question I always ask: How does one successfully build a below ground tunnel in Florida?
Reminder, Disney World's Magic Kingdom is technically on the second floor.
@@HarryLovesRuth Central Subway in SF is having this very problem at the Moscone Center station and it looks like it's going to be delayed _again_. I'm hoping it will open in my lifetime. Construction started uh.. 9 years ago?
@@agntdrake At this point in climate change, anything built in Florida that's not already on pontoons shows a lack of forward planning.
I think you might be pleasantly surprised Patrick. As I posted in a comment further up, the current LVCC Loop is actually carrying far more passengers per vehicle/route/stop than the entire Las Vegas bus service
The Vegas Bus service has a daily ridership of 178,390 across 51 routes and 3,900+ stops and a fleet of 708 buses.
Now, compare this to the Boring Co’s Loop which only has 1 route, 3 stops and 70 cars and yet carried 27,000 passengers per day during SEMA in November.
So that very large bus network only carries 6.6x the number of passengers of the small 3-station Loop despite having 51x the number of routes, 1,300x the number of stops and 10x the number of vehicles each of which has 10x the seating capacity as each Loop EV.
Perhaps the Loop isn’t that bad a solution after all?
Particularly since the now under-construction 51 station, 29 mile Vegas Loop will have stations at the front doors of pretty much every hotel and casino on the Las Vegas Strip solving the complaint of visibility far more effectively than a train service that could never hope to have that extremely high number and frequency of stations in such a short distance.
Whether or not you like the Loop, moving cars underground is really a win for everyone. And while I'm very pro transit and think we should be hugely pushing people onto it, even countries like Singapore amd the Netherlands have cars. So I'm very pro the loop just to push forward low cost car tunneling.
Fast forward 2 years the monorail just posted it's first ever profit. The Monorail at MGM is VERY easy to find, you literally took a wrong turn. Enter front doors where cabs pick up, take a right and head down the escalator at the Underground
At 12:00. I LOVE the reset that the COVID pandemic has caused in NYC. I'm loving the fact that outdoor dining has now become more ingrained and far more common in far more neighborhoods within NYC. All these restaurants taking up road space also displaces car parking spots that were once there, which means that this new norm forcefully pushes down the number of people who will want to own and drive cars in the city. So it's a win-win for everyone except the awful people who still want to drive cars within this crowded metropolis.
Your thoughts are right on. It should go right down the strip. I love the Monorail but it's so well hidden as all of Vegas Transit. Horrible system and system map, bus included.
I used the monorail on the strip for DEFCON in 2015, it worked great for me, especially in combination with a lot of underage drinking. The fare wasn't memorably high when I paid for the whole trip worth of day passes on arrival, and got me between Bally's (where DEFCON was held) and my hotel, which was the last stop. It was very empty though so idunno. I was living in Toronto at the time, and it felt a lot more useful than the TTC lol.
The wayfinding isn't a huge deal because the monorail stops are at the back of every building, and visible any time you go outside.
A separate tram on the centerline of the strip, maybe even primarily made of monotrack, would probably work pretty well.
European trams usually don't run in mixed traffic though. I really hope that if they shut down the strip or if they cut down on lanes they should create high capacity BRT or preferably a tram.
Wrong. Trams do share space with other modes. It is in fact one of their core features.
@@flierfy It can be a mix. But they generally have to intersect with vehicular traffic at the least.
@@flierfy Only if you cling to anglophone definitions. Most tram systems have a dedicated right of way wherever possible.
You should rename this video "Vegas: Transit Fiasco". lol. Seriously Vegas just seems like the U.S's place to try out all the weird Gadgetbahn options possible and not care about the outcome. That would be a worthy plan if other cities actually learned from Vegas's mistakes and NEVER COPIED THEM EVER.
Yeah, it's like there's this effort to provide exaggeratedly different travel options for tourists (valuable people) and locals/labor (disposable people).
Oh, and as an added benefit to centralizing employee parking= Every casino that has a dedicated lot (Which is all of them) would find themselves with a whole lot of extra land to do something with- it's probably the concepts biggest selling point. "Oh, now I have 5 more acre's? what can I do with that?" Just look what Ballys did with all that dead space in front of them- a cool pedestrian promenade that draws businesses to lease the space, draws tourists to visit it, and makes your property stand out and be more memorable to visitors.
The strip should have bus lanes. Also I don’t understand why the public transportation isn’t better. Been multiple times and the trams look out of place everytime
A simple solution would be to restore the SDX service and extend it to serve the airport. Even without dedicated bus lane, (bus lanes would be much better but might be hard to get approved), that would make a fair alternative to Uber or Taxi.
Turns out I've been to Vegas 3 times since '95 and I had no idea that monorail even existed, hidden on the back side of those hotels. The solution is so simple since the strip is so massively wide. Separate 2 narrow lanes with curbs and paint, just wide enough for a bus down the center of the strip ideally. Add stations at cross streets and people can use the existing crosswalks to gain access and board the bus/tram during red lights. Give the bus lane an advance green with just enough seconds to clear the intersection for left turning drivers. No tunnels, no elevated tracks, no stairwells, escalators and elevators.
Maybe the monorail would have higher ridership if it wasn't so damn hard to find where the stations even are. I just got back from Vegas and wanted to take the monorail to go to the Stratosphere, managed to find the station behind the Paris only to find that it was walled off on multiple sides from street level. I ended up just using the deuce for the length of the trip.
Technically not true. There is Street access for Paris/Bally.......but it's on Audrie Street and is not clearly marked. I only found out when I saw people using the doors and spotted the ticket office inside.
Yes i absolutely HATE that monorail. And I did exactly you did trying to find the mgm monorail station. It’s stupid that it didn’t go down the center of Las Vegas blvd. Not only it’s hard to find you do a ton of walking just to get to a station
Hey, we were in Vegas at the same time! Lol. Was there because of a family emergency. The last couple of nights we stayed in Harrah's. We left Friday, so the first day of the draft.
Ok, so I used to drive for RTC. They have two bus yards and two different contractors running the buses. (There's three if you count the paratransit service) I drove for MV Transportation so I didn't get to drive the Strip buses.
RTC claims it doesn't have the money to run light rail or even street cars. I honestly think it's a combination of the taxi companies and the casinos not wanting it. I'm with you on the visual clutter of the OCS. It wouldn't block a damn thing. Plus I think having a light rail or Streetcar system, more people would ride it. They could've replaced the old SDX line with a Streetcar. But the line would turn East at Tropicana to Paradise and then South again to the airport. There's open property near the airport a people mover could be built to meet the light rail or Streetcar line. The empty lot on Trop just east of the MGM would be the lot for the rail vehicles.
The monorail in Vegas is a big joke, as you proved. One thing you left out, it closes at midnight. The one thing you did miss, because it was Draft Weekend, it runs empty when nothing is going on. I rode it during the week when I lived there. I freaking ghost town. I took the same trip you took. I was by myself except for one family that rode between intermediate stops. That's why it went bankrupt two times.
Love ya, CityNerd!
14:36 'Awkward pivot to taxi tunnels...' the politest way to describe the clusterfcuk that is the Vegas Loop.