Would Egypt Ever Record an Exodus
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- Опубликовано: 16 ноя 2024
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What is the Patterns Of Evidence Film Series?
Patterns of Evidence is a documentary film series that travels through the Bible, investigating evidence of its historical credibility, the accuracy of its transmission through the centuries, and how it impacts the modern world.
Timothy Mahoney is an award-winning investigative filmmaker, raised as a Christian, who now has the same question that many today are asking: Did the stories recorded in the Bible really happen?
In this film series, he sets off to seek answers by traveling to the locations where biblical events are said to have happened. Along the way, he interviews leading archaeologists and scholars from all over the world who argue all sides of the debate about the credibility of the Bible. The biblical stories are retold, accompanied by dramatic reenactments and special effects.
Patterns of Evidence lets the viewer draw their own conclusions as it takes them on a journey to the ancient world of the Bible. This refreshingly balanced approach is inspiring and intellectually challenging for both skeptics and believers alike, providing profound new evidence that affirms the Bible.
Thinking Man Films is the production company for the Patterns of Evidence film series and television programs. Thinking Man Media is the book publishing, curriculum development, and distribution company for Patterns of Evidence media.
-- Patterns of Evidence Films --
► "The Exodus" - Is the history found in the Bible credible? Is there any physical evidence to support the biblical story of the Exodus? An in-depth investigation by filmmaker Timothy Mahoney searches for answers to these questions amid startling new finds that match the Bible’s account of the Exodus from Egypt.
► "The Moses Controversy" - The film uncovers a new pattern of evidence that some believe link the Israelites to the world’s first alphabet. Was this a divine gift necessary for the Israelites to read the words given to Moses at Mt Sinai?
► "The Red Sea Miracle" - In this investigation Timothy Mahoney examines the journey to the crossing location, looking at two competing views of the Red Sea Miracle. The investigation raises giant questions about the real location for the crossing site and its implications on your view of God. The answers to these questions point to one of two very different realities.
► "The Red Sea Miracle II" - How could thousands of feet of water be parted at the Red Sea? Or was the sea merely parted by the act of wind in nature, through a shallow Egyptian lake? Mahoney investigates these locations to see if any have a pattern of evidence matching the Bible. This cinematic journey leads him to inquire… “Do miracles still happen today?”
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Living in a time with information conduits such as RUclips is absolutely amazing. I can just type in a question and receive immediate truth. What a time to be alive!
There are also a lot of lies
Immediate truth? LOL Most of what you Google is lies, you have to look for the truth hard!
@@missthunderstormablea lot of truth too. Lots of independent confirmation.
Well....."recieving" is right, but always getting the" Truth i" only so so on the Correct part. Bedt to go to old magazines or books Before 2000 or even 1990, to find Good information in this age if re-writing, re-defining and erasing. I have always loved old books, so I have lits for my grandkids to use!
@@Lodestarter
You can now make an informed decision based on the information you have.
Just like I believe that most of things in there is made up... Since all of church scholars haven’t prove that anything in bible actually happened in Egypt.
And, my sources are from... all these great African scholars who go to Egypt for 30+years can interpret what's inscribed on walls and decipher the hieroglyphics better that all the egyptologist who been there fro 40 years and to make it make since... with other sources of evidence.
These other egyptologist, most of the stuff they’re saying is based on what they value and trying to eat off black African culture.
Like what the US been doing on African American culture from about 150 years.
I believe it has been recorded actually, indirectly, in the listing of military campaigns of Thutmose III, his army seems to disappear towards the end of his reign, that would fit with the loss of the army in the Red Sea.
Check out Ahmose I. He "expelled" the Hyksos, and there was a rebuilding afterward...
Why not mention the ipuwer scroll? Oldest parchment found in Egypt and it talks about the worst days of Egypt and the Nile being turned to blood
If the Egyptians only mentioned good things. How do we know about the Hyksos?
@@maazi.naaniya9158 All it takes is one rogue Egyptian scribe. And the Ipuwer Papyrus does not say the disasters killed the pharaoh, and came from the God of the Israelites.
@@maazi.naaniya9158 the Pharoah of upper Egypt needed to justify conquering lower Egypt, so the records claimed that the Hyksos conquered the delta and oppressed Egyptians. The archeology suggests that there was a power vacuum and the Hyksos moved in, without conquering.
@@FLPhotoCatcher even the Bible doesn't claim the Pharoah was destroyed. His army with chariots yes, but nothing about him, although many have thought it did. A bit like Jonah's "Whale", which was recorded as a great fish, the whale is stuck in people's minds.
@@maazi.naaniya9158 🤺☦🇷🇺We know it from Manetho, not from Egyptian steles. Liaг, that's not what we say. We say Egyptians never mention certain defeats and humiliations, like the exodus! The fact that they expelled the hyksos and Cushites is good enough for them to mention them, but they never elaborated on their history and rulers, that is why we don't know who tf is Joseph's hyksos Pharaoh
Why did the ancient Egyptians never mention the Exodus? In order of likelihood:
1) It never happened.
2) If it did happen, the escape of a few of their slaves would have been a minor footnote in the long history of their great civilization.
Finally someone with common sense. I can't believe how this video is trying real hard to stay away from the truth.
That is a good theory, the question is how important were the slaves for them at that moment
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There were two pillars found on either side of the now purported Red Sea crossing. One is still there, but eroded by water. The Saudi gov took the other one that supposedly was raised by Solomon in remembrance of the crossing. There are also two tablets in Egypt that seems to talk about "wondering bedouins who worship YAWAY':1) at Soleb and 2)Amarah-west. There is also a papyrus that might describe the plagues called the Ipuwer Papyrus.
I don't remember reading about Solomon, going back to the site of the Red Sea crossing, generations later and raising pillars there. My knowledge of the Old Testament is is far from perfect. I'll go back and look.
@@surferdude4487 It's not in the Bible. Not a lot of artifacts aren't. I'm not saying its for sure; the one's the Saudis didn't take and it had eroded off.But look at the Joshua alter. It's an alter within alter. Or rather, it's and alter within a venerated structure. The people of Israel probably wanted to preserve the original alter and built a structure around it Like we build museums today. That's not in the Bible either, although it does say he did many works. Not every single thing in these peoples' lives are in the Bible. You have to put yourself there as if you were living there. That's what makes history exciting. They found a bulla there with Isaiah's name on it. We don't know if it was a letter to a king, priests etc. But it is exciting stuff.
@@Drakemiser There were pillars built where Isreal crossed the River Jordan. They used the Ark to stop the river so that they could cross on dry ground. That was with Joshua leading them.
@@surferdude4487 No the pillars were at the Red Sea, not the Jordon. Second, the Ark was something like 2 1/2 ft by 3 ft. It's not going to stop anything. God stopped the waters both times. And the Ark was the Holy seat of God. You think they'd dump it in the water? Have you seen the Jordon? I don't know here you got this information but it is Biblically, and textually wrong.
The alter was recorded at the Jordon. It is poetry that "God's foot stopped the Jordon for the Ark(and priests) to pass before Israel. But Solomon 100's of years later could've put these two pillars one on each side. People in the area had said the the pillar had Proto Hebrew on one while the other had fallen in the water. But the Saudis came and Tok the one with the writing still intact, It said something like I Solomon, a servant of God erect these pillars in honor of the Red Sea".And Mount Sinai is not where tradition says, but is in Arabia, as Paul noted in the NT at a site called Jabal al Lawz, Or as the locals know it Jabal al Musa(the Mountain of Moses). It fits the criteria written in the Bible 3,000 ears ago. But don'y trust me, look yup Jabal al Lawz yourself. You'll be amazed at the consistency. Also it is believed that they crossed the gulf of Aquaba, not the Suez. The train lines up perfectly with Exodus.
Did the Pharaoh go into the split Red Sea with his Army? Or did he wait behind and watch. If the Pharaoh led his Army through the sea, then he perished. If not, he returned to his Palace without his Army. The Pharaoh of the Exodus was not Rameses II. IMO. But before Rameses II.
Fair point, especially considering the losses from Passover meaning second, third born were among the pursuing army that got wiped out as well -- leaving Egypt in a rebuild stage while crossing Sinai and eventually the Jordan ... Makes one all the more curious what was lost at Alexandria or remains hidden in the likes of the Vatican vaults ....
@@robmerrill3460 It is claimed that Pharaoh ordered 20,000 Chariots to chase down the Israelites. Two men per Chariot equals 40,000 men. That had to be Pharaoh's entire Army. And Egypt having lost all their first born earlier. Passover protected the Israelites. I believe that was the reason for chasing down the Israelites in the desert. They were angry.
The pharaoh was not there , he sent the army to go after Moses upon the Red Sea it opened they walked though and when the army where passing the sea came crashing inn after .. pharaoh stood alive it was believed God wanted him to be a witness of what happened when his army didn't come back and got swallowed by the sea .. not by word of mouth but by the kings mouth that you didn't mess with God ( never again was there any other records in biblical history tht the Jews where slaves in a whole ) ..
Ramses II was pharao for 66 years and died at the age of 90. I dont think he was still leading armies at that age...
The exodus pharaoh was Amenhotep 2. On Expedition Bible's channel there is a video showing the timeline, and if you search youtube other videos tell about Amenhotep 2's later raid of Canaan and nearby places for a lot of slaves, presumably to replaced the Israelites who left.
Dynastic Egypt would have had no knowledge of the Exodus , as it happened to the Hyksos Pharaoh. Dynastic Pharaoh Ahmose would have only received word of the diminishment of Hyksos forces. Once the Biblical historians finally get their heads out of their butts, and place the Exodus where it should be in the Egyptian timeline,Circa 1550-40 BCE. Every contradiction will disappear and right narrative will totally make sense including that in both Leviticus and Deuteronomy, Moses reminds the Hebrews that when they were in need , that Egypt welcomed them!
The Hyksos were the Hebrews
@@korey15 there is archeological evidence, as well as paintings of a small migration into the Nile Delta Circa 1900’s BCE, of asiatics( Canaanites). There us no indication of advanced technology during this migration. The advanced technology of the spoked wheel chariot, horses and Tin/ Bronze weapons, occurs Circa 1760 BCE with the Hyksos incursion. While there were Canaanites included in this invasion, the technology came from north of the levant. Horses and chariots were developed in the Eurasian steppes. AndTin/ Bronze from south of the Caucasus mountains.
The Egyptian records along with archeological evidence indicate climate change and droughts ,one lasting between 5-10 years during the period of the1900’s BCE. Such a drought would be wide spread and a migration due to famine would not be unusual.
That his agrees with the Hebrew account of Jacob and Joseph and the migration into Egypt, the Hebrews cannot be considered as the Hyksos, as they did not reign or rule anything in Egypt as the Hyksos did.
@@walterulasinksi7031 just because there’s evidence of Asiatics entering the Nile delta does not mean that they were Hebrew. There is zero evidence that they were Hebrews, only religious people, connecting dots that are not there.
The Asiatic migrants who came in to Egypt, have as much a chance to be Hyksos as they do Hebrew. How do you know Hebrews didn’t rule in Egypt? Because they don’t mention it in the Bible? The Egyptian‘s don’t mention the presence of Hebrew slaves at all either , but you still believe they were. Why is the Hebrew record of events more reliable than the Egyptian?
Taking the Bible at face value, historically, like you do without any evidence is ridiculous. How do you know the Hebrews were telling the truth in their accounts? Why would the Egyptian’s slaughter and enslave children, unless those children were the remnants of a foreign invasion?
The Hebrews and Joshua went around killing and conquering after Moses died. They didn’t have a true homeland and they were shepards. That SOUNDS like the Hyksos to me and it just sound like you don’t want the Hebrews to be Hyksos.
@@korey15 While our knowledge is fragmentary, what we do have says the Hyksos were never slaves. Moreover, they never worked for Pharoah as Joseph did; we have no knowledge of that (at most Joseph _worked for_ the Hyksos and even that is not known from other sources).
For most of their rule, they controlled a part of Egypt and the regular Egyptian dynasties went on separately, albeit reduced in territory. They were driven out, to be sure, but the relationship doesn't fit what the Bible says because they left not as slaves, but as a defeated invader.
Whatever the Hyksos were, they are certainly not as described in the Bible. Moreover we have no independent archeological evidence of hundreds of thousands, let alone two million, people traversing the Sinai, a movement that would have left substantial traces if it lasted anything close to the 40 years in the Bible.
If the Hebrews were the Hyksos, then the biblical account is beyond weird. Why say you were slaves when you weren't? Why say you wandered in the desert when, at most (even this is not certain) you simply and expeditiously retreated through the Sinai after you lost that last battle? The only account we have of their retreat does not suggest a 40 year wandering and even that is not considered certain.
Usually when a ruler or general in ancient times had a battle the out come was exaggerated to make him look better than he or the battle really was.
Yep. But the battle was at least _mentioned_. Based on known lies in the Egyptian record, what one would expect to see is that the Exodus was mentioned, but as a gracious and generous act by Pharaoh. That a movement of two million people (see Numbers) went unremarked by Egypt or anyone else is kind of. . .remarkable.
Sop - if the losing side doesn't' talk about a loss.... but talks up the victories.... then the winning side must also be embellishing the result
You know what is the exact reason why Egyptians didnt include the Exodus in there walls. Because it can lead those things to there annihilation. Imagine Egypt was visited by Persians and Babylonians and other Kingdoms for a field trip ,then they saw that Egypt is not that Mighty anymore because of Exodus, they may attack or invade Egypt. In short Ancient Kingdoms will show how Mighty they are. Any weaknesses will be edited
But people at that time were good at keeping secrets. Another exemple: Jews established this invincible, god-powered, conquering kingdom that committed total righteous genocide, right in the heart of an Egyptian province, for many centuries and yet no known political entity of the time, no contemporary neighbour ever recorded it - they were too ashamed I guess.
🤣
They were attacked and they were defeated, and they were a vassal state for many years.
And that's exactly what happened when the Hyksos invaded.
@@phillipsmith387 The Hyksos did not invade - they were already there. They were secessionists more than invaders. Even Manetho (who hated them) admits there was no battle.
Family ! Fam . . . please HEAR me out here. I find the WHOLE idea that we are watching this video in 2023 imagining and ALL of us . . . are somehow conceiving "EGYPT" as if it was "a PERSON", a SINGLE PERSON or a SINGLE INDIVIDUAL with a SINGLE UNIFIED mind, such that Egypt was so UNITED in thought and purpose that ALL of its MILLIONS of PEOPLE, were mysteriously a SINGLE MIND/BRAIN and a SINGLE robotic person :((
This narrative is just terrifying to me . . . that ALL of us watching this video, are suddenly imagining Egypt as if it was just a SINGLE person :(( I am utterly disappointed. The fact that NONE of us can even conceive that the Israelites themselves, having been slaves in Egypt for . . . . 400 yearrrrs . . . . (being NONNN-Egyptians!) . . . COULD have SURRRRELY left LOTSSSS and LOTSSS of HIDDEN evidence buried in ENDLESS secret places under the ground and in (HIDDEN) stones ALLLL over the place, but ALL we can imagine . . . is that the word "Egypt" somehow simply refers to something we should visualize as "a SINGLE person".
I am disappointed family. 3 to 7 MILLLLION Anti-Egyptians leaving Egypt in such a monumental departure . . . are simply dismissed as "part and parcel of Egypt = a place where ALL humans in it . . . had a 100% UNITED robotic mind" 🙄🙄🤕🤕🤕
This is perhaps the LAZIEST form of GENERALIZATION i have EVERRR come across. Referring to MILLIONS of Non-Egyptian people with a statement saying "Egypt could NOT have inscribed or recorded ANYYYTHING at all on stones becuz it was FORBIDDEN by Egypt itself" . . . is loaded with a HUUUUUGE amount of irrational generalization :((
How would you feel if i told ALL of you that . . . "Egypt could NOTTT have allowed the STORRRY about Slavery, or any evidence thereof, to be KNOWN by any foreign nations or to be TOLD to any foreign nations, becuz such a forbidden thing (telling foreign nations BAD stories about Egypt) would have been something TOTALLY AGAINST the Pharaoh's wishes" 🙄🙄🙄 🤔🤔🤔🤔
as Christians, we REMAIN DUTY BOUND to diggg up ALL the soil if we HAVE to, and FIND that evidence, period !! People have brought forth bizarre things such as bones of dinosaurs dating back to 500 million years ago and placed them BEFORE our eyes without ANY FAITH on their part necessary for them TO DO SO, and here we are . . . continuing to make excuses for a COMPLETE ABSENCE of even petty EVIDENCE of what SHOULLLD HAVE been an EXTREMELY dramatic, monumental and IMPOSSIBLE-to-OBLITERATE event. We cannot afford to gamble the lives and hopes of 1.2 billion Christians on such a conjecture 😮💨🤥🤥.
The next question or the question that maybe should have been asked is...."is there Egyptian archaelogical evidence of the Hebrews being enslaved?"
Nope.
probably no, not even Moses have mention, power of Man's oldest skill EDITING
Yes there is, watch the Exodus by Simcha Yakavovich he shows the Egyptian hieroglyphs of enslavement during that documentary and also hieroglyphs of the Exodus itself at about an hour an 8 minutes through.
There is evidence that Hebrew slaves lived in ancient Egypt. For example, the Papyrus Brooklyn 35.1446 is a seven-foot-long document dated 1809-1743 BC that provides Egyptian proof of Hebrew slaves in that nation during the time of Jacob . Additionally, on blocks of stone found on the Sinai Peninsula, there are carvings that resemble the Hebrew script - they are quite different from the hieroglyphs of the Egyptians.
Another piece of evidence is the blocks of stone found on the Sinai Peninsula that contain carvings resembling Hebrew script. These carvings are quite different from the hieroglyphs of the Egyptians and provide evidence of an independent culture. Several historians believe that the images carved in the stone prove that these people were the slaves of the Egyptians .
While there is no direct evidence that people worshipping Yahweh sojourned in ancient Egypt, let alone during the time the Exodus is believed to have happened, there are many other pieces of evidence suggesting the presence of Hebrew-like names in ancient Egypt.
And how do we know the Hyksos took Egypt and ruled over it? Sounds like the Egyptians recorded that humiliation.
What is strage for me is the fact that in Egypt at that time should have been ambassadors, merchants and visitors front foreign countries (Babylon, Assyria, Hitite Empire, Crete etc) and no one mentioned the plagues and the destruction of the pharaoh's army.
I forget the YT channel on Biblical subjects but I recently saw a vid regarding a discovered papyrus upon which a poet who lived around-to-shortly-after the time of the exodus had written a poem which, in fact, poetically described the plagues wrought upon Egypt! (I recall - without full confidence of my exactitude - a comment from Jacque Cousteau, "Fragment [of pottery, household utensils, toys, etc] tell us more about a culture than tombs of kings." Yep. Kings and queens have their staff PR folk. The common folk have reality.
All moses the prince of the desert wanted was for Pharoah to let his people go
Would Yahweh lead his chosen people in circles through the desert for forty years to reach the promised land 250 miles away?
Where was the food and water in the desert to keep alive the million men women and children and their flocks of sheep and goats?
Intelligent thinking adults who understand reality would like to know.
Are there any Egyptian records of the Prince of Egypt aka Moses going out regularly on his war adventures on behalf of his favorite Pharaoh ?
Would Egyptians glyph all over their massive walls all those amazing victories over other peoples Moses accomplished for his beloved Pharaoh ?
@@krishnaabreakingnews would the Egyptians eliminate any victories from there walls concerning their new enemy Moses?
@@marcusmuse4787 allegedly, when god man Moses had a change of heart and switched sides to fight and kill for in the name of some other god, (during his 40s I think,) there were no more Egyptian victories.
When Moses was an Egyptian Prince his name would probably have been Thutmoses.
(09 December 2023)
My understanding on the date for the Exodus?
IT IS A CONFLATION OF EVENTS SPANNING A PERIOD OF TIME FROM CIRCA 5000 BC (Neolithic Times) to Late Iron Age II Times, circa the 6th century BC.
(1) The Neolithic settlement (5000 BC) on the plain Er-Raha, in the shadow of Ras Safsafeh (discovered in the late 1980s), miss-dated 1446 BC by the Iron Age II Israelites and it was miss-identified as being Moses' settlement. Ras Safsafeh being Mount Sinai/Horeb
(2) Early Bronze Age II settlements, ca. 2300 BC like Ai (Et_Tell, and Arad). miss-dated 1446 BC by the Iron Age II Israelites.
(2) A recasting of the Hyksos Expulsion of circa 1530 BC, as noted by Professor Donald Bruce Redford (an Egyptologist).
(3) The sudden appearance of Iron Age I settlements on both sides of the Jordan River (circa 1200-1100 BC), miss-dated 1446 BC by the Iron Age II Israelites (cf. 1 Kings 6:1).
(4) Late Iron Age II Settlements (ca. the 7th/6th centuries BC) in Edom, Moab, and Ammon, as noted by Dr. Burton MacDonald.
**THE ELUSIVE KEY* I STUMBLED UPON, TO *UNSCRAMBLE* THE EXODUS DATE?
My "Ah-ha moment" came when I read the diary of a Christian Pilgrimess called Egeria (4th century AD).
Her Christian guides, pointed out to her stone circles in the valley approach to Mount Sinai (today's Gebel Musa for some).
Her guides said the large stone circles were the remains of hut foundations built by Moses' Israelites over the year spent at Mt. Sinai.
Archaeologists have excavated some of these stone circles and determined Egeria's Christian Guides were WRONG, the pottery debris associated with the stone circles was that of Early Bronze Age II Times, ca. 2300 BC, not 1446 BC, not 1260 BC.
I came to realize that IF EGERIA"S GUIDES HAD MISDATED THESE STONE CIRCLES WHY NOT THE IRON AGE II ISRAELITES?
No one knew the age of any ancient site or artifact until Sir Flinders Petrie of England developed by 1890 AD Pottery Typologies to date sites and artifacts by!
An ancient Iron Age Israelite would not be able to tell the difference between a Neolithic sherd and a Late Bronze Age Sherd, as to when it had been made!
***It is my assumption that the Iron Age Israelites who composed the Exodus account MISS-DATED EVERY ARTIFACT AND SITE IN THE SINAI AND NEGEV, AS CIRCA 1446-1406 BC, the World of Moses, according to 1 Kings 6:1.***
Ask any Iron Age Israelite (1200-562 BC) to show you the "physical proof" of Israel's presence in the Sinai and Negeb and he probably would have shown you the hundreds of stone circle nomadic goat-herder camps (camps from Neolithic to Iron Age Times).
WHY did the archaeologists FAIL to find Mount Sinai?
They were looking in the WRONG ERA!
Either 1446-1406 BC (based on 1 Kings 6:1) or 1260 BC and the world of Ramesses II, ca. 1260 BC, neither of which, could be found!
The archaeologists reported back that there was no archaeological evidence of Moses and Israel for those two dates.
***These archaeologists had failed to realize the Iron Age Israelites had no way to properly date any site or any artifact.***
Accordingly, my research has identified Mt. Sinai, and the remains of the Ten Commandments, and the Golden Calf, but not by searching for artifacts of either 1446-1406 BC or 1260 BC!
If interested in my findings, google my papers posted at "Academia Profile, Walter R. Mattfeld."
For me, the archaeologists FOUND MOSES' SHATTERED TEN COMMANDMENTS, BUT WERE UNAWARE THEY HAD DONE SO!
TODAY THE TEN COMMADMENTS REST IN A EGYPTIAN MUSEUM, THE CURATORS UNAWARE OF WHAT THEY HAVE!
MOSES' NAME ALSO HAS BEEN FOUND IN THE SOUTHERN SINAI, IN THE AREA OF THE TEN COMMANDMENTS AND GOLDEN CALF!
Egyptian chariots have been found on the place where the Israelites are supposed to have crossed the " red sea" .
Have these relicts been dated by magnetic or any other modern datation technique ? Has the provenience of the wood used to build these charriots (Lebanon ? Holywood ?) been
en determined ?
So good, thank you!
I still believe the Exodus story is somehow connected with Prince Ahmose leading the remaining followers of Aten out of Egypt after the death of Akhenaten. I know the accepted timelines do not match by quite a bit, but the parallels are so compelling. This is probably also mixed up with stories from the expulsion of the Hyksos.
Feros would have read the inscriptions of the ancestors and read about how great there were how Brave and Victorious they were when you see a statue of someone you automatically think that person must have achieve something great the Egyptians inscriptions would have been about bursting about their stature
The question is IF ancient Egypt was the powerful United States of ancient times, and then the slaves of Israel left, the Egyptian army was lost (in the gulf of Aqaba) with no record? BUT their is also no record of HOW or WHY this world power fell from power. Historically Egypt suddenly lost all it's influence, power. WHY? HOW? Points to the biblical records when no other records of this sudden fall from power is available.
"the Israelites were never in Egypt, did not wander in the desert, did not conquer the land in a military campaign and did not pass it on to the 12 tribes of Israel. Perhaps even harder to swallow is the fact that the united monarchy of David and Solomon, which is described by the Bible as a regional power, was at most a small tribal kingdom. And it will come as an unpleasant shock to many that the god of Israel, Jehovah, had a female consort and that the early Israelite religion adopted monotheism only in the waning period of the monarchy and not at Mount Sinai". - Ze'ev Herzog professor of archaeology at The Department of Archaeology and Ancient Near Eastern Cultures at Tel Aviv University specializing in social archaeology, ancient architecture and field archaeology.
The last pyramid was built in 4000 BCE and Abraham was born in 1000 BCE, that's 3000 years difference between both timeline and Israel was not even born.
IMO, the pyramids and the sphynx were built long before the time of Jacob. That has nothing to do with the captivity of Isreal or the exodus.
@@surferdude4487 The Israelites were never slave in Egypt. The hieroglyphics that you saw was the Nubians working around 2000-2050 BCE. The Egyptian captured the Nubians in battle, it wasn't Israelites.
@@EJLegionHonor All I'm saying is that Isreal had nothing to do with the building of the pyramids because that happened before the great flood.
Professor Donald B. Redford, a world renown Egyptologist, in 1992, identified the Bible's Exodus as a recasting of the Hyksos Expulsion of circa 1530 BC.
Redford (pp. 412-413, and p. 410):
"Despite the lateness and unreliability of the story in Exodus, no one can not deny that the tradition of Israel's coming out of Egypt was one of long standing...There is only one chain of historical events that can accommodate this late tradition, and that is the Hyksos descent and occupation of Egypt (see chapter 5). The memory of this major event in the history of the Levant survived not only in Egyptian sources. It would be strange indeed if the West Semitic speaking population of Palestine, whence the invaders had come in MB IIB, had not also preserved in their folk memory this great moment of (for them) glory. And it is in the Exodus account that we are confronted with the "Canaanite" version of this event...In sum, therefore, we may state that the memory of the Hyksos expulsion did indeed live on in the folklore of the Canaanite population of the southern Levant."
Redford suggests the Exodus account appearing in the Bible is of the Egyptian Saite Period in terms of its Egyptian geography being the best match:
"Whoever supplied the geographical information that now adorns the story had no information earlier than the Saite period (seventh to sixth centuries B.C.)... He felt constrained to supply them from the Egypt of his own day and, significantly perhaps, cited several places where Asiatic elements and especially Judaean mercenaries resided in the sixth and fifth centuries."
(cf. Donald B. Redford. 1992. _Egypt, Canaan, and Israel in Ancient Times._ Princeton University Press)
Redford suggests the Exodus account may have been penned in Post-Exilic times, circa 440 BC.
I, myself, have dated the penning of the Exodus to circa 562-560 BC based on 2 Kings 25:27 mention of the Babylonian monarch, Evil Merodach, who reigned circa 562-560 BC according to Cuneiform records.
Regards,
Walter R. Mattfeld (23 June 2023)
You’re right, defeats weren’t recorded back then. That’s why the Israelites never recorded their defeats to Shishaq, the Philistines, Sennacherib, Neco, Nebuchadnezzar, Alexander, the Romans…yep, unheard of.
They might describe it as driving out occupiers. Pharao Ahmoses fought them and negotiated their leave and later destroyed some of their fortresses in the levante, one near today Gaza.
The papyrus Ipuwer describes the plagues that preceded the Hebrew exodus.
Professor Weeks notes it s unlikely the Egyptians would record a defeat. This opinion is also shared by Professor Kitchen.
BUT WHAT ABOUT THE EGYPTIANS RECORDING A VICTORY OVER AN ENEMY FORCE?
The Bible informs us that Pharaoh, with a strong hand, is to drive the Hebrews out of Egypt:
Exodus 11:1 and RSV
"Pharaoh...will drive you away completely...the Egyptians were urgent with the people, to send them out of the land of Egypt...
Exodus 11:1 KJV
"...Pharaoh...shall surly thrust you out hence altogether."
Exodus 11:1 RSV Collins
"...Pharaoh...will drive you away..."
Pharaoh's "DRIVING AWAY" sounds to me like a military victory in which Pharaoh drives away enemy Asiatics in Egypt known as the Hyksos!
The Bible tells us, AFTER Israel has left Egypt, and is on her way to Canaan, Pharaoh changes his mind and pursues after Israel.
This, for me, recalls Pharaoh Ahmoses I changing his mind and pursuing after the Hyksos, whom he had expelled from Egypt.
The Bible acknowledges a battle between Egyptian forces and Israel, after leaving Egypt.
Ahmoses I army catches up with the HYksos at a site called Sharuhen, near Gaza and engages them in battle.
All these parallels, in Egyptian records, is proof for me that Egypt did record the Exodus from Egypt by Israel, but as a victory for Egypt over the Hyksos.
The Bible is apparently refuting the Egyptian account of what was behind the Exodus.
So, it is nonsense to claim Egypt has the no record of the Exodus, it does, as the Hyksos Expulsion.
Here in Israel and outside of Israel, even the most non-religious Jews will at the least, celebrete Passover, we wouldn't dream of not celebrating and retelling the story every single year
Whatever Japheth
I have suspected this for a long time. Pride is a you know what
Why is an exedus counted as a defeat?
People were from time to time going in and out of Egypt, why would they note it down.
An interesting read is Profsr. Colin Humpfreys book "The Miracles of Exodus"at yr local library. JN
What about the defeats by other nations or by other groups of nations in war? For instance, Babylon, or Assyria, or Philistines (Sea Peoples)? How much written evidence is there for these defeats in Egyptian hieroglyphs?
The Egyptians did not write about the Exodus or their defeat are there surrounding countries that wrote about the Exodus?
Are there any Egyptian records of the Jews arriving there and their eventual fall into slavery? I understand not documenting the exodus but the Jews arrival and subjugation would seem to be events that the Egyptians would have documented 1) for their "magnanimous" generosity and 2) their power over perceived enemies.
There's lots of evidence but how annoying the Egyptians didn't write about it. I wonder if someone did in a cave or something during the exodus.
There’s zero evidence. The Hyksos were the Hebrews
Pharaonic Egypt were propagandist of course they would not inscribed on the walls
How about a record of the first born dying? You would think that would've been documented somewhere outside the Bible.
You think the Pharaoh would admit vulnerability like that to the world?
How many other failings or short comings did Egypt record.
Point is that wich temple would glorify another God's victory.
It was recorded in Babylon the igigi revolted against Enlil and it more likely they were Pre-israliites tribes that revolted against a human king who was a self proclaimed god king.
There's allot of evidence of the exodus in Babylon perhaps because it didn't really happen in Egypt.
It is possible that over time it was forgotten and Egyot somehow became the focus.
Exodus means mass departure! 2nd book of the bible Which recounts the departure of the Israelites from slavery in Egypt! has to be after the fall of the bronze age, when the Egyptian and the whole mediterranean went into a complete tale spin of crash and burn, That's the only time that Israel was free from Egyptian rule
Hi. I just want to stress that exodus did happen but not in egypt that we know today.. but it s in misrayem which refers to misr in arabic and this kingdom is located in western Sinai..
Dont get fooled by archeogists.. exodus is real but you are looking at the wrong place.. check where is Avaris the capital city of the kingdom of jews
This is a great explanation as far as the origin of the Jacobites, but there were several Exodus of Semitics out of Egypt, some forced. The Torah stories appropriate quite a few other traditions from different cultures and stories.
Seeking Ma'at is a great idea.
No they wouldn't,it would declare their own defeat,a prideful group as they were,would have kept the event secret.for sure.
They don't want you to know this
(19 September 2023, 05:10 p.m.)
In this video the question is posed by Tim Mahoney:
"Did the Egyptians ever make mention of defeats by their enemies?"
The answer given is "No!"
This, simply, is not true!
The female Pharaoh, Hatshepsut, makes a passing reference to the Hyksos, despoiling Egypt, showing no regard for Egyptian gods and desecrating Egyptian Temples, and oppressing native Egyptians.
All this seems to be an Egyptian admission, from Hatshepsut, that the Hyksos enemies were running rough-shod over a helpless Egypt, until defeated and run out of the land by Pharaoh Ahmoses I, founder of the Egyptian 18th Dynasty.
Professor Donald B. Redford (A world renown Egyptologist) is of the understanding that the Hyksos Expulsion was recast as Israel's Exodus under Moses, as was noted in my previous comment of 2 months ago (23 June 2023).
I note several parallels between the Hyksos Expulsion and the Biblical Exodus:
(1) Pharaoh Ahmoses I _expels_ the Hyksos from Avaris circa 1530 BC.
(2) In the Bible, Pharaoh _expels_ the Israelites, after the death of Egypt's first born, fearing more deaths.
(3) After the Hyksos have left Egypt, having crossed the Sinai to settle in Canaan, Ahmoses I pursues after them.
(4) The Bible has Pharaoh pursuing after Israel has left Egypt, headed for Canaan.
(5) Ahmoses I engages the Hyksos in war at a location called Sharuhen, in Canaan.
(6) The Bible has Pharaoh, engaging in a battle, Israel, near a location called the wilderness of Shur.
(7) Ahmose I praises his gods for helping him expel the Hyksos, and defeating them after they have left Egypt.
(8) Israel praises its God for defeating Pharaoh near the Sinai Wilderness, after leaving Egypt.
_It looks to me like the author of the Exodus has employed a series of inversions, turning the Egyptian account upside down and inside out!_
This suggests for me, that the Jewish historian, Flavius Josephus, in his first Century AD _History of the Jews,_ has correctly observed that Manetho's 3rd Century BC account of the Hyksos Expulsion is the Egyptian version of the Torah's Exodus.
Whereas the biblical account has the expelled ones being portrayed as fearful, cowardly slaves, ready to flee back to Egypt rather than face in war the Philistines, the Egyptian account has the expelled ones as ferocious, battle-hardened warriors, bent on destroying a native ruled Egypt, and dividing Egypt up with their Cushite allies, thus ending all native rule over Egypt.
All this suggests to me, _another inversion_ by the Exodus' author, turning the Egyptian account upside down and inside out.
Redford is outdated.
Please explain WHY he is oudated?@@blusheep2
@@WalterRMattfeld Lets start with the fact that his book was copyrighted in 1992. Thats 30 years ago.
Show me what exactly is flasified information since 1992 regarding the Hyksos and his claim they have been recast as Israel in the Exodus.@@blusheep2
You're quite an evasive squirrel aren't you? I suspect you have never read Redford's book, have you?@@blusheep2
Israel does record defeats and shortcomings.
Look at other cultures, though. How much written, or chiseled evidence is there of colossal defeats? Rome won its 100-year war against Carthage and guess who wrote that history? Rome, or Roman sympathizers. Josephus was also a documenter of the Jewish Wars. Would he have made Rome out to be the worst possible thing? That is not how he wrote about Rome. So, history is written down by the victors, not the vanquished. That has been the way throughout history until relatively recently in historical times.
I wouldn’t
nobody returned home.
Yes
It’s called patterns of evidence because when you gather all the data there is an overall picture of history that emerges.
All the people picking apart little things and asserting their presuppositions is laughable. If you watch the whole movie, the patterns of evidence are overwhelming.
The shrine a el-arish...
The stupidest mistake people make is to take the writing of ancient nomadic hateful bedouins' as a history book!.
Yep, and interpret every piece of ancient art or story as something literal
yep. And interpret every piece of ancient story or art as literal
yep. And interpret every piece of ancient story or art as literal
The official Egyptian written account would definitely not reveal the actual account of Exodus. Egyptian historical accounts were purposely exaggerated and any accounts that were not complimentary to Egypt's exploits and accomplishments were fictitiously supplemented. They lied. Rameses the 2nd account of the war with the Hitites is an example. According to the official record Rameses himself singlehandedly defeated the Hitites when in reality Rameses barely escaped being killed or captured being to far in the advance against the Egyptian army which quickly advanced from the rear saving Rameses butt. It ended in a standoff with no clear victory and a mutual peace treaty that ended hostilities. The Egyptian hieroglyphs always saved face. Good to know when reading the Egyptian version. They were master propagandists that the common Egyptian knew at the time. The real events of the Exodus would never be admitted to. The communist are the modern day equivalent. They never lost a battle, the state invented everything, and all other non-communist governments are corrupt and decadent. America is in the midst of this corrupt revisionist account of psuedo truth currently. There's the facts and the truth and then there's the agenda driven lies by the Democrats. So what does that mean for Americans who believe the democrats and the MSM? Your either stupid or corrupt. LOL
All true, at least about Ramses. But it means that if the exodus happened, what we should expect to see is the Pharoah in question graciously consenting to let them go after faithful service. Or, something of that sort.
We also see a certain amount of censorship where later rulers take cudgels to prior hieroglyphs they didn't like. This reminds us that they were not writing all this for our benefit, but for their own. Despite widespread illiteracy, there apparently was enough literacy that they had to say "something" to their own contemporaries to explain current events. The departure of what the Bible says were two million people (800, 000 warriors in Numbers) would seem to have required some sort of propaganda, not silence.
@@curious968 Silence is a form of propaganda. By ignoring and pretending it never happened. Removing the records of the only known gueen that ruled Egypt was erased but they missed some the evidence. There's a documentary called PATTERNS OF EVIDENCE that moves the Exodus to an earlier more appropriate Pharaoh that fits well with the timeline of the Old Testament chronology. It's amazing how little is known of real history. Several large important civilizations have been revealed, some recently. Egyptian history has large gaps and important missing details of what little is known. I'm old and one thing I've learned is academia and experts to often give the impression they are all knowing. This does not mean I discard evidence or discovery but maintain a healthy skepticism. Skepticism is is an important tenet where all knowledge is open to questioning and testing. Ofcourse this excludes flat earth type of nonsense. This is not narcissistic but most of the population chose to be stupid. It is one of those conditions I list as "part of the human condition." I'm not being argumentative or trolling so take no offense.
The Egyptians would not have kept a record of such a humiliating defeat. When did the Egyptians people ever record any defeat or destruction from an enemy?
The battle of Kadesh for one. They simply lied about the outcome. This is now confirmed by Hittite records, though it was long suspected. A few scholar apparently think it was a draw, but it was certainly not the smashing victory that Ramses bragged about and the Hittites got pretty favorable terms in the end.
May some of the story in the bible was base in true events But some were Not true
The history does record the fall of Egypt.
One little possibility is that the numbers involved in the Exodus and the military pursuit were quite small. For that matter, maybe the Egyptian forces didn't drown in the Red Sea. Maybe they just reached impassable territory or the border of the territory they could operate and quit.
Archaeologists have said, you could not have that huge number of people wandering around for 40 years and see no surviving traces of their once presence. Many possibilities. Perhaps many tried to leave and most either turned back or got turned back. Maybe many were offered the chance to leave and most turned it down. The event as described could not have involved as many people as is claimed. A force the size of company chasing 5000 at the most is the plausible limit.
'Mses. Pharoah of the Hyksos.
Much like the politics of today.
Some simply won't admit defeat despite all the evidence against them.
Thanks so much for your videos. I just subscribed. Amazing how much fake news there was- even back then. I guess they will be caught a little off guard when Moses or his shadow shows up as one of the 2 Witnesses in the Tribulation 😂.
I believe the other witness will be Elijah. What you think?
@@Coronaboii88 I agree. I think the other one will be a very much like Elijah. They were in the Transfiguration and Malachi 4:5-6 says Elijah that will turn the hearts of the children to their fathers. Many people think the part that John the Baptist fulfilled from verse 6 was “And he shall turn the heart of the fathers to their children “ but not the reverse.
So far the Lord hasn’t brought anybody back from the dead though. I have been studying typology of the 2 witnesses for about a year now and recently the Lord has led me into a deep dive into the Book of Song of Solomon. I think there is a lot to do with end times prophecy in this short book, not to mention a foreshadowing of the final Antichrist in King Solomon.
For instance, Ca 8: 11-12 reads
Solomon had a vineyard at Baal- hamon; he let it out to keepers; every one for the fruit thereof was to bring a thousand pieces of silver.
My vineyard, which is mine, is before me: thou, O Solomon, must have a thousand, and those that keep the fruit thereof two hundred.
These verses remind me of Balenciaga ads and the Book of Revelation and guilotines. I figure if we are in the last days and we haven’t used this one yet then we should maybe some of us be studying it too.
Shalom to you
@@Coronaboii88 I left a really long comment about this subject on rapture hourly watch channel’s last video mentioning the 2 witnesses if you are interested. Hope it blesses you.
@@meganpurcell8781 what an interesting take. We are definitely in the End Times for sure. I will definitely check out your recent comments and appreciate the reply. God bless you 🙏🏽
@@Coronaboii88 The Lord’s richest blessings to you brother. Thank you for responding to my comment. Much love to you
An emphatic NO! The Egyptians would never have recorded the real story. They were only interested in glorifying the gods and the Pharaoh, not an Exodus of a million or more Hebrew (Habiru) slaves who spoiled Egypt with their booty of gold and silver and precious art and grain.
So much has been lost, thousands of papyrus scrolls. But definitely not, the Egyptians would never admit defeat.
You cannot record something that never happened
Why are you showing Europeans who converted to the Israelite faith with this video for ?
The ancient Israelite people would have been black descendants of Shem. Europeans descend from Japheth. Genesis 10.
We know what Mesopotamians looked like. They were descendants of one.
Is there mention of Joseph?
Stop hiding the evidence.
No, because it never happened.
if you believe it happened produce evidence
Pottery, artifacts, clothing, bodies.
The Egyptians could not erase 17 years of Akhenaten 1351-1334 BCE so how could they erase 400 Hebrew years.
Yup
Amazing how exodus plagues matches up with Revelation.
@@colenewaltersmusicandother9330 imagine how fairy tales match up with the bible
The Hebrews were only in Egypt about 210 years, and the actual enslavement probably lasted less than 100 years!
@@chodeshadar18 No, sory to burst your bubble they were never in Egypt.
Opinion...opinion...opinion...
The gaslighting in this video is unbelievable.
Maybe they were not mentioned because it never happened. That's what Ze'ev Herzog said.
Is this program about history or about forcing a biblical story on the Egyptians? Al the so called “ experts “ repeat the same mantra “ the Egyptians would not mention their defeat”. Are this scientists or storytellers! In the whole artefacts found in Egypt , there is not 1 mention of Moses, not 1 mention of Pharaoh , not one mention of Jews or Israelites or Hebrews! They stayed as the Bible says centuries in Egypt ( came in as a group of 70 persons and left as a group of 2 million persons)! Do the maths!
There's nothing there stop trying
To create a fantasy
Zeus There's found warships places but concluded is mythology
GOD destroyed their armies, their gods, and even got Egyptians to pay the chosen to please leave! Why in the world would they ever record that.
Why in the world would they describe the failure at Kadesh? But, they did record it. They simply lied about the battle's outcome (something that, by the way, was long suspected before we found the Hittite records at last in the 20th century).
They would have found a way to lie about the Exodus and make it look like Pharoah's generosity or some such.
The departure of 2 million would have been noticed by their own people and by anyone else in the region. That creates a lot of pressure to come up with an official account, even if it is lies end to end.
Egypt might not record such a thing, if it ever happened, but their enemies would. Funny how they didn't.
Tzitzit
Akhenaten just up and changes Egypt from a polytheistic to a monotheistic culture out of no where, and it just so happens to be during Moses time🤔! The reason the Egyptians didn’t record it is because God decimated Egypt! That’s why.
He still worshipped the sun 🌞 your god is a 🌋
@@maazi.naaniya9158 He probably misinterpreted the Israelites! The Bible says that the gospel was preached to Abraham, which precedes this time period. When he heard the part about Jesus being the son of God, he thought it was the literal sun. Of course that’s just a guess
Or it never happened
@@johnharrison5656 And, like many guesses, it is simply wrong. Egypt had its own history and culture. It did not take instruction from what was then nomadic tribes by the Bible's own description. Moreover, it is very clear that Akhenaten's monotheism was not accepted by the priesthood and very likely not by the people. The Armana period is fascinating, but it is not the story of a successful religious revolution and it is not the story of Israelite customs being adopted by a pharaoh. It is the story of one king's revolt against his own people's gods and his subsequent destruction by what we would today call "counter-revolutionaries."
And sorry, nobody back then was talking about Jesus as the son of god. That revelation was yet to come.
The Egyptians were propaganda miesters.. You're never gonna see an Egyptian defeat recorded on the great temples and other surviving murals...They even recorded"the Great Victory" of Ramses over the Hittites at Kadesh ... The Hittites also recorded the battle as a near thing for the defeat and capture of the Egyptian Pharaoh... Ramses in his arrogance nearly rode into an ambush...😂
history includes only victorious and they where defeated by the israelites...
Op ops
YOU cannot record something that never happened.