LDS Missions & The Toll They Take
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- Опубликовано: 12 сен 2024
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My heart goes out to all the former missionaries who had experiences like these 💔 Wishing the best for you going forward!
Exmo Lex you are performing a great service to those that have been so negatively effected from the stress of a mission. It is so sad that the Mormon Church is so hypocritical and negative, but you are doing a wonderful service to recognize the pain and suffering from their involvement. I have been out for over forty years and have never never never ever regretted it. Keep up the great work!
John D. Lee you are a moron that likely laps up that mormon shit, at least that is what your name suggests. John D Lee was the only man to pay the ultimate price for the Mountains Meadows Massacre that the Mormons perpetrated on the wagon train from the Midwest. Mormons dressed up as Indians and murdered something like 83 people including children. Wow, it is truly wondrous how your parents picked such a perfect name for an asshole like you. When you lie to people and then you’re found out, then you really pay the price of those lies. Mormons, and the Mormon Church lies on a daily basis and hides the truth. Just like Brigham Young did when he allowed John D Lee, who had been sealed to Brigham as a son, to take the bullet instead of him fessing up to the truth that he knew about the massacre all along. Now, go fuck yourself...
Great video. Heartbreaking. I'm glad you used my picture. I had the broken arm. The next day I went tracting in cold weather and went into shock at a members house. Serving a mission was absolute misery for me. What a waste of time and money.
When young Mormons knock on my door - #1 I remember how _I felt_ when I went door to door witnessing (not as a Mormon or JW). #2 I always invite them in and try to be as kind and polite as I can be. Why?? Because I recognize that they are so very young, that I expect many of them have never been away from home for more than a week or two before. That they are at an age when their brain functions (frontal lobe) have not fully developed and therefore, what they are saying generally goes with their age and what their family taught them to say. When I was young, I put a lot more stock in the power of emotions than I do now. For me, Love is not a "feeling" - it's a commitment - it's being there when it is the hard choice, not the warm fuzzy one. I enjoy the warm fuzzy feeling greatly, and I know it is a product of 'love' - but it isn't love per se.
Also, I try to be nice to the missionaries so I can, perhaps, give them pause the next time someone tells them how atheists "act" and "think" - that some of us are the little grey haired grandma type that bake cookies and do needle work - that we say things like "please" and "thank you."
A side benefit, the more time they spend with me is less time for them to influence my neighbors. You never know when you ask a question if it will resonate, and become something that the missionary puts on a shelf, that perhaps 10 years later they take down and re-examine as they think through _why_ they believe what they believe.
This gives me a heart for missionaries, compared to simply wanting to prove their religion wrong. Great video, thank you!
To this day, I still can't go into a church building because of the PTSD of my mission
Would you get ptsd from a stint on survivor? I always laugh when the families come out and they all start crying. Try 2 years 4 phone calls, whats survivor 30 days, ridiculous. Our ancestors must be turning in their graves . PTSD lol, I have had as have many that occasional dream where you have to go out again now thats scary! Lol. To this day i swear i served longer then 2 years because of the dreams. That said best 2 years of my life and all i ate was rice! 🤐
@@six1nyne wtf are you trying to say??? I am so confused. What does survivor have to do with anything??
@@cottoncandy3630 the comment made me think about cry babies which made think about survivor crybabies who flip out on the family visit episode. Like they been away from their families soooooo long shows like a month long. Then this fool talking about ptsd from his mish. In my experience the ones who struggle on their mission are the ones who dont unpack their suitcases, dont follow mission rules and question the missionary program. They usually dont mesh well with others who know why they are out their and struggle. Its very simple lose yourself in the work and if you got ptsd ask the great physician for healing. But most these elders or sisters cant see past they nose in most cases. jomo. 😢
@@six1nyne ah, I see. What you fail to realize my dude is that nobody is the same. Just because you were not affected on your mission does not mean that many other faithful missionaries were not. Hours of doors slammed in your face, curses and rejections are wayy more than enough to give an individual PTSD. If you don't believe me, ask any certified psychologist. It is also really insensitive to claim that it can be taken away at any second. If that was the case, then no mormon or christian would ever suffer from, well, anything. But that's not realistic. Just because you do not understand another individuals problems does not mean they do not exist.
@@cottoncandy3630 i never implied it could be taken away in a second i merely meant if the people in question worked at enjoying the mission and the work which involves numerous door slams, praying, and heavy reliance on the lord then they would be able to work through their fears and mostly what I saw was people unwilling to do the little things to start them on that path.
You do such good work. Sometimes the BEST thing anyone can hear is "I understand." "You don't have to suffer needlessly." And "You're not going to 'hell' if you just be yourself." I bet someone will see this and turn their life around. You may end up saving someone's life. And that's a great thing. Thank you for being a catalyst for good! You rock.
I was thinking about this just last night, how the gospel places so much emphasis on agency and freedom, yet the being a missionary is the antithesis of this. It is a good example of how the church is in direct contradiction with itself. Every aspect of your life is controlled and monitored as a missionary.
to hear the the pressure that the leaders place on young men to go on missions see this clip from Elder Holland at a youth fireside. It makes me sad. ruclips.net/video/xqSZMBjX8nw/видео.html
On the mission that which is not mandatory is forbidden.
John D Lee i wouldn't take teens in the first place. I certainly wouldn't compel them to go with insanely high social pressure and them treat them like they have a disease and shunning them if they didn't go or heaven forbid they come home early.
Very sad,such a cult. I can see how this was ripping at your heart but know you are doing the right thing revealing these things. ♥️
Worse than that.
The bottom of Exmo`s hair is turning red.
After she dipped her toe, in the lake of fire!
I am 18 and was raised Mormon (exmormon now). I have two younger brothers still in the church and I really really hope they don't end up going on missions. If they go on a mission they will miss extremely influencial years of their life. It's not a coincidence that the age that people go on missions are also the years right after highschool when they would be going out to college, living life independently for the first time, and figuring themselves out.
A few weeks back a lady at work asked me to look over an essay her daughter was requested to write. Her daughter graduated last year from her high school collegiate program. The essay was intended for future program candidates - to be able to hear a graduate's thoughts and grasp the purpose and benefits of the program. Her writing was good but I pointed out areas that needed to be tweaked.....mostly grammatical errors. One item my generation-X-self thought she should leave-out was her talking about the academic pressure and how it affected her "mental health" early on. I thought that was not a positive sentence and too personal for the purpose of this essay, and that she should leave it out. The next day i asked my co worker what her daughter thought of my suggestions. She used them all.....except for the mental health thing. She insisted that it has to stay because it was a "major part of her experience."
That really clued me in on something. For whatever reasons, these younger generations really put a high importance and focus on mental health. It's a very personifying thing. Which leads me to something i had not thought about before. .....Perhaps, there's a lot of 20 and 30 something year olds leaving the church because mental health is such a high priority today and the church really stresses out people as it always has.
Saw an interview yesterday with a woman in her late 20's that recently left the church. I'm pretty sure she was unaware of how many times she was talking about her mental health surrounding all the guilt and shame from her church experience. Perhaps mass exodus of young adults from the church is not just about the secularization of society or issues with church history (the usual culprits) Maybe there is a large percentage of that age group that just don't want the added stress that is, after all.....100% optional. (on one NEEDS religions in their life) There was a time in our society when the stress seemed worth it, but for what the church is still selling....it's not mentally worth it to a younger generation. The church has missed the boat, yet again, on that.
mindeloman
That’s exactly why I no longer practice. I stopped over a year ago. I developed Religious OCD from all the junk I had been through in my life. All the way from a kid till now. My older brother helped me see what I was struggling with and he talked to me about it all. He truly saw how it was affecting and hurting me. So I stopped going and stopped practicing. I’m so tired of the constant guilt I felt all the time. Family members would point out to me not going. Old roommates I had in the past would try and get me to go to church. “Sorry man I’m a man in my mid 30s I can choose as I damn well please” haha
But it was hurting me so much and I didn’t care to be with the church anymore. If God truly exists there’s no way he’s this big of an asshole. It’s pretty messed up too that I always joke with friends and say Well I’ll be the telestial...so y’all have fun up there...”
That’s no way for a person to think or joke like that. We don’t have a damn clue what will happen and if anything will happen. But yes so many of us are tired of the old ways. The miracle of forgiveness...damn I hated they book. More like the Miracle of Condemnation....
As a teen, I distanced myself from Mormonism and chose for myself not to be a missionary. All should choose for themselves. This is a deeply personal choice, and the influence of others should be ignored.
Smart guy!
This was so good and nice to know I wasn’t alone in having the same experiences when I was a missionary. It was also cool to see my pictures among others, making that story feel even more real. If you ever want to share my story I would love to. Thanks for the great work and videos!
Lots of admiration for making this video Lex , I can see when it touched home and the emotion. Love always .
A prophet, seer, and revelator has zero discernment & clueless to what happens to missionaries. Let alone The pandemic.
As a Returned Missionary (West Germany late 1980s), I found parts of this triggering. Not your fault. First learning and since then Thinking about how I was manipulated sometimes makes me cry (and I’m not a crier).
I know a ton of people that were on missions honestly they seem very happy and from my viewpoint it seemed a great way to introducing a young person to the world please tell me if I’m wrong
@@truethat8503 If you’re a Mormon, then a mission might be the first time you are living away from your parents. A missionary’s life, at least in the late 1980s, is highly structured, not like normal life. One of my companions said, “The only normal thing a missionary can do is eat.”
I live in Europe and use to see missionaries in our town, also they talked to me in the street once. I used to make fun of them but now I feel rather sorry for them, I didn't have any idea how bad is their situation :(
I have a very good friend is a Momon, who had been as a mission. Watching your video and others allows me to understand him better.
My older brother served his mission out east. During that time my parents split it took. A massive toll on me, my sister and my brother. Even though he is really good at hiding his emotions. I could subtly tell from his mannerisms. It took a massive toll on his heart his mind and his soul. He cared so much about me and my sister growing up I could only imagine how powerless. He felt when he received the news of our parents.
I wasn't suicidal on my mission but it definitely exacerbated my bipolar. I had my first ever panic attack there and have developed work anxiety. I literally can't hold a job by myself without reasonable accommodations because of my mission.
Great video. Glad I disappointed my parents and didn’t go on a mission. I recommend checking out Apostitch for some cool cross stitch designs. Etsy and instagram.
I served a mission and had a great experience
So happy for you! ♥️
One thing I always try to ask the door to door witnessing folks, like Mormon Missionaries : "Do you believe that good things happen to bad people? and do you understand that bad, even horrifying things happen to good people?" That there is no real metric or formula that explains either scenario. I know very well that the Bible covers this - but the answer is extremely unsatisfying when you consider 90% of the teaching is that if you do good, you will reap goodness and the reverse for evil deeds. But in real life, that is just not how it works.
Wow ! Some of those stories are really sad. I sometimes see missionaries on my city bus. I saw the video where your husband shared his experiences dealing with mental health issues while out on his mission. And to think at one point I lamented I never served one because of situational issues at that time in my life ! Hearing all these stories makes me think all the governing body of the church care about is the tithing money the church brings in from members, but I was an active, believing member and I had some super spiritual experiences. It's so weird !!! The only reason I lost my testimony was because I had a social falling out with members in my congregation that lead to a faith crisis. That faith crisis was a godsend, because it woke me up to a happier way of being - outside of the church. I realized I had made the LDS church too central a part of my life. Maybe it wouldn't hurt to ask the missionaries I see if they are doing ok. They may need someone to talk to, who understands the pressures of LDS life as a missionary.
I was raised to serve a mission. In high school I never went on dates because I felt like they would distract me, and so when I got home I had 0 social or work skills. I'm 24 now and still have little to no direction because of this
I have a few cousins preparing to go on a mission. I feel sad and upset that the church is taking advantage of their time and money like this but if I say anything I would be the jerk who is raining on “the best 2 years” of their life. I have one cousin who I thought for sure would leave the church as soon as he turned 18 as he always asked questions and couldn’t get past the church’s convoluted history, but he changed his mind when he got his patriarchal blessing and is now pumped to go on a mission. Heart broken :(
That can't be as bad, as what is happening to Exmo Lex.
Her hair is turning red, after dipping her toe into the lake of fire!
I mentioned a similar story via email to you about a young couple left the church as they had too many discrepancies about the book of Mormon. They were so depressed over the whole ordeal, they left the church. Last I heard of him he and his girlfriend at the time moved to a much larger city, changed religion and got married after they got settled in. I didn't ask which one he joined but he says he's happier and planning to raise a family. The last conversation I had with him, he said to believe in the one God, one Jesus and the one book, the Bible. The book of Mormon was propaganda and a waste of time. This was about 15 years old. I'm sure he's much happier now. He shared me his experience after I shared mine dating back over 30 years ago.
My missionary experience was horrible. I took a long time to adjust to it but I did it. What was worse was when I came back. The mission (especially for men) is a way for the church to get you to conform to their idea of an ideal man. The cult wants you to become a charismatic salesman for the Lord. A few men will become exactly that. The rest of us need to understand how binary that thinking is. Not everybody fits the mold the cult has for us. You just cannot pound square pegs into round holes.
Not without a miracle anyway. Perhaps a marvelous work and a wonder...oh wait.
Study the concept of "diversity" and you know the main issue of the church (besides that Smith made it all up). If you cannot conform to the cliche of a heterosexual businessman or housewife, you will be miserable in that church.
I was diagnosed with Crohn's Disease about 18 months before my mission. I had a horrible time, riding a bike it was literally killing me. My mission president said, pray harder... long story short my experience was the start of my leaving the church a few years later. Looking back now more than 20 years later I am so glad I left and if I hadn't had the experience I did I don't believe I would have left when I did. But the mental and emotional impact it had still haunts me today...
I had a great mission. I met so many amazing people and learned so much about the world. And my fifth companion became my first boyfriend. :)
So great to hear ♥️♥️
It is amazing just how much damage faith can do to people. I never served a mission, but truly feel bad for those who did and the shit they endured for the "Lord". Other than learning the skills of being a salesman. it is pretty much a complete waste of their time and money.
If the LDS church really held the power of God in the priesthood, then they would be out anointing with oil, laying on those powerful hands, and slapping on a big juicy blessing to end this pandemic. As it is, the priesthood is fictional, otherwise there would be no need for doctors, hospitals, therapeutic drugs, operations, or mortuaries in Utah.
As both a tbm and exmo I've had nightmares about being back on the mission. Most former missionaries I know have experienced the same thing.
hi from France, i am a christian (not mormon) but very interested in all religions. You are doing a pretty good job, helping others. Most churches are most about money and none own the Lord. God bless you and your family.
The church needs to stop lowering the age for missions, I appreciate the stories; because truth is being shared and hopefully this will help other's think; before they serve an LDS mission.
Thank you for this video, Lex. It's raw and important that people know about this.
Thank you for the effort you put into to creating this video. I could definitely relate to some of the stories shared.
My husband and I invited these 2 Mormon boys (18, 19 years old), a few years ago, to have a beverage like coffee or tea, but they didn't accept any, but did give us a Book of Mormon and came over a few times (4 or 5 times, maybe). And they were simply the nicest for the longest. However, I could tell we were nearing out conversations with them (I'm assuming you can visit one person's home so many times before you either bring them to church, or you leave empty-handed (I was taught this practice, minus the door to door, as a Baptist)). You could tell they tired of having discussion/debate and I got a sense of urgency. We did exchange numbers the second time around, but they didn't even make small talk after the last visit.
Yeah, we were not to waste time with people who "didn't progress" as missionaries. We were to dump them and find people who were "more prepared" to be manipulated by our bullshit message.
Aside from all the negative is this video, I just wanted to say I LOVE your current hair color ❤️
These videos are awesome! You're quickly becoming my favorite exmo channel.
Wow, thanks!
I went on my mission 43 years ago oh, yes 43 years :-) I went to Southern California I learned very quickly for my first companion it didn't matter how many contacts you made how many lessons you taught It was what you reported on your weekly reports to the Zone leaders that then went to the mission assistants than the mission president sometimes. And I did not have one companion that told the truth on the reports and many would get mad at me if I question that we were fibbing / lying . I recently found my old missionary Journal, before I threw it out. And all the names that I kept of people that I had taught that were baptized or that I baptized myself. I could only find one that was active. And she blocked me from Facebook because I answered a question someone had asked her with the correct answer not a sugar-coated one. My first companion was so set on getting baptisms but we baptized one lady who had never been to church. And when she started to pray she would yell "oh Jesus oh Jesus!" He baptized her! But it made his numbers look good, his goal was to become a leader. One day I told him to go to hell and he told me that I might be sent home for telling him that. He was thinking that would scare me and I was thinking" if that's all it takes to go home I'm going to tell him that more often. Very hard emotionally physically continuously on a bike for two years in my case it was for almost 26 months. I still have nightmares that I am on a mission and I am 60 years old! Some of the dreams I have to go out and can't take my family with me I have to leave my wife home. Or I'm just simply back out there. Remember that was the days when you could call home once or twice a year and that's it.
Numbers are a joke dude only an idiot(your lying comps) who doesnt understand the gospel would be imtimidated or influenced by numbers. Some weeks we taught 3 discussions some weeks we taught none. I had no problem telling a district leader or zone leader or prez. where he could put his numbers. Remember the worth of souls is great in the sight of God;
11 For, behold, the Lord your Redeemer suffered death in the flesh; wherefore he suffered the pain of all men, that all men might repent and come unto him.
12 And he hath risen again from the dead, that he might bring all men unto him, on conditions of repentance.
13 And how great is his joy in the soul that repenteth!
14 Wherefore, you are called to cry repentance unto this people.
15 And if it so be that you should labor all your days in crying repentance unto this people, and bring, save it be one soul unto me, how great shall be your joy with him in the kingdom of my Father!
16 And now, if your joy will be great with one soul that you have brought unto me into the kingdom of my Father, how great will be your joy if you should bring many souls unto me!
17 Behold, you have my gospel before you, and my rock, and my salvation.
18 Ask the Father in my name in faith, believing that you shall receive, and you shall have the Holy Ghost, which manifesteth all things which are expedient unto the children of men.
19 And if you have not faith, hope, and charity, you can do nothing.
Do your best and teach with the spirit thats all that matters. Numbers are a measuring stick and way to understand how the work is going. I baptized 10 people in NYC i dont know if thats good or if thats bad. I know i did my best and anyone who wants to say numbers can u know what. I know my soul will delight with theirs and great shall be our joy in the world to come. The only number that matters anyway is one. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:
23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
I think my number that officially was " baptized" was 36 and like I said I have checked as much as I can and I can find one that is still active. You make some good points that are cut and pasted from church information. There's reasons why the prophet has change missions when I went 40 years ago it was like prison, not that I know what prison is like :-) two phone calls a year asking you to only use a few hours of your Monday time as P day and work instead. What are your suit coat when you're riding your 10-speed bicycle in Southern California when it's a hundred and ten oh, by the way I didn't do that but that was the mission rule. So many problems on missions I see why so many come home because of emotional problems. They talk about missionaries saying that they thought about jumping in front of a bus to be able to get off their mission. I can think of many times where I thought if I crashed into this car I build a go home with an honorable release. And not be harassed by a few Companions and threatened to be sent home. So use all the scriptures you want. A very large number of returned missionaries quit the church.
@@RonJohnston ya they do i did almost myself transitioning aint easy. I was like that too 2 years 2 phone calls i served like 20 years ago. I dont know what its like today. I cant speak about wanting to kill myself or jump in front of a subway or bus. I enjoyed my mish, however i was in the big apple everyday was an adventure. I get that theirs issues and probably 2 much pressure put on the kids. I was a strong kid if i didnt go id tell someone a problem with it to go @#$% theselves personally. I think its a personal decision and the reason the brethren push so hard is cause lots of souls to save and so little time. Well find the happy medium give us time and let us make mistakes. Theirs no such thing as an infailable church. We aint even 200 years old yet!
@@RonJohnston if its a hundred and 10 best believe i aint in my coat. Rules are made to be broken just use your common sense and protect urself. You think the lord cares if your in your coat? Cmon dude. We always ude to say see this and hold out the white bible and say see it bends. Go out and have fun not like movies girls and stuff but enjoy your comp dude. Get into sticky situations and laugh and dont think about home. That shiz will still be there. Your mish is a short time and goes by fast if ur doing it right. We use to play bball everywhere we went shirt and ties. The kids in nyc would pull down fire escape ladders and shoot hoops wed jump in shirt and ties no pday. Enjoying the people enjoying the culture thats what its about. If your one of th em then they can see u as a brother and not some dude with an agenda. Someone whos ready to share a message that has brought you a lot of joy and only wishes to share that joy.
@@JohnDLee-im4lo says john d lee the man who denounced brigham. Otay. Hey next time you aim at me centre the heart and dont mangle my body.
Brilliant expose.... Reminiscent of the work of top newspaper and television reporters of years ago. Poignant, compelling stories and insightful commentary. Growing up in Southern California years ago, the Missionary experience was totally different....more humane where the individual Missionary was revered and the "Company" wasn't pushing for "numbers". It's very saddening how the so called "Brethren" can be so callous to the needs of young Missionaries....they are losing a generation they can ill afford to lose, and they are losing some of the older generation who knew better times, with better leaders. With all the new information in the past several years and RUclips videos of the "real" before unheard history of the Church, they better get their act together and figure out how to sustain the membership...not being so rigid, lightening up and being more positive might help. Again, GREAT video
Such sad stories. :-(
When I’m older and have gotten my name removed from the church and everything, and missionaries come knocking on my door, I’m going to give them a warm welcome and let them make themselves at home. The mental, emotional, and physical toll they take from missions is heartbreaking and when they come to visit me I want to give them time to relax and and enjoy themselves. I won’t however let them convert me back to Mormonism or talk about any of the church beliefs, because I have no interest in that anymore. But I will still welcome them with open arms and give them a nice break for an hour or so from the tiring and stressful atmosphere wherever their “home base” is.
Thank you for this. I had a love hate relationship with my mission. Mostly hating myself during and years afterwards.
So sorry for that!
There's a natural order to things , whether we believe in God or not , this order is unchangeable, we can see it everyday. It takes a certain amount of maturity and personal experience to begin life , itself, making choices that are beneficial and in the best interest of those around you and personally.
I often questioned the Church policy of employing missionaries between the ages of 18-30 , young men and women who know so little about life , just like the young soldiers who are sent out to war who face imminent death . The LDS Church is so rooted in control that it will even use the innocent to propagate its purpose without questioning. Looking back I do feel sorry for all of those that fell for the Church's manipulation.
Another powerful video. Again, I know I'm a little slow to seeing this one, but thank you. My oldest brother was nearly destroyed by the mission he went on in the early 90s. I was only about nine years old when he came home early in "utter disgrace". He had a mission president and companions who pressured him horrendously to be a salesman when he was a deeply introverted, highly intelligent and quiet person who didn't believe in the church and wanted to be using his intellect to go to college instead, but he was the oldest son and had to serve a mission. I still remember the fury I felt when people suggested his return home early was shameful. He won't talk about even now, nearly thirty years later. I'm glad the church is making the mission experience just a bit more humane (I would have given anything to be able to talk to my brother weekly back then). But that doesn't excuse what people have been put through. Thanks for bringing more awareness to this.
My anxiety prevented me from going on a mission. Anxiety is usually a bad thing, but it saved my life.
My younger brother was sent home shortly after leaving on his mission since he quickly became suicidal. I felt somewhat responsible since I could tell he didn't want to go but didn't try and help him stay home. I was so conflicted letting him leave in the first place, walking out from his farewell talk in tears. I didn't go on a mission myself as I stopped believing in the church in highschool. Before that I had been a far more devout Mormon than my brother ever was. It's been probably 6 years since I stopped believing, but I still haven't built up the courage to tell my family other than my brother who I told while he was on his mission. Once he got back my parents were quick to throw him into a local mission where he would live at home and work downtown at the lds headquarters. Guess they couldn't just let it go. Luckily this had already happened to multiple guys in our Ward so people weren't too judgemental.
The more video's I see like this the happier I am that I never pushed my son to go on a mission, you see I always took care of my missionaries so I saw how they where treated and they told me enough stories I knew I didn't want him to go and thank heavens he didn't seem interested in going so it was a none issue in our home, i'm still in contact with some of my missionaries and they call me their Texas mom, even though I'm know longer a member i'll always take care of the missionaries, there will always be a meal or even groceries for them and their welcome to come in and relax and my missionaries always watched tv but it was always family tv and if I see them out and about I will always stop and talk with them because they need all the kindness they can get.
. 'Abdu'l-Baha, a significant figure and leader of religion, taught, "Religion is the light of the world. If it is made the cause of darkness through human misunderstanding and ignorance, it would be better to do without it. "
. 'Nuf said.
I feel like these are problems no one likes to talk about. Thanks for bringing light to this subject. Great video!
When I was 16 I was diagnosed with a degenerative retinal disease and went through unimaginable depression and anxiety from it. But what gave me hope was that I was being told it would help me be a better missionary. Then when I turn 19 the State president said I couldn't go because I would slow the work of God. Then while I was in college another Bishop said I needed to serve a mission in order for my life to work out and had to move home where that same stake president that told me no the first place told me no once again because of my eyesight. I still had enough eyesight to ride a bike I just couldn't drive so it was silly
One of the missionaries in the missionary house where we lived on my mission was bragging, in reading the "little grey standards book" we had all been given, about having "broken all the rules in the book -- except the ones about girls"
I am not LDS.
Doing public service is one of the most therapeutic thing that people can do.
Doing public service abroad is even twice the fun.
The non-Mormon people I know who've done service abroad usually talk about it as a positive, life changing experience.
Such people are going to do service and not sell people on a church.
It seems to me that the problem isn't with doing service abroad. The problem seems to be about a particular group that is using the missionaries to gain wealth and power for a questionable group.
yintercept Exactly!
Definitely. If they were passionate about going for their own motives, it would probably be one of the best experiences of their life. Most missionaries feel so pressured to go that in their minds, it isn't a choice. They feel forced by family, friends, and the church.
@@thanesmashmontages412 When I talk to returned missionaries, I always talk to them about the local culture. I will ask they about the museums and archeological sites they visited, and I will ask they what things they learned from the local culture.
The ones that can answer the questions tend to talk more favorably of their mission than the ones that cannot.
I love the idea of going on a mission. I would want to learn everything I could about the people and culture I was visiting.
I couldn't be an LDS Missionary because that program is built on the foolish idea that Provo Utah is somehow the pinnacle of civilization and that we must build the world in the image of Utah County.
My mission president told me I would be making a selfish decision if I went home. This was his response after I told him I wanted to walk into traffic just to go home. I ended up staying the whole 2 years in the end sadly. Ex-mormon 8 years strong🥳
This has nothing to do with the video (which was v interesting btw!), but your outfit is so cute! Is it a dress? Where is it from?!
Toriana Kay thank you! It is a dress, it’s from Target 😊
I'm glad I never did a mission
Thank you, Lexy. A valuable vid. Maybe it should be required viewing in the Church?(as if).
I’ve seen your other posts on this, and I wanted to comment on the issues of missionaries being hungry etc. In my ward(I’m not quite ex yet!) there’s a calendar passed around in relief society, and people mark days to have the Elders in for dinner. I think there’s rules about investigators being present on certain days, not sure about that.
Sisters who don’t have members of the priesthood in the home make “take aways”. If missionaries do service work for members it’s an unwritten rule we give them lunch. They have more invitations than they can accept for Christmas etc, and we are advised that gifts of special foods are appreciated.
Many in my ward are Polynesian, and “If in doubt, feed someone” seems to be a default. Maybe that’s why I’ve heard missionaries comment on all the weight they’ve put on, despite all the work and walking.
Your vids on missionaries have really alerted me to realise many missionaries, even if well fed, may be very unhappy. I’m going to be more supportive and watchful.
Kudos, and thanks.
Like your door example, I had only one mission president and I remember him being generous at the beginning until he was “ talked to” by an area authority (never found out who) and then got stingy on paying for things like that. I remember in one of our areas, he then had my companion and I make a payment arrangement with our landlord to have a phone installed ( this was Mexico in the 1990’s where phone service was a fairly expensive luxury).
My friend was a sister missionary under a mission president who was extremely sexist. Sisters weren't 'real' missionaries and he didn't want them in his wards taking away future converts from the men. My friend was the only one who stood up to him by saying that it was the same god that called her to serve as he did the male missionaries. All the other sisters were too afraid and depressed.
1 thing I heard many times before going in to a mission and during was that it was better to die serving an “honorable mission” than returning home without honor. Also talking with some exmo ex-missionaries, we found out that all of us had mission nightmares after we came home, but no one talked about it when they were active in the church. I would love to hear your input about this 2 issues and how common they are.
I'm so glad I never went on a mission. Even as a girl, I felt some pressure to do it. I even had a family trust that would have paid for it. But there's something about missionary work that always made me uncomfortable (& frightened!). And recently I figured out why. It's just like an MLM. Give me all your friends phone numbers and names, and ask you personal questions too early, and numbers are more important than people, And it's a sales job. I hate sales jobs!
Listening to these stories though, I'm definitely wanting to make sure my kids know I don't want them to go.
My cousin's husband was told/asked by a member of the bishopric after losing their twin boys at 21 weeks if this was caused because of something he didn't or did do on his mission. I was floored.
That is so horrifying.
@@ExmoLex yes and it was at the luncheon after the funeral.
Wow...just, wow...😢
it’s obvious to me that my brother doesn’t want to go on a mission. he has so much pressure put on him (being the only biological male of my siblings). my mother pressures him so intensely it could make me scream. the bishop has caught on and is telling people that are planning to go on missions and return missionaries to “help ease him into the idea.” i wish i could do something more to help him.
um, and there are those that ask us, "Why do you call us a cult?" (OMG)
While on a mission the church take their passport
They took mine. I was posted in a part of Argentina where I would see trucks daily that hauled apples and pears to Brazil. I dreamed of getting a ride of one and starting a new life where I could life my misery (mormonism) behind. I still think that probably would have been a good decision. Unfortunately I didn't have my passport as it had been taken from me and so that kind of killed that plan.
You’re joking? Please tell me you’re joking? If not, all these innocent young people are being trafficked, slave labour. Also, I would think it would add greatly to the feeling of not having any power, of being under control.
That is unbelievable. I feel so very sad for the young men and women.
Thanks for sharing about young missionary, when I was an activity member I always had them around for meals or just somewhere were the can chill out a be them and most of the time I think I used to see them about three times in one week. We use to sit and chat for hours in and always told not to tell where they were and I did that as I felt the were too young to be away from there home. and my home was like a second home and I was told by them I was like a mother to them and I always told if they need something to eat help themself. I'm glad I have stopped going as it upset that women of the church were not allowed to do the something as man of the church and I even broke all the rules and I was told that I could not be part of anything in the church until I was told different and told to ask for forgiveness of my sins and that made matters worse as I felt like I was no good to anyone. Another thing that made fell an outcast as I felt the church was family-friendly and not every welcoming to women who could not have kids as I felt frown down on. I'm much happier today by not going to chuurch.
Looking back, the only thing I appreciate about my mission were the genuinely nice people who supported and fed us without judgement, and the chance to learn a new language.
Everything else was hell. Everything. I'm still filled with anxiety from being forced into a mold that i just could never fit.
The ad right before this video was a Christian dating app 💀
I am very sorry about all missionary and what they went through. When I was a member, I would try to be kind and supportive. Some detection and intervention would help with all the missionary, especially the last missionary. If one person would have given kindness and mercy. This wouldn't happen and it really breaks my heart
on the topic of why would god call such unqualified person to that position: i had a stake president who had a speach impediment. can you imagine the torture of listening to a mormon speach plus the severe speach impediment? mormons have so many meetings, and they are all so boring. fast and testimony is the absolute worst. off topic, but why do they torture their members so?
As someone who has a speech impediment and is mistreated/discriminated against for it, I do not appreciate this comment.
@@shawnreed7876 in this life trials and tribulations come. suffering is optional. in other words learn to live life and accept your disabilities with a cheerful heart or no. the option is up to you.
Is there anything I could do to help someone currently back home in self quarantine from his mission? Nobody should suffer like this. Your mental state matters allot. This cult is weird.
I think the best thing would be to keep in contact and offer emotional support if needed.
Thank you for this. I'd love to see more like this 💛
Thanks Lex!
I almost lost both my kids for unreasonable expectations in the Mormon culture and from other family members! I don't want to go too much into detail on their stories, to respect their privacy.
But also, I have witnessed similar stories first hand, including 2 friends in my Elder's quorum, back when I was 19 getting ready to leave on a mission, that took their lives due to the pressure of a mission. Thinking back, I believe one of those 2 friends was secretly gay (he took his dad's shotgun to end his life too).
I've seen it time and again, and it's disgusting how the church's culture is set up for this to keep occurring with teens in Mormon families, with no remorse because the leaders can never admit or apologize for anything!! Seriously, have they ever straight said they were wrong or that they're sorry for any of the actual deeds/rules they've had in place which have caused harm and deaths?
Sorry if I sound angry, but this is a very tender subject which breaks my heart also.
Again thanks for the video, although it triggered me...lol.
this made me cry
Oh my goodness. That was horrendous.
I have a question for Lexi or any other former LDS members. I heard that not all church members can get into the temple. What percentage of Mormons can do this? Is it a very small number or is it pretty high? Just curious. Thanks.
I can’t give you figures, but I know some “wards”(parishes/areas) are far more temple active than others.
I myself was baptised over ten years ago, and I’ve never been. Partly because I’ve smoked a lot of this time, but also because I don’t tithe. I’ve been told if I start tithing *without fail* for about three months I can get my patriarchal blessing, then after maybe six months of tithing and faithfully following rules I can get my temple recommend.
So no, not all members are “temple worthy”. And you don’t get told a lot about temple experiences; I’ve learned a lot from channels like this, aka anti-Mormon, enough that I’m off the idea. I think I’m going to be Exmo very soon. It’s only the friendships keeping me atm
"R.E.M. - Losing My Religion"
I'm so happy I left early from my mission. Glad I didn't give a fuck what other Mormons thought of me
6:04 I am sad to hear that if only someone reached out to him!
Thanks 🙏
Missionaries; The real virus seems to take precedence above "The Mind Virus." (All religion.)
Believe nothing, no matter where you read it, or who said it, no matter
if I have said it, unless it agrees with your own reason and your own
common sense. Quote by Buddha.
Thanks for the great video. I'd like to plug a book that is related to the topic. It was written by a man from my old Ward in Utah. It's called "The Accidental Terrorist: Confessions Of A Reluctant Missionary" by William Shunn. It's a great read!
These stories make me incredibly sad.
Your mission vids.. tragic. It's like war stories from Afghanistan or Iraq. Senseless way to survive. I'm not lds but between your mission stories and what have been learning from a variety of sources but I'm just astounded by..it's so hard not to say child n spiritual n psychological n physiological n human rights abuses I keep hearing. And I already knew some of the lds history. But I don't see or hear about someone living in southern Baptist country n faking it as one for legal reasons..who could only get to about p 60 of a bio on Jos. Smith and started having nightmares. I knew a little bit about the history and etc but why nightmares? About a yr later n across the country in my usual state I moved to a primarily lds town run like the other that was mainly run by Baptists. You learn a lot real quick. But I was trying to read the BOM so could maybe understand people better. Instead I only got 2 ch in lamanites or something.. and nightmares. I tried to continue reading but screaming nightmares only woke my kids. People who weren't lds told me to just stop reading n etc. So about a year or 2 later n some good n not so good interactions with Mormons I get this small book called Mama, Mormonism and Me. 136p took a year to read because the whole time the author was lds, I got nightmares but such a fascinating story. Then she becomes a real Christian and Baptist no less. This past year, nearly 25 yrs after living in lds law country n nightmares I've been around missionaries who enlightened me a little n I've actually been able to read bits of the BOM but I see it now as a religious satire. To explain is not for now. Since listening to exlds my compassion and respect n blessings and I can't find the words what I am hearing and learning now is affecting me so profoundly. I get to weeping n stop n then I get so tearful it nearly blows my mind. And you know it's not just LDS. Many blessings to you courageous enough to think n reason n be the Captain of your ship and the Master of your soul.
So sad
Damn shes nice to look at!❤
Here's something to consider: In Mormon doctrine it states that people who did not get to hear the gospel will be taught it in the next life, essentially by angels. It also stands to reason that faith and obscurity is no longer an issue either since one is dead and on the other side, so it would be easier to accept the gospel. So missionaries teaching people in this life with inferior teaching ways are actually doing a disservice to living people, especially when those people reject the Mormon gospel because of logical reasons like all the terrible history and obscurity based on a concept of faith, faith being an unreliable source of truth and very limited in making one secure and endure in a belief.
And what is interesting is you doing this channel is reaching far more people than a zone of missionaries can or does. You're influence/ channel is getting ideas across to people searching for truth, and the comments at the bottom lead to so much more thoughtful conversation than two LDS missionaries sitting around talking about church theology and rules to people who half the time aren't even interested but are just forced to listen due to TBM parents.
Amen Stella. It also shows how ridiculous the practice of "Baptizing for the Dead" is. If you're dead, you don't need to be baptized because... you're already dead! And if they're taught the gospel in the after-life and eventually become Mormon, then they're just going to have to make do without a baptized body because theirs is 6 feet under the ground and rotting! I'm sure that God can use all of his powers to work around that. And it gets worse... They also perform temple-weddings for dead people because "had they still been alive, this is what they would have wanted to make it to the Celestial kingdom". How messed up of a cult do you have to be in to think that you have to get married for other people? And the best part of all of this is that I don't need to do any of this Mormon-BS here on earth because all I have to do is die and patiently wait for somebody else to do it all for me. What a wonderful religion!
@@mylesmarkson1686 Like why not just baptize the prophet and he can stand in for all the people who have died or will die without the gospel? Say one prayer, dunk and done.
Instead it's finding names and presenting them to temple workers and dunking people 20 times over forever. Cut down on temples and spending money on temples, and instead could give to the poor more. And what about names forgotten or not passed in? According to Mormonism those dead wait in limbo until someone submits their name into the temple and does their work for them?
This is like medieval Christianity or reverse infant Catholic baptism, which Mormons hate.
Catholics say one must be baptized when a baby because all must be baptized, just like Mormons preach. Then when a Catholic is of a certain age they then can go for first communion which is when they can become a member. So baptized babies in their Catholic church are just getting a blessing done, not membership.
And Members believe the same thing, sort of, just in reverse or when someone dies. Yet Mormons freak out over Catholic baptism of infants. Really what's the difference?
Both sects are taking away the choice of the actual, physical act of wanting baptism or not, both say baptism is essential, both claim it doesn't make one a member, even though you are saying they are cleansed through the procedure, and yet a living person would become a member after baptism, right? How doesn't baptism by proxy make the dead members?
(At least Catholics declare that baptism is just a blessing and not really membership for babies) and both claim it's done out of love, even though the person had zero choice in someone saying their name and then putting water on them?
How would Mormons feel if the FLDS church was dunking their members in proxy of dead LDS members and re baptizing them FLDS? Which is probably happening , lol. Or if some Satanists church, out of what they consider love, was baptizing dead LDS members into a Satanist church?
Lex--I've been visiting here since last Oct. My heart goes out to you and others who have left the church because of the CES Letter or whatever. I've been studying church history and doctrine for many decades--nearly 6 to be exact. I've had the opportunity to serve 5 missions. Completed my last mission with my wife late last year.
I've seen and experienced a lot of stuff. I respect agency and if you and others have decided to become atheist that is your business. However, when you run the Lord's church down, as you have done for many months, I need to speak up.
If you were to interview every missionary since Joseph Smith's day until now (well over a million) I believe you would find the vast majority give positive feedback about their experience. Of course, you would find a relatively small number who, for a variety of reasons, give feedback that isn't so positive.
Life is tough and faith is not an easy gift of the Spirit to obtain--I know that by experience. I also know by experience that when one exercises faith when trials come, they are the ones who are given strong manifestations of the Spirit. Those who let their faith buckle when trials come forfeit such experiences.
Question: are you making money by producing RUclips videos?
1st thing; people don't "decide" what to believe or not believe. Can you suddenly believe in Pixies? People are either convinced something is true or not. It can be bad reasons or good, but you can't pick your beliefs. Can you go back to believing in Santa? Next, you use the word faith like it's a good thing. It's not, and I can show you why; is there any belief one couldn't hold based on faith? Doesn't a Muslim, a catholic, a Baptist, a white supremacist all use faith for their beliefs? Is there anything one couldn't believe based on faith? Faith isn't a reliable path to truth. Its gullibility. Stop being gullible.
Jared
And yet your study has not enlightened you at all?
Question....do you approve Joseph Smith marrying young girls? Sisters, mother's and daughters, married women with living husbands who he sent away to serve missions, and so much behind Emma's back? That he threatened Emma that she had to accept it? That he liked about everything right up to his death?
Jared
I do understand that you initially responded from a place of feeling personally attacked, however, you did not answer my question. Please do .
@@krissee6961 --it appears you haven't studied. If you have, then you have relied on only critics points of view.
Follow the link below for a 5 min video. Then follow the links below the video section for a deep dive into the history of Joseph Smith's polygamy by qualified writers.
Did you know that none of the plural wives of Joseph Smith ever criticized him? Why is that? I would think they, of all people, are the best source to form an opinion about Joseph Smith and polygamy.
ruclips.net/video/CixqAmzxmYw/видео.html
@@six1nyne being called goofy by a guy who thinks he has an invisible superhero friend who hates gays, masturbation and black people before 1978, all based on a case of the feelings, is a badge of honor.
Lol she said “Missionary”!
I'm glad I didn't go I pretty sure I wouldn't have been mentally strong enough let alone fiscally strong enough. Its probably a good thing where I live in the UK where we don't have a gun culture. I didn't have pressure from my family but I did from my ward. my Brother never went ether. I was made to feel like I was the only one. in stake meetings they would sometimes ask all the Returned Missionaries to stand up and I was more or less the only one who stayed seated. my dad didn't go ether. some smart ass Elder thought it would be good to embarrass me infront of an investigator by saying I was in training to go on a Mission when they asked why I had a blue badge instead of a black one I told them I wasn't. stake Missionaries are the Keys for the Elders we let them into the homes that would have been locked to them like womens homes. we also stayed with the members long after the Elders had gone. most didn't stay anyway. we only heard the words it was the best two years of my life and When I was on my Mission ect its nice to hear these story's. its funny I once gave myself a drug overdose after 60 minutes of being bullied into going on a mission In a Mission its interesting I was in my 30s at the time and in a full time Job. the person who gave me the interview is out of it himself and feels very bitter in wasting so much time of his life. he told my sister how he and is wife are treated like outcast by is bother because he doesn't go to church. it was the best time of his life as well even though he got is Jew broken after someone swinging a baseball bat. if its true that they take Elders past port off them thats very much like People Trafficking. I knew the Tablets wouldn't kill me but I think that is why I did it otherwise I don't think I would have had the courage to have done it if I know their was a risk of dying. not a Missionary but a woman I knew had a step son who hung himself at 15 and is dad blamed himself thinking maybe it was something he had done I don't know why this lad did it he had stopped going to church long before he did it. its interesting that all the people who had drink problems where the ones in the church and not out of it Religions attract a lot of vulnerable people. I've not been to Church for about 10 years now
Why would he shot himself with his parents there ect I just don’t understand, I’ve had a really bad life to it’s such a shame people do those things
It was Valentine's Day and he was 25 and unmarried with no girlfriend. Most people in the church marry very soon after they get home from their missions. The day probably exacerbated his loneliness and depression. If you really want to kill yourself you don't talk to someone you just do it.
Jen Foster I’m a Virgin and will be 25 this year, it’s a hard life when you try and follow the right path! If I was a bad guy I would probably have had a better chance
Jen Foster if there is no resurrection of Christ and the dead then the mans death is in vain and he has perished but if there is then his family can see him again and they can be happy and at peace
@@Dreammaster695 This is true but when you are depressed you can't always think logically and see the good in your situation. :)
Ahh missionary's, the cult with in the cult
Such a negative video in a negative time.. why? Missionaries are nice people how about a positive video for once.. it’s not all doom and gloom
NightmareEntity if you don’t like the content, don’t watch. No one is forcing you.
Missionaries ARE nice people. No one ever said anything about them not being great, amazing people. I was a missionary and I suffered from crippling depression. I spent an entire night outside away from my companion, watching semi trucks drive by 2 feet in front of me, constantly trying to just push myself to jump out in front of them. This video is to help raise awareness and to encourage people to see missionaries as real people with real feelings so that maybe less people slam doors in their faces and do something nice for them instead. This video is positive. The church abuses its missionaries. The only way you see it as not being positive is if you are uninformed or didn't watch the whole thing.
Some missionaries are LGBT? Hmmmm... Of course. Some of everybody is.
Exmo lex:
Have you ever been told. That the bottom of your hair, is turning red.
Since you dipped your toe in the lake of fire?
Good one!
Alright, so I’ll try to condense my thoughts as much as possible, but it is inevitable that this will be a lengthy post....I am a devout believer in, and follower of Jesus Christ as a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. I stumbled across your videos a few weeks back, and have watched bits and pieces of many of them.
Ultimately, once I get through 3-4 minutes of most the videos I get bored hearing the same old John Dehlinian rhetoric that has been spewed by others that are out there. Let me say first that I am thankful for content like yours (and others within this antagonistic/naysayer conglomerate). I mean that sincerely. First, I believe it is a good thing to have one’s faith challenged. While I don’t necessarily agree with the tactics used by you and others, I think on a general level it can lead to further exploration and increased faith promotion for those that have a sound foundation and ability to properly analyze oppositional claims/opinions (including the overall delivery methods of these claims/opinions). Second, I am a strong believer in the freedom of speech even if those claims, thoughts, opinions, ideas, contents, suggestions are presented with the purpose to undermine, disrespect, hyperbolize, and sub-standardize the beliefs of another.
Lastly, and most importantly, your content demonstrates (either intentionally or unintentionally) the deployment of nebulous amounts of illogical argumentation and logical fallacies in order to obtain psychological effect.
Now, we are all guilty of using logical fallacies in one shape or form when we are trying to “prove our point”, but I have noticed that individuals such as yourself and your fellow cohorts use pervasive amounts of logical fallacies in order to feed that bloody “anti-LDS” red meat to your “followers”. After all, you need to “grow your channel” right? So it is imperative you give your constituents what they want. The only difference between you and some of the other naysayer provocateurs on you tube is that you deliver your content from the front seat of your car to give the “soccer mom” appeal (which I admit is a rather clever marketing appeal for your channel). Unfortunately, just as you have done with this video about missionaries, you deploy snide/hyperbolic methods such as argumentum ad misericordiam, reductio ad absurdum, special pleading, circular argumentation (in various forms), various syllogistic and quantification fallacies, Gish Gallup techniques, and many others....the end supposition presented by you and those that regurgitate John Dehlinian rhetoric, is that we as members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints only fit into 2 types of boxes (false dilemma fallacy): We are either complicit in a grand scheme/lie OR
we are mindlessly hoodwinked/brainwashed into a “toxic corporation”. Again, the use of cryptic/fallacious argumentation in an attempt to “grow your channel”
I could go on and on...Thank you for your channel. Again, it gives a demonstration to those who are wanting to better understand the fallacious psychology and methods deployed by naysayers who are antagonistic to those of us who are trying to worship Almighty God according to the dictates of our own conscience.....
Thanks for the comment, I could always use a little algorithm boost!
Dr DLehrsch32 it's sad that you don't bother to put the intelligence you have to better use. After all, to rephrase, the Light of God is Love.
Exmo Lex ok, uhh yeah......
Kris See “It’s sad you don’t bother to put the intelligence you have to better use”....I mean it is this kind of poorly thought out commentary that just baffles me to no end...Do you know what I spend 99.999% of my time doing professionally, theologically, personally?? Furthermore, what would you suggest I spend my time doing anyway?? I don’t care what your believe system is, spending 5 minutes to share insight and defending your faith is a noble pursuit.
I can only assume your parting statement “after all the light of God is love” is a cryptic attempt to claim I am possibly insufficient in this “love” since I called ExMoLex out for some of her fallaciously rhetorical tendencies.
To further make my point, I’ll have you know that some LDS doctors including myself went to Ukraine in 2019 to provide free medical care. We paid for our own travel, but the so-called “toxic LDS corporation” provided supplies, equipment, DME, and local volunteers from Ukraine members. I am involved in many different ways “outside” of the LDS Church in my local community. I volunteer with Goodwill Industries, Salvation Army, Habitat for Humanity, and Doctors Without Borders. I pay tithing, but I also donate money to other charitable organizations including the ACS, ANA, local chaplaincy, local youth sport programs and others. I do all these things for no other reason than LOVE. I do these things in a continual effort to glorify God and demonstrate this love through good works and not just rhetorical “faith alone”. I have learned these principals through a lifelong desire to follow the teachings of Jesus Christ and be accounted as a saint as a member of his ekklesia (church). I also learned many of these valuable lessons and principles while serving a full time mission in a foreign country.
(Yes, serving missions are hard and they challenge everyone spiritually, emotionally, psychologically, and physically...but for the vast majority it not only produces faithful members of the church but positive members of humanity that are productive community benefactors). Yet, you won’t hear these types of examples in videos put out by exmolex and her cohorts. You will only get the reductio ad absurdum spin...
Now, I typically don’t advertise my involvement in these things, but when you make the incoherent claim to someone that it is sad they don’t “put their intelligence to better use” and cryptically claim they don’t exhibit the “light of love” you may want to think 5-6 times before you push send....
Dr DLehrsch32 that's not actually what I said. I was rephrasing from " the glory of God is intelligence" because the glory of God is Love.
I know a lot of really good beautiful people like you who are Mormons. I also know a lot of equally good beautiful people who are not Mormon.
The reason I left was not even based directly on the verifiable falsity of Joseph Smith. I left because the doctrine is inconsistent, illogical, and most importantly antichristian.