Check out part TWO of this topic!: ruclips.net/video/HCQ_N571VAA/видео.html Here it is. As promised, my Halo video to celebrate 50,000 subs. I actually made this many months ago, and decided it would be fun to hold it for a 50k celebration. That's why the audio and production may feel a little different compared to my most recent material. Thank you to everyone who's been supporting me. All the new Doom people, back to the MK9 boys. This video isn't one of my normal analysis or opinion pieces. It's a collection of thoughts I've had for 20 years about how this game affected the world around me. I know it's not what was expected, but I hope you enjoy it anyway. (I can feel a bad like ratio coming just based on the title, but hey, that's okay. I'm having fun here.) *** side note, when I say Bioshock felt modernized (even though it had some classic shooter mechanics), I meant that it felt made for console playing speed. Not talking about regenerating health and weapon limits. I could have worded that better. If you like my content, consider supporting me on Patreon. patreon.com/underthemayo RUclips Memberships to my channel now available, click the "Join" button. Follow me on Twitch at twitch.tv/underthemayo Join the Discord: discord.gg/s4PEVcc
Mayo you should check out RAGE 2, it's very aggressive combat with extremely satisfying gunplay and health dropped from killed enemies. But the story and open world is bad
Wow I thought I was the only one who felt this way about halo, I don’t hate the game it’s ok but it felt so slow, tedious & frustrating. Halo 2 is slightly better and halo 3 didn’t really improve the gameplay that much, I also agree with Under the Mayo about FEAR gameplay is much better than halo.
Not the video I was expecting, but I liked it and made me look at my one favorite franchises from another set of eyes. I never thought of Halo as ruining something, but now I know it kinda did indirectly. It’s cool and weird to see how our scenarios were kinda similar yet completely different outcomes. I saw halo for the first time when I was very young like kindergarten or younger and immediately became fascinated by it because I loved sci-fi as well. I couldn’t get a hold of my own halo game until way later in life but I was so happy when I did. But now all that kids want to do is play fortnite, and when I mention they should try halo I get immediately turned down. Sorry for the rant thing I just did, I just think this video really opened my eyes to something I never thought of before
Halo didn't ruin FPS games, everyone else desperately trying to copy it overall ruined FPS games. Same with CoD. Honestly, extremely tired of giuant boring open world FPS games with RPG elements.
Halo actually did ruin FPS games by itself creating the demand for these mechanics and Halo itself being pretty much intolerable to play for gamers used to PC FPS games
@@sh_i_ro yes brother. We must unite and pave the way for the James regime. Our army will conquer all. When the 2020 nightmare is over a new world will be born. Born of Jameses. Rise up great army of Jameses! Our time is nigh!
Actually, you can still rocket jump, but it it much, much more limited than quake’s rocket jump. You can only jump right when you collect the overshield.
The interesting thing about Halo is that I feel it kind of did coincide alongside PC shooters that existed in a different part of the market. While Halo certainly did affect console shooters, I saw a lot more Half-Life influence in PC releases. Games like F.E.A.R. and Doom 3 were definitely more Half-Life than Halo. Hell, I refer to that time as the Half-Life era.
You're definitely right about that. Not many games tried to replicate Halo's gameplay loop on PC, probably due in large part to the more free controls available, and the fact that Halo obviously had a very limited audience on PC. I think Call of Duty had a much more obviously negative impact on the style of games we got after it got big and popular.
Yeah I agree, it wasn't really until the late 2000s-early 2010s that PCs started getting games that were console-first and the markets merged. PC had Battlefield 1942/Battlefield 2, Half-Life 1/2, Doom 3, Far Cry 1, Crysis, to name a few. All huge PC shooters that were scaled back, if available at all, on console releases.
PC shooters were influenced by Half Life 1 focus on narrative, scripted set piece moments and world building but gameplay wise those games are not really similar. Doom 3 was a slow paced action horror game and FEAR was a intermediately paced tactical shooter. Half Life 1 plays and feels like Quake 2 but with reloading, more interesting levels and story. Its gameplay is still very fast paced with fast movement, b-hopping, aggressive enemy ai and no weapon limit. GoldSrc engine is also heavily modified Quake engine.
@@fuckso2342They play waaay more like Half-Life than they do Halo. Narrative focused linear fps where you can carry as many weapons as you want (aside from fear)
@Something Diabolical The key to being good at halo is running pistol / sniper and headshotting everything before it even is close enough to spot you. Because you move like a man stuck in mud
I'd argue that Halo to the fps genre is what RE4 is to the horror genre. It's an incredible game but because of its success, it had spurred an enormous amount of cheap cop outs and imitations in order to leech off it.
I'm talking about how the game to felt when it came out and I was sitting in rooms with my friends playing casually. Most of my feelings and evaluation of the game in this video are voiced in the past, reflecting how I felt 20 years ago.
Halo is like the Shrek of FPS games. Green bois staring in great games who would cause shitty imitators to copy its mechanics without understanding why Halo used said mechanics.
Halo(CE)'s health system makes sense in the setting. You're in a power suit with a recharging energy shield built on reverse-engineered alien technology, along with some armour plating that could take some hits that shared a system with the marines. What happened to the genre was like if Metroid took off like Halo did & then you had WW2 & modern military soldiers morphballing all over the place & having guns instead of hands. But at least that would've been kinda fun & wacky!
@@Gruntvc at least major publishers finally seem to be understanding that diversification is better for ongoing profitability than putting all your eggs in the trend-chasing basket. But they still wish they were Zynga & Epic so bad. It's almost like they forgot they swallowed Blizzard already then WoW stopped growing & what they're trying to do is neither possible nor sustainable.
@@pradeepdungdung4379 343's Halos are hiliarious. For all the harm Halo did to FPS's diversity, it was at least a trendsetter. And then 343 comes along to follow new trends that more or less killed Halo's relevancy today. Let's hope that id doesn't start making the same mistakes now that Microsoft owns them too.
While I understand you felt that as a kid, you're wrong at Halo's role in gaming. Halo isn't a cover shooter, and I don't recommend playing it like one, you're actively thinking, reloading, or repositioning yourself when your shields are low and shouldn't just be sitting in a corner doing nothing. Halo was the transitional game between the old quake likes and the cover shooter, it's a mix of both. Halo fans have no problem with battle royale when it comes to changing gameplay (how does that affect halo?) Games like COD actually changed Halo with sprint and loadout-like mechanics is what damaged Halo for many. I don't mean to be rude but I just felt that you misrepresented Halo's role in the evolution of shooters
I think a good analogy can be made, and that's with comics Before Superman, many heroes wore trench coats, duel wielding pistols and was extremely detective driven, until Superman happened and everything changed, the golden age of comics is when everyone copied the spandex trend with powers until YEARS until a handful of publishers took action and returned to the old.
"I tried to give Halo another chance, so I played the oldest and slowest game" It's obviously your opinion that the tactical, cover, whatever you want to call them shooters had detrimental effects on the genre. But saying it that way also implies that the only good shooters are the extremely fast arena Quake/Unreal/Doom style ones. How would you create a believable world and tell a believable story about humanity fighting against a technologically superior alien alliance if you designed the game with large, open levels, aliens that died very quickly, and a super soldier that can carry an entire arsenal all on his own but dies just as quickly as the aliens? None of it goes together. Now, we could sit around and think of how to make those gameplay elements work that way, but that's the point I'm making. Gameplay and narrative serve each other. Doom will never have a moment like Noble 6 sacrificing himself to ensure the Pillar of Autumn escapes Reach. The Spartan super soldiers, as strong as they are, are still normal humans and their deaths are impactful moments. Doomguy is an unstoppable superhuman force and the gameplay is meant to make you feel that way. It's just pure chaotic fun. A game like Halo puts me in the middle of a real conflict, as a real human soldier. Like, when I get the rocket launcher in Doom, I got, alright, another weapon. In Halo, picking up the rocket launcher is a big deal. They are a precious resource and getting the maximum damage out of it is very satisfying. I dunno, that's how I see things. I like Doom and Halo. Not for the gameplay, for how they make me feel.
Really good points about how the movement and the lore create an impactful moment in the games. even when I was a young dude these moments did not make me cry but certainly touched me. I hated Halo 4 and the direction Halo went in after Halo Reach. I replayed these games years ago and the ending of Halo 3 touches me more than had I not played it in a more aware status.
this is literally the video. I see everyone praise his takes, but.... the second he starts talking about Halo, which is around 8 minutes in, he just says "it isn't doom". Every negative he says is just something that Doom had and Halo didn't, as if any shooter that isn't Doom automatically hurt video games. Reloading, the shield, the movement that isn't almost flying, the 2 weapons. Yeah man, it isn't doom, but there's a very good reason it became so popular Xbox Live would have failed without it. Doom (both original and new) are extremely good games and very influencial, but... just because Halo wasn't doom, that doesn't mean it wasn't good. I can understand where the criticism comes from, but all of it feels like "It wasn't like the game I loved, so it's not good".
@@lolmarko4897 I didn't miss the point, I watched the entirety of the video. The points he makes, however, I do not agree with and continuously boil down to shooters after Halo not being like Doom, which he liked.
@@steliosvagianos8445i think what they mean by point of the vid is that mayo said at the beginning that nearly the whole video is opinionated and biased, but how he feels. So its completely fine to disagree, this is just what he personally thinks.
I felt that when he said that in the video. As far as I know, I don't recall having that happen to me before (mainly cuz I rarely went to a few game tournament parties), but I honestly felt sad when he mentioned this happened to him. I can only imagine being the only person to bring their setup for a game your friends use to play only to find yourself playing that game alone and remembering the fun times you had playing said game while your same friends are currently playing the next big thing a few inches away from you in walking length.
@@HK-07 oh I get that. For me I grew up on the fps games he doesn't enjoy like halo and call of duty, etc. So those type of games never truly bugged me because I never saw, or let alone noticed, the walking speeds or the amount of guns you can carry because I just stick to the flow of the shooters I play. I never cared about my character running like the flash, or carrying an arsenal to experiment with against enemies, but for those who did grew up playing those type of fps games I can totally understand the frustration. The only thing I disagree with him on in this video is him putting the blame on halo as being the sole reason for the pivot of game design when it comes to fps games in the 2000s/2010s. The industry should be blamed for trying to make shooters feel like halo rather than trying to do their own unique style of fps games. But hey, with the growing boomer shooter renaissance that's been happening lately, and with triple a companies making fast paste 90 style games like the new doom and wolfenstein games, who knows? We might be seeing more of these style of fps games in the years to come. I just want a new turok game damnit! Lol
@@HK-07 nothing wrong with casual players, I cannot stand these hyper cuck doom players, I like doom, but almost everyone who plays doom has some superiority complex like they’re somehow better than other gamers and casual gamers can’t play.
@@HK-07 "it made me want say “YEAH! Fuck you!” to the people or “casuals” that the industry favoured but shamelessly left the old-school FPS players in the dust. I wouldn’t actually say that to them though." B R U H
@@viperlife914 I swear most of the people defending Halo here didn't watch the video in full. I love classic Halo and yet I still agree 100% with Mayo's points.
It's more "PC Gamer cries about something that has nothing to actually do with Halo." There was multiple large properties before Halo that had all the "issues" Halo had, but apparently they don't count for some reason.
It was a good video, but if you were worried about this video getting people angry before they clicked, i would changed the title to something a little Less clickbaity.
@@belottov to be fair, he had some really shitty hot takes in that video with opinions he probably could have just kept to himself. It just comes off like he just wants every game to play exactly like Doom. Which I doubt he actually believes, but it does come across that way.
A lot of the design choices in Halo weren't done because of console limitations, they were done intentionally. Bungie wanted players to make more tactical choices and interact with the environment more by limiting them to two weapons. Making grenades and melee attached to buttons instead of a whole weapon slot made combat flow better, even on PC. Halo was revolutionary for finally moving FPS combat forward instead of sticking with the stale formula used since Wolfenstein, also, weapon balance in Halo is entirely built around only being able to carry two weapons. It's not Halo fault if a million other games copied that limitation without copying the overall design that made it work.
Halo felt intolerably slow and unfun for PC gamers by itself and without the help of any other games, games trying to copy it basically just turned it into a vortex that was sucking in franchises we loved and watering them down, and though that was the real injury, you guys are all ignoring that another point the guy made and that a lot of people share was that Halo was not a fun game for PC FPS gamers
People like you throw the word “tactical” around a lot, I don’t think you know what it means. The two weapon limit isn’t tactical, its disruptive. The game wants you to use the right weapon for the job, yet the game expects you to stop playing the game for a while to look for the right weapon on the ground. It’s not fun, it’s not clever and it’s just fucking annoying. And before you go “you just can’t play the game lol”, I cleared the entire of CE of Legendary and have beaten nearly all Covenant levels with just assault rifle and pistol, so don’t pull the “you can’t play” crap on me. “Moving FPS combat forward”? Don’t fucking make me laugh.
I'm expecting this to be a good quality video that I disagree with. Open to being convinced but doubt that will happen. Expect this to be more an argument for homogenization in shooters post halo like we saw with cod and titanfall after that.
Halo had a dozen copycats that imitated the health regen and two weapon limit, but forgot to include the varying enemy types that played off each other and sandbox level design.
I see where you're coming from as a massive doom fan, but man... Not everyone wants a game as fast paced as Doom. I love the shit out of it and it definitely has the best combat in any shooter ever, but the downside is that it's *exhausting* to play for any length of time, especially for someone used to other FPSs. Most of the time I like being able to chill behind cover and pick enemies off with precision weapons, use stealth in any capacity, basically use the playstyles that Doom makes completely impossible. As for enemies' shields recovering, git gud. If you can't keep fire on someone long enough to kill them before they kill you, get better, that's where the challenge comes from in Halo. Learn to use cover, learn to stop your enemies from taking advantage of it. It sounds like you just don't like the mechanics of Halo (which again I get, it's just not your style and that's fine), but you can't say that one of the most innovative and successful FPSs of all time ruined the genre; that's objectively false.
@Leon Johansson Well then, Halo would eventually get boring if it was it's only own game mechanic, the point of gaming is to expand and be creative, it's all about preference, but from this guy, he's being biased as hell for fast paced shooters.
@Leon Johansson Well guess what, Doom isn't even close to being a dead franchise, and people have to accept the fact not everyone likes fast paced games every now and then, Mechanics like Halo feel fresh and alive, while mechanics like wolfenstein gets repetitive at times. Its called "Innovation".
@Leon Johansson That's not point I said, what I said was If the whole Wolfenstein mechanics were still around and Halo didn't even exist, then the Wolfensteins mechanics would get repetitive, and the genre of fps would fall, same goes for Halo vise versa though, BUT there's other games like Halo that are somewhat similar to Halos mechanics, but are different from one another, people didn't just like cod for it's gameplay back then, it was also it's story telling and characters, every has preferences on these type of games, however when I looked at the title of this video, all I saw was pretty much ( Make Fast Paced Shooters great again), there's nothing wrong playing those types of games, people just intend to find other game mechanics more interesting. Good day.
@CessNight5672 he's saying halo ruined fps it was the first case of this not the legacy or whatever this one game then everything else that adapted these systems
@CessNight5672 the industry made the game the design choices is what ruined the fps genre the game mechanics and systems completely made fps games different so it is the game or at least what makes up the game
This idea of Halo being this game designed to be a molasses-coated slogfest so that it could be playable on consoles is kinda funny to me. I first played Halo CE on PC and absolutely loved it, and I still play it on PC to this day because it's my favourite way to play. I love Halo's slower pace because, well, it's different. Every shooter wants to be this coke-snorting hyper-speed ADHD nightmare and it gets tiresome sometimes. I like Playing Halo because it's more mellow pace is refreshing and allows other parts of the game to shine. I hate how recent games have tried to constantly speed up the pace of gameplay. Also, you say the enemies are visually bland? *HERESY*
I somehow doubt that considering that COD came after Halo and they're essentially very close to the same type of movement and gameplay mechanics like regenating health and nerfed movement compared to games like Quake 3 in 1999.
I kinda understand your feelings, but to me it seems like you wanted every FPS to be an arena shooter, but arena shooters are obviously a subgenre, the fact that Halo and the generation of games that followed took the attention away from arena shooters is also because of a point of no innovation that arena shooters had reached. I personally love the Halo saga, maybe more than any other game franchise, and as a guitarist the fact tha Halo 2 had a soundtrack improvised by Steve Vai was a big part of that. The skirmish mode in Reach is something you would rly love imo anyways, give it a try.
@@arnoldSwollenmember well you could argue that the 90s were all just Wolfenstein and Doom clones. Its a dumb argument. The industry will chase trends where the majority of attraction lies. This happens with all genres, not just FPS.
One of the biggest offenders must be Duke Nukem Forever: from what started as a fast-paced old-school shooter, just to embrace the modern trend of regenerated health & taking cover, linear path, and being limited to hold only 2 weapons at any given times! All this while marketing makes him looks like the same badass he used to be, only to reveal that you just play another one of those shooters where you hide like a bitch every time you get a boo-boo!
@@DMCMaster550 almost any time Duke Nukem does that it's more a friendly poke, but tribute to those games. It's more for the devs. Duke Nukem 3D did the same with Doom. DNF is still ass though.
As a hardcore Halo fan, I loved this video. I loved your honest critique and your different view of the shooter industry coming from the PC world. And I loved how you connected Halo's effect back then to the Battle Royal effect today 🙌🙌
Thanks. I really do respect the series even though it's not for me. It's not Halo the game that was bad. It was the homogenization of shooters in the wake of its success.
@@underthemayo no absolutely not you'd just burn yourself out playing that forever but you made some really good points and all I have to say is great job, a well executed video
@@underthemayo no absolutely not you'd just burn yourself out playing that forever but you made some really good points and all I have to say is great job, a well executed video
The problem isn't Halo, the problem is we need more games like Doom 2016, Doom Eternal and Quake Champions but game companies don't wanna develop those types of fps's
Well, to be fair, we have a metric fuckton of throwback FPS shooters made by Indie companies now. Look up New Blood Interactive if you wanna look for a publisher with them, they wear that shit like a badge of honor. DUSK, Blood, ULTRAKILL... Then there's other amazing shooters with retro graphics and high adrenaline gameplay like Project Warlock and Strafe. Long story short, there's a ton of stuff to enjoy, but it's indie games
@@jajkub2001 yeah i don't think those games ever stopped to be honest its just that cover based shooters were more mainstream... plus there have been hybrid game like the borderlands series where u can run and gun and play slow methodical if u want.
Really, really interesting video. Not something I see very often: a highly subjective, individual-level interpretation of a game, based more on past recollection than objective analysis. And as a longtime Halo fan, it was indeed refreshing to see. I love Halo and always will, but you made some great points from a perspective that I don't have.
I get you’re points mate and honestly fair enough. But I feel you’re kinda missing the point in halo: it’s supposed to be a mix between sci fi Action and grounded military shooter.. I think most design decisions were made with that in mind
Pretty much this. A good 50%of this was basically "hey....this isnt doom, or quake, what the hell?!!!!!" Kinda ticked me off because the thought process is kinda idiotic. Every game should be seen through a new lens, if you want to compare you have to compare them between accurate means, comparing halo to quake is apples to oranges.
Most people forget that Bungie tested different guns at shooting ranges so that they could model in-game weapons after real-life weapons in terms of looks, sounds, and how they feel. Oh, and they also fused vehicular combat into a FPS in campaign and multi-player which really hadn't been done before Halo CE, other than Mech Warrior (but you couldn't jump out of your Mech, Titanfall style and run and gun on foot).
Because Hes biased with Fast paced shooters, imagine if every game were to be a fast paced, the shooter genre would be repetitive and no longer be interesting for people and move on to something else, people may say other game companys are copying Halos mechanics, but it isn't really copying, it's just expanding more mechanics and more new gameplay feels from other franchise, such as cod, hunting games, battlefield, Rainbow six siege, etc. If every game were to have Doom game mechanics, then what's the point playing other games, if Doom is that only arcade special franchise to enjoy.
Also, In real life you reload. That’s more realistic and you can’t expect the future to not have bullets reload themselves. And it’s balanced for multiplayer because who wants a guy spamming none stop. Not all games can just be like your taste
Yeah it's... kind of weird how he keeps talking about how X is ok in military shooters and not ok in the military sci-fi shooter Halo. Bit of a retard take.
While I don't agree with you, it is refreshing to see someone who can critique something they don't enjoy without attacking it, or the fan base. Halo 1 is still my favourite FPS. You can have a different opinion, mayo, but as a huge fan, it's good to hear that you can respect why people do enjoy it. Criticism without hate, thank you.
Huge halo fan boy here but I totally see your point of view. Halo isn’t for everyone. My gf actually thinks it’s very slow paced and is always the game she’s least down to play. Same with my best friend. So I get it. Even I feel like that sometimes after playing the new doom games. Totally agree with the Halo effect thing going on with battle royals now. I hate it lol.
I never got the hype for Halo. The story is booooring as shit and the gameplay is super lame. Maybe because it came on xbox back in the day everyone got in the hype train. I always compare Halo with Skyrim. Both water down FPS.
I really don't think it was Bungie's fault for causing games to change this dramatically. They just tried shaking it up a little bit, and people liked it. Because of that, fps games changed. More and more companies tried to recreate what halo has created. I just don't think it's right to blame halo, and halo only, for trying to be different.
Before you comment, think of it this way. You're in school and you have lots of time left in your math class. You decide to leave early, because one person leaving can't hurt too bad, right? Well there's a full classroom full of students with nothing to do, so they follow you little by little. Its not the first persons fault for trying something new, it's the people who followed.
@@chxsek Halo didn’t even start out as an FPS game. It was originally supposed to be a science fiction clone of Bungie’s previous fantasy RTS, the StarCraft to Myth’s Warcraft.
As a person that grew up with CoD and halo and shooters like this. I can confirm that after I finished playing fortnite because it just wasn’t the same. I’m realizing that this is going to be bad for the games that I love like CoD and such. I tried DOOM 2016 out and loved it and ever since I have loved those boomer shooters more than anything. In fact DOOM Eternal is now my favorite game to release.
It's not about trends, it's really down to execution. Activision milked Call of Duty to death, and between all the imitators and endless marketing it was easy to hate on it, but at the end of the day they made great blockbuster singleplayer campaigns and had addictive multiplayer deathmatch when at their peak. Doom Eternal is a very different kind of shooter, even compared to the other Doom games, but I think it is definitely one of the best FPS games of all time, and I'm a classic Doom fan first. Just because battle royale is popular among the kids who play Fortnite because it's free, it doesn't mean the game is good. In fact, usually the free shit sucks. If it didn't, the devs would realize they could charge money for it.
You are giving Fortnite too much credit. Its literally just a test bed for Unreal Engine 4 and now UE5 updates. Do you really think the seasons are there to give people new things? No, it's to test new mechanics, bug fixes, physics etc.
You're not imagining stuff, what you said about NIN is true, Trent also told the developers themselves when he was making the music for Quake. He also confessed that the Fragile was also constantly delayed because of Quake's multiplayer. I think you can find that interview if you google it with the right words.
@@underthemayo Ok, can I prompt you with something? Halo is built as a tactical shooter, but I feel like other shooters borrowed Halo’s mechanics, despite not being tactical shooters. A run and gun fps game shouldn’t adopt features for a tactical shooter like Halo. I think it was just “Halo is popular, lets put Halo features in our game” without understanding the purpose of Halo’s design choices. This is coming from someone who’s beat all of them on Legendary, so I’m obviously biased.
You've got to be taking the piss but as a long time halo fan I'm seeing current trends ruin halo itself with them trying to add all this mediaeval stuff into MCC and how they just seem to want to turn it into fortnight with wacky armors and bring back armor effects
@Low Tier BBCFactory Fully agree. Reloads can be super fun and add to the strategy of a game. In Halo, having a point where you're incentivised to switch weapon or charge at an enemy to melee them because your clip ran out is good. On the flip side, Doom having no reloads plays into the gameplay style. The strategy in that game is learning how to keep your guns stocked with ammo so you can keep putting out as much damage as possible. Both fun, very different games.
@@KaptainKommissar I understand his points fine, especially because I'm a huge fan of the kinds of games he's talking about. I specifically think that saying "reloading means waiting till I can have fun again" is batshit insane. Please explain what I missed.
4 года назад+42
There is a thing called "flow state", when your mind is completely focused on the task at hand and your brain is most efficient at working on that task. In that flow state, if the game manages to get you in it, any kind of stopping is very disappointing. To put it simply: getting into cover to dodge incoming fire is great, getting into cover because your auto-regenerating health bar needs to recharge is not. You can see these two concepts in work at two quite similar games (even though neither of them has health regen), Counter-Strike Global Offensive and Rainbow Six Siege: in CSGO, you learn to peek and shoot while moving between different positions all the time, whereas in RSS your ability to lay down and camouflage itself makes you wait at a very specific angle like a booby trap. In CSGO, you can get into the flow and keep it for the whole round - in RSS, you just wait until the right triggers are touched for you to start reacting to the game.
As someone who has been playing Halo for 15 years and (obviously) loves Halo, this is a really well-made video and I personally think it's spot on. However, I want to add some context on the Halo multiplayer in particular that I hope others watching the video find useful. For Halo 1 and 2 in particular, the games were *much* faster than you would originally think due to the extremely high technical ceiling for these games. The famous TSK (three shot kill) in Halo 1 with the primary weapon (the pistol) is extremely fast and you got around the inherent slowness with reloading and close-quarters combat with glitches like the backpack reload and BLB (grenade - beatdown - grenade). The sniper of course was also a 1 shot kill that felt smooth and fired quickly. Movement felt smooth overall but did feel stilted when jumping. There were some tricks (grenade jumps, OS + rocket jumps, etc) to make movement faster that also increased the skill gap. For Halo 2, things got even crazier. The auto-aim in that game was so ridiculous that it wasn't hard for anyone to put together a relatively quick kill, but if you got good at reticule positioning, general reaction time, and map understanding, you would be unstoppable with the sniper in particular due to quickscoping. And then there were so many button glitches to make things even faster. YY (double switch which acted as a ubiquitous end lag canceling mechanism) and grenade reloading (off-host, which is most of the time) made reloading feel lightning quick. BYYB, BXB, BXR, RRBX for near instant kills close up. RRX (double shot) to make the BR almost a 2 shot kill when combined with YY. Crouch jumping felt really smooth and powerful as it unlocked so many locations around the maps (Ring 3 on Sanctuary, Pink 3 on Midship, shortcut jump on Lockout, etc). The button glitches all had pretty tight execution windows and they, combined with all the other wonderful aspects of Halo 2, made Halo 2 an amazing fast-paced competitive shooter with a sky-high skill ceiling. Unfortunately, Halo and the rest of the industry moved away from the speed of the first 2 games (who can blame the devs, a lot of this was on accident), so I've been getting more and more jaded about Halo and the shooter genre in general since Halo 3. But in the end, even the best Halos can't compete with the original PC shooters in terms of fluidity and speed - There's no denying that. Anyways, thanks for the video - I can tell a lot of effort was put into it and it's just really good. :)
@@donovan6320 i dont consider Halo to actually be all that slow in reality, sure its not "Fast" like Doom, but just because its not Fast doesnt mean its Slow. Now you can say comparatively its Slower, but again this is relative to what its being compared to.
It's funny you mentioned bioshock because that series is a perfect example of how consoles affected shooters. The first two games let you use your full arsenal and even had different ammo types for each weapon. Then infinite put in a two weapon limit , regenerating shields and went from a free roam environment to wave based encounters.
The logic here makes no sense. The first two games were made on console so how did console gaming affect the third one negatively? You are confusing console and the games on console that became popular, COD being the most popular game for years in a row is what created that, not the console.
@@BananaMana69 Actually he's right, but for completely wrong reasons. Bioshock was dumbed down for consoles. If you Play System Shock 2 you'll realize that Bioshock is just a dumbed down System Shock 2, but with a more unique aesthetic and nice graphics. Even the story beats are somewhat copied, but maybe a bit more cleverly presented in Bioshock.
@@JackChop I had heard that Rage 2 plays a lot like Doom Eternal since there are a lot of upgrades that will make you feel like a bad ass in the later game - which I know came out before, but a youtuber compared rage 2 to doom reboot and eternal.
I'd love to know too. I love his channel. And it's not like I hate halo or think it's a series. I get why its loved and why it's important. This video is more about capturing why myself and others felt this way when it came out. ActMan's thoughts would be great.
Not gonna lie, as much as I love halo, I miss the old frantic pace of arena shooters, damn you fortnite for killing the revival of unreal tournament and overwatch for causing quake champions to have abilities
Not even just the arena shooters (which we still have - although I guess Apex Legends and Overwatch aren't as fast as UT/Q3) - what's totally missing is that arena combat/movement system in a *single-player* campaign-driven game. There is no modern equivalent of Unreal, Half-Life, Quake... except *maybe* Doom 2016/Eternal.
As a fan who grew up with Halo, this is a really interesting perspective. You have really opened my eyes to your perspective, I now feel like I understand how trends and different land mark games effect the industry. Halo was the next Doom, Fortnite is the next Halo.
Great points, I totally agree with your observation except for the last bit. Halo was an arena shooter, so it was really more in the same category of COD, even Counterstrike. What happened is that a new genre of game became the main thing. I think that had something to do with the changing times and definitely the advances in technology. Having 16 people on a LAN party was crazy back in the say, but a massive online arena with 150 people was inconceivable. Fortnite was the next PUBG and PUBG took a concept that was itself first popularized in media by the rise of Battle Royale. Not in games even, but first in the Hunger Games book and movies, itself part of the trend of YA post-apocalyptic novels. I guess it just goes to show how the different areas of media and tech intersect to form pop culture.
Quake was the next Doom, Half-Life was the next Quake and Halo was the next Half-Life... too bad Half-Life 2 didn't become the next Halo, because that would have been a great direction for the shooters to come... instead Call of Duty, and it's ilk of boring tactical, cover based shooters became the next trend.
TBH, console ruin gaming, in a way, when Devs actively limit themselves BECAUSE they make games with console in mind, thats why you have 4 skills because of controllers... when games made with PC in mind with have 8-10 skills because you have 1-0 on a keyboard.
@@desko2041 Eh, I have a nitpick with this comment. You see, although people type out long and exaggerated paragraphs on why the disagree, it’s a bit ridiculous to boil it down to something so small. Do you get that? Because I don’t think you do. I really don’t understand how someone could say something so preposterous and benign, that I MAY just smoke a cigar and read a page from my favorite book, “Writing for Dummy’s”. Anyways, to get back to your point, I think people have a very good reason to type out an extremely long comment on why they disagree. I mean, if this “Mayo” man can make a twenty minute video on it, why can’t I comment a two thousand word essay on I think he’s wrong? Interesting how a different perspective can change someone’s opinion...
Dude, you couldn’t have said that any better, I’m a hardcore halo fan myself and halfway through the vid my fanboy blood was boiling a little, but somehow you got your point across and I understand, subbed Absolute legend
I'm a Halo fan and I loved this video!! Our backgrounds in FPS games are very different considering what Wolfenstein was for you Halo 3 was for me, but I totally understand where you are coming from. I'm happy I subbed to you all those months back, it was definitely worth it. Congrats on 50k!!
Insightful nice. Although I do disagree with you on some points, you have my full respect and admiration for turning a video I was ready to dislile (due to my ignorance) into something that helped me look at things through the bigger picture with excellently presented constructive criticism. Bravo! I wholeheartedly thank you for enlightening me and you have my utnost sympathy.
@@ChairmanKam The "Just Cause" series and a hundred other games have grapple hooks, "Halo: Infinite" has been in development since before "DOOM 2016", now shut the fuck up about Halo 'stealing' ideas from other games, no one owns an idea or a concept only their IP and this video explains it best: ruclips.net/video/6ZQPxKG1O3Y/видео.html
@@starhammer5247 You clearly missed my point, but that's ok. 343i has been allergic to Halo's DNA since "Legends", and they need to actually acknowledge what they have here. They have VERY clearly been chasing trends. Believe me, no one wants me to be wrong more than me.
@@ChairmanKam Alright, but the grapple hook in Infinite is meant more for exploration than combat and has been in development for longer than Eternal, and in the trailer, you can see the grapple hook is used in far more creative ways than the meat hook as the meathook is primarily used for combat rather than exploration (speedrunner's don't count). But I do agree that 343 hasn't been doing the greatest job when handling Halo, but I get really pissed off when people start criticizing crap when it isn't even out yet or haven't even looked at the rest of it so I'd prefer for people to post their criticisms after they've played the game rather than before it's even released, it's just annoying when someone judges something before it's even out or complete.
I have a feeling you'd find Marathon a really interesting missing link here. Reloading, story/objective based level design, checkpoints, but naturally a huge Doom influence with health being an even bigger rarity.
@Michal Litecký Doom 3 didn't suck. Doom 3 just wasn't Doom. Give it a different story and a different name and it would have been completely different in its reception.
I also kinda get the feeling that the original doom games didn't have reloading due to how young the genre was, rather than it being a tactical, purposeful exclusion by the devs for gameplay reasons.
See this is how you talk/debate about something. Not bashing the game, not hating the player base, etc. Just giving your honest opinion. Excellent work mayo
too bad facts dont care about opinions, and that some of his bigger complaints are just simply false. Not to say that everything was incorrect, but he seems to only be addressing the symptom of his root problem rather than the actual cause for it. "Combat Evolved" isnt the problem for him, its that he just doesnt like consoles, or that he wants all games to feel like Doom or Tribes or Quake or something. I dont understand the animosity towards games like Halo or CoD or Battlefield even, it just comes off as elitist and kinda douchy.
ah shit you got me bro, nice comeback /s in fact however I did have the misfortune of watching this clickbait tier hot take. Its not trying to be objective, lets be real here. Its coming from a place of raw emotion and is only indicative of the author's opinion. That being the case, its not completely devoid of merit. He's entitled to hold his opinion, as are his fans and followers. If you count yourself among them, thats fantastic, he really does have some good quality videos out there. But this aint it Chief.
@@ClassMRule He's made it clear in the video that Halo is a great game. More importantly, his problem is how the influence of Halo lead to a huge quantity of imitators, and as such the FPS market became one-sided instead of this balanced mixture of varied FPS games made for their respective platforms, either PC or Console. Obviously, he prefers the faster FPS games made for PC, but that wasn't the main focus. Of course, when you say stuff that shows you either haven't watched the video or don't get the clear context, you're bound to say a load of rubbish.
@@ultrairrelevantnobody1862 Would you say that Rogue "killed" Roguelikes, or that Metroid/Castlevania "killed" Metroidvania games? Or that Dark Souls "killed" Soulslikes? Because thats comprabale to saying that Halo "killed" the genre of "Halo-Killers" which followed the games industry influence following the popularity of the console shooter.
It takes BALLS to post something like this (esp w the click baity title). But I understand and respect why you posted it. While I may disagree very VERY heavily about how you view FPS, it's not to say it's wrong. You just view it differently. Hope you get more subs Mayo Man.
That’s why nowadays it’s way better since classic, and modern can exist instead of being one sided. Which is basically what happened in the past 15 years of shooters.
@MEME GOD I mean you were clearly salty. You threw out a heavily opinionated comment and insulted new shooters lol running fast and shooting at the same time doesn’t require more skill than good positioning and good aim. Just different skill. You have no arguments you’re just... salty
@MEME GOD running around and shooting takes as much skill as positioning, and having decent enough aim. Obviously, games like quake require skill, from denying weapon pick ups, to area control, but the same can be said for games like Rainbow Six Siege, or even Halo 3, you need skill for every game, unless your playing something like COD💀, honestly why can’t we just appreciate these games and stop arguing over them? It’s one person opinion to the next .
"I know your pain, guys. I've been there." A sentiment that is comforting, to say the least. Expertly done, this is getting my like, and if your other videos are as well put as this, I'll be subbed shortly after.
Except he wasn't. He's complaining that he didn't like the game design direction. Games themselves were still fine full priced games. What people are now facing are games being actively cut and sold in pieces, predatory monetization practices. Mobile games. All he went through is see FPS games start to prefer a style that wasn't to his own taste, but they were still proper full games.
When you said a lot of old school halo players might have adverse reactions to battle royale games like you did with halo I instantly understood how you felt and for the entire video I was thinking that "yeah halo blew up and changed shooters for sure but its not that big of a deal right"? But holy shit I understand now, I grew up with halo and it was the first shooter I ever played and seeing all these battle royale games just pop up out of nowhere and completely change everything felt kinda shitty. Now I'll be honest I've spent more time playing fortnite than I'm happy to admit and the game isn't inherently bad (got a horrible community though) but like you said about halo and how you could just never truly get into it because it wasn't like your classic fast paced pc shooters, well I guess its the same for me with all these battle royale games. On a side note though I absolutely fucking love the old school fast paced shooters. Doom is definitely one of my favorite games alongside Halo and Dark souls. It was interesting to learn about your perspective of halo.
@@miguelcorreia6777 That's because of hype. Back then, when games were announced, very few people got to see the trailers, teasers, etc. They didn't know much about how the game would be unless they attended conventions or had demo versions. These days, you have an autistic entity called 'the internet' that would over-intensify any kind of trailer or teaser and give revenue to the greedy company making the said game and release it in an unfinished state anyway. For Halo CE's case, this one game went against the mainstream view that FPS games aren't suitable on console, and absolutely astounded everyone who played this game. This game had the quality and ability to revolutionize FPS in the way it did. Don't forget though, games like Return To Castle Wolfenstein (my favorite Wolfenstein even to this day and I'd still recommend this game to anyone who wants to play quality FPS shooter games) came after Halo and it was still praised a lot. That game has heavy traits of the old school arena genre. We also have games like System Shock 2 and Deus Ex that also influenced the class-based SP side of things a lot, and I feel sad that this genre (supposedly coined as 'immersive sim') isn't that talked about these days. And you also had the terribly underrated MilSim sparkers like Operation Flashpoint CWC (now called ArmA CWA) which set forward the Military Simulator genre. All these games had traits and qualities in them that made them contribute to the gaming industry and provide more variety. You like fast paced action? Go play the old school arena games. You like ultra- realism? Try games like ArmA. You want a challenging action game with a compelling story and also a small blend of realism? You can try STALKER. You have so many options with such unique playstyles. While games like CoD came out and 'copied' the design that Halo set in motion, it made it's own contribution by bringing WW2 games to console and made them go mainstream. And games like Medal of Honor also had good campaigns. But Battle Royale has no redeeming factor in it. It's just a mod that came from another survival mod which was from a MilSim game. The only reason why it still exists now is because it's where the money's at these days, and thanks to the drama that unfolded between PUBG and Fortnite when this genre was new. This genre hasn't revolutionized anything. The current state of the video game industry is a show to how degenerative things have become. When BR was new, it was fresh. People like to try new things every once in a while. That's why it was enjoyable, BUT ONLY FOR THE SHORT TERM. It didn't have any more sophisticated things that could separate this gametype into a fully different genre. And now, despite that people have already enjoyed it for it's worth, the companies still want to milk it as much as possible.
It was way worse with Halo than with battle royale imo, because the effect of Halo was inescapable, but these days there are so many games being made you can really have your pick. I occasionally pick up battle royale games to check them out and sometimes even enjoy them for a while, but I never feel like the genre is infringing on the games I enjoy. Hell, the game that I have the most hours in on Steam is Hunt: Showdown, which is I suppose a kind of battle royale game. I guess that's a bit of a tangent, but Halo really did change basically the entire FPS landscape for the worse for PC players and did it in a way that was largely inescapable for years. You lived with the awareness that even if one of your favorite games got a sequel, it would most likely suck because of what Halo did to the market. You might get annoyed that Fortnight is so popular and how much your friends get into Twitch streamers, but you have so many other options and communities now that you can safely ignore that battle royale is even a thing when it comes to finding games you enjoy.
You know, i love Halo. I was ready to rage at this video before watching the whole thing, but as i was watching the intro, and your backstory, i started to remember my childhood, and playing all those amazing shooters on my dad's PC. Unreal Tournament is my favorite game of all time. Whenever i hear the term "First Person Shooter" it is the game that immediately comes to mind. I first played it back in 2001, i must've been only 7 years old at the time. My dad asked me if i wanted to play a game like DOOM (He didn't have Quake). Loving DOOM i of course said yes, and i was shown Unreal Tournament. I credit UT, as being the catalyst that made me into the gamer i am today, and despite what my play time on Steam says, (like 25 hours) over the past 18 years, I've played Unreal Tournament for untold thousands of hours. I can load it up anytime, and enjoy it, with a huge grin that stretches from ear to ear. Prior to 2016, i remember longing for an experience like Quake 3, or Unreal Tournament. And outside of a couple of examples like TOXXIK, and Nexuiz, i always went back to Quake Live, UT99, UT04, and UT3. Then DOOM (2016) came along, and hit me with such a huge dose of Dopamine, Adrenaline, and Nostalgia, i couldn't stop until the game was beaten. But, even then, DOOM had me concerned for a different reason Here's the status i wrote on Facebook shortly after playing DOOM (2016) for the first time: "Playing the new DOOM, makes me really depressed. Not because it's a bad game, DOOM Is amazing. No, what makes me depressed is just knowing it's gonna be overshadowed by less deserving Spunkgargleweewee games like Infinite Warfare, and Battlefield 1." While it wasn't completely, the talk was definitely about Infinite Warfare, BF1, and Overwatch. It was really disappointing to see so many GOTY awards go to Overwatch, when DOOM felt the freshest in 2016. Nowadays, it seems the old school shooter is starting to see a decent resurgence especially in the Indie scene. I really hope this renaissance of old school shooters continues for years to come. The popularity of DOOM (2016), and DOOM Eternal is great start. In the words of the late Totalbiscuit in his closing thoughts of DOOM (2016): "I certainly hope it spawns some imitators, and hopefully some good ones to." Fantastic video.
@@biglad3701 well i did watch it so, things change over time and its sad that he doesnt see that as a good thing, the entire video is basically him going "WAAAHHHH two weapon limit sucks WAAAHHHH recharging health WAAAAHHHH reloading" its like reloading makes the game more tactical as you have to chose when to leave yourself vanurable, its like a two weapon limit means you have to be tactical about your choice of weapons, its like recharging health means the action can go on for alot longer, if you have 5 health in wolfenstine or doom you have to go back and find a medkit or die in the next encounter witch slows the pace
@@jkbscopes1233 In modern Doom, glory kills refill health. At least Doom improved in keeping the fast-paced gameplay interactive, whilst Halo did not. He did bring up some valid points as to why he disliked the instant healing feature and how it affected future titles. Again, he never said it was a bad game, nor did I.
As someone who’s put in 1500 hours into TF2, I kinda felt the way you did about HALO in regards to Overwatch - the shift from CLASS-based shooter to HERO-based shooter, with fancy abilities you can do with a press of a button. Imo, abilities dumbed down the potential of hero shooters by restricting the mechanics with cooldowns. But now since OW blew up the genre, all hero fps games follow suit. I am not a fan of pressing a button to do something and having to wait an arbitrary amount of time to press that button again. It makes no sense Genji can reflect with his sword but then not pull it out again after, or how Winston has to wait a certain amount of seconds to leap again, or Ana having an unlimited amount of sleep darts but can only use it once every x seconds. Waiting on cooldowns, as opposed to actively filling up a bar to use something powerful (Uber, Soldier’s banners, scout’s bonk, pyro’s phlog crits) just ain’t that engaging for me. With the latter, it forces you to engage with the game instead of passively waiting when on cooldown, and rewards the player for doing well. Compare hero shooters to tf2, and how the latter is balanced around the ammo mechanic (something that OW needed to not be so spammy imo) - Pyro can airblast/reflect projectiles unlimited times, but spamming it leaves u vulnerable and eats ur ammo away. Soldier can rocketjump at any given time to truly zoom in and out of battle, no need to wait for a cooldown just to do ONE jump. It’s balanced by health getting splashed from each rocket, and in the case of the Gunboats secondary, which reduces splash damage immensely, being super mobile comes at the cost of a secondary shotgun. Demo can also stickyjump, which is more mobile but costs greater health. Spy can disguise at ANY time, turn invisible at ANY time, and can OHKO the enemy from behind at any given time. No need to wait for some dumb timer to dictate what u can do, the player controls the flow of his gameplay. That’s not even mentioning the deep movement mechanics for all the classes, scout with his double jump, pyro with flare jumping/reflect jumping and switching to the powerjack for extra speed, Soldier/demo and rocket/stickyjumping, demoknight with trimping, *heavy has nothing*, Engineer with sentry jumping with the wrangler to get to different spots, Engineer with the Eureka effect to teleport instantly at the press of a button, Medic constantly trying to surf damage to add mobility and lessen splash damage, *sniper same as medic but to less effect*, and the Spy with a whole subset of Trickstabs and movement techniques to expose the back of an enemy - seriously, the things spies can do after hours of mastering their movement is insane - and that’s not even including how you can use your guns alongisde your movement to kill. My point being, there’s a reason why Tf2 is still being played by thousands of people everyday, 13 years later - there’s no other game like it. It’s truly one of a kind, from the culture to the mechanics and the characters and unique weapons and taunts and situations that arise from playing. I will love this game till I die, but I’m just kinda disappointed that the potential Overwatch had didn’t really come to fruition in the way I thought it would. Thanks for the vid Mayo, you a real one.
@@emin166 “Shut up guys. Stop debunking this video that’s built off an opinion that’s poorly explained and articulated”. Yeah sorry tell Mayo to explain his problems with Halo next time instead of just being lazy and not willing to admit he just didn’t like it cause it was a different type of shooter. Cause that’s all he did. Which doesn’t fit this clickbait title of the vid.
I mean I like both doom and halo. Fast paced is great and all but sometimes sitting back and playing something slower is pretty fun. I just generally enjoy first person shooters as a whole, regardless of speed
@@badgasaurus4211 2 on legendary just isn't fun, and 2 is probably my favorite of the classic games. You die in 7 plasma bolts, get oneshot by the (many) jackal snipers, and the noob combo is so good and everything else so underpowered your playstyle becomes extremely restricted.
This may come out of nowhere, but you actually managed to make me realize something: I've been playing Team Fotress 2 for years, and me and a bunch of friends have always had trouble against a single class: Sniper. Thanks to your vid, I could finally think about it better, and realize that, even for a Arena-style shooter that has a ton of elements from Quake gets fucked over by a single class, and that's because Snipers directly contradicts the free roaming nature of TF2 by denying entire areas by just being there. He slow the game down to a croll and it's the most gamebreaking class in the sense that it can completely deny the other team as long as he can aim well. Even for a 2007 game that continues to be played and receive bits of content up to this day, Sniper still remains as an intruder to the whole game's foundation by imposing a way of playing that directly contradicts the nature of the other classes. So, thanks Mr. UnderTheMayo.
I, umm... Shoot at them to make their aim shake? Send a spy? Spam flares/rockets? Use uber? Are you sure you're not talking about sentries? Is the sniper so good or do you just stand around? Countersnipe him and be done? And finally - is railgun broken in Quake?
@@doommaker4000 -a class being countered by itself and only itself is dumb, since most other classes have ways of dealing with each other -spy has to get trough the entire enemy team just to get close to the sniper, which doesn't even guarantee a kill due to quickscopes being a thing -spamming projectiles doesn't work due to the fact that they aren't hitscan and can be avoided, and also the fact that, to do so, you need to get in his sightline, which will more than likely get you killed for doing so -bullet spread and awful hitreg fuck up most attempts at tweaking a Sniper's aim from afar, which would lead to you dying to him for exposing yourself to him -Quake wasn't class based, and allowed for a lot of counterplay thanks to the faster pacing, dynamic map design, and multiple option Quake incentivizes your movement due to everyone else doing the same and the maps being designed around that idea TF2's sniper only lacks in KotH maps due to their smaller design, while he dominates in every other enviroment because of the rest of the map pool having plenty of room for him to keep the distance and abuse the short ranged nature of the other 8 classes And if you want more backup, I have played a fair amount of Highlander matches, and you also have devs claiming that Sniper is the only class they ever considered removing
What made Halo so damn good was its sandbox. Which future games that tried to be like Halo failed at understanding. It wasn't halo's fault for revolutionizing the console shooter, but more of the developers of said clones and such that did not replicate what made halo so goddamn good. Which in my opinion was the sandbox, and the enemies that big man chief fought.
There's definitely a resurgence of classic FPSes in the indie scene. You'll definitely have to look beyond the AAA scene for the sorts of games you want. Also on another note, try Vanquish.
By today’s standards bioshock definitely feels prehistoric, funnily enough, I feel that it plays better on pc than console, but even with the clunky and weighty controls, it’s still worthy of a play through and is really a genuine classic that’ll be remembered as much as many of the other games you speak of
bruh ı fucken loved Bioshock due to its different plasmoids and no weapon limit (unlike Bioshock Infinite WTF) its story was great and enviormental and elemental attacks with different ammonation types and tonics made it a different fun RPGish game. Bioshock 1 is obviously my fav in the series with its unique settings , unique gameplay and story (thoe the whole little sister harvest or rescue thing was useless since there is no reason to harvest them cause you get more than enough ADAM throughout the game)
@@666chapelofblood just play any modern fps, they’re just variations of the same control scheme which make them feel similar. I think the clunky controls of bioshock add to its charm
This is what sums up my opinion with Halo perfectly. Halo is one of my favourite franchise of all time. Yet, I despise it’s legacy. After Halo release, the FPS genre slowly turn into regenerating health slow moving copypastas, incorporating Halo’s mechanics willy nilly, without thinking of the possibility that it might not mix very well.
I'd say the shift in mainstream FPS design didn't just happen with Halo, but also with Half-Life 2 and COD 4; all of them were slower paced FPS games, compared to the classics, with a focus on more realistic design, story telling, more linear map design, etc. I'm sure there are others, but those are the main three I can think of.
No, even call of duty has better gameplay than halo in my opinion. It's not my type of game, but I can stand playing it for more than 15 minutes, unlike halo 3, which is literally the worst shooter I have played. This is all my opinion by the way.
I gotta' say, I really like this new style of video. It's so cool hearing about your experiences with games, and it's even better that you're embracing that part after just mentioning those experiences briefly in your other videos. Great that you don't care much about how things are received (at least negatively that is), because I'd love to see more videos like this. Love your stuff, man. Keep up the good work. Congrats on 50k subs too, here's to 50k more.
Wow, I love this video! The different perspective you give on this game is amazing and actually gives good points. I'm talking from the view point of a guy who is subscribed to the Actman who LOVES halo so seeing this review made me think about in a more in-depth way. Thank you, man.
Under The Mayo makes a video about halo: "OPEN THE GATES!" its called Halo Ruined First Person Shooters: "CLOSE THE GATES!" he brings up lot of good points: "OPEN THE GATES A LITTLE!"
@@No_Face1313 I mean yeah they are gripes, this whole damn video is all about his feelings on halo and modern shooters, but that’s the point. This video is just about an old school shooter player feeling disappointed with how games went after halo, but at no point does he say these games are objectively bad, or that anyone who plays these games has bad taste, he just thinks that halos mechanics are slow and tedious compared to the fast paced action packed shooters of yesteryear. He even relates to people who grew up with halo and are now facing the battle royals craze, since that’s what he went through for a long time.
@Tarbosaurus Let me add details cause yeah, it DID happen! 1) When I say classmates, I mean the 5-10 people who sat near me in my computer class and maybe a few of my friends who weren't in that class. 2) My high school had a hard drive connected to almost all the school's computers. I put the WADS, source ports, and mods in there and boom, they all have access. Also, of all the stories on the internet, this is the one you have to voice doubt on? Hell, I've told more farfetched things on the internet before (that did happen cause my autistic ass really does not like to lie)
@@VaderTheWhite Funnily enough, I had a classmate in my engineering class that did the exact same thing but instead of doom they got the original halo 😄 Also I LOVE your profile pic 😁
Well, I have no childhood relations about doom or halo. But, I have played a hecktic masterpiece! Do you know these old nokia with gameloft games? There was a game called diamond rush. It was a rogue-like but with no rogue-like mechanics. It's was a puzzle game about an adventurer trying to find 3 crystals or something. I guess you will understand when you try it... I was a really different kid from others back then.
In my opinion halo moved the industry forward just as much as doom but in a completely different way. If movies were video games doom would’ve been the first movie with sound but halo would’ve been the first movie in color, two major milestones just done in two completely different ways
As much as I love halo. I agree whole heatedly. Kind of like how games like the Last of Us and Uncharted ruin AAA gaming for me. It use to be fun video games but now it's all Movie like cinematic gaming. With slow walking scene. That's why I love the yakuza games. You can have a great story with awesome characters and amazing gameplay.
I find Yakuza tries to be like movies too much, there are far too many cut scenes. I've tried 2 and both had 30 minutes plus of cutscenes to start the game.
@@fastenedcarrot9570 i played yakuza zero on game pass a few weeks back and was just taken a back at just how many cutscenes there were and just how long they dragged. Like jesus they are persona 5 levels of bad
@@shawklan27 Yeah, I've been told so many times to stick with and you'll enjoy it bit when you finally start some gameplay and you get a guy going on a long rant to give backstory to how you use money to buy new abilities (and it still doesn't make any sense) I lose all interest. Odd to say the least.
I really hope BotW reset the standard for AAA games. I don't want to play walking simulators when I get a Series X. Though... I guess Uncharted and TLOU _are_ Sony exclusives.
@@smugplush The good thing is Bloodborne didn't shamelessly attempt to copy movies - that alone already makes it by far the most interesting PS exclusive to me.
I admire your openness about your own opinions, that's pretty respectable. At the same time, I feel this is not a just representation of Halo and its core mechanics. I had actually hoped somebody like you, with your attention to detail in game design, would pick up on more of its fundamentals. So, fearing somebody might find out about Halo over this video, here's my attempt at more clearly defining Halo's systems and appeal: Halo's main approach to gameplay follows sandbox design; while games like Doom mostly offered you your environment to traverse, weaponry to use smartly and enemies to kill, which on its own is quite stunning (I can hopefully claim, having played through most Doom games), Halo focuses more on the the 3d game world (more about that later). Halo's core interaction and combat system is organized via the Golden triangle: Meele (easily accessible as opposed to being its own 'weapon'), Weaponry from close to long range, and grenades with different effects. Combine this with different damage types (bullets, most useful against unshielded enemies, and plasma, most useful against shields of any kind), and your weapon variety easily complements your enemies. Fittingly, there exist enemies with and without shields and different ranks. Doom would force demons against you in any scenario, so it might be smart to make them fight each other, which you can do with movement alone. Halo, on the other hand, gives the enemies a clear, and similar to Doom visually distinct rank structure, so while it might be smart to use your Assault rifle to spray down unshielded Grunts before engaging their leader (an elite), it may be equally smart to kill the tougher elite first by depleting his shields and then taking his life, which leads the Grunts to run away in fear. The main takeaway: it is in your hands how you approach enemies and each corner of the golden triangle forces you to bargain appropriately. Only use plasma weaponry and get up close to melee away lives? Use plasma frags to scatter enemies, deplete an elite's shield and go for a sniper kill? And that's just the dynamic between two of Halo CE's four main Covenant enemies. Back to the sandbox: by giving enemies and players access to the environment, Vehicles and weaponry, the outcome to your plans may always differ. Shields aren't there to force you to hide, quite the opposite: previous games had you sacrifice lives for every mistake you made, Halo gives you a buffer to encourage interesting plays. Slow movement? Makes you think about your placement and options rather and offers vehicles in the sandbox. Two weapon limit? Doom and similar games have a (albeit branching) hierarchy of weapons. In Halo, every weapon has major strengths and weaknesses which balance each other out, giving each an individual role beyond 'killing'. You may use two different damage types to counter Covenant enemies but which weapons have the perfect range you curently also need? Or do you plan on only using projectiles, the Flood's main weakness? Or only plasma, the Sentinel's main weakness? Lastly, the sandbox offers multiple solutions to your, Mayo's, main problems. Every enemy carries a weapon you can pick up and use to your advantage. Learn the strengths and weaknesses of each weapon and the gameplay will feel similarly methodic to Doom Eternal (which,borrowed many of Halo's mechanics). You're out of ammo and there's a weapon across the room you might need? Sacrifice a frag and let the weapon fly towards you. Or just explode a vehicle and make it flip onto your enemies. All in all, different from Doom to an extent you fail to present properly. Especially obvious in your 'redemption' of Halo CE' in the end. The example you use of enemies being in an open field and lacking cover is one of the early points the game teaches you that you and your enemies are dependant on the environment. Had you played on something more than normal, you would have quickly realized enemies spot you faster and spread accordingly, dodge more frequently and attack more viciously. And yet, every enemy can die in less than one clip of any weapon if you also utilize the sandbox, your movement and positioning and your melees and grenades, as opposed to most of the gameplay you show here, Mayo. On a final note, I'd suggest playing Halo CE Anniversary with classic graphics, since they quite clearly distinguish your enemies as well as their ranks and more properly present the tone of each level, but that's another debate
This was really nice to watch. A lot of nostagia trip. I never realized that I too kind of skipped most modern shooters. Half Life deathmatch had that run and gun feel, played some Unreal, a lot of Quake 3 Arena. I played CS, and CS Sourse for years, and never really move on to anything else. Switched to RTS and League of Legends. Played Halo on PC at some point. Really loved the story and characters, and the combat was fun too. Never played multiplayer Halo. Played thorugh Borderlands, and really loved the 2013 Tom Raider, but not really as a shooter, but for the story and exploartion. Then Total Biscuit (RIP) reviewed Doom 2016 and at next good sale I had it and riped and teared at my hearts content. It felt GREAT. So great that I bought Eternal at launch. I bought only three games full price at launch: StarCraft 2 (all 3 expansions) (because SC Brood Wars is god), Overwatch (but I kind of regret that one :D, I was high on the Blizzard hype train) and Doom Eternal. If you read this, and wish to play another really awesome game - Hades! Supergiant games outdid themselves. It's not a shooter, but its fast, very well made, it has that controlled chaos feel to it, and it really rewards good fast playstyles. It's not exactly the same feel (flow) as Doom, but there are moments, when the build is right and you vibe with the weapons, that it feels sooooooooo fast and so satisfying. And the story and music are great. I hope you check it out.
I don't think COD itself did, I think oversaturation of COD poisoned the genre. I think it's recovering and COD is adapting and becoming more like it used to when it was good, but still. I can agree to an extent.
The original modern warfare was a great game, hell it's one of the few cod games I genuinely like But it would be hard to ignore its impact on oversaturating the market, cause EVERYONE wanted a part of the modern warfare gravy train
I love how you mention tf2 and just say: really fun but not campaign. Also, I get where you come from and I completely understand your point about halo. I think that it was a really bad thing that basically the whole market switched to the slower type of games. I think it would've been better if it was 50/50 and that you could just switch between them.
It WAS 50/50. A lot of the most popular FPS titles of the 2000s were fast paced shooters like Battlefront 2 and Far Cry. Not to mention Crysis, which was similar to Halo but was anything but slow paced. Regenerating health wasn't really the norm till the 2010s, it was moreso an option compared to how it later became "Oh, I don't regenerate health? That sucks."
Check out part TWO of this topic!: ruclips.net/video/HCQ_N571VAA/видео.html
Here it is. As promised, my Halo video to celebrate 50,000 subs. I actually made this many months ago, and decided it would be fun to hold it for a 50k celebration. That's why the audio and production may feel a little different compared to my most recent material. Thank you to everyone who's been supporting me. All the new Doom people, back to the MK9 boys. This video isn't one of my normal analysis or opinion pieces. It's a collection of thoughts I've had for 20 years about how this game affected the world around me. I know it's not what was expected, but I hope you enjoy it anyway. (I can feel a bad like ratio coming just based on the title, but hey, that's okay. I'm having fun here.)
*** side note, when I say Bioshock felt modernized (even though it had some classic shooter mechanics), I meant that it felt made for console playing speed. Not talking about regenerating health and weapon limits. I could have worded that better.
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@@HK-07 It was a good game that I played as a kid. Played a little of the second one. Didn't play the others.
Mayo you should check out RAGE 2, it's very aggressive combat with extremely satisfying gunplay and health dropped from killed enemies. But the story and open world is bad
Wow I thought I was the only one who felt this way about halo, I don’t hate the game it’s ok but it felt so slow, tedious & frustrating. Halo 2 is slightly better and halo 3 didn’t really improve the gameplay that much, I also agree with Under the Mayo about FEAR gameplay is much better than halo.
@@mano7636 I'm quite sure he's already played it. (Edit: he hasn't yet)
Not the video I was expecting, but I liked it and made me look at my one favorite franchises from another set of eyes. I never thought of Halo as ruining something, but now I know it kinda did indirectly. It’s cool and weird to see how our scenarios were kinda similar yet completely different outcomes. I saw halo for the first time when I was very young like kindergarten or younger and immediately became fascinated by it because I loved sci-fi as well. I couldn’t get a hold of my own halo game until way later in life but I was so happy when I did. But now all that kids want to do is play fortnite, and when I mention they should try halo I get immediately turned down. Sorry for the rant thing I just did, I just think this video really opened my eyes to something I never thought of before
Halo didn't ruin FPS games, everyone else desperately trying to copy it overall ruined FPS games. Same with CoD.
Honestly, extremely tired of giuant boring open world FPS games with RPG elements.
That's literally what he is saying lol!
I would say COD ruined FPS games, but they took so much from Halo
Halo actually did ruin FPS games by itself creating the demand for these mechanics and Halo itself being pretty much intolerable to play for gamers used to PC FPS games
u preaching to the choir G
Like the new Halo? Rip
I garuntee you'll get less hate for dissing battle royale than halo
guarantee it
@@sh_i_ro ah. A fellow james. Good day to you bro.
@@Jaden-Ring brot- brother?
@@sh_i_ro yes brother. We must unite and pave the way for the James regime. Our army will conquer all. When the 2020 nightmare is over a new world will be born. Born of Jameses. Rise up great army of Jameses! Our time is nigh!
@@Jaden-Ring CHARGE
When I first played Halo, and used the Rocket Launcher for the first time, I attempted a rocket jump. It was a bad move.
technically you did jump tho
F
You'll love the Halo 3 Brute-Shot and Halo 2 Energy sword. Both can function as good movement utilities.
@@pradeepdungdung4379 My grenade button
Actually, you can still rocket jump, but it it much, much more limited than quake’s rocket jump. You can only jump right when you collect the overshield.
The interesting thing about Halo is that I feel it kind of did coincide alongside PC shooters that existed in a different part of the market. While Halo certainly did affect console shooters, I saw a lot more Half-Life influence in PC releases. Games like F.E.A.R. and Doom 3 were definitely more Half-Life than Halo. Hell, I refer to that time as the Half-Life era.
pro jarek when billybob
You're definitely right about that. Not many games tried to replicate Halo's gameplay loop on PC, probably due in large part to the more free controls available, and the fact that Halo obviously had a very limited audience on PC. I think Call of Duty had a much more obviously negative impact on the style of games we got after it got big and popular.
Yeah I agree, it wasn't really until the late 2000s-early 2010s that PCs started getting games that were console-first and the markets merged.
PC had Battlefield 1942/Battlefield 2, Half-Life 1/2, Doom 3, Far Cry 1, Crysis, to name a few. All huge PC shooters that were scaled back, if available at all, on console releases.
PC shooters were influenced by Half Life 1 focus on narrative, scripted set piece moments and world building but gameplay wise those games are not really similar. Doom 3 was a slow paced action horror game and FEAR was a intermediately paced tactical shooter. Half Life 1 plays and feels like Quake 2 but with reloading, more interesting levels and story. Its gameplay is still very fast paced with fast movement, b-hopping, aggressive enemy ai and no weapon limit. GoldSrc engine is also heavily modified Quake engine.
@@fuckso2342They play waaay more like Half-Life than they do Halo. Narrative focused linear fps where you can carry as many weapons as you want (aside from fear)
"hide so you can heal"
you sure are gonna hate halo 2 legendary
Why hide snipers will kill you in 1 hit anyway
*Shakes* jAkAL SnIPerS
@@cg5380 yeah why hide? XD the chiefs armor in halo 2 is made out of wet paper
@Something Diabolical The key to being good at halo is running pistol / sniper and headshotting everything before it even is close enough to spot you. Because you move like a man stuck in mud
I mean at least in halo 2 your shields regen faster.
I'd argue that Halo to the fps genre is what RE4 is to the horror genre. It's an incredible game but because of its success, it had spurred an enormous amount of cheap cop outs and imitations in order to leech off it.
hey good to see ya here buddy
@@csabaszabo6859 I apologize if I don't recognize you. Are you from George Salonikh's stream?
@@AnakinSkywakka yeah
The same can be said of Doom
i mean thats how the fps genre got started in the first place. for a while, every new fps game that came out was labeled a doom clone.
Bashing on Halo? Nah
Bashing on Battle Royale? *Yes*
Battle Royal and FTP games full of microtransactions and pay to win mechanics are the true evil of this industry.
Tetris 99 and Super Mario Bros. 35 are the only exceptions.
Too bad Mario 35 is limited time only.
Battle royale is just copy and paste garbage trash. Blackout and warzone are ass.
@@Gruntvc Not entirely Apex Legends is pretty awesome EA is just greedy.
"There's no bunny hopping"
are we playing the same game.
I'm talking about how the game to felt when it came out and I was sitting in rooms with my friends playing casually. Most of my feelings and evaluation of the game in this video are voiced in the past, reflecting how I felt 20 years ago.
@@underthemayo o okay thanks for clarifying
@@underthemayo i too had some really dumb opinions when i was six years old, thankfully i grew out of them, and now i leave it buried in the past.
Is there actual, momentum gaining, bunny hop in halo? I've never played it but I highly doubt it.
@@superior96 it’s not momentum based, but there are movement mechanics and skilled tricks you could use.
Halo is like the Shrek of FPS games. Green bois staring in great games who would cause shitty imitators to copy its mechanics without understanding why Halo used said mechanics.
tell that to 343
Halo(CE)'s health system makes sense in the setting. You're in a power suit with a recharging energy shield built on reverse-engineered alien technology, along with some armour plating that could take some hits that shared a system with the marines.
What happened to the genre was like if Metroid took off like Halo did & then you had WW2 & modern military soldiers morphballing all over the place & having guns instead of hands. But at least that would've been kinda fun & wacky!
And then CoD became extremely popular after MW1 2007 and the same desperate copying happened again.
This industry is not good.
@@Gruntvc at least major publishers finally seem to be understanding that diversification is better for ongoing profitability than putting all your eggs in the trend-chasing basket. But they still wish they were Zynga & Epic so bad. It's almost like they forgot they swallowed Blizzard already then WoW stopped growing & what they're trying to do is neither possible nor sustainable.
@@pradeepdungdung4379 343's Halos are hiliarious. For all the harm Halo did to FPS's diversity, it was at least a trendsetter. And then 343 comes along to follow new trends that more or less killed Halo's relevancy today.
Let's hope that id doesn't start making the same mistakes now that Microsoft owns them too.
While I understand you felt that as a kid, you're wrong at Halo's role in gaming.
Halo isn't a cover shooter, and I don't recommend playing it like one, you're actively thinking, reloading, or repositioning yourself when your shields are low and shouldn't just be sitting in a corner doing nothing.
Halo was the transitional game between the old quake likes and the cover shooter, it's a mix of both.
Halo fans have no problem with battle royale when it comes to changing gameplay (how does that affect halo?) Games like COD actually changed Halo with sprint and loadout-like mechanics is what damaged Halo for many.
I don't mean to be rude but I just felt that you misrepresented Halo's role in the evolution of shooters
Agreed
I think a good analogy can be made, and that's with comics
Before Superman, many heroes wore trench coats, duel wielding pistols and was extremely detective driven, until Superman happened and everything changed, the golden age of comics is when everyone copied the spandex trend with powers until YEARS until a handful of publishers took action and returned to the old.
absolutely
Anyone who thinks halo is a cover shooter must have a negative iq
@@HK-07 you don't have to imagine it cuz we're doing it right now
"I tried to give Halo another chance, so I played the oldest and slowest game"
It's obviously your opinion that the tactical, cover, whatever you want to call them shooters had detrimental effects on the genre. But saying it that way also implies that the only good shooters are the extremely fast arena Quake/Unreal/Doom style ones.
How would you create a believable world and tell a believable story about humanity fighting against a technologically superior alien alliance if you designed the game with large, open levels, aliens that died very quickly, and a super soldier that can carry an entire arsenal all on his own but dies just as quickly as the aliens? None of it goes together. Now, we could sit around and think of how to make those gameplay elements work that way, but that's the point I'm making. Gameplay and narrative serve each other. Doom will never have a moment like Noble 6 sacrificing himself to ensure the Pillar of Autumn escapes Reach. The Spartan super soldiers, as strong as they are, are still normal humans and their deaths are impactful moments. Doomguy is an unstoppable superhuman force and the gameplay is meant to make you feel that way. It's just pure chaotic fun. A game like Halo puts me in the middle of a real conflict, as a real human soldier. Like, when I get the rocket launcher in Doom, I got, alright, another weapon. In Halo, picking up the rocket launcher is a big deal. They are a precious resource and getting the maximum damage out of it is very satisfying.
I dunno, that's how I see things. I like Doom and Halo. Not for the gameplay, for how they make me feel.
He is just verifying his bias and love for fast paced shooters, thats what all it is.
It's crazy to think that Halo 2's movement is faster than Halo 5's sprint.
Really good points about how the movement and the lore create an impactful moment in the games. even when I was a young dude these moments did not make me cry but certainly touched me.
I hated Halo 4 and the direction Halo went in after Halo Reach. I replayed these games years ago and the ending of Halo 3 touches me more than had I not played it in a more aware status.
Holy shit that's a long comment.
While I agree with the sentiment. You can 100% make a realistic style game with the setting you proposed.
"it's not doom eternal"
_round of applause_
this is literally the video. I see everyone praise his takes, but.... the second he starts talking about Halo, which is around 8 minutes in, he just says "it isn't doom". Every negative he says is just something that Doom had and Halo didn't, as if any shooter that isn't Doom automatically hurt video games. Reloading, the shield, the movement that isn't almost flying, the 2 weapons. Yeah man, it isn't doom, but there's a very good reason it became so popular Xbox Live would have failed without it. Doom (both original and new) are extremely good games and very influencial, but... just because Halo wasn't doom, that doesn't mean it wasn't good.
I can understand where the criticism comes from, but all of it feels like "It wasn't like the game I loved, so it's not good".
@@steliosvagianos8445 amazing you successfully missed the entire point and are criticizing a point never made in the video. gg
@@lolmarko4897 I didn't miss the point, I watched the entirety of the video. The points he makes, however, I do not agree with and continuously boil down to shooters after Halo not being like Doom, which he liked.
@@steliosvagianos8445i think what they mean by point of the vid is that mayo said at the beginning that nearly the whole video is opinionated and biased, but how he feels. So its completely fine to disagree, this is just what he personally thinks.
every mayo video
"I would bring my PC and play quake and the other 16 guys would play halo with each other"
wow
I felt that when he said that in the video.
As far as I know, I don't recall having that happen to me before (mainly cuz I rarely went to a few game tournament parties), but I honestly felt sad when he mentioned this happened to him.
I can only imagine being the only person to bring their setup for a game your friends use to play only to find yourself playing that game alone and remembering the fun times you had playing said game while your same friends are currently playing the next big thing a few inches away from you in walking length.
@@HK-07 oh I get that. For me I grew up on the fps games he doesn't enjoy like halo and call of duty, etc. So those type of games never truly bugged me because I never saw, or let alone noticed, the walking speeds or the amount of guns you can carry because I just stick to the flow of the shooters I play. I never cared about my character running like the flash, or carrying an arsenal to experiment with against enemies, but for those who did grew up playing those type of fps games I can totally understand the frustration.
The only thing I disagree with him on in this video is him putting the blame on halo as being the sole reason for the pivot of game design when it comes to fps games in the 2000s/2010s. The industry should be blamed for trying to make shooters feel like halo rather than trying to do their own unique style of fps games.
But hey, with the growing boomer shooter renaissance that's been happening lately, and with triple a companies making fast paste 90 style games like the new doom and wolfenstein games, who knows? We might be seeing more of these style of fps games in the years to come.
I just want a new turok game damnit! Lol
@@HK-07 nothing wrong with casual players, I cannot stand these hyper cuck doom players, I like doom, but almost everyone who plays doom has some superiority complex like they’re somehow better than other gamers and casual gamers can’t play.
@@HK-07 "it made me want say “YEAH! Fuck you!” to the people or “casuals” that the industry favoured but shamelessly left the old-school FPS players in the dust. I wouldn’t actually say that to them though." B R U H
This is so sad
Halo didn't ruin anything. The industry cluelessly trying to copy it, while not understanding its principles, is what ruined FPS.
"capitalism breeds innovation" my ass
Yeah, a more apropriate title may be "How the Success of Halo ruined First Person Shooters"
so basically what he said in the video then nice
@@shadowcheto85 How the success of Halo ruined the state of the then-ongoing FPS game genres.
@@viperlife914 I swear most of the people defending Halo here didn't watch the video in full. I love classic Halo and yet I still agree 100% with Mayo's points.
Correction of the title, "how halo ruined my experience with the fps genre"
Kinda seen this comment coming lol
yep
That’s click bait for you
It's more "PC Gamer cries about something that has nothing to actually do with Halo."
There was multiple large properties before Halo that had all the "issues" Halo had, but apparently they don't count for some reason.
@@JZStudiosonline typical PC gamer
It was a good video, but if you were worried about this video getting people angry before they clicked, i would changed the title to something a little Less clickbaity.
If it were less clickbaity, it would not have gotten as much attention.
He knew what he was doing.
The most I took away from this video was "rElOaDiNg" and "goofy aliens in my space shooter". Like bruh.
@@xshullaw That's more of an indictment on you, man.
@@belottov to be fair, he had some really shitty hot takes in that video with opinions he probably could have just kept to himself. It just comes off like he just wants every game to play exactly like Doom. Which I doubt he actually believes, but it does come across that way.
@Steps for sure but when people copy over games it starts to feel stale.
A lot of the design choices in Halo weren't done because of console limitations, they were done intentionally. Bungie wanted players to make more tactical choices and interact with the environment more by limiting them to two weapons. Making grenades and melee attached to buttons instead of a whole weapon slot made combat flow better, even on PC. Halo was revolutionary for finally moving FPS combat forward instead of sticking with the stale formula used since Wolfenstein, also, weapon balance in Halo is entirely built around only being able to carry two weapons. It's not Halo fault if a million other games copied that limitation without copying the overall design that made it work.
EXACTLY, it’s much more tactical. That’s what it’s designed to be
Yes, I watched the video too
Halo felt intolerably slow and unfun for PC gamers by itself and without the help of any other games, games trying to copy it basically just turned it into a vortex that was sucking in franchises we loved and watering them down, and though that was the real injury, you guys are all ignoring that another point the guy made and that a lot of people share was that Halo was not a fun game for PC FPS gamers
People like you throw the word “tactical” around a lot, I don’t think you know what it means.
The two weapon limit isn’t tactical, its disruptive. The game wants you to use the right weapon for the job, yet the game expects you to stop playing the game for a while to look for the right weapon on the ground. It’s not fun, it’s not clever and it’s just fucking annoying. And before you go “you just can’t play the game lol”, I cleared the entire of CE of Legendary and have beaten nearly all Covenant levels with just assault rifle and pistol, so don’t pull the “you can’t play” crap on me.
“Moving FPS combat forward”? Don’t fucking make me laugh.
@@dunadan7136 its a halo fanboy, what do u expect? 🤷🏻♂️
Now I feel like I’m weird for loving both games, doom and halo
You can love them both. They're both great games.
Doom is Eternal and Halo is Infinite. But both are legendary
Nothing wrong with that.
@@fishnutz5196 Ohhhh.... Clever.
I feel like their is a huge overlap in their communities so likely not as weird as you think.
Sees the title, grabs a pitchforck, well fellas let's first listen to what this folk has to say.
Guess he lives, he made valid points, just like he did in Alien Isolation. And that's why I subscribed !!🤠 Howdy !
This ended well
Started sharpening my pitchfork when he complained about reloading.
Same
I'm expecting this to be a good quality video that I disagree with. Open to being convinced but doubt that will happen. Expect this to be more an argument for homogenization in shooters post halo like we saw with cod and titanfall after that.
Halo had a dozen copycats that imitated the health regen and two weapon limit, but forgot to include the varying enemy types that played off each other and sandbox level design.
I see where you're coming from as a massive doom fan, but man... Not everyone wants a game as fast paced as Doom. I love the shit out of it and it definitely has the best combat in any shooter ever, but the downside is that it's *exhausting* to play for any length of time, especially for someone used to other FPSs. Most of the time I like being able to chill behind cover and pick enemies off with precision weapons, use stealth in any capacity, basically use the playstyles that Doom makes completely impossible. As for enemies' shields recovering, git gud. If you can't keep fire on someone long enough to kill them before they kill you, get better, that's where the challenge comes from in Halo. Learn to use cover, learn to stop your enemies from taking advantage of it. It sounds like you just don't like the mechanics of Halo (which again I get, it's just not your style and that's fine), but you can't say that one of the most innovative and successful FPSs of all time ruined the genre; that's objectively false.
@Leon Johansson Well then, Halo would eventually get boring if it was it's only own game mechanic, the point of gaming is to expand and be creative, it's all about preference, but from this guy, he's being biased as hell for fast paced shooters.
@Leon Johansson Well guess what, Doom isn't even close to being a dead franchise, and people have to accept the fact not everyone likes fast paced games every now and then, Mechanics like Halo feel fresh and alive, while mechanics like wolfenstein gets repetitive at times. Its called "Innovation".
@Leon Johansson That's not point I said, what I said was If the whole Wolfenstein mechanics were still around and Halo didn't even exist, then the Wolfensteins mechanics would get repetitive, and the genre of fps would fall, same goes for Halo vise versa though, BUT there's other games like Halo that are somewhat similar to Halos mechanics, but are different from one another, people didn't just like cod for it's gameplay back then, it was also it's story telling and characters, every has preferences on these type of games, however when I looked at the title of this video, all I saw was pretty much ( Make Fast Paced Shooters great again), there's nothing wrong playing those types of games, people just intend to find other game mechanics more interesting. Good day.
this was a video about his own opinion, i dont see why mayo would want to include other people's opinions when this is how *he* feels
YEAH!....... -what he said!.....
The title is misleading. A better title would be “Halo’s Legacy Ruined First Person Shooter”
Or maybe “Halo Imitators Ruined First Person Shooters”?
its not misleading its an appropriate title
@CessNight5672 how is it misleading
@CessNight5672 he's saying halo ruined fps it was the first case of this not the legacy or whatever this one game then everything else that adapted these systems
@CessNight5672 the industry made the game the design choices is what ruined the fps genre the game mechanics and systems completely made fps games different so it is the game or at least what makes up the game
This idea of Halo being this game designed to be a molasses-coated slogfest so that it could be playable on consoles is kinda funny to me. I first played Halo CE on PC and absolutely loved it, and I still play it on PC to this day because it's my favourite way to play. I love Halo's slower pace because, well, it's different. Every shooter wants to be this coke-snorting hyper-speed ADHD nightmare and it gets tiresome sometimes. I like Playing Halo because it's more mellow pace is refreshing and allows other parts of the game to shine.
I hate how recent games have tried to constantly speed up the pace of gameplay.
Also, you say the enemies are visually bland?
*HERESY*
I agree, slower FPS games like Halo and Metroid prime are amazing
I somehow doubt that considering that COD came after Halo and they're essentially very close to the same type of movement and gameplay mechanics like regenating health and nerfed movement compared to games like Quake 3 in 1999.
@WlmsKds GD Pffffff in a few centuries
"dead space isn't an fps"
y-yeah, thats because its a third person shooter
whats ur point. he said it aint a fps cuz its not
@@tuscanollie1242 using that logic, he might as well state every other game that isn’t FPS just so we know haha
@@jonjones66696 ok idc
@@jonjones66696 Yeah, but it's a very good console shooter. Mayo probably brought it up because he likes it.
Also it's a horror game first, not an action title.
Well this looks like the classic story of an industry learning the wrong lessons from a success and you suffering because of it
So a industry that never learns anything teeheehee
@@imtoddhowardandimadeskyrim6553 Let's all laugh!
I kinda understand your feelings, but to me it seems like you wanted every FPS to be an arena shooter, but arena shooters are obviously a subgenre, the fact that Halo and the generation of games that followed took the attention away from arena shooters is also because of a point of no innovation that arena shooters had reached. I personally love the Halo saga, maybe more than any other game franchise, and as a guitarist the fact tha Halo 2 had a soundtrack improvised by Steve Vai was a big part of that. The skirmish mode in Reach is something you would rly love imo anyways, give it a try.
Yeah, Halo isn't DOOM or UT or Quake so Halo ruined FPS. What? He just wants every FPS to be fast paced Arena Shooters.
It's not just arena games that had fast pace, advanced movement and OTT combat in the '90s: it was almost the entire PC FPS genre.
@@arnoldSwollenmember what I don’t understand is how halo is the reason for that. Is it just because it is successful?
@@arnoldSwollenmember well you could argue that the 90s were all just Wolfenstein and Doom clones. Its a dumb argument. The industry will chase trends where the majority of attraction lies. This happens with all genres, not just FPS.
@@arnoldSwollenmember he talked about how halo didn't have a feature that quake had
One of the biggest offenders must be Duke Nukem Forever: from what started as a fast-paced old-school shooter, just to embrace the modern trend of regenerated health & taking cover, linear path, and being limited to hold only 2 weapons at any given times! All this while marketing makes him looks like the same badass he used to be, only to reveal that you just play another one of those shooters where you hide like a bitch every time you get a boo-boo!
Duke Nukem Forever and Aliens Colonial Marines are two of the worst FPS games ever made.
Do not buy Gearbox.
@@DMCMaster550 Down right hypocratic then.
@@DMCMaster550 almost any time Duke Nukem does that it's more a friendly poke, but tribute to those games. It's more for the devs. Duke Nukem 3D did the same with Doom. DNF is still ass though.
The period of around 2010 to 2012 is when things were really at there worst with the themes I'm talking about in this video.
@@DMCMaster550 dude, nobody likes or liked DNF. Duke fans don't associate with that garbage.
Mans is complaining about reloading lol
As a hardcore Halo fan, I loved this video. I loved your honest critique and your different view of the shooter industry coming from the PC world. And I loved how you connected Halo's effect back then to the Battle Royal effect today 🙌🙌
Thanks. I really do respect the series even though it's not for me. It's not Halo the game that was bad. It was the homogenization of shooters in the wake of its success.
@@underthemayo yea I love Halo, it is my childhood and i see your arguement and agree with it, great video
@@harold6848 I wouldn't want every game to play like Doom or Quake or Fear either.
@@underthemayo no absolutely not you'd just burn yourself out playing that forever but you made some really good points and all I have to say is great job, a well executed video
@@underthemayo no absolutely not you'd just burn yourself out playing that forever but you made some really good points and all I have to say is great job, a well executed video
I would LOVE to hear your take on the Battle Royale genre.
It would be hard to do because I'd have to play more of it and I really don't want to lol
Understandable
You mean Fortnite mode because every game has one these days.
@@underthemayo Based.
@@Legion849 Pretty much, yes.
The problem isn't Halo, the problem is we need more games like Doom 2016, Doom Eternal and Quake Champions but game companies don't wanna develop those types of fps's
Well, to be fair, we have a metric fuckton of throwback FPS shooters made by Indie companies now. Look up New Blood Interactive if you wanna look for a publisher with them, they wear that shit like a badge of honor. DUSK, Blood, ULTRAKILL... Then there's other amazing shooters with retro graphics and high adrenaline gameplay like Project Warlock and Strafe.
Long story short, there's a ton of stuff to enjoy, but it's indie games
@@jajkub2001 yeah i don't think those games ever stopped to be honest its just that cover based shooters were more mainstream... plus there have been hybrid game like the borderlands series where u can run and gun and play slow methodical if u want.
@@jajkub2001 dusk singleplayer alone is satisfying but frantic. I couldn't imagine what duskworld is like
@@jajkub2001 So, make triple A classic shooters, since doom 2016, doom eternal, and quake champions are triple A.
They don't want to develop them because of halo
Really, really interesting video. Not something I see very often: a highly subjective, individual-level interpretation of a game, based more on past recollection than objective analysis. And as a longtime Halo fan, it was indeed refreshing to see. I love Halo and always will, but you made some great points from a perspective that I don't have.
I get you’re points mate and honestly fair enough. But I feel you’re kinda missing the point in halo: it’s supposed to be a mix between sci fi Action and grounded military shooter.. I think most design decisions were made with that in mind
Pretty much this.
A good 50%of this was basically "hey....this isnt doom, or quake, what the hell?!!!!!"
Kinda ticked me off because the thought process is kinda idiotic. Every game should be seen through a new lens, if you want to compare you have to compare them between accurate means, comparing halo to quake is apples to oranges.
Most people forget that Bungie tested different guns at shooting ranges so that they could model in-game weapons after real-life weapons in terms of looks, sounds, and how they feel. Oh, and they also fused vehicular combat into a FPS in campaign and multi-player which really hadn't been done before Halo CE, other than Mech Warrior (but you couldn't jump out of your Mech, Titanfall style and run and gun on foot).
Because Hes biased with Fast paced shooters, imagine if every game were to be a fast paced, the shooter genre would be repetitive and no longer be interesting for people and move on to something else, people may say other game companys are copying Halos mechanics, but it isn't really copying, it's just expanding more mechanics and more new gameplay feels from other franchise, such as cod, hunting games, battlefield, Rainbow six siege, etc. If every game were to have Doom game mechanics, then what's the point playing other games, if Doom is that only arcade special franchise to enjoy.
Also, In real life you reload. That’s more realistic and you can’t expect the future to not have bullets reload themselves. And it’s balanced for multiplayer because who wants a guy spamming none stop. Not all games can just be like your taste
there's a point where realism gets in the way of fun.
Just have to say, Halo is a military shooter with a sci-fi setting.
Facts
Yeah it's... kind of weird how he keeps talking about how X is ok in military shooters and not ok in the military sci-fi shooter Halo. Bit of a retard take.
Games can be grounded in reality without being stuck in a modern setting
Exactly what I was thinking, glad someone said it.
Look at ur likes. The company which now owns halo
While I don't agree with you, it is refreshing to see someone who can critique something they don't enjoy without attacking it, or the fan base. Halo 1 is still my favourite FPS. You can have a different opinion, mayo, but as a huge fan, it's good to hear that you can respect why people do enjoy it. Criticism without hate, thank you.
“Watch your tongue arbiter what you say is heresy”
Huge halo fan boy here but I totally see your point of view. Halo isn’t for everyone. My gf actually thinks it’s very slow paced and is always the game she’s least down to play. Same with my best friend. So I get it. Even I feel like that sometimes after playing the new doom games. Totally agree with the Halo effect thing going on with battle royals now. I hate it lol.
I never got the hype for Halo. The story is booooring as shit and the gameplay is super lame. Maybe because it came on xbox back in the day everyone got in the hype train. I always compare Halo with Skyrim. Both water down FPS.
May you please elaborate on how the story is boring and the gameplay is bad. I would like to know why you hate a great.
its not more of halo ruined fps its more everyone else saying i want to do that also. and then that just became normal so yeah and no its halos fault
What?
Oh god here we go....
*Under The Mayo uploads a video entitled "Halo Ruined First Person Shooters"*
Mission Objective: *SURVIVE*
I really don't think it was Bungie's fault for causing games to change this dramatically. They just tried shaking it up a little bit, and people liked it. Because of that, fps games changed. More and more companies tried to recreate what halo has created. I just don't think it's right to blame halo, and halo only, for trying to be different.
Before you comment, think of it this way. You're in school and you have lots of time left in your math class. You decide to leave early, because one person leaving can't hurt too bad, right? Well there's a full classroom full of students with nothing to do, so they follow you little by little.
Its not the first persons fault for trying something new, it's the people who followed.
@@chxsek Halo didn’t even start out as an FPS game. It was originally supposed to be a science fiction clone of Bungie’s previous fantasy RTS, the StarCraft to Myth’s Warcraft.
As a person that grew up with CoD and halo and shooters like this. I can confirm that after I finished playing fortnite because it just wasn’t the same. I’m realizing that this is going to be bad for the games that I love like CoD and such. I tried DOOM 2016 out and loved it and ever since I have loved those boomer shooters more than anything. In fact DOOM Eternal is now my favorite game to release.
It's not about trends, it's really down to execution. Activision milked Call of Duty to death, and between all the imitators and endless marketing it was easy to hate on it, but at the end of the day they made great blockbuster singleplayer campaigns and had addictive multiplayer deathmatch when at their peak. Doom Eternal is a very different kind of shooter, even compared to the other Doom games, but I think it is definitely one of the best FPS games of all time, and I'm a classic Doom fan first. Just because battle royale is popular among the kids who play Fortnite because it's free, it doesn't mean the game is good. In fact, usually the free shit sucks. If it didn't, the devs would realize they could charge money for it.
You are giving Fortnite too much credit. Its literally just a test bed for Unreal Engine 4 and now UE5 updates. Do you really think the seasons are there to give people new things? No, it's to test new mechanics, bug fixes, physics etc.
@@riddell26 I just enjoyed the game, I never said it wasn't just a test bed. I just used to enjoy the gameplay
“Looks at title”
“Tread lightly, for this is hollowed ground”
A Shepard must tend to his flock
@@TheMiner16 Thank you
May the light of lights be with you!
@@colbycoolby1592 Yes
"tAkE cArE, aRbItEr... *WhAt YoU sAy Is HeReSy"*
You're not imagining stuff, what you said about NIN is true, Trent also told the developers themselves when he was making the music for Quake. He also confessed that the Fragile was also constantly delayed because of Quake's multiplayer.
I think you can find that interview if you google it with the right words.
it's not HALO that ruin FPS
it's the gaming industry tried copy HALO's style that ruined FPS
that's what his point actually
Such a long title though...
@@underthemayo Yes but the short title is the one that would most likely get people to hunt you down xD
Clones, the bane of the entertainment industry...
@@underthemayo Ok, can I prompt you with something? Halo is built as a tactical shooter, but I feel like other shooters borrowed Halo’s mechanics, despite not being tactical shooters. A run and gun fps game shouldn’t adopt features for a tactical shooter like Halo. I think it was just “Halo is popular, lets put Halo features in our game” without understanding the purpose of Halo’s design choices. This is coming from someone who’s beat all of them on Legendary, so I’m obviously biased.
@@underthemayo just call it the Halo effect, or "Halo is now feeling the Halo effect"
With all due respect, a lot of this is wrong, Halo saved the FPS genre and is completely different to other shooters in so many great ways
You've got to be taking the piss but as a long time halo fan I'm seeing current trends ruin halo itself with them trying to add all this mediaeval stuff into MCC and how they just seem to want to turn it into fortnight with wacky armors and bring back armor effects
@@SSStevie how is this in any way related to this comment ?
How did Halo save the FPS genre? I don't recall any threat to shooters during that time.
@Aether fax
Man getting angry at reloading in fps games for 20 minutes
Here they come
It does suck tbh.
@@mexido165 if done wrong
@@etlttc353 lmao
He only talked about it for like 30 seconds if not less.
"Everytime I emptied my clip and had to reload, it's like the game was saying stop having fun now and wait a few seconds"
What.
Yeah, because in real life weapons don't need to reload.
@Low Tier BBCFactory Fully agree. Reloads can be super fun and add to the strategy of a game. In Halo, having a point where you're incentivised to switch weapon or charge at an enemy to melee them because your clip ran out is good. On the flip side, Doom having no reloads plays into the gameplay style. The strategy in that game is learning how to keep your guns stocked with ammo so you can keep putting out as much damage as possible. Both fun, very different games.
It's almost like you don't understand his points
@@KaptainKommissar I understand his points fine, especially because I'm a huge fan of the kinds of games he's talking about. I specifically think that saying "reloading means waiting till I can have fun again" is batshit insane. Please explain what I missed.
There is a thing called "flow state", when your mind is completely focused on the task at hand and your brain is most efficient at working on that task. In that flow state, if the game manages to get you in it, any kind of stopping is very disappointing. To put it simply: getting into cover to dodge incoming fire is great, getting into cover because your auto-regenerating health bar needs to recharge is not. You can see these two concepts in work at two quite similar games (even though neither of them has health regen), Counter-Strike Global Offensive and Rainbow Six Siege: in CSGO, you learn to peek and shoot while moving between different positions all the time, whereas in RSS your ability to lay down and camouflage itself makes you wait at a very specific angle like a booby trap. In CSGO, you can get into the flow and keep it for the whole round - in RSS, you just wait until the right triggers are touched for you to start reacting to the game.
As someone who has been playing Halo for 15 years and (obviously) loves Halo, this is a really well-made video and I personally think it's spot on. However, I want to add some context on the Halo multiplayer in particular that I hope others watching the video find useful. For Halo 1 and 2 in particular, the games were *much* faster than you would originally think due to the extremely high technical ceiling for these games.
The famous TSK (three shot kill) in Halo 1 with the primary weapon (the pistol) is extremely fast and you got around the inherent slowness with reloading and close-quarters combat with glitches like the backpack reload and BLB (grenade - beatdown - grenade). The sniper of course was also a 1 shot kill that felt smooth and fired quickly. Movement felt smooth overall but did feel stilted when jumping. There were some tricks (grenade jumps, OS + rocket jumps, etc) to make movement faster that also increased the skill gap.
For Halo 2, things got even crazier. The auto-aim in that game was so ridiculous that it wasn't hard for anyone to put together a relatively quick kill, but if you got good at reticule positioning, general reaction time, and map understanding, you would be unstoppable with the sniper in particular due to quickscoping. And then there were so many button glitches to make things even faster. YY (double switch which acted as a ubiquitous end lag canceling mechanism) and grenade reloading (off-host, which is most of the time) made reloading feel lightning quick. BYYB, BXB, BXR, RRBX for near instant kills close up. RRX (double shot) to make the BR almost a 2 shot kill when combined with YY. Crouch jumping felt really smooth and powerful as it unlocked so many locations around the maps (Ring 3 on Sanctuary, Pink 3 on Midship, shortcut jump on Lockout, etc). The button glitches all had pretty tight execution windows and they, combined with all the other wonderful aspects of Halo 2, made Halo 2 an amazing fast-paced competitive shooter with a sky-high skill ceiling.
Unfortunately, Halo and the rest of the industry moved away from the speed of the first 2 games (who can blame the devs, a lot of this was on accident), so I've been getting more and more jaded about Halo and the shooter genre in general since Halo 3. But in the end, even the best Halos can't compete with the original PC shooters in terms of fluidity and speed - There's no denying that. Anyways, thanks for the video - I can tell a lot of effort was put into it and it's just really good. :)
I think the main thing is the 2 weapon limit and the slow player speed Both of which cannot really be worked around.
Thanks for the essay! A+
I’ve been watching your content for so long I’ve went through entire life periods.
Aaaand BXR
@@donovan6320 i dont consider Halo to actually be all that slow in reality, sure its not "Fast" like Doom, but just because its not Fast doesnt mean its Slow. Now you can say comparatively its Slower, but again this is relative to what its being compared to.
It's funny you mentioned bioshock because that series is a perfect example of how consoles affected shooters. The first two games let you use your full arsenal and even had different ammo types for each weapon. Then infinite put in a two weapon limit , regenerating shields and went from a free roam environment to wave based encounters.
The logic here makes no sense. The first two games were made on console so how did console gaming affect the third one negatively? You are confusing console and the games on console that became popular, COD being the most popular game for years in a row is what created that, not the console.
@@BananaMana69
Actually he's right, but for completely wrong reasons. Bioshock was dumbed down for consoles. If you Play System Shock 2 you'll realize that Bioshock is just a dumbed down System Shock 2, but with a more unique aesthetic and nice graphics. Even the story beats are somewhat copied, but maybe a bit more cleverly presented in Bioshock.
Brain dead takes
Just waiting for Doom Eternal clones now
Ultra skull
Can’t wait for people to call them “Doom-likes”
The boomer shooter returned for a while now. Play Dusk (the best one), Amid Evil, Ion Fury, HROT
I doubt any will be as good as eternal tho
@@JackChop I had heard that Rage 2 plays a lot like Doom Eternal since there are a lot of upgrades that will make you feel like a bad ass in the later game - which I know came out before, but a youtuber compared rage 2 to doom reboot and eternal.
I am really interested to see what the act man thinks about this video
I'd love to know too. I love his channel. And it's not like I hate halo or think it's a series. I get why its loved and why it's important. This video is more about capturing why myself and others felt this way when it came out. ActMan's thoughts would be great.
@@underthemayo I disagree with you opinion but good video but I think halo saved the FPS industry
@@Spartan-ng6sx are you trolling are are you just stupid
@@Spartan-ng6sx alternatively, you could watch the video.
@@tomturtl I did I thought all of his points were completely biased bs because he didn’t like it
Not gonna lie, as much as I love halo, I miss the old frantic pace of arena shooters, damn you fortnite for killing the revival of unreal tournament and overwatch for causing quake champions to have abilities
OW is a bad game imo.
Quake Champions is pretty good. Otherwise they would have to make Quake Live... Oh, it's dead cause new players stopped coming?
Not even just the arena shooters (which we still have - although I guess Apex Legends and Overwatch aren't as fast as UT/Q3) - what's totally missing is that arena combat/movement system in a *single-player* campaign-driven game. There is no modern equivalent of Unreal, Half-Life, Quake... except *maybe* Doom 2016/Eternal.
What are your thoughts on tf2? 12v12 games on payload, last point, get pretty frantic for me
@@Junya01 Tf2 is my favorite class based shooter
As a fan who grew up with Halo, this is a really interesting perspective. You have really opened my eyes to your perspective, I now feel like I understand how trends and different land mark games effect the industry. Halo was the next Doom, Fortnite is the next Halo.
Great points, I totally agree with your observation except for the last bit. Halo was an arena shooter, so it was really more in the same category of COD, even Counterstrike. What happened is that a new genre of game became the main thing. I think that had something to do with the changing times and definitely the advances in technology. Having 16 people on a LAN party was crazy back in the say, but a massive online arena with 150 people was inconceivable. Fortnite was the next PUBG and PUBG took a concept that was itself first popularized in media by the rise of Battle Royale. Not in games even, but first in the Hunger Games book and movies, itself part of the trend of YA post-apocalyptic novels. I guess it just goes to show how the different areas of media and tech intersect to form pop culture.
Quake was the next Doom, Half-Life was the next Quake and Halo was the next Half-Life... too bad Half-Life 2 didn't become the next Halo, because that would have been a great direction for the shooters to come... instead Call of Duty, and it's ilk of boring tactical, cover based shooters became the next trend.
Fortnite is a test bed for Unreal Engine 4. Don't delude yourself
but Fortnite is a third person shooter
TBH, console ruin gaming, in a way, when Devs actively limit themselves BECAUSE they make games with console in mind, thats why you have 4 skills because of controllers... when games made with PC in mind with have 8-10 skills because you have 1-0 on a keyboard.
I don’t agree with some of your points but I respect this vid
This is a way better comment than the comments that write entire essays on why they disagree
@@desko2041 Eh, I have a nitpick with this comment. You see, although people type out long and exaggerated paragraphs on why the disagree, it’s a bit ridiculous to boil it down to something so small. Do you get that? Because I don’t think you do. I really don’t understand how someone could say something so preposterous and benign, that I MAY just smoke a cigar and read a page from my favorite book, “Writing for Dummy’s”. Anyways, to get back to your point, I think people have a very good reason to type out an extremely long comment on why they disagree. I mean, if this “Mayo” man can make a twenty minute video on it, why can’t I comment a two thousand word essay on I think he’s wrong? Interesting how a different perspective can change someone’s opinion...
@@Pertlight yes
@@desko2041 I just want someone to love me
@@Pertlight no
Dude, you couldn’t have said that any better, I’m a hardcore halo fan myself and halfway through the vid my fanboy blood was boiling a little, but somehow you got your point across and I understand, subbed
Absolute legend
I'm a Halo fan and I loved this video!! Our backgrounds in FPS games are very different considering what Wolfenstein was for you Halo 3 was for me, but I totally understand where you are coming from. I'm happy I subbed to you all those months back, it was definitely worth it. Congrats on 50k!!
I'm encouraged by how many halo fans get where I'm coming from. Respect man. Hoping for a bright future for halo fans! Thanks!
Insightful nice.
Although I do disagree with you on some points, you have my full respect and admiration for turning a video I was ready to dislile (due to my ignorance) into something that helped me look at things through the bigger picture with excellently presented constructive criticism. Bravo!
I wholeheartedly thank you for enlightening me and you have my utnost sympathy.
10:35 "No grapple hook"
Halo Infinite: Im gonna stop you right there
I mean doom eternal even has a grapple hook right?
Master chief has it in his wrist, and doom slayer has it in his super shotgun...
Speaking of the Halo series being ruined by following trends...
@@ChairmanKam The "Just Cause" series and a hundred other games have grapple hooks, "Halo: Infinite" has been in development since before "DOOM 2016", now shut the fuck up about Halo 'stealing' ideas from other games, no one owns an idea or a concept only their IP and this video explains it best: ruclips.net/video/6ZQPxKG1O3Y/видео.html
@@starhammer5247 You clearly missed my point, but that's ok. 343i has been allergic to Halo's DNA since "Legends", and they need to actually acknowledge what they have here. They have VERY clearly been chasing trends. Believe me, no one wants me to be wrong more than me.
@@ChairmanKam Alright, but the grapple hook in Infinite is meant more for exploration than combat and has been in development for longer than Eternal, and in the trailer, you can see the grapple hook is used in far more creative ways than the meat hook as the meathook is primarily used for combat rather than exploration (speedrunner's don't count). But I do agree that 343 hasn't been doing the greatest job when handling Halo, but I get really pissed off when people start criticizing crap when it isn't even out yet or haven't even looked at the rest of it so I'd prefer for people to post their criticisms after they've played the game rather than before it's even released, it's just annoying when someone judges something before it's even out or complete.
I have a feeling you'd find Marathon a really interesting missing link here. Reloading, story/objective based level design, checkpoints, but naturally a huge Doom influence with health being an even bigger rarity.
"Doom doesn't reload."
You made doom 3 feel sad 😞
@Michal Litecký I loved it personally. It's not perfect but it does action horror well.
Well doom 3 has done great at its job as a horror fps game
@Michal Litecký Doom 3 didn't suck. Doom 3 just wasn't Doom. Give it a different story and a different name and it would have been completely different in its reception.
I also kinda get the feeling that the original doom games didn't have reloading due to how young the genre was, rather than it being a tactical, purposeful exclusion by the devs for gameplay reasons.
I think 3 is alright it's just not like the original dooms it's a solid game in my opinion
See this is how you talk/debate about something. Not bashing the game, not hating the player base, etc. Just giving your honest opinion. Excellent work mayo
too bad facts dont care about opinions, and that some of his bigger complaints are just simply false. Not to say that everything was incorrect, but he seems to only be addressing the symptom of his root problem rather than the actual cause for it. "Combat Evolved" isnt the problem for him, its that he just doesnt like consoles, or that he wants all games to feel like Doom or Tribes or Quake or something. I dont understand the animosity towards games like Halo or CoD or Battlefield even, it just comes off as elitist and kinda douchy.
@JJCaustic
In other words, you didn't even watch the video.
ah shit you got me bro, nice comeback /s
in fact however I did have the misfortune of watching this clickbait tier hot take. Its not trying to be objective, lets be real here. Its coming from a place of raw emotion and is only indicative of the author's opinion. That being the case, its not completely devoid of merit. He's entitled to hold his opinion, as are his fans and followers. If you count yourself among them, thats fantastic, he really does have some good quality videos out there. But this aint it Chief.
@@ClassMRule
He's made it clear in the video that Halo is a great game. More importantly, his problem is how the influence of Halo lead to a huge quantity of imitators, and as such the FPS market became one-sided instead of this balanced mixture of varied FPS games made for their respective platforms, either PC or Console. Obviously, he prefers the faster FPS games made for PC, but that wasn't the main focus. Of course, when you say stuff that shows you either haven't watched the video or don't get the clear context, you're bound to say a load of rubbish.
@@ultrairrelevantnobody1862 Would you say that Rogue "killed" Roguelikes, or that Metroid/Castlevania "killed" Metroidvania games? Or that Dark Souls "killed" Soulslikes? Because thats comprabale to saying that Halo "killed" the genre of "Halo-Killers" which followed the games industry influence following the popularity of the console shooter.
It takes BALLS to post something like this (esp w the click baity title). But I understand and respect why you posted it. While I may disagree very VERY heavily about how you view FPS, it's not to say it's wrong. You just view it differently. Hope you get more subs Mayo Man.
Thanks. Again, this isn't a click bait title. I stand by the title. I can say that while still thinking halo was a good game.
@@underthemayo halo didnt ruin the fps genre tho lol, companies that tried to copy it did
@@hayabuzon8219 honestly i agree with you mostly
@@hayabuzon8219 So basically what he said in the video
@@funnyjupiter4499 but not in the title
The same could be said of the shooters of the mid-late 90’s being Doom Clones
Right? Lol hes upset that everyone copied halo when the previous generation was everyone trying to smash doom and quake together
@MEME GOD you’re clearly salty bud it’s ok lol
That’s why nowadays it’s way better since classic, and modern can exist instead of being one sided. Which is basically what happened in the past 15 years of shooters.
@MEME GOD I mean you were clearly salty. You threw out a heavily opinionated comment and insulted new shooters lol running fast and shooting at the same time doesn’t require more skill than good positioning and good aim. Just different skill. You have no arguments you’re just... salty
@MEME GOD running around and shooting takes as much skill as positioning, and having decent enough aim. Obviously, games like quake require skill, from denying weapon pick ups, to area control, but the same can be said for games like Rainbow Six Siege, or even Halo 3, you need skill for every game, unless your playing something like COD💀, honestly why can’t we just appreciate these games and stop arguing over them? It’s one person opinion to the next .
and then The Halo Killer was Halo itself..
(in Palpatines voice) Ironic..
"I know your pain, guys. I've been there."
A sentiment that is comforting, to say the least. Expertly done, this is getting my like, and if your other videos are as well put as this, I'll be subbed shortly after.
Except he wasn't. He's complaining that he didn't like the game design direction. Games themselves were still fine full priced games. What people are now facing are games being actively cut and sold in pieces, predatory monetization practices. Mobile games.
All he went through is see FPS games start to prefer a style that wasn't to his own taste, but they were still proper full games.
When you said a lot of old school halo players might have adverse reactions to battle royale games like you did with halo I instantly understood how you felt and for the entire video I was thinking that "yeah halo blew up and changed shooters for sure but its not that big of a deal right"? But holy shit I understand now, I grew up with halo and it was the first shooter I ever played and seeing all these battle royale games just pop up out of nowhere and completely change everything felt kinda shitty. Now I'll be honest I've spent more time playing fortnite than I'm happy to admit and the game isn't inherently bad (got a horrible community though) but like you said about halo and how you could just never truly get into it because it wasn't like your classic fast paced pc shooters, well I guess its the same for me with all these battle royale games. On a side note though I absolutely fucking love the old school fast paced shooters. Doom is definitely one of my favorite games alongside Halo and Dark souls. It was interesting to learn about your perspective of halo.
Battle Royale was fun in the beginning, but now everything has to have a battle royale mode for some reason
@@miguelcorreia6777 yeah, battle royale has been heavily over saturated with how much its been shoved in our faces.
@@miguelcorreia6777 That's because of hype. Back then, when games were announced, very few people got to see the trailers, teasers, etc. They didn't know much about how the game would be unless they attended conventions or had demo versions. These days, you have an autistic entity called 'the internet' that would over-intensify any kind of trailer or teaser and give revenue to the greedy company making the said game and release it in an unfinished state anyway.
For Halo CE's case, this one game went against the mainstream view that FPS games aren't suitable on console, and absolutely astounded everyone who played this game. This game had the quality and ability to revolutionize FPS in the way it did. Don't forget though, games like Return To Castle Wolfenstein (my favorite Wolfenstein even to this day and I'd still recommend this game to anyone who wants to play quality FPS shooter games) came after Halo and it was still praised a lot. That game has heavy traits of the old school arena genre. We also have games like System Shock 2 and Deus Ex that also influenced the class-based SP side of things a lot, and I feel sad that this genre (supposedly coined as 'immersive sim') isn't that talked about these days. And you also had the terribly underrated MilSim sparkers like Operation Flashpoint CWC (now called ArmA CWA) which set forward the Military Simulator genre. All these games had traits and qualities in them that made them contribute to the gaming industry and provide more variety. You like fast paced action? Go play the old school arena games. You like ultra- realism? Try games like ArmA. You want a challenging action game with a compelling story and also a small blend of realism? You can try STALKER. You have so many options with such unique playstyles. While games like CoD came out and 'copied' the design that Halo set in motion, it made it's own contribution by bringing WW2 games to console and made them go mainstream. And games like Medal of Honor also had good campaigns.
But Battle Royale has no redeeming factor in it. It's just a mod that came from another survival mod which was from a MilSim game. The only reason why it still exists now is because it's where the money's at these days, and thanks to the drama that unfolded between PUBG and Fortnite when this genre was new. This genre hasn't revolutionized anything. The current state of the video game industry is a show to how degenerative things have become.
When BR was new, it was fresh. People like to try new things every once in a while. That's why it was enjoyable, BUT ONLY FOR THE SHORT TERM. It didn't have any more sophisticated things that could separate this gametype into a fully different genre. And now, despite that people have already enjoyed it for it's worth, the companies still want to milk it as much as possible.
It was way worse with Halo than with battle royale imo, because the effect of Halo was inescapable, but these days there are so many games being made you can really have your pick. I occasionally pick up battle royale games to check them out and sometimes even enjoy them for a while, but I never feel like the genre is infringing on the games I enjoy. Hell, the game that I have the most hours in on Steam is Hunt: Showdown, which is I suppose a kind of battle royale game. I guess that's a bit of a tangent, but Halo really did change basically the entire FPS landscape for the worse for PC players and did it in a way that was largely inescapable for years. You lived with the awareness that even if one of your favorite games got a sequel, it would most likely suck because of what Halo did to the market. You might get annoyed that Fortnight is so popular and how much your friends get into Twitch streamers, but you have so many other options and communities now that you can safely ignore that battle royale is even a thing when it comes to finding games you enjoy.
I'd love to hear your full analysis and thought on Half Life.
You know, i love Halo. I was ready to rage at this video before watching the whole thing, but as i was watching the intro, and your backstory, i started to remember my childhood, and playing all those amazing shooters on my dad's PC. Unreal Tournament is my favorite game of all time. Whenever i hear the term "First Person Shooter" it is the game that immediately comes to mind. I first played it back in 2001, i must've been only 7 years old at the time. My dad asked me if i wanted to play a game like DOOM (He didn't have Quake). Loving DOOM i of course said yes, and i was shown Unreal Tournament. I credit UT, as being the catalyst that made me into the gamer i am today, and despite what my play time on Steam says, (like 25 hours) over the past 18 years, I've played Unreal Tournament for untold thousands of hours. I can load it up anytime, and enjoy it, with a huge grin that stretches from ear to ear. Prior to 2016, i remember longing for an experience like Quake 3, or Unreal Tournament. And outside of a couple of examples like TOXXIK, and Nexuiz, i always went back to Quake Live, UT99, UT04, and UT3. Then DOOM (2016) came along, and hit me with such a huge dose of Dopamine, Adrenaline, and Nostalgia, i couldn't stop until the game was beaten. But, even then, DOOM had me concerned for a different reason
Here's the status i wrote on Facebook shortly after playing DOOM (2016) for the first time: "Playing the new DOOM, makes me really depressed. Not because it's a bad game, DOOM Is amazing. No, what makes me depressed is just knowing it's gonna be overshadowed by less deserving Spunkgargleweewee games like Infinite Warfare, and Battlefield 1."
While it wasn't completely, the talk was definitely about Infinite Warfare, BF1, and Overwatch. It was really disappointing to see so many GOTY awards go to Overwatch, when DOOM felt the freshest in 2016.
Nowadays, it seems the old school shooter is starting to see a decent resurgence especially in the Indie scene. I really hope this renaissance of old school shooters continues for years to come. The popularity of DOOM (2016), and DOOM Eternal is great start. In the words of the late Totalbiscuit in his closing thoughts of DOOM (2016): "I certainly hope it spawns some imitators, and hopefully some good ones to."
Fantastic video.
I think BF1 was amazing. It has a better atmosphere and gameplay than BFV.
"I was ready to rage at this video before watching the whole thing"
hehe Good ol' Mayo is good with clickbait titles, uh?
@@chrll He ended up being kinda right. Halo did kinda ruin shooters to an extent.
@@Suiax yep. More than "kinda right", I would say "absolutely right". But that title!
@@Suiax yea he's complaining cause companies started giving a different sub category of fps that he didn't like so he was mad
Dude really brought his whole computer to a halo lan party.
if you simply had added "for me" at the end of the title you would have alot less dislikes
halo didnt ruin the FPS indistry
it just ruined it for you
Exactly
You obviously didn't watch the full video.
@@biglad3701 well i did watch it so,
things change over time and its sad that he doesnt see that as a good thing, the entire video is basically him going "WAAAHHHH two weapon limit sucks WAAAHHHH recharging health WAAAAHHHH reloading"
its like reloading makes the game more tactical as you have to chose when to leave yourself vanurable, its like a two weapon limit means you have to be tactical about your choice of weapons, its like recharging health means the action can go on for alot longer, if you have 5 health in wolfenstine or doom you have to go back and find a medkit or die in the next encounter witch slows the pace
@@jkbscopes1233 In modern Doom, glory kills refill health. At least Doom improved in keeping the fast-paced gameplay interactive, whilst Halo did not. He did bring up some valid points as to why he disliked the instant healing feature and how it affected future titles. Again, he never said it was a bad game, nor did I.
I don't think that would have worked. Xbox fans get triggered too easily.
As someone who’s put in 1500 hours into TF2, I kinda felt the way you did about HALO in regards to Overwatch - the shift from CLASS-based shooter to HERO-based shooter, with fancy abilities you can do with a press of a button. Imo, abilities dumbed down the potential of hero shooters by restricting the mechanics with cooldowns. But now since OW blew up the genre, all hero fps games follow suit.
I am not a fan of pressing a button to do something and having to wait an arbitrary amount of time to press that button again. It makes no sense Genji can reflect with his sword but then not pull it out again after, or how Winston has to wait a certain amount of seconds to leap again, or Ana having an unlimited amount of sleep darts but can only use it once every x seconds.
Waiting on cooldowns, as opposed to actively filling up a bar to use something powerful (Uber, Soldier’s banners, scout’s bonk, pyro’s phlog crits) just ain’t that engaging for me. With the latter, it forces you to engage with the game instead of passively waiting when on cooldown, and rewards the player for doing well.
Compare hero shooters to tf2, and how the latter is balanced around the ammo mechanic (something that OW needed to not be so spammy imo) - Pyro can airblast/reflect projectiles unlimited times, but spamming it leaves u vulnerable and eats ur ammo away. Soldier can rocketjump at any given time to truly zoom in and out of battle, no need to wait for a cooldown just to do ONE jump. It’s balanced by health getting splashed from each rocket, and in the case of the Gunboats secondary, which reduces splash damage immensely, being super mobile comes at the cost of a secondary shotgun. Demo can also stickyjump, which is more mobile but costs greater health. Spy can disguise at ANY time, turn invisible at ANY time, and can OHKO the enemy from behind at any given time. No need to wait for some dumb timer to dictate what u can do, the player controls the flow of his gameplay.
That’s not even mentioning the deep movement mechanics for all the classes, scout with his double jump, pyro with flare jumping/reflect jumping and switching to the powerjack for extra speed, Soldier/demo and rocket/stickyjumping, demoknight with trimping, *heavy has nothing*, Engineer with sentry jumping with the wrangler to get to different spots, Engineer with the Eureka effect to teleport instantly at the press of a button, Medic constantly trying to surf damage to add mobility and lessen splash damage, *sniper same as medic but to less effect*, and the Spy with a whole subset of Trickstabs and movement techniques to expose the back of an enemy - seriously, the things spies can do after hours of mastering their movement is insane - and that’s not even including how you can use your guns alongisde your movement to kill.
My point being, there’s a reason why Tf2 is still being played by thousands of people everyday, 13 years later - there’s no other game like it. It’s truly one of a kind, from the culture to the mechanics and the characters and unique weapons and taunts and situations that arise from playing. I will love this game till I die, but I’m just kinda disappointed that the potential Overwatch had didn’t really come to fruition in the way I thought it would. Thanks for the vid Mayo, you a real one.
this isn't a video about TF2 or overwatch, ur comment is irrelevant
Before watching: So you have chosen death
After watching: ‘Ah, I see you’re a man of culture as well’
Redditor
Mans just don’t know the pocket reload
That’s what I was thinking 😂
The classic combo that saved your ass on legendary
You guys just shut up
@@emin166
“Shut up guys. Stop debunking this video that’s built off an opinion that’s poorly explained and articulated”. Yeah sorry tell Mayo to explain his problems with Halo next time instead of just being lazy and not willing to admit he just didn’t like it cause it was a different type of shooter. Cause that’s all he did. Which doesn’t fit this clickbait title of the vid.
I mean I like both doom and halo. Fast paced is great and all but sometimes sitting back and playing something slower is pretty fun. I just generally enjoy first person shooters as a whole, regardless of speed
Halo is really tactical on legendary (mainly CE and 2) and you have to make tough choices about encounters its great.
Doom eternal and halo 3 👌🏾
@@benjiii3407
Man of culture 💪
@@badgasaurus4211 2 on legendary just isn't fun, and 2 is probably my favorite of the classic games. You die in 7 plasma bolts, get oneshot by the (many) jackal snipers, and the noob combo is so good and everything else so underpowered your playstyle becomes extremely restricted.
I am a doom and halo fan at the same time lol
This may come out of nowhere, but you actually managed to make me realize something: I've been playing Team Fotress 2 for years, and me and a bunch of friends have always had trouble against a single class: Sniper.
Thanks to your vid, I could finally think about it better, and realize that, even for a Arena-style shooter that has a ton of elements from Quake gets fucked over by a single class, and that's because Snipers directly contradicts the free roaming nature of TF2 by denying entire areas by just being there. He slow the game down to a croll and it's the most gamebreaking class in the sense that it can completely deny the other team as long as he can aim well. Even for a 2007 game that continues to be played and receive bits of content up to this day, Sniper still remains as an intruder to the whole game's foundation by imposing a way of playing that directly contradicts the nature of the other classes.
So, thanks Mr. UnderTheMayo.
I, umm... Shoot at them to make their aim shake? Send a spy? Spam flares/rockets? Use uber? Are you sure you're not talking about sentries? Is the sniper so good or do you just stand around? Countersnipe him and be done?
And finally - is railgun broken in Quake?
@@doommaker4000
-a class being countered by itself and only itself is dumb, since most other classes have ways of dealing with each other
-spy has to get trough the entire enemy team just to get close to the sniper, which doesn't even guarantee a kill due to quickscopes being a thing
-spamming projectiles doesn't work due to the fact that they aren't hitscan and can be avoided, and also the fact that, to do so, you need to get in his sightline, which will more than likely get you killed for doing so
-bullet spread and awful hitreg fuck up most attempts at tweaking a Sniper's aim from afar, which would lead to you dying to him for exposing yourself to him
-Quake wasn't class based, and allowed for a lot of counterplay thanks to the faster pacing, dynamic map design, and multiple option
Quake incentivizes your movement due to everyone else doing the same and the maps being designed around that idea
TF2's sniper only lacks in KotH maps due to their smaller design, while he dominates in every other enviroment because of the rest of the map pool having plenty of room for him to keep the distance and abuse the short ranged nature of the other 8 classes
And if you want more backup, I have played a fair amount of Highlander matches, and you also have devs claiming that Sniper is the only class they ever considered removing
@@doommaker4000 you got rekt
@@doommaker4000 Are you sure you are not taking about Heavy?
you just wait until act man becomes friends with mayo after this video
Now whenever I see enemies in the distance in a FPS game, I'M LIKE YESSSS, MEATHOOK!!!! then realize I'm playing the wrong game ):
Wolfenstein: the game everyone's dad had on their pc.
What made Halo so damn good was its sandbox. Which future games that tried to be like Halo failed at understanding. It wasn't halo's fault for revolutionizing the console shooter, but more of the developers of said clones and such that did not replicate what made halo so goddamn good. Which in my opinion was the sandbox, and the enemies that big man chief fought.
There's definitely a resurgence of classic FPSes in the indie scene. You'll definitely have to look beyond the AAA scene for the sorts of games you want.
Also on another note, try Vanquish.
woaaah vanquish dude
By today’s standards bioshock definitely feels prehistoric, funnily enough, I feel that it plays better on pc than console, but even with the clunky and weighty controls, it’s still worthy of a play through and is really a genuine classic that’ll be remembered as much as many of the other games you speak of
bruh ı fucken loved Bioshock due to its different plasmoids and no weapon limit (unlike Bioshock Infinite WTF) its story was great and enviormental and elemental attacks with different ammonation types and tonics made it a different fun RPGish game. Bioshock 1 is obviously my fav in the series with its unique settings , unique gameplay and story (thoe the whole little sister harvest or rescue thing was useless since there is no reason to harvest them cause you get more than enough ADAM throughout the game)
It "feels" prehistoric if you're a zoomer.
@@666chapelofblood just play any modern fps, they’re just variations of the same control scheme which make them feel similar. I think the clunky controls of bioshock add to its charm
You should probably change your title to “how halo ruined my experience of the FPS genre”
Its HIS channel. So 'my' is automatically implied
@@nareshwildbones But he’s correct. Everything this guy whines about is a personal problem
@@XmarcX92 if your going to insult mayo, the least you can do is say the name right
@@Nightflyermike Huh?
@@XmarcX92 Yeah, but it's also *his* channel, by the theme of the video ALONE it's clear that “personal” is implied here.
This is what sums up my opinion with Halo perfectly. Halo is one of my favourite franchise of all time. Yet, I despise it’s legacy. After Halo release, the FPS genre slowly turn into regenerating health slow moving copypastas, incorporating Halo’s mechanics willy nilly, without thinking of the possibility that it might not mix very well.
There can be no greater heresy!
Nice pfp
He shall be an exemple for all who want to break our covanant.
I'd say the shift in mainstream FPS design didn't just happen with Halo, but also with Half-Life 2 and COD 4; all of them were slower paced FPS games, compared to the classics, with a focus on more realistic design, story telling, more linear map design, etc. I'm sure there are others, but those are the main three I can think of.
I think MOH and COD1 had even more of an effect.
You misspelled Call of Duty.
Yeah, it's "Cale uf dooty".
No, even call of duty has better gameplay than halo in my opinion. It's not my type of game, but I can stand playing it for more than 15 minutes, unlike halo 3, which is literally the worst shooter I have played. This is all my opinion by the way.
I gotta' say, I really like this new style of video. It's so cool hearing about your experiences with games, and it's even better that you're embracing that part after just mentioning those experiences briefly in your other videos.
Great that you don't care much about how things are received (at least negatively that is), because I'd love to see more videos like this.
Love your stuff, man. Keep up the good work. Congrats on 50k subs too, here's to 50k more.
Wow, I love this video! The different perspective you give on this game is amazing and actually gives good points. I'm talking from the view point of a guy who is subscribed to the Actman who LOVES halo so seeing this review made me think about in a more in-depth way. Thank you, man.
There is more than one way to make a fun and engaging fps game...The Doom way is not the only one.
Explaining to indie devs that they're not making boomer shooters, they're only making DOOM-likes
Under The Mayo makes a video about halo: "OPEN THE GATES!"
its called Halo Ruined First Person Shooters: "CLOSE THE GATES!"
he brings up lot of good points: "OPEN THE GATES A LITTLE!"
His "good points" are childish gripes though.
@@HK-07 if you watched the video then youd understand that it's not hard at all to see the connection of my comment to his video.
@@No_Face1313 You're the one who didn't watch the video
@@HK-07 Oof size large
@@No_Face1313 I mean yeah they are gripes, this whole damn video is all about his feelings on halo and modern shooters, but that’s the point. This video is just about an old school shooter player feeling disappointed with how games went after halo, but at no point does he say these games are objectively bad, or that anyone who plays these games has bad taste, he just thinks that halos mechanics are slow and tedious compared to the fast paced action packed shooters of yesteryear. He even relates to people who grew up with halo and are now facing the battle royals craze, since that’s what he went through for a long time.
2008: I was fully introduced to Doom. And I became a hero to my classmates by getting it on virtually every computer in my high school. Good times
I used to put Quake in a hidden folder in the school's network and play deathmach with my friends, every time they found out I'd just put it again.
@Tarbosaurus Let me add details cause yeah, it DID happen!
1) When I say classmates, I mean the 5-10 people who sat near me in my computer class and maybe a few of my friends who weren't in that class.
2) My high school had a hard drive connected to almost all the school's computers. I put the WADS, source ports, and mods in there and boom, they all have access.
Also, of all the stories on the internet, this is the one you have to voice doubt on? Hell, I've told more farfetched things on the internet before (that did happen cause my autistic ass really does not like to lie)
@@VaderTheWhite Funnily enough, I had a classmate in my engineering class that did the exact same thing but instead of doom they got the original halo 😄
Also I LOVE your profile pic 😁
@@Jessica-yl2gu Thanks, made it myself!
Well, I have no childhood relations about doom or halo. But, I have played a hecktic masterpiece! Do you know these old nokia with gameloft games? There was a game called diamond rush. It was a rogue-like but with no rogue-like mechanics. It's was a puzzle game about an adventurer trying to find 3 crystals or something.
I guess you will understand when you try it... I was a really different kid from others back then.
In my opinion halo moved the industry forward just as much as doom but in a completely different way. If movies were video games doom would’ve been the first movie with sound but halo would’ve been the first movie in color, two major milestones just done in two completely different ways
Wow that was a great analogy holy shit
I'm honestly glad I saw this video after the elden ring stream, explained an awful lot.
As much as I love halo. I agree whole heatedly. Kind of like how games like the Last of Us and Uncharted ruin AAA gaming for me. It use to be fun video games but now it's all Movie like cinematic gaming. With slow walking scene. That's why I love the yakuza games. You can have a great story with awesome characters and amazing gameplay.
I find Yakuza tries to be like movies too much, there are far too many cut scenes. I've tried 2 and both had 30 minutes plus of cutscenes to start the game.
@@fastenedcarrot9570 i played yakuza zero on game pass a few weeks back and was just taken a back at just how many cutscenes there were and just how long they dragged. Like jesus they are persona 5 levels of bad
@@shawklan27 Yeah, I've been told so many times to stick with and you'll enjoy it bit when you finally start some gameplay and you get a guy going on a long rant to give backstory to how you use money to buy new abilities (and it still doesn't make any sense) I lose all interest. Odd to say the least.
I really hope BotW reset the standard for AAA games. I don't want to play walking simulators when I get a Series X. Though... I guess Uncharted and TLOU _are_ Sony exclusives.
@@smugplush The good thing is Bloodborne didn't shamelessly attempt to copy movies - that alone already makes it by far the most interesting PS exclusive to me.
I admire your openness about your own opinions, that's pretty respectable. At the same time, I feel this is not a just representation of Halo and its core mechanics. I had actually hoped somebody like you, with your attention to detail in game design, would pick up on more of its fundamentals. So, fearing somebody might find out about Halo over this video, here's my attempt at more clearly defining Halo's systems and appeal: Halo's main approach to gameplay follows sandbox design; while games like Doom mostly offered you your environment to traverse, weaponry to use smartly and enemies to kill, which on its own is quite stunning (I can hopefully claim, having played through most Doom games), Halo focuses more on the the 3d game world (more about that later). Halo's core interaction and combat system is organized via the Golden triangle: Meele (easily accessible as opposed to being its own 'weapon'), Weaponry from close to long range, and grenades with different effects. Combine this with different damage types (bullets, most useful against unshielded enemies, and plasma, most useful against shields of any kind), and your weapon variety easily complements your enemies. Fittingly, there exist enemies with and without shields and different ranks. Doom would force demons against you in any scenario, so it might be smart to make them fight each other, which you can do with movement alone. Halo, on the other hand, gives the enemies a clear, and similar to Doom visually distinct rank structure, so while it might be smart to use your Assault rifle to spray down unshielded Grunts before engaging their leader (an elite), it may be equally smart to kill the tougher elite first by depleting his shields and then taking his life, which leads the Grunts to run away in fear. The main takeaway: it is in your hands how you approach enemies and each corner of the golden triangle forces you to bargain appropriately. Only use plasma weaponry and get up close to melee away lives? Use plasma frags to scatter enemies, deplete an elite's shield and go for a sniper kill? And that's just the dynamic between two of Halo CE's four main Covenant enemies. Back to the sandbox: by giving enemies and players access to the environment, Vehicles and weaponry, the outcome to your plans may always differ. Shields aren't there to force you to hide, quite the opposite: previous games had you sacrifice lives for every mistake you made, Halo gives you a buffer to encourage interesting plays. Slow movement? Makes you think about your placement and options rather and offers vehicles in the sandbox. Two weapon limit? Doom and similar games have a (albeit branching) hierarchy of weapons. In Halo, every weapon has major strengths and weaknesses which balance each other out, giving each an individual role beyond 'killing'. You may use two different damage types to counter Covenant enemies but which weapons have the perfect range you curently also need? Or do you plan on only using projectiles, the Flood's main weakness? Or only plasma, the Sentinel's main weakness? Lastly, the sandbox offers multiple solutions to your, Mayo's, main problems. Every enemy carries a weapon you can pick up and use to your advantage. Learn the strengths and weaknesses of each weapon and the gameplay will feel similarly methodic to Doom Eternal (which,borrowed many of Halo's mechanics). You're out of ammo and there's a weapon across the room you might need? Sacrifice a frag and let the weapon fly towards you. Or just explode a vehicle and make it flip onto your enemies. All in all, different from Doom to an extent you fail to present properly. Especially obvious in your 'redemption' of Halo CE' in the end. The example you use of enemies being in an open field and lacking cover is one of the early points the game teaches you that you and your enemies are dependant on the environment. Had you played on something more than normal, you would have quickly realized enemies spot you faster and spread accordingly, dodge more frequently and attack more viciously. And yet, every enemy can die in less than one clip of any weapon if you also utilize the sandbox, your movement and positioning and your melees and grenades, as opposed to most of the gameplay you show here, Mayo. On a final note, I'd suggest playing Halo CE Anniversary with classic graphics, since they quite clearly distinguish your enemies as well as their ranks and more properly present the tone of each level, but that's another debate
This was really nice to watch. A lot of nostagia trip. I never realized that I too kind of skipped most modern shooters.
Half Life deathmatch had that run and gun feel, played some Unreal, a lot of Quake 3 Arena.
I played CS, and CS Sourse for years, and never really move on to anything else. Switched to RTS and League of Legends.
Played Halo on PC at some point. Really loved the story and characters, and the combat was fun too. Never played multiplayer Halo.
Played thorugh Borderlands, and really loved the 2013 Tom Raider, but not really as a shooter, but for the story and exploartion.
Then Total Biscuit (RIP) reviewed Doom 2016 and at next good sale I had it and riped and teared at my hearts content. It felt GREAT.
So great that I bought Eternal at launch. I bought only three games full price at launch: StarCraft 2 (all 3 expansions) (because SC Brood Wars is god), Overwatch (but I kind of regret that one :D, I was high on the Blizzard hype train) and Doom Eternal.
If you read this, and wish to play another really awesome game - Hades! Supergiant games outdid themselves.
It's not a shooter, but its fast, very well made, it has that controlled chaos feel to it, and it really rewards good fast playstyles.
It's not exactly the same feel (flow) as Doom, but there are moments, when the build is right and you vibe with the weapons, that it feels sooooooooo fast and so satisfying. And the story and music are great.
I hope you check it out.
A genre is never dead. Only asleep.
Tell that to classic adventure games and no, Walking Dead doesn't count.
Futuristic Racing?
F-Zero?
That entire Genre of racing games is on life support and that saddens me
@@lucylu3342 Damn
Call of Duty ruined the FPS genre.
It certainly made it worse for a while.
I don't think COD itself did, I think oversaturation of COD poisoned the genre. I think it's recovering and COD is adapting and becoming more like it used to when it was good, but still. I can agree to an extent.
@@underthemayo cod and battlefield ruined it in not halo
@@noblewolves3142 Yeah exactly. This isn't about the individual games. It's about their affect.
The original modern warfare was a great game, hell it's one of the few cod games I genuinely like
But it would be hard to ignore its impact on oversaturating the market, cause EVERYONE wanted a part of the modern warfare gravy train
I literally got suckered into watching a video where a boomer spergs out about how fps games were better in the 90's for 20 minutes.
I love how you mention tf2 and just say: really fun but not campaign. Also, I get where you come from and I completely understand your point about halo. I think that it was a really bad thing that basically the whole market switched to the slower type of games. I think it would've been better if it was 50/50 and that you could just switch between them.
When does he ever mention TF2???
@@JustinWHY-zz7gz when do you ever watch the video?
Because Doom has such a compelling storyline /s
@@ClassMRule yeah, and don't you forget about the deeply lore of Quake.
It WAS 50/50. A lot of the most popular FPS titles of the 2000s were fast paced shooters like Battlefront 2 and Far Cry. Not to mention Crysis, which was similar to Halo but was anything but slow paced. Regenerating health wasn't really the norm till the 2010s, it was moreso an option compared to how it later became "Oh, I don't regenerate health? That sucks."