People really need to give props to Hiro Murai too. He’s the dude who’s been able to make Donald Glover’s vision a reality especially with his work on Atlanta and this video.
I swear this is me and one of my close friends ALL THE TIME!! My friend is narcissistic and cynical while I’m typically the opposite so when he makes optimistic remarks we always have the same type of battle. I even showed him on a podcast and we argued the same points Myke and Rod argued
I think the whole trying to "expose" Donald Glover for not having a black wife is the usual tedious behaviour of holier than thou people trying to drag people for being "fake woke" as opposed to celebrating issues being brought up
I saw this one video this black woman put out... she was really tryna get this man up outta here. Talking bout he can't be pro black with his white wife. Took a poem of his completely outta context. Then the comment section was waaaay worse. I couldn't deal.
I usually don't agree with Rod, but I'm with him on this one-it isn't Gambino's job to explain his art. I get Mike Eagle's point but at the same time, why single out Gambino and this video specifically for not explaining further? Kendrick doesn't explain his albums and what he's trying to say is definitely too complex and multilayered for the average person to grasp or understand. Therefore is Kendrick not doing his job correctly? I get the point but I do feel like Rod that Gambino is being criticized specifically and I don't think that's fair when he put out this amazing music video. I also don't think that anyone will come away from the video without at least some sort of opinion beyond "this is dope" or "this is trash" because so much is happening and there is so much vivid imagery. I don't really think some racist person is going to watch this and miss the message completely and then if Gambino comes out and says the opposite-I really don't think their mind would change. This song is expected to debut in the top 3 at least next week-it's everywhere. I think Gambino has done more than enough to disperse his message and only time will tell if it actually does anything. Just my opinion though-I see all of your points and have so much respect for y'all so keep doing your thing. Love the new studio!!
Ryan Comeau Open mike Eagle's complaint would be valid against Kendrick as well. Although you could argue that even when Kendrick is nuanced he doesn't completely go over as many people in the way this video is. I am not saying Kendrick is not as deep just in most cases the base level is more direct to the theme whereas here gambino's base level goes completely over a large number of people. You would be surprised how many people don't take away anything from the video. Personally if you don't think a bunch of people are missing point of discussion in the video you have missed one of the video's corr comments. I don't think this will change the mind of a racist person but honestly I believe this video is geared towards those who are irresponsibly neutral or conscious and ignorant.
I think people are missing the point of the video, but my argument is that they would think whatever they want no matter what Gambino said. His fans and people who want to try to understand the video would listen to him, but I just feel as though the people who don't want to understand or will bash it won't be swayed by anything Gambino says about it. Of course, I could be wrong though. Appreciate the comment man
Agreed., I also understand that Open Mike Eagles perspective came from an honest place, but I think it’s an optimistic view of things. I think Gambino risk loses more by explaining his art because it limits the meaning to something specific. People who are going to reinforce their biases watching this would still do so with the explanation. He could explain himself and people could just disagree.
I think the main thing they're just not even considering is that there is a group of people who can be reached by an abstract message that wouldn't listen to or understand a straightforward message.
I hope that Glover never comes out and explains the video. The conversation is more important with the ambiguity. What I think is really awesome about it is video is that there's one big clear message: we ignore the bullshit around us, usually by diving into some kind of hedonic pursuit. Then there's a ton of smaller (not smaller in terms of importance, but in prominence in the video) which some are obvious and clear, but others can be read in all kinds of ways, many of which are a direct result of the life you've lived until you saw this video. It's a Rorschach test. Is this entirely about white oppression? Is this entirely about how blacks cannibalize themselves? Is it some mix? It's it about guns? Or are guns just the easiest shorthand to show a disconnection from violence? Is it just how violence affects black communities or is it a universal statement? Hell, is there even any judgement in this or is it just what he feels is an observation of reality as it is. Again, I don't care about what Glover has to say because all of us who want things to get better need to be talking about it. Glover talking about it removes the conversation.
I disagree, I think that's a cop-out imo. The video is clearly trying to say something, shouldn't people understand what that thing is? What's the point of having a message, if that message isn't clearly illustrated? Art can be just as powerful, or even more, with a clearly defined message. Clearly, Gambino had his intentions behind the video when he was making it, I want to know what that is.
kashstory if you need to be spoon-fed a exclamation from a piece of art then that explanation is probably going to mean nothing to you even when you hear it.
There’s one thing that no ones talking about... the message he’s sending to hip hop itself. Think about the style of his verse and the song in general. He’s using a new age hip hop beat and ad libs all over the place. He’s bridging a gap in hip hop between meaningful hip hop and “trash” hip hop. Even though it’s not really “mumble rap” per say, he’s making a meaningful “mumble rap” song. This guy needs to be cemented in the hip hop culture already. I’m tired of people sleeping on this guy.
Gambino shed light on not being accepted by black women awhile ago.. "Relax, black chick, I think that I have offended thee Got nothing against the sisters, I just don’t think they’re into me I am not a thug, AKA: what they pretend to be I am just myself, AKA: my worst enemy" "It’s cool though, it’s all good You want a dude who keep it real and stay hood I’m sorry, babe, but I act me I don’t act Black, whatever that be" - Childish Gambino / Not Going Back
EricTheKidMusic I see that as a cop out. I’m as square as they come and I pull Black women easily. They’re a lot of Black nerds who want and chase after non-Black women and their excuse is always “Black girls weren’t into me.” I call bullshit. Especially as you get older.
EricTheKidMusic I understand brother, what I’m saying is that I believe his analysis of his experiences is skewed. Many square Black people think that its Black people that don’t appreciate their uniqueness, NOOOO.... no one does. It just that because we (Black people) are also indoctrinated with anti-Black ideas we think that it’s just Black people that don’t like nerds. The only reason Black nerds are halfway accepted in non-Black spaces is because we come off non-threatening and semi not-Black.
MrZLeroy92 Not everyone had the same experiences you had. If a black woman said the same about black men, (like Issa Rae) a lot of people would be more willing to understand.
I totally agree with Rod because putting a message in a coded way for people to decode it themselves helps them reflects on the issues that are being discussed and push them to talk with others that are more enlightened to learn. You can't just break everything down all the time. That's taking people for idiots. Yes most people are, but not breaking it down shows some respect and confidence towards the community. Also the tweet of OME is a bit unfair since the act of putting out a video like this is already a step in a right direction. It is certainly not enough but it is stirring the pot. The message might get lost in the movement of the mediatic waves but it might reach the ears of some.
I sometimes think it's not fair to the whole group when people keep acting like Myke is the only worthwhile member. I know you didn't say that, but there's this attitude that kinda neglects what other people in the group say. Like a lot of them have good points, I'm here for the whole conversation.
It's annoying when people keep labelling "acting black" "acting white" why are you setting expectations for people why can't I just be me? My personality traits are my own, and don't have to be shared across a race or ethnicity.
It's unbelievable that there aren't more people who think like this. I think focusing this much on race and giving it this significant of a role only makes the problems worse. They talk about how white people aren't who Donald is making this video for and that is really fucked up and kinda racist. Black problems are humanity's problems.
Jirehn IsJirehn what do your “personality traits” mean In a white supremacist society if your “personality traits” mirror white people’s? You insult Black people by not grasping that Black people have been living in this white supremacist society for 500 years and that there is a reason why Black people tend to look suspiciously at other Black people who are “acting white.” The accusation of “acting white” and it being seen as a negative attribute in the Black community didn’t come from nowhere.
@@MrZBlackneffect I agree with your statement but at the same time what is being "black" ? Cuz we always associate being black with our most ignorant stereotypes. You don't wear clothes a certain way, or sag your pants... you're being looked at your peers funny. You don't talk with a lot of slang terms... you're being looked at funny. God help you if you can't dance and you're terrible at basketball... you're being excluded from your own peers. Imagine being a black kid not having any of these attributes to what we define as being "black" especially being a black male. He's going to have to chill wit the white kids cuz the black kids want none to do with him. I've lived that life man and the only thing I could hold on to that I could Identify with being black was the fact that I was super talented dancer, and anything to do with art I excelled at, and even though I wasn't good with basketball, I was fast, so any thing that had to do with running, (football, tag, soccer) I wasn't excluded from that. But I couldn't hang wit the black kids cuz I was to well spoken at the time and I my parents wouldn't let me outside the house wit my ass hangin out my pants. And psychologically that resonates wit me today at 25, cuz I look like the biggest stereotype ever, dreadlocks, tattoos, all dat, you couldn't tell me apart from any nigga cuz all I wanted to do is just be unapologetic-ally "black." And man I hated being black too when I was young cuz like no one black was like me, but I aint really fuck wit the white kids either cuz it still just wasn't me, but when a man like Donald Glover came out.... it was really refreshing, here's another "corny" black dude who ain't afraid to be himself and make it big doing so. Only difference was he wasn't born broke. It took a while for me to love my own skin again, didn't like myself till I was maybe 13. I'm 25 now and nobody has called me 'white-washed' since I was 10 cuz I would fight you on the spot. If you wanted to see me on some nigga-ish calling me white wash would do it. I find it funny though, you couldn't get a job being black having tattoos and dreadlocks back then, having long hair in general was just a no-no cuz it was seen as 'messy' or nappy even if you combed that motherfucker nicely, or braided it in some cornrows, so you always had to rock the buzzcut or short fade. And you can never talk to your employer how you would talk to your boys, right now I make it a point to look and act like a stereotype until people actually have a decent conversation wit me. Back to the main point I'm tryna get at, being black should be more then knowing how to rap and play basketball. The term acting black or white shouldn't even be a thing, cuz when it comes to acting black it only sheds light on the ignorant side of being black. We are basically putting white people on a pedestal saying to another black person acting white means they are smarter then the average negro. It's not right.
@@alwaysonroad365 its called minorities being forced to meet certain expectations while white people are the status quo or a white canvas where they are allowed to be anybody. Stereotypes on racial minorities are more generalized than stereotypes of the white majority where its more diverse and is dependent on different parts of America and Europe) Yankee, southern, cali, Midwest accent, etc.)
I agree with Myke. It's bs that Gambino hasn't been accepted by a lot of black people until now. I don't agree, however, that the end of the video was him running away from white involvement. I thought it was pretty clear that Gambino was talking about both the gun problem in America and black-on-black violence. Him running away at the end with those wide eyes is him running from the truth that we're all distracted from.
Not disagreeing with you at all. But just asking...if this is the case then why was the crowd he was running from white? That seems odd if that's the truth we're all distracted from.
Myke C-Town maybe because white people are biggest proponnents of the naratives he put through in the video. He wants to talk about the issues like black on black violence, but he wants to get away from the white people that are just blindly shouting "Black on black crime! Black on black crime!"
I'm not gonna be ignorant and say it doesn't matter that they're all white, cause it obviously does. I just think white involvement popping up at the end is a different turn to the rest of the video - to me that concept almost seems out of place with everything else.
Mercutio Tbh I agree with Myke, the significance of the chasers being white is crucial. I feel he's running away from the fear of what he's become. Knowing that becoming a star (celebrity) he's played into the hands of his oppressors who are giving him money and fame, expecting him to stay quiet and keep dancing, disregarding the problems his community are facing.
When he's running, young thug is singing " You're just a black man in this world, you're just a bar code ". I'll go with Myke's theory. Also you sound super arrogant talking about " it was pretty clear that XYZ" when literally nothing in this video is obvious and can be interpreted in different ways
I have a theory about the part where he lights a joint. He makes a motion like he has a gun and everyone takes off running "from the black man with a gun," but as he finishes off the movement of his arms he's really just reaching for a joint, one of the least violent things you can do. In this scene we have a black man doing something peaceful yet everyone is scared because they think he has or is reaching for a gun.
Are you guys gonna do another video on Atlanta? I'd love to hear what you dudes thought about this season, Especially the Teddy Perkins/Michael Jackson episode lol! I really hope they get an award for that episode OMG dude lol!
Yeah avcourse it is I never said it wasn't but for me there's 3 episodes that stand strong and that is "Teddy Perkins", "The Woods" And "FUBU" those 3 to me were dope af, But yeah the whole season is a gem, You're right.
I can't give a lot of credit to the argument that the video is too coded. Even being white and Australian I felt the messages he's conveying are pretty clear, especially after the second watch. Granted, not to the granular detail of the 17 children and VERY fine points like that, but the overarching messaging around gun violence and the way black people are portrayed in entertainment vs reality can't be missed. Maybe the only people who could misunderstand have an agenda and mindset that's too rigid to be able to win over in this political climate anyway. People compare Gambino to Kanye West at the moment because they're both using their platforms to expose huge audiences to performance art that makes a statement without directly explaining the meaning. In the same way that every detail of Gambino's video has a reason, wouldn't we expect this lack of direct explanation to have a reason? From the outside in, the US appears to be a country that's politically divided, to the point where constructive discussion is almost impossible. Gambino and Kanye are using their art to force people to openly discuss these issues on public platforms, and ideally create a dialogue that bridges the gap. Even if I'm way off the mark on that estimation, it's the effect their work is starting to have, and that couldn't happen if they directly explained the meaning of their art because the audience would categorise them as being part of a certain political camp and move on from the work.
Hubblebub Lumbubwub we've all been teenagers at some stage, and sitting in on a discussion is often a better way to learn than to be presented with raw information
coming back to this, is kinda crazy to realize that they all started loving the gambino video, and by the end, because one tweet from open mike, everybody but rod changed their opinion
Gambino doesn’t have to explain the video, if he explains it the conversation ends. The whole point is for people to connect with each other and get what they get from the video. An artist shouldn’t explain or tell people what to interpret from their art. That’s the people’s responsibility once an artist explains his art it loses its value. Imagine if your favorite painter, filmmaker, or musician said “this is what my art means and if you get something else out of it you’re wrong” it loses some of the connection the consumer can have
Revelation 6:8 8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.”
Open Mike clarified in a later tweet that he doesn't like that it's up to all the thinkpieces and twitter buzz to interpret what the video means, because we don't even know if everyone's coming out with the right interpretations, not just that a lot of viewers aren't engaging past a surface level. I think I agree with him overall - the topic is too important to let everyone take away a different interpretation of what the video's saying, and Donald Glover is obviously trying to say a lot with it. I think it's good that he's forcing everyone who already gets it to really think about it and discuss, but I hope he speaks on it before too long. Great discussion, love the channel.
Myke’s right about him presenting a different black experience but at the same time he use to distance himself from black people, but not black culture. That could get a little tricky. But he did a complete 180 when he was held at gunpoint by a cop with his mother and father next to him outside of his own concert. He was in white spaces most of his career then that incident happens and I guess somethin clicked and now we have this Gambino. He told the story on the breakfast club in 2014 I think.
losgryfog he was still in a white space. And you kinda have to denounce your blackness to fit in with most white crowds. You are the company you keep. I feel like he was making the music for them but now he’s making music for black people ie Awaken, My Love. I know some white people who don’t get a single reference on that album and said it was “meh”.
how is he making music for white people when he litterally says camp is for him when he was 13. Like lyrics including " Lovin' white dudes who call me white and then try to hate When I wasn't white enough to use your pool when I was 8". it was always for black people but it was just a different kind of black person who arent really accepted in the black community (like discussed in the video) I bet your the kid who think this "He said I wasn't really black because I had a dad I think that's kinda sad. Mostly 'cause a lot of black kids think they should agree with that"
William Johnson I started to reply to dude about the 2 points I disagreed with, but I felt like it was going to start this wild argument and said " it's not even worth it". The only way you say Donald made music for white people is if you are the black person telling black people they aren't "really" black people. The first time I heard Camp, I listened from front to black without interruption. because he was speaking to ME, a black boy from a black neighborhood, going to a black school, living with my black parents...but somehow I'm white. I also disagreed with saying you have to denounce your blackness to be around MOST white people, I've never had to do that and I'm currently living in a predominantly white neighborhood with my white girlfriend and most of the people around here voted for trump and I have no problem looking them in the eye and telling them I'm against trump because he is working for white racism. I think a lot of black people get around white people and start trying to get them to acquiesce to black sentiments, and MOST of them aren't going to do that, that doesn't mean "denounce" your blackness, that means they only respond to bloodshed, black people aren't yet ready to take it there and they know this.
618 Day did he say he distanced himself from black culture? If that's coming from you, that's a really shitty idea. He is who he is. Nothing more, nothing less.
Ian Smart You better than me then because I don't understand how someone can take the time to put all this together for his people and then they dismiss it because of his spouse.
Not dismiss it, but analyze it differently because of his spouse. I don't think those ppl are saying he shouldn't have a say, but that it should be taken into account when they decide to procreate with the race they're criticizing (Get Out for example). I don't think its right, but at least can understand where the idea is coming from.
YESSS! that moment of silence for 17 seconds is actually when the kids disappear as well, so I think that was def intended as a reference to the school shooting.
When the music stops he takes out the joint to deal with the trauma or distract him from what has happened around him, now that there is no music. The moment Gambino lights the blunt, he has left reality. Thats why the guy he killed in the first scene is back playing the guitar, and SZA is randomly sitting on one of the cars.
I don't think Childish has to specifically state any intentions or motivations in his video, he can just let the art speak for itself. This is because sometimes an artist may feel uncomfortable outright stating something or maybe don't know how to state their exact thoughts appropriately so instead they show their emotions/thoughts through their art.
When he's running at the end, it's because even though he's the "Uncle Ruckus" for us right now, he's not exempt from the fucked up stuff he's been trying to distract us from. They'll come for him too eventually, basically.
Before this video I always wondered why entertainers get paid so much to perform seemingly trivial talents now I see the talent may not be worth much in itself but the distraction performing the talent creates is priceless to keeping people in line and controlled.
In a lot of ways this video was a mirror. People noticed the things that they already have on their mind. There are clear reference points in the content, but more vague ones.
I usually think Rod is more positive on the convo but I've got to agree wit him on this one. Gambino is not making just a think piece video from having our own perspectives. The video out their for everyone to watch & if they choose to shrugged off ignore the issues; which has been a detriment in urban communities for generations then u r part of the problem. Open Mike eagle I feel we're he's coming from he should've worded like he wants to see a black artist "overcome the shed" Don't turn your back on us and not evaluate art to start commotion wit no resolution". If Dat would've been the case he had a great argument not saying he's right or wrong he has more of advice. He wouldn't have gotten heatwave he's recipient of. Don't get wrong I totally agree with what he's implying 100%. Donald Glover having a white wife is like people interpreting him shooting trayvon Martin dad in the video complete utter nonsense!! Defeats the purpose mainly find a way to ensure lecture of excuses.
First off I wanna say I love that DEHH is having these convos. They are more than just a hip-hop channel and I fucks with them for that. Secondly, I think Childish Gambino is on another level and I am glad he is. His work is always a treat and the man is a genius.
I think it's important to maintain that "coded way" of expressing because art isn't always going to be the thing that makes ideas click for people, ESPECIALLY through the lens of something that may not be more than simple entertainment to a fairly large amount of the population. However, it is incredibly important for people to understand that they're not alone in processing these emotions related to these events through these logical ties that make the expression of the ideas in music cohesive, so that when people do come around to being in touch with their empathy, they're joining a whole big idea that's ingrained into a community rather than them simply feeling like they could potentially betray where they came from.
This song and video is just amazing. If you listen to the song without the video, it just sounds like a trap banger. But he's creating a holistic experience with the video that colors the song forever. That's some next level shit.
(Explanation for Yellow Shoes) There is a play by the well known Swiss Author Friedrich Dürrenmatt called The Visit. Basically it's about a Guy who empregnated his then-girlfriend and left her alone. So she had to leave Town forever and go to America. Years later she comes back to the Small Town to take revenge on the man. She tries to Buy everyone into secretely killing the Guy. At first everyone neglects, but as time goes by more and more people take her money. As a Secret sign to show they have "Sold their soul", they get yellow shoes. So everyone who has surrendered to the offering of big, fast money, Wears These. Maybe far- fetched, but I couldn't stop thinking about it. (Taken from Reddit but info about the play checks out)
I'm really glad that Gambino isn't coming out and explaining everything because it makes the video more powerful. It's just like not showing the monster in a horror movie makes it scarier. People have been talking about Eraserhead forever because David Lynch won't explain what the hell it's about, so the art becomes more powerful. The world won't listen if you spoon-feed it a point of view. If you give the world a little mystery to solve, whether that be through symbolism or surrealism, anything gained from solving that mystery is more personal IMO.
I agree with Rod. Childish Gambino doesn’t need to explain anything to anyone. He’s using his platform in a creative progressive way to share an important and powerful message. He’s can express his art in any way he sees fit. ..don’t ask this man to dumb it down please.
A few things: I really enjoyed this discussion and especially loved what Myke said at around 2:58 about black ppl dismissing other black ppl who are diffenrent or show interest in other things not typically "black" and call them white....as if theres only one way to be black (Also he was the shit on Community and when he left the show it went downhill fast) Also I really enjoyed this discussion esp. just coming from The Breakfast Club's analysis and hearing Charlagmane ignorant ass opinion of the video which was basically that a white person should of shot up the choir b/c we shouldnt enforce neg. stereotypes of black ppl and that whenever a white person sees it they r instantly gonna think of black on black violence. (Although this may be true in some cases, that scene makes u instantly think of the Charleston shooting, not black on black violence, even with Donald Glover doing the deed) And lastly its very disheartening hearing black ppl, esp. black women (again this all coming from a black woman) trying to disregard Donald for being with a white woman as if being with someone whos not black means that your not pro- black, which is the stupidest fucking thing to me (B/c as Myke said, ure still seen and will be treated as a black person no matter who u are with) as if we can control who we fall in love with so easily (As long asyour not bashing the black men/women while in an interracial relationship, duh) Sorry this was so long, just had a lot to say regarding this topic (I am open to discussing/debating this with anyone just no unneccesary insults pls)
The way I saw the main message was that the place black artists have in pop culture distracts people from the reality of racism and oppression of black communities.
My mentor used to say to me, "If I told You everything,,. you wouldn't learn anything." Now that I'm older I get what he meant by that. My experiences and independent thought is important.Also..I learn more from people who have different view points than i do sitting and talking with people I see eye to eye with on most things. Yes A picture is truly worth a thousand words. And don't discount other people of other races and background's ability to understand and empathize with the struggle and plight of Black people.
It's great to see how much discussion Childish Gambino's video is creating. Good art for me is art that starts a conversation without giving any answers and This is America does that in my opinion. It's interesting to hear you talk about seeing the video through the lens of African-American identity politics and concerns about racism. For me, I saw it predominantly as a commentary on gun violence in America but looking at it again it's definitely half and half, or maybe split into thirds between black politics, gun violence, and how America's entertainment industry can distract us from both. It's good to see influential music artists dealing with heavy topics like this and starting a conversation that needs to be had about the US's problematic relationship with guns and racial identity.
great art has layers, whatever resonates is subject to the interpreter. this is art theory 101. the way u guys are passionate in defending & admiring Gambino's vision/message...the same courtesy must be extended to all the other artists u critique on this channel.
True, its important to remember though - that the deep dive will only take place within that certain niche community of insiders who understand that aspect of the message that the artist may or may not have intended. Another reason why genres like country/jazz/opera are often overlooked by say our normal friends or just causal music listeners who may not resonate with the messages or look deeper into symbolism, artwork, videos and lyrics.
I'm not sure how many people have seen the "don't hug me I'm scared" series on RUclips, but my hypothesis for this gambino video is the same as for that series. I like to call it the rorschach theory. Rorschach being a psychological test where people project their own interpretation onto an inkblot. In the video there is a bunch of imagery for the viewer to draw interpretation from. This included with the fact that the authority on the video Donald Glover as well as the creators of the RUclips series offer no right or wrong explanation of the content. So in theory whatever you take from the video isn't wrong if that's how you interpreted it, because the only person who can give a definitive meaning to it is the creator of the content.
Maia A To be frank Black women are being brutally hurt by this white supremacist society but Black men are white society’s number one target.... There are actually articles out that state that essentially the Black community is drowning because Black men are drowning. White society fears no one like they fear the Black man and the data supports this. I would have love to see Black women’s perspective on the music video also.
He’s been asked a few times about the video, but he feels that if he explains anything at all about his intentions, it’ll take away from the conversation people are having. I respect that.
Its great that Donald Glover leaves this out there for many interpretations and to start many deep serious conversations. I think he should leave it out there for continue discussion for a few weeks, but it would be extremely important and I think he really should do a big interview after the few weeks are over before the conversations become dead and before people quickly move to the next big topic or dance craze as depicted in his message. He really needs to break down every single part of his video to make sure every single person and ethnic group understand the exact meaning that he was trying to convey. Yes, he put this message out there as art with an important message behind it, but if the true POSITIVE meaning is being completely missed interpreted or over looked, especially by other ethnic groups and is reflecting more negative opinions about black people in general and having some non-black people stating, "Who cares? This is just another typical black nonsense video!", then it is his responsible to clear up the possible harmful negativity and to make sure every black person, old and, especially the young black teens and every single non-black person understand every single message in his video clearly, that its mostly about what has been and is still going on in our society as a whole and not only about one ethnic group. Its about everyone! Sorry, but black people do not need other people thinking his absolutely brilliant and wonderful messages are about black on black crimes, blacks enjoying shootings, killing, doing drugs, getting money by any means, stealing cars, not complying to the police and trying to run away from the police. Glover's true messages are spot on, but he needs to make sure no one is miss conveying his overall message to mean Trump's misguided message about, "Let's Make America Great Again!" and end up having more racist people targeting black people. Kanya has done enough damage. So I think Glover MUST and should give every detail meaning to his deep message and brilliant piece of art. Peace!
Once an artist puts out a piece of work it is not just theirs anymore. It’s then the responsibility of everyone who watches/listens to decide what it means for them and talk about it with others. It wouldn’t hurt if bino explained it but I think it has more meaning than just what he intended. Also even if he did that would not stop some people from (purposefully) misunderstanding it. And some of the most important critical art has been incredibly criptic like apocalypse now which still shapes how people see the Vietnam war
Also when you explain something to an extent it kinda caps it, it like adds a ceiling or a definite, whereas if you don't it allows peoples minds to wander and grab different things from it. But no it isn't WRONG and wouldn't hurt to explain it. Like cliff hangers on some films, like I don't know inception or something
The internet didn't take off because everybody "got it." It took off because people that were genuinely interested in it were inspired and took it to the next level. Same thing with social issues and inspiration such as This Is America.
Jesuren Quintana Why are both issues considered antithetical to each other. Both are problematic issues that should be considered, and both lead to the same thing. The deaths of black people.
Another thing I love that he did was sample different trap adlibs from tons of people like 21, Migos, etc., basically saying regardless of what happens we end up distracting ourselves from the truth by listening to hype music instead of things that have a message, and many artists turning a blind eye
Gambino made a whole multiart-universe. When you watch the TIA video is interesting and artistic, maybe youll pick some things or have an opinion, but, if you watch atlanta, then listen to awaken my love and then watch the video, its a whole experience.
Myke *seems* very cynical. Gambino doesn't need to provide an explanation, you can have faith that the people who "get" it, can reach their peers and others who "don't" in new discourse. His art has value in the conversations and think-pieces, video or written, that have been had. Its visual performance overshadows the rhymes. He's not a strong lyricst. Art is a starting point when statistics are dry and dialogue is stale. I'm confident that the imagery speaks to the pain in the Black community at large and a window into Gambino's personal thoughts on his celebrity.
Come on, bro. I didn’t say he has to explain anything. You totally skipped over the part where we were discussing Open Mike Eagle’s point. Not my own. I was simply saying that an explanation wouldn’t hurt since the video was made to convey a certain point. I totally understand that art speaks for itself (most of the time). But, in this instance, I don’t think it would take away from the art at all to offer an explanation to the many people who clearly don’t “get it.”
Mike Eagle was trying to discredit the video the same way all the other were trying to decredite Gambino because he has a white girlfriend/ Baby Mama, there will always be so called fake woke people who live on tearing down anyone who is stealing their spotlight.
Man I don't think I wanted this video to end. Great convo on the subject, I think people can learn a lot from this video alone after watching Gambino's video for the first time
“What’s understood ain’t gotta be explained.” Y’all always want explanations. It will reach those who feel it. Point blank period. Let the rest fall through the cracks. We don’t have the time space to be explaining shit every moment, other shit to do
To go against Modest Media's point... If you start to give people "passes" on their art due to their track record of doing whatever it is they do for their community through their work, you'll begin missing the message before you even experience it. In other words, if I have a critique of Gambino's song/video but I don't express it because I say "you know what, he does so much already... I should be quiet." I never put my own thoughts out there and I never start a conversation that could lead me to understand the work more. This could lead me to never actually watching/listening to Gambino again! Because before I see it, I already "know" where he is going with it. No sugarcoating in critiques. An artist should always know: "You are you; You are not your art."
“That’s the only way people see black people: entertainment or murder” dropping some light knowledge
Abdul Sesay that’s deep
Ken brings a bigger tablet every video,it cracks me up so much.
Alex Rodriguez LOL! He's a tablet collector.
Ah shit that's pretty funny.
Alex Rodriguez I hope he sees your comment and rocks a flat screen next time
That tablet was HUGE!! Lmao
He's gonna be pulling out laptops pretty soon
It wouldn’t be a DEHH convo if Mike didn’t think they shouldn’t be talking about it in the first place
Facts
Daniel Pezzi : hahhahaah ...damn it, your right
Lol THIS IS TRUE
Myke for every convo "Who cares about this?"
I just watched the video. Where'd he say that?
People really need to give props to Hiro Murai too. He’s the dude who’s been able to make Donald Glover’s vision a reality especially with his work on Atlanta and this video.
yo its always a battle between myke's cynicism and ralph's optimism. Even on the podcast😂. nothing wrong with it. its just fun to hear
A_ Wav Rod is a bit dumb that's the problem really.
PicturesJester no he just plays devils advocate too much
I swear this is me and one of my close friends ALL THE TIME!! My friend is narcissistic and cynical while I’m typically the opposite so when he makes optimistic remarks we always have the same type of battle. I even showed him on a podcast and we argued the same points Myke and Rod argued
WHOOPS I MEANT ROD* lol ma b
Myke's view b mad trash n corny, son. I need Rod's opposition, son (PAUSE)
I think the whole trying to "expose" Donald Glover for not having a black wife is the usual tedious behaviour of holier than thou people trying to drag people for being "fake woke" as opposed to celebrating issues being brought up
100%
Fake woke hotep twitter
Crabs in a barrel.
This is America.
I saw this one video this black woman put out... she was really tryna get this man up outta here. Talking bout he can't be pro black with his white wife. Took a poem of his completely outta context. Then the comment section was waaaay worse. I couldn't deal.
I usually don't agree with Rod, but I'm with him on this one-it isn't Gambino's job to explain his art. I get Mike Eagle's point but at the same time, why single out Gambino and this video specifically for not explaining further? Kendrick doesn't explain his albums and what he's trying to say is definitely too complex and multilayered for the average person to grasp or understand. Therefore is Kendrick not doing his job correctly? I get the point but I do feel like Rod that Gambino is being criticized specifically and I don't think that's fair when he put out this amazing music video. I also don't think that anyone will come away from the video without at least some sort of opinion beyond "this is dope" or "this is trash" because so much is happening and there is so much vivid imagery. I don't really think some racist person is going to watch this and miss the message completely and then if Gambino comes out and says the opposite-I really don't think their mind would change. This song is expected to debut in the top 3 at least next week-it's everywhere. I think Gambino has done more than enough to disperse his message and only time will tell if it actually does anything.
Just my opinion though-I see all of your points and have so much respect for y'all so keep doing your thing. Love the new studio!!
Ryan Comeau Open mike Eagle's complaint would be valid against Kendrick as well. Although you could argue that even when Kendrick is nuanced he doesn't completely go over as many people in the way this video is. I am not saying Kendrick is not as deep just in most cases the base level is more direct to the theme whereas here gambino's base level goes completely over a large number of people. You would be surprised how many people don't take away anything from the video. Personally if you don't think a bunch of people are missing point of discussion in the video you have missed one of the video's corr comments. I don't think this will change the mind of a racist person but honestly I believe this video is geared towards those who are irresponsibly neutral or conscious and ignorant.
I think people are missing the point of the video, but my argument is that they would think whatever they want no matter what Gambino said. His fans and people who want to try to understand the video would listen to him, but I just feel as though the people who don't want to understand or will bash it won't be swayed by anything Gambino says about it. Of course, I could be wrong though. Appreciate the comment man
Agreed., I also understand that Open Mike Eagles perspective came from an honest place, but I think it’s an optimistic view of things. I think Gambino risk loses more by explaining his art because it limits the meaning to something specific.
People who are going to reinforce their biases watching this would still do so with the explanation. He could explain himself and people could just disagree.
The video is pretty straight forward. It's supposed to be. Sure the little details are up for debate. But the overall message is the same regardless.
I think the main thing they're just not even considering is that there is a group of people who can be reached by an abstract message that wouldn't listen to or understand a straightforward message.
I hope that Glover never comes out and explains the video. The conversation is more important with the ambiguity. What I think is really awesome about it is video is that there's one big clear message: we ignore the bullshit around us, usually by diving into some kind of hedonic pursuit. Then there's a ton of smaller (not smaller in terms of importance, but in prominence in the video) which some are obvious and clear, but others can be read in all kinds of ways, many of which are a direct result of the life you've lived until you saw this video. It's a Rorschach test. Is this entirely about white oppression? Is this entirely about how blacks cannibalize themselves? Is it some mix? It's it about guns? Or are guns just the easiest shorthand to show a disconnection from violence? Is it just how violence affects black communities or is it a universal statement? Hell, is there even any judgement in this or is it just what he feels is an observation of reality as it is. Again, I don't care about what Glover has to say because all of us who want things to get better need to be talking about it. Glover talking about it removes the conversation.
He said he won't, which is great
I disagree, I think that's a cop-out imo. The video is clearly trying to say something, shouldn't people understand what that thing is? What's the point of having a message, if that message isn't clearly illustrated? Art can be just as powerful, or even more, with a clearly defined message. Clearly, Gambino had his intentions behind the video when he was making it, I want to know what that is.
kashstory if you need to be spoon-fed a exclamation from a piece of art then that explanation is probably going to mean nothing to you even when you hear it.
Thank you!
Completely agree.
There’s one thing that no ones talking about... the message he’s sending to hip hop itself. Think about the style of his verse and the song in general. He’s using a new age hip hop beat and ad libs all over the place. He’s bridging a gap in hip hop between meaningful hip hop and “trash” hip hop. Even though it’s not really “mumble rap” per say, he’s making a meaningful “mumble rap” song. This guy needs to be cemented in the hip hop culture already. I’m tired of people sleeping on this guy.
I don't think he's doing that. He enjoys these newer artists.
The Completely Blank Page that’s the point.
When gambino say "I'm on Gucci, I'm so pretty". Pretty much summaries the scene with everyone is flexing and profiting from violence itself.
Dapper Dop
He’s more than Hip Hop Artist at this point. He’s just an artist
STILL BORING
Gambino shed light on not being accepted by black women awhile ago..
"Relax, black chick, I think that I have offended thee
Got nothing against the sisters, I just don’t think they’re into me
I am not a thug, AKA: what they pretend to be
I am just myself, AKA: my worst enemy"
"It’s cool though, it’s all good
You want a dude who keep it real and stay hood
I’m sorry, babe, but I act me
I don’t act Black, whatever that be" - Childish Gambino / Not Going Back
EricTheKidMusic I see that as a cop out. I’m as square as they come and I pull Black women easily. They’re a lot of Black nerds who want and chase after non-Black women and their excuse is always “Black girls weren’t into me.” I call bullshit. Especially as you get older.
MrZLeroy92 Here’s the thing though.. he’s talking about his experiences with black women.
MrZLeroy92 Yea when you get older. He could be talking about when he was younger
EricTheKidMusic I understand brother, what I’m saying is that I believe his analysis of his experiences is skewed. Many square Black people think that its Black people that don’t appreciate their uniqueness, NOOOO.... no one does. It just that because we (Black people) are also indoctrinated with anti-Black ideas we think that it’s just Black people that don’t like nerds.
The only reason Black nerds are halfway accepted in non-Black spaces is because we come off non-threatening and semi not-Black.
MrZLeroy92 Not everyone had the same experiences you had. If a black woman said the same about black men, (like Issa Rae) a lot of people would be more willing to understand.
I totally agree with Rod because putting a message in a coded way for people to decode it themselves helps them reflects on the issues that are being discussed and push them to talk with others that are more enlightened to learn. You can't just break everything down all the time. That's taking people for idiots. Yes most people are, but not breaking it down shows some respect and confidence towards the community. Also the tweet of OME is a bit unfair since the act of putting out a video like this is already a step in a right direction. It is certainly not enough but it is stirring the pot. The message might get lost in the movement of the mediatic waves but it might reach the ears of some.
Been waiting to hear what Myke thinks about this
FACTS
These discussions with the whole group be dope as fuck as well
I sometimes think it's not fair to the whole group when people keep acting like Myke is the only worthwhile member. I know you didn't say that, but there's this attitude that kinda neglects what other people in the group say. Like a lot of them have good points, I'm here for the whole conversation.
kashstory Big facts.
i'm here for beazy430
Myke stank face needs to be merch 1:05
Here's a public good for all to use imgur.com/a/m8uxlEe
stfn893 I felt the same
stfn893 Viewtiful profile pic bro
DEHH Conversations *>>>* Commercial Radio/ TV/ Internet show
Doctor watches
It's annoying when people keep labelling "acting black" "acting white" why are you setting expectations for people why can't I just be me? My personality traits are my own, and don't have to be shared across a race or ethnicity.
It's unbelievable that there aren't more people who think like this. I think focusing this much on race and giving it this significant of a role only makes the problems worse. They talk about how white people aren't who Donald is making this video for and that is really fucked up and kinda racist. Black problems are humanity's problems.
Jirehn IsJirehn what do your “personality traits” mean In a white supremacist society if your “personality traits” mirror white people’s?
You insult Black people by not grasping that Black people have been living in this white supremacist society for 500 years and that there is a reason why Black people tend to look suspiciously at other Black people who are “acting white.”
The accusation of “acting white” and it being seen as a negative attribute in the Black community didn’t come from nowhere.
@@MrZBlackneffect I agree with your statement but at the same time what is being "black" ? Cuz we always associate being black with our most ignorant stereotypes. You don't wear clothes a certain way, or sag your pants... you're being looked at your peers funny. You don't talk with a lot of slang terms... you're being looked at funny. God help you if you can't dance and you're terrible at basketball... you're being excluded from your own peers. Imagine being a black kid not having any of these attributes to what we define as being "black" especially being a black male. He's going to have to chill wit the white kids cuz the black kids want none to do with him. I've lived that life man and the only thing I could hold on to that I could Identify with being black was the fact that I was super talented dancer, and anything to do with art I excelled at, and even though I wasn't good with basketball, I was fast, so any thing that had to do with running, (football, tag, soccer) I wasn't excluded from that.
But I couldn't hang wit the black kids cuz I was to well spoken at the time and I my parents wouldn't let me outside the house wit my ass hangin out my pants. And psychologically that resonates wit me today at 25, cuz I look like the biggest stereotype ever, dreadlocks, tattoos, all dat, you couldn't tell me apart from any nigga cuz all I wanted to do is just be unapologetic-ally "black." And man I hated being black too when I was young cuz like no one black was like me, but I aint really fuck wit the white kids either cuz it still just wasn't me, but when a man like Donald Glover came out.... it was really refreshing, here's another "corny" black dude who ain't afraid to be himself and make it big doing so. Only difference was he wasn't born broke.
It took a while for me to love my own skin again, didn't like myself till I was maybe 13. I'm 25 now and nobody has called me 'white-washed' since I was 10 cuz I would fight you on the spot. If you wanted to see me on some nigga-ish calling me white wash would do it. I find it funny though, you couldn't get a job being black having tattoos and dreadlocks back then, having long hair in general was just a no-no cuz it was seen as 'messy' or nappy even if you combed that motherfucker nicely, or braided it in some cornrows, so you always had to rock the buzzcut or short fade. And you can never talk to your employer how you would talk to your boys, right now I make it a point to look and act like a stereotype until people actually have a decent conversation wit me.
Back to the main point I'm tryna get at, being black should be more then knowing how to rap and play basketball. The term acting black or white shouldn't even be a thing, cuz when it comes to acting black it only sheds light on the ignorant side of being black. We are basically putting white people on a pedestal saying to another black person acting white means they are smarter then the average negro. It's not right.
@@alwaysonroad365 its called minorities being forced to meet certain expectations while white people are the status quo or a white canvas where they are allowed to be anybody. Stereotypes on racial minorities are more generalized than stereotypes of the white majority where its more diverse and is dependent on different parts of America and Europe) Yankee, southern, cali, Midwest accent, etc.)
I agree with Myke. It's bs that Gambino hasn't been accepted by a lot of black people until now. I don't agree, however, that the end of the video was him running away from white involvement. I thought it was pretty clear that Gambino was talking about both the gun problem in America and black-on-black violence. Him running away at the end with those wide eyes is him running from the truth that we're all distracted from.
Not disagreeing with you at all. But just asking...if this is the case then why was the crowd he was running from white? That seems odd if that's the truth we're all distracted from.
Myke C-Town maybe because white people are biggest proponnents of the naratives he put through in the video. He wants to talk about the issues like black on black violence, but he wants to get away from the white people that are just blindly shouting "Black on black crime! Black on black crime!"
I'm not gonna be ignorant and say it doesn't matter that they're all white, cause it obviously does. I just think white involvement popping up at the end is a different turn to the rest of the video - to me that concept almost seems out of place with everything else.
Mercutio Tbh I agree with Myke, the significance of the chasers being white is crucial. I feel he's running away from the fear of what he's become. Knowing that becoming a star (celebrity) he's played into the hands of his oppressors who are giving him money and fame, expecting him to stay quiet and keep dancing, disregarding the problems his community are facing.
When he's running, young thug is singing " You're just a black man in this world, you're just a bar code ". I'll go with Myke's theory. Also you sound super arrogant talking about " it was pretty clear that XYZ" when literally nothing in this video is obvious and can be interpreted in different ways
I have a theory about the part where he lights a joint. He makes a motion like he has a gun and everyone takes off running "from the black man with a gun," but as he finishes off the movement of his arms he's really just reaching for a joint, one of the least violent things you can do. In this scene we have a black man doing something peaceful yet everyone is scared because they think he has or is reaching for a gun.
TheShot Doctorr reeeeeeaaaach
Childish Gambino has been slept on for a long time, glad he’s been recently given his props from r the great Artist that he is
Tbf he hasn't always been as good of an artist as he is now
Gato Loco Yes he is lmfao. He has no bad project and each project is amazing for being in it's own lane. Gambino was soooo slept on.
I'ma assume you've only listened to everything once or so. It's cool if you found out Gambino through Redbone, I ain't gonna judge.
Well 2 of those are his mixtapes lol. But I respectively disagree brotha.
Elygod
Youre gonna try tell me camp and royalty are on the same level as this? Lmfao zzzzzzzz
Myke and Modest gotta throw hands 😂😂
nothing nothing I got my bread on modest 😂😂😂
nothing nothing
It has to happen lol
bmoresgreatest05 myke is skinny but fierce, rod is big but friendly. Idk who I have my money on lol.
Rod would definitely lay them hands on Myke but Myke would try to outwit Rod out of the fight lol
if you dont get in a lil argument with your bro everyday thats not really your bro
SZA was the black women watching the black man dance and basically do what he has to do to get his money. Always supporting him.
Black women don't always support black men, and black men don't always support black women.
you know how explaining a joke kills it, same situation here. Words cannot explain everthing that's why you have art.
This should be good.
ADAJ3 : oh here we go!
After that intro with Myke
Are you guys gonna do another video on Atlanta? I'd love to hear what you dudes thought about this season, Especially the Teddy Perkins/Michael Jackson episode lol! I really hope they get an award for that episode OMG dude lol!
Androo-TheWytGuy bruh that whole season is a GEM
Yeah avcourse it is I never said it wasn't but for me there's 3 episodes that stand strong and that is "Teddy Perkins", "The Woods" And "FUBU" those 3 to me were dope af, But yeah the whole season is a gem, You're right.
Androo-TheWytGuy probably not
Androo-TheWytGuy probably the funniest ones were alligator man, barbershop and sport waves
Well I hope they do
The white horse is from the bible "I looked, and behold, a pale horse; and he who sat on it had the name Death; and Hell was following with him."
Police car was following it right?
I can't give a lot of credit to the argument that the video is too coded. Even being white and Australian I felt the messages he's conveying are pretty clear, especially after the second watch. Granted, not to the granular detail of the 17 children and VERY fine points like that, but the overarching messaging around gun violence and the way black people are portrayed in entertainment vs reality can't be missed. Maybe the only people who could misunderstand have an agenda and mindset that's too rigid to be able to win over in this political climate anyway.
People compare Gambino to Kanye West at the moment because they're both using their platforms to expose huge audiences to performance art that makes a statement without directly explaining the meaning. In the same way that every detail of Gambino's video has a reason, wouldn't we expect this lack of direct explanation to have a reason? From the outside in, the US appears to be a country that's politically divided, to the point where constructive discussion is almost impossible. Gambino and Kanye are using their art to force people to openly discuss these issues on public platforms, and ideally create a dialogue that bridges the gap. Even if I'm way off the mark on that estimation, it's the effect their work is starting to have, and that couldn't happen if they directly explained the meaning of their art because the audience would categorise them as being part of a certain political camp and move on from the work.
That we understand the message doesn't mean everyone does. Look at the comments, it's full of teenagers.
Hubblebub Lumbubwub we've all been teenagers at some stage, and sitting in on a discussion is often a better way to learn than to be presented with raw information
Yeah, I think the gist of the song/video was pretty clear even if not every single detail.
coming back to this, is kinda crazy to realize that they all started loving the gambino video, and by the end, because one tweet from open mike, everybody but rod changed their opinion
Gambino doesn’t have to explain the video, if he explains it the conversation ends. The whole point is for people to connect with each other and get what they get from the video. An artist shouldn’t explain or tell people what to interpret from their art. That’s the people’s responsibility once an artist explains his art it loses its value. Imagine if your favorite painter, filmmaker, or musician said “this is what my art means and if you get something else out of it you’re wrong” it loses some of the connection the consumer can have
I don't want this to sound condescending but feefos vocabulary the way he structured arguments has improved heaps
Revelation 6:8
8 And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.”
Don Yeezy909 The book is a trip.
William Cooper "Behold A Pale Horse"
Dre Hardin and where do you think he got it from?? right....
Dre Hardin people love to denied the Bible but it’s ok I guess
Don Yeezy909 .....Huh ?
Dre Hardin Exactly
Open Mike clarified in a later tweet that he doesn't like that it's up to all the thinkpieces and twitter buzz to interpret what the video means, because we don't even know if everyone's coming out with the right interpretations, not just that a lot of viewers aren't engaging past a surface level. I think I agree with him overall - the topic is too important to let everyone take away a different interpretation of what the video's saying, and Donald Glover is obviously trying to say a lot with it. I think it's good that he's forcing everyone who already gets it to really think about it and discuss, but I hope he speaks on it before too long. Great discussion, love the channel.
I agree, Mark. Thanks for the comment. I didn't see his other tweets on the subject so this puts things more into context.
Myke’s right about him presenting a different black experience but at the same time he use to distance himself from black people, but not black culture. That could get a little tricky. But he did a complete 180 when he was held at gunpoint by a cop with his mother and father next to him outside of his own concert. He was in white spaces most of his career then that incident happens and I guess somethin clicked and now we have this Gambino. He told the story on the breakfast club in 2014 I think.
618 Day
but from his first album he was ALWAYS talking about race. his first video was about race
losgryfog he was still in a white space. And you kinda have to denounce your blackness to fit in with most white crowds. You are the company you keep. I feel like he was making the music for them but now he’s making music for black people ie Awaken, My Love. I know some white people who don’t get a single reference on that album and said it was “meh”.
how is he making music for white people when he litterally says camp is for him when he was 13. Like lyrics including " Lovin' white dudes who call me white and then try to hate When I wasn't white enough to use your pool when I was 8". it was always for black people but it was just a different kind of black person who arent really accepted in the black community (like discussed in the video)
I bet your the kid who think this "He said I wasn't really black because I had a dad I think that's kinda sad. Mostly 'cause a lot of black kids think they should agree with that"
William Johnson
I started to reply to dude about the 2 points I disagreed with, but I felt like it was going to start this wild argument and said " it's not even worth it".
The only way you say Donald made music for white people is if you are the black person telling black people they aren't "really" black people.
The first time I heard Camp, I listened from front to black without interruption. because he was speaking to ME, a black boy from a black neighborhood, going to a black school, living with my black parents...but somehow I'm white.
I also disagreed with saying you have to denounce your blackness to be around MOST white people, I've never had to do that and I'm currently living in a predominantly white neighborhood with my white girlfriend and most of the people around here voted for trump and I have no problem looking them in the eye and telling them I'm against trump because he is working for white racism.
I think a lot of black people get around white people and start trying to get them to acquiesce to black sentiments, and MOST of them aren't going to do that, that doesn't mean "denounce" your blackness, that means they only respond to bloodshed, black people aren't yet ready to take it there and they know this.
618 Day did he say he distanced himself from black culture? If that's coming from you, that's a really shitty idea. He is who he is. Nothing more, nothing less.
The people who are focused on who he's married to are focused on the wrong thing. The only thing that should matter is his message.
I agree, but I've seen takes from black women that are interesting. I don't agree with them, but I understand that feeling.
Ian Smart You better than me then because I don't understand how someone can take the time to put all this together for his people and then they dismiss it because of his spouse.
No art is not separate from the person. You can't preach to me to be vegan while eating pork chops.
Upful Soul Is Donald Glover preaching that black people should only marry within their own race? That's not the message I got from "This Is America."
Not dismiss it, but analyze it differently because of his spouse. I don't think those ppl are saying he shouldn't have a say, but that it should be taken into account when they decide to procreate with the race they're criticizing (Get Out for example).
I don't think its right, but at least can understand where the idea is coming from.
Never clicked a link so fast! Thank you DEHH👏🏾🙌🏾
Ken out here hitting the dougie
kens like teach me how to dougie teach me how to dougie
I wish they spoke about the song more. The lyrics and the adlibs and what they took away from that, I don’t even know if it bangs in the whip?!?!?
YESSS! that moment of silence for 17 seconds is actually when the kids disappear as well, so I think that was def intended as a reference to the school shooting.
Video fades in-- Myke: "The thing that frustrates me"
Oh, here we go.
The dancing represents how America wants us to just entertain them and nothing else matters
I fo real want yall to do a review of Season 2 of Atlanta if we gon be talkin bout Donald Glover.
I agree with Rod! People seem to wait until others do something, to critic it rather than doing something themselves.
When the music stops he takes out the joint to deal with the trauma or distract him from what has happened around him, now that there is no music. The moment Gambino lights the blunt, he has left reality. Thats why the guy he killed in the first scene is back playing the guitar, and SZA is randomly sitting on one of the cars.
I don't think Childish has to specifically state any intentions or motivations in his video, he can just let the art speak for itself. This is because sometimes an artist may feel uncomfortable outright stating something or maybe don't know how to state their exact thoughts appropriately so instead they show their emotions/thoughts through their art.
Feefo didn't say much koz it don't "bump in the whip" lol
When he's running at the end, it's because even though he's the "Uncle Ruckus" for us right now, he's not exempt from the fucked up stuff he's been trying to distract us from. They'll come for him too eventually, basically.
Before this video I always wondered why entertainers get paid so much to perform seemingly trivial talents now I see the talent may not be worth much in itself but the distraction performing the talent creates is priceless to keeping people in line and controlled.
"entertainment and murder" that really hit.
In a lot of ways this video was a mirror. People noticed the things that they already have on their mind. There are clear reference points in the content, but more vague ones.
The fact that multiple perspectives can be right is amazing.
I usually think Rod is more positive on the convo but I've got to agree wit him on this one. Gambino is not making just a think piece video from having our own perspectives. The video out their for everyone to watch & if they choose to shrugged off ignore the issues; which has been a detriment in urban communities for generations then u r part of the problem. Open Mike eagle I feel we're he's coming from he should've worded like he wants to see a black artist "overcome the shed" Don't turn your back on us and not evaluate art to start commotion wit no resolution". If Dat would've been the case he had a great argument not saying he's right or wrong he has more of advice. He wouldn't have gotten heatwave he's recipient of. Don't get wrong I totally agree with what he's implying 100%.
Donald Glover having a white wife is like people interpreting him shooting trayvon Martin dad in the video complete utter nonsense!! Defeats the purpose mainly find a way to ensure lecture of excuses.
First off I wanna say I love that DEHH is having these convos. They are more than just a hip-hop channel and I fucks with them for that. Secondly, I think Childish Gambino is on another level and I am glad he is. His work is always a treat and the man is a genius.
Shout out to the ad libs from 21, offset, young thug that made the actual song even more lit
I had view the video over 12 times, when Gambino shoots the choir in my opinion it was about the Church shooting in Charleston, SC
“It’s the only two ways people see Black folks, as entertainment or murder...”
That just gave me chills.
I think it's important to maintain that "coded way" of expressing because art isn't always going to be the thing that makes ideas click for people, ESPECIALLY through the lens of something that may not be more than simple entertainment to a fairly large amount of the population.
However, it is incredibly important for people to understand that they're not alone in processing these emotions related to these events through these logical ties that make the expression of the ideas in music cohesive, so that when people do come around to being in touch with their empathy, they're joining a whole big idea that's ingrained into a community rather than them simply feeling like they could potentially betray where they came from.
This song and video is just amazing. If you listen to the song without the video, it just sounds like a trap banger. But he's creating a holistic experience with the video that colors the song forever. That's some next level shit.
(Explanation for Yellow Shoes)
There is a play by the well known Swiss Author Friedrich Dürrenmatt called The Visit. Basically it's about a Guy who empregnated his then-girlfriend and left her alone. So she had to leave Town forever and go to America. Years later she comes back to the Small Town to take revenge on the man. She tries to Buy everyone into secretely killing the Guy. At first everyone neglects, but as time goes by more and more people take her money. As a Secret sign to show they have "Sold their soul", they get yellow shoes. So everyone who has surrendered to the offering of big, fast money, Wears These.
Maybe far- fetched, but I couldn't stop thinking about it.
(Taken from Reddit but info about the play checks out)
Good points myke, entertainment or murder , good convo
I'm really glad that Gambino isn't coming out and explaining everything because it makes the video more powerful. It's just like not showing the monster in a horror movie makes it scarier. People have been talking about Eraserhead forever because David Lynch won't explain what the hell it's about, so the art becomes more powerful. The world won't listen if you spoon-feed it a point of view. If you give the world a little mystery to solve, whether that be through symbolism or surrealism, anything gained from solving that mystery is more personal IMO.
Gambino is a mastermind
Elijah Duarte freaks and geeks
Sza represents "a hood ornament" on a car
Nothing more, Nothing less.
"Stop
Analyzin
Criticzin
You should realize what I am
And start epitomizin..."-D.M. Carter, circa 2007
Great Conversation.... nice one Guys, peace from London UK.
myke dropping some knowledge bombs up in there
I agree with Rod. Childish Gambino doesn’t need to explain anything to anyone. He’s using his platform in a creative progressive way to share an important and powerful message. He’s can express his art in any way he sees fit. ..don’t ask this man to dumb it down please.
A few things:
I really enjoyed this discussion and especially loved what Myke said at around 2:58 about black ppl dismissing other black ppl who are diffenrent or show interest in other things not typically "black" and call them white....as if theres only one way to be black
(Also he was the shit on Community and when he left the show it went downhill fast)
Also I really enjoyed this discussion esp. just coming from The Breakfast Club's analysis and hearing Charlagmane ignorant ass opinion of the video which was basically that a white person should of shot up the choir b/c we shouldnt enforce neg. stereotypes of black ppl and that whenever a white person sees it they r instantly gonna think of black on black violence.
(Although this may be true in some cases, that scene makes u instantly think of the Charleston shooting, not black on black violence, even with Donald Glover doing the deed)
And lastly its very disheartening hearing black ppl, esp. black women (again this all coming from a black woman) trying to disregard Donald for being with a white woman as if being with someone whos not black means that your not pro- black, which is the stupidest fucking thing to me
(B/c as Myke said, ure still seen and will be treated as a black person no matter who u are with) as if we can control who we fall in love with so easily
(As long asyour not bashing the black men/women while in an interracial relationship, duh)
Sorry this was so long, just had a lot to say regarding this topic
(I am open to discussing/debating this with anyone just no unneccesary insults pls)
That's one hell of a cliffhanger... Great video!
The way I saw the main message was that the place black artists have in pop culture distracts people from the reality of racism and oppression of black communities.
There’s a riot goin on... the spirit of sly and the family stone lives through this visual
Sza as Lady Liberty
My mentor used to say to me, "If I told You everything,,. you wouldn't learn anything." Now that I'm older I get what he meant by that. My experiences and independent thought is important.Also..I learn more from people who have different view points than i do sitting and talking with people I see eye to eye with on most things. Yes A picture is truly worth a thousand words. And don't discount other people of other races and background's ability to understand and empathize with the struggle and plight of Black people.
35:56 - 36:02 Meme this. I can't come up with anything clever.
Nyjbh B I just cried laughing lol 😂
Wow! Great convo...watched this before watching the video.
Donald said himself he ain't explaining the video. That defeats the purpose and he wants the discussion.
It's great to see how much discussion Childish Gambino's video is creating. Good art for me is art that starts a conversation without giving any answers and This is America does that in my opinion.
It's interesting to hear you talk about seeing the video through the lens of African-American identity politics and concerns about racism. For me, I saw it predominantly as a commentary on gun violence in America but looking at it again it's definitely half and half, or maybe split into thirds between black politics, gun violence, and how America's entertainment industry can distract us from both.
It's good to see influential music artists dealing with heavy topics like this and starting a conversation that needs to be had about the US's problematic relationship with guns and racial identity.
great art has layers, whatever resonates is subject to the interpreter. this is art theory 101. the way u guys are passionate in defending & admiring Gambino's vision/message...the same courtesy must be extended to all the other artists u critique on this channel.
Daniel † DeJesus If the art doesn't prompt such a depth of thought and emotion the discussion will reflect that.
True, its important to remember though - that the deep dive will only take place within that certain niche community of insiders who understand that aspect of the message that the artist may or may not have intended. Another reason why genres like country/jazz/opera are often overlooked by say our normal friends or just causal music listeners who may not resonate with the messages or look deeper into symbolism, artwork, videos and lyrics.
A 37 minute dead end discussion. Nigga we EATIN!👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾👏🏾
I'm not sure how many people have seen the "don't hug me I'm scared" series on RUclips, but my hypothesis for this gambino video is the same as for that series. I like to call it the rorschach theory. Rorschach being a psychological test where people project their own interpretation onto an inkblot. In the video there is a bunch of imagery for the viewer to draw interpretation from. This included with the fact that the authority on the video Donald Glover as well as the creators of the RUclips series offer no right or wrong explanation of the content. So in theory whatever you take from the video isn't wrong if that's how you interpreted it, because the only person who can give a definitive meaning to it is the creator of the content.
Been waiting a year for this
I wish Sophie was here to add her two cents. Childish gambino does not extend the conversation to black women I believe, I would have liked her take.
Maia A To be frank Black women are being brutally hurt by this white supremacist society but Black men are white society’s number one target.... There are actually articles out that state that essentially the Black community is drowning because Black men are drowning.
White society fears no one like they fear the Black man and the data supports this.
I would have love to see Black women’s perspective on the music video also.
He’s been asked a few times about the video, but he feels that if he explains anything at all about his intentions, it’ll take away from the conversation people are having. I respect that.
NOTIFICATION GANG
Also "Amercia" broooooo
Its great that Donald Glover leaves this out there for many interpretations and to start many deep serious conversations. I think he should leave it out there for continue discussion for a few weeks, but it would be extremely important and I think he really should do a big interview after the few weeks are over before the conversations become dead and before people quickly move to the next big topic or dance craze as depicted in his message. He really needs to break down every single part of his video to make sure every single person and ethnic group understand the exact meaning that he was trying to convey. Yes, he put this message out there as art with an important message behind it, but if the true POSITIVE meaning is being completely missed interpreted or over looked, especially by other ethnic groups and is reflecting more negative opinions about black people in general and having some non-black people stating, "Who cares? This is just another typical black nonsense video!", then it is his responsible to clear up the possible harmful negativity and to make sure every black person, old and, especially the young black teens and every single non-black person understand every single message in his video clearly, that its mostly about what has been and is still going on in our society as a whole and not only about one ethnic group. Its about everyone! Sorry, but black people do not need other people thinking his absolutely brilliant and wonderful messages are about black on black crimes, blacks enjoying shootings, killing, doing drugs, getting money by any means, stealing cars, not complying to the police and trying to run away from the police. Glover's true messages are spot on, but he needs to make sure no one is miss conveying his overall message to mean Trump's misguided message about, "Let's Make America Great Again!" and end up having more racist people targeting black people. Kanya has done enough damage. So I think Glover MUST and should give every detail meaning to his deep message and brilliant piece of art. Peace!
I need this video
Once an artist puts out a piece of work it is not just theirs anymore. It’s then the responsibility of everyone who watches/listens to decide what it means for them and talk about it with others. It wouldn’t hurt if bino explained it but I think it has more meaning than just what he intended. Also even if he did that would not stop some people from (purposefully) misunderstanding it. And some of the most important critical art has been incredibly criptic like apocalypse now which still shapes how people see the Vietnam war
Also when you explain something to an extent it kinda caps it, it like adds a ceiling or a definite, whereas if you don't it allows peoples minds to wander and grab different things from it. But no it isn't WRONG and wouldn't hurt to explain it. Like cliff hangers on some films, like I don't know inception or something
The internet didn't take off because everybody "got it." It took off because people that were genuinely interested in it were inspired and took it to the next level. Same thing with social issues and inspiration such as This Is America.
"And they tell me it's the white man I should fear. But it's my own kind doin' all the killing here."-Tupac Shakur
Jesuren Quintana Why are both issues considered antithetical to each other. Both are problematic issues that should be considered, and both lead to the same thing. The deaths of black people.
one of these days Mike and modest are going to fight!
Helllll yeah
Another thing I love that he did was sample different trap adlibs from tons of people like 21, Migos, etc., basically saying regardless of what happens we end up distracting ourselves from the truth by listening to hype music instead of things that have a message, and many artists turning a blind eye
Video was epic
Kinge tripping Community is dope
Love your content guys, y’all are my favorite hip hop RUclipsrs, I hope you guys continue to grow and get bigger! Peace!
Gambino made a whole multiart-universe. When you watch the TIA video is interesting and artistic, maybe youll pick some things or have an opinion, but, if you watch atlanta, then listen to awaken my love and then watch the video, its a whole experience.
Myke *seems* very cynical. Gambino doesn't need to provide an explanation, you can have faith that the people who "get" it, can reach their peers and others who "don't" in new discourse. His art has value in the conversations and think-pieces, video or written, that have been had. Its visual performance overshadows the rhymes. He's not a strong lyricst.
Art is a starting point when statistics are dry and dialogue is stale. I'm confident that the imagery speaks to the pain in the Black community at large and a window into Gambino's personal thoughts on his celebrity.
Come on, bro. I didn’t say he has to explain anything. You totally skipped over the part where we were discussing Open Mike Eagle’s point. Not my own. I was simply saying that an explanation wouldn’t hurt since the video was made to convey a certain point. I totally understand that art speaks for itself (most of the time). But, in this instance, I don’t think it would take away from the art at all to offer an explanation to the many people who clearly don’t “get it.”
Mike Eagle was trying to discredit the video the same way all the other were trying to decredite Gambino because he has a white girlfriend/ Baby Mama, there will always be so called fake woke people who live on tearing down anyone who is stealing their spotlight.
Man I don't think I wanted this video to end. Great convo on the subject, I think people can learn a lot from this video alone after watching Gambino's video for the first time
“What’s understood ain’t gotta be explained.”
Y’all always want explanations. It will reach those who feel it. Point blank period. Let the rest fall through the cracks. We don’t have the time space to be explaining shit every moment, other shit to do
I keep trying to butt in but then remember its a video
To go against Modest Media's point... If you start to give people "passes" on their art due to their track record of doing whatever it is they do for their community through their work, you'll begin missing the message before you even experience it. In other words, if I have a critique of Gambino's song/video but I don't express it because I say "you know what, he does so much already... I should be quiet." I never put my own thoughts out there and I never start a conversation that could lead me to understand the work more. This could lead me to never actually watching/listening to Gambino again! Because before I see it, I already "know" where he is going with it. No sugarcoating in critiques. An artist should always know: "You are you; You are not your art."
Keep up the conversations DEHH👌