This was such an interesting discussion. I always love hearing Glenn. Ian Rowe is such a compliment to the issues of education and fairness. Not only in race, but education, and using his term, humanity. My prayers are for great success for Ian Rowe and his agenda in the future. Life is all about balance and I believe both of these men are living examples as to how to achieve those ends. If our purpose in life is, as directed by Source, love with service to others, then I think we are seeing through these men, the best approach for our best selves moving forward.
@@elizabethdorgan6393 Thanks for the insight. I was not aware. It’s certainly getting harder to find people that can help to elevate our systems (pleural).
I went to a magnet IB school (Classen School of Advanced Studies in Oklahoma City). I found it more challenging and inspiring than both my undergraduate and MA studies. Our teachers treated us like adults, guiding us in our studies but ultimately leaving success or failure in our hands. Thank you for spreading the IB model, Mr. Rowe. These kids need you!!
he takes all the money for his CEO salary and the children are not getting an education. He never showed up on campus of any school building at Public Prep.
@@roundedges2 I've only recently discovered Bob as a result of his work on 1776 Unites and his discussion with Hawk Newsome on Braver Angels. If you've got some recommendations on lectures, etc from him, I really like what I've seen so far and would love to learn more.
18:19 "to demonstrate not just the legacy of slavery in the United States, but the legacy of excellence. The stories of resilience, of inventiveness, of innovation that the black community did exercise, even in the face of unbelievable adversity"
Is it too late to get them on the November 2020 ticket?!?!? Add Glenn to the next “presidential” debate stage and this election would be a done deal. Thank you Glenn for another excellent, thought provoking podcast.
Imho, this is probably the best answer to the current crisis in educational outcome. Incredibly exciting news and I look forward to seeing the results of this new venture. Fantastic interview Glenn Loury, with Ian Rowe. There's a lot to think about here. Love your podcast. Keep up the good work, we need you.
I have followed you Mr. Rowe, for years.......how can your outlook convince more black Americans of its correctness is the.biggest question! It is critical for all of us but especially for black Americans
So happy to hear you bring up the idea that the K-12 system needs major improvements. Everyone is crying for free college while the primary & secondary systems are leaving students unprepared for it.
Wow! God bless you both! Even as Glenn is playing "Devil's advocate", it was fun to see him stifling a smile as Ian talked. Brilliant. Inspiring. Hope-giving. God bless you both. May your tribes increase!!! Listening and applying the wisdom you share.
I would love to see that debate that Ian brought up (any combo of Coleman/Glenn/Sowell/McWhorter/Larry Elder vs TNC/Sandy Darity would be highly entertaining). I wonder why it hasn't happened yet 🤔🤔🤔
Bravo! This is so exciting, so positive, a great conversation and noble objective. As an educator, I applaud the concept and can't wait to see it at work.
Great Conversation, smart ideas that will benefit our communities in a great way. Strong families great education and strong faith keep up the great work!
I came from an IB school and it helped set me up for success in university & life. It was my introduction to philosophy which I majored in undergrad and am now pursuing in grad school. Seriously underutilized program imo
What era was your IB, Will? As Ian said, IB has been around a long while. Since the 90s when I became aware, I thought it was a gimmick to enchant Americans with "international" and also perhaps fewer science requirements. I am very interested in 1776 Unites! My hypothesis is it's as much or more about the learning environment as it is about the structure of the [almost interchangeable] alternative program of study and study options.
That's negative, and appeals to people's competitive side-taking. "I only want to watch information from winners." I feel your reaction, Bang. Social media is not just for the "I" first-person commenter. I try to be proud of promoting something healthy in the trail I leave behind, including humor. Notice, this comment was mostly about me. love
Hello Glen and Ian - Have either of you read Robert Kennedy and His Times, by Arthur M Schlesinger Jr (1978) ? This conversation reminds me of these specific chapters in His Times = Chapter 18. Justice and Poverty. Chapter 33. The Breach Widens: South Africa, New York. Chapter 35. Tribune of the Underclass. Chapter 36. Images.
The Socratic Method is how they have taught in accredited law schools for decades (watch the movie The Paperchase to see what it looks like). I had no idea it was part of the IB curriculum. I grew up in a big college town (Gainesville, FL) in the 1980’s and 90’s. All the smartest kids bussed over to Eastside High School in the poorest area of town to attend the IB Program there. It would be amazing to see this take root in schools all over the country.
Should look at Fairview Middle School and Richards High in Tallahassee Florida for examples of the use of IB programs in lower income areas and schools
The problem isn't colonization, it's institutionalization. The public school system was designed from the beginning to prevent critical thinking and create a predictable populace to run the machines - a factory farm for human beings. Now, the idea of discipline has completely disappeared and replaced by learned helplessness, which has even spilled into higher education. Childhood now persists well into the 20's, and solving this problem isn't just a matter of throwing money at it. Ian Rowe seems to have a lot right - emphasizing discipline whilst also empowering students to make choices about their own destiny for a change. When you and John McWhorter run for president in 2024, I would suggest tapping Rowe as your education secretary.
I would also like to provide some specific examples of learned helplessness: - For the students - Don't fight back - tell a teacher. And everyone's a winner. Now may I go to the bathroom? - For the parents - Universal daycare, free preschool, and free lunch (and we all know what economists say about that last one...) - Never have to care for your own kid again!
I since I live in the Bronx and went to public school. I say the kids in the Bronx need skill training , commercial drivers , business education and science. Art is more subjective and should be taught in a way that is fun and informative.
White conservatives look to the black conservatives to speak with the authority they have but whites do not. Ian Rowe then points to the church to speak from among the black community with the authority that their culture at large doesn't have. Wonderful conversation, gentlemen. Loved meeting Ian for the first time. A new fan. I hope that the 1776 Project connects with WallBuilders. Here's a great video which includes just the sort of highlights of the historical achievements of black Americans Glenn and Ian discussed. Specifically start at 6:00 : ruclips.net/video/iJygZhHd3bM/видео.html&ab_channel=StreamsofLight__CharlesPlacide
Talking about the 1776 project and the contribution of black americans I was watching a WWII documentary and saw brief mention of the all black 761st tank battalion named the Black Panthers who served with distinction in Europe. Sounds like a great movie if Hollywood could manage not to ruin it
Just extend your argument--my argument, too, Brittney!--to all races, because that is true!! It will make our argument more experienced over time, then we can add which groups need the first help, if there is a competition for resources. Just a thought you inspired. Thanks!
We need to argue these ideas regardless. Ideas are seeds in people's minds, and even if a lot of people reject them, SOMEONE is listening! The better ideas will win in the end, but only if we have courage enough to say them. I say courage because yes, in these strange times there is a strong risk of being called names (racist, complicit, grifter, Uncle Tom etc - the list goes on - and there's an insult for EVERYONE, black, white, or in between like me!). Sorry if this sounds preachy - I'm actually directing it at myself as I write it! But have courage, your voice is needed!
A lot of great content here. But I think the faith leaders angle is not gonna be an effective one - It would certainly benefit any community if they believed in a higher power that promoted united families and so on... But if they don't, then they don't. And no amount of pascal's wager will help that one, you'll just end up dividing folks more. Need a new secular narrative if you're gonna get people on board.
Thank you for mentioning the rural kids. One question to ask might be why young men from high population urban areas are killing each other yet young men from a rural environment are killing. Themselves. Just as a way to address the violence of all groups in all places. As a white guy with a "rural" childhood i understand the shame that pushes people to take their own lives. What or who or why do young men in high population urban areas kill each other. And it is not a color thing. It's a urban thing. Irish men and Italian men had gangs in urban areas killing each other 100 puls year ago. At the start of the industrial revolution?
Only listened to half so far but this just kinda reminds me that "both sides" of this issue have a lot of common ground and probably agree with a majority of what the other is saying and want. They probably just disagree with the way and narrative it's said
Are you sure though? It seems to me that the fundamentals are totally different - for example, promoting victim identities vs not accepting that kind of victim narrative.
engineers are grounded in how things actually work rather than those who have an idea about how they want it to work.....you can't legislate physics....too many people want to drive the train but very few want to figure out how the gear box functions....engineers make it so.!!
4:20 or so, I call BS. I did my student teaching 30 years ago in a non-affluent, urban school with a largely minority population that offered the International Baccalaureate curriculum. The "urban" high school where I currently live is also the only school in the metro area to offer the IB curriculum. I'm not 100%against charter schools, but I am annoyed by those who ignore that many public schools have long been undertaking effective, life-changing curriculum.
I think that upshot of Raj Chetty's research is encouraging in that it seems that a "network" of 2 parent households in a neighborhood provides a buoying effect even for single parent households in the same neighborhood. My perception is that this dovetails into Rowe's concept of "mediating institutions" - those households in other words, form a kind of aggregate support network and stabilizing influence.
yes Yes YES! Where is it written black kids can’t excel? Please give black kids an opportunity to learn to love learning. It is a gift that keeps giving all life long.
Great podcast, but do not understand why he thinks it requires a faith leader to point out facts, evidence, and true causality for situations like the one we saw with Jacob Blake. In my opinion, and he stated this earlier, this can be achieved with simple open dialogue.
Wonderful discussion and, btw, I think having classes available for parents to choose to learn these concepts would be a positive addition. Also, the newest neuroscience information is excellent to keep injecting into the body of information available to the student and parents at appropriate age levels.
Very interesting discussion. The problem proposing a entrepreneurial solution to the NHJ adherents is that they are aren't actually interested in lifting black people up by whatever means necessary, they are only interested in a very narrow set of possible solutions that are collectivist in nature and would likely see the NHJ's, TNC's, MED's and Kendi's installed as the high priests/ ranking party officials in the new system. It is disingenuous and deceptive to say that they are looking to improve the lives of typical black Americans. They are looking for power and prestige, and using the plight of lower income blacks as a vehicle to attain them. The tragic irony, of course, is that someone found yet another way to monetize human suffering, along especially insidious lines, which they claim to be the exclusive purview of "capitalism". I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a more apt example of "wolves in sheep's clothing".
48:25 Ian lets his moderation slip a bit, "That's enough of that [white people characteristics].' Then Ian cites some info about infancy and childhood development. BRO! In-utero also. In fact, mom's hormones change baby's DNA. Stess and other hormone variables have inevitable and permanent effects. All cultures and races. P.S. If tiny humans weren't in "pre-school" they wouldn't get "suspended."
If Zac and Ian could join forces Watch "Talking Metamodernism with Zak Stein - Growing Down Podcast" on RUclips ruclips.net/video/SM7kKHnrlvY/видео.html
Note to self: Will 1776 Unites materials be available for home schooling? I'm convinced my state public schools are toxic. My children left K-12 just before the crash approx 2010, and I thought it was bad then. Good job for elders like me, now, to help home school the grandchildren. Aside, do folks realize there are renewed political initiatives to outlaw home schooling? I don't know the full history, but home schooling is not, or has not been, legal in many states. It has not "met" compulsory attendance laws.
@@paigemccormick6519 Ian Rowe went to his own Police Department in Pelham - to tell them I called the child abuse hotline - I did!! After a child abuse intake operator gave me the directive to call 911 to the school the next morning at 730p.m. Ian Rowe accepted my resignation at 8:15pm that night which is a class e felony. Public Prep then submitted Ian Rowe's resignation to an investigator from the federal government that it was Public Prep's position that Ian Rowe accepted my resignation 45 minutes after a child abuse specialist gave me the directive to call NYPD to the school. I will email it to you:). By Public Prep's own admission Ian Rowe was the administrator who made the decision to accept a teacher's resignation who was the subject of a child abuse allegation.......Three different NYS law enforcement agencies are now involved in Ian Rowe's failure to report child abuse - Town of East Hampton, NY, NYPD and Pelham Manor. Email me - I will show you the supporting documentation and the timing of Ian Rowe blocking me and law enforcement from the school - ed2133@nyu.edu
@@paigemccormick6519 Stacey Pitcher an attorney and partner at the law firm Obemayer signed her name to a legal position statement sent to the EEOC that it is Public Prep's position that Ian Rowe was the Public Prep employee who made the decision to accept a teacher's resignation minutes after that same teacher called the NYS central registry - a Class E felony
If ADOS gets the debt paid by the government, a number of us would create more businesses and be more independent. Ian Rowe modern Booker T. Washington approach is fine but I heard too much blaming on low income black women choices. Low income and poor people in this country are having a tough time regardless of race. All the tradition institutions that sustain working class and middle class communities have diminished, we can definitely debate about the why.
V, could the "why" potentially extend to analyzing the choices (as I think you're saying, of more than the black community only)? You say you heard too much blaming on low income black women choices. I feel agreement with your reaction, but I did not hear the blaming first-hand from Ian. I know that blaming is out there, and I also want discussion and healthy communities. Your thoughts have enlightened me, and now I know what ADOS is! Do I really sound this white? love from back in the day, too
Fantastic conversation. BTW Glen’s devil’s advocate about teaching children to graduate high school, work, get married then have kids maybe not being the reason why they are successful has merit. I come from a family of 8 children. We were all raised the same way and under Christian values. My oldest sister is single with two kids living in a trailer park with no money. My next oldest sister he never gotten a driver’s license and worked at DQ until she got knocked up and had twins in which she married and is a stay at home mom (their income is lower middle class). My next sister is low income with no kids but rents a house that my dad bought at a cheap rate. My next sister has physical and mental disorders so she is an outlier. Then there is me which would be considered middle to upper middle class who got married then had a child recently. Then there is my brother who just finished his lineman apprenticeship and bought a house (currently long term dating) who is middle to upper middle class. Then there is my sister who has had health issues so she is kind of an outlier but appears to have no real ambition when it comes to having a “traditional” life. Then there is my youngest brother who is in college (not very ambitious but you never know) so it is too early to really know. Very wide spectrum of results and very wide range of view points on most everything coming from the same household. Other traits are pretty much the only way to explain it. Just like Glen said, these things still NEED to be taught because they definitely help. They just might not be the causal effect.
I have a question what is the black way? I see black people where African garb in America? But Africans depending on there country don’t act like the stereotypical African American. I’ve heard people like Thomas Sowell describe it as certain languages and culture we took from whites while in slavery. That slang and certain attitudes came from Scottish and Southern British I believe. They used words and behaviors like and being in the military I’ve met people from around the world and if they want to act like an American. They tend to follow the personalities of those in front of them i.e country by they speak country. I was wondering if the same thing happened to slaves brought here. We did not come here speaking English and I’m wondering if what Thomas Sowell calls “Black Redneck culture” is a realistic view.
Yes I agree. But ppl like Nicole Hannah Jones aren't concerned with that. She and the rest are narrow minded. Making millions off of false grievances. It's almost like the glass have empty or full analogy
It took the 1619 project to even make you think about creating 1776 United curriculum. Respect the 1619 project for awakening and or shaking the American conscience.
Good discussion. I have the answer regarding "reparations". In response to the slaves being counted as 3/5ths persons in the original 1787 Constitution for the purpose of political respresentation (of course that 3/5ths voting power was given to white property owners), let's give all black people in the US an extra 2/5ths vote for the next 75 years (symbolically representing the period from 1789 until 1865). This brings people into the political process, emphasizes that we value the United States as an experiment in democracy (not a society obsessed only with money, in other words), and allows the black voters to design their own "uplift" as Ian Rowe says at one point (if I recall correctly). My plan avoids the overly contentious issue of money, but still allows black America to vote itself more resources for schools, transportation, healthcare, etc, (while also creating an incentive for black America to reach out to others to gain more votes and more political power) if it so desires. My proposal also has the tremendous advantage of causing people to learn a little history.
The point of the 3/5ths rule was to punish states that held slaves. Non-slave states counted each African American as a full person for the purposes of determining the number of U.S. Representatives and electoral votes they received. Slave holding states, on the other hand, were only able to get credit for 3/5ths of their slave population when determining how many Representatives they received. The 3/5 rule was thus an explicitly anti-slavery rule since it punished any state that held slaves. (I haven't got through the video yet, so I'm not sure if they mention this. If so I apologize.) and was only repealed by virtue of passing the 13th amendment. (I believe it was the same provision of the Constitution that barred the importation of any more slaves.) You may have already known all of that when you wrote your post, if so I apologize. I'm just adding this incase anyone wonders.
Boxcar101 Yeah I’ve heard this right wing argument before that adding extra voting power to the Southern states was meant as “punishment”. Over here in reality-land, punishment has a different meaning in the dictionary than it does in the rightwingosphere. No biggie, doesn’t have anything to do with my suggestion anyway. Thanks for the reminder though. (Take note that, quite obviously, had the southern states freed the slaves, they would have been counted as whole persons for the purpose of congressional representation. Thus, any “punishment” was self-inflicted.)
@@jazzfan7491 it's not a right wing argument, it's just a fact. It took voting power away from Southern States. Had that provision not been in the Constitution slave states would have been able to fully count each slave in their census and would therefore have gotten extra representatives. Even in the South free blacks were counted as a full citizen for allocation of representatives. This provision was anti-slavery, nothing right or left wing about it. To the extent a state had slaves, they lost 2/5 of their Representation.
Boxcar101 So you’re saying it was a punishment to be given extra political power representing their enslaved population right? Giving the southern white men extra voting power, representing their slaves, power which they used to maintain slavery and expand it into other states, was punishment, right? Good example of why we now need whatever you would call the opposite of punishment, such as giving more voting power to black Americans. 🤓
![Affirmative Action for Americans? | Glenn Loury & Amy Wax [The Glenn Show]](/img/1.gif)
As a high school teacher, I am profoundly happy for conversations like this: brilliant, positive, deep, nuanced and powerful.
Ian Rowe failed to report child abuse as Public preps ceo
This was refreshing. Great guest. Enough of the victim mentality and time to embrace achievements
Become a victor, not a victim
I like that!
Ian Rowe failed to report an allegation of child abuse on April 17, 2018 as Public Preps ceo
This was such an interesting discussion. I always love hearing Glenn. Ian Rowe is such a compliment to the issues of education and fairness. Not only in race, but education, and using his term, humanity. My prayers are for great success for Ian Rowe and his agenda in the future. Life is all about balance and I believe both of these men are living examples as to how to achieve those ends. If our purpose in life is, as directed by Source, love with service to others, then I think we are seeing through these men, the best approach for our best selves moving forward.
Ian Rowe failed to report an allegation of child abuse on April 17, 2018 as Public Prepa CEO
@@elizabethdorgan6393 Thanks for the insight. I was not aware. It’s certainly getting harder to find people that can help to elevate our systems (pleural).
As always, Glenn is a great devil's advocate.
He is! I love it!
He is an iron man of steel manning opposition arguments.
Second only to the Devil himself. (And I say this as a compliment.)
Ian Rowe failed to report an allegation of
Child abuse as Public Prepa on April 17, 2018
I went to a magnet IB school (Classen School of Advanced Studies in Oklahoma City). I found it more challenging and inspiring than both my undergraduate and MA studies. Our teachers treated us like adults, guiding us in our studies but ultimately leaving success or failure in our hands. Thank you for spreading the IB model, Mr. Rowe. These kids need you!!
Great stuff!!!
I love watching Glenn engage in true debate - able to take either side and argue it adequately.
Black Excellence. Or more aptly called. Excellence.
Indeed
he takes all the money for his CEO salary and the children are not getting an education. He never showed up on campus of any school building at Public Prep.
Bob Woodson and crew are doing great work. Glad to see Ian on sharing some much needed inspiration.
@@roundedges2 I've only recently discovered Bob as a result of his work on 1776 Unites and his discussion with Hawk Newsome on Braver Angels. If you've got some recommendations on lectures, etc from him, I really like what I've seen so far and would love to learn more.
Don’t publicly link yourself with Ian Rowe. He failed to report child abuse on April 17, 2018 as Public Prep’s CEO. He’s a phony and fake all around
18:19 "to demonstrate not just the legacy of slavery in the United States, but the legacy of excellence. The stories of resilience, of inventiveness, of innovation that the black community did exercise, even in the face of unbelievable adversity"
I worked for Public Prep = all Ian Rowe does is show up on the internet and say "low expectations for minorities is soft bigotry."
Glenn Loury John McWhorter 2024!
I'd vote for them.
They'd probably end up debating each other though
.. and still get elected 🤣🤣🤣
Time Kakuru - That’s awesome.
Is it too late to get them on the November 2020 ticket?!?!? Add Glenn to the next “presidential” debate stage and this election would be a done deal. Thank you Glenn for another excellent, thought provoking podcast.
I'll try and move to the US now so I can vote for them!
Imho, this is probably the best answer to the current crisis in educational outcome. Incredibly exciting news and I look forward to seeing the results of this new venture. Fantastic interview Glenn Loury, with Ian Rowe. There's a lot to think about here. Love your podcast. Keep up the good work, we need you.
Professor Lowry's interrogations are always salient and on point. Bravo.
Let's go!!! Back at it again with Brother Rowe! I know teachers who teach at Girls Prep and they're some of the best teachers I've ever met.
Ian Rowe failed to report child abuse as Public Preps CEO. Don’t publicly link yourself to him
I have followed you Mr. Rowe, for years.......how can your outlook convince more black Americans of its correctness is the.biggest question! It is critical for all of us but especially for black Americans
Mr Rowe is indeed correct, but how do you know what black folks you know would or wouldnt agree with him?.
Rev. Jasper Williams. He preached some hard truths
So happy to hear you bring up the idea that the K-12 system needs major improvements. Everyone is crying for free college while the primary & secondary systems are leaving students unprepared for it.
Ian Rowe failed to report an allegation of child abuse on April 17, 2018 as Public Prepa CEO. He’s a phony and fake all around
You both are wonderful men. Thank you so much. God bless you both.
Ian Rowe failed to report child abuse as a charter ceo. Don’t link yourself to him
Wow! God bless you both! Even as Glenn is playing "Devil's advocate", it was fun to see him stifling a smile as Ian talked. Brilliant. Inspiring. Hope-giving. God bless you both. May your tribes increase!!! Listening and applying the wisdom you share.
Don’t link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed to report an allegation of child abuse as Public Prepa
CEO. He’s a phony and fake all
Around
Good talk, again. Love Dr. Loury and his guests.
I would love to see that debate that Ian brought up (any combo of Coleman/Glenn/Sowell/McWhorter/Larry Elder vs TNC/Sandy Darity would be highly entertaining). I wonder why it hasn't happened yet 🤔🤔🤔
Bravo! This is so exciting, so positive, a great conversation and noble objective. As an educator, I applaud the concept and can't wait to see it at work.
Two brilliant minds!
Great Conversation, smart ideas that will benefit our communities in a great way. Strong families great education and strong faith keep up the great work!
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed to report child abuse as Public Prep’s CEO
Spectacular interaction and wonderfully insightful.
Love, beauty, wisdom. Truly.
America needs more people like Ian! (And Glenn of course .)
Apprenticeships are great for helping young people start finding their way in the world
I went to Frankfurt International school in Frankfurt a.m Germany, and graduated with an IB diploma! It's served me well!
Fantastic to see Glenn at 43:00 bring up the issue of confounding factors when looking at correlational vs causal data. 👍
I came from an IB school and it helped set me up for success in university & life. It was my introduction to philosophy which I majored in undergrad and am now pursuing in grad school. Seriously underutilized program imo
What era was your IB, Will? As Ian said, IB has been around a long while. Since the 90s when I became aware, I thought it was a gimmick to enchant Americans with "international" and also perhaps fewer science requirements. I am very interested in 1776 Unites! My hypothesis is it's as much or more about the learning environment as it is about the structure of the [almost interchangeable] alternative program of study and study options.
Great discussion! Thanks Glen!
How does this channel not have more views? Great conversation.
I know!
These are criminally underviewed and subscribed to. Glen and his guests have quickly become must listen/watch content.
That's negative, and appeals to people's competitive side-taking. "I only want to watch information from winners." I feel your reaction, Bang. Social media is not just for the "I" first-person commenter. I try to be proud of promoting something healthy in the trail I leave behind, including humor.
Notice, this comment was mostly about me. love
I am thankful that as a parent we have a choice to put our kids in charter schools. It is great to be able to have those choices!
Isn failed to report child abuse on April 17, 2018 as Public preps ceo
This was fantastic...and I couldn't help but think that Andrew Yang is the only political leader at the moment that would understand this
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed to report child
Abuse as charter CEO
@@elizabethdorgan6393 applaud the ideas not the person
Great dudes.
This conversation is how the adult world should converse. Reason, ideas, and vision well articulated without tribalism.
Yes, it's brilliant!
Please have a national debate! That would be amazing!
Steel Sharpening Steel. I love it
IB is top notch. My two have been immersed in it while in Copenhagen, Singapore and now Melbourne.
I did IB in Australia and loved it, there was such a strong focus on critical thinking and learning in general
Stoic principles, very cool.
Love this!
Your name is very positive!
Thank you!
Hello Glen and Ian - Have either of you read Robert Kennedy and His Times, by Arthur M Schlesinger Jr (1978) ? This conversation reminds me of these specific chapters in His Times = Chapter 18. Justice and Poverty. Chapter 33. The Breach Widens: South Africa, New York. Chapter 35. Tribune of the Underclass. Chapter 36. Images.
The Socratic Method is how they have taught in accredited law schools for decades (watch the movie The Paperchase to see what it looks like). I had no idea it was part of the IB curriculum. I grew up in a big college town (Gainesville, FL) in the 1980’s and 90’s. All the smartest kids bussed over to Eastside High School in the poorest area of town to attend the IB Program there. It would be amazing to see this take root in schools all over the country.
More people need to hear this.
Don’t publicly link yourself with Ian Rowe. He failed to report child abuse
Should look at Fairview Middle School and Richards High in Tallahassee Florida for examples of the use of IB programs in lower income areas and schools
Excellent discussion. Need specifics. Example : Get rid of birth control, abortion and divorce.
The problem isn't colonization, it's institutionalization. The public school system was designed from the beginning to prevent critical thinking and create a predictable populace to run the machines - a factory farm for human beings. Now, the idea of discipline has completely disappeared and replaced by learned helplessness, which has even spilled into higher education. Childhood now persists well into the 20's, and solving this problem isn't just a matter of throwing money at it. Ian Rowe seems to have a lot right - emphasizing discipline whilst also empowering students to make choices about their own destiny for a change.
When you and John McWhorter run for president in 2024, I would suggest tapping Rowe as your education secretary.
I would also like to provide some specific examples of learned helplessness:
- For the students - Don't fight back - tell a teacher. And everyone's a winner. Now may I go to the bathroom?
- For the parents - Universal daycare, free preschool, and free lunch (and we all know what economists say about that last one...) - Never have to care for your own kid again!
I since I live in the Bronx and went to public school. I say the kids in the Bronx need skill training , commercial drivers , business education and science. Art is more subjective and should be taught in a way that is fun and informative.
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed
To report child abuse as Public prep ceo
@@elizabethdorgan6393 oh
White conservatives look to the black conservatives to speak with the authority they have but whites do not. Ian Rowe then points to the church to speak from among the black community with the authority that their culture at large doesn't have. Wonderful conversation, gentlemen. Loved meeting Ian for the first time. A new fan.
I hope that the 1776 Project connects with WallBuilders. Here's a great video which includes just the sort of highlights of the historical achievements of black Americans Glenn and Ian discussed. Specifically start at 6:00 : ruclips.net/video/iJygZhHd3bM/видео.html&ab_channel=StreamsofLight__CharlesPlacide
Talking about the 1776 project and the contribution of black americans I was watching a WWII documentary and saw brief mention of the all black 761st tank battalion named the Black Panthers who served with distinction in Europe. Sounds like a great movie if Hollywood could manage not to ruin it
What a great idea this baccalaureate program is. This is what we need. Not the stupid 1600 whatever thing.
Jasper Williams, Jr., was the controversial minister at Aretha's funeral.
If I argued what Ian is arguing I’d just be labeled a racist, then ridiculed, then ignored.
Just extend your argument--my argument, too, Brittney!--to all races, because that is true!! It will make our argument more experienced over time, then we can add which groups need the first help, if there is a competition for resources. Just a thought you inspired. Thanks!
We need to argue these ideas regardless. Ideas are seeds in people's minds, and even if a lot of people reject them, SOMEONE is listening! The better ideas will win in the end, but only if we have courage enough to say them. I say courage because yes, in these strange times there is a strong risk of being called names (racist, complicit, grifter, Uncle Tom etc - the list goes on - and there's an insult for EVERYONE, black, white, or in between like me!). Sorry if this sounds preachy - I'm actually directing it at myself as I write it! But have courage, your voice is needed!
@@just_another32 Nice, Victoria!
A lot of great content here. But I think the faith leaders angle is not gonna be an effective one - It would certainly benefit any community if they believed in a higher power that promoted united families and so on... But if they don't, then they don't. And no amount of pascal's wager will help that one, you'll just end up dividing folks more. Need a new secular narrative if you're gonna get people on board.
Do these reparations go on forever? What about the next generation of black Americans ?
You do realize neither of these men are necessarily arguing for reparations but rather are saying should have a debate about it.
@@sabinesfamily yes I do.
That is a nice suit
And you're honest too, so it must be true!
@@just_another32 LOL!
There are three different New York State law enforcement agencies involved in Ian Rowes failure to report child abuse
Thank you for mentioning the rural kids. One question to ask might be why young men from high population urban areas are killing each other yet young men from a rural environment are killing. Themselves. Just as a way to address the violence of all groups in all places. As a white guy with a "rural" childhood i understand the shame that pushes people to take their own lives. What or who or why do young men in high population urban areas kill each other. And it is not a color thing. It's a urban thing. Irish men and Italian men had gangs in urban areas killing each other 100 puls year ago. At the start of the industrial revolution?
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe = he failed
To report child abuse as Public prep ceo
Only listened to half so far but this just kinda reminds me that "both sides" of this issue have a lot of common ground and probably agree with a majority of what the other is saying and want. They probably just disagree with the way and narrative it's said
I love your common ground hypothesis! Let's work with it, because it gets ugly in the trenches of the way and the narrative. Thanks!!
Are you sure though? It seems to me that the fundamentals are totally different - for example, promoting victim identities vs not accepting that kind of victim narrative.
engineers are grounded in how things actually work rather than those who have an idea about how they want it to work.....you can't legislate physics....too many people want to drive the train but very few want to figure out how the gear box functions....engineers make it so.!!
4:20 or so, I call BS. I did my student teaching 30 years ago in a non-affluent, urban school with a largely minority population that offered the International Baccalaureate curriculum. The "urban" high school where I currently live is also the only school in the metro area to offer the IB curriculum. I'm not 100%against charter schools, but I am annoyed by those who ignore that many public schools have long been undertaking effective, life-changing curriculum.
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed
To report child abuse as charter ceo
At around @41:45 b Schapiro likes citing that as well
I think that upshot of Raj Chetty's research is encouraging in that it seems that a "network" of 2 parent households in a neighborhood provides a buoying effect even for single parent households in the same neighborhood. My perception is that this dovetails into Rowe's concept of "mediating institutions" - those households in other words, form a kind of aggregate support network and stabilizing influence.
I like Ian. He’s a good guy
He accepted a salary of $330k a year where African American students were not being taught how to read
yes Yes YES! Where is it written black kids can’t excel? Please give black kids an opportunity to learn to love learning. It is a gift that keeps giving all life long.
Great podcast, but do not understand why he thinks it requires a faith leader to point out facts, evidence, and true causality for situations like the one we saw with Jacob Blake. In my opinion, and he stated this earlier, this can be achieved with simple open dialogue.
Wonderful discussion and, btw, I think having classes available for parents to choose to learn these concepts would be a positive addition. Also, the newest neuroscience information is excellent to keep injecting into the body of information available to the student and parents at appropriate age levels.
Great conversation!!! Wish we had more of the same.
Don’t publicly link yourself to Isn Rowe. He failed to report an allegation of child abuse on April 17, 2018
Yang / Rowe 2024
First!!
Keep... hitting... like button... but it doesn't make more likes! Uggghhh!!!
Ian Rowe should run for office. Seriously.
Secretary of Education under the Loury/McWhorter administration in 2024.
he accepted a salary of $330k and minority children were not being taught how to read.
There are three different law enforcement agencies involved in Ian Rowes failure to report child abuse on April 17, 2018
@@elizabethdorgan6393 evidence?
@@tglass55 Detectives Kreitzberg and Kinley in NYPD; Detective Colleran in Pelham Manor Police, Detective Anderson in East Hampton
Very interesting discussion. The problem proposing a entrepreneurial solution to the NHJ adherents is that they are aren't actually interested in lifting black people up by whatever means necessary, they are only interested in a very narrow set of possible solutions that are collectivist in nature and would likely see the NHJ's, TNC's, MED's and Kendi's installed as the high priests/ ranking party officials in the new system. It is disingenuous and deceptive to say that they are looking to improve the lives of typical black Americans. They are looking for power and prestige, and using the plight of lower income blacks as a vehicle to attain them.
The tragic irony, of course, is that someone found yet another way to monetize human suffering, along especially insidious lines, which they claim to be the exclusive purview of "capitalism". I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a more apt example of "wolves in sheep's clothing".
Don’t publicly link yourself
To Ian Rowe. He failed
To report child abuse as a charter ceo
48:25 Ian lets his moderation slip a bit, "That's enough of that [white people characteristics].'
Then Ian cites some info about infancy and childhood development. BRO! In-utero also. In fact, mom's hormones change baby's DNA. Stess and other hormone variables have inevitable and permanent effects. All cultures and races.
P.S. If tiny humans weren't in "pre-school" they wouldn't get "suspended."
whatever Ian Rowe says in public on the internet is polar opposite of who he actually is. Public Prep posted miserable results.
If Zac and Ian could join forces
Watch "Talking Metamodernism with Zak Stein - Growing Down Podcast" on RUclips
ruclips.net/video/SM7kKHnrlvY/видео.html
America is a corporation!
Note to self: Will 1776 Unites materials be available for home schooling?
I'm convinced my state public schools are toxic. My children left K-12 just before the crash approx 2010, and I thought it was bad then. Good job for elders like me, now, to help home school the grandchildren.
Aside, do folks realize there are renewed political initiatives to outlaw home schooling? I don't know the full history, but home schooling is not, or has not been, legal in many states. It has not "met" compulsory attendance laws.
Don’t publicly link yourself to Ian Rowe. He failed
To report child abuse as Public prep ceo
@@elizabethdorgan6393 I fell for "your" comment a year ago. Not again.
@@paigemccormick6519 Ian Rowe went to his own Police Department in Pelham - to tell them I called the child abuse hotline - I did!! After a child abuse intake operator gave me the directive to call 911 to the school the next morning at 730p.m. Ian Rowe accepted my resignation at 8:15pm that night which is a class e felony. Public Prep then submitted Ian Rowe's resignation to an investigator from the federal government that it was Public Prep's position that Ian Rowe accepted my resignation 45 minutes after a child abuse specialist gave me the directive to call NYPD to the school. I will email it to you:). By Public Prep's own admission Ian Rowe was the administrator who made the decision to accept a teacher's resignation who was the subject of a child abuse allegation.......Three different NYS law enforcement agencies are now involved in Ian Rowe's failure to report child abuse - Town of East Hampton, NY, NYPD and Pelham Manor. Email me - I will show you the supporting documentation and the timing of Ian Rowe blocking me and law enforcement from the school -
ed2133@nyu.edu
@@elizabethdorgan6393 You clearly have experienced something important.
Are you saying Rowe covered up child abuse?
@@paigemccormick6519 Stacey Pitcher an attorney and partner at the law firm Obemayer signed her name to a legal position statement sent to the EEOC that it is Public Prep's position that Ian Rowe was the Public Prep employee who made the decision to accept a teacher's resignation minutes after that same teacher called the NYS central registry - a Class E felony
Bacca - laureate = please practice your pronunciation before you try to come out here and teach others.
If ADOS gets the debt paid by the government, a number of us would create more businesses and be more independent. Ian Rowe modern Booker T. Washington approach is fine but I heard too much blaming on low income black women choices. Low income and poor people in this country are having a tough time regardless of race. All the tradition institutions that sustain working class and middle class communities have diminished, we can definitely debate about the why.
V, could the "why" potentially extend to analyzing the choices (as I think you're saying, of more than the black community only)? You say you heard too much blaming on low income black women choices. I feel agreement with your reaction, but I did not hear the blaming first-hand from Ian. I know that blaming is out there, and I also want discussion and healthy communities. Your thoughts have enlightened me, and now I know what ADOS is!
Do I really sound this white? love from back in the day, too
Fantastic conversation. BTW Glen’s devil’s advocate about teaching children to graduate high school, work, get married then have kids maybe not being the reason why they are successful has merit.
I come from a family of 8 children. We were all raised the same way and under Christian values. My oldest sister is single with two kids living in a trailer park with no money. My next oldest sister he never gotten a driver’s license and worked at DQ until she got knocked up and had twins in which she married and is a stay at home mom (their income is lower middle class). My next sister is low income with no kids but rents a house that my dad bought at a cheap rate. My next sister has physical and mental disorders so she is an outlier. Then there is me which would be considered middle to upper middle class who got married then had a child recently. Then there is my brother who just finished his lineman apprenticeship and bought a house (currently long term dating) who is middle to upper middle class. Then there is my sister who has had health issues so she is kind of an outlier but appears to have no real ambition when it comes to having a “traditional” life. Then there is my youngest brother who is in college (not very ambitious but you never know) so it is too early to really know.
Very wide spectrum of results and very wide range of view points on most everything coming from the same household. Other traits are pretty much the only way to explain it.
Just like Glen said, these things still NEED to be taught because they definitely help. They just might not be the causal effect.
I have a question what is the black way? I see black people where African garb in America? But Africans depending on there country don’t act like the stereotypical African American. I’ve heard people like Thomas Sowell describe it as certain languages and culture we took from whites while in slavery. That slang and certain attitudes came from Scottish and Southern British I believe. They used words and behaviors like and being in the military I’ve met people from around the world and if they want to act like an American. They tend to follow the personalities of those in front of them i.e country by they speak country. I was wondering if the same thing happened to slaves brought here. We did not come here speaking English and I’m wondering if what Thomas Sowell calls “Black Redneck culture” is a realistic view.
Yes I agree. But ppl like Nicole Hannah Jones aren't concerned with that. She and the rest are narrow minded. Making millions off of false grievances. It's almost like the glass have empty or full analogy
There are three different NYS law enforcement agencies involved in Ian Rowes failure to report child
Abuse
It took the 1619 project to even make you think about creating 1776 United curriculum. Respect the 1619 project for awakening and or shaking the American conscience.
11:51 "It sounds like it could impoverish a brother" Really? Depends on your idea of poverty. From where I sit, teacher salaries look pretty good.
He was a horrible CEO - Public Prep asked him to leave.
Jello how are you
Good discussion. I have the answer regarding "reparations". In response to the slaves being counted as 3/5ths persons in the original 1787 Constitution for the purpose of political respresentation (of course that 3/5ths voting power was given to white property owners), let's give all black people in the US an extra 2/5ths vote for the next 75 years (symbolically representing the period from 1789 until 1865). This brings people into the political process, emphasizes that we value the United States as an experiment in democracy (not a society obsessed only with money, in other words), and allows the black voters to design their own "uplift" as Ian Rowe says at one point (if I recall correctly). My plan avoids the overly contentious issue of money, but still allows black America to vote itself more resources for schools, transportation, healthcare, etc, (while also creating an incentive for black America to reach out to others to gain more votes and more political power) if it so desires. My proposal also has the tremendous advantage of causing people to learn a little history.
The point of the 3/5ths rule was to punish states that held slaves. Non-slave states counted each African American as a full person for the purposes of determining the number of U.S. Representatives and electoral votes they received. Slave holding states, on the other hand, were only able to get credit for 3/5ths of their slave population when determining how many Representatives they received. The 3/5 rule was thus an explicitly anti-slavery rule since it punished any state that held slaves. (I haven't got through the video yet, so I'm not sure if they mention this. If so I apologize.) and was only repealed by virtue of passing the 13th amendment. (I believe it was the same provision of the Constitution that barred the importation of any more slaves.) You may have already known all of that when you wrote your post, if so I apologize. I'm just adding this incase anyone wonders.
I don't agree forthright, but I commend such a unique solution.
Boxcar101 Yeah I’ve heard this right wing argument before that adding extra voting power to the Southern states was meant as “punishment”. Over here in reality-land, punishment has a different meaning in the dictionary than it does in the rightwingosphere. No biggie, doesn’t have anything to do with my suggestion anyway. Thanks for the reminder though. (Take note that, quite obviously, had the southern states freed the slaves, they would have been counted as whole persons for the purpose of congressional representation. Thus, any “punishment” was self-inflicted.)
@@jazzfan7491 it's not a right wing argument, it's just a fact. It took voting power away from Southern States. Had that provision not been in the Constitution slave states would have been able to fully count each slave in their census and would therefore have gotten extra representatives. Even in the South free blacks were counted as a full citizen for allocation of representatives. This provision was anti-slavery, nothing right or left wing about it. To the extent a state had slaves, they lost 2/5 of their Representation.
Boxcar101 So you’re saying it was a punishment to be given extra political power representing their enslaved population right? Giving the southern white men extra voting power, representing their slaves, power which they used to maintain slavery and expand it into other states, was punishment, right? Good example of why we now need whatever you would call the opposite of punishment, such as giving more voting power to black Americans. 🤓
They look pretty similar. Makes me think of the diversity of Black Republican sketch by Keyan and Peele lol